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West Bromwich Albion FC Forums => West Bromwich Albion FC => Topic started by: BB74 on June 08, 2012, 09:38:09 AM
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ALBION are delighted to announce they have appointed Steve Clarke as their new Head Coach.
The 48-year-old Scot has signed a two-year contract to take over the reins from Roy Hodgson, following his appointment as England manager.
Clarke arrives at The Hawthorns with more than ten years of Barclays Premier League experience under his belt, having served as assistant manager at Chelsea, Newcastle and West Ham, and, most recently, as first-team coach at Liverpool.
Since beginning his coaching career in 1998, Clarke has worked alongside some highly-respected managers - most notably Jose Mourinho and the late Sir Bobby Robson - and boasts two Premier League titles, plus an FA Cup triumph and three League Cup successes, on his honours list.
Albion's Sporting & Technical Director, Dan Ashworth, said: "I'm delighted to welcome Steve to the Club.
"We firmly believe we have appointed the right man to keep the club moving forward.
"After Roy was appointed as England manager, we cast the net far and wide to identify the most suitable candidate to fill his shoes.
"From the outset, we decided to pursue candidates who are renowned for their coaching ability and Steve was very much at the forefront of our thoughts because of the clubs he has worked at and the high regard he is held in within the game.
"After holding talks with Steve, he emerged as the outstanding candidate.
"Steve has worked alongside and learned from some top managers and, most importantly, he knows the Premier League inside out and what it takes to succeed at this level.
"He is a talented British coach who has served his time in the trenches as a No.2 in order to get an opportunity to be in sole charge of a team - and we are delighted to give him that chance.
"Steve has a real hunger and drive to succeed as a No.1 and is excited about the ongoing project we have at the club.
"We also have a structure in place that will hopefully give Steve the support he needs to carry on the success we have enjoyed over the past three seasons."
Clarke, who has held his UEFA Pro Licence since 2006, began his playing career at St Mirren before moving to Stamford Bridge, where he amassed 421 appearances and won the FA Cup and League Cup.
He hung up his boots after playing the full 90 minutes of Chelsea's European Cup Winners' Cup success against Stuttgart in Stockholm in 1998.
http://www.wba.co.uk/page/News/0,,10366~2805026,00.html (http://www.wba.co.uk/page/News/0,,10366~2805026,00.html)
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"After holding talks with Steve, he emerged as the outstanding candidate.
You sure about that Dan? What about Rangnick? ;)
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At last we appoint our man.
Whatever our thoughts are about his pedigree - let's get behind him 100%
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Load of rubbish Albion
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Glad its done. Glad the other thread is locked. Glad we can crack on!
Good luck Steve, you got my support 100%.
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Welcome to the club SC.
youve got my support.
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Happy with this appointment. A superb coach so hopefully our fans will give him a chance.
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Welcome to the club, Steve. Now that it's done and dusted, hopefully all Albion fans will give you a fair chance to show what you can do.
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My support will be there for Albion and I will be there at the begining of the season.
However, in my opinion this season will only end in relegation!
I really hope I am wrong!
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Welcome SC. Lets end this un-backed up negativity unless it turns into a disaster but until then, support our new manager, you never know, he might just step up and prove the doubters wrong
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Good luck to him, I think he's an excellent coach, hopefully he can step up as the main man.
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He his without doubt one of the mostly qualified British coaches ever! He as a great pedigree of being with and I am sure of learning from some of great & SUCCESSFUL managers!
He as youth on his side and played for good teams so I hope all Albion supporters get behind him and give the man a chance?
He is our man now and whatever the ups and downs experienced in the process of finding a replacement it is time to give our all hearted support to 'Our Leader'!
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Incidentally, I wonder why we've departed from the 12 month rolling contract that Peace favours?
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IMHO a very interesting move. A football insider, however relatively low profile, I'm sure he's more of a known quantity to Dan Ashworth than he is to the rest of us. I am old enough to remember him as a player, but I needed to look as pix of him to be reminded of about him properly, if you see what I mean. He could be dead in the water by Xmas, or he could be just what we need, a steady hand here to do 5 years and put his name in the frame for bigger things.
Now for the fixture list...
:)
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Not overly impressed to be going from one extreme to the other in terms of experience level between Hodgson and Clarke. It is a big risk, I have no doubt about his abilities as a coach but his ability tactically and when it comes to motivating are completely unknown.
With that said he is a man that has a point to prove when trying to shake off his assistant tag and I'm very intrigued to see how he's going to get on.
Welcome to the club Steve.
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Welcome Steve,
I hope your man management skills are as good as your coaching. Now go and sign Foster and a few top class players to keep us in the top 10.
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Disappointing appointment, stand out my bottom.I can only see this season being a struggle but good luck anyway.I hope for all Albion fans its goes well.Fingers crossed i will be proved wrong,BoingBoing
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http://www.wba.co.uk/page/News/0,,10366~2805194,00.html
STEVE Clarke is 'honoured' to have been appointed as Albion's new head coach and says he is determined to keep the 'good times' rolling at The Hawthorns.
The 48-year-old Scot has joined the Baggies with more than ten years' coaching experience in the Barclays Premier League, having served as assistant manager to the likes of Jose Mourinho, Sir Bobby Robson and Kenny Dalglish during spells at Chelsea, Newcastle, West Ham and Liverpool.
He now aims to put the vast knowledge he has gained into practice and prove he can be a success as a No.1 with Albion.
"I'm absolutely delighted to be given this opportunity," said Clarke.
"Becoming a head coach in my own right has always been an ambition of mine and I feel I have served my apprenticeship.
"I've done everything I could as an assistant.
"It's a process I've gone through, with a plan in mind to work as hard as I could alongside some of the best managers and coaches in the world, learning as much as possible from them, before stepping out on my own.
"I've taken something from every manager I've worked with and I've felt ready to make the step up for some time.
"I'm delighted West Bromwich Albion have given me the chance to make that progression and I'm determined to make the most of it.
"'I look forward to meeting and working with a very talented group of players and aim, with their help, to prove I can be a successful head coach."
Clarke says he plans to build on the solid foundations that have been laid by his former Chelsea team-mate Roberto Di Matteo and new England boss Roy Hodgson over the past three years.
"West Bromwich Albion strikes me as a friendly, really well organised club with a fantastic structure in place," he added.
"The Chairman and Dan Ashworth did a terrific job in selling the club's project to me and I fully aim to repay the board's faith.
"The team and supporters have had some good times in recent years and, with their help, I would like to think those good times can continue following my appointment.
"I know from past visits to The Hawthorns how well the supporters back the team and joining a club of such stature is a real honour. I can't wait to get started."
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Incidentally, I wonder why we've departed from the 12 month rolling contract that Peace favours?
Maybe it no longer favours Peace for whatever reason.
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Welcome on board Steve!
I am now quite excited by this, keep looking at his background and players he has worked with and improved and think its a positive sign! Can he make the step up to main man, well we will see but he has the qualities and skills and if he doesnt it wont be for the want of trying.
Well worded from DA too, he says we spread our search far and wide so doesnt claim we only spoke to one person but says following that Clarke emerged as the oustanding candidate, that could well be true, bearing in mind within Clarke been officially available after leaving Liverpool Wednesday it appeared we had made a move.
For all the bitching on here, and most of us have, i have no doubt with the way our support usually is, come first game of the season whatever peoples thoughts the majority will give Steve the full backing and get behind him, we may not be the biggest club in the world but we do have great support!
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my support as always, good luck Steve, coaching wise it will be excellent for the players.
However I fail to believe he was top of our list.
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Very very disappointed. I cant believe we've had to wait all this time for this appointment.
I'm not going to hide my feelings just because some may hurl abuse my way- i'm not happy about it and i can't guarentee he will have my full support. Although i will give him some time and i will still support the lads on the pitch 100%.
I'm feeling a little deflated. I sincerly hope he proves me wrong.
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Good luck to him. I will be there cheering him on. Let's hope we avoid our traditionally hard start of fixtures as it is imperative we get wins under our belt to get our miserable supporters on side.
Now over to the board to land foster, defender, Gardner and hutszi.
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Very very disappointed. I cant believe we've had to wait all this time for this appointment.
I'm not going to hide my feelings just because some may hurl abuse my way- i'm not happy about it and i can't guarentee he will have my full support. Although i will give him some time and i will still support the lads on the pitch 100%.
I'm feeling a little deflated. I sincerly hope he proves me wrong.
Good post, that echos my thoughts exactly. I just couldn't be bothered to write it :D
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stevie clarkies blue and white army, wellcome stevie
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I feel a bit underwhelmed but when I think about things rationally who else could we have attracted? We are not a big club and we probably have the smallest budget in the Prem. RR sounded great because of his pedigree but never managed here. Hughton I wasn't keen on personally and doesn't really have much more experience and Ranieri was a non starter IMO. Who else was there?
Clarke has proven to be a very good coach albeit with big clubs with huge budgets. I don't worry about the tactical or man management side of things because even as a coach these are traits that would be required anyhow. Anyone who thinks differently is probably a bit naive. Any appointment carries risk but the fact he has never had the main job makes this appointment even riskier. I don't recall any assistant being successful at this level after 'stepping up'. Hopefully he can buck the trend. Good luck and welcome.
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Very very disappointed. I cant believe we've had to wait all this time for this appointment.
I'm not going to hide my feelings just because some may hurl abuse my way- i'm not happy about it and i can't guarentee he will have my full support. Although i will give him some time and i will still support the lads on the pitch 100%.
I'm feeling a little deflated. I sincerly hope he proves me wrong.
I'm a little bit deflated too but am slowly starting to come around to the idea.
Regardless.... He is here now so to not fully support the guy is just churlish.
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I don't think it's a bad shout to be fair, Peace want's a coach not a manager an has been a top coach for over 10 years now, that's what he has Ashworth for to do all the wealing and dealing, let's get behind him from day 1 and here's to hopefully another successful chapter on the West Bromwich Albion rollercoaster ;D
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Warm welcome Steve, prove them wrong mate.
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iam really disappointed. Really thought that RR will take that great chance. Dont know his reasons. Anyways, guys, i wish
you all the best for next season
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Very very disappointed. I cant believe we've had to wait all this time for this appointment.
I'm not going to hide my feelings just because some may hurl abuse my way- i'm not happy about it and i can't guarentee he will have my full support. Although i will give him some time and i will still support the lads on the pitch 100%.
I'm feeling a little deflated. I sincerly hope he proves me wrong.
Many of us will be disappointed, especially as we had Roy as last gaffer
Many of us are frustrated at the wait for the appointment.
I can understand your feeling deflated. All of us are to some degree.
But to say that means you will not guarantee him your full support is crazy! He is in the job and he gets 110% support from me and I hope everyone else, until there are good reasons why he should not have it. And there are not any such reasons 30 minutes into the job. :)
Let's see what happens before we pass judgment!
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Underwhelming considering the names we've been linked with but it's done. No amount of moaning will change anything, buy your season tickets, buy your shirt and I expect to see you all there next season.
If you're not renewing based on this then it's probably a good thing you wont be there next season anyway.
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Excellent coach and im glad we have given him a crack on his own.
Got a good feeling about this.
Welcome and good luck Steve :)
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I too feel completely underwhelmed by the appointment, I still dont buy the "obvious choice" argument put out by Ashworth. A two year deal for an untested Head Coach seems like a gamble to me, although I guess if he turns good, it'll put off some of the other clubs who would be out to poach him.
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Firstly, Steve welcome to Albion.
People may feel underwhelmed about this appointment purely because the names linked with the vacancy (Villa-Boas, Rangnick, Bilic) and Steve hasn't exactly had a major spotlight on him during his career. That doesn't mean he can't cope as 'Number One'. I really wish him the best of luck, and Peace may have just pulled another rabbit out the hat.
We are Albion!
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I really hope he's successfull but not to much as I am quite frankly bored of us swapping managers every 18 months/2 years. I know football has changed but I want us to break the mould and have someone here for years.
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Congratulations to SC - an interesting and brave appointment. I am looking forward to seeing how he handles the team - who if anybody he brings in to support him. Perhaps not quite as exciting as Rangnick would have been but he was a significant risk. Well done Albion - lets get behind him now. First job sign Foster and re-sign Scharner.
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Very very disappointed. I cant believe we've had to wait all this time for this appointment.
I'm not going to hide my feelings just because some may hurl abuse my way- i'm not happy about it and i can't guarentee he will have my full support. Although i will give him some time and i will still support the lads on the pitch 100%.
I'm feeling a little deflated. I sincerly hope he proves me wrong.
I wouldn't dream of hurling abuse in response to an opinion, but I don't think it's appropriate to be down on JP and DA for taking a long time to make an appointment, and then assume we've landed a head coach that we could have acquired in a few days. The fact that we've taken 6 weeks does indeed show that we've cast the net wide, we have taken time to talk to the likes of Ranieri and Rangnick, and ultimately it's surely better if we don't rush into an apointment.
Perhaps the talks with those two big names showed that they weren't all they were cracked up to be. Yes, I wanted it to be Rangnick too, but the longer it all went on the more I wondered how keen he was. He may have felt he was too big for us. Above all I want Albion's manager, sorry head coach, to be someone who really wants it.
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Loving the spin from the club.
SC was never on their radar until Kenny was sacked, and that was weeks after RH was appointed England boss.
WBA would never have paid Liverpool compensation for him had Kenny remained.
I welcome him. I support him. But i'm deflated by the appointment and the whole process. Huge questions over his ability to motivate and 'manage' a match tactically.
His coaching qualifications speak for themselves.
Good luck Steve. You'll need it.
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Well here goes my money on first manager to be sacked to be Steve Clarke.
Dont shoot me down, ill get behind the lads but i can only see this appointment being a disapointment!
Im just discusted that weve taken the biggest risk out of all the people we have spoke about on here, yes they all would be a risk but he has never managed a club in his life, he has no experiance in this role and to be quite frank i dont understand why we have even considerd Steve Clarke.
Not happy, and now I dont feel to confident in the coming season.
Good Luck, Prove Me Wrong!
