Author Topic: Tony Pulis  (Read 5133255 times)

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fatboy_coach

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Re: Tony Pulis
« Reply #500 on: January 25, 2015, 10:00:04 AM »
5Live were reporting it as a chance for TP to see Dawson and McAuley play together in a competitive game. Hopefully it was a one off cup thing as others have said.

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Re: Tony Pulis
« Reply #501 on: January 25, 2015, 10:15:36 AM »
If Man Utd are having trouble getting results, then why are people moaning about what we're seeing, at our level?

Man Utd are a million miles ahead of us, won dozens of trophies in the past 20 years, but look at them now. They are struggling to scrape results, losing at home etc yet they have some of the best players money can buy: Rooney, van Persie, Di Maria De Gea....

I was one of the many who moaned as soon as AI was unveiled, but I believe I had valid reason to: he had no PL experience, had been out of management for a number of years and his previous jobs included teams from lower leagues. We all knew he probably wouldn't last until Christmas so, why experiment? Why not just get the right person first time?

TP is the exact opposite: He has bags of experience, the past number of years keeping Stoke in the PL and doesn't take any stick from anyone. This is the exact thing we need. Players got comfortable under the old system and needed to have their butts kicked around the changing room. A massive clear out happened - something we all begged for all last season.

Yes, it's frustrating when we don't play well and win, but if you want that satisfaction every week (almost) of winning AND playing attractive football then you may as well go and watch someone like Chelsea or Man City. It doesn't even happen at Arsenal and Spurs, who are massive clubs.

TPs first game saw a 7-0 win, do you honestly think we'd have had that under the previous management? We'd have scraped a 1-0, if we were lucky. You could hear TP shouting instructions to get forward and attack right from the off. This guy means business and has the ability to keep us in the league. We need to toughen up and get some points on the board.

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Re: Tony Pulis
« Reply #502 on: January 25, 2015, 10:51:05 AM »
I think there is a certain amount of whistling in the dark going on here. Yes once there are a few different players maybe things will be a little less disjointed but the basic Pulisball model is well established. Fine get a couple of wingers in but if they are playing as deep as we did against Everton they are not going to make very much difference.

Hiring Pulis is giving up on anything else other than survival by any means possible although on the upside he does takes the cup's seriously and doesn't rotate his teams much so I would hope that a few cup runs to sustain interest.

Short term he is the right man for the job and I am happy to grinding out results but I don't believe it is really a transition to something that will ever be anything other than I slightly more progressive version of Pulisball. Longer term I do wonder where we will end up at the end of the Pulis era.
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robnewbold

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Re: Tony Pulis
« Reply #503 on: January 25, 2015, 10:56:44 AM »
So bad he's undefeated and close to getting Manager of the Month for January.

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Re: Tony Pulis
« Reply #504 on: January 25, 2015, 10:59:07 AM »
Why do I keep reading 'if you want to win playing good football go watch Chelsea/Man City blah blah blah?' I doubt any West Brom fan believes this is possible in every game we play but so far in Tiny's reign we have beaten a mid table conference side who out footballed us for 40 minutes, scraped a fortunate 1-0 against (arguably) the worst team in the Prem, parked a Boeing 747 against a very defensively poor Everton team & showed no intent to win the game & yesterday put 11 men behind the ball for the whole of the second half against a very very average Championship side who looked like a rabbit in the headlights in the first half & were there for the taking without having to endure a squeaky bum last 20 minutes.

None of the following are mutually exclusive:

Win playing good football
Lose playing good football
Win playing ugly
Lose playing ugly

A balance is needed & Mr Pulis will receive my support for 90 minutes each week, for the remainder of the season in the hope he can get us playing any of the above four in a four match cycle, I hope those telling others to 'go watch other teams' will try to understand that, as fans we have an opinion too.   
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stokelad84

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Re: Tony Pulis
« Reply #505 on: January 25, 2015, 11:11:41 AM »
'Good football' as a term is too vague. Playing good means different things to different people. If West Brom had more possession in the next game there will still be supporters on here saying the football is ugly.

