Author Topic: Alan Irvine  (Read 1234791 times)

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maccbaggie

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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #5275 on: December 07, 2014, 08:48:01 PM »
Downing would be an absolute disaster. The only positive would be that he'd finally get sacked.

WestBromJim

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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #5276 on: December 07, 2014, 08:51:28 PM »
But, he's here, apparently fantastic! I know he said he didn't want the top job, but that's making all the big calls without the big blame.

My opinion is if Downing wants to be a part of our (sorry JP's club) then maybe he might stick his head over the parapit to get shot at.
No matter where I roam, I will come back to the Brummie road, Cause no bonds, can ever tempt me from thee. The Jam (nearly)

WestBromJim

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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #5277 on: December 07, 2014, 08:53:27 PM »
So we agree, Downing ain't the answer.


Bye then!

C'mon JP, show your brilliance.


Brings me back to my post on how the "football" budget is allocated, head of recruitment or coach
« Last Edit: December 07, 2014, 08:56:57 PM by WestBromJim »
No matter where I roam, I will come back to the Brummie road, Cause no bonds, can ever tempt me from thee. The Jam (nearly)

Mister AT

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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #5278 on: December 07, 2014, 09:06:24 PM »
I think they only reason Downing didnt take the job last year was because I think deep down he knows hes comfortable in his current role. He has seen 'head coaches' come and go yet he has remained in a job.

If he moved up to take the Head Coach role and failed, he would be out of a job. At present hes comfortable and earning money.
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BobTaylor

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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #5279 on: December 07, 2014, 09:11:01 PM »
I can understand why it is getting to people i really can and thats why i worry for Saturday the whole occasion not at least them prats in the away end loving every minute of it. If we do lose fail to score etc i think there would be a few who didnt return after Christmas sad but true but also true that the club dont really care im afraid, I think depending if we get a home draw tonight we really could see the lowest crowd for a while to the Hawthorns come January the 3rd obviously i hope we turn it around the next 2 games but im far from confident at the moment i think the only positive thing that would come out of a loss on Saturday is the club would see the fans frustrations in full not pretty but effective maybe.

GrGr

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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #5280 on: December 07, 2014, 09:16:55 PM »
That's going backwards, we need new blood not a transfusion.

It's not going backwards, it's a step out of the Irvine disaster so it is a step forward until we can bring in someone who has a clue.

I doubt we have someone lined up to step in straight away, so what will happen is that Irvine will cling on for ages and ages and ages until we are into late winter/early spring and not enough time is left to save the season, especially with our tough finish.

My guess is that we will be well cut off by then together with Hull, Leicester and Burnley. If Hull and QPR find a bit of form well that's it for us. 

GrGr

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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #5281 on: December 07, 2014, 09:17:58 PM »
I think they only reason Downing didnt take the job last year was because I think deep down he knows hes comfortable in his current role. He has seen 'head coaches' come and go yet he has remained in a job.

If he moved up to take the Head Coach role and failed, he would be out of a job. At present hes comfortable and earning money.

Exactly, not rocket science is it. He has a wonderful job as it is.

maccbaggie

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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #5282 on: December 07, 2014, 09:20:16 PM »
It's not going backwards, it's a step out of the Irvine disaster so it is a step forward until we can bring in someone who has a clue.

I doubt we have someone lined up to step in straight away, so what will happen is that Irvine will cling on for ages and ages and ages until we are into late winter/early spring and not enough time is left to save the season, especially with our tough finish.

My guess is that we will be well cut off by then together with Hull, Leicester and Burnley. If Hull and QPR find a bit of form well that's it for us.
It really is criminal. With the right manager this squad should be in the top-half. The worst thing for me is that we have the players, they're just not being played by our incompetent coaching team.
« Last Edit: December 07, 2014, 09:22:43 PM by maccbaggie »

WestBromJim

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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #5283 on: December 07, 2014, 09:20:28 PM »
I think they only reason Downing didnt take the job last year was because I think deep down he knows hes comfortable in his current role. He has seen 'head coaches' come and go yet he has remained in a job.