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Having slept on it, I'm feeling bright and positive about this appointment. Sure I'm disappointed to miss out on RR but when you strike his name who else could we realistically get? AVB probably only knows our name because he got sacked here; Ranieri chose French second flight football over EPL so he's welcome to it - not for me; Laudrup - just as big a gamble; Hughton is a decent coach/manager but why restructure our whole club to accommodate him? Wilkins is a good coach but would he be as driven as Clarke?
So we have Steve Clarke with great coaching credentials lets get behind him and the lads for our third successive premier league campaign.
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I too feel completely underwhelmed by the appointment, I still dont buy the "obvious choice" argument put out by Ashworth. A two year deal for an untested Head Coach seems like a gamble to me, although I guess if he turns good, it'll put off some of the other clubs who would be out to poach him.
To be fair the comments from Ashworth are just lip service really. Its pretty obvious we did offer the job to Rangnick and he turned us down but if you look at things logically then Clarke would probably have been well up there on the list given the way we operate and his reputation as a coach, only thing going against him is lack of any experience as a number 1 and that is a big issue but he now has a point to prove.
The contract length is a gamble but then the whole move is.
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"From the outset, we decided to pursue candidates who are renowned for their coaching ability and Steve was very much at the forefront of our thoughts because of the clubs he has worked at and the high regard he is held in within the game."
TBH, he fills this criteria 100%, this criteria was set by DA and the board. We all agree that DA is superb at his role, therefore we have to back his judgement.
With this is mind, lets judge SC come christmas, not before he has even worked with the team.
I for one was moaning re Roy Hodgson after some of the dross that we played at the beginning of the season, but in the end he came good. Lets give SC a fair crack first before we write him off.
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Not my first choice, but he wasnt the worse option we could have gone for. I will support Clarke 100 per cent.
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Peace goes for the cheap option again.....
Absolutely disgraceful, especially when you read that probably our preferred choice, is now the manager of Norwich City, at least Delia has some b*lls, and some cash, not like our accountant.
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Loving the spin from the club.
SC was never on their radar until Kenny was sacked, and that was weeks after RH was appointed England boss.
WBA would never have paid Liverpool compensation for him had Kenny remained.
I welcome him. I support him. But i'm deflated by the appointment and the whole process. Huge questions over his ability to motivate and 'manage' a match tactically.
His coaching qualifications speak for themselves.
Good luck Steve. You'll need it.
He was interviewed when the first round of interviews happened with Ranieri, Wilkins etc. We didn't just pounce when he left Liverpool.
At least its not Appleton and at least Sealandair was half wrong!!
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I simply do not understand why posters feel so negative about this appointment. There is no appointment that we could have made that would make the slightest bit of difference to the resources available to the club and that rather than who the coach is will determine the outcomes on the pitch. The range of possibilities for next year are still the same at the bottom end relegation and at the top end mid table. It would be the same under Clarke or Rangnick or even Mourinho.
However that debate is over I hope fans get behind him and show the same level of patience that was extended to some of his predecessors when we get a poor patch of form which is inevitable over the course of a season.
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Big Dave on SSN now
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http://www1.skysports.com/football/news/11698/7800212/Dalglish-Clarke-a-top-coach (http://www1.skysports.com/football/news/11698/7800212/Dalglish-Clarke-a-top-coach)
Kenny Dalglish believes his former Liverpool assistant Steve Clarke would be a perfect fit for West Brom, as they close on his appointment as their new boss.
The Baggies are expected to make an announcement regarding their vacant managerial post on Friday.
They have been in the market for a successor to Roy Hodgson, who is now in charge of the England national side, since the end of the 2011/12 Premier League season.
Numerous candidates have been linked with the post, including German tactician Ralf Rangnick.
It is, however, Clarke that has leapt to the front of the queue.RespectHe spent last season aiding Dalglish at Anfield, but left his assistant manager's role in the wake of the Scot's sacking.
It is understood that West Brom are now set to hand him his first taste of life in a top coaching job, and Dalglish believes the Baggies have made the right choice.
"Steve Clarke was a fantastic assistant boss to me at Liverpool," he told the Daily Record of a man who has also held coaching positions at Newcastle, Chelsea and West Ham.
"The players all respected him and enjoyed their training with him.
"I hear he's about to get the manager's job at West Brom and I'm happy for him.Stability"It would be a great move for him and for the club.
"It would be the perfect place for him to start out as boss because of the stability of the club.
"In some ways, the job there is a head coaching position and it would allow him to continue with something he does brilliantly.
"At the same time, he could ease himself gently into the role of managing a football club.
"I'm glad he's getting fixed up. He would be an asset to any club."
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Some comments on here are laughable, we are West Brom, not Man Utd, not Barcelona. We have little resources in comparison and are by no means an established Premier League club. Plus, we're not based in London which is another disadvantage, especially for overseas managers. We were never going to get a 'high profile' manager, but we've taken our time to find somebody who will fit in with the structure of the club, a structure that has took us from nowhere to mid table in one of the best leagues in the world.
So for all the people moaning, ask yourself if you want to support your team, who over the last 10 years have given us a fantastic roller coaster ride of emotions (it's never dull), or do you want to whinge all season like the Villa fans and end up having a shocker of a season?!
For all of those who keep going on about Hughton as well, he's been manager of 2 clubs who were expected to do well, he has not 'overachieved', why do people think he is so good? Mowbray has done wonders with Middlesbrough and got us up, but I wouldn't want him back!
Support the club or go and support Villa and join the 'we should be Champions League - Big club' brigade!
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Congratulations to SC - an interesting and brave appointment. I am looking forward to seeing how he handles the team - who if anybody he brings in to support him. Perhaps not quite as exciting as Rangnick would have been but he was a significant risk. Well done Albion - lets get behind him now. First job sign Foster and re-sign Scharner.
Foster very important - he seems a leader, organiser and motivator (especially if Olssen leaves) but if SC's first step is re-signing Scharner I will be VERY worried. Good Luck Steve Clarke.
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What also needs to be taken into account is that the structure of our club is different to others. We have Dan Ashworth. Many managers want to do their finding themselves. Our priority was for a coach who can manage, not a manager who can coach a bit. There are no doubts at all about his coaching pedigree.
In terms of the others, its no always about money. The vision of the club is to continue to support the structure - ie supporting Dan Ashworth. Some managers will not want to work in this way. The money may not have been the issue.
On this board we constantly seeing people complaining that the big names and big money signings are not made. Well, sorry, but time and time again, the unlikely contenders have been the ones that are better. Look at players like dorrans, ridgewell, malumbu.
If you dont like what you see on the pitch, or the results, then fine. But unless you understand the strategy and the way the club is put together then its a bit harsh to cirticise.
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firstly although i can't be described as the most excited person in the world, everyone needs to get behind him 100% if he is going to succeed, dont want to become a joke like blackburn and villa last season.
As i said this appointment doesn't fill me with excitement but brings with it more interest in how one of the best no.2's can step up (lets hope he can)
as someone's said bring on the fixtures, cue liverpool, west ham or chelsea
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Nothing signing and totally underwhelmed compared to the kind of manager/coach we should have signed.
HOWEVER
Now we have signed him, he will have my full backing and support.
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Glad its done.
Glad Steve Clarkes been appointed, good luck to him he will get mine and I'm sure most fans support.
Do Dan and JP think we're all totally stupid. Some of the spin they have put on the OS is amazing.
Steve emerged as the outstanding candidate? Get real you pair you got desperate when the number one target went off the radar. All this AVB and Ranieri were interviewed etc, anybody ever thought why that was released to the press but all went quiet when RR was 'thinking about it'.
Call me cynical but all fuss and palaver releasing these big names went quiet after the season ticket deadline had passed.
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Wow, what is it coming to when people say they cant give the manager 100% support, sounds like a few cant wait for him to fail so they can come on and say I told you so!
There is no reason on this planet why you shouldnt give the manager and team 100% support, as Ive said before we are West Brom, a class above the Blackburn, Wolves and Villa fans lets not become like them.
Whenever the fans dont get behind the team and manager and start getting on there backs it only ends in one thing which is failure.
if we are after a head coach then we have got a coach who has one of the best reputations in the country and worked with the very best players in the world so I dont know where our arrogance has come from after just 2 good seasons.
i really wanted RR after what I had heard and read about him but he would have been just as big a gamble.
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The words I was expecting as usual when appointing a manager or signing a player "we are delighted......." and "the outstanding candidate".
I share the concerns of many that SC has no previous management experience and there is a big question mark over whether he can take on the additional responsibilities in addition to his recognized coaching ability. For example some have commented that his demeanor is not suitable for motivating players such as during half-time breaks.
The jury is definitely out but we will have to give him a reasonable period of time to prove himself and for JP and DA to prove all us doubters wrong.
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Underwhelmed. He might do a good job, he might do a bad job. Massive gamble at the most crucial of points in our history. Will he persuade Olsson, Mulumbu and Pete to stay? If they go will he be able to manage a side without them to safety?
The cheap option yet again.
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Support the club or go and support Villa and join the 'we should be Champions League - Big club' brigade!
This is exactly the type of post I was referring to.
I fail to see how telling fellow fans to 'go and support Villa' just because their view point differs from yours, can be classed as a worthwhile post?
I don't know of anyone on here who believes we should be in the Champions League. However, what I do know is we have just had a top manager who has gone on to manage England so therefore, many would like another top coach to come in and continue where Roy left off, and not going for the cheap option so that we don't have to pay compensation.
I'm not saying SC will fail and a proven coach would have been an instant success, but it is more of a gamble going with someone who is unproven.
I really hope that the ones who mock ‘the doubters’ will not be moaning and calling for SC’s head when we lose a few matches.
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To be honest I'm underwhelmed and worried, but probably because he's an unknown quantity. However,
I'd rather Clarke than a half-hearted Rangnick. Rangnick dithered over his decision ... this was enough for me to see he was the wrong choice. Clarke will be keen to prove himself as No1, he knows the prem well, he has good contacts (Chelsea, Liverpool, Mourinho), he's a highly rated coach which fits our model well, he's not Appleton, he's not from the merry-go-round of failed/jaded managers (Curbishley, McCarthy etc.)
The club have not said he was our first choice and we know they always have a plan B. I think he became plan A when Rangnick dithered, maybe resurfacing doubts over his hunger for the job and perhaps the 'burnout' episode.
The key thing now is the support provided by JP/DA. We need to sign Foster (or equivalent), retain Olsson (or sign better), retain Mulumbu (or sign better), retain Odemwingie (or sign better)... without these players SAF or the special one himself would struggle to match Roy's achievements.
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Some comments on here are laughable, we are West Brom, not Man Utd, not Barcelona. We have little resources in comparison and are by no means an established Premier League club. Plus, we're not based in London which is another disadvantage, especially for overseas managers. We were never going to get a 'high profile' manager, but we've taken our time to find somebody who will fit in with the structure of the club, a structure that has took us from nowhere to mid table in one of the best leagues in the world.
So for all the people moaning, ask yourself if you want to support your team, who over the last 10 years have given us a fantastic roller coaster ride of emotions (it's never dull), or do you want to whinge all season like the Villa fans and end up having a shocker of a season?!
For all of those who keep going on about Hughton as well, he's been manager of 2 clubs who were expected to do well, he has not 'overachieved', why do people think he is so good? Mowbray has done wonders with Middlesbrough and got us up, but I wouldn't want him back!
Support the club or go and support Villa and join the 'we should be Champions League - Big club' brigade!
Top post.
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Some comments on here are laughable, we are West Brom, not Man Utd, not Barcelona. We have little resources in comparison and are by no means an established Premier League club. Plus, we're not based in London which is another disadvantage, especially for overseas managers. We were never going to get a 'high profile' manager, but we've taken our time to find somebody who will fit in with the structure of the club, a structure that has took us from nowhere to mid table in one of the best leagues in the world.
So for all the people moaning, ask yourself if you want to support your team, who over the last 10 years have given us a fantastic roller coaster ride of emotions (it's never dull), or do you want to whinge all season like the Villa fans and end up having a shocker of a season?!
For all of those who keep going on about Hughton as well, he's been manager of 2 clubs who were expected to do well, he has not 'overachieved', why do people think he is so good? Mowbray has done wonders with Middlesbrough and got us up, but I wouldn't want him back!
Support the club or go and support Villa and join the 'we should be Champions League - Big club' brigade!
Yes my mate! I couldn't have written it any better myself. You are spot on. :)
We are the Albion and that means for sure things will never be easy. If SC & I truly believe he will, does a great job for us then he will go to a 'bigger' club thats for sure & who would blame him? ;)
On another note was Jock Wallace the last Scotsman to 'manager' the Albion?
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Some comments on here are laughable, we are West Brom, not Man Utd, not Barcelona. We have little resources in comparison and are by no means an established Premier League club. Plus, we're not based in London which is another disadvantage, especially for overseas managers. We were never going to get a 'high profile' manager, but we've taken our time to find somebody who will fit in with the structure of the club, a structure that has took us from nowhere to mid table in one of the best leagues in the world.
So for all the people moaning, ask yourself if you want to support your team, who over the last 10 years have given us a fantastic roller coaster ride of emotions (it's never dull), or do you want to whinge all season like the Villa fans and end up having a shocker of a season?!
For all of those who keep going on about Hughton as well, he's been manager of 2 clubs who were expected to do well, he has not 'overachieved', why do people think he is so good? Mowbray has done wonders with Middlesbrough and got us up, but I wouldn't want him back!
Support the club or go and support Villa and join the 'we should be Champions League - Big club' brigade!
I just stated a fact, about the Accountant taking the cheap option, if you think we have no money, what about the massive surplus shown at the end of the last financial year.
Let's remember we are a football club, and the profits generated should be used for the benefit of the football club. I have stated previously we are not a city of London institution, for the financial benefit of our Chairman., but that is the way that we are being run.
It's a disgrace.
PS. I think that Steve is an excellent coach, but it is a massive gamble on him being a good manager.
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Im more dismayed than down hearted but ill get behind him. i just worry about our top players who now will probobly think that albion have no serious ambition. A very big gamble . boing boing
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The jury is out on this one..
Put simply if the results don't come in the first half of the season then he might not see a second year.
