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Albion Matchday Forum / Re: View from the Opposition

« on: October 26, 2012, 09:10:41 PM »

would you employ anyone if you didn't know they could do the job dragon?

Clarke had virtually no experience as a manager and I'd honestly not be surprised to see him struggle if he had to cover Ashworth's job as well. Remember he's the head coach, not the manager (something I forgot, hence my disappointment) so he's basically doing what he's been doing for years with a few bits added on, however I don't expect other teams to know that is how we work.
 
As such, they thought he was in the "manager controlling everything" camp, which he isn't, and he has NOTHING to show he could do the job, especially with how few No.2's succeed in the promotion at this level.

No but that was not the case because Albion spent two months dedicated to finding the right man. They obviously interviewed him numerous times, got an insite into his coaching style and got reviews from former employees before deciding upon him. Even Blackburn obviously thought Steve Kean would be god enough when they employed him. Just because he hadn't been a manager doesn't mean we did not think he would be a success.

To me his title doesn't make that much difference and to say he would not be fit for the managers' role without appropriate reasoning now is disrespectful. I don't blame Newcastle fans for not knowing his title, that doesn't have much to do with this. How few No 2s succeed? firstly this is not a fair argument because if a manager leaves when a club is in financial trouble then they will naturally appoint their assistant, due to their lack of funds.

So in your world how would you become a manager if no clubs employed anyone who hadn't been a manager? That was just three short paragraphs repeating the same point three times. The truth is you didn't know what to think.

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Albion Matchday Forum / Re: Lawro Predicts

« on: October 26, 2012, 06:15:25 PM »

These days I only look at Lawro's predictions for a laugh. Paul Merson's on Sky Sports are miles better. Sadly he predicted a 3-2 win for Newcastle.

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Albion Matchday Forum / Re: View from the Opposition

« on: October 26, 2012, 06:12:58 PM »

We've had much worse. Newcastle fans were very complimentary towards us so I don't see the problem. Our start has probably come as a surprise to them, but it's come as a surprise to Albion supporters too as I would expect that not many of us had expected us to have 14 points after 8 games.

The only thing that is wrong is the reaction to Steve Clarke being appointed. I like to think not all football fans are as stupid as Blackburn fans in regards to managers appointed. I accept our start being a surprise to people; I do not accept people predicting us to go down with no substantial reason. It's just the idea that a club will be relegated because they have someone that you don't know much about. If you did know more you would point out how every club he has been at has played some very attractive football. It's not them in general, it's just that idea.

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Albion Matchday Forum / Re: View from the Opposition

« on: October 26, 2012, 04:45:21 PM »

I don't look at this feature every week. I bet Albion fans were bashing him when he was appointed bthen. Disgrace.

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Albion Matchday Forum / Re: View from the Opposition

« on: October 26, 2012, 03:48:29 PM »

I usually love posts like this but that particularly disgusted me. It's not any fault of Liam's however it was just the Newcastle fans. I stopped reading as sonn they were reflecting on how West Brom had surprised them all and they thought we were going down. They proably either hadn't taken one look at our squad all summer or just assumed that players like Yacob are absolute s*** because they weren't in the premier league this season.

On Newcaslte, I think the main thing to discuss is Ba and Cisse. Personally I would switch to a 4-3-3 with them as they have so many good midfielders (Anita doesn't consistantly start which tells you something), Ba and Cisse don't have any real chemistry. I would prefer Ba to Cisse not as a result of form but a result of overall playing abilities. Cisse can be the super sub. I can't see them suffering from second season syndrome or high expectations.

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General Football & Sports / Re: Favourite player at each Premiership club.

