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Author Topic: How do we change our style?  (Read 6118 times)

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Offline seteefeet

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How do we change our style?
« on: October 26, 2017, 10:17:01 AM »
Ok, I'm not a fan of Pulis, never have been, probably never will be but, I'm not a "Pulis Hater" either.
To be honest, if I could watch Albion playing decent football and winning games, I couldn't care less if it was Pulis, Guardiola or Sammy Cheung in charge!

So,
Question 1) What would you do to change our style, using the current group of players?
Question 2) If Pulis did it would you back him? Or is it just too late?

Personally, all I would do, is drop one of the DM's and bring in a no.10, play proper full backs and cut the cord between said full backs and wide midfielders.

Quite simple really, no high line or ticca takka, just allow the players a bit of freedom of expression and movement.

And, yes,  if Pulis did this ("flying pig emoji"), I would be happy for him to stay.


Offline ashdoy

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Re: How do we change our style?
« Reply #1 on: October 26, 2017, 10:40:09 AM »
Ok, I'm not a fan of Pulis, never have been, probably never will be but, I'm not a "Pulis Hater" either.
To be honest, if I could watch Albion playing decent football and winning games, I couldn't care less if it was Pulis, Guardiola or Sammy Cheung in charge!

So,
Question 1) What would you do to change our style, using the current group of players?
Question 2) If Pulis did it would you back him? Or is it just too late?

Personally, all I would do, is drop one of the DM's and bring in a no.10, play proper full backs and cut the cord between said full backs and wide midfielders.

Quite simple really, no high line or ticca takka, just allow the players a bit of freedom of expression and movement.

And, yes,  if Pulis did this ("flying pig emoji"), I would be happy for him to stay.

I would allow full backs to overlap much more. Chadli/Brunt/McClean arent 'direct' wingers and prefer to drift forward with the ball so this allows the full backs chance to overlap to create spaces between defensive lines.

I would play a good old number 10 behind the front man. Would play more grounded football. No suggesting like City but at least try to give the front players the bal at their feet, with support, further forward.

I also would ask our backline to play 30 yards higher. I do believe we have the lowest offsides against us in the league as our backline is so deep, all the time!
Hoof Hoof! Thats the sound of da Pulis!

Offline saltnshake

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Re: How do we change our style?
« Reply #2 on: October 26, 2017, 11:02:20 AM »
I would allow full backs to overlap much more. Chadli/Brunt/McClean arent 'direct' wingers and prefer to drift forward with the ball so this allows the full backs chance to overlap to create spaces between defensive lines.

I would play a good old number 10 behind the front man. Would play more grounded football. No suggesting like City but at least try to give the front players the bal at their feet, with support, further forward.

I also would ask our backline to play 30 yards higher. I do believe we have the lowest offsides against us in the league as our backline is so deep, all the time!

We can’t play our defence 30 yards further up the pitch they don’t have the pace and teams would get in behind us, what we do need to do is stop using the wide players as second fullbacks and allow them to play further forward, also play Chadli behind Jay we need to keep the ball better.
« Last Edit: October 26, 2017, 12:24:10 PM by B_H_Baggie »

Offline ashdoy

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Re: How do we change our style?
« Reply #3 on: October 26, 2017, 12:23:32 PM »
We can’t play our defence 30 yards further up the pitch they don’t have the pace and teams would get in behind us, what we do need to do is stop using the wide players as second fullbacks and allow them to play further forward, also play Chadli behind Jay we need to keep the ball better.

Well without it we'd be facing an impossible task of playing "football" further up the pitch, wouldnthave play-round lines or a saftey pass. They need to be closer to the midfield if the midfield were pushed higher.

Im going to get on Football Manager 2018, my tactics will see us win the league in 12months. :)
Hoof Hoof! Thats the sound of da Pulis!

Offline Backofthenet

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Re: How do we change our style?
« Reply #4 on: October 26, 2017, 12:24:33 PM »
As I have said (and thought) a few times previously, football is not really complicated.
You get the ball and keep it. When you have possession the other team can't score. The other best way to achieve this is to score goals yourself. You can only do this when you've got the ball.
So in real terms, all this technical stuff goes out of the window. They spoke ;last season about hitting balls long into space and 'chasing it'. Logic says if you do that you've given it away. When I played if it got hoofed forward to clear lines or reprieve for the defence the target used to be to force a throw in deep in opposition half - at least you could then get forward and try to make them, play.
All we do is sit back and wait and with the best will in the world everyone has a mistake in them and other things affect that - tiredness, short lapse of concentration, just outplayed. That results in another losing performance and disillusionment.
George Best never just hoofed it but he could dribble, pass, shoot and tackle. At the Albion he would have been converted to a centre back to boot it clear and not leave his own half.
We could do it there just needs to be a will.
Incidentally Leicester fans don't seem overjoyed with their appointment !!

