Author Topic: Darren Moore  (Read 858580 times)

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baggies_24

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Re: Darren Moore
« Reply #1650 on: October 04, 2018, 07:04:35 AM »
The defending is abysmal and I think it could cost us id Darren Moore doesn't get it addressed in the transfer window.
As dingle don said last night it would be almost impossible to finish in the top two with a goals against like ours.

But I tell you what, we can never be accused of being boring can we.
Keep it going boys

I like that the boys never gave up last night it shows the character they have and shows we will not be out of many games this season. The defending is very worrying at the moment, to get out of this league you have to go to places like Rotherham on a cold Tuesday night in January & scrape a  2-1 1-0 win even when you haven’t played very well. We managed it the season we went up under Mowbray & Di Matteo at the moment we look as though we have to score a minimum 2 goals in a game to get anything out of it. Certainly not complaining as it’s a breath of fresh air compared to some of the rubbish we’ve been served up the past 3 years but if the current defending isnt improved I can see it costing us down the line.

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Re: Darren Moore
« Reply #1651 on: October 04, 2018, 07:55:59 AM »
1 defeat in 10 and some want him gone

 :-[

Unbelievable isn't it?

I notice that a few are saying that they are staying quiet on the forum due to the negativity, and I will admit that I have taken a step back. The in play thread makes me smile - there are a few contributors on there who just want to have a go, comments about 'hoof ball' and general negative observations are just a waste of electricity and time.... but some feel compelled to do this from the comfort of their armchair watching a dodgy and illegal stream........

Personally I love whats going on and what Darren has done for the club. Caught us all out with the triple sub last night, and regardless of your thoughts before that we did not look like scoring - after it we nicked a point so go figure. That's why Darren and Graham manage to the team and we all have jobs etc

I don't think that it will take a few keyboard warriors to tell them that our defence is bobbins, they already know.

Can't wait to go to the ground on Saturday.....COYB!!
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Re: Darren Moore
« Reply #1652 on: October 04, 2018, 08:19:38 AM »
I like that the boys never gave up last night it shows the character they have and shows we will not be out of many games this season.

The character we show in ganes under Moore is one of the big highlights of his reign so far.

I'll continue to voice my opinion on the aspects I feel we are failing with because this is a discussion forum, not a cheer leading zone, but that doesn't mean I want Moore gone.

It is clear the players will fight all the way for him and that they enjoynplaying for him. We have came back from behind a few times now, especially late in games and that fight is needed to get out of this division.
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Re: Darren Moore
« Reply #1653 on: October 04, 2018, 08:35:08 AM »
I think some of us are becoming like vile fans and think we have a divine right to go back up.

Personally I don't think that's the case at all. I believe it is because people think we have the best squad in the division, despite signing Mears and Bartley, and therefore should be going straight back up because we have the players to do it. Put it another way, with the squad we have compared to the likes of a Sheffield United who now sit above us, would you not be disappointed if we didn't finish top two at the end of the season? I would personally see that as failure given the tools at our disposal.


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Re: Darren Moore
« Reply #1654 on: October 04, 2018, 08:46:38 AM »
I think some of us are becoming like vile fans and think we have a divine right to go back up.

The teams we are playing are used to this division and more importantly the rigours of Saturday then Wednesday games.

To expect to turn up at sheff wed and expect us to batter then is ridiculous as these teams are usually a few points behind us and they are at home.

It sickens me to read comments like this division is dross as it is not, as it has a lot of competitive teams who have spent heavily over the years trying to go up.

The defence is worrying but the positives are we don't throw in the towel and we get that crucial away point to which helps us get the average 2 points per game we need.

I believe the person who wrote that formed his opinion from watching a number of games on tv.
By & large, I agree with him, there are a lot of poor sides in the Championship, but there are also some 6 to 8 sides who all have the potential for automatic promotion. I believe we are among them, but are not outstandingly better than any of them.
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Re: Darren Moore
« Reply #1655 on: October 04, 2018, 08:48:42 AM »
I think some of us are becoming like vile fans and think we have a divine right to go back up.



To be honest getting promoted does nothing for me.
Give me the rough and tumble of the Championship every wee.
I have something this season I haven't had for 3 or 4 seasons!
Value for money and entertainment.
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Re: Darren Moore
« Reply #1656 on: October 04, 2018, 08:51:21 AM »
Personally I don't think that's the case at all. I believe it is because people think we have the best squad in the division, despite signing Mears and Bartley, and therefore should be going straight back up because we have the players to do it. Put it another way, with the squad we have compared to the likes of a Sheffield United who now sit above us, would you not be disappointed if we didn't finish top two at the end of the season? I would personally see that as failure given the tools at our disposal.

