Author Topic: Alan Irvine  (Read 1766561 times)

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BobTaylor

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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #3525 on: November 05, 2014, 07:52:43 AM »
The half way point is where we will get a proper perspective of where we are as a team, when we have played every team once. If we lose the next 3 games (which is quite likely), we will have 13 points from 13 games and everything will look a little less rosy. Not yet convinced that Jacko's perceived negativity isn't in fact a realistic assessment and that a few reasonable results haven't clouded some people's judgement
While I would say that we have three tough games coming four including west ham I also no how unpredictable the Albion can be we could easily get something from three of them games a win on Saturday would be mega a point would be satisfying, Dont think 40 points would see you relegated this season or even 38 points.

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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #3526 on: November 05, 2014, 09:24:45 AM »
I would suggest that the negativity surrounding his appointment and the views of a number of Sheff Wednesday supporters have clouded some people's judgement.  The open minded supporter who looks at the current position rather than lives in the past has to say that he is doing a good enough job based on results.
I agree, it's time to move on now, he has done enough to warrant some backing.
After our awful pre-season and poor start to the season, I was very much in the 'this guy is clueless' camp, but fair play to him, he has stuck to his guns and ethos and it is paying some dividends, in the league at least.
My biggest gripe with him was never his lack of experience, but his reputation for playing negative, turgid football, but to be honest I have seen no real sign of this since the Swansea game. Ok, we play a bit narrow, but all of our midfielders are footballers and can pick a pass and at times we have played some really good stuff.
The Bournemouth game was horrible, but it's hard to blame Irvine as he will be judged on league results, he just fell into the trap of doing what everyone else does. Shame he didn't have the guts to go for it, but understandable why he didn't.

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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #3527 on: November 05, 2014, 02:41:53 PM »
after 10 games I fully expected us to be on the same points as Burnley, not Everton ManU and Newcastle.

it's been a great start to the season. far exceeding expectations.

i'm happy to say that AI and JP have proved me wrong so far.

let's take one game at a time and not worry if we lose the next 3

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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #3528 on: November 05, 2014, 02:59:45 PM »
He's perfect for the head coach role. Credit to Rob Kelly and Keith Downing too who work together extremely well it seems.
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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #3529 on: November 05, 2014, 03:00:48 PM »
after 10 games I fully expected us to be on the same points as Burnley, not Everton ManU and Newcastle.

it's been a great start to the season. far exceeding expectations.

i'm happy to say that AI and JP have proved me wrong so far.

let's take one game at a time and not worry if we lose the next 3
:o

Really ? I wouldn't say so . I expected us to beat both Palace and Sunderland so think we should be 4 points better off by now
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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #3530 on: November 05, 2014, 03:28:10 PM »
:o

Really ? I wouldn't say so . I expected us to beat both Palace and Sunderland so think we should be 4 points better off by now
Did you expect us to beat Spurs then?
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KnaveofAlbion

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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #3531 on: November 05, 2014, 03:30:36 PM »
Did you expect us to beat Spurs then?

Or draw with Man U, given their £150mill 3 pronged strikeforce?

Such a daft comment and a prime example of the negativity on here. Moan about stuff we "done wrong" and give no credit at all for the stuff we've done right.
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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #3532 on: November 05, 2014, 03:32:04 PM »
He's perfect for the head coach role. Credit to Rob Kelly and Keith Downing too who work together extremely well it seems.


For me this is the key here, they all work in harmony together
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Chipperfan

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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #3533 on: November 05, 2014, 03:55:57 PM »
Did you expect us to beat Spurs then?

Quite so Stever. Like the Knave says, it's all too easy to cherry pick and then whinge about things that might have gone better while totally ignoring the things that did go well.
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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #3534 on: November 05, 2014, 04:17:37 PM »
We're about where I thought we would be to be honest. Its disappointing that after winning at Spurs we haven't managed to win either of the home games against side that will be down there but that's football.