If he moved up to take the Head Coach role and failed, he would be out of a job. At present hes comfortable and earning money.

Agree mate , by all accounts he his fantastic at his craft, but, who should be capable of hiring or firing him? JP? garlick? Or the bloke that happens to front the Albion when things go tits up?

I think a football coach should coach, I think a head of recruitment should recruit, but solely on the recommendation of the coach.

JP gives a target performance wise, a budget to achieve that goal, the coaching then tells Mr recruitment to buy what's required within the financial parameters.

Coach gets his wishes and fails, terrah. recruitment can't attract, terrah, chairman can't provide terrah
No matter where I roam, I will come back to the Brummie road, Cause no bonds, can ever tempt me from thee. The Jam (nearly)

BobTaylor

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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #5284 on: December 07, 2014, 09:23:23 PM »
If we went down this season i would be amazed if Downing was still in a job come next season, No way would Peace take to that kindly.

Jeremy Roland Peace

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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #5285 on: December 07, 2014, 09:25:36 PM »
I could be wrong but didn't Downing say last season he was interested in going into management but he didn't want the Albion job full time.

Maybe he knows what the issues are behind the scenes and wouldn't want to have to deal with them on a full time basis

WestBromJim

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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #5286 on: December 07, 2014, 09:38:54 PM »
I could be wrong but didn't Downing say last season he was interested in going into management but he didn't want the Albion job full time.

Maybe he knows what the issues are behind the scenes and wouldn't want to have to deal with them on a full time basis

Yeah, but that's scary, we have a chicken and egg situation, do we do this to achieve that, or do we do that to achieve this?

No club can tread water and hope to stay buoyant. Too many bigger and similar sized clubs to us underachieving.

Off the field, without a shadow of a doubt, JP and his team ain't performing, on the field the people JP has entrusted arnt up to scratch.

The fact we have cheap ticket sales tells me, cheap product.

The fact people are disillusioned says to me, don't know his target market.
« Last Edit: December 07, 2014, 09:57:19 PM by Quakes Fan »
No matter where I roam, I will come back to the Brummie road, Cause no bonds, can ever tempt me from thee. The Jam (nearly)

baggiejohn

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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #5287 on: December 07, 2014, 09:39:49 PM »
Every game is losable, maybe if we keep it tight and avoid losing we can snatch a win now and then when we magically get all the breaks going our way. This works now and then but not very often, still we must persist with this model at all costs since Every game is losable, maybe if we keep it tight and avoid losing we can snatch a win now and then when.... (repeat this loop ad nauseam).

Actually, that's a really interesting theory - seriously.
As I've said on another topic, I don't understand this differentiation between a manager & a head coach, the principle works in other sports & there's no reason why it shouldn't work in football, but...............

Does anybody know for certain how our Coaching structure is set-up?
a)I assume that AI reports in to TB, & DK, KD & RK report in to AI, but what if they all report in to TB? Doesn't that undermine AI?
b)What are DK, KD & RK's main responsibilities? I assume that DK's speciality is goalkeeping, with the other two specialising in defence & attack.If that's not the case, then we might need to balance the coaching team.
c)What does AI look for when he's viewing our next opponents? Does he do a "SWOT" test (strengths, weaknesses, opportunities, threats) or does he just focus on their strengths & threats?

I'm not convinced we're doing a lot wrong, & IMO we don't need to rip up the blueprint & start again, but we do need to take a look at how the structure is set up, because clearly something's not right.
« Last Edit: December 07, 2014, 09:42:39 PM by baggiejohn »
If it was easy, it wouldn't be Albion

A wise old owl sat in an oak, the more he saw, the less he spoke
The less he spoke the more he heard, why aren't we like that wise old bird?

