Author Topic: Karlan Grant Signs  (Read 45765 times)

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miggybaggy

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Re: Karlan Grant Signs
« Reply #825 on: October 16, 2020, 09:59:06 AM »
Brief interview up on the WBA Facebook site. 

Already knows a few of the team, Sawyers, Diangana and Ajayi quite well it seems. He did call Ajayi "Shemi" though. Have we all been pronouncing it wrong?

Another positive note, Bilic seems to have spoken to him!

Yes. The one real positive I'm picking up is the tremendous team spirit that's developed amongst our squad over the past year or so. This could well become an important factor if we're to survive in the greed league. Go on Karian....make yourself into a hero.....everyone loves a goal scorer!

skyclad99

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Re: Karlan Grant Signs
« Reply #826 on: October 16, 2020, 10:02:55 AM »
Brief interview up on the WBA Facebook site. 

Already knows a few of the team, Sawyers, Diangana and Ajayi quite well it seems. He did call Ajayi "Shemi" though. Have we all been pronouncing it wrong?

Another positive note, Bilic seems to have spoken to him!

I read an article when he first joined, and it is pronounced Shemi apparently.
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baggiejohn

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Re: Karlan Grant Signs
« Reply #827 on: October 16, 2020, 11:33:10 AM »
I am surprised that Huddersfield are prepared to spread the payments over 6 years though, I can understand staged payments over 2 or 3 years. I am also surprised at the length of the contract as well, but got him and thats all that matters I guess.

I doubt that Huddersfield are prepared to spread the payments over 6 years. What's more likely, is we've taken out a loan that has to be repaid over a 6 year period. If it's a fixed interest loan, borrowing money is dirt cheap right now.
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Albionic

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Re: Karlan Grant Signs
« Reply #828 on: October 16, 2020, 04:02:55 PM »
welcome to the baggies Karlan, I wish you all the luck possible.

Lovin the championship, just lovin it !

gazberg

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Re: Karlan Grant Signs
« Reply #829 on: October 16, 2020, 05:14:41 PM »
Madeley/Athletic posted an article 10m ago saying its £12m, not 15m. 6x2m a year payments. That feels much better.

The Black Pearl

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Re: Karlan Grant Signs
« Reply #830 on: October 16, 2020, 06:17:43 PM »
I read an article when he first joined, and it is pronounced Shemi apparently.

Like Mish Moneypenny!
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Re: Karlan Grant Signs
« Reply #831 on: October 16, 2020, 06:28:16 PM »
Like Mish Moneypenny!

By Chrisht what an amuzhing analogy.
Now where'sh the button for the ejector sheat?
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Gilsey 56

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Re: Karlan Grant Signs
« Reply #832 on: October 16, 2020, 08:27:42 PM »
I so wish that this was true Gilsey. There are a fair few on here who it seems from their  normal critical postings who can't wait to see him fail.

Good luck Karlan- lots of goals and assists and 8+ level performances galore. You will need to be a super-hero mate!! Most of us ARE behind you

You maybe right mate, I hope we all want success deep down even if a few eat humble pie

BalisPen

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Re: Karlan Grant Signs
« Reply #833 on: October 16, 2020, 09:54:31 PM »
It’s not normal for a fee to be paid over the length of the players contract. It may not be unique but it’s rare from what I gather.

I’ve also never seen anything suggest we tried to get him from Charlton. Huddersfield were already heading down and we were looking good for promotion so who knows if we could have convinced him then. I imagine we probably could have but we had Gayle and J-Rod and no vision!

You should look harder then as we were definitely linked to him when he left Charlton.

BalisPen

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Re: Karlan Grant Signs
« Reply #834 on: October 16, 2020, 09:57:45 PM »
Madeley/Athletic posted an article 10m ago saying its £12m, not 15m. 6x2m a year payments. That feels much better.

So it has gone down in this thread from £15m to £14 to are good £12m.

Don't you just hate undisclosed feed.

johnny Cash

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Re: Karlan Grant Signs
« Reply #835 on: October 16, 2020, 10:07:31 PM »
You should look harder then as we were definitely linked to him when he left Charlton.

There was nothing more than tenuous links. Nothing to suggest we bid or tried.

gazberg

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Re: Karlan Grant Signs
« Reply #836 on: October 16, 2020, 10:07:46 PM »
I Iike the MLS way of just putting everything out in the open including wages but that's purely to satisfy my curiosity!