Man United are a great example. For the first 60 minutes against QPR they had 65% possession and created 4 attempts. Lots of backwards and square passing to the 3 center halves. Controlling the ball and keeping all the opposition players in their half. Some West Broms on this thread would consider this good football.

The last 30 minutes, van Gaal switched to 4-4-2, brought on Fellaini for extra height and went more direct. The possession dropped to 50%, but they created 8 shots and converted 2 of those. Some people may consider that last 30 minutes ugly, but they were more dangerous and ended up winning the game.

Football is and will always be a results business. Owners and Chief Executives will bang on about entertainment to justify charging £40+ to watch a game of footy. But while the games are decided on goals and not on a score based system like Ice Skating, the result will always be more important.

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Re: Tony Pulis
« Reply #506 on: January 25, 2015, 11:22:03 AM »
'Good football' as a term is too vague. Playing good means different things to different people. If West Brom had more possession in the next game there will still be supporters on here saying the football is ugly.

Man United are a great example. For the first 60 minutes against QPR they had 65% possession and created 4 attempts. Lots of backwards and square passing to the 3 center halves. Controlling the ball and keeping all the opposition players in their half. Some West Broms on this thread would consider this good football.

The last 30 minutes, van Gaal switched to 4-4-2, brought on Fellaini for extra height and went more direct. The possession dropped to 50%, but they created 8 shots and converted 2 of those. Some people may consider that last 30 minutes ugly, but they were more dangerous and ended up winning the game.

Football is and will always be a results business. Owners and Chief Executives will bang on about entertainment to justify charging £40+ to watch a game of footy. But while the games are decided on goals and not on a score based system like Ice Skating, the result will always be more important.


You always talk a lot of sense, enjoy reading your input.

In TP we trust

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Re: Tony Pulis
« Reply #507 on: January 25, 2015, 11:23:53 AM »
If Man Utd are having trouble getting results, then why are people moaning about what we're seeing, at our level?

Man Utd are a million miles ahead of us, won dozens of trophies in the past 20 years, but look at them now. They are struggling to scrape results, losing at home etc yet they have some of the best players money can buy: Rooney, van Persie, Di Maria De Gea....

I was one of the many who moaned as soon as AI was unveiled, but I believe I had valid reason to: he had no PL experience, had been out of management for a number of years and his previous jobs included teams from lower leagues. We all knew he probably wouldn't last until Christmas so, why experiment? Why not just get the right person first time?

TP is the exact opposite: He has bags of experience, the past number of years keeping Stoke in the PL and doesn't take any stick from anyone. This is the exact thing we need. Players got comfortable under the old system and needed to have their butts kicked around the changing room. A massive clear out happened - something we all begged for all last season.

Yes, it's frustrating when we don't play well and win, but if you want that satisfaction every week (almost) of winning AND playing attractive football then you may as well go and watch someone like Chelsea or Man City. It doesn't even happen at Arsenal and Spurs, who are massive clubs.

TPs first game saw a 7-0 win, do you honestly think we'd have had that under the previous management? We'd have scraped a 1-0, if we were lucky. You could hear TP shouting instructions to get forward and attack right from the off. This guy means business and has the ability to keep us in the league. We need to toughen up and get some points on the board.

Great post....spot on

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Re: Tony Pulis
« Reply #508 on: January 25, 2015, 11:31:46 AM »
The football dished up may be dull, turgid and boring but it's no different to what half of the other teams in the Prem serve up.

As others have pointed out it's all about staying in the greed league now.  Too many teams scared stiff of conceding the first goal is the reason why the majority of modern day football is mind numbing.

I will judge the new coach when he has his own players in as at the moment it's still a square peg in round hole scenario and has been for the last few years now.

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Re: Tony Pulis
« Reply #509 on: January 25, 2015, 11:34:46 AM »
I really can't see Pulis being here for the long term. The next week is crucial for him in terms of player recruitment.  If we don't get who he wants then I can see an immediate falling out.
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Re: Tony Pulis
« Reply #510 on: January 25, 2015, 11:35:12 AM »
'Good football' as a term is too vague. Playing good means different things to different people. If West Brom had more possession in the next game there will still be supporters on here saying the football is ugly.