WestBromJim

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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #5288 on: December 07, 2014, 09:52:35 PM »
Actually, that's a really interesting theory - seriously.
As I've said on another topic, I don't understand this differentiation between a manager & a head coach, the principle works in other sports & there's no reason why it shouldn't work in football, but...............

Does anybody know for certain how our Coaching structure is set-up?
a)I assume that AI reports in to TB, & DK, KD & RK report in to AI, but what if they all report in to TB? Doesn't that undermine AI?
b)What are DK, KD & RK's main responsibilities? I assume that DK's speciality is goalkeeping, with the other two specialising in defence & attack.If that's not the case, then we might need to balance the coaching team.
c)What does AI look for when he's viewing our next opponents? Does he do a "SWOT" test (strengths, weaknesses, opportunities, threats) or does he just focus on their strengths & threats?

I'm not convinced we're doing a lot wrong, & IMO we don't need to rip up the blueprint & start again, but we do need to take a look at how the structure is set up, because clearly something's not right.

I agree kinda, but the 1st year we went to div 3 didn't we draw our last dozen games? Or close to?

Or as I understand sports in general, play to win, give yeah best, not good enough,,,oh well, always next year.
« Last Edit: December 07, 2014, 09:56:40 PM by WestBromJim »
No matter where I roam, I will come back to the Brummie road, Cause no bonds, can ever tempt me from thee. The Jam (nearly)

Mr Cynical

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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #5289 on: December 07, 2014, 09:56:53 PM »
Very depressing.  Not even having much of a go when it was obvious what a poor team Hull were.

Given time (that I hope he isn't going to get) I might subscribe to the opinion that AI is a good coach.  But I don't think I have seen anything to lead me to believe that he is a tactician, motivator or leader.  If they are not needed in the Head Coach position then where, in the club, does this come from?

We need someone who is going to lead this club and take people (players, colleagues and fans) with them.  Someone, that is going to come up with a tactical plan to succeed (not just to defend and hope for the best).  We need someone who is going to change talented assets like Blanco and Brown from squad fillers into points winners.  We need someone who is going to inspire everyone.

I don't think that person was on the short list for the Head Coaches position back in May/June.  So you have to try to make the job as attractive as possible in order to get them in.  So, JP, please go and find him.  Give them whatever job title they want, put the right support staff around them to create the environment to succeed rather than trying to jam the wrong person into the wrong position.  Its essential if you want to maintain your £80m turnover.

Mister AT

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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #5290 on: December 07, 2014, 10:00:32 PM »
Another reason why I see Irvine being here until end of January is, if Irvine is correct when he says the summer signings aint good enough, and we get a new manager in, he is going to want to spend and change the squad in January.

We are known to not spend, or spend very little in January so that could potentialy put off any new coach from coming in.

Which leaves AI in a job until February, by that time we will be close to gone (if current performances continue).
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Ste1987

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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #5291 on: December 07, 2014, 10:00:57 PM »
12:13pm - He's still here....

WestBromJim

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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #5292 on: December 07, 2014, 10:01:42 PM »
Very depressing.  Not even having much of a go when it was obvious what a poor team Hull were.

Given time (that I hope he isn't going to get) I might subscribe to the opinion that AI is a good coach.  But I don't think I have seen anything to lead me to believe that he is a tactician, motivator or leader.  If they are not needed in the Head Coach position then where, in the club, does this come from?

We need someone who is going to lead this club and take people (players, colleagues and fans) with them.  Someone, that is going to come up with a tactical plan to succeed (not just to defend and hope for the best).  We need someone who is going to change talented assets like Blanco and Brown from squad fillers into points winners.  We need someone who is going to inspire everyone.

I don't think that person was on the short list for the Head Coaches position back in May/June.  So you have to try to make the job as attractive as possible in order to get them in.  So, JP, please go and find him.  Give them whatever job title they want, put the right support staff around them to create the environment to succeed rather than trying to jam the wrong person into the wrong position.  Its essential if you want to maintain your £80m turnover.

