[skyclad99]

You can quote lack of investment but we had the best part of £30 million sitting on the bench the last few months.

Whatever money we had in the summer we spunked up the wall.

You could say we invested wisely for next season Liam😁

[baggie38]

What let us down?

Billic, Dowling, Ken, Lai,

I'm not going to give big sam to much stick because he came in and had pennies to play with. The players we recommended to bring in have been improvements. The problem with alot of loans is clubs won't release them until closer to the end of the window. Those 4 weeks in January and how late they joined had a say in being costly potentially. If we start at the beginning the budget wasn't enough plain and simple you can't go into a division where teams throw money around for fun then join the party and throw wet tissue paper. Billic was to insistent on Krovinovic coming back and chasing Grant oh and the small matter of being persistent in our pursuit of Ivanovic. The mistakes were made last summer and our fate was sealed then. What do we learn from this season? Nothing new. The club lacks ambition and that won't change with the current board or ownership. We will go down lose players and have to replace them no doubt some dross will come in no doubt we will bring in some decent loans. The owner doesn't care and won't care until he is out of here and washed his hands of the club. What we need to do now is look forward immediately and plan. We need an answer from Sam ASAP this week ideally we can't afford to delay or wait on him to give us an answer. This summer is huge for the future of our club. Do we challenge next season or become a average second tier club? One things for sure Dowling is out of his depth and needs to go. Billic paid with his Job in November dowling needs to do one now aswell.

[Dexy]

1 .Don't go up with owners looking to sell
2. Don't go up while falling out behind the scenes
3. Don't sign three left sided players in one window blowing your budget.
4. Don't sign one left sided forward from lower league and try to turn him into a lone forward.
5. Act on clear failing weak areas from the season before ( midfield ) .
Loads more , utter joke of a season.

[boinging_along]

Hiring a manager that is known for a defensive approach with a team that can't defend.

[baggie38]

Hiring a manager that is known for a defensive approach with a team that can't defend.

Rubbish he improved us. If you look at the amount of points we picked up the last 10 games or so it would be enough for us to stay up. We didn't shift Billic out the door quick enough and bring him in quick enough was the issue.

[California Dreaming]

Rubbish he improved us. If you look at the amount of points we picked up the last 10 games or so it would be enough for us to stay up. We didn't shift Billic out the door quick enough and bring him in quick enough was the issue.

Conveniently forgetting that he made us worse before we saw any improvement. The points tally since he arrived would not have kept us up, he failed in his stated task, alienated some players who we will need next season and played some bizarre tactics in games he himself pronounced as ‘must win’. He is not totally to blame, but is certainly not blameless.

[zippyandbungle]

Conveniently forgetting that he made us worse before we saw any improvement. The points tally since he arrived would not have kept us up, he failed in his stated task, alienated some players who we will need next season and played some bizarre tactics in games he himself pronounced as ‘must win’. He is not totally to blame, but is certainly not blameless.

That last sentence is key
I can’t stand allardyce, but whilst there have been some obvious improvements ... there have also been mistakes from him that seem too easily forgotten.
Posters revel in “his” 5-2 demolition of Chelsea....but our defeat at Everton was all about Gibbs being sent off .
In the Chelsea match he also had his “inspired” tactical change almost forced upon him.

[Dexy]

https://theathletic.com/2575351/?amp#click=https://t.co/RT93b6K8it
I'll put this up for now due to being a major topic.
Steve Madeleys take on it .

[Baltic]

Key Reason

-  Totally insufficient budget. Resp Lai

Contributory Reasons

-  In-balanced squad. Resp Dowling/Bilic
-  Poor contribution from signings. Grant, Diangana, Ivanovic. Resp Dowling/Bilic
-  Lack of fitness. Resp Bilic
-  Failure to get deserved points and momentum early on. Resp REF/VAR, Gibbs (Everton), SJ (Spurs/Chelsea) MP (3 game ban)
-  Going backwards before we went forwards. Resp Allardyce

[NJS]

Guochan Lai never promised to shell out lots of money and Leader Xi 's about turn as regards investment would have prevented him anyway.  I don't know whether there will be much pressure to dispose of his risky asset; he might just as easily decide to let its value slowly and quietly decrease.

Dowling's tenure of the DoF position has been a disaster (save for MP).  What we need is a new DoF but as such an appointment is made by the board, I don't know how such a stand-off body could identify one.  Pehaps an old director (Jenkins) will be recalled.

The problem starts at the top but is Allardyce's style too ponderous and unsuited to today's refereeing style which prohibits the more robust forms of defence prevalent when he was in his pomp?