My feelings haven't changed at all, I think we'll maybe scrape play offs at best, the starting xi has a couple of issues in midfield and at the back, add to those a couple of injuries and suspensions and we could have problems. We've missed Phillips massively in the last couple of games and got away with it. We certainly have no divine right to go up and if we do this squad needs major work as in the main it got us relegated with gutless performances, the 2 bright sparks we have are not ours and neither will be here next season, out of the other 2 regular new signings Johnstone would be fine in the Prem but Bartley from what we've seen so far is not convincing.

I tend to ignore (and usually remove) comments saying we're like vile fans etc etc as it tends to take away anything in that particular post worthwhile.
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Re: Darren Moore
« Reply #1657 on: October 04, 2018, 08:59:11 AM »
My feelings haven't changed at all, I think we'll maybe scrape play offs at best, the starting xi has a couple of issues in midfield and at the back, add to those a couple of injuries and suspensions and we could have problems. We've missed Phillips massively in the last couple of games and got away with it. We certainly have no divine right to go up and if we do this squad needs major work as in the main it got us relegated with gutless performances, the 2 bright sparks we have are not ours and neither will be here next season, out of the other 2 regular new signings Johnstone would be fine in the Prem but Bartley from what we've seen so far is not convincing.

I tend to ignore (and usually remove) comments saying we're like vile fans etc etc as it tends to take away anything in that particular post worthwhile.

Oh I would certainly agree on the promotion front. We would not keep getting away with abject performances like we have this season, we would be punished accordingly by better strikers so there would be some serious work required, but for this season, I do feel that we have the best squad in the division so anything less than top two isn't good enough. I would agree that our failure to bring in cover for Phillips and address the centre of midfield are issues, but there aren't many teams with great midfields in this league so we can get away with it and have done to date thanks to our firepower.

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Re: Darren Moore
« Reply #1658 on: October 04, 2018, 09:36:13 AM »
I do think that we need to look at bringing in a CB who is comfortable playing out from the back in January, who that is I don't know.

I've read a few comments to the effect that we won't get promoted leaking goals the way we do but we do have a positive goal difference and Huddersfield got promoted, albeit through the play offs, with a negative goal difference so it can happen.
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leeiswba

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Re: Darren Moore
« Reply #1659 on: October 04, 2018, 09:48:26 AM »

I tend to ignore (and usually remove) comments saying we're like vile fans etc etc as it tends to take away anything in that particular post worthwhile.

Don’t know mate, I am starting to agree with it.

The reaction after those subs last night was shocking, booing the manager when we were top of the league 2 days ago and the one who brought a bit of pride back to us last season, never mind the fact is he a modern day legend.

Sounds exactly like villa fans to me, don’t know if I just notice it more now but I don’t remember fan turning so quick 10 years ago

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Re: Darren Moore
« Reply #1660 on: October 04, 2018, 10:22:10 AM »
Don’t know mate, I am starting to agree with it.

The reaction after those subs last night was shocking, booing the manager when we were top of the league 2 days ago and the one who brought a bit of pride back to us last season, never mind the fact is he a modern day legend.

Sounds exactly like villa fans to me, don’t know if I just notice it more now but I don’t remember fan turning so quick 10 years ago

Nothing different to be honest just that these days theres more places like this for those views to be aired.

Point stands people want to start telling others to go down the villa or the wolves may find themselves looking for another forum, does nothing to get debate on here and just ruins what ever else you post. People have a right to air their opinion whether positive or negative without being told to go elsewhere for having a differing view.
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leeiswba

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Re: Darren Moore
« Reply #1661 on: October 04, 2018, 10:40:11 AM »
Nothing different to be honest just that these days theres more places like this for those views to be aired.

Point stands people want to start telling others to go down the villa or the wolves may find themselves looking for another forum, does nothing to get debate on here and just ruins what ever else you post. People have a right to air their opinion whether positive or negative without being told to go elsewhere for having a differing view.

Doesn't bother me in the slightest people moaning on here mate and I agree its saft people telling others to go up the Villa, my problem is with the people at the game last night who decided to boo the manager and his decision.

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Re: Darren Moore
« Reply #1662 on: October 04, 2018, 10:57:38 AM »
I think the positives massively outweigh the negatives with Big Dave, biggest one being i actually look forward to games!

I think he has got a lot of things right but its now at the stage to admit the defensive experiment isnt going to work as it is. I know we are the buzz words of 'transition' and 'work in progress' and i think its obvious going forward and our style are testament to that, we have improved massively.