Offline seteefeet

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Re: How do we change our style?
« Reply #5 on: October 26, 2017, 12:40:51 PM »
As I have said (and thought) a few times previously, football is not really complicated.
You get the ball and keep it. When you have possession the other team can't score. The other best way to achieve this is to score goals yourself. You can only do this when you've got the ball.
So in real terms, all this technical stuff goes out of the window. They spoke ;last season about hitting balls long into space and 'chasing it'. Logic says if you do that you've given it away. When I played if it got hoofed forward to clear lines or reprieve for the defence the target used to be to force a throw in deep in opposition half - at least you could then get forward and try to make them, play.
All we do is sit back and wait and with the best will in the world everyone has a mistake in them and other things affect that - tiredness, short lapse of concentration, just outplayed. That results in another losing performance and disillusionment.
George Best never just hoofed it but he could dribble, pass, shoot and tackle. At the Albion he would have been converted to a centre back to boot it clear and not leave his own half.
We could do it there just needs to be a will.
Incidentally Leicester fans don't seem overjoyed with their appointment !!
So what would you do?
I'm just interested to hear what people would do differently, if anything, in Pulis' shoes.
If we all say different things then it's obviously not that easy. If, however, we all come up with the same solution, we cannot all be wrong surely?

Offline FallOutBoy

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Re: How do we change our style?
« Reply #6 on: October 26, 2017, 12:56:16 PM »
First thing I'd do is play people in their proper positions across the back four; so it would go:

Nyom - Dawson - Evans - Gibbs

Secondly I would prioritize possession of the ball. If you have the ball, and you are in their half, they can't score, as Old Big 'ead once said.

Set up the midfield so that there was variation in attack. Barry / Yacob can sit, Greg can get up and down, Chadli can play behind the striker. Then we have an old-fashioned winger on one side (Burke / Phillips / Leko) and a more crafty footballer on the other (Brunt). This would allow more flexibility in our attacking play.

Support Rondon / Rodriguez when they have the ball. If they go wide, somebody takes up a central position, and we still carry a threat.

Don't be scared of the ball. Don't be scared to try something special. Know your role within the team, but don't be afraid to do something that you think can make a difference - express yourself.

We actually have some decent players. If we just try to play on the front foot for once, be proactive and not reactive, then we might get somewhere.

Offline crocodile007

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Re: How do we change our style?
« Reply #7 on: October 26, 2017, 01:26:32 PM »
First thing I'd do is play people in their proper positions across the back four; so it would go:

Nyom - Dawson - Evans - Gibbs

Secondly I would prioritize possession of the ball. If you have the ball, and you are in their half, they can't score, as Old Big 'ead once said.

Set up the midfield so that there was variation in attack. Barry / Yacob can sit, Greg can get up and down, Chadli can play behind the striker. Then we have an old-fashioned winger on one side (Burke / Phillips / Leko) and a more crafty footballer on the other (Brunt). This would allow more flexibility in our attacking play.

Support Rondon / Rodriguez when they have the ball. If they go wide, somebody takes up a central position, and we still carry a threat.

Don't be scared of the ball. Don't be scared to try something special. Know your role within the team, but don't be afraid to do something that you think can make a difference - express yourself.

We actually have some decent players. If we just try to play on the front foot for once, be proactive and not reactive, then we might get somewhere.

That's exactly how I see it. Someone else mentioned it earlier too - cut the tie between wide player and full back. I'm sick of seeing Chadli/JRod playing as full backs.

Offline Backofthenet

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Re: How do we change our style?
« Reply #8 on: October 26, 2017, 01:43:55 PM »
I think we should start at the back with retaining possession.
Encourage Foster to throw or kick to a well placed wide player. - Full back or deeper lying winger. Let them move the ball through the midfield who should be wanting it. Get it out to wingers who should be encouraged to run at defenders or cross into the box for forwards to get in a strike or retain possession. Not easy but practical - perhaps we should practice with a ball and actually passing it through the team.
So much for style but what system. Personally 4-4-2 fits because most systems should be flexible and players have to take some responsibility for this. If a full back is getting punished the  winger or midfielder should help out. By the same token if a winger cuts inside the full back should overlap to provide an outlet or stretch the defence.
   