In my view, of his acquisitions, Yokuslu has been a top man, Diagne and Snodgrass old pros who've been OK but haven't really moved the dial. AMN has been good in parts.   I don't know whether Big Sam's conservative mindset is tuned to developing and bringing on young players so that would undermine the reason for having an academy.

Is SA prepared to stay on with the budget we can provide?  Will he just say that he did not get the 'support' he required and walk away?  We need to know quickly.

[seteefeet]

Key Reason

-  Totally insufficient budget. Resp Lai

Contributory Reasons

-  In-balanced squad. Resp Dowling/Bilic
-  Poor contribution from signings. Grant, Diangana, Ivanovic. Resp Dowling/Bilic
-  Lack of fitness. Resp Bilic
-  Failure to get deserved points and momentum early on. Resp REF/VAR, Gibbs (Everton), SJ (Spurs/Chelsea) MP (3 game ban)
-  Going backwards before we went forwards. Resp Allardyce

Nicely summed up mate, saved me some ink! Just missed one factor, and for me, the main one, and that is the Premier League itself.

We could get all the other things right and still fail, simply because we have less money than everyone else and the fault for that lies firmly at the door of the Premier League and the fact that it has allowed, nay encouraged, it to become such a corrupt, unfair, biased, uneven "competition".

We would pretty much have to put ourselves on the brink of extinction to truly compete in that god forsaken league.
GOOD RIDDANCE
Roll on August.

[skyclad99]

Conveniently forgetting that he made us worse before we saw any improvement. The points tally since he arrived would not have kept us up, he failed in his stated task, alienated some players who we will need next season and played some bizarre tactics in games he himself pronounced as ‘must win’. He is not totally to blame, but is certainly not blameless.

Nothing convenient about it Cali. When he arrived he obviously thought the players were OK. It took several games and numerous formation/team changes for him to realise that on the whole we were total rubbish, and that some keys areas [Livermore/Sawyers] were woefully bad. Once the window was open his task was to redress the balance with little more than a jar of buttons - a task he did pretty well in my opinion.
The fact that we got worse is likely down to BS asking players to play to  a different style, something they found difficult to adjust to because they are not that good in the first place.
Lets face it, we have had a car crash of a season, and until the circus that owns us are gone, this is going to continue for the forseeable, regardless who is in the hot seats.
The high price paid by Lai [set by the previous chap] means that we are virtually unbuyable - Lai will have to stomach a loss of something like 50% if he wanted to sell, and I cannot see him doing that. Likewise, we will need some reasonable investment if we are going to get back up next season, and I cannot see him doing that either.
I have to laugh at times when posters come on saying 'we need to get rid and replace, we need to buy a striker, or DM, or anyone else.... with what?

[gazberg]

On a smaller level of self-destructive behaviour internally, whoever believed that there would be transfer bargains galore due to covid and remaining inactive until we realised it wasn't happening setting us even further back should be fired.

[PartisanBaggie]

Nothing convenient about it Cali. When he arrived he obviously thought the players were OK. It took several games and numerous formation/team changes for him to realise that on the whole we were total rubbish, and that some keys areas [Livermore/Sawyers] were woefully bad. Once the window was open his task was to redress the balance with little more than a jar of buttons - a task he did pretty well in my opinion.
The fact that we got worse is likely down to BS asking players to play to  a different style, something they found difficult to adjust to because they are not that good in the first place.
Lets face it, we have had a car crash of a season, and until the circus that owns us are gone, this is going to continue for the forseeable, regardless who is in the hot seats.
The high price paid by Lai [set by the previous chap] means that we are virtually unbuyable - Lai will have to stomach a loss of something like 50% if he wanted to sell, and I cannot see him doing that. Likewise, we will need some reasonable investment if we are going to get back up next season, and I cannot see him doing that either.
I have to laugh at times when posters come on saying 'we need to get rid and replace, we need to buy a striker, or DM, or anyone else.... with what?

What you’re saying is right and I agree with you.

This was spoken about at length a year ago and the bottom line is very simple:

For Lai to sell WBA and recoup as much money as he can, we have to be playing in the Premier League. I can’t personally see him being able to sell our club whilst we’re in the Championship, not for the sort of money he’s asking for anyhow. Any interested party right now will be saying to Lai “we’re prepared to offer you (for example) £50million for West Bromwich Albion because you’re in the second tier of English football and that’s the market valuation given the size of the club, assets, etc.”

Do you think Lai is going to digest a £100+million loss on an investment made only 5 years ago?

We’re right back where we were at the end of the 17/18 season. Only, we’re more used to the situation.