Man United are a great example. For the first 60 minutes against QPR they had 65% possession and created 4 attempts. Lots of backwards and square passing to the 3 center halves. Controlling the ball and keeping all the opposition players in their half. Some West Broms on this thread would consider this good football.

The last 30 minutes, van Gaal switched to 4-4-2, brought on Fellaini for extra height and went more direct. The possession dropped to 50%, but they created 8 shots and converted 2 of those. Some people may consider that last 30 minutes ugly, but they were more dangerous and ended up winning the game.

Football is and will always be a results business. Owners and Chief Executives will bang on about entertainment to justify charging £40+ to watch a game of footy. But while the games are decided on goals and not on a score based system like Ice Skating, the result will always be more important.

Being a Stoke fan I wouldn't expect you to understand when an West Brom fan says 'good football'  ;) your 'too vague' comment is surely an attempt to muddy the waters of what is a very basic desire for most football fans to be excited by what they are watching, whilst football may be a results business to you, please don't assume you're talking on behalf of all football fans, many of who, like myself prefer to call it an entertainments business, this is why the sport is watched the World over because people love to be entertained, the result of most games are irrelevant to neutrals as long as they have enjoyed watching the game, maybe the 8 (or so) years of the Pulis era you had has given you a different perspective of football & thats fine but wouldn't you agree that the style of play Hughes adopted at Stoke last season was much more enjoyable to watch?     
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Re: Tony Pulis
« Reply #511 on: January 25, 2015, 11:35:25 AM »
there is no doubt that TP was the right man for the job, we know exactly what we were getting, we know it will not be particulary pleasing on the eye especially with the current squad he has to work with, but he knows as we know while they will not set the world on fire, under the right stewardship they will keep us up.
I am sure he is looking to get one or two players in who can increase the attacking options , if he can do that then we may start to win pretty, but in the meantime i will settle for winning ugly and staying in the division , and hopefully as we know TP respects the FA Cup maybe going all the way to Wembley

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Re: Tony Pulis
« Reply #512 on: January 25, 2015, 11:36:36 AM »
I would class myself as a football purist in that I absolutely love seeing good, attractive football. However, this is a results business and whilst we're not playing free-flowing, champagne football, it's nice to be turning up to games and expecting to see us battle and fight instead of rolling over and having our bellies tickled.

Until Pulis came in I was very quickly losing interest in Albion thanks to the previous Head Coach. I was fed up of seeing us play pointless possession football with no end product, whilst making stupid mistakes at the back. What I'm now seeing isn't easy on the eye but what we can do as fans is hold our heads up high at the end of the 90 and say the players gave everything they've got.
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Re: Tony Pulis
« Reply #513 on: January 25, 2015, 11:50:55 AM »
My own view is the appointment of Tony Pulis is an outstanding move by the Albion, he's exactly the type of Manager / Head Coach I wanted to see at the club, after the decision was made by the club to remove AI.

Of course I acknowledge the concerns of some of our supporters, but have to say I don't share them and really hope we have Pulis at the helm on a long term basis.

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Re: Tony Pulis
« Reply #514 on: January 25, 2015, 11:57:21 AM »
Arsenal are probably playing some of the best football in the division and their fans are not happy calling for Wengers head because they haven't won a trophy for years.

The other day, against Man City, they reverted to a type of football akin to the Pulis style and won, I wonder how their fans feel about that and if it is acceptable?

Managers / Coaches are subject to "Heads I win, tails you lose" syndrome.

One Tony Pulis, there's only one Tony Pulis!!!!!!

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Re: Tony Pulis
« Reply #515 on: January 25, 2015, 12:09:42 PM »
Why do I keep reading 'if you want to win playing good football go watch Chelsea/Man City blah blah blah?' I doubt any West Brom fan believes this is possible in every game we play but so far in Tiny's reign we have beaten a mid table conference side who out footballed us for 40 minutes, scraped a fortunate 1-0 against (arguably) the worst team in the Prem, parked a Boeing 747 against a very defensively poor Everton team & showed no intent to win the game & yesterday put 11 men behind the ball for the whole of the second half against a very very average Championship side who looked like a rabbit in the headlights in the first half & were there for the taking without having to endure a squeaky bum last 20 minutes.