I think in the opening ten games there are a lot of positives to take. We're keeping clean sheets which is not something you associate with us in the Premier League, we're looking very good defensively after the shambles of last season and we also seem to have a very united squad. There are improvements to be made in the final third of the pitch but overall I've been quite happy with our start to the season. Irvine has made some bold calls and I think by and large we've tried to play some good football bar a couple of games which now seem a million years ago.
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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #3535 on: November 05, 2014, 04:33:29 PM »
Did you expect us to beat Spurs then?

No but it's not worth as much when you can't beat Palace at home for me.

Or draw with Man U, given their £150mill 3 pronged strikeforce?

Such a daft comment and a prime example of the negativity on here. Moan about stuff we "done wrong" and give no credit at all for the stuff we've done right.

On the whole we tend to up our game against some of the bigger sides so hoping for a draw isn't out of the question and with 5 minutes to go many thought we could hold on.

Read through my posts, I'm not really a negative poster, I'm just giving my opinion on our performance so far. The cup run has also bugged the life out of me for another year.
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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #3536 on: November 05, 2014, 04:46:37 PM »
If the day before the season kicked off you had asked me where we would be after 10 games, I would have said bottom 3 and looking for yet another manager, Chairman under immense pressure.
So credit where its due, still lots to do and some dark times to come no doubt, but the new teams (playing staff / coaches / PR) have all started well IMO.
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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #3537 on: November 05, 2014, 04:58:46 PM »
In relation to my previous comment looking at the games we have played I think these are the games that we have either done worse or better than I would have expected:

Sunderland - drew (2 points dropped)
Everton - Loss ( 1 point dropped)
Spurs - Won (2 points gained)
Palace - Drew (2 points dropped )

I make it out to to be 3 points below where I think we should be, then again some might say I'm being over the top and too ambitious to think we could dream of drawing against a terrible defensive unit.

Also factor in the cup, should be doing better, credit to Bournemouth but we should have been getting through.

Still not convinced on Irvine tactically, but I think we are coming along nicely.
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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #3538 on: November 05, 2014, 04:59:57 PM »
The win at Spurs and draw with Yanited has offset the dropped points at home to Sunderland  and Palace. We're about where I expected to be honest, that said I now expect to pick up very little in the next 4 games.
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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #3539 on: November 05, 2014, 05:02:31 PM »
As it stands I'm tempted to add the southampton draw as a point gained, as good as they seem to be doing right now :-X
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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #3540 on: November 05, 2014, 05:52:05 PM »
I think these are the games that we have either done worse or better than I would have expected:
Sunderland - drew (2 points dropped)
Everton - Loss ( 1 point dropped)
Spurs - Won (2 points gained)
Palace - Drew (2 points dropped )

That's where we differ mate, I go into games think we stand a good chance of getting a win or draw, but I never expect. Only the Burnley game is close to a gimmie in this league.

If we really are under performing and are currently on par with Man U, then that just shows how  far we've come of late. I still think we'll get 14th-16th mind.
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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #3541 on: November 05, 2014, 08:58:15 PM »
I'm slowly warming to AI, comes across quite well in interviews, compare him to the sweaty sock at vela and I know which one I prefer.
I think he's proved one point in so much that he does appear to be able to turn things round when we're in a rut.
We are, at this moment in time, exactly in the same position after 10 games that we were with Clarke in charge.
Traditionally we tend to go into a nose dive around this time of year, I think that will be a telling time and hopefully AI makes a better fist of it than Clarke did.
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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #3542 on: November 06, 2014, 12:32:10 AM »
I'm slowly warming to AI, comes across quite well in interviews, compare him to the sweaty sock at vela and I know which one I prefer.
I think he's proved one point in so much that he does appear to be able to turn things round when we're in a rut.
We are, at this moment in time, exactly in the same position after 10 games that we were with Clarke in charge.
Traditionally we tend to go into a nose dive around this time of year, I think that will be a telling time and hopefully AI makes a better fist of it than Clarke did.