My side would look like this:-
                                                          Foster

Nyom                              McAulley                       Evans                   Gibbs

Phillips                            Yacob                        Krychowiak                 Brunt

                                          Rodriguez                 Robson-Kanu

Not everyones choice I accept, but I think I could motivate these and this is also quite 'balanced'.
Dawson would be in (for Evans) but he is now out for around 8 weeks - sad loss.   

Offline 17GD

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Re: How do we change our style?
« Reply #9 on: October 26, 2017, 01:49:44 PM »
I'd be tempted to go 4-1-4-1. Maybe Yacob in front of the back four, which would give our midfield a higher pressing point. I'd also try to keep the same players playing, unless injury sets in of course, as I think a grounded team is better than rotation.

+ LB and LW to constantly link up and overlap, same on the right

+ I would want possession, as opposed to letting the opposition have it, so high pressing and urgency to win the ball. I would never get angry with players who run and try to get possession, even when they make errors, I just hate a lethargic approach.

+ ensure wingers get the ball in the box as soon as possible. If the striker isn't in the box waiting then I'd be blaming the striker and supporting striker. If the ball isn't in the box you can't score.

+ in training I would be working on passing and distribution, right from the GK. At times our passing is woeful.

+ tell the players to shoot on sight and don't be afraid to miss.

This approach would excite the fans, and with an excited crowd comes a confident team and ultimately, a fortress.

Online Droitwich Baggie

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Re: How do we change our style?
« Reply #10 on: October 26, 2017, 02:13:21 PM »
Learn to pass the ball to one of our own.

Offline Fritzl Palace

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Re: How do we change our style?
« Reply #11 on: October 26, 2017, 02:59:13 PM »
The thing is, under Pulis, you could list any formation you wanted to, the players will still be instructed to play in the same manner.

Pulis has a way of working, it has been very successful for him and has made him extremely wealthy, should have made him even more wealthy had he not been ridiculous with Palace. He is never going to change that, even if we get back to the way we were playing last season, there would still be very little successful passing to our players or keeping the ball and creating chances that way, it would still be get the ball forward quickly just with a winger who is able to beat a man and force corners to give us our best chance of a goal.

That way is not for me but I wouldn't expect him to change just because fans aren't a fan of it, which is why it is the club who need to, or needed to last summer for me, act.

Offline seteefeet

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Re: How do we change our style?
« Reply #12 on: October 26, 2017, 03:09:21 PM »
The thing is, under Pulis, you could list any formation you wanted to, the players will still be instructed to play in the same manner.

Pulis has a way of working, it has been very successful for him and has made him extremely wealthy, should have made him even more wealthy had he not been ridiculous with Palace. He is never going to change that, even if we get back to the way we were playing last season, there would still be very little successful passing to our players or keeping the ball and creating chances that way, it would still be get the ball forward quickly just with a winger who is able to beat a man and force corners to give us our best chance of a goal.

That way is not for me but I wouldn't expect him to change just because fans aren't a fan of it, which is why it is the club who need to, or needed to last summer for me, act.
What if he were to change though mate, and it worked? As one of his biggest critics, would you accept him?

Offline Fritzl Palace

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Re: How do we change our style?
« Reply #13 on: October 26, 2017, 03:23:04 PM »
What if he were to change though mate, and it worked? As one of his biggest critics, would you accept him?

Of course. I only judge anyone on what I see week in week out. I have nothing against him personally.

Offline Backofthenet

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Re: How do we change our style?
« Reply #14 on: October 26, 2017, 03:31:23 PM »
Just read a quote from Chris Wilder -

"The game doesn't change though. You have got to outwork the opposition, out-run the opposition, then get on the ball and play in a way that people want to see you play and be positive with it". This is in an article on the BBC Sport website.

I wonder if anyone at the club has read it

Interesting

Offline A5HB

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Re: How do we change our style?
« Reply #15 on: October 26, 2017, 04:10:03 PM »
I don't think we need a particularly drastic style change myself. I have no problem having less of the ball, trying to play on the break and defend properly. I just wish we would give ourselves more of a chance on games and give the opposition something to worry about.

We probably need to play 10-15 yards higher up the pitch as a team, as well as maybe pushing the midfield or some of them anyway a little higher too. Basically we still keep a decent shape but we can press teams a bit more in their half/near half way and make them play through as opposed to playing in front or around us. Hopefully this would then get the wide players a bit higher so that when we knick it we can break a bit quicker. Would be nice to try and make the pitch a bit bigger when we have the ball too, so we can play out a bit more too, as opposed to going forward quickly and playing off the front. Just need to keep the wide players wide and allow for a bit more movement off the ball.