Agree
No matter where I roam, I will come back to the Brummie road, Cause no bonds, can ever tempt me from thee. The Jam (nearly)

GrGr

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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #5293 on: December 07, 2014, 10:10:59 PM »
Very depressing.  Not even having much of a go when it was obvious what a poor team Hull were.

Given time (that I hope he isn't going to get) I might subscribe to the opinion that AI is a good coach.  But I don't think I have seen anything to lead me to believe that he is a tactician, motivator or leader.  If they are not needed in the Head Coach position then where, in the club, does this come from?

We need someone who is going to lead this club and take people (players, colleagues and fans) with them.  Someone, that is going to come up with a tactical plan to succeed (not just to defend and hope for the best).  We need someone who is going to change talented assets like Blanco and Brown from squad fillers into points winners.  We need someone who is going to inspire everyone.

I don't think that person was on the short list for the Head Coaches position back in May/June.  So you have to try to make the job as attractive as possible in order to get them in.  So, JP, please go and find him.  Give them whatever job title they want, put the right support staff around them to create the environment to succeed rather than trying to jam the wrong person into the wrong position.  Its essential if you want to maintain your £80m turnover.

Well put.

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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #5294 on: December 07, 2014, 10:14:56 PM »
I'm fed up with the albion, and bored of it too. I cant get excited about going to watch them anymore, I'm dreading the thought of going up Saturday, but I cant blame Irvine in full for that.

Irvine is a great coach, to many professionals have the same opinion so I agree with that. The problem is that a great coach can coach the players but they don't necessarily have the experience/knowledge to setup a team to compete. This is the problem and has been the problem for some time. The only reason Hodgson was so successful was because he was a manager but without the title. The scouting team do a good job and even though we get a few duds we also get a few good players too. Saido has developed a lot this season and some of that has got to because of Irvine.

I'm now of the opinion that we do not necessarily have to get rid of Irvine but we need to bring someone in that understands the tactics side and someone to pick the side. I think that sort of person is a called a manger. The problem would be if Irvine wouldn't want to stand down.

There is only one thing I'm certain of, is that if the team fails to perform against the villa, he is finished, There will be no way back for him, even though I'm not sure there is a way back now.

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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #5295 on: December 07, 2014, 10:19:30 PM »
http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/west-brom-ben-foster-says-8243981

Foster speaking highly of Irvine..

“He made a few changes and I think it worked. That formation and that team selection it really does work for us,”
That comment from Foster is sufficiently crass to justify everything that he said being ignored!

WorcsWBA

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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #5296 on: December 07, 2014, 10:20:43 PM »
I'd rather have Downing than Irvine tbh.
I'd rather have neither of them thanks - it's long overdue time for a new broom.

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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #5297 on: December 07, 2014, 10:22:44 PM »
Another reason why I see Irvine being here until end of January is, if Irvine is correct when he says the summer signings aint good enough, and we get a new manager in, he is going to want to spend and change the squad in January.

We are known to not spend, or spend very little in January so that could potentialy put off any new coach from coming in.

Which leaves AI in a job until February, by that time we will be close to gone (if current performances continue).




I think the players hes on about need a good run. hes got it wrong its he thats not good enough
Born and Bred in Oak Road West Bromwich B71   Est in the swinging sixties

GrGr

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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #5298 on: December 07, 2014, 10:22:58 PM »
I'd rather have neither of them thanks - it's long overdue time for a new broom.

I agree it's a bit of a false choice, but Irvine's football is simply too depressing.

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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #5299 on: December 07, 2014, 10:32:21 PM »
Imagine how depressing it's going to be when come the end of January he's still here and he's got rid of Ideye, Blanco and Varela without giving them a chance, before employing Chris Baird as the linchpin in our midfield for the remainder of the season. That's going to be fun isn't it?!