That's what I am wondering too. Irvine has a relatively stable team now, which is obviously why he keeps playing the same team week in week out, but what happens when players get injured, fatigued, suspended or lose form? Has Irvine done enough to integrate new players into his system? Can he change the system to adapt to the players at his disposal or will he demand that players adapt to the system, even if they might not really fit into it?

We are at the same point total as last year this time, but we have had the rub of the green in the last couple of games. When that goes against us, which it will, will we have enough to still keep picking up the points?

I believe there are worse teams than us in this division, but that doesn't make us a very strong team. Irvine has done ok so far, certainly he could have started far worse, and I do like that the (current) players seem to like playing for him and are comfortable with this setup. But I think we will have a bumpy ride this season like last year.

A thin squad, our usual November/December slump and a tough run in in the spring combined with unenterprising football. Hopefully we will be saved by some even worse teams again this year.
« Last Edit: November 06, 2014, 04:33:55 AM by GrGr »

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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #3543 on: November 06, 2014, 08:24:28 AM »
That's what I am wondering too. Irvine has a relatively stable team now, which is obviously why he keeps playing the same team week in week out, but what happens when players get injured, fatigued, suspended or lose form? Has Irvine done enough to integrate new players into his system? Can he change the system to adapt to the players at his disposal or will he demand that players adapt to the system, even if they might not really fit into it?

We are at the same point total as last year this time, but we have had the rub of the green in the last couple of games. When that goes against us, which it will, will we have enough to still keep picking up the points?

I believe there are worse teams than us in this division, but that doesn't make us a very strong team. Irvine has done ok so far, certainly he could have started far worse, and I do like that the (current) players seem to like playing for him and are comfortable with this setup. But I think we will have a bumpy ride this season like last year.

A thin squad, our usual November/December slump and a tough run in in the spring combined with unenterprising football. Hopefully we will be saved by some even worse teams again this year.

There is no reason to believe that we won't finish around 14th/15th, and it would be unrealistic to expect us to finish much higher than that.  The margins in this league are very fine, and apart from Burnley who have no chance, there are 9 or 10 other clubs who are battling it out with us.  Whatever happens, we all know that 3 go down and we've just got to grind out results, avoid a long run of losses, and hope that we go into the last month already safe.   At the moment we look like being able to do that,  but things can quickly change.

Our squad depth is crucial.  We all seem to have reservations about some of our squad back-up, but is it better than Leicester's or QPR's or Sunderland's or Villa's or Hull's?  We will soon find out.

Its going to be a roller coaster until May.  Let's make sure that our fantastic support  generates another few vital points.

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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #3544 on: November 06, 2014, 08:44:15 AM »
From what I have seen of us and the other teams so far there are at least five teams worse than us. We will be more than safe this season if we can keep most of the first 11 injury free we have players like Anchiebe who can make a real impact coming on from the bench. For Irvine to improve us from last season would be a good achievement.
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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #3545 on: November 06, 2014, 10:28:16 AM »
This is where we really missed a trick in the cup by making too many changes. It made them all look rubbish, where they almost certainly are not. If we had integrated 2 or 3 into the current 11 it would have given us an idea of how we will cope with injuries etc., instead we got a bunch of strangers not having a clue how each other worked.
Who knows, we may even have gone into the hat.

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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #3546 on: November 06, 2014, 12:05:55 PM »
Games come thick and fast from late Nov to early Jan so it's inevitable that some injuries / suspensions or whatever will kick in. The problem for AI is making sure players are ready to slot in when the need is there.
This is a huge factor in giving people game time in the Capital One - if we just swapped 3 or 4 it means there are 5 or 6 who will not have played for an even longer period......should AI rotate the squad more in the prem ?
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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #3547 on: November 06, 2014, 01:29:39 PM »
Games come thick and fast from late Nov to early Jan so it's inevitable that some injuries / suspensions or whatever will kick in. The problem for AI is making sure players are ready to slot in when the need is there.
This is a huge factor in giving people game time in the Capital One - if we just swapped 3 or 4 it means there are 5 or 6 who will not have played for an even longer period......should AI rotate the squad more in the prem ?