None of the following are mutually exclusive:

Win playing good football
Lose playing good football
Win playing ugly
Lose playing ugly

A balance is needed & Mr Pulis will receive my support for 90 minutes each week, for the remainder of the season in the hope he can get us playing any of the above four in a four match cycle, I hope those telling others to 'go watch other teams' will try to understand that, as fans we have an opinion too.   

I'm sure you told people if you don't like it don't go when your hero was coach. A bit of bitterness that you was wrong, I'm loving WBA again, in Pullis we trust
It's easy to have faith in yourself and have discipline when you're a winner, when you're number one. What you got to have is faith and discipline when you're not a winner.

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Re: Tony Pulis
« Reply #516 on: January 25, 2015, 12:39:40 PM »
Older viewers will remember a certain Red Adair - a fabled oil and gas well firefighter of the 60s and 70s who was famously summoned up by desperate oil companies facing disaster from a blow out. When all seemed lost they turned to Red and he was exceptionally good at what he did.

The only thing was that others had to rebuild the rigs and get production back on track once Red had done his job.

For Red Adair, read Tony Pulis. Another expert firefighter - good at being parachuted in to avoid disaster by doing whatever it took in an emergency, but having neither the technical know how nor the imagination to rebuild.

So for now, we need Red (sorry Tony) but he is not the long term solution to move the Albion to the next level.

And, like Red, Tony is playing a dangerous game. Stringing two lines of four across the back and soaking up all the pressure others throw at us (Hull, Everton and Brum second half) can not succeed forever.

Hopefully he will put out the fire for now, but he is not the future.
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Re: Tony Pulis
« Reply #517 on: January 25, 2015, 12:52:33 PM »
Being a Stoke fan I wouldn't expect you to understand when an West Brom fan says 'good football'  ;) your 'too vague' comment is surely an attempt to muddy the waters of what is a very basic desire for most football fans to be excited by what they are watching, whilst football may be a results business to you, please don't assume you're talking on behalf of all football fans, many of who, like myself prefer to call it an entertainments business, this is why the sport is watched the World over because people love to be entertained, the result of most games are irrelevant to neutrals as long as they have enjoyed watching the game, maybe the 8 (or so) years of the Pulis era you had has given you a different perspective of football & thats fine but wouldn't you agree that the style of play Hughes adopted at Stoke last season was much more enjoyable to watch? 

For me personally I loved the Cup Final season more than anything Mark Hughes has produced so far.

Pennant and Etherington bombing down the wings with Jon Walters and a Bony like Kenwyne Jones up front. Hammering Bolton 5-0 in the Semi Final. Hammering and scoring 3 past Newcastle, Wolves and Arsenal in the league. I would have fancied us against anybody during that period. If the Cup Final was a few weeks earlier we would have won it!

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Re: Tony Pulis
« Reply #518 on: January 25, 2015, 12:54:21 PM »
Why do I keep reading 'if you want to win playing good football go watch Chelsea/Man City blah blah blah?' I doubt any West Brom fan believes this is possible in every game we play but so far in Tiny's reign we have beaten a mid table conference side who out footballed us for 40 minutes, scraped a fortunate 1-0 against (arguably) the worst team in the Prem, parked a Boeing 747 against a very defensively poor Everton team & showed no intent to win the game & yesterday put 11 men behind the ball for the whole of the second half against a very very average Championship side who looked like a rabbit in the headlights in the first half & were there for the taking without having to endure a squeaky bum last 20 minutes.

None of the following are mutually exclusive:

Win playing good football
Lose playing good football
Win playing ugly
Lose playing ugly

A balance is needed & Mr Pulis will receive my support for 90 minutes each week, for the remainder of the season in the hope he can get us playing any of the above four in a four match cycle, I hope those telling others to 'go watch other teams' will try to understand that, as fans we have an opinion too.   