West brom are established, sc is not but we all hope he's up to the job.
Question is, how will some of the more senior players feel about playing for an unproven coach.
Time will tell..
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To be fair to the club, they cant say we are delighted to announce our 6th choice, they have to put spin, they said the outstanding candidate, not 'always our number 1 choice' he could of been the outstanding candidate out the people who did want the job.
We can bang on about Ralf, AVB, Ranieri, but even if they were all offered it and turned it down, there could of been 100 people turned it down, you cant force them to accept it, all you can do is move on to the next best person who does want it.
Its not like we have gave it to some sunday league manager, this is the bloke who has coached the likes of Drobga, Lampard, Robben, Gerrard, Suarez every day and fans of clubs he has worked at and other staff think the sun shines out of his a**e so least he deserves his support and a chance!
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we have just had a top manager who has gone on to manage England so therefore, many would like another top coach to come in and continue where Roy left off, and not going for the cheap option
I think Roy came to us because he knew he was in the running for the England job and he needed to be at a Prem club being seen to be doing well to give him a chance of getting it after the Liverpool debacle. Would we have got him otherwise?
Roy is one of the worlds top coaches and to think we could replace like with like was never going to happen.
It may just be that Steve Clarke is one of the worlds top coaches in waiting. Just the sort of person JP and DA have a habit of going for, as in TM and RDM. And RDM hasn't done too bad has he?
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Any ideas if there will be a press conference today?
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Im more dismayed than down hearted but ill get behind him. i just worry about our top players who now will probobly think that albion have no serious ambition. A very big gamble . boing boing
Lol, Except one season with West Ham this is probably the worst set of players that Clarke has worked with, with all respect possible to our players I don't mean that in a bad way. So if any player thinks that (which I dont think they will) they need to pull there head out of the clouds.
You are right about a very big gamble though, and boing boing ;D
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Ron Wylie in 80s was last Scot to manage us
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If people dont rate him, undecided, or love him then thats their opinion, we all have them and our reasons why.
However i dont get the cheap option, i am sure Clarke is known as the most expensive number 2 in the country isnt he? (that sounds wrong doesn it!)
If we offered Ranieri £2m a year and he gets £4m a year at Monaco cant do much, if we offered Rangnick £2m a year and he still says no, should we just offer Clarke £2m for the sake of it! If his demands are £1m a year or whatever then so be it!
I genuniely dont think we were that fussed about Hughton, 2 out the last 3 appointments we have paid clubs compensation for the manager and backroom staff so we have shown we will pay out for the right man which would suggest they felt Hughton wasnt the right man.
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Any ideas if there will be a press conference today?
Press conference is a week on Monday, the 18th June.
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I think Roy came to us because he knew he was in the running for the England job and he needed to be at a Prem club being seen to be doing well to give him a chance of getting it after the Liverpool debacle. Would we have got him otherwise?
Roy is one of the worlds top coaches and to think we could replace like with like was never going to happen.
It may just be that Steve Clarke is one of the worlds top coaches in waiting. Just the sort of person JP and DA have a habit of going for, as in TM and RDM. And RDM hasn't done too bad has he?
TM has been a disaster at Celtic and Boro and RDM got incredibly lucky !
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I was just about to post something similar.
I think Roy came to us because he knew he was in the running for the England job and he needed to be at a Prem club being seen to be doing well to give him a chance of getting it after the Liverpool debacle. Would we have got him otherwise?
Roy is one of the worlds top coaches and to think we could replace like with like was never going to happen.
It may just be that Steve Clarke is one of the worlds top coaches in waiting. Just the sort of person JP and DA have a habit of going for, as in TM and RDM. And RDM hasn't done too bad has he?
The set of circumstances that allowed us to get a manager of Roy's status were an absolute rarity. We couldn't possibly have replaced like for like. He was unluckily out of work at the same time as we were looking for a new boss (imagine Roy's compensation to buy him from fulbam or Liverpool). He needed to be in a job in the PL to fulfil his ambition. It was the perfect fit at the time. Maybe when the planets are all in alignment again we can do something similar.
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Welcome Steve.
We sincerely wish you all the success we wish ourselves.
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If I’m honest, I was a little bit disappointed when I heard that Steve Clarke was closing in on the job particularly given our strong pursuit of Rangnick who, on paper, looked a very strong candidate.
However, the more I hear about Steve Clarke and the high regard with which he is held within the game, the more I am warming to the idea of his appointment. His coaching methods have been widely praised and he was seen as the man responsible for considerably improving the defensive performances of both West Ham and Liverpool. If we are to reinforce the defensive work that Hodgson did during his time here, then Steve Clarke would appear to be a good man for the job.
I understand the concerns regarding his lack of managerial experience and there are certainly question marks over how he will adapt to the increased demands of this role. What style of football will he employ? How will he handle the media pressure? Are his man management skills up to scratch? There is off course an element of risk regarding these unanswered questions but there is also an element of excitement. I genuinely believe from what I’ve heard/read that Clarke has the potential to be a very good manager. Whether he will be able to fulfil this potential is off course a different issue.
Regardless of whether you are for or against the appointment I think it’s time to draw a line in the sand and give Clarke your full support. Anything but this is completely unacceptable IMO.
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He was interviewed when the first round of interviews happened with Ranieri, Wilkins etc. We didn't just pounce when he left Liverpool.
At least its not Appleton and at least Sealandair was half wrong!!
I wasn't saying we pounced only after he left Liverpool. I'm saying he wasn't even on the radar until Kenny left.
We would never have paid compo to buy him out of his contract at L'pool had Kenny remained and had SC stayed a part of Kenny's coaching team.
Anyway, as long as his philosophy is to keep the ball on the deck, press hard and be tight at the back I'll be happy.
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Just to add, this talk of SC being the ‘cheap’ option is such a lazy, generic argument. Rangnick and Ranieri were arguably ‘cheap’ options given that they were both without a club. Also, by the sounds of it Hughton wasn’t pursued because he didn’t fit the structure of the club rather than anything to do with compensation figures (despite that being the press line). Perhaps Clarke is simply the ‘right’ option given the structure we have in place at the football club and our seeming lack of success in trying to entice higher profile candidates.
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I think WBA would do well to bring in another person to support SC and the coaching team. Somebody who can help deal with the press etc.
A Wilkins character etc.
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Steve Clarke!! I would think it was the last name anybody thought about when Roy left, and before anybody has a go at me I have been a Baggie since 1966 and seen some rubbish managers / coaches and I hope to God he wont be one of them but only time will tell. I am disappointed with the appointment.
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If I’m honest, I was a little bit disappointed when I heard that Steve Clarke was closing in on the job particularly given our strong pursuit of Rangnick who, on paper, looked a very strong candidate.
However, the more I hear about Steve Clarke and the high regard with which he is held within the game, the more I am warming to the idea of his appointment. His coaching methods have been widely praised and he was seen as the man responsible for considerably improving the defensive performances of both West Ham and Liverpool. If we are to reinforce the defensive work that Hodgson did during his time here, then Steve Clarke would appear to be a good man for the job.
I understand the concerns regarding his lack of managerial experience and there are certainly question marks over how he will adapt to the increased demands of this role. What style of football will he employ? How will he handle the media pressure? Are his man management skills up to scratch? There is off course an element of risk regarding these unanswered questions but there is also an element of excitement. I genuinely believe from what I’ve heard/read that Clarke has the potential to be a very good manager. Whether he will be able to fulfil this potential is off course a different issue.
Regardless of whether you are for or against the appointment I think it’s time to draw a line in the sand and give Clarke your full support. Anything but this is completely unacceptable IMO.
Excellent post, couldn't have put it better myself!!
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Great appointment, all the best Steve Clarke.
I personally think Mr Clarke will be a great manager, he has patiently built up his confidence working with some top clubs and top names. Now hes ready to lead a side himself i am really pleased he chose West Brom because i see him swiftly becoming as respected as Martinez and Rodgers.
His defensive knowledge is immense so hopefully Steve can carry on where Roy left and make us very hard to beat. Who knows, he might talk his mate Zola into joining us to help coach the attacking side of things, thats dreaming, but the reality is that its Steve Clarke at the helm next season, that for me is a brave and positive move that deserves our 100% support.
I dont reckon he will be sacked by xmas etc etc like some on here are saying, i think that in a couple of years time we will have dificulty keeping him when the "bigger" clubs see what they're missing out on.
Go for it Stevie, the future is unwritten.
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not impressed, should and could have attracted better.Good luck Steve you are going to need it.You get my full support
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I'm disappointed but also very excited over the appointment. I appreciate the club did their level best to try and attract a more glamorous name, I certainly took the names of Ranieri and Rangnick to heart and perhaps got to indulged and lost sense of reality. We are a small club in this league which will always punch over its weight. What I do hope is that our fans give Steve Clarke time and if we do lose our first three games or whatever, they remain patient and give him our continued support.
Good luck, Clarkey!
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not impressed, should and could have attracted better.Good luck Steve you are going to need it.You get my full support
Is that not a contradiction? How is this giving him your full support?
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Is that not a contradiction? How is this giving him your full support?
I wont be calling for his head is what i mean
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welcome to WBA steve clarke i wish you all the luck in the world you going to need it.
you have learned from some of the best managers in the world hope that helps.
well mr peace i have learned from the tightest b*****d in the world so ill keep my money firmly in my pockets for now just like you,
ahh f**k it im goin fishing.
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Good blog, worth a read.
http://blogs.birminghammail.net/westbromwichalbion/ (http://blogs.birminghammail.net/westbromwichalbion/)
PERCEPTION and image isn't all it's cracked up to be.
Example: Take a football manager who many fans aren't sure about?
Sounds like Roy Hodgson and England, no?
Try one a little closer to home.
Steve Clarke for West Bromwich Albion.
When the Birmingham Mail broke this news, first came the surprise and then followed an outpouring of all sorts.
Some of it positive, a lot of it mixed, much of it despondent, disappointed and even angry.
He should be appointed today.
Whether Clarke was first choice or not is irrelevant.
The process of recruitment raised more questions than it answered. At times the perception was of an internal trawl through the League Managers Association's website of out-of-work bosses. So many people spoken to. Foreign coaches brought in. Albion's due diligence knows no bounds and you have to admire them for not going for the obvious option.
The lack of open dialogue or statements was frustrating for fans. German reports claiming Ralf Rangnick was the new boss didn't help. Yet Jeremy Peace is no Dave Whelan and Dan Ashworth is definitely no Jez Moxey.
The 'process' seemed unnecessarily clumsy and drawn-out.
And clearly Albion are taking a risk when perhaps there is no demand or need for it.
But is it any more of a risk than the alternatives? Maybe. But each appointment carries some doubt.
How many people wanted Gary Megson, Tony Mowbray or Roberto Di Matteo?
This appointment could be a Jeremy Peace masterstroke just as easily as it could define the chairman's next two years or so if it goes horribly wrong.
But isn't that usually the case? The safe pair of hands which arrived in the form of Roy Hodgson last February were not available this time. A lot of it was damaged goods.
Claudio Ranieri? He's been collecting P45s for fun during the last few years.
Ralf Rangnick, a German with a great pedigree. He might have become Albion's Arsene Wenger. Or maybe their Christian Gross.
Ultimately both might have been very successful too. We shall never know. Chris Hughton is perhaps the one which might hurt them. Albion's pursuit of him seemed dog-eared.
Others were unsuitable, out-of-reach or probably not too different to those already mentioned. And, again, only a select number of people within Albion's corridors of power got to know the quirks, mannerisms, qualities and deficiencies of each candidate.
It's easy to be seduced by high-profile names, foreign tongues and smooth operators. Sometimes a little more substance is needed.
I have no clues as to how Steve Clarke will set his teams up. Pre-season will be intriguing.
Clarke is happy to indulge innovation.
He's been No2 alongside the free-flowing Ruud Gullit, the methodical Jose Mourinho, purist Gianfranco Zola and helped shape Kenny Dalglish's defence. Sometimes successfully, sometimes not.
What of Steve Clarke the manager? Therein lies another issue.
He won't be a manager, but the head coach. Many of those 'managerial' responsibilities are handed over to Dan Ashworth.
It's a hybrid role - which served Hodgson and Robbie Di Matteo effectively - but the distinction between the two is valid and much of Clarke's previous experience is geared towards this aspect of the position. A shouter, a motivator who is averse to training would have been totally unsuitable. It's designed more with coaching in mind.
That said, certain aspects of this role, not least man-management of players and being their 'gaffer', will be new to him. These will test him. He doesn't have long to learn.
The other argument being used is that Clarke doesn't possess the profile to attract players. This is a misnomer. The notion that he (or any other boss for that matter) would lack a pedigree to sell the club to players is pure urban mythology. Footballers are primarily attracted to clubs who offer the best financial packages and chances for silverware. Players who suggest otherwise are, from experience, offering mere lip service. Few managers these days - apart from those at the very tip of the football pyramid - have the gravitas or power to offer this mystical pull towards their club.
Zola, who served for some of Italy's and England's best coaches as a player before becoming a boss himself, described Clarke's innovative training sessions as "brilliant".
Ex-Chelsea player Aleksey Smertin, a footballer of 16 years, once said: "Clarke was very approachable and could talk to the players at the same level. You could be honest with him. He was a funny guy as well. I don't know too many players who didn't like him."
And what of the Special One?
Mourinho said: "If he had the chance to manage a club, even a big club like Chelsea, he would be ready for that. He is that good. He is an intelligent guy and always looking to improve. He is very open to co-operation and learning. He has a good relationship with the players, knows how to handle them. I think he is much, much better than many managers who are in charge of teams at the moment."
We shall see.
Albion's finishing point of 10th will inevitably be an expectation Clarke has to wrestle with. Hodgson extracted a lot from his players.
It would need a staggering level of good fortune and financial investment to better that.
Merely maintaining Premier League respectability is crucial.
Away from the hyperbole, Albion have their part to play.
Roy Hodgson warned that greater investment was needed to give Albion any chance of being more than just a mid-table side.
Just because he's gone, Hodgson's words shouldn't fall on deaf ears just because a new man is in charge.
Anyway, Steve, enjoy...