Yes, theres no way we will still have the same 11 available every game over the next 3 months and at the moment the players coming in will of played practically no 1st team football in 6 months (it's not even like they are getting 20/30 mins off the bench)

I don't think you can argue to much with the teams he has been picking and the players who were given a chance to stake a claim at Bournemouth did themselves no favours but you cant expect to just drop a player in the team and him perform straight away if he hasn't played all season. At some point in the next 2 or 3 weeks AI has to start rotating the team around slightly more than we have been in anticipation of the sides he wants to put out for certain games in December/January

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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #3548 on: November 06, 2014, 08:07:25 PM »
Viewing the Tony Brown tributes this week (which were superb and very enjoyable) it was interesting to hear the Bomber chatting about John Giles first season as Albion manager, and the fact that half way through that first season we were way off the pace and close to the relegation zone, only to turn it around and gain promotion back to the old First Division.

As Tony Brown commented, the chances are that these days in the modern game he'd have been given the boot in similar circumstances by many clubs.

Being an old git I can recall those days, albeit as a youngster, and although we were all in a bit of awe of Giles who had a very high playing profile at that time, the football itself wasn't great for the first few months, and it was around 4 months until things really started to click into gear, but I don't recall people having much of a moan and everyone seemed patient and content to give the bloke time.

The only reason I'm commenting on this thread, is that on hearing those comments it struck me how entrenched the views of some Albion fans have been with AI virtually from day one. Thankfully it seems to be a dwindling number now, though as always we know that come the next defeat those who have no confidence in him will be out in force and at times it feels as if he's paying the price for having a low profile in the game, by Premiership standards, as much as anything else.

Appreciate the Giles era is a very long time ago, but for me, the principle of giving a new Coach time stands true and, talking generally rather than about the Albion, the short termism in football these days, when two or three consecutive defeats is considered a "disaster / disgrace" blah blah, has surely on many occasions been self defeating for many clubs.
« Last Edit: November 06, 2014, 08:11:53 PM by Brummie Road »

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Re: Alan Irvine sacked by Albion
« Reply #3549 on: November 06, 2014, 10:40:06 PM »
Viewing the Tony Brown tributes this week (which were superb and very enjoyable) it was interesting to hear the Bomber chatting about John Giles first season as Albion manager, and the fact that half way through that first season we were way off the pace and close to the relegation zone, only to turn it around and gain promotion back to the old First Division.

As Tony Brown commented, the chances are that these days in the modern game he'd have been given the boot in similar circumstances by many clubs.

Being an old git I can recall those days, albeit as a youngster, and although we were all in a bit of awe of Giles who had a very high playing profile at that time, the football itself wasn't great for the first few months, and it was around 4 months until things really started to click into gear, but I don't recall people having much of a moan and everyone seemed patient and content to give the bloke time.

The only reason I'm commenting on this thread, is that on hearing those comments it struck me how entrenched the views of some Albion fans have been with AI virtually from day one. Thankfully it seems to be a dwindling number now, though as always we know that come the next defeat those who have no confidence in him will be out in force and at times it feels as if he's paying the price for having a low profile in the game, by Premiership standards, as much as anything else.

Appreciate the Giles era is a very long time ago, but for me, the principle of giving a new Coach time stands true and, talking generally rather than about the Albion, the short termism in football these days, when two or three consecutive defeats is considered a "disaster / disgrace" blah blah, has surely on many occasions been self defeating for many clubs.
agree with you Brummie (Tim? ). Problems of short term ism is caused by the radio as they try to provoke an outcry and thus phone calls.

I wasn't keen on irvine at all and I am not won over (only 3 wins for example) but he seems to have worked out best team and I am really hopeful Varela could be a stunning signing.

fingers crossed this weekend as we could conceivably lose the next 3 and that will cause panic!!
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