However defensively there is no signs of any real improvement, we are nearly a quarter of the way through the campaign and if anything i would say its got worse, if we had the odd game where we shocking you would say ok but it happens nearly every game, there comes a point to say thats enough.

Its not just that Hegazi, Dawson and Bartley are out of form (which they are) but its the fact they just dont look comfortable with the basics of the role, they all look nervous and this spreads to the keeper too.

Dawson has gone from being one of our most consistent performers in the league above to a shell of the player he was, i am not Hegazi's biggest fan but he has his strengths yet at the moment he is an accident waiting to happen and watching Bartley on those surges is painful to watch at times.

I dont blame the players too much, i said at the start of the season i didnt see why a midfielder should need to drop and take the ball off them two yards away as the defenders at that level should be able to pass and carry a ball forward. I got that badly wrong, i do find it staggering that multi million pound footballers do struggle to pass and control a ball more than 10 yards but they clearly do.

If the long term plan was going to be playing out from the back then i do wonder why on earth we signed Bartley, if you want a stereotypical championship centre half who will head and kick anything, you sign Bartley. If you want somebody to keep possession and build from the back, you dont sign Bartley.

I love the you score 2 we score 3 in theory but if you want to win promotion which i assume we do, then there has to be a balance, you have to give yourself a chance with a clean sheet, we dont get out of bed unless we concede at least 1 and lately its more and more conceding 2's, its just not sustainable, you dont actually win anything when you defend as bad as we do, no matter how good your strikers are.

We dont have the defensive personnel to play the way Mooro and Jones want to play, i think revert back to what our defenders strengths are, style and formation wise for now then look to sign players who suit ball playing and 3 at the back.

We have tried something new, it hasnt worked for now, it happens to all coaches, learn from it, change it and move on.

At home i fancy us to blitz anyone and i would put half the premier league teams in with that too, away from home its very different. Big Dave said before the game last night it was all about the performance, he didnt really get that and its happened quite often away so maybe the time is to say, okay how we are setting up / approaching games away isnt working, you cant play well every game but we havent really played well away from home at all so again learn from it, change it and move on!

I have no idea if Big Dave got lucky with the subs last night or if it was tactical genius or panic subs, i like to see the positives and give the benefit of the doubt and with what he has achieved i would like to think it was the plan all along, something he has also added is the never give up attitude, players want to play for him, he is implementing a style we all want to see, as a fan i have said what i think we could improve but my job isnt on the line here but the biggest thing he has done is added pride back to our club, after the last few years of being classed as anti football, a bit of joke club last year, we now have the pride back and i put that down to one man - Darren Moore.

« Last Edit: October 04, 2018, 11:03:14 AM by Albion79 »

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Re: Darren Moore
« Reply #1663 on: October 04, 2018, 11:17:06 AM »
We are still in a transistional peroid

If we was to sack Moore would set us back even more.

The players are fighting for Moore. We need that

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Re: Darren Moore
« Reply #1664 on: October 04, 2018, 11:25:28 AM »
I think the positives massively outweigh the negatives with Big Dave, biggest one being i actually look forward to games!

I think he has got a lot of things right but its now at the stage to admit the defensive experiment isnt going to work as it is. I know we are the buzz words of 'transition' and 'work in progress' and i think its obvious going forward and our style are testament to that, we have improved massively.

However defensively there is no signs of any real improvement, we are nearly a quarter of the way through the campaign and if anything i would say its got worse, if we had the odd game where we shocking you would say ok but it happens nearly every game, there comes a point to say thats enough.

Its not just that Hegazi, Dawson and Bartley are out of form (which they are) but its the fact they just dont look comfortable with the basics of the role, they all look nervous and this spreads to the keeper too.

Dawson has gone from being one of our most consistent performers in the league above to a shell of the player he was, i am not Hegazi's biggest fan but he has his strengths yet at the moment he is an accident waiting to happen and watching Bartley on those surges is painful to watch at times.

I dont blame the players too much, i said at the start of the season i didnt see why a midfielder should need to drop and take the ball off them two yards away as the defenders at that level should be able to pass and carry a ball forward. I got that badly wrong, i do find it staggering that multi million pound footballers do struggle to pass and control a ball more than 10 yards but they clearly do.

If the long term plan was going to be playing out from the back then i do wonder why on earth we signed Bartley, if you want a stereotypical championship centre half who will head and kick anything, you sign Bartley. If you want somebody to keep possession and build from the back, you dont sign Bartley.

I love the you score 2 we score 3 in theory but if you want to win promotion which i assume we do, then there has to be a balance, you have to give yourself a chance with a clean sheet, we dont get out of bed unless we concede at least 1 and lately its more and more conceding 2's, its just not sustainable, you dont actually win anything when you defend as bad as we do, no matter how good your strikers are.