BalisPen

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Re: Karlan Grant Signs
« Reply #837 on: October 16, 2020, 10:24:56 PM »
There was nothing more than tenuous links. Nothing to suggest we bid or tried.

So you've gone from no links to tenuous links.

If you can't remember that is an issue for you.

We matched other bids of £2m and he was out of contract in 6 months when he moved then and Rangers wanted him on a free, so find another stick to beat the Albion with.
« Last Edit: October 16, 2020, 10:33:19 PM by BalisPen »

BalisPen

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Re: Karlan Grant Signs
« Reply #838 on: October 16, 2020, 10:30:09 PM »
I am surprised that Huddersfield are prepared to spread the payments over 6 years though, I can understand staged payments over 2 or 3 years. I am also surprised at the length of the contract as well, but got him and thats all that matters I guess.

No surprise really as it's a football debt which takes priority over any other debt includes the taxman, so will always have to paid and it is 6 income in their budget.

johnny Cash

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Re: Karlan Grant Signs
« Reply #839 on: October 16, 2020, 10:37:29 PM »
So you've gone from no links to tenuous links.

If you can't remember that is an issue for you.

We matched other bids of £2m and he was out of contract in 6 months when he moved then and Rangers wanted him on a free

Can you read? Show me where I said there was no links? I said there was nothing to suggest we actually tried to sign him previously. You were the one who suggested he had a decision to make between us and Huddersfield and chose them.  Which there is no evidence to suggest.






BalisPen

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Re: Karlan Grant Signs
« Reply #840 on: October 17, 2020, 01:46:03 AM »
Can you read? Show me where I said there was no links? I said there was nothing to suggest we actually tried to sign him previously. You were the one who suggested he had a decision to make between us and Huddersfield and chose them.  Which there is no evidence to suggest.

Yes I can read a little bit, but I have difficulty with big words.

So can you tell me what this means:

"I’ve also never seen anything suggest we tried to get him from Charlton"?

Stop digging.

Just because you knew nothing of our previous bid, it doesn't mean it didn't happen and that the club had "no vision" like you say.

Like I said before you haven't looked very hard for the evidence of the bid.

I wrote a post of my opinion of the transfer fee being staggered and how we had previously bid for him previously, and you countered it isn't normal, like you have inside knowledge of every player sale.

Staggered payments are not out of the ordinary at all and what ever you read on wiki or whatever doesn't make that gospel.






johnny Cash

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Re: Karlan Grant Signs
« Reply #841 on: October 17, 2020, 08:40:00 AM »
Yes I can read a little bit, but I have difficulty with big words.

So can you tell me what this means:

"I’ve also never seen anything suggest we tried to get him from Charlton"?

Stop digging.

Just because you knew nothing of our previous bid, it doesn't mean it didn't happen and that the club had "no vision" like you say.

Like I said before you haven't looked very hard for the evidence of the bid.

I wrote a post of my opinion of the transfer fee being staggered and how we had previously bid for him previously, and you countered it isn't normal, like you have inside knowledge of every player sale.

Staggered payments are not out of the ordinary at all and what ever you read on wiki or whatever doesn't make that gospel.

It means not every link, many of which are tenuous means we have or will act. By your logic Deeney, Grey and Ayew must have all turned us down to stay in the championship.

I also never said spreading payments wasn’t normal. I said spreading payments over the length of a players contract was not. You are changing what I’ve said. You may be confused between an accounting practice and instalments which is understandable.

I don’t take my opinions from wiki.  It’s you that is believing everything you read without establishing credibility. In fact no that’s not true, you read something then embellish.   


baggiejohn

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Re: Karlan Grant Signs
« Reply #842 on: October 17, 2020, 09:00:07 AM »
It means not every link, many of which are tenuous means we have or will act. By your logic Deeney, Grey and Ayew must have all turned us down to stay in the championship.

I also never said spreading payments wasn’t normal. I said spreading payments over the length of a players contract was not. You are changing what I’ve said. You may be confused between an accounting practice and instalments which is understandable.

I don’t take my opinions from wiki.  It’s you that is believing everything you read without establishing credibility. In fact no that’s not true, you read something then embellish.


Just to support your argument about spreading payments over the life of a contract.

If it is now common practice, it must be very recent.

I have trawled  through the accounts of several Premier League clubs of our size, accounts are currently available up to June 2019.

There is always an entry in creditors & debtors for amounts owing/being owed in more than one year.
If it were common practice to spread payments over the life of a contract, then you would expect the amounts owing in more than one year to be substantial, and they're not.