Chris Lepkowski
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I wont be calling for his head is what i mean
Sounds like you will be one of those where you cant wait to open a 'carson' thread the minute we have a bad result.
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Sounds like you will be one of those where you cant wait to open a 'carson' thread the minute we have a bad result.
Probably right,if we loose the first 5 games i wont be the only one either i suspect
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I really cant understand the negativity, yes its a risk but so would employing any coach. Take Liverpool for instance with Kenny (King Kenny, the best thing since sliced bread). Sacked!!!!
We wanted a coach because the set up at Albion is different from most. This guy comes with a really good track record and the backing of all his past employers, generous with their praise. Now Pep Guardiola finished playing in I think 2005, started coaching at a little known club Barcelona and was made manager in 2008. The rest is history.
This is a brave appointment but one the more I think about it makes total sense.
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Probably right,if we loose the first 5 games i wont be the only one either i suspect
Well your idea of giving someone your full support is way off what mine is!!
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Welcome Steve, prove to us and the world that you can go on to become a great number 1.
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If I’m honest, I was a little bit disappointed when I heard that Steve Clarke was closing in on the job particularly given our strong pursuit of Rangnick who, on paper, looked a very strong candidate.
However, the more I hear about Steve Clarke and the high regard with which he is held within the game, the more I am warming to the idea of his appointment. His coaching methods have been widely praised and he was seen as the man responsible for considerably improving the defensive performances of both West Ham and Liverpool. If we are to reinforce the defensive work that Hodgson did during his time here, then Steve Clarke would appear to be a good man for the job.
I understand the concerns regarding his lack of managerial experience and there are certainly question marks over how he will adapt to the increased demands of this role. What style of football will he employ? How will he handle the media pressure? Are his man management skills up to scratch? There is off course an element of risk regarding these unanswered questions but there is also an element of excitement. I genuinely believe from what I’ve heard/read that Clarke has the potential to be a very good manager. Whether he will be able to fulfil this potential is off course a different issue.
Regardless of whether you are for or against the appointment I think it’s time to draw a line in the sand and give Clarke your full support. Anything but this is completely unacceptable IMO.
Completely agree with your post. I think some people are confusing a good appointment with an exciting appointment (ie a big name). We dont yet know if he will be a good appointment but we wouldnt know that whoever got the job. By all accounts he is an excellent coach. Everyone who has worked with him has nothing but praise for him, so I am hopeful he will be a success. Let's just give him a fair chance and see what happens.
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That article is perfect. There will always be irrational people and supporters in the world the only thing you can do (which most chairmen and football clubs do) is ignore them and do what they think is best.
It's a risk, any appointment we would have made is a risk in some way .Steve Clarke is our head coach, support him and the team and see where it gets us.
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Well your idea of giving someone your full support is way off what mine is!!
I wont boo him if thats what you mean, i wont shout his name either unles he keeps us up.I will just sit there like i normally do encouraging the team
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Just to add, this talk of SC being the ‘cheap’ option is such a lazy, generic argument. Rangnick and Ranieri were arguably ‘cheap’ options given that they were both without a club. Also, by the sounds of it Hughton wasn’t pursued because he didn’t fit the structure of the club rather than anything to do with compensation figures (despite that being the press line). Perhaps Clarke is simply the ‘right’ option given the structure we have in place at the football club and our seeming lack of success in trying to entice higher profile candidates.
A lazy comment, sorry, it is not lazy, but it is accurate. The whole of the club is run on the cheap, sometimes being careful with the cash is acceptable, but the continued scrooge like attitude of the Chairman, will lead to disaster.
It could be that manager's like Hughton, were not interested in joining us, I feel that there should be a little more honesty, AVB, etc were never going to join us, all far to expensive,
I am aware that we do not have a good reputation in footballing circles, which will only change when Peace sells up.
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Well your idea of giving someone your full support is way off what mine is!!
he also likes to support [or not support] the albion in a clown suit
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Fact is we have no way of knowing which way this appointment will go.
This time last year we were saying QPR/Swansea/Norwich were doomed and would go sstraight back down.
What do we, or some pundits for that matter actually know.
Rogers and Lambert have been picked to lead more established clubs in the Premiership after only one season at it, who's to say Clarky wont be in that position next season. His credentials certainly stack up against those two.
Lets give the bloke the respect he deserves and hope it works out for him. And us ::)
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he also likes to support [or not support] the albion in a clown suit
Yes and i was done in on the day not, i remember your coment that anyone dressed as a clown would get done in, how wrong you were.Do you go the the Hawthorns much?
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As I have said before,Steve Clarke is not the perfect choice in my opinion.But I will back him 100% and wish him luck,maybe he is the right one for us,only time will tell..
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not these days i have other commitments, why does that mean im less of a fan than you
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Further thoughts on Steve Clarke's appointment. http://tinyurl.com/csco2jd
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I too am not going to hide my feelings. I'm gutted in all honesty. The way things went has just been a joke. I really hoped we would go out there and look for somebody on par with Hodgson and we've ended up rolling the dice and placing someone into the job with nobody knowing what the hell might happen next year.
I think its going to be a bumpy ride next season, I just beg that we don't undo all the good hard work we've done over the past three years, started with Di Matteo and improved by Hodgson.
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I too am not going to hide my feelings. I'm gutted in all honesty. The way things went has just been a joke. I really hoped we would go out there and look for somebody on par with Hodgson and we've ended up rolling the dice and placing someone into the job with nobody knowing what the hell might happen next year.
I think its going to be a bumpy ride next season, I just beg that we don't undo all the good hard work we've done over the past three years, started with Di Matteo and improved by Hodgson.
Nobody knows what the hell might happen next year, irrespective as to who is manager.
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not these days i have other commitments, why does that mean im less of a fan than you
We are all fans together.
Season ticket holder from Devon,Travel to quite a few away games, co leader of the Honour the bomber campaign, collecting signatures in the snow(Swansea) wind and rain
Like i say i haver never booed anyone at the Albion and i certainly dont start negative threads on under performing employes at the Albion.Just because i dont agree with this appointment it dont mean to say i am not going to continue supporting the players on the pitch.
Lets hope Steve does well
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A lazy comment, sorry, it is not lazy, but it is accurate. The whole of the club is run on the cheap, sometimes being careful with the cash is acceptable, but the continued scrooge like attitude of the Chairman, will lead to disaster.
It could be that manager's like Hughton, were not interested in joining us, I feel that there should be a little more honesty, AVB, etc were never going to join us, all far to expensive,
I am aware that we do not have a good reputation in footballing circles, which will only change when Peace sells up.
Hang on there chap, while I am disappointed with the Clarke appointment I still think the club is run financially sound. I don't want us to end up like Portsmouth do you
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The more I think about it, the more I am quietly pleased with this appointment. Granted it is not the big name that we all wanted e.g. AVB, Rangnick, Ranieri but I'd much rather have a coach who perhaps is a little under the radar with something to prove to himself and the rest of the footballing world, someone who is comitted to wanting to be our head coach over someone like Ranieri or Rangnick who was clearly holding out for a better deal.
Its the same with players, we got rid of the likes of Koumas and Davies who didn't want to play and replaced them with players who did. Can any of you say you were excited when we announced signings like Billy Jones and Gareth McCauley whilst them lot down the road were splashing the cash on defenders? We have produced suprises time and time again and there is more reason to be be optimistic about this appointment than there is to be negative about it.
COYB.
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I'm disappointed as this reeks of Albion doing things on the cheap! We all know nothing of SC as he is totally new to management , but what worries me is that he has never been promoted from within when the manager has been sacked ! He has only been trusted with one game as a caretaker.
I know has been at some large clubs , but if he was so good at West Ham with Zola , why didn't he get his chance then? These clubs must know how good he really is.
Every new appointment is a chance , but this seems to be a lot riskier than Norwich's new appointment! Premier League status is a lot to lose!!
I hope I'm very wrong , but we are going to struggle next year
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I'm disappointed as this reeks of Albion doing things on the cheap!
I can understand certain critisisms of the Clarke appointment but not this one, it has been quoted numerous times on here in the last few days that Clarke was one of the highest paid coaches in the PL last season.
"£600k a year at Chelsea, £900k a year at West Ham with £1m compensation to get him, £750k a year at Liverpool."
Any form of statistics you look at will show you that wages are the most important area of expendature in a football club, and we certainly cannot be accused of doing things on the cheap if the above figures are anything to go by.
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Cheap or otherwise, it's a better decision than that Hughton fellow anyway in my view. Well, at least more interesting. He's got just as many faults as Rangnick or Hughton. A risk worth taking, and I think it's the most likely to turn up roses. Then again all I expect is to stay in the league still. Anything better will do me nicely, Steve. ;)
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Interestingly i cannot find a single comment from our chairman on the appointment.Has he resumed a family holiday or is he lying low hoping any unfavourable reaction will have passed by the time of the press conference :o
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Clarke does have a lot of Premiership experance something that Rangnick doesnt have. I'm looking forward to the new signings in the coming months.
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as been mentioned probably not anyones first choice but SC's credentials as a coach
are second to none, DA described him as an outstanding candidate obviously from his
coaching record and HIS interview 3 weeks ago how does anyone know that he wasn't
in the frame after this (obviously he was),
ranieri,avb we obviously spoke to but come on did anyone hand on heart belive we would get either ranieri looking for his pension fund abd avb just not big enough for him,
so RR is a diff matter we may well have offered him the job but he as took over a week to give an answer or not give an answer and we moved on who really knows
CH nothing to do with compensation whether that suits peoples arguments or not it was about all the staff he wanted to bring with him
which brings us to SC our new gaffer i have no idea whether it will work or not but i for one will give him my 100% backing
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Welcome to WBA Steve.
Here's hoping you prove the doubters wrong.
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I'm disappointed as this reeks of Albion doing things on the cheap! We all know nothing of SC as he is totally new to management , but what worries me is that he has never been promoted from within when the manager has been sacked ! He has only been trusted with one game as a caretaker.
I know has been at some large clubs , but if he was so good at West Ham with Zola , why didn't he get his chance then? These clubs must know how good he really is.
Every new appointment is a chance , but this seems to be a lot riskier than Norwich's new appointment! Premier League status is a lot to lose!!
I hope I'm very wrong , but we are going to struggle next year
Difference here is that he isn't a manager, which he would have been if stepping up. This is the prefect role for him, inbetween being coach (which he excels at) and being a full time manager.
Steve will do a fine job and we will stay in the league, which unfortunately with all the money the top teams have, is the best we can hope for until/unless JP sells to genuine rich new owners
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Have I missed something but when did Chris Hughton become the next Jose Mourinho? Seriously he has 2 years as a manager 3 months at premier league level and the rest of his coaching career has been as an assistant. On that basis no one on here really can claim he is vastly better than Steve Clarke he might not be as good but we will never know.
As for doing it on the cheap the club has an income of somewhere between £55m and £60m most of which goes on players wages. I see little or no point in spending money on compensation for a coach and thereby depriving the coach of resources to achieve his objectives.
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What a joke I was really looking forward to next season but now fear the worst, lets wait and see where Foster ends up, my money says he will not be coming back to us.
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It's over and done with now.
I understand people being underwhelmed or disappointed, but hopefully when the time comes he gets the full support of all the fans and not have people waiting to jump on his back at the first opportunity.
At least now this is done, we can now all start worrying about something else. When's Foster signing? ;)
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Really gutted and worried about this appointment, however, it is done now, so I will be getting behind SC and the boys and hope we all do the same the last thing we want is an atmosphere at the Hawthorns akin to what the vile had last season.
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Have I missed something but when did Chris Hughton become the next Jose Mourinho? Seriously he has 2 years as a manager 3 months at premier league level and the rest of his coaching career has been as an assistant. On that basis no one on here really can claim he is vastly better than Steve Clarke he might not be as good but we will never know.
As for doing it on the cheap the club has an income of somewhere between £55m and £60m most of which goes on players wages. I see little or no point in spending money on compensation for a coach and thereby depriving the coach of resources to achieve his objectives.
Best post I have seen - ;)
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i made my views known on the manager thread but this has to be the most inspired and most intelligent appointment I have seen by any EPL club in years. please just read up a little about what people in the game say about him.
If Roy was not involved in that recommendation I would be amazed. WBA have a little gem on their hands.
Are you about Mr J Russell? ITK's do you think now or not?
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Not to be unveiled to the media until Monday 18th June apparently. Will give him enough time to learn the script Jeremy Peace has given him ;)
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lets ALL give sc a chance as im sure we will being albion fans, he will be hungry as its his first time at the helm of a club so lets hope his 10 year apprentiship will be to our advantage, lets hope he does well but not fantasticly well or we will be looking for yet another head coach, no appointment is assured to be successful so lets how he does before we judge him, not a choice that gets the blood pumping but neither was rh was he?? only time will tell.
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i actually think this appointment may work if SC gets the right backing in the transfer stakes and gets the senior players onside early in his reign
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lets ALL give sc a chance as im sure we will being albion fans, he will be hungry as its his first time at the helm of a club so lets hope his 10 year apprentiship will be to our advantage, lets hope he does well but not fantasticly well or we will be looking for yet another head coach, no appointment is assured to be successful so lets how he does before we judge him, not a choice that gets the blood pumping but neither was rh was he?? only time will tell.
Seen this said a few times, and I have to say I don't get it. My view is let's do as well as we possibly can, like we have the last 2 seasons, always looking to improve on and off the pitch i.e EPPP. The longer we continue to 'punch above our weight' then becomes our weight. And we should try to punch above that then too. If we're not aiming as high as we possibly can, then what's the point? And if that means recruiting a new Head Coach every 2 years then so be it.
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Shocking JP time to go.
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Hang on there chap, while I am disappointed with the Clarke appointment I still think the club is run financially sound. I don't want us to end up like Portsmouth do you
I think there is a huge difference between spending an extra million or two for the right manager or player compared with what Portsmouth have done.
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I can understand certain critisisms of the Clarke appointment but not this one, it has been quoted numerous times on here in the last few days that Clarke was one of the highest paid coaches in the PL last season.
"£600k a year at Chelsea, £900k a year at West Ham with £1m compensation to get him, £750k a year at Liverpool."