As I say, nothing hugely drastic but a few tweaks to make the matches more even.

Offline Standaman

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Re: How do we change our style?
« Reply #16 on: October 26, 2017, 04:59:11 PM »
If Pulis was inclined to tweak his system then I suspect it would have happened by now the fact that it hasn't would suggest that it won't happen.

Making the deep sitting block work better from an attacking perspective.

1. Invert the wingers to get them closer to the lone Centre Forward.
2. Use at least one of the full backs to provide width probably Gibbs
3. Spring counters from the goal keeper rather than wasting time

This would improve us as an attacking force, without interfering with the base system.

Obviously I would like to go further but baby steps. 


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Offline seteefeet

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Re: How do we change our style?
« Reply #17 on: October 26, 2017, 06:47:59 PM »
If Pulis was inclined to tweak his system then I suspect it would have happened by now the fact that it hasn't would suggest that it won't happen.

Making the deep sitting block work better from an attacking perspective.

1. Invert the wingers to get them closer to the lone Centre Forward.
2. Use at least one of the full backs to provide width probably Gibbs
3. Spring counters from the goal keeper rather than wasting time

This would improve us as an attacking force, without interfering with the base system.

Obviously I would like to go further but baby steps.
Happy for him to stay if he did that, or too late?

Online Albionic

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Re: How do we change our style?
« Reply #18 on: October 26, 2017, 07:09:02 PM »
It's more about attitude than system,
1.Stop the time wasting
2. Launch it skywards only as a necessity
3. Aim to keep ball on ground as much as possible
4. Be prepared to try using skills to beat people
5. Make runs off the ball to drag opponents out of position
6. If you try something and lose the ball, be ready to try something again
7. Be audacious and occasionally play to the crowd
8. Try shooting from distance
Lovin the championship, just lovin it !

Offline Standaman

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Re: How do we change our style?
« Reply #19 on: October 26, 2017, 08:15:50 PM »
Happy for him to stay if he did that, or too late?

Too little too late it really just about the limit that I think that Pulis might embrace. Note I don't expect us to play through the midfield or play further up the pitch or even abandon the deep sitting block at home against even modest opponents.
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Offline SmethDan

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Re: How do we change our style?
« Reply #20 on: October 26, 2017, 11:17:52 PM »
No need for some on here to change their style.

I've heard three star jumpers, flares and platform shoes are making a comeback next year  ;D .
It doesn't matter how many resources you have.
If you don't know how to use them, they will never be enough.
Oh, and always remember to defecate on those Vile chaps in claret and spew.

Offline HampshireBaggie

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Re: How do we change our style?
« Reply #21 on: October 26, 2017, 11:41:59 PM »
I’ve always thought we’ve looked better when we press teams.

Offline TheJacko2000

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Re: How do we change our style?
« Reply #22 on: October 26, 2017, 11:47:02 PM »
Pinstripes?
Proud to be a Baggie. BOING BOING.

Offline chipperclark

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Re: How do we change our style?
« Reply #23 on: October 27, 2017, 12:00:02 AM »
 ;D Play 2 upfront...you cannot have Rondon running around like a headless chicken,on his own, and expect him to score goals. I would suggest Chadli or JRod for this role,as the "second striker".

Need a flair,creative midfielder like Aaron Moy to pull the strings in attack....we haven't had one of these for 10 years,and we are crying out for creativity and organisation.

Need Burke fit to give us some pace down the flanks.

I think the Defensive formation is fairly strong,but need Yacob back in the team,we win more with him playing.

Well thats my 2 bobs worth....now Tony take it on board.

Offline wba_1996

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Re: How do we change our style?
« Reply #24 on: October 27, 2017, 12:33:51 AM »
There's no way we'll ever change style under Pulis. We time-waste from the first whistle in every game, regardless of the opposition and regardless of the score. Even appointing Sam Allardyce would make us more attacking by default, you can't go backwards from Pulis on that front.

If you're asking how we would change style if someone else came in; Playing players in their correct positions would be a start, Dawson would never start a game at right back again in his career, abandoning the 3 defensive mids, playing 15 yards further up the pitch, encouraging players to pass the ball to each other, stop the time-wasting, encourage the players to express themselves, show intent to actually win football matches.

All of the above could be achieved without even abandoning our 'defensive' play style and under a pragmatic manager. Sadly Pulis has become a parody of himself, the way he approaches a football match is actually worse than what the 'Tony Pulis long ball dinosaur' jokes would have you believe. I'm sure we'll see this again when the lineup is announced to face Man City.