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Do you want Sam to stay as manager?

Yes
103 (63.2%)
No
60 (36.8%)

Total Members Voted: 163

Author Topic: Sam Allardyce  (Read 599124 times)

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TAFKATMNo1Fan

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Re: Sam Allardyce
« Reply #1850 on: January 26, 2021, 11:40:20 PM »
Imagine if Lai showed his face this season.

He would have probably been there tonight

Always seemed to make an appearance when the big boys turned up

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Re: Sam Allardyce
« Reply #1851 on: January 26, 2021, 11:41:04 PM »
I'm with Baggies on this the tighter the budget the more focussed and structured everything has to be in terms of recruitment. Some of the problem was Bilic a) Getting the Band back together and b) Tactically throwing the band under the bus.

If we had got everything spot on we might be 5 to 6 points better off and be in with a shout of survival.

I blame Dowling for recruitment to a point. He does not determine the finances available that is the CEO and if you want deficit financing (and most fans seem to expect that) the ownership. Everything else after that is just the reality of the situation.

I absolute blame Dowling for Allardyce. Setting aside my personal animosity toward Allardyce this squad and him were never going to be a happy marriage and pinning our hopes on getting players in during January with very limited funds to make any significant difference was frankly bordering on the delusional.

We have just set fire to a big bag of money for no good reason. 
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baggie82

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Re: Sam Allardyce
« Reply #1852 on: January 26, 2021, 11:42:09 PM »
He’s still begging for two new additions.

I think he’s being polite asking for two as we need three at a minimum.

Centre half, central midfielder and a forward.

I was hoping it was a typo and he was asking for 20.

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Re: Sam Allardyce
« Reply #1853 on: January 26, 2021, 11:49:46 PM »
He would have probably been there tonight

Always seemed to make an appearance when the big boys turned up

Perhaps thats where our players get their shirt swopping passion from.

Evo_Baggies

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Re: Sam Allardyce
« Reply #1854 on: January 27, 2021, 12:11:07 AM »
Just watched his post match interview.

I'm starting to feel sorry for the guy, I think he's in way over his head with how bad we are.

He felt that we had started to turn a corner with the Wolves win and the decent effort against West Ham. Then we go and defend like that.

He mentioned he has no idea why we are so awful at home
 It makes zero sense with empty grounds...

boinging_along

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Re: Sam Allardyce
« Reply #1855 on: January 27, 2021, 12:13:07 AM »
Maybe he should question why we went 4 at the back and dropped Bartley?

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Re: Sam Allardyce
« Reply #1856 on: January 27, 2021, 12:23:13 AM »
Can only imagine how ugly it might have gotten had we had full crowds in the last few home games

It wouldn’t have got this bad with the fans in the ground.

If this pandemic has proven anything, it’s that Albion fans are one of the better sets of fans to play in front of and that when we aren’t there, our home form goes to pot and we suffer 4 and 5 goal thrashings in multiple occasions.
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Re: Sam Allardyce
« Reply #1857 on: January 27, 2021, 12:53:25 AM »
I thought he was supposed to improve us? Wasn’t his strength supposed to be organizing a defence?

SirTonyM

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Re: Sam Allardyce
« Reply #1858 on: January 27, 2021, 01:30:50 AM »
The players are an embarrassment and it’s not necessarily Sam’s fault but our home record since he took over, must be the worst in modern memory for a new manager.
3-0
5-0
4-0
5-0

chipperclark

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Re: Sam Allardyce
« Reply #1859 on: January 27, 2021, 02:40:58 AM »
Maybe he should question why we went 4 at the back and dropped Bartley?
What about Gallagher (our "workaholic" ) not even bought on as a Sub??? What is going on at this Club. Bartley was our man of the match 2 weeks ago and dropped????? Something is wrong here...the "poison" throughout the place??

Oldbury24

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Re: Sam Allardyce
« Reply #1860 on: January 27, 2021, 07:25:46 AM »
The players are an embarrassment and it’s not necessarily Sam’s fault but our home record since he took over, must be the worst in modern memory for a new manager.
3-0
5-0
4-0
5-0

If a managers job is to organise the team and motivate players he has so far failed dismally.   Regardless

However, can't be replaced so can only hope he finds a way.   Not necessarily to keep us up, but just to leave the season behind with some semblance of pride intact.  Can't imagine he really wants to be here? 
« Last Edit: January 27, 2021, 08:08:08 AM by Oldbury24 »

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Re: Sam Allardyce
« Reply #1861 on: January 27, 2021, 08:18:17 AM »
If a managers job is to organise the team and motivate players he has so far failed dismally.   Regardless

However, can't be replaced so can only hope he finds a way.   Not necessarily to keep us up, but just to leave the season behind with some semblance of pride intact.  Can't imagine he really wants to be here?