Any form of statistics you look at will show you that wages are the most important area of expendature in a football club, and we certainly cannot be accused of doing things on the cheap if the above figures are anything to go by.
It doesn't necessarily mean he is on big wages with us though. The facts are that he was unemployed and the chance to be a 'no.1' at a Prem club is too good an opportunity to miss. I bet he's taken whatever was on the table to get this opportunity.
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I'm all for opinions but what people are avoiding is actually identifying this "we should have got better / much more experienced / higher profile" mystical manager.
Ranieri and AVB were never in a million years going to become our manager (i generally believe i would have been a more likely candidate to get the job and i have only a six month semi-drunken player manager stint in the Stafford Sunday League DIV 3 on my CV!)
A club like ours have to take risks in appointing managers. We are simply not a club who lure's big name managers. RR would have also been a massive gamble too. I never really understood the Chris Hughton love in, so overall I'm pretty excited about the season ahead.
If we wanted premier league management experience take your pick from Mick McCarthy, Steve Bruce, Steve Coppell or Alan Curbishly.
If players are happy with the cash in their pocket they arent going anywhere (except for 1 or 2 delusional foreign players i could mention who think the top 4 are waiting to sign them!) I would also suggest that Clarke has some fantastic contacts in his locker in regards to young talented players / players who aren't getting a game with the big boys.
Yes its a risk, but a well thought out one in my opinion.
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I think there is a huge difference between spending an extra million or two for the right manager or player compared with what Portsmouth have done.
Agreed, but it is more complex than that. It's a mindset among many fans.
If we listened to everything on this board, we would be splashing a few million on AVB, more millions on a few world class players and then when it all went tits up, as the odds suggest it would, we could easily end up like Portsmouth, in administration.
Ok they won an FA Cup but their fans would probably prefer to be in the Prem and on an even keel.
We should thank God JP is a businessman first and a fan second!
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I'm really excited about next season now with Clarke finally in place. I am optimistic about his chances and I'm looking forward to see how we can enhance the squad in the transfer window; hopefully keeping hold of our key players in the process.
Good luck Steve, expect a warm reception at the Hawthorns in the very near future.
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Anything been mentioned about who Steve will have as his number 2?
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Interesting that much of the reaction from non-WBA supports is very postive...
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/18366208
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The more ive had time to dwell on the decision, the more im warming to it even more than i did already.
Think this could potentially be a little masterstroke from JP and DA.
Good luck SC, Stevie Clarkes Barmy Army.
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I want my season ticket back
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Anything been mentioned about who Steve will have as his number 2?
Im guessin hell stick with Downing and Kiely for the foreseeable future.
Will probably bring 1 in as a asssitant at some point.
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The more ive had time to dwell on the decision, the more im warming to it even more than i did already.
Think this could potentially be a little masterstroke from JP and DA.
Good luck SC, Stevie Clarkes Barmy Army.
What makes you say that? (not disagreeing, just wondered)
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I want my season ticket back
Who did you give it to? Sounds like you're really looking forward to the season the way that you can't wait to get your hands on your season ticket already.
Welcome to the club Steve. Looking forward to seeing what type of approach you bring to our game. Onwards and upwards : )
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Watch when we have a good start to the season, win a few games, and suddenly it's 'genius' Ashworth and 'shrewd' Peace again.
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Welcome and good luck Steve!
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Interesting that much of the reaction from non-WBA supports is very postive...
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/18366208
I would suggest that the reaction from these people would be massively different if it had been their club that had appointed him.
Dont sh** on your own doorstep !
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What makes you say that? (not disagreeing, just wondered)
In the ideal scenario Clarke shows why he's rated highly proves he can manage. This would be shown by the continuation of Hodgson's success in terms of a resilient defense and league success. I.e. Clarke becomes Brendan Rodgers #2.
Clarke learnt under Mourinho, the defensive mastermind, and depending on who you believe was also responsible for Liverpool's strong defense last year, which was their main positive.
Of course, it's all speculation and he could be rubbish - but I think the above would clearly constitute a masterstroke.
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I see that the 'unveiling' of Steve to the media will not take place until a week next Monday - presumably to tie in with the launch of the new kit and, hopefully, to unveil some new signings.
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good luck steve
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I see that the 'unveiling' of Steve to the media will not take place until a week next Monday - presumably to tie in with the launch of the new kit and, hopefully, to unveil some new signings.
And to wait until peoples concerns have had the chance to abait !
Think it may take a little bit longer for that than next Monday.
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I see that the 'unveiling' of Steve to the media will not take place until a week next Monday - presumably to tie in with the launch of the new kit and, hopefully, to unveil some new signings.
More likely to tie in with pre-booked holidays.
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I want my season ticket back
Get in touch with the ticket office I'm sure they will sort you out with a new one as I can only assume you have lost it, great to hear you are so enthusiastic to get it back when others appear devastated with the appointment of Clarke so good on you.
If however you are trying to say you want a refund on your ticket then I'm sure they will help you out with that too.
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how much "coaching" should professional footballers at the top level actually need. I feel like a manager is more crucial at the top than a coach, someone who will motivate the players rather than coach them,
You cant question the guys background in coaching, but i do have reservations as to whether Clarke will be able to manage and motivate our players
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My first reaction was mild disappointment but I'm coming round to this decision.
JP/DA have been right in the past so let's trust their judgement again. I've often felt underwhelmed with previous manageral appointments even Roy Hodgson and Gary Megson/Ray Hartford - I was wrong on each of those occassions so I've come to the conclusion that I know little about what makes a good Head Coach!
Good luck Steve Clarke - Up The Baggies!
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Shocking JP time to go.
Award winningly pathetic comment there, well done.
We've had back to back 11th and 10th place finishes, done with a background of virtually no debt and we've the best collection of players for about thirty years.
Yet JP and co don't deliver the big fancy name you want so it's JP out?!
He tried for The Tinkerman and Ralf and apparently even interviewed AVB. But they didn't want to come. What more could he do? So he's nabbed a very well respected coach with 10+ years in the Prem at many top clubs. It's a coaching role, not a managing one, which alot of people outside of Albion don't seem to get.
There are many "bigger" clubs who would kill to be us right now. We outrank them because of how we're run, which is almost entirely down to JP and AD.
Shame on you for JP to go. At best it's clueless and Naive and at worst it spoilt and ridiculous.
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welcome and good luck steve! :D
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Could be an inspired and long term appointment. Think David Moyes, thats what i'm hoping.
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Well he's here and he will get my backing.Too many people are writing him off before he has got behind his desk.
You don't work at some of the biggest clubs in the prem and with some of the biggest names in football if you are a mug.
He knows this division inside out,knows how tough and merciless it is,and he will have an head start by knowing this.
Most importantly,he says he is honoured to be here and wants to build on the foundations already laid.
He doesn't come over as someone who sees us just as a stop gap until a better appointment comes along,which i always felt might be the case with Rangneck,and to be fair was the case with Roy.
He is here for at least two years because he wants to be and feels he has a lot to offer.
Lets trust JP and DA on this one.
Welcome to the Hawthorns Steve.
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Welcome to the club Steve, we're behind you 100%.
However i'm still very underwhelmed at this appointment, not necessarily with Clarke but the way we messed about for so long and being told this out and out lie that he was at the top of our list. I have no problem trusting DA and JP in finding a good Head Coach, but I don't like being lied to by the club I spend a huge proportion of my income on.
Ahh well, such is life. BOING BOING!
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Award winningly pathetic comment there, well done.
We've had back to back 11th and 10th place finishes, done with a background of virtually no debt and we've the best collection of players for about thirty years.
Yet JP and co don't deliver the big fancy name you want so it's JP out?!
He tried for The Tinkerman and Ralf and apparently even interviewed AVB. But they didn't want to come. What more could he do? So he's nabbed a very well respected coach with 10+ years in the Prem at many top clubs. It's a coaching role, not a managing one, which alot of people outside of Albion don't seem to get.
There are many "bigger" clubs who would kill to be us right now. We outrank them because of how we're run, which is almost entirely down to JP and AD.
Shame on you for JP to go. At best it's clueless and Naive and at worst it spoilt and ridiculous.
Ha ha .... brilliant response 'solo baggie'!
The guys here now! Worked with the best of 'em including Sir Bobby & Mourinho, so let's back him to the hilt!
Welcome to the Baggies Clarkey! Now go & get everyone onside by talking Ollson into staying & working with DA at bringing in Foster & a few other quality signings!
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Shocking JP time to go.
I am not thrilled with the appointment but I don't want JP to go.
Apart from the Sheikh and Abramovich there is not another current owner that I would want running our club.
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Very excited, these are the reasons
* What style of football will he play?, some say he organised the Liverpool defence and they were quite strong at the back. But apparantley he loves the ball to be passed on the ground not hoofed up to the target man.
*What formation will he play?, will it be a rigid 4-4-2 or will he go to 4-5-1 ?
* What type of players will he go for ? Dan Ashworth will help Clarke out with this.
* And who will he bring in to help him out, Kiely and Downing will stay but we could do with a assistant coach.
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Very excited, these are the reasons
* What style of football will he play?, some say he organised the Liverpool defence and they were quite strong at the back. But apparantley he loves the ball to be passed on the ground not hoofed up to the target man.
*What formation will he play?, will it be a rigid 4-4-2 or will he go to 4-5-1 ?
* What type of players will he go for ? Dan Ashworth will help Clarke out with this.
* And who will he bring in to help him out, Kiely and Downing will stay but we could do with a assistant coach.
Well none of the teams he has been involved with have been hoofball merchants,and Chelsea and Liverpool build from the back and keep it simple.
I think he will go 4 5 1.
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Mixed feelings. We are a top half (just!) Premier League side. To go for someone who has never done the job before is dissappointing to say the least!
I'm not writing Clark off and I would love him to prove me wrong- but appointing someone with no experience seems a bit small time for me. But JP has proved the doubters wrong in the past so I wouldn't put it past him unearthing a gem!
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Welcome on board Steve, you've got my support.
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Thank God that dreadful Next Manager thread is finally closed. :P ;D
Welcome Steve and all the best of luck! ;)
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how much "coaching" should professional footballers at the top level actually need. I feel like a manager is more crucial at the top than a coach, someone who will motivate the players rather than coach them,
You cant question the guys background in coaching, but i do have reservations as to whether Clarke will be able to manage and motivate our players
I think it's evident that our standard of player responds to being properly coached. Look at how much more organised our players looked under Roy compared to RDM or Mowbray. Remember how nervous we all used to be whenever we conceded a corner?
If we wanted a motivator perhaps we should have appointed Keegan or Warnock?
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Loving the spin from the club.
SC was never on their radar until Kenny was sacked, and that was weeks after RH was appointed England boss.
WBA would never have paid Liverpool compensation for him had Kenny remained.
I welcome him. I support him. But i'm deflated by the appointment and the whole process. Huge questions over his ability to motivate and 'manage' a match tactically.
His coaching qualifications speak for themselves.
Good luck Steve. You'll need it.
Wasn't he interviewed weeks ago?
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Peace goes for the cheap option again.....
Absolutely disgraceful, especially when you read that probably our preferred choice, is now the manager of Norwich City, at least Delia has some b*lls, and some cash, not like our accountant.
Probably? On what basis have you come to this assumption?
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Can anyone shed any light on the reasoning behind the 2 year deal?
Its bad enough employing someone with no management experience what so ever.
But to not give him a one year contract seems ludicrus to me.
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Shocking JP time to go.
Unbelievable. The man who has helped us become a semi-established Premier League club. The man who has steered us to our back to back highest standings in 30 years. The man who has us as the top club in the Midlands. The man who has kept this club solvent when so many are circling the plug. The man who has retained the services of probably the best Director of Football and who keeps pulling the rabbit out of the hat with bargain basement signings rather than £10m flops. The man who recognised that fans are struggling and cut season ticket prices. The man who spoke with all of the top and available coaches and showed great ambition to TRY to get AVB, Ranieri etc
He signs a top coach and before the first day of pre-season it is his "time to go". We have NO idea if Clarke will succeed or not. There was a time when Moyes, Mourhino etc were unknown and unproven. Maybe Clarke will fail, maybe he won't. Maybe we should have said "JP time to go" when he made all of the other disappointing signings such as GMac....
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Unbelievable. The man who has helped us become a semi-established Premier League club. The man who has steered us to our back to back highest standings in 30 years. The man who has us as the top club in the Midlands. The man who has kept this club solvent when so many are circling the plug. The man who has retained the services of probably the best Director of Football and who keeps pulling the rabbit out of the hat with bargain basement signings rather than £10m flops. The man who recognised that fans are struggling and cut season ticket prices. The man who spoke with all of the top and available coaches and showed great ambition to TRY to get AVB, Ranieri etc
He signs a top coach and before the first day of pre-season it is his "time to go". We have NO idea if Clarke will succeed or not. There was a time when Moyes, Mourhino etc were unknown and unproven. Maybe Clarke will fail, maybe he won't. Maybe we should have said "JP time to go" when he made all of the other disappointing signings such as GMac....
Brilliant post mate. Sadly there will always be fans who are unrealistic and will moan about every decision like if it was them making the decisions they wouldnt be so stupid. But if you want to talk hard FACTS then your post hits the nail on the head
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Award winningly pathetic comment there, well done.
We've had back to back 11th and 10th place finishes, done with a background of virtually no debt and we've the best collection of players for about thirty years.
Yet JP and co don't deliver the big fancy name you want so it's JP out?!
He tried for The Tinkerman and Ralf and apparently even interviewed AVB. But they didn't want to come. What more could he do? So he's nabbed a very well respected coach with 10+ years in the Prem at many top clubs. It's a coaching role, not a managing one, which alot of people outside of Albion don't seem to get.
There are many "bigger" clubs who would kill to be us right now. We outrank them because of how we're run, which is almost entirely down to JP and AD.
Shame on you for JP to go. At best it's clueless and Naive and at worst it spoilt and ridiculous.