« on: October 20, 2012, 09:48:59 AM »

This is my brothers one

Chelsea- Hazard
Man Utd- Kagawa
Man City- Yaya Toure
Everton- Baines
Tottenham- Bale
West Brom- Morrison
Arsenal- Cazorla
West Ham- Diame
Fulham- Berbatov
Newcastle- Ben Arfa
Swansea- Michu
Stoke- Crouch
Sunderland- Fletcher
Liverpool- Sterling
Wigan- McCarthy
Aston Villa- Petrov
Southampton- Lallana
Norwich- Holt
Reading- McAnuff
QPR- Granero

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General Football & Sports / Re: England Under 21 squad

« on: October 14, 2012, 10:20:36 PM »

Forums are just that Dragon full of different opinions thats all. Could be anyone coudnt it? Any numpty wum from the dingles or the villa just trying it on. Im talking about actual baggies fans. The people who sit next to me at the match, mates at work, family and friends. IMO if you want a real opinion ask a REAL supporter.

Good post Rubyruby. True point justpointing out what I've seen.

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General Football & Sports / Re: Favourite player at each Premiership club.

« on: October 14, 2012, 09:58:42 PM »

First of all I will admit that I am very judgemental in the sense that I have a habit of loving or hating a player and then never changing my opinion. Anyway here are my picks:

Arsenal: Santi Cazorla, Mikel Arteta and Jack Wilshere. All three are versatile, commited, sheer class and do not have any specific weaknesses. It's been a shame for football to see Jack Wilshere to be out for so long. I love all three of them so hard to pick a favorite.

Aston Villa: Stilian Petrov. For  me was the reasonwhy Villa collapsed late last season. He would be so vital so any side. I know he is nowhere near the quality of Petrov but at least Villa have Karim El Ahamdi now. Has always been quite a similar midfielder.  On another note, on young players I would say Gary Gardner as he was incredible in the NextGen series last year.

Chelsea: Fernando Torres and John Terry. Terry can do everything and leads by example; Torres is sheer class in everything he does. He is still one of the best strikers in the world in my opinion. I know about Terry's behaviour issuesbut that doesn't change my opinion.

Everton: Marouane Fellani. I used to be fustrated with him at defensive midfield because he gave away way too many fouls but now he achieving his enormous potential. Way too good for Everton

Fulham: Last season I would have said Dembele as he was miles better than Dempsey in my opinion. Now I would say Berbatov but I do not want to repeat the phrase "sheer class". I don't really like Fulham at the moment; not releasing Danny Murphy would have given me some respect for them.

Liverpool: Undoubtedly Steven Gerrard. I bet most young children who dream of being footballers still look up to him. A legend at Liverpool.

Manchester City: Vincent Kompany and Yaya Toure. I admire them both for different reasons; Kompany for reading the game in astonishing fashion and for being a leader on and off the pitch; Toure for what he provides.

Manchester United: Wayne Rooney, Ryan Giggs and Shinji Kagawa. Rooney for his endless effort, Giggs for his ability to never waste possesion while consitantly creating something out of nothing and Kagawa for his incredibly high football IQ. Every young attacking mid should watch him.

Norwich: I really want them to be releagated but I still have respect for Grant Holt. Not good enough for England for me but his positioning and instincts are  excellent. Not as clinical as hyped out to be.

QPR: I hate their guts. Don't have a favorite player.

Reading: Honestly mine is Adam Le Fondre. Clinical finisher, good in the air, good positioning and also has a good first touch on him. Such a complete, trademark striker who reminds me of someone who plays for Nottm Forest now. He who I shall not name.

Southampton: Adam Lallana. He can play in the center and on the right, he is very effective in both. Movement and dribbling is quality. Quick thinker aswell.

Stoke: Don't really like them but my favorites are joint Peter Crouch and Ryan Shawcross. Peter Crouch because of the type of striker he is and Ryan Shawcross becaus of how much he has come along since the Aaron Ramsey injury. He bolongs to a team better than Stoke.

Sunderland: Adam Johnson. Fast and tricky young winger who can score great goals. No player is ever going to make the most of Roberto Mancini's tactics of changing your complete startng XI every game for no reason. He never got a fair run in the side.

Tottenham Hotspur: Moussa Dembele. Can do everything as a center mid and I'm glad that he is not a striker any more because he did not achieve his potential there. A wonderful player.

West Bromwich Albion: Jonas Olsson. No competition. Too important to us. I have his name on the back of my shirt.

