Author Topic: Under 23's / Academy Thread (Read 646121 times)

wba_1996 · « **Reply #1300 on:** July 07, 2019, 01:20:53 PM »

Issue we've got with the likes of Fitzwater and Wilson is they haven't had an extended period of games where they have stood out on loan. However, Edwards barely got a kick at Exeter then scored a screamer for them in the Play Offs and looked decent in his limited chances for Albion.

If they aren't obviously head and shoulders above when on loan, like Berahino was, then it's a difficult call to make. Wilson could be capable back-up next season, or he could be completely out of his depth. That's where a decent manager either brings through a young talent, or makes the call to get experienced cover. From the little I've seen, I'd be worried if Fitzwater or Wilson were in our back 4 for any extended period.

paulosull · « **Reply #1301 on:** July 07, 2019, 02:27:51 PM »

Problem we have is the depth of our squad so youngsters have to be kept around just in case of injuries etc.

baggie96 · « **Reply #1302 on:** July 07, 2019, 05:57:51 PM »

The three players who could go to the very top are/were Barry, Rogers and one a year younger called Rico Richards. Hopefully Rogers stays as genuinely think he could be a decent bench option even this season.

paulosull · « **Reply #1303 on:** July 07, 2019, 06:04:29 PM »

Quote from: baggie96 on July 07, 2019, 05:57:51 PM

The three players who could go to the very top are/were Barry, Rogers and one a year younger called Rico Richards. Hopefully Rogers stays as genuinely think he could be a decent bench option even this season.

I think Bilic might have the balls to play a few youngsters this season

baggie96 · « **Reply #1304 on:** July 07, 2019, 06:08:52 PM »

Quote from: paulosull on July 07, 2019, 06:04:29 PM

I think Bilic might have the balls to play a few youngsters this season

Hope so. Weâ€™ve got players who can go onto become decent standard, ie harper, field, Oâ€™Shea, tulloch, Edwards etc. These are all obviously older so should be closer to the team. Oâ€™Shea in particular has had rave reviews from Exeter fans. Kane Wilson is a strange one, he was massively rated a couple of years ago, suppose heâ€™s still only 19 but hasnâ€™t really kicked on.

baggie96 · « **Reply #1305 on:** July 08, 2019, 03:56:06 PM »

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-7225029/Manchester-City-swoop-highly-rated-West-Brom-England-17-starlet-Morgan-Rogers.html

Weâ€™re being torn apart

bradleysrocket · « **Reply #1306 on:** July 08, 2019, 04:01:32 PM »

Quote from: baggie96 on July 08, 2019, 03:56:06 PM

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-7225029/Manchester-City-swoop-highly-rated-West-Brom-England-17-starlet-Morgan-Rogers.html

Weâ€™re being torn apart

wonder what we are likely to receive by way of compensation/fee.

Signor_Maresca · « **Reply #1307 on:** July 08, 2019, 04:06:21 PM »

FFS this is getting ridiculous.

kris_boing · « **Reply #1308 on:** July 08, 2019, 04:09:28 PM »

It's disgusting that this can happen. Really have to start questioning whether it's actually worth having an academy if our best kids keep getting pinched.

AlbionFan · « **Reply #1309 on:** July 08, 2019, 04:40:16 PM »

Itâ€™s a food chain and begs the question of why we arenâ€™t doing similar to smaller clubs than us?

Dan · « **Reply #1310 on:** July 08, 2019, 04:47:01 PM »

I think a better route for us would be Brentford's B team where its basically just a bunch of very cheap signings, kind of Mowbray's underbelly idea on a bigger scale. We had some dreadful players from that but the likes of Dorrans and Mulumbu made it more than worth it. Seems far more profitable and if we do get anyone decent from it they're under contract.

SmethDan · « **Reply #1311 on:** July 08, 2019, 04:51:09 PM »

Quote from: baggie96 on July 08, 2019, 03:56:06 PM

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-7225029/Manchester-City-swoop-highly-rated-West-Brom-England-17-starlet-Morgan-Rogers.html

Weâ€™re being torn apart

If this goes through it rips the absolute urine out of the academy and compensation system.

Vexed.

kc56wba · « **Reply #1312 on:** July 08, 2019, 04:53:10 PM »

Didn't Peace try and stop this thing happening during a Premiership meeting and was voted down by the top six clubs.

Topman · « **Reply #1313 on:** July 08, 2019, 04:53:42 PM »

This truly is a proper blow. Was looking forward to seem him come into the squad this year. I am at a loss to see how this is fair. Fulham lost one to Liverpool. It seems clubs are stockpiling as someone said. Thereâ€™s a decent chance Rogers will go nowhere with his career but when they can pay whatever the player is made. Iâ€™m kinda getting done with football

divinewind · « **Reply #1314 on:** July 08, 2019, 04:55:02 PM »

As i said before, why is it always us they come for. You can add England pinching Hodgson and Ashworth as well.
Nobody comes for Nuno or Neves at the Wolves. If they had been ours they would be at United or somewhere now.
This club is going down the drain and i think it is deliberate neglect.
We are just a nursery club. The owner is an assett stripper.

divinewind · « **Reply #1315 on:** July 08, 2019, 04:59:37 PM »

No money to buy players, and having our youngsters stolen after years of coaching. What is the point of being a football club?
So drunk off with the game now, waste of time and effort bothering.

koren · « **Reply #1316 on:** July 08, 2019, 05:18:11 PM »

Jamie Soule would be the next one if he can't break into 1st team this season.
The club have to convince the youngsters that their future is here, there would be chances to play if they stay.