The only reason we are where we are now is down to roy and lets face it we were lucky to get him.The whole set up that JP and DA have created was always going to lead us to getting a second rate head coach no-one with any real quality was going to touch us if your happy with that then fair play to you.But in my eyes it's time Peace sold up and shipped out he has taken us as far as he can we need investment not prudence and this appointment smacks of the latter.
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Can anyone shed any light on the reasoning behind the 2 year deal?
Its bad enough employing someone with no management experience what so ever.
But to not give him a one year contract seems ludicrus to me.
A) He's not a manager, he's a coach. He won't be "managing" anything other than the players and their training.
B) To only give the man a 1 year contract would publically show we have no faith.
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A lazy comment, sorry, it is not lazy, but it is accurate. The whole of the club is run on the cheap, sometimes being careful with the cash is acceptable, but the continued scrooge like attitude of the Chairman, will lead to disaster.
It could be that manager's like Hughton, were not interested in joining us, I feel that there should be a little more honesty, AVB, etc were never going to join us, all far to expensive,
I am aware that we do not have a good reputation in footballing circles, which will only change when Peace sells up.
I have come to the conclusion that it does not matter who peace appointed you would have still attacked him. I think peace is the best thing that has ever happened to the albion and my reason is its because it makes your blood boil so much. I have yet to see you post anything positive i really hope you live in LA asthat is the best place for you. Your negative posts show you care very little for the club or maybe you are jealous as you never had the chance to run our great club.Oh and by the way how much notice do you take of football if you did you might be able to spell hughtons name correctly
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The only reason we are where we are now is down to roy and lets face it we were lucky to get him.The whole set up that JP and DA have created was always going to lead us to getting a second rate head coach no-one with any real quality was going to touch us if your happy with that then fair play to you.But in my eyes it's time Peace sold up and shipped out he has taken us as far as he can we need investment not prudence and this appointment smacks of the latter.
..and who exactly appointed Roy then? Wouldn't be JP and DA?
Face facts, JP has put us up for sale, nobody wants to buy us! We have to live within our means. We are not in London or Manchester. We are a few miles down the road from a club with a wealthy owner and a large fanbase. We are not in the most attractive region of the UK for prospective buyers.
Given that, a top half finish while being totally solvent is like winning the champions league!
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Underwhelmed. He might do a good job, he might do a bad job. Massive gamble at the most crucial of points in our history. Will he persuade Olsson, Mulumbu and Pete to stay? If they go will he be able to manage a side without them to safety?
The cheap option yet again.
Compared to
Rangnick-Free
Ranieri-Free
Wilkins-Free
Hughton- £2 million from a team that didn't want to sell to us in anyway
I don't see any difference there to the others bar hughton
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Good Luck Steve!! Prove the doubters wrong!
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..and who exactly appointed Roy then? Wouldn't be JP and DA?
Face facts, JP has put us up for sale, nobody wants to buy us! We have to live within our means. We are not in London or Manchester. We are a few miles down the road from a club with a wealthy owner and a large fanbase. We are not in the most attractive region of the UK for prospective buyers.
Given that, a top half finish while being totally solvent is like winning the champions league!
We were lucky to get Roy if he wasn't licking his wounds and eager to prove the people of Liverpool and the press wrong we would have ended up with Hughton and who knows probably just missed out on promotion back to the Prem.If QPR the sixth biggest club in London can attract investment i'm sure there's hope for us.
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The more I think about it the more it makes sense, I am really looking forward to him taking over now and wish him all the best.
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the key word for QPR is 6th best London club. to foreign investment there is London and the north. Then there's a void of countryside or something like that
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Why cant people get real and accept us for what we are. An average size and supported club that has to live within its means to survive. Im not going to single out JP. The board and employees of WBA including the players have with our outstandingly loyal support moved us to the best position we have been in for many years. Now the gains we will make will be incrementally smaller unless a super rich owner can be found to facilitate a giant leap. I suggest we focus on the positives ie The Academy, Ground Expansion, Squad Development, Training Facilities and Improving the Matchday Experience.
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If QPR the sixth biggest club in London can attract investment i'm sure there's hope for us.
Errrrm, but they are in London (see my original post)...
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Why cant people get real and accept us for what we are. An average size and supported club that has to live within its means to survive. Im not going to single out JP. The board and employees of WBA including the players have with our outstandingly loyal support moved us to the best position we have been in for many years. Now the gains we will make will be incrementally smaller unless a super rich owner can be found to facilitate a giant leap. I suggest we focus on the positives ie The Academy, Ground Expansion, Squad Development, Training Facilities and Improving the Matchday Experience.
Spot on mate! :)
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I can't help an ironic smile whenever I read people saying "JP is useless", "Steve Clarke is out of his depth" or "XYZ player is 5hit". These people are amongst the very best at what they do in the country and in some cases the world. How many people who post on here can honestly say that they are the best at their job? How many can honestly say that they are respected up and down the country as a role-model in their profession. How many can even say that they even do their best?
Perhaps something to think about before we start throwing the rotten veg at JP and Steve Clarke...
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The only reason we are where we are now is down to roy and lets face it we were lucky to get him.The whole set up that JP and DA have created was always going to lead us to getting a second rate head coach no-one with any real quality was going to touch us if your happy with that then fair play to you.But in my eyes it's time Peace sold up and shipped out he has taken us as far as he can we need investment not prudence and this appointment smacks of the latter.
Mate you need to get real. The Club was put up for sale no one wanted it so where would we get investment. If Perace sold up this club could go to the wall. Is that what you want?
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If you look back at the threads these moaners are the same people who comlained about Roy being installed as manager. He was an old hasbeen who played negative football. Stop wasting your time moaning and look forward to a third consecutive season in the premiership. I thought that I would never get a chance to take my son to see the Albion play in the premiership. Season tickets for the family are now a real treat.
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I have been looking at the comments on the BBC site,and most Liverpool and Chelsea fans think we have made a great appointment.Liverpool fans say he improved their defence.
The only pessimists appear to be Albion fans. ::)
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to be fair you cansee why. We had England's new manager, then rumours of an ex Milan and Chelsea manager and his no.2, then an ex Shalke manager was near enough there before that was scrapped and then it looks like we got an unproven manager who's never managed in a matter of days (when i expect it's been much longer than that)
This appointment had been built so high by the fans that Clarke wasn't even an option. but he's here now so we'll see in the future if he's good or not.
Liam Ridgewell seems happy though!
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I wasnt impressed at 10.30 this morning but the more I think about it the more I realise what a good
appointment it could turn out to be.Iam glad we havnt gone for the boring obvious choice such as Lambert
and Hughton.This Steve Clake geezer looks like he`s on a mission which can only be good.
I dont think players really need an out and out manager shouting the odds at them and telling them what
to do.You only have to look at Chelsea and Di Matteo and we all know Terry and Lampard managed that team.
I`d say Brunt and Morrison will manage this Albion squad.
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and who knows, maybe Brunt will be played on the left for once in the PL :D
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and who knows, maybe Brunt will be played on the left for once in the PL :D
Well football is a simple game. ;)
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The more I think about it the more it makes sense, I am really looking forward to him taking over now and wish him all the best.
Another positive would be how he fits in with this EPP statues we're after. Think he'll do well in bringing youth players through the ranks, which in turn helps with our self sustainability.
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Great appointment, plays football which is what we are all about! Dont understand why people are complaining and we havent even kicked a ball yet, moan at Christmas.....if there is any cause to!
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Welcome Steve,i will admit i was a little underwhelmed when i first heard he was to be our new head coach mainly due to him never having been a number 1 anywhere.Since this morning ive warmed to the idea after looking into his top draw coaching career over the years,he certainly isn't a newbie to the top flight and I'm pleased we didn't go for a Bruce been everywhere type.
The catch for me will be signings,Clarke has spent his coaching career with the likes of Shearer,Gerrard,Drogba.....while i don't expect to sign those sort of players I'm convinced Clarke needs 3 or 4 better players than what we have to bridge the gap between what we have and what he has worked with.I hope he is given full support on any players he wants.
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I also think he's been signed with a view to knowing some of the 'hidden gems' in the academies of Liverpool, Chelsea etc and maybe bringin them to us, even if only on loan deals
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Peace goes for the cheap option again.....
Absolutely disgraceful, especially when you read that probably our preferred choice, is now the manager of Norwich City, at least Delia has some b*lls, and some cash, not like our accountant.
Actually it was technically Villa's cash. So much easier to spend someone elses money. Ok so it felt like a bit of an anticlimax at the time but like most people I think it may be yet another masterstroke by JP and DA. It's a calculated gamble just like all of our managerial appointments in the past. Unfortunately that's the ballpark we have to play in without a megarich backer. Personally I can't wait for next season now a line has finally been drawn under this.
Best of luck Steve Clarke.
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Guys, new to the debate.
I live down here in Wimbledon surrounded by Chelsea fans and they hold Steve Clarke in the highest regard. He is Chelsea through and through and probably wants to be their manager one day. No doubt we are a stepping stone for his ambitions but I think that could work for us very very well.
He has good contacts in the game and may well be able to pull off some transfer coups. I am glad we have a domestic manager; I was not keen on having the first prem German coach and definitely not the Tinkerman Italian.
If he can get the squad buzzing with his ideas then we might kick on to the next level. Remember those heady days in the late 70's of great european football nights? With a bit of luck that may well return over the next 2-3 years. Hold on to your seats guys this guy has got major ambitions!!
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I was shocked, underwhelmed and disappointed when it forst broke that SC was the new manager.
However, though I will still debate the disappointing process of appointing an Albion manager, I welcome the Steve and hope he rams my doubts right back down my throat !
I have a season ticket to back my team whoever owns or runs it and I will now back the new manager - he's now one of us and could be the man to consolidate Roy's work. In a way, it's a relief that the process is over and we can concentrate upon the new regime.
I just hope he's backed sufficiently by Peace to allow him to make his own mark on the club.
Welcome Steve Clarke.
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I have deliberately avoided this thread all day as I was not very impressed but the more I think about it the more it makes sense with the set up that we have. He is a great coach. He is not responsible for buying the players and never has been at any of the roles he has had in the past.
His new role will push him to the front and it matters not what his title is if the results are bad he takes the 5hit. I'm not a fan of this system beacause as a fan I know that in the event of thing going wrong he will be the fall guy not the person who is scouting/buying the players. I think I'm right in saying that potential purchases are discussed with the head coach/ manager whatever you want to call him. Personally I'm not a fan of this. A lot of managers in this country don't like it either. But I'll be behind him.
Good Luck.
Boing Boing
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Very excited! Welcome, Steve Clarke, from one of many fans of WBA in America. :)
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i just have a feeling this is going to be a great move i am 100% behind him and i think we will have a successful season, remember you heard it here first. if it all backfires i will come on here and take all the stick coming at me. i just hope all you doomongers and negative people will come on here and do the same and admit you were wrong!!
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I wasnt impressed at 10.30 this morning but the more I think about it the more I realise what a good
appointment it could turn out to be.Iam glad we havnt gone for the boring obvious choice such as Lambert
and Hughton.This Steve Clake geezer looks like he`s on a mission which can only be good.
I dont think players really need an out and out manager shouting the odds at them and telling them what
to do.You only have to look at Chelsea and Di Matteo and we all know Terry and Lampard managed that team.
I`d say Brunt and Morrison will manage this Albion squad.
As much as I like brunt as a player, he always seems to be one of the quietest blokes on the pitch. Can't see him "managing" the squad.. Think he was only made captain because Jonas didn't want the role.
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I have deliberately avoided this thread all day as I was not very impressed but the more I think about it the more it makes sense with the set up that we have. He is a great coach. He is not responsible for buying the players and never has been at any of the roles he has had in the past.
His new role will push him to the front and it matters not what his title is if the results are bad he takes the 5hit. I'm not a fan of this system beacause as a fan I know that in the event of thing going wrong he will be the fall guy not the person who is scouting/buying the players. I think I'm right in saying that potential purchases are discussed with the head coach/ manager whatever you want to call him. Personally I'm not a fan of this. A lot of managers in this country don't like it either. But I'll be behind him.
Good Luck.
Boing Boing
Wrong. No player will be purchased without the approval and support of the Head Coach.
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Hi everyone this is my first post and having read the other posts it is quite clear that Steve Clarke's appointment has divided the fans, but we must remember that we are there to support the team regardless of who the manager is, look what happened at Villa last season fans had a part to play in the team's performances. In my opinion JP now has to come up with the goods in terms of providing money to take the club forward no more freebies. Last season we bought freebies did it improve our defence did we stop leaking goals NO did we flirt with relegation YES same will happen again unless we spend and the worst case senario would be we don't spend and get relegated if that happens JP and DA will have to be held accountable.
But my message to all is get behind the team.
BOING BOING
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On a positive note, think its possibly the first time wba have had a decent shout in the London Evening Standard!!
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welcome steve ,not my ideal choice, but you will certainly get a good crack of the wip at the baggies dont let us down
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Hi everyone this is my first post and having read the other posts it is quite clear that Steve Clarke's appointment has divided the fans, but we must remember that we are there to support the team regardless of who the manager is, look what happened at Villa last season fans had a part to play in the team's performances. In my opinion JP now has to come up with the goods in terms of providing money to take the club forward no more freebies. Last season we bought freebies did it improve our defence did we stop leaking goals NO did we flirt with relegation YES same will happen again unless we spend and the worst case senario would be we don't spend and get relegated if that happens JP and DA will have to be held accountable.
But my message to all is get behind the team.
BOING BOING
I say wellcome mate!
Only thing is yes Mc Aulay did as well as Jones on "Freebies" (don't forget there is wages to pay sometimes a free will cost just as much as a transfer but money goes on wages?) I cannot agree with you as our defense was much better and we kept more "clean sheets"
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Thanks glosterbaggie i still feel at times there were far too many defensive errors and it was only Hodgsons organisation rather than the quality of players we had that we kept clean sheets. As you can probably tell from my name i have been used to better defenders !
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Wrong. No player will be purchased without the approval and support of the Head Coach.
you cant honestly believe that,fortunatly we have one of the best talent spotters in the game in DA
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I never get tired of explaining how the recruitment process works. The recruitment team is responsible for scouting and identifying potential players. The coach is responsible for running the team on a day to day basis and he will identify the areas of the team that need to be improved. He will then talk to the Head Scout and Technical Director about possible targets within the budget and agree a list of potential recruits. The technical director then gets goes and does the deal.