West Ham: Mark Noble. He should be in the England side in my opinion. Top class midfielder.

Wigan Athletic: Ryo Miyachi and Callum McManaman. Miyachi is a top talent and McManaman simply because his goal against Nottm Forest looked similar to Steve.

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General Football & Sports / Re: England Under 21 squad

« on: October 14, 2012, 06:29:28 PM »

I dont know any Albion fans who dont like him to be honest. Most I know see him as a young player with bags of potential

In just about every forum with him mentioned I see responses either sayng they are not sure about him or that he is plain rubbish. In fact I've seen nothing positive since the very beginning of last season.

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General Football & Sports / Re: England Under 21 squad

« on: October 13, 2012, 06:23:21 PM »

I saw the England U21s against Serbia and Dawson was brilliant. He showed real signs on concentration to make such a brilliant block in the dying minutes. I still don't understand why Albion fans don't like him; what has he ever done wrong?

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General Football & Sports / Re: Most Over& Underated players ?

« on: October 13, 2012, 06:16:51 PM »

I write this not only as a Chelsea fan, but, as a fan of football.

Overrated players:
Mikel Arteta -
Everyone assumes he is a good player simply because of his passing ability. His game fails when you move away from that. He is not the most positionally aware midfield "maestro", nor is he fast enough to make up for the imperfections of himself and his teammates. He has an eye for the game, but, in comparison to someone like Xavi, he pales in comparison. He constantly gets thrust up there with the best, but, he really only has a few great treats.

Fernando Torres -
As much as it hurts to say this, Torres is simply a bad striker. He isn't a bad player, he would thrive anywhere on the field but in front of goal. In the past, he was quite the athlete, which may have made up for some of his shortcomings as a footballer, but, as injuries took their toll and he lost that athleticism and pace that made him who he once was, his shortcomings as a footballer have been exposed for all to see. He isn't a striker. He fails to do the job required of him with terrifying consistency. Compared to some of the best, at the moment, he isn't even in the top 20.

Robin Van Persie -
He isn't anywhere as good as he is being made out to be. He has had an absolutely pitiful goalscoring record. Last year was the only year in his career where he has scored over 20 goals. Utterly horrid. The dutchman wouldn't break into my top 50 strikers of the past decade list.

Mario Gomez -
Again, a player who is nowhere near as good as he is framed to be. He is simply not a good striker, nor, in my opinion, a good player. He doesn't hold up the ball, he doesn't have mind-bending finesse, he doesn't have outright power, and he isn't the best at being where he needs to be when he needs to be there. He, however, has enough chances to make Messi weep. If you were to hand those chances to Messi, Messi's goalscoring record would be breaking the hundred-barrier within a season. He had an unbelievable 10 goalscoring chances vs. Chelsea, and like 14 shots in total. Absolutely miserable for a "striker" to not convert any of them.

Steven Gerrard -
A player hasn't been as overrated as Stevie Me since the murderers dished out 11 million for his compatriot Emile Heskey. I have absolutely no idea why he is rated so highly. There are plenty of midfielders in the PL better than him, even in his prime. I guess all it takes to become the most overrated player in the world is a following of brainwashed scouse. Forever outraged, never ashamed, as the saying goes. Ol' Stevie's goalscoring/assist record is proof of the claim i've made.


I'm not going to type a paragraph for each of the underrated players, as I'm fairly sure I'm entirely incorrect for some of them.

Underrated -
Kevin De Bruyne
David de Gea
Juan Mata
Rodrigo
Glen Johnson
Ryo Miyaichi
Keisuke Honda
Alan Dzagoev
Aleksandr Kerzhakov
Marko Marin
Lorik Cana
Odise Roshi
Xherdan Shaqiri

and......................

Lionel Messi. We have no idea what the hell we're experiencing. He is likely the best player we are going to live to see, a true diamond among gems-of-slightly-less-value. A one-in-a-century kind of player. He isn't a game changer, like my personal favorite player, Cruyff, but, the man is an absolute god, and should be recognized as such. He gets an incredible amount of heat, simply because he plays for Barcelona, and yes, I'll admit it, I hate barcelona with a passion, and have since the ovrebo incident, but, as a fan of football, I cannot overlook Messi's talent.