The players don’t seem to have any pride whatsoever, so I can’t see how they are going to do anything worthy of instilling any in us fans. A more pathetic bunch I haven’t ever seen. Sam is struggling, if he persists with that same eleven, particularly Sawyers and Furlong in the next few games then I will be extremely concerned.

baggie82

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Re: Sam Allardyce
« Reply #1862 on: January 27, 2021, 09:28:54 AM »
What about Gallagher (our "workaholic" ) not even bought on as a Sub??? What is going on at this Club. Bartley was our man of the match 2 weeks ago and dropped????? Something is wrong here...the "poison" throughout the place??

Big Sam’s team selection was awful. No Button, Grosicki, Bartley or Gallagher. All should have started. That back four and keeper he picked was horrendous.

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Re: Sam Allardyce
« Reply #1863 on: January 27, 2021, 09:31:16 AM »
We are better away from home under Allardyce than we were under Bilic but the home form is obviously a major concern.

Luckily we have to play most of the teams around us away (only Fulham and Newcastle at home I think), so we may well pick up a few more wins and some draws. It won't be enough to keep us up unless we get a real Dm, a centre forward and a centre half in; and even then it would still take a miracle.
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Re: Sam Allardyce
« Reply #1864 on: January 27, 2021, 09:31:20 AM »
Been here long enough so he should know his best 11, which consists of Sawyer's and Livermore as first choice midfield. Think its lazy coaching from Allardyce as he relying on our more experienced players hence Phillips introduction as a Sub last night and giving him the armband when Livermore was suspended. Scratching my head at the way he set us up at the back, why tinker with it when we seemed to be more solid?
« Last Edit: January 27, 2021, 09:34:55 AM by paulosull »

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Re: Sam Allardyce
« Reply #1865 on: January 27, 2021, 09:40:22 AM »
Taking the relative merits of Bilic nd Allardyce out of the picture.
You have a squad built around the tactics and prejudices of Manager A and you sack him and bring in Manager B who has a very different set of tactics and prejudices but there is no money to change the squad to such an extent that would meet Manager B's tactics and prejudices.
So where have we got other than spending what little money there is on sacking Manager A and hiring Manager B?
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Re: Sam Allardyce
« Reply #1866 on: January 27, 2021, 09:41:05 AM »
As I've said on the next match thread, six points form the next two games is vital. Absolutely vital.

Worst defensive record - as in goals shipped - since 1935 (Aston Villa) - BBC website.

While I don't really want to knock our manager and while I'm not saying Bilic would have kept us up ... something is dramatically wrong in our set up that we have shipped 22 (?) since he came in.

NJS comments are spot on.
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darbolina

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Re: Sam Allardyce
« Reply #1867 on: January 27, 2021, 09:56:40 AM »
Taking the relative merits of Bilic nd Allardyce out of the picture.
You have a squad built around the tactics and prejudices of Manager A and you sack him and bring in Manager B who has a very different set of tactics and prejudices but there is no money to change the squad to such an extent that would meet Manager B's tactics and prejudices.
So where have we got other than spending what little money there is on sacking Manager A and hiring Manager B?

This is the nail on the head and typical Albion since Dowling has been DoF including signings we didn't need. Maybe the relationship with Bilic was so bad that it had to be ended but to get in a replacement in SA who is literally the polar opposite with little resources to change the squad was just stupid, we've seen the response the players have given - pretty much given up.

This is looking every bit as bad as Pardew so far..............and that was baaaaaaad!!

Lai Out, Dowling out and let's wait until SA walks which I don't think will be too far past March at the latest.

When does the EFL fixture list come out?

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Re: Sam Allardyce
« Reply #1868 on: January 27, 2021, 10:16:34 AM »
Having seen his post match interview I'd have loved to have been in that dressing room to hear what he thinks of whom followed by the back and forth. It would have made for much better entertainment than the game at any rate.
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Re: Sam Allardyce
« Reply #1869 on: January 27, 2021, 10:25:52 AM »
Allardyce's league record since he took over is:

W1  D1  L5  F5 A22

Bilic's last 7 results were:

W1  D1  L5  F4 A12

We only conceded more than 2 goals in a game once (Palace) in Bilic's last 7 games. In 3 of them we only let in 1 goal and we also got our only clean sheet so far (Sheff Utd).

So although the points accrued are the same for both, we have been significantly worse defensively under Allardyce. Despite this, many Albion fans are giving him a free pass for some reason. It's hard to imagine that any other incoming manager would get the same easy ride that he's getting.

I know he hasn't had much chance to shape the squad in his image yet (and it looks like we won't bring enough players in to do that), but remember Dowling's words when Allardyce joined:

"Sam looked at the squad before he came here and I’m sure if he felt there needed to be massive changes he wouldn’t be here now. Sam believes there is something here to work with which gives us amazing confidence as a club".

The lack of training time excuse has now gone, so all that seems to be left is new signings or bust, because there's seemingly nothing Allardyce can do to improve the current squad. Indeed, he's managed to make our defending much worse, when defensive organisation is supposed to be his key strength.