Albion79 · « **Reply #1317 on:** July 08, 2019, 05:28:27 PM »

As somebody said above, we should be doing the same to smaller clubs than us.

There will be championship, league one and league two clubs with a standout player or two in their academy who maybe arent quite ready for Liverpool or Man City (yet) we should be going in and getting them.

Its depressing but thats football, there is a food chain, there is no point the club crying and feeling sorry about players who have gone or are going, they arent ours anymore so move on and do the same to others as whats happened to us.

alex1 · « **Reply #1318 on:** July 08, 2019, 05:37:40 PM »

I still think Â£2 million a year, if that figure is correct, represents good value for the Academy. That money nowadays would only get you a run-of-the mill defender in the transfer market. But we must keep blooding youngsters in the first team. Otherwise we are completly dependant on what we can afford in the transfer market.

Baggies · « **Reply #1319 on:** July 08, 2019, 05:54:33 PM »

We have to ask why this keeps happening to us with such frequency, and not to clubs like Southampton, Palace and Norwich.

I think there are 2 things the club needs to do.

One is provide an environment which the players trust is the best possible place for them to be. So far our failure to develop a player from an 8 year old into a first teamer who then goes on to bigger and better things is a black mark (Field, Leko, Edwards all examples of this).

The second, and i've said this before, is for a long term strategic rethink at the academy. We are a striker specialist academy. Brown, Sinclair, Roberts, Barry and Rogers have all been nicked, with Dhanda being an attacking midfielder. Even those we kept, Berahino, Wood, Nabi, Sawyers, Roofe and promising kids Soule and Tulloch - these players blossom earlier than any other position, meaning they can show potential at 16 and start to look like they are worth a punt. Problem then is that we can't tie them down until they are 17 so they are easy pickings.

The clubs making big money out of their academies develop players who take longer to shine. Wing backs, wide men, defenders and midfielders.

I think we need to work harder to identify players in these positions and ease off having so many strikers. We just don't get any value from the strikers, as seen by this weekends double hammer blow.

baggie96 · « **Reply #1320 on:** July 08, 2019, 06:08:02 PM »

There is something deeply wrong with our academy, the amount of players we are losing is abysmal. Rogers is a huge wba fan and so are his family, he is on the cusp of the first team. Why does he want to leave? No point producing players for someone else.

Dan · « **Reply #1321 on:** July 08, 2019, 06:45:35 PM »

Quote from: baggie96 on July 08, 2019, 06:08:02 PM

There is something deeply wrong with our academy, the amount of players we are losing is abysmal. Rogers is a huge wba fan and so are his family, he is on the cusp of the first team. Why does he want to leave? No point producing players for someone else.

Well some of it is just the clubs coming in for them but the clubs plans for players above 18 is extremely poor really. It seems an endemic thing as well, Jimmy Shan was a full on youth coach and still gave very little in the way of opportunity. Including playing Murphy who did nothing and barely tried consistently ahead of Edwards.

I imagine if you were a young player coming through you'd look at the likes of Field, Edwards and Leko with a lot of concern. Not going on loan, not getting game time, there just doesn't seem a development plan in place for them. We keep youth players in the squad as back ups who have no realistic chance of playing. Then every summer sign a bunch of players in front of them, because they can't be trusted because they haven't played. Then you've got people like Tyler Roberts who never got a chance here, probably friends with some of these players telling them how much better it is when they leave.

Aside from the absolute elite tier of player all young players are going to be relatively inconsistent and need time to grow, but the rewards can be huge if given. This club never gives that opportunity. The fans also are not used to it and extremely impatient with players, look how many were willing to write Harper off already.

lewisant · « **Reply #1322 on:** July 09, 2019, 09:41:45 AM »

A lot of people saying there's something wrong with our academy but we aren't alone in this happening sadly https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/48913138

For that youngster, Liverpool does seem a better shout than Man City/Chelsea mind.

popmonkey · « **Reply #1323 on:** July 09, 2019, 12:33:53 PM »

One of the problems with our academy is that in the past the structure/coaches had been there for a long time, and were well trusted, so could give genuine advice on whether a player was ready for the step-up. By going cheap on the first team management, the club has lost Darren Moore and Jimmy Shan from the setup completely, leaving it with less experienced coaches, and removing some of the clear pathways that previously existed.

I wouldnt be surprised if we were very tight when it comes to wages of the young players, relying heavily on appearance/performance bonuses rather than wages, whilst also being very negative towards players' agents. All this is bound to push the players' representatives to recommend them move elsewhere, which will generate the agent more cash in the short term, with little regard to the player's ongoing development.

Why should a player be loyal if the club doesn't show they respect their talent?

FallOutBoy · « **Reply #1324 on:** July 09, 2019, 12:39:39 PM »

Quote from: AlbionFan on July 08, 2019, 04:40:16 PM

Itâ€™s a food chain and begs the question of why we arenâ€™t doing similar to smaller clubs than us?

We are. But because it's us and a smaller club, it isn't really newsworthy. We've done it as far back as George Thorne.

Also the sums involved might be smaller, but they mean more to the clubs involved because they aren't earning premier league money.