We dont have the defensive personnel to play the way Mooro and Jones want to play, i think revert back to what our defenders strengths are, style and formation wise for now then look to sign players who suit ball playing and 3 at the back.

We have tried something new, it hasnt worked for now, it happens to all coaches, learn from it, change it and move on.

At home i fancy us to blitz anyone and i would put half the premier league teams in with that too, away from home its very different. Big Dave said before the game last night it was all about the performance, he didnt really get that and its happened quite often away so maybe the time is to say, okay how we are setting up / approaching games away isnt working, you cant play well every game but we havent really played well away from home at all so again learn from it, change it and move on!

I have no idea if Big Dave got lucky with the subs last night or if it was tactical genius or panic subs, i like to see the positives and give the benefit of the doubt and with what he has achieved i would like to think it was the plan all along, something he has also added is the never give up attitude, players want to play for him, he is implementing a style we all want to see, as a fan i have said what i think we could improve but my job isnt on the line here but the biggest thing he has done is added pride back to our club, after the last few years of being classed as anti football, a bit of joke club last year, we now have the pride back and i put that down to one man - Darren Moore.


We don't have the personnel to play the way we are playing you say BUT we are one point off the top of the league and since Jones's arrival we have lost one game a last minute handball goal vs Middlesbrough.

We clearly do have the players to play this way but it's an education for fans because we all grew up on four at the back and building from a solid defence. The game has evolved though and some fans perceptions haven't.

Yes of course we need to improve at the back  no denying that but people threw the same criticisms at Man City two seasons ago that we are getting now. It takes time but we're clearly doing a lot right and getting results.

The game nowadays favours attacking teams particularly in league formats. In cups or over a short period of time teams can succeed by being more pragmatic, France in the world cup is a good example but over a large number of games the Man City's, the Liverpool's, the Barcelona's come out on top.

We're doing OK and the three at the back gives us so much more flexibility going forward. I love it.
« Last Edit: October 04, 2018, 11:27:05 AM by Atomic »

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Re: Darren Moore
« Reply #1665 on: October 04, 2018, 11:41:46 AM »
We are still in a transistional peroid

If we was to sack Moore would set us back even more.

The players are fighting for Moore. We need that

Exactly. I said on the after match debate thread, just look at the reaction from Barnes following his equaliser when he ran to the fans. We'd never have come back from two down away from home in the last couple of seasons, and that's all down to Moore's man management.

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Re: Darren Moore
« Reply #1666 on: October 04, 2018, 11:45:53 AM »
I don't see how anyone can watch that defence and think "yeah, we have the players to play this way".  Our attack, and the best part of that attack we don't even own, are bailing us out.  Can they do it for the entire season?  Who knows.

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Re: Darren Moore
« Reply #1667 on: October 04, 2018, 12:11:51 PM »
Yes, the defence isn't perfect but the greatest thing missing from our team is a box to box midfielder it's the midfield which is causing us problems especially when playing away.
 

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Re: Darren Moore
« Reply #1668 on: October 04, 2018, 12:12:01 PM »
Our attack is bailing our defence out at the moment, you shouldnt need to score 2 goals to get at least a point.

Our defenders are out and out defenders, they are not ball playing defenders, they have probably spent their entire careers heading and kicking everything, they are now being being asked to play in a completely different way and they just dont look comfortable, if there were signs of improvement then you stick with it, but they arent improving and with each game they are turning into poorer versions of the players they were.

You wouldnt ask Brunt to start playing as a tough tackling hatchet man centre midfielder, you wouldnt ask Barry to be your box to box midfielder, you wouldnt ask Robson Kanu to play the number 10 creative centre forward role, its not what they do or what they are good at in that role, yet we are asking 3 no nonsense centre halves to be our starting point of keeping possession and starting attacks, when the reality is they are struggling with even the basics of organisation let alone passing the ball and bringing it out of defence, it just isnt their game, play to the strengths and they will look good defenders again.

Teams dont cut us open, they dont have to work that hard , we tend to just gift them chances from our own basic errors, usually passing the ball to them on a regular basis or the defenders having a breakdown in communication, we have conceded one of the highest amounts in the league.

Get Hegazi, Dawson and Bartley back doing what they are good at for now, then gradually (probably starting january) sign defenders who can play the way that Moore and Jones want us too, Rome werent built in a day!