So if the coach identifies that he needs a left back he then agrees with the Technical Director which left backs to pursue and the Technical director does the deal. It is not hard to comprehend nor does it interfere with the Coach's ability to run the team but there is a cadre of British managers who don't get it. I find this perplexing and if I didn't know better I would be suspicious of their motives. :)
From the clubs perspective separating the manger's traditional role gives us some protection from our Manager being poached and taking "his" backroom staff with him. Hughton has left Blues in as a terrible state taking virtually anyone with any football knowledge with him.
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you cant honestly believe that,fortunatly we have one of the best talent spotters in the game in DA
I do believe that. Do you really think Hodgson, RDM and Mowbray would have put up with that? If someone is picking a team and is responsible for results then they would want a say on incoming players.
This is how it works:
Head Coach goes to DA and for e.g. says 'I want a new left back' DA says 'here's a list of ten on our database, who do you fancy or have you got someone else in mind?'.
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Great Appointment can't see what all the fuss is about Could someone explain to me what they mean when they say it's a cheap option ? .He ticks all the boxes of how the club operates. Let's get behind him and the lads and not be do a Villa
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Great Appointment can't see what all the fuss is about Could someone explain to me what they mean when they say it's a cheap option ? .He ticks all the boxes of how the club operates. Let's get behind him and the lads and not be do a Villa
Basically:
a) out of work (so no compensation to pay)
b) never been a 'head coach' so lacks experience in that position
c) not a fashionable name (Ranieri, AVB and the likes)
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Hi everyone this is my first post and having read the other posts it is quite clear that Steve Clarke's appointment has divided the fans, but we must remember that we are there to support the team regardless of who the manager is, look what happened at Villa last season fans had a part to play in the team's performances. In my opinion JP now has to come up with the goods in terms of providing money to take the club forward no more freebies. Last season we bought freebies did it improve our defence did we stop leaking goals NO did we flirt with relegation YES same will happen again unless we spend and the worst case senario would be we don't spend and get relegated if that happens JP and DA will have to be held accountable.
But my message to all is get behind the team.
BOING BOING
??...........didnt flirt with relegation we were nowhere near it?
Our defence and team defence were way better last season?
What really changed wasnt the squad it was the quality of the coaching! If Steve Clarke can bring anything like the quality that Roy did we will stay up again no problem.
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I don't of course know if it is true but have seen he was on £600,000 a year at Chelsea?
So I don't think he will be on the minimum wage with us?!!
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Hi rubyruby we were flirting with relrgation until we got three wins at thwe beginning of the year to take us from 25 points to 34 points and a bit of breathing space and remember we had some poor performances under Hodgson as well and it was only his coaching skills that kept us up.
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Wilkins was on £300k when he was there so I'd be surprised if Clarke was on double that.
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I don't think he will be cheap. He commanded big wages at other clubs he coached and he has negotiated himself a two year contract here which isn't the norm. He has an impressive reputation I don't think we are paying him peanuts.
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Hi rubyruby we were flirting with relrgation until we got three wins at thwe beginning of the year to take us from 25 points to 34 points and a bit of breathing space and remember we had some poor performances under Hodgson as well and it was only his coaching skills that kept us up.
Hi oldboy welcome to the boards! personally i think It a bit of a myth that we were ever in any real trouble because if you track the season as a whole under Roy we never lost more than 2 games on the spin. In other words we were consistent. fact is below the top 6 ALL the teams are technically in a relegation scrap if you look at it that way because there arnt many points separating them. But in reality we pretty much can see mid season which teams are or are likely to struggle across the season as a whole. I felt very confident we had the players at the start to do the job and unless we have a clearout I expect us to do it again.....................over to you SC
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Hi oldboy welcome to the boards! personally i think It a bit of a myth that we were ever in any real trouble because if you track the season as a whole under Roy we never lost more than 2 games on the spin. In other words we were consistent. fact is below the top 6 ALL the teams are technically in a relegation scrap if you look at it that way because there arnt many points separating them. But in reality we pretty much can see mid season which teams are or are likely to struggle across the season as a whole. I felt very confident we had the players at the start to do the job and unless we have a clearout I expect us to do it again.....................over to you SC
What about the first 3 games of the season?
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Rubyruby i hope that you are right and all us baggies fans can be more relaxed and we can stay up comfortably again.
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One thing to consider is that we have an average quality squad compared to other teams, what we did have last year was a manager who utilised the squad to it's maximum, and we had an excellent goalkeeper too.
What Clarke needs to give him a chance is to keep Foster and improve the squad aswell, because not many managers could equal what Roy did with the players we had.
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Basically:
a) out of work (so no compensation to pay)
b) never been a 'head coach' so lacks experience in that position
c) not a fashionable name (Ranieri, AVB and the likes)
So basically what you're saying is we lack ambition .Well just look down the road at Blues if you want ambition , oh ! and Portsmouth
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Baggie steve i agree with you wholeheartedly, and charliebaggie i do believe that we lack ambition because otherwise we would have been an established premiership club by now rather than a yo-yo club.
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So basically what you're saying is we lack ambition .Well just look down the road at Blues if you want ambition , oh ! and Portsmouth
Not the same thing at all. WBA can show ambition without going bankrupt FFS ! Why do people assume that to show ambition we have to cut our own throats. Talk about over reaction !! ??? ::) ::)
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So basically what you're saying is we lack ambition .Well just look down the road at Blues if you want ambition , oh ! and Portsmouth
You asked what some people meant by a 'cheap signing' and I told you. Don't shoot the messenger! ???
If I wanted to support a very ambitious team I'd support one of the Manchester's. As long as we live within our means and show some spirit and determination then I'm happy.
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What about the first 3 games of the season?
Well OK if you wish to be pedantic and not look at the context of my post fine? it took us 3 games to get into gear but look at the opposition? I still stand by the point I made though.
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Well OK if you wish to be pedantic and not look at the context of my post fine? it took us 3 games to get into gear but look at the opposition? I still stand by the point I made though.
I wholeheartedly agree with the point you make. I feel the fact we lost 3 on the bounce at the start of the season an interesting point though; because fan's didn't really panic much under Roy. If that happens with Steve though God help us.
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For those who weren't at the Hawthorns in the mid-ninties on a cold Tuesday night against Swindon (finished 1-1, attendance of just 9,000) may I remind you all that the following seemed like a pipe dream:
- Plans to expand the stadium in place to above 30k
- Vastly improved traning ground (indoor pitch, deso outdoor pitches, hydrotherapy pool)
- Committment to spending £2.5m per annum on the academy, grade 1 elite status
- Wage bill of near £50m per year (how high do you moaners think it should be?)
- Season tickets near sold out
- Third consectuve premiership season to commence (is that our 7th prem season in total so far?)
The phrase "you've never had it so good springs to mind".
It seems to me that we have a new generation of fans who can't see the woods from the trees.
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Welcome to The Baggies!
Hope you do us PROUD!!
Boing Boing
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I wholeheartedly agree with the point you make. I feel the fact we lost 3 on the bounce at the start of the season an interesting point though; because fan's didn't really panic much under Roy. If that happens with Steve though God help us.
Roy was the ultimate safe pair of hands. You sort of always knew what to expect like a quality brand. I think SC might be ok and I sincerely hope the majority dont panic if we dont make the perfect start. Mind you from Steves point of view he will see it as crucial that he does. He's going to be feeling the pressure come the first day of the season thats for sure.
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For those who weren't at the Hawthorns in the mid-ninties on a cold Tuesday night against Swindon (finished 1-1, attendance of just 9,000) may I remind you all that the following seemed like a pipe dream:
- Plans to expand the stadium in place to above 30k
- Vastly improved traning ground (indoor pitch, deso outdoor pitches, hydrotherapy pool)
- Committment to spending £2.5m per annum on the academy, grade 1 elite status
- Wage bill of near £50m per year (how high do you moaners think it should be?)
- Season tickets near sold out
- Third consectuve premiership season to commence (is that our 7th prem season in total so far?)
The phrase "you've never had it so good springs to mind".
It seems to me that we have a new generation of fans who can't see the woods from the trees.
Well said Baggie 82. I was there. Let's all get behind Steve.
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dont know if anyones asked and i looked back through so many pages on the 'next manager ' thread to keep up and just cant be bothered on this, but, why is there not a press conference till a week monday?!
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£600k at chelsea, £1m compo and £900k a year at west ham and £750k a year at Liverpool.
Wish I was that cheap.
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Some comments on here are laughable, we are West Brom, not Man Utd, not Barcelona. We have little resources in comparison and are by no means an established Premier League club. Plus, we're not based in London which is another disadvantage, especially for overseas managers. We were never going to get a 'high profile' manager, but we've taken our time to find somebody who will fit in with the structure of the club, a structure that has took us from nowhere to mid table in one of the best leagues in the world.
So for all the people moaning, ask yourself if you want to support your team, who over the last 10 years have given us a fantastic roller coaster ride of emotions (it's never dull), or do you want to whinge all season like the Villa fans and end up having a shocker of a season?!
For all of those who keep going on about Hughton as well, he's been manager of 2 clubs who were expected to do well, he has not 'overachieved', why do people think he is so good? Mowbray has done wonders with Middlesbrough and got us up, but I wouldn't want him back!
Support the club or go and support Villa and join the 'we should be Champions League - Big club' brigade!
Well excuse us for not being thrilled with the appointment! You know there are some who if we would have appointed Mickey Mouse would find some way to spin it into a good choice. Yea we are West Brom not Man City but what is so wrong in wanting, striving, and hoping for the absolute best head coach we can get?? You know I have not read a single post thus far with someone who is not in favor of this appointment stating that they are going to go protest in front of the Hawthornes or sing Clarke out during our first home match. Like me we are deflated and a bit let down and not optimistic about SC but each one I have read said that they will be behind him, support him and the team and pray that we will be proven wrong and will be more than happy to be proven wrong. We do support the club and will be behind them 100%, were just not jumping for joy and dancing in the streets over SC. Sounds to me your arrogant judgmental attitude would be more in line with a Villa fan!! No one is stating we go down the road of Villa and Blackburn were a bit let down and feel we could have done a bit better thats all! Were not thrilled about it but like me will be behind the team, club and head coach 100% and will be hoping we have found a diamond in the rough. I am not optimistic but I'll get behind the guy and hope that he succeeds!
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And I believe he is on a £3m pound contract - not sure how true that is.
Im 100% behind him, I can say its Neva stale with Albion - if you don't like it become an everton fan and just languish with being average
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And I believe he is on a £3m pound contract - not sure how true that is.
Im 100% behind him, I can say its Neva stale with Albion - if u don't like it become an everton fan and just languish with being average
Queen Victoria is still alive.
Your statement is about as true as mine!
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I am not thrilled with the appointment but I don't want JP to go.
Apart from the Sheikh and Abramovich there is not another current owner that I would want running our club.
agreed
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For those who weren't at the Hawthorns in the mid-ninties on a cold Tuesday night against Swindon (finished 1-1, attendance of just 9,000) may I remind you all that the following seemed like a pipe dream:
- Plans to expand the stadium in place to above 30k
- Vastly improved traning ground (indoor pitch, deso outdoor pitches, hydrotherapy pool)
- Committment to spending £2.5m per annum on the academy, grade 1 elite status
- Wage bill of near £50m per year (how high do you moaners think it should be?)
- Season tickets near sold out
- Third consectuve premiership season to commence (is that our 7th prem season in total so far?)
The phrase "you've never had it so good springs to mind".
It seems to me that we have a new generation of fans who can't see the woods from the trees.
I was I was :D :D :D
Drove 3hrs to gnd and 3hrs back home. Woodman was empty 30mins before kick off.
It was April and it snowed that night.
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And I believe he is on a £3m pound contract - not sure how true that is.
Im 100% behind him, I can say its Neva stale with Albion - if you don't like it become an everton fan and just languish with being average
Sit yourself down...take a deep breath...and for Gods´sake, take them blinkers off!!!! ;)
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The more I think about the appointment the more I realise we got the right man,
We have the man starting out in his first managerial post, determined to succeed, will fight to the tooth and give it 100%.
Compare this to Ralf. Taking a step down from European management to manage a club who he would of looked as purely as a stepping stone for bigger and better things. And Ranieri who would rather pick the better lifestyle than better club.
We got the right sort of man in the end, we can be sure Clarke will give it everything and I too pledge my support.
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Went to the used car lot to buy an E type Jag....
somehow came home in a Mini...
Yeah some people love them
they do the job they were designed for
I know to really can afford to run it
but somehow I still feel ripped of by the salesman.
PS: give me a week and I'll be 100% behind SC ;)
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For those who weren't at the Hawthorns in the mid-ninties on a cold Tuesday night against Swindon (finished 1-1, attendance of just 9,000) may I remind you all that the following seemed like a pipe dream:
- Plans to expand the stadium in place to above 30k
- Vastly improved traning ground (indoor pitch, deso outdoor pitches, hydrotherapy pool)
- Committment to spending £2.5m per annum on the academy, grade 1 elite status
- Wage bill of near £50m per year (how high do you moaners think it should be?)
- Season tickets near sold out
- Third consectuve premiership season to commence (is that our 7th prem season in total so far?)
The phrase "you've never had it so good springs to mind".
It seems to me that we have a new generation of fans who can't see the woods from the trees.
I was there to and agree that this appointed is right for the club and peace have made some great decisions of late !!! I will be behind SC 100% from the word go and I wish him every success at the Albion !!!
I think the posters who are moaning and being critical need to had a reality check.
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For those who weren't at the Hawthorns in the mid-ninties on a cold Tuesday night against Swindon (finished 1-1, attendance of just 9,000) may I remind you all that the following seemed like a pipe dream:
- Plans to expand the stadium in place to above 30k
- Vastly improved traning ground (indoor pitch, deso outdoor pitches, hydrotherapy pool)
- Committment to spending £2.5m per annum on the academy, grade 1 elite status
- Wage bill of near £50m per year (how high do you moaners think it should be?)