Players values are shown as intangible assets on the balance sheet. These values are amortised (reduced proportionately) over the life of the contract.
If we make a profit on the sale of the player, that is shown on the profit and loss statement
If it was easy, it wouldn't be Albion

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section5

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Re: Karlan Grant Signs
« Reply #843 on: October 17, 2020, 09:14:25 AM »

Just to support your argument about spreading payments over the life of a contract.

If it is now common practice, it must be very recent.

I have trawled  through the accounts of several Premier League clubs of our size, accounts are currently available up to June 2019.

There is always an entry in creditors & debtors for amounts owing/being owed in more than one year.
If it were common practice to spread payments over the life of a contract, then you would expect the amounts owing in more than one year to be substantial, and they're not.

Players values are shown as intangible assets on the balance sheet. These values are amortised (reduced proportionately) over the life of the contract.
If we make a profit on the sale of the player, that is shown on the profit and loss statement

Possibility that the recent situation reflects the structure of the deal? Does seem very odd

AlbionFan

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Re: Karlan Grant Signs
« Reply #844 on: October 17, 2020, 09:53:50 AM »
I think those old enough, would recognise it more as "Hire Purchase"  :D
My posts are my personal views and any links or external inclusions are not necessarily an endorsement by me.
I'm an ordinary bloke with no hidden agenda, here just to enjoy all things Albion etc.

It's all about opinions, so don't shoot the messenger if he/she has a different view to you!

BalisPen

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Re: Karlan Grant Signs
« Reply #845 on: October 17, 2020, 01:23:55 PM »
It means not every link, many of which are tenuous means we have or will act. By your logic Deeney, Grey and Ayew must have all turned us down to stay in the championship.

I also never said spreading payments wasn’t normal. I said spreading payments over the length of a players contract was not. You are changing what I’ve said. You may be confused between an accounting practice and instalments which is understandable.

I don’t take my opinions from wiki.  It’s you that is believing everything you read without establishing credibility. In fact no that’s not true, you read something then embellish.

It was late at  night and you know exactly what I meant by paying over the length of a contract as that was what you originally questioned.

You clearly said there was no evidence of any link when you wrote:
"I’ve also never seen anything suggest we tried to get him from Charlton"?
Therefore, you went from that to tenuous links, do you agree on that?

Now you seem to be saying you basically believe what you want to believe and that is all that matters.

Well that is great for you, but I don't go onto post on the ones you believe by saying there is no evidence of them which is basically saying I made it up.

So for clarification here's the link going back to when we were interested in him, which I chose to believe then and still do now and I wrote about it on here, an Wba forum, as I remembered the link from back then and now meant we were paying upto £13m more for him:

https://www.newsshopper.co.uk/sport/17379507.charlton-athletics-karlan-grant-wanted-number-clubs/

It is you who came on to dismiss my post purely based on you not remembering it and then you mentioned the the payment of fees over contract length not being normal and finished off with slagging the club off for having no vision in not chasing grant back in  Jan 2019, so don't try and now say I am embellishing what you said.






« Last Edit: October 17, 2020, 01:46:02 PM by BalisPen »

johnny Cash

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Re: Karlan Grant Signs
« Reply #846 on: October 18, 2020, 08:44:14 AM »
Once again, I’ve never denied there was a link to grant.

I said there is nothing to suggest we actually acted, whereas you said he chose Huddersfield over us.

Why is there nothing to suggest we acted...
1) the absence of any reported bids or further stories beyond a couple of tenuous links
2) none of the stories of him signing for Huddersfield suggested he rejected an offer from us.
3) none of the stories this time around have suggested we bid 18 months ago
4) Dowling has been quoted has saying we had followed his progress for a long time. He may have said we had tried to sign him previously but he chose the premier league if that had been the case

So there is nothing to suggest he choose them over us. You are the one believing what you choose to believe in the absence of any evidence. Do you not understand the difference between a tenuous link and action. I can’t keep going in circles and reaso man you out of a view you’ve clearly not reasoned Yourself in to.

In terms of the contract, once again there is nothing to suggest paying fees over a length of a players contract is normal.  Technically a bid, which you’d assume would explain how money would be paid would need to be accepted before you’d even discuss a players contact (although in reality all technicalities may not be ironed out until later). What you said was not demonstrably true there either, regardless of whether you are now trying to change what you ‘meant’.