« Last Edit: October 04, 2018, 12:13:52 PM by Albion79 »

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Re: Darren Moore
« Reply #1669 on: October 04, 2018, 12:41:37 PM »
On reflection I am in complete agreement with Oldbury WBA's response to my post on negativity last night.  It is the diverse nature of opinion, both positive and negative, on a forum like this that makes it interesting and will keep me posting.  However, I don't think anybody is suggesting that posters would be better off at the Villa or Wolves, or even that negative comments should be discouraged.   It's just that it doesn't seem the Albion way as I know it!  I will get back to Darren Moore but to explain what I mean.....

I was born in Oldbury in the 70's but too late in the decade to have seen or even remember the real glory years in yellow and green.   Unfortunately, I was just old enough (a year is a long time when your a diddler) to be aware of Villa's European cup win and remember the number of Claret and Blue shirts that turned up at school after that.  That win gave all Villa fans I knew an arrogance and sense of superiority that held good for three decades.....and still seems to be instilled.  How can the tenure of a man like Bruce be ended by a cabbage!!  Funny yep......but at least Gould got the dignity of a coffin.   

Prior to the arrival of SGM my best days as an Albion fan were the Swansea semi-final at home and Ossie's day at Wembley...around that was a load of pooh to be honest.  How can you become arrogant and carry expectation with that background.   So I've been grateful to Sir Gary, the Celtic Judas (he's now forgiven) RDM, Uncle Roy and even SC for our promotions and subsequent success in the PL.  Then AP :( TP arrived; Peace wanted his investment protecting, football died and I lost the love.....nuff said.   Ignoring AP, we end up with Darren Moore and pride is restored but not our Premiership status. 

So we are now back at the level I know best with a manger who is a club legend, a fully qualified coach but first time manager learning on the job, one of our own from just down the road, playing ridiculously attacking football, using free transfers and not out of choice, who is great friends with one of the best coaches in the country, has an eye for real young talent (Barnes is REAL talent), a good man motivator (Dawson) and well liked within the game.  We are top scorers in the league, and even top for a few days!!  Good football, pride restored and as an aside West Brom just happen to have taken a punt on one of the few black managers in the country (a little nod back to our heritage).

And yet there are still the odd posters who seem unhappy with his appointment and are even now ready to call for his head?  I am probably just misreading the posts, just as it is easy to misread the intonation in texts and emails.   This is probably just in game frustration coming from a desire to win and do well, and wanting what's best for the Albion!!  However, this is not the Albion way I know and not the way of my Albion mates I spoke to this morning.... but I DO agree it does make the forum interesting and enjoyable to take part in, in a way a good old love-in would not.   I look forward to the "heated debates" when we do have that inevitable run of poor results.   

Apologies if my posts go on a bit........

 

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Re: Darren Moore
« Reply #1670 on: October 04, 2018, 01:26:15 PM »
It would be interesting to see the style of play and tactics particularly defensively had Moore chose Appleton or someone else as his assistant. Jones obviously has a big say in what happens .

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Re: Darren Moore
« Reply #1671 on: October 04, 2018, 01:46:37 PM »
Our defence is looking aweful at the moment and I agree that they are not comfortable at playing the ball out. However they are not helped by having 2 central midfielders who don't offer them a pass and if they do, they pass it straight back to them
Whether they are comfortable on the ball or nor, 3 or 4 at the back would have made no difference to the goals conceded last night. We knew Wednesday had scored many goals from outside the box so we let their best player have a free shot from 20 yards out. He was never closed down. The second was a joke and the fact they cant pass the ball to each other made no difference
Keep with 3 at the back, but look for better quality but please sort out that centre midfield. Anyone notice Brunts best moment came from a cross from the wing. If we want to shoehorn Brunt into the side we should have played him instead of Mears for the last 2 games.

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Re: Darren Moore
« Reply #1672 on: October 04, 2018, 01:47:05 PM »
It would be interesting to see the style of play and tactics particularly defensively had Moore chose Appleton or someone else as his assistant. Jones obviously has a big say in what happens .

Jones is key to it all....coached at PL level with success and at the world cup with Belgium.  Would not have come here were it not for his friendship with Darren Moore.  They have both said that they share the same footballing philosophies, but Darren Moore has no experience of implementing ideas wheras GJ has a decade of it.

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Re: Darren Moore
« Reply #1673 on: October 04, 2018, 02:50:21 PM »
Moore was the one who wanted to change the style. If he hadn't we wouldn't of appointed jones.

Sack Moore and we lose jones and end up having to change things again

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Re: Darren Moore
« Reply #1674 on: October 04, 2018, 03:08:23 PM »
we have bucked trends in the past, can we PLEASE buck one more, no sacking manager / coach for a min of 3 years - lets have some stability and BUILD for success, not demand instant gratification.
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