Mikel Arteta: He's not supposed to be a "midfield maestro" as this season he has started all of his games at defensive midfield. He is very underrated.

Torres isn't overrated either but that's just my opinion. He's still one of the best strikers in the world.

Agree about Mario Gomez. People talk about him when Bastian Schweinsteiger was a million miles better last season. Fairly limited.

Also heavily disagree with Gerrard and Van Persie. Robin Van Persie hasn't had a sensational scoring record in his earlier years due to fatigue from injury problems. I'm not brainwashed with Gerrard, I just understand wy people don't think he's good enough any more. He just has a different playing style. Sometimes I do miss his lod style though as his long passes can go astray at times. Not excellent physcially but still has a high football IQ and is technically brilliant.

Agree with most of the underrated players but don't agree with Marin. I think he's overrated.

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General Football & Sports / Re: Most Over& Underated players ?

« on: October 13, 2012, 06:04:44 PM »

Funnily enough didn't the City fans call him a highlights footballer? looked good in highlights but in the rest of the game did bugger all?

I find the question mark confusing as you're not making yourself clear over whether you agree with them or not. I think that stuff is a load of nonsense. Don't you expect a player who gets a start around once in three months to tire before the end?

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General Football & Sports / Re: Most Over& Underated players ?

« on: October 10, 2012, 10:58:43 PM »

Back to the topic, James Morrison is one of the most under rated players in the premier league, this season so far he has been immense, the likes of Scott Sinclair and agbonlahor are both extremely over rated in my opinion. I also thought sherjill macdonald was under rated 

Totally agree. Man City  just bought Scott Sinclair because of how good he is on paper, not acknowledging that last season he was just any other midfielder. Adam Johnson is miles better.

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General Football & Sports / Re: Most Over& Underated players ?

« on: October 10, 2012, 10:55:37 PM »

I still fail to see how watching 10 minutes of highlights allows you to form an opinion on a player. How many times do you see highlights of a particular tv programme, think it looks worth watching and then when its finished think it was a total point of rubbsh and moan about the selected bits they showed to get you interested.

We'll have to agree to disagree. Thanks for the discussion.

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General Football & Sports / Re: Most Over& Underated players ?

« on: October 10, 2012, 10:32:25 PM »

The bit I found critical was the liking between me and the other person's comment. I am not writing without substance

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General Football & Sports / Re: Most Over& Underated players ?

« on: October 10, 2012, 10:29:27 PM »

Please point out where I have criticised ? I have expressed my opinion.

10 minute highlights are not enough to form a good proper opinion on a player as all you're seeing is purely that, highlights.

How is impossible to watch Marseille or At Madrid ? there games are always available to view as they are two of the biggest clubs in their respective countries so please do not accuse me of being sceptical of what can and cannot be seen.

A 'few' reserve games are available but you also told us how many times Sam Mantom was man of the match in our reserves when he had hardly figured and in the games he had figured many of those were not viewable anywhere, thats why I struggle to see how you base those opinions.

The Sam Mantom thing was a misunderstanding because I thought there seemed to be a pattern of them naming him as man of the match on the club website, but I went horribly wrong on that. Just a simple mistake. I have changed my opinion on him now a fair bit as I've looked in detail what Walsall fans think of him. Still think he's technically good from what I've seen of him though. If you watch 10 min highlights concisantly then yes it is not enough to suggest that he should be the first name on our team sheet but it's easily enough to have an opinion. I can't opint back to where I thought you were bring critical right now because I'm writing a reply but with the skeptical part I wasn't specifically referring to you, I was being general. Sorry for the confusion.

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General Football & Sports / Re: Most Over& Underated players ?