[PartisanBaggie]

On a smaller level of self-destructive behaviour internally, whoever believed that there would be transfer bargains galore due to covid and remaining inactive until we realised it wasn't happening setting us even further back should be fired.

I wonder who that could be Gaz...🤔

[gazberg]

I wonder who that could be Gaz...🤔

I think we have an idea but can't say for sure.

[PartisanBaggie]

I think we have an idea but can't say for sure.

It’s not going to be the owner, chairman or CEO. It’ll be whoever’s in charge of transfer dealings at the club.

I distinctly remember Mark Jenkins’ parting statement in the Express & Dingle just under 12 months ago saying it’ll be much, much harder to do transfer dealing because of COVID-19.

[baggiejohn]

It’s not going to be the owner, chairman or CEO. It’ll be whoever’s in charge of transfer dealings at the club.

I distinctly remember Mark Jenkins’ parting statement in the Express & Dingle just under 12 months ago saying it’ll be much, much harder to do transfer dealing because of COVID-19.

He implied that transfer fees would be lower because clubs would want to off-load players.
Bye & large he was (& still is) correct, as demonstrated in the January window, it's just that we focused on players instead of value for money in the summer.

You can put the blame on Dowling if you want, but there's two tiers above him, & one of them is supposed to be looking after the shareholders interests

Here's the full statement

https://www.expressandstar.com/sport/football/west-bromwich-albion/2020/08/06/exclusive-mark-jenkins-on-albions-finances-post-covid-19/

[Adder]

Last summer there was a mis-calculation of certain areas of the squad.
Bilic's major downfall was expecting our midfield to be good enough in the prem. At times we were overrun in the Championship. Bilic was quoted a few times saying that 'some of our players will be better suited to the premier league'. He didn't give names but I can't help suspecting that he meant the likes of Sawyers Pereira and Diangana. Clearly only Pereira has proved himself this year.

It's stating the obvious to say we've looked more at home at prem level since the January additions.

[baggie82]

Very good article in the athletic today by Steve Madeley setting out in further detail what has gone on this season. The pertinent point is that our budget was just £20m with anything else to be staggered over the next few years and that left us with no realistic chance of being able to compete. The writing was on the wall before a ball was kicked:

"The Athletic has learned that even during pre-season senior Albion figures, chatting to others in football, raised serious doubts about their ability to compete in the top flight with the money available."

The club should have been more honest and admitted we were broke and doing a Norwich.

[gazberg]

The club should have been more honest and admitted we were broke and doing a Norwich.

100000% this. Myself and others on here suggested the very same thing before a ball was kicked.

[Albionic]

100000% this. Myself and others on here suggested the very same thing before a ball was kicked.

Yep, but someone would have had to tell the owner, which was a career limiting move !!

[gazberg]

Yep, but someone would have had to tell the owner, which was a career limiting move !!

Great deal of truth in that!

[BaggieBoy04]

Well were to blaim we can blaim Bilic but as I don't want to cause an arguement then I won't say anything but he wasn't perfect.
Sam needed to do what we had done last ten games eairler
Biggest Problem Our board
The quicker these morons leave the better. Were to start
You want to sell a club you got royally ripped off by JP under him we had been In the Prem for 7 years. The same season as our relegation these guys come in sack Pulls after a loss to Chelsea as opposed to say Huddersfield. Bring in a circus act after then Big Dave comes in tries to rescue a sinking ship alternatively fails. They then give him the Job and yes Albion Fans love Big Dave and happily backed him but he was inexperienced anyway Darren has in the play offs the board sack him in a disgusting way. We then get Jimmy Shan for rest of season miss out on Promotion had we had an actual new manager we could have gone up. Anyway Slav comes in amazing how did we get him. He starts of wonderful Covid happens then something happens behind the scenes maybe. Then Slav gets us up in 1 year the board give him 2 clearly showing they want the final year of Parachute payments. Anyway we come up with a criminally low budget. The board spunk most of it on Diangana for the future Slav wanted him back on loan. Then we know the rest. Moral is Lai wanted to sell well put money in to actually secure the status of the club maybe get them pushing for Mid Table keep viable assests invest in Youth to increase the Value then sell.

But since JP washed his hands of us and sold at an overinflated price we have become unstable unable to compete so ultimately JP has a blaim to ultimately now Keep Big Sam he could get us up if we keep MP it won't be pretty but I would much rather go up him then keep us up so these owners can get out of the club or hopefully this 50+1 rule we signed the petition for gets acted on and we get a say. Until either happens well Albion will just keep having our proud name dragged through the mud

[saml30]

Theres a lack of investment but Dowlings signings have been poor.

But go back and see how happy people were with the Grant and Grady signings for instance.