Initially I I disagreed with two points you made, because neither appear to be true. Both cases were you taking 2+2 and making 37.

BalisPen

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Re: Karlan Grant Signs
« Reply #847 on: October 18, 2020, 03:33:03 PM »
Once again, I’ve never denied there was a link to grant.

I said there is nothing to suggest we actually acted, whereas you said he chose Huddersfield over us.

Why is there nothing to suggest we acted...
1) the absence of any reported bids or further stories beyond a couple of tenuous links
2) none of the stories of him signing for Huddersfield suggested he rejected an offer from us.
3) none of the stories this time around have suggested we bid 18 months ago
4) Dowling has been quoted has saying we had followed his progress for a long time. He may have said we had tried to sign him previously but he chose the premier league if that had been the case

So there is nothing to suggest he choose them over us. You are the one believing what you choose to believe in the absence of any evidence. Do you not understand the difference between a tenuous link and action. I can’t keep going in circles and reaso man you out of a view you’ve clearly not reasoned Yourself in to.

In terms of the contract, once again there is nothing to suggest paying fees over a length of a players contract is normal.  Technically a bid, which you’d assume would explain how money would be paid would need to be accepted before you’d even discuss a players contact (although in reality all technicalities may not be ironed out until later). What you said was not demonstrably true there either, regardless of whether you are now trying to change what you ‘meant’.

Initially I I disagreed with two points you made, because neither appear to be true. Both cases were you taking 2+2 and making 37.

What gets me is who made you the arbiter of what link I should believe?

It appears that you consider yourself some kind font of all Albion knowledge because you have time to post more often than me and you still keep on digging, as if you haven't any recollection of something it must not have happened.

Truth is neither of know what really happened in January 2019, even though it was widely reported then and as the article shows sky sports reported it. We also reported to be after Joe aribo from Charlton, but I suppose because you cannot remember that either, it didn't happen.

But, we do know is you came for me and basically said I made it up even though I didn't respond to any post you put up on this thread, including the one where you clearly said you wish we went after him in Jan 2019 essentially.

Instead  you accused me of embellishing what you said, which I did not as you cleary said : "no evidence" then went onto "tenuous links" to now trying to dissect what has been said by dowling, which supports my argument not yours BTW.

I wrote:

"I hope some add ons are involved to take it to £15m, as still gutted we missed out on him when he went for £2m, but the prem swayed him then too."

So did I say he chose Huddersfield over US? No

Or id I say I am gutted we missed out on him which is reasonable given the links you didn't know about claiming them to be non existent (yes that is what no evidence means) and then hedging your bets to tenuous links.

It was YOU  who said if he had the choice he would have chosen us as we looked like we'd get promotion and huddersfield were doomed.

And now you have been shown a credible link that we may have tried you cannot accept something happened at the Albion you knew nothing about then and now, and still continue to deny it.

You clearly went from no evidence (your words which you keep trying to forget) to tenuous evidence to now saying essentially because  Dowling didn't ring and tell of our interest at the time, the long term interest he has now admitted, which you accept, must have begun the day after we missed out on him.

Regarding the fee, how do you know it is not normal practice now, are you party to every contract we agree?

As given our very limited resources it is an excellent way to get players now without the massive outlay upfront.

So to sum up your honour, please, please believe me and the link evidence and YOU stop making up stuff like I said he rejected us.


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Re: Karlan Grant Signs
« Reply #848 on: October 18, 2020, 03:34:02 PM »
Are you two still at it?? ;D
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Re: Karlan Grant
« Reply #849 on: October 18, 2020, 03:36:05 PM »
Dowling “we have followed Karlan’s progress for a long time”.

Shame we hadn’t been following a little longer, perhaps we could have signed him in Jan 19 when we should have, for a fraction!

Decent signing though, particularly with one eye on next season.

Here's your comment, which I didn't respond to as you can see. You could have reciprocated and said whatever I missed something in Jan 2019 and not commented and moved on, but instead you went the opposite way completely and now continue with clearly unproven argument and make up that in said he rejected us.

But, it was you who came for me saying essentially I had made it up the link in Jan 2019 as you had not seen anything : "I’ve also never seen anything suggest we tried to get him from Charlton"?"
your words).

And all because this post clearly shows you knew nothing of the January 2019 interest and was happy to put the boot into the club when you said we had "no vision" to do it.
« Last Edit: October 18, 2020, 03:50:52 PM by BalisPen »