« on: October 10, 2012, 09:52:17 PM »

How on earth do you find time to socialise, do homework, revise and then watch two football matches of a night? Watching one football match takes up the majority of my night. I'm not denying you might have seen those players play, I'm just doubtful about whether you've watched them enough to form such opinions. Telling the truth, I haven't heard of some of those players, although I'm not a great lover of foreign football. Purely because it's too time consuming when you are working towards A-Levels.

Surely though, at some point, these football matches clash which makes it even more difficult to form such opinions. I still don't know how you consider Gareth McAuley to be over-rated and not as good as Craig Dawson. Even Jones Olsson has came out today singing his praises.

Watching two streams at once. They only come on at around 7.45-8. I'm doing my GCSE's at the moment and I don't go out with my friends that much nowadays after school as near then is when my parents are avaliable to help me revise. On either a Saturday or a Sunday I spend a sold three hours revising but I start at like 9am. I always make sure I get some fresh air as well. When I say underrated, I don't mean underrated in England. When I talk about this I am referring to British newspapers or transfer rumours; who does the British media hype and who don't they hype. You don't need to have an in-depth analysis of them to know that.

Oh no I agree with Olsson coming out for him and I think they are a superb partnership. It's just that I think McAuley is completely dependent on Olsson's leadership which is why I don't really rate him. No way I would drop McAuley from the starting XI right now. A team is about chemistry and that is what they have. I still remain adamant that Olsson and Shawcross should be at far better clubs right now and are so underrated. In the end Olsson made the right decision by signing a new contract due to injury history, profile and age. Just think if he was playing like this maybe even two years ago it may be completely different.

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General Football & Sports / Re: Most Over& Underated players ?

« on: October 10, 2012, 09:42:01 PM »

I'm talking about the George Thorne games you see, the other reserve players we have that you were giving opinons on from games that are not viewable.

I didn't even look at the list of players, as previously stated once you mention McAuley in the overrated list I stopped looking.

I saw a comment recently when someone was questioned over their knowledge and views on players from a top European club and told that they could not have watched enough games to make those decisions. I may be able to find it again. Your 'structure' reminds me of that comment.

Then why criticise if you haven't looked. I've seen a few games of George Thorne. A few of our reserve games are aviable. You can also get decent 10 minute highlights of a lot of our games if you just look around the net. Some English fans are so skeptical they think it's impossible to watch teams like Atletico Madrid and Marseille. You don't have to watch them every week to determine whether they are overrated or underrated. No way I'm going to lie and say I haven't watched these players.

19

General Football & Sports / Re: Most Over& Underated players ?

« on: October 10, 2012, 09:32:35 PM »

How can you watch more than one game at once and keep an up to date profile on each player. You're going to miss things when you're watching the other game etc. Again, looking at football websites isn't a sufficent way in my opinion as so many people can say different things. Just look at this board for example, some of us have differing views on different players but you wouldn't neccesarily believe one side without having watched the player.

I thought you streamed our reserve matches so how do have the time to watch so much football? Dan Ashworth watches around 300 matches but you must watch double that!

Decent website by the way.

THe first question is very simple. Missing a moment in a game does not mean you cannot keep up to date with their playing styles etc. You don't need to see a player every minute every game to determine how good they are. You just have to watch them on some sort of consistent basis. As I've mentioned below my football opinions are not based on websites, football websites are just insightful, up to date  and give guidance of which players and which teams to follow.

Just finding a structure. After school I either revise, socialise or do homework. At nighttime I usually end up watching a mastch or two. I admit that I spend practically all of Saturday and Sunday afternoons watching football. I like to go out for a walk or something in the morining. I never watched all of our reserve fixtures, just as much as I can (which is not very much.)

Good point about missing out the bits of football however even though I'm not sure it does matter that much. I'm condering getting a video capture software called FRAPS.

Thanks about the website.

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General Football & Sports / Re: Most Over& Underated players ?

« on: October 10, 2012, 08:25:01 PM »

Its physically not possible to watch the amount of football you claim to watch. Many games involving players you mention will not be available to stream especially lower league games/ reserve games and in many cases only highlights available will be the goals in that game.

