Author Topic: Matheus Pereira  (Read 260113 times)

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PartisanBaggie

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Re: Matheus Pereira
« Reply #2275 on: July 31, 2021, 02:09:00 AM »
Fair comment fella….it seems a long time ago but paying 100k a week (x 2) smashed our bank balance down to zero.

Unfortunately, as you’re well aware….there’s no money leaving China into the Prem. groups like Fosun are a global entity and have flexibility…we’re screwed.

If we go up Lai will surely run, and if it happens…we’ll all have been extremely lucky.

I’ve gone past the notion of Lai being able to sell the club anytime soon. Even if we are promoted, he’d still be faced with the same problem as last season. I guess that’s why this ‘longer-term’ plan is currently in situ.

As for the Chinese money thing, Lai hasn’t invested a penny since originally buying the club as an investment back in 2016. I don’t expect that to change either.

FOSUN on other hand are cutting back at the Custard Bowl.

PartisanBaggie

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Re: Matheus Pereira
« Reply #2276 on: July 31, 2021, 02:11:10 AM »
We may as well keep him for another season... I don't trust 'em.

Yep, me neither. That’s why I mentioned in an earlier post he’s probably already been sold.

frazzle

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Re: Matheus Pereira
« Reply #2277 on: July 31, 2021, 05:58:07 AM »
I'm afraid his price tag isn't going to reflect that. His next move may get him in the position where he has the opportunity to show he has the consistency and ability to justify that sort of rating but he's not there yet.

Yep totally agree. I think his level can be as high as he wants it to be but think his next move will be the stepping stone to that level, so we just need to get as much as we can.

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Re: Matheus Pereira
« Reply #2278 on: July 31, 2021, 07:51:46 AM »
It is really simple if Pereira was comparable with Grealish in the view of the people that matter i.e. Man City or another big 6 club then this is what they do. They buy Pereira and Johnstone for £50m. You have a comparable player to Grealish and you have Johnstone as a back up option and the key is Johnstone qualifies as home grown so that covers off one of the advantages that Grealish holds over Pereira. Even though Man City are richer than God they still won't turn their noses up at this because that is another £50m they can throw at Spurs for Kane.

Nobody is bidding more than £30m for Pereira because a) they don't need to for a whole host of reasons but the biggest is we are not in the Premier League and the player is looking at a 50% wage cut and  or b) they don't think he is as good as a similar player that they are prepared to pay £100m or £50m for.

It is not a disgrace it is not an insult it is something called reality.
The above is the cold , hard truth .
Comparing MP to Pogba is the same , Pogba has won things at the highest level as much as his 2nd spell at Old Trafford has been mixed .
Reality is 25m / 30m with addons is about right for MP.
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Re: Matheus Pereira
« Reply #2279 on: July 31, 2021, 08:07:21 AM »
If only matches against Chelsea were the only yardstick. We’d get £150 for Callum Robinson.

Harsh, we'd definitely get more than £150  ;) .
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Re: Matheus Pereira
« Reply #2280 on: July 31, 2021, 08:39:46 AM »
The fact that the top 6 have shown no interest in MP so far, indicates there is a concern about his capability at 'top level'.  It might be pace or perhaps defensive discipline.  I have to accept their superior judgement but frankly don't see it.  He's proved he can change a game at EPL level on a regular basis, his skills are almost unique, the pace of pass/vision are outstanding.

My forecast is that we will lose him for a fee in the £25m range, but he will move on within 2 years for £50m plus to a top team. 

Why the valuation consensus is so low, I just don't understand.  (Masi in one podcast thought £18m was OK).   Leicester sold Chilwell for £45m and Brighton sold White for £50m, are they the most talented players they've had in 40 years? ... I doubt it.  We once were raped by Man Utd but at least we sold our best player for a world record fee, now it seems Albion players are under valued even compared with Brentford!

If we are to be successful in the future we will have to change our image and become much more competent at the 'game' of hyping and selling our star assets.  The current set up is clearly not up to the task. 

LiamTheBaggie

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Re: Matheus Pereira
« Reply #2281 on: July 31, 2021, 08:58:43 AM »
It is really simple if Pereira was comparable with Grealish in the view of the people that matter i.e. Man City or another big 6 club then this is what they do. They buy Pereira and Johnstone for £50m. You have a comparable player to Grealish and you have Johnstone as a back up option and the key is Johnstone qualifies as home grown so that covers off one of the advantages that Grealish holds over Pereira. Even though Man City are richer than God they still won't turn their noses up at this because that is another £50m they can throw at Spurs for Kane.