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Re: Sam Allardyce
« Reply #1870 on: January 27, 2021, 10:43:56 AM »
It's actually strange - we look half decent when we press, in fact in the first minute we did it a couple of times and regained possession, as well as later in the first half. Again, we created chances against Wolves and West Ham when we won the ball high up the pitch, and yet our default is to sit deep and heap pressure onto our defence.

Kudos to Sam for implementing the press, as it wasn't seen much at all under Bilic, but it does make you wonder why we don't do it more.
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gazberg

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Re: Sam Allardyce
« Reply #1871 on: January 27, 2021, 10:48:20 AM »
It's actually strange - we look half decent when we press, in fact in the first minute we did it a couple of times and regained possession, as well as later in the first half. Again, we created chances against Wolves and West Ham when we won the ball high up the pitch, and yet our default is to sit deep and heap pressure onto our defence.

Kudos to Sam for implementing the press, as it wasn't seen much at all under Bilic, but it does make you wonder why we don't do it more.

Let one goal in and they gave up.

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Re: Sam Allardyce
« Reply #1872 on: January 27, 2021, 12:48:36 PM »
There is organization (which we need) but as others have said there is mentality. I haven’t seen a side collapse so easily when they go behind. Someone last night said we have let in 5 goals 4 times this season already..The other strange assumption is we can now just turn it on against Fulham and Sheff Utd. Where will this magical form come from to beat either of them? Having seen a little of Fulham they look a decent side to me.

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Re: Sam Allardyce
« Reply #1873 on: January 27, 2021, 02:31:51 PM »
I think Big Sam is caught in two minds at the moment.

He is known for getting teams organised and hard to beat, get that right then build. However i know from a seminar i did where he was guest speaker and from a interview he does on BT  - State of the Game, that he hates his reputation as a defensive and direct, he said every club he has been at he has played a different way depending on the bulk of the squads abilities.

He said his last job (the seminar was before he took the Albion job) was Everton, he said they were a big club, in free fall, conceding loads and he sorted them out and got them to 8th place finish yet he was hounded for being defensive and boring instead of praised for sorting them out.

I wonder if he has come to us to try and change the general perception about him, he is saying all the right things about keeping clean sheets, tightening up, etc yet at the moment the evidence doesnt back that up, since the Arsenal game he has nearly four weeks of pretty regular training time and we seem to of got worse defensively (we wasnt great under Bilic)

I think somebody who is as experienced as Big Sam would of watched our games this season before he got the job, he would of seen we started to improve defensively towards the end of Bilic era (Palace game aside) when we had gone mainly back to 3 at the back, yet he seems to keep trying 4 at the back when its clear we have full backs who cant actually defend.

I dont think the players are good enough which is the main issue and you cant coach individual errors, but we dont just not seem organised, we just look lost, nobody seems to be in the correct position during the game and i would of thought that would be the most basic first thing he would work on, yet he plays a formation where you only really have two players defending because Furlong and Gibbs are a waste of time defensively, and we are getting worse.

When we went up i had hoped we would take the game to teams but it became apparent pretty quick that our attacking threat was weak in this league, Diangana with the exception of a great goal v Everton has been anonymous, Grant although i think is played out of position has offered nothing and misses a good chance nearly every game, Robinson tries hard but doesnt really ever offer a goal threat, Pereira hasnt hit the heights he is capable of but is still out best player and biggest threat, i think we have only scored more than one goal in three league matches out twenty so it shows we cant rely on trying to outscore teams.

Big Sam would of known this, so if you know your attack isnt going to get many goals, i know you have to offer a threat but first and foremost, you make yourself hard to beat, yet we look so lost and unorganised, we played Man City last night and had our most attacking line up of the season playing which just doesnt usually happen under Allardyce teams.

I do think last night maybe there was an element of planning for the next two games (which in itself is poor, i always think you should try and get points) but it backfired with how badly we collapsed.

Despite all the above, i still have some faith in Big Sam as long as he is backed with players he wants, otherwise we shouldnt of appointed him, he has done his bit shifting Austin, Bond, Krovinovic and Harpers wages off the bill as well as another couple by the sounds of it, so he should be given some support.

I have no issue with him calling the players out in public either, if they lose the odd game heavily so be it, but they are embarrassing themselves every game at home, think people can accept they are not good enough but a few were just coasting and not giving 100% which there is no excuse for so i am glad he has his say as he must be embarrassed too.

There is still nearly half a season left, it dont look great but we can still stay up, we firstly have to back him with a few new players he wants, and secondly, Allardyce needs to go back to doing what he does best right, get us organised.
« Last Edit: January 27, 2021, 02:34:45 PM by Albion79 »

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Re: Sam Allardyce
« Reply #1874 on: January 27, 2021, 03:10:18 PM »
I know he hasn't had much chance to shape the squad in his image yet
Oh, I don't know. A few of them look like they could do with shedding a few kilos.
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