You would find trying to win playing good football would likely end very poorly with what is an extremely limited squad though. To play styles of football you need players to fit it. Our problem is really since mid-way in Clarke's reign there has been no style and hence we've struggled and been extremely easy to beat.

Nobody, anywhere wants their midfield to constantly give the ball away cheaply, regardless of style, nobody wants to be forced back and unable to have any of the ball. These are problems that have plagued the team for 2 1/2 years now.

It also makes no sense to reduce games like you've done, we drew to that same Hull team a month ago, we lost to an even worse QPR side, we lost to that same Everton side at home without putting up any fight, we went to penalties against an Oxford side who were 92nd in the the football league when we played them.

Pulis plays a boring style but he's the right man at the right time. The club was desperate after a succession of terrible decisions to bring someone in who though not exciting actually has a grip on the league and know's what they're doing. It's not quite Hodgson but its towards that level. Bringing someone in to stabilise the club was crucial, Pulis will hopefully be here a few seasons without any relegation battle like he was at Stoke which will make the club far healthier. It's all well and good saying we can play good football but really to get a manager like that for a club like ours who's actually got a decent track record would be remarkable difficult.
« Last Edit: January 25, 2015, 01:05:18 PM by Dan »

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Re: Tony Pulis
« Reply #519 on: January 25, 2015, 01:03:44 PM »
For me personally I loved the Cup Final season more than anything Mark Hughes has produced so far.

Pennant and Etherington bombing down the wings with Jon Walters and a Bony like Kenwyne Jones up front. Hammering Bolton 5-0 in the Semi Final. Hammering and scoring 3 past Newcastle, Wolves and Arsenal in the league. I would have fancied us against anybody during that period. If the Cup Final was a few weeks earlier we would have won it!

This is football , I remember the great escape season for the achievement (result) not for the fact I sat through mostly dire football all season. We need to get a grip if we're suggesting its better to lose whilst passing it around vs winning whatever it takes! 

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Re: Tony Pulis
« Reply #520 on: January 25, 2015, 01:09:01 PM »
I think that the time to judge the style of play is when TP has some of his own players in the team. I don't believe for one second that he wants us to sit back and defend for 90 mins and this is backed up by his post match comments after the Everton game in particular. The problem we have at present is that there is no width at all (apart from Brunty  ;)) and the lack of pace in wide/forward areas is frightening!

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Re: Tony Pulis
« Reply #521 on: January 25, 2015, 01:20:12 PM »
Does anybody know what TP means when he says the team is unbalanced? Is is side to side, front to back, too many of the same type of players? Are there not enough players with different attributes to let him ring changes?
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Re: Tony Pulis
« Reply #522 on: January 25, 2015, 01:30:29 PM »
 would have liked martin jol as manager, maybe he would play gamboa and poco more

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Re: Tony Pulis
« Reply #523 on: January 25, 2015, 02:23:49 PM »
Does anybody know what TP means when he says the team is unbalanced? Is is side to side, front to back, too many of the same type of players? Are there not enough players with different attributes to let him ring changes?

It‘s pretty obvious that this has been the case for some time. Quality, pace and width is severely lacking.
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Re: Tony Pulis
« Reply #524 on: January 25, 2015, 02:41:50 PM »
Does anybody know what TP means when he says the team is unbalanced? Is is side to side, front to back, too many of the same type of players? Are there not enough players with different attributes to let him ring changes?

I find it quite laughable that Tony Pulis can call the team unbalanced to be honest.

Yes it isn't the greatest squad in the world and yes there are too many players who are far too similar and yes we are short on wingers.

But if Pulis wants to talk about balance then he needs to drop the notion that Brunt is a central midfielder and that Craig Gardner is a wideman. You can also then throw in Joleon Lescott figuring at left back and its therefore not hard to realise why our side was so unbalanced yesterday. We had too many players figuring in roles that they are quite simply not comfortable with.

I said in the stand yesterday that it felt like Pulis was trying to make a point to somebody with his selection yesterday that new additions are needed immediately.
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