Nobody is bidding more than £30m for Pereira because a) they don't need to for a whole host of reasons but the biggest is we are not in the Premier League and the player is looking at a 50% wage cut and  or b) they don't think he is as good as a similar player that they are prepared to pay £100m or £50m for.

It is not a disgrace it is not an insult it is something called reality.

Great post which sums up the realities of where we are.

People continue to use Buendia and Grealish as a yardstick. Those posters need to remember that both of those selling clubs are in the Premier League with no requirement to sell and can therefore attract a premium price.

We on the other hand are in the championship and do not have a pot to **** in.

Had we stayed up last season then you would find ourselves in the position of being able to request top dollar. We didn’t. And we now need the monies to invest in the current side of which Pereira has no future.
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Re: Matheus Pereira
« Reply #2282 on: July 31, 2021, 08:59:15 AM »
...

Why the valuation consensus is so low, I just don't understand.  (Masi in one podcast thought £18m was OK).   Leicester sold Chilwell for £45m and Brighton sold White for £50m, are they the most talented players they've had in 40 years? ... I doubt it.  ...

Thing is Leicester and Brighton were offering Chilwell and White the spotlit stage and wages of the Premier League.  Buying clubs know that clubs in the EFL are bound to sell sooner or later. 

The way I see it, situation is
a. we hold out for >£25M and get a large fee but too late in the window when the players that we are looking at are gone and we're left with a load of money (maybe taxable, I don't know WBA's accounting year, or maybe set against losses of previous years)

b. We hold on and don't sell him.  Then there's the strong possibility that he becomes sulky, does not train sufficiently; gets himself sent off for a rest or by precedent do an Evans, a Berahino or an Odemwingie on us.

c. We sell him early in the window (preferably overseas) for ~£25M and use the money to strengthen.

 
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overseas baggie

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Re: Matheus Pereira
« Reply #2283 on: July 31, 2021, 09:42:38 AM »
Thing is Leicester and Brighton were offering Chilwell and White the spotlit stage and wages of the Premier League.  Buying clubs know that clubs in the EFL are bound to sell sooner or later. 

The way I see it, situation is
a. we hold out for >£25M and get a large fee but too late in the window when the players that we are looking at are gone and we're left with a load of money (maybe taxable, I don't know WBA's accounting year, or maybe set against losses of previous years)

b. We hold on and don't sell him.  Then there's the strong possibility that he becomes sulky, does not train sufficiently; gets himself sent off for a rest or by precedent do an Evans, a Berahino or an Odemwingie on us.

c. We sell him early in the window (preferably overseas) for ~£25M and use the money to strengthen.

 

Re option A there is hardly any money about.  There will still be plenty of deals to be done on deadline day if we have cash.  We just need enough time to do those deals if Pereira is sold too late.

And the knock-on is that we suddenly sign several players then we will urgently need to ship out several young players on loan as they won't be needed for the first team squad.

frazzle

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Re: Matheus Pereira
« Reply #2284 on: July 31, 2021, 10:19:22 AM »
I’m still hanging on to the dream that he stays with us, gets us up, chooses to sign a ten year contract and takes us into Europe.

Adamstv

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Re: Matheus Pereira
« Reply #2285 on: July 31, 2021, 11:20:13 AM »
West Ham prefer a loan move with an option to buy but WBA wish to sell. The club are currently in negotiations with this and we have competition from other clubs. We are considering going back in with a £15m cash offer.” From ExWHU

£15m - are they having a laugh. That is an insult to the guy.

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Re: Matheus Pereira
« Reply #2286 on: July 31, 2021, 11:25:05 AM »
West Ham prefer a loan move with an option to buy but WBA wish to sell. The club are currently in negotiations with this and we have competition from other clubs. We are considering going back in with a £15m cash offer.” From ExWHU

£15m - are they having a laugh. That is an insult to the guy.

That would be an appalling offer. Should be laughed out of town.
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Re: Matheus Pereira
« Reply #2287 on: July 31, 2021, 11:49:50 AM »
This is a joke of a club run by idiots if we sell Matheus for anything less than £40 million. Billionaire owner your having a laugh.

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Re: Matheus Pereira
« Reply #2288 on: July 31, 2021, 11:51:38 AM »
You would think they would have asked the new manager if there will be a place in his system for our best player if he can't be sold but judging by the prices they are considering it seems not.

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Re: Matheus Pereira
« Reply #2289 on: July 31, 2021, 01:00:57 PM »
All I see about this matter is what I would class as ‘pub talk’ I doubt anyone knows exactly what is going on unless directly involved.

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Re: Matheus Pereira
« Reply #2290 on: July 31, 2021, 01:29:31 PM »
Thing is Leicester and Brighton were offering Chilwell and White the spotlit stage and wages of the Premier League.  Buying clubs know that clubs in the EFL are bound to sell sooner or later. 