Looking at football websites and getting the opinions on players from members of those sites is not a way of making an honest opinion of a player either.

Mate which ones on that list are you talking about? If their really is anyone from lower leagues or reserve leagues then it's still possible to get highlights.

It is because you don't have to watch them all at once, you just need to follow lots of leagues like I do and it comes to me. Looking at websites keeps me up to date, it does not determine my opinion. To be honest I'm surprised that you don't realise that that list is only based around 4 leagues: Premiership, La Liga, Serie A and Bundesliga. True I included a bit of the Erdivisie and one player from the French Ligue but believe me I watch a bit of them and the highlights you can get are a lot more than goals. Try using the website I recommended to Liam.  Stuff about streams isn't true. You can get streams to practically all top-flight  games. It is possible because usually when I watch a game I have a few games on other tabs muted. I flick to them from time to time and that does give you knowledge. I also watch at least a game most days midweek and a lot more on Saturday and Sunday. It's just about finding a structure so you don't get carried away.

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General Football & Sports / Re: Most Over& Underated players ?

« on: October 10, 2012, 08:07:48 PM »

Dragan.........................Dan Ashworth hasnt given you a call by any chance has he?............

Thanks lol.

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General Football & Sports / Re: Most Over& Underated players ?

« on: October 10, 2012, 08:05:34 PM »

Just looks like random names lifted off FIFA13 to me. 

Haha. What evidence do you have for that?? I don't even have fifa 13 yet. They are all reasonably well known players that I have watched blieve it or not. People like you will eventually look like idiots taking me as a joke. I'm not trying to show off I'm just answering the posters' question.

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General Football & Sports / Re: Most Over& Underated players ?

« on: October 10, 2012, 08:00:57 PM »

How on earth have you studied all of those players enough to understand whether they're under & over rated?!

Look at a lot of football websites and watch a lot of football. Simple. I have actually watched all of them. A website I recommend is http://www.matchhighlight.com/category/full-match-game/. Watching a few of the games and highlights can teach you a lot. Sometimes I watch more than one game at once via streaming.

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General Football & Sports / Re: MOD 3 and generally rubbish punditry.

« on: October 08, 2012, 09:47:00 PM »

Well if the England team was up to Garth Crooks it would have 6 forwards and one attacking midfielder.

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Albion Matchday Forum / Re: After Match Debate

« on: October 07, 2012, 11:50:21 AM »

My sense was that the double substitution yesterday was more about giving Lukaku and Rosenberg some game time than about changing the game we were in, which was almost taken as read.

You might say that's seeing the big picture, looking beyond the moment, working on the whole squad for the whole season. Or you might say its not seeing the wood for the trees, taking unnecessary chances, that every game should be 100% focused on nothing but going all out in that game.

I think it may be the trait of a manager who's grown up in football managements working with big, richly talented squads at big rich clubs, who are used to winning and to making substitutions based on that assumption. I think he's probably thinking a bit more broadly than we're used to at the Albion. And if he keeps it up, there's bound to be times it comes unstuck (I was going to write "because we don't have Torres on the bench", but we do, actually, have a £20 million future superstar on the bench).

On balance, though, I think it's a symptom of us becoming a serious premier league team with more quality squad depth than we've probably ever had (in the glory days, there weren't squads in the same way, after all).

Agree with the concept of this although I only agree with you on the thinking behind one of the substitutions although I though and still think that Carke got all of his substitutions completely right. Yes they didn't gel but that was because Mackie came on for them and they instantly looked a better team. It was just luck and circumstances. He and I think Lukaku and Long need to have time as the lone striker EVERY game for now. Later on it will just be Lukaku. He took Odemwingie off because he understandably tired in the second half.

I'm proud to have a manager who has tactics like Clarke's. While fans weree raving on about how well Hodgson did last season I honestly knew we could do better. In my opinion there is no excuse for using the same tactics in every game over the course of a season and getting all of your points away from home. Just not acceptable. Di Matteo was a much better tactician but he let himself down with some insane team selections like playing Tamas every game.