The way I see it, situation is
a. we hold out for >£25M and get a large fee but too late in the window when the players that we are looking at are gone and we're left with a load of money (maybe taxable, I don't know WBA's accounting year, or maybe set against losses of previous years)

b. We hold on and don't sell him.  Then there's the strong possibility that he becomes sulky, does not train sufficiently; gets himself sent off for a rest or by precedent do an Evans, a Berahino or an Odemwingie on us.

c. We sell him early in the window (preferably overseas) for ~£25M and use the money to strengthen.

 

D. No one meets our valuation (circa £35 million) he gets his head down and gets us promoted, as there has been no sign of any dissent aside from selection issues throughout his career.
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baggie82

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Re: Matheus Pereira
« Reply #2291 on: July 31, 2021, 01:31:07 PM »
Why the valuation consensus is so low, I just don't understand.

I'm not part of this "consensus" but to answer your question I can only presume West Bromwich is part of Yorkshire.


OhBilics

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Re: Matheus Pereira
« Reply #2292 on: July 31, 2021, 02:06:59 PM »
You would think they would have asked the new manager if there will be a place in his system for our best player if he can't be sold but judging by the prices they are considering it seems not.
Ha! You'd think, wouldn't you. I can only assume they'd already decided to sell MP before getting the new manager in (see "that" report in The Times relating to January). You'd still think they'd take into account the strengths or otherwise of the rest of the squad and appoint someone whose style they could easily fit into, but no, they appoint someone whose style is high-press, high-energy, and our squad haven't played a high-press and who've been so unfit over the last seasons that some of them are blowing after half an hour of a normal game. But hey, this is Albion, and joined up thinking doesn't seem to be a strong point of our board.

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Re: Matheus Pereira
« Reply #2293 on: July 31, 2021, 02:21:34 PM »
Sadly it just seems their lack of vision and awareness of football related matters comes through again.

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Re: Matheus Pereira
« Reply #2294 on: July 31, 2021, 03:00:54 PM »
Ha! You'd think, wouldn't you. I can only assume they'd already decided to sell MP before getting the new manager in (see "that" report in The Times relating to January). You'd still think they'd take into account the strengths or otherwise of the rest of the squad and appoint someone whose style they could easily fit into, but no, they appoint someone whose style is high-press, high-energy, and our squad haven't played a high-press and who've been so unfit over the last seasons that some of them are blowing after half an hour of a normal game. But hey, this is Albion, and joined up thinking doesn't seem to be a strong point of our board.
Begs the question why VI took the job if we are such an ill fit. Is he just a mercenary then?

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Re: Matheus Pereira
« Reply #2295 on: July 31, 2021, 03:07:01 PM »
D. No one meets our valuation (circa £35 million) he gets his head down and gets us promoted, as there has been no sign of any dissent aside from selection issues throughout his career.

I agree with that, £35m would probably be my price too.

I think in a combination of desperation and Pereira’s desire to go we will do it for less though.

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Re: Matheus Pereira
« Reply #2296 on: July 31, 2021, 06:55:22 PM »
We may as well keep him for another season... I don't trust 'em.
Are you prepared to loan the club the 25-30m then?
If they agree to your demand of keeping him for another season?
If youre going to get told off, get told off for doing something not for doing nothing..

PartisanBaggie

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Re: Matheus Pereira
« Reply #2297 on: July 31, 2021, 08:37:44 PM »
D. No one meets our valuation (circa £35 million) he gets his head down and gets us promoted, as there has been no sign of any dissent aside from selection issues throughout his career.

Option D is where I’m at too.

£35million sounds about right for Pereira. I’d sooner he stayed on for another season though. That whole ‘keeping the nucleus of the team’ following previous relegations springs to mind.

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Re: Matheus Pereira
« Reply #2298 on: July 31, 2021, 08:38:16 PM »
Are you prepared to loan the club the 25-30m then?
If they agree to your demand of keeping him for another season?

You are implying the club needs to sell Pereira to stay afloat, which is not the case. We are okay financially for this season and Pereira goals / assists could be the difference that gets us promoted back to the Premiership at the first time of asking.

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Re: Matheus Pereira
« Reply #2299 on: July 31, 2021, 10:08:30 PM »
You are implying the club needs to sell Pereira to stay afloat, which is not the case. We are okay financially for this season and Pereira goals / assists could be the difference that gets us promoted back to the Premiership at the first time of asking.
I’m not
The only thing I’m implying is that people find it very easy to advise others on what to do with a 25m asset.
If youre going to get told off, get told off for doing something not for doing nothing..