- Season tickets near sold out
- Third consectuve premiership season to commence (is that our 7th prem season in total so far?)
The phrase "you've never had it so good springs to mind".
It seems to me that we have a new generation of fans who can't see the woods from the trees.
I couldn't agree more but the game you picked (Swindon at home) was a luxury, try 5th November 1991, 7.30 pm kick off, open terrace, circa 400 diehards, right on the North Sea, driving rain all night - Hartlepool United away - 3rd Division - Score 0-0, now that was scraping the barrel.
Good luck to Steve Clarke and best wishes from a supporter of West Bromwich Albion ;D ;D
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Well excuse us for not being thrilled with the appointment! You know there are some who if we would have appointed Mickey Mouse would find some way to spin it into a good choice. Yea we are West Brom not Man City but what is so wrong in wanting, striving, and hoping for the absolute best head coach we can get?? You know I have not read a single post thus far with someone who is not in favor of this appointment stating that they are going to go protest in front of the Hawthornes or sing Clarke out during our first home match. Like me we are deflated and a bit let down and not optimistic about SC but each one I have read said that they will be behind him, support him and the team and pray that we will be proven wrong and will be more than happy to be proven wrong. We do support the club and will be behind them 100%, were just not jumping for joy and dancing in the streets over SC. Sounds to me your arrogant judgmental attitude would be more in line with a Villa fan!! No one is stating we go down the road of Villa and Blackburn were a bit let down and feel we could have done a bit better thats all! Were not thrilled about it but like me will be behind the team, club and head coach 100% and will be hoping we have found a diamond in the rough. I am not optimistic but I'll get behind the guy and hope that he succeeds!
I think we probably did in all honesty
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I couldn't agree more but the game you picked (Swindon at home) was a luxury, try 5th November 1991, 7.30 pm kick off, open terrace, circa 400 diehards, right on the North Sea, driving rain all night - Hartlepool United away - 3rd Division - Score 0-0, now that was scraping the barrel.
Good luck to Steve Clarke and best wishes from a supporter of West Bromwich Albion ;D ;D
My old man did the 500 mile round trip from Pwllheli (where he was working at the time) to this game. He claims it as the low of his 50 years following the Albion. I was only 11, at home and in school the next day, and was thus spared!
My low is the Woking debacle. Something like that I believe grounds you. Some of you in your late teens early twenties don't know how good you've got it. I had to sit through most of Graham Harbey's 97 Albion appearances at an impressionable age!!! Amazed my old man got me to stick with them tbh, but I loved it from day one. It gets a hold on you I guess.
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I can not believe we have appointed a coach on the grounds that THE SPECIAL ONE,thinks he will be good? All the other prem teams get coaches with experiance all we get after this long wait is an experiment,surely if he was all that he`s cracked up to be liverpool would have done better last season?I expect better of the albion,i wish him all the luck but the way things are at the albion i think we need someone strong and experianced at dealing with the rubbish he will get from peace and co.
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All feels very meh. unsure what to make of it all. Reserving judgement on him though
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Went to the used car lot to buy an E type Jag....
somehow came home in a Mini...
Yeah some people love them
they do the job they were designed for
I know to really can afford to run it
but somehow I still feel ripped of by the salesman.
PS: give me a week and I'll be 100% behind SC ;)
Trust me mate, you'll have alot more fun in a mini than an e-type (sounds strange but it's true.) The best thing is a mini is easier to replace if it goes wrong.... but mostly it's very fun ;D
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Wrong. No player will be purchased without the approval and support of the Head Coach.
If you had bothered to read it all you could have worked out that I'm talking about sole responsibility which is what most managers want.
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Trust me mate, you'll have alot more fun in a mini than an e-type (sounds strange but it's true.) The best thing is a mini is easier to replace if it goes wrong.... but mostly it's very fun ;D
i was hoping for a mondeo
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First of all welcome to the new Manager. I will of course give my full support. Yes it does feel a little strange, but it felt a little strange with Megson, Mobray and RDM as well if I am honest. Have to say that in recent times Jes and Dan have done better at picking winners than I would have done. Key early task is keeping some of our key players on board. Need to keep Foster and particularly Mulumbu. Lets see how we get on!
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If you had bothered to read it all you could have worked out that I'm talking about sole responsibility which is what most managers want.
If you had bothered to read up on the role of 'Head Coach' then you would know your post about his position (i.e scouting and signing players) does not make much sense.
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I had to sit through most of Graham Harbey's 97 Albion appearances at an impressionable age!!!
Ah yes, Graham Harbey, I remember him scoring a cracking goal from what seemed like 40 yards in a game against Hudderesfield though!!!
Mind you, there was that penalty he took against Swindon which I think landed somewhere in downtown Smethwick...
Anyway, back to this thread. After being initially underwhelmed I'm feeling happier about the situation, especially with Big Dave getting on board. And if we can get Foster in sooner rather than later then things will be looking much rosier. Good luck Steve, and welcome.
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I couldn't agree more but the game you picked (Swindon at home) was a luxury, try 5th November 1991, 7.30 pm kick off, open terrace, circa 400 diehards, right on the North Sea, driving rain all night - Hartlepool United away - 3rd Division - Score 0-0, now that was scraping the barrel.
Good luck to Steve Clarke and best wishes from a supporter of West Bromwich Albion ;D ;D
I was there that night. 3of us off the wrenna went in a mates escort van. Foggy awful night without a shot at goal.
I am behind him 100% and will be until the day he leaves or is asked to leave by JP, however, wba COULD HAVE DONE SO MUCH BETTER OVER THE YEARS. FROM THE POSITION WE WERE IN IN THE LATE 70'S TO BEING RELEGATED JUST OVER 3 OR 4 YEARS LATER WINNING ONLY 3 GAMES ALL SEASON ( 2 AGAINST THE bLUES ) is absolutely criminal.
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I for one was disappointed with Steve Clarke appointment but the more I have heard about him and his coaching ability the more I am looking forward to the new season. The JP haters should get behind him and not try and force him out because if JP goes this club is in the s**t.
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On paper the new appointment fits the structure very well let's see how it pans out. I have my doubts but I really hope I'm proved wrong.
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70.Albion1991
8th June 2012 - 21:10
Lee Clark is a great young manager, I don't know what some fans are complaining about.He did a fantastic job at Huddersfield. Perhaps he will bring Rhodes with him.
:-[ :-[just saw this on the BBC website :-[ :-[
if anyone knows this guy can you buy him a newspaper or something and take it round before he embarrases us anymore
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70.Albion1991
8th June 2012 - 21:10
Lee Clark is a great young manager, I don't know what some fans are complaining about.He did a fantastic job at Huddersfield. Perhaps he will bring Rhodes with him.
:-[ :-[just saw this on the BBC website :-[ :-[
if anyone knows this guy can you buy him a newspaper or something and take it round before he embarrases us anymore
WHATS THE NEWSPAPER FOR, TO HIT HIM OVER THE HEAD WITH OR STUFF UP HIS AR$£ ?? No point in taking for him to read because if he can make a statement like that, he obviously cant read can he ?!
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70.Albion1991
8th June 2012 - 21:10
Lee Clark is a great young manager, I don't know what some fans are complaining about.He did a fantastic job at Huddersfield. Perhaps he will bring Rhodes with him.
:-[ :-[just saw this on the BBC website :-[ :-[
if anyone knows this guy can you buy him a newspaper or something and take it round before he embarrases us anymore
Here was me thinking the village idiot supports the dingles ;) ho hum another illusion shattered
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Here was me thinking the village idiot supports the dingles ;) ho hum another illusion shattered
Haha that poster is me :P. It was a joke obviously... Well I found it amusing.
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Haha that poster is me :P. It was a joke obviously... Well I found it amusing.
Apologies for calling you the Village Idiot. Sometimes the written word fails to convey its true meaning :-[
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I never get tired of explaining how the recruitment process works. The recruitment team is responsible for scouting and identifying potential players. The coach is responsible for running the team on a day to day basis and he will identify the areas of the team that need to be improved. He will then talk to the Head Scout and Technical Director about possible targets within the budget and agree a list of potential recruits. The technical director then gets goes and does the deal.
So if the coach identifies that he needs a left back he then agrees with the Technical Director which left backs to pursue and the Technical director does the deal. It is not hard to comprehend nor does it interfere with the Coach's ability to run the team but there is a cadre of British managers who don't get it. I find this perplexing and if I didn't know better I would be suspicious of their motives. :)
From the clubs perspective separating the manger's traditional role gives us some protection from our Manager being poached and taking "his" backroom staff with him. Hughton has left Blues in as a terrible state taking virtually anyone with any football knowledge with him.
Congratulations, one of the best posts I have ever read on westbrom.com. Precise, insightful - if only the fans would read and understand the organisation we would remove the confusion between the roles of manager, ,head coach, Director of football - I wish :DC
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Will be interesting to see who does pre season training at Blooze as the only person left is the woman who washes the kit, pmsl !
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Apologies for calling you the Village Idiot. Sometimes the written word fails to convey its true meaning :-[
Why don't you have a link for your blog on here Standaman? I think it's a good read.
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I've been away all week, and feel really off the pace with what's been going on. I only knew about Steve Clarke when I read it in the morning paper, and I have to confess that initially, my heart sank given the names that had been bandied about.
I haven't read this thread in full, but the more I think about it, the more I think this appoitment could work out OK from the point of view of setting up a side tactically.
My concern is whether he's the man with the experience to wheeler deal in the transfer market at a time when we need to nail down so many contract issues, the most important of which is Ben Foster.
There's one hell of a lot of business to sort out before next season, and we need to trust that Dan Ashworth is up to it - I believe he is.
So welcome, Steve Clarke. You're a Baggie now. Understand what it means in terms of heritage and history. And do us proud!
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Very interesting appointment, a man with plenty of experience as a number 2 and has worked with some of the biggest clubs and managers. Of course there is a concern that he has no actual managerial experience but i am very dissapointed by some of the supporters reactions about not giving him a chance. (I will add that i have not saw anything on here with me not reading the whole thread)
I personally feel it is definately not the worst choice we could have made and is one that still leaves me excited and intrigued about the upcoming season compared to other potential candidates where of course i would have given them an oppurtunity but may have been more concerned. Maybe we could have had someone with more managerial experience and i will admit that he was not in my thought process for the vacancy and even when i saw the news that he had left Liverpool i didn't expect any approach from the football club.
He does arrive with a great reputation and CV also possessing glowing references from some of the greatest names in the game so that is the positive and most appealing factor.
I will not deny that i had my fears before Hodgson's departure about the 2012/2013 season as i believe it will be tougher than our previous campaigns with better teams and a potential loss of star players.
Anyway, all the best to Steve Clarke. Hopefully he is given enough time and support by the fans and the board to have a sucessful time here.
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http://sport.stv.tv/football/clubs/hibernian/205551-video-steve-clarkes-full-interview-with-friday-night-football/
A decent 30 minute video interview of Clarke from a couple years ago, worth a watch for people who haven't seen it.
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May I be the first to welcome Masseurs Stephen Clark and Darren More to the Hawthornes. Who kneads that joker Hughton, anyway. ;)
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May I be the first to welcome Masseurs Stephen Clark and Darren More to the Hawthornes. Who kneads that joker Hughton, anyway. ;)
Hughton Cosstta Hughton.................... ;D
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Now the dust has settled, I have a few thoughts on the appointment.
Firstly, we made a lot of researching managers from the moment we appointed Hodgson (and before him Di Matteo). Sure enough, as soon as Hodgson was confirmed as England manager Rangnick was invited over and Ranieri was interviewed for the job. Despite this though, we still had trouble getting a manager and ended up having a prolonged, untidy looking search for a manager. To interview so many managers and coaches over a 5 week period gives the impression of starting from scratch and does not leave the impression of a detailed search having gone on during Hodgsons reign. Interviewing the likes of Ray Wilkins for a start is a head scratcher - what was the point of the research pre Hodgson leaving if you are still interviewing Ray Wilkins after?
The Ralf Rangnick affair also looks a bit of a mess. As soon as we firmed up our interest, German observers were telling us he would not come as he would rather go to a side challenging for honours. Why then, did we allow a 2 or 3 week chase to drag on so long before he said no thanks? Just like Hargreaves before, I think we allowed somebody to lead us on for too long. The club might need to consider this in the future.
The Chris Hughton situation also looks very scruffy and unorganised. We knew the situation with him, having interviewed him already. They must have known he wanted to bring his entourage with him? Why then, did we have him at the top of our list for so long and after making unofficial approaches, eventually made one last approach as reported by Colin Tattum, the Blues journalist? This goes back to the due diligence concept that the club have highlighted so often. Whats the point in researching if you still take so long to work out something they should have already known? If we did not want lots of coaches coming, that should have halted the Hughton chase from the start.
So, we now have Steve Clarke as manager. He was interviewed 2 weeks ago, and Hodgson was approached by England 5 weeks ago. If he wasn't interviewed for the first 2 or 3 weeks, he was not one of our first choices. Even after he was interviewed, we still tried to get Rangnick and Hughton so I dont know why the club bothered pretending Clarke was the first choice. It is better to just say nothing at all rather than pretending when the secret is already out.
Now ive got my rant out of the way, Steve Clarke is a forward thinking choice. It isnt free of risk and I dont buy the lines that "head coach means you only coach" because even a head coach needs to do more than just training ground drills, they need to research their opponents, come up with tactics and identify weaknesses in your own side and the opposition, however he has been around a long time and somebody needed to give him a chance. He has worked with many top managers and that is a positive. If he hasnt picked up things from managers like Mourinho, Gullit, Robson and Dalglish then I wonder what he has been doing. Unlike Appleton, who for me has too little experience to come here, Clarke will have been exposed to many different managers methods and beliefs. Hopefully, he has picked the best bits from everyone and has a good grounding on tactics and what to look for in other teams that can be exploited.
Id rather have Clarke than Bruce or Curbishley, as im not keen on recycling old managers. I am glad we have offered a new manager a chance to do have a go at a premier league club. Lets face it, at WBA we like to do things differently and in bringing in Clarke we have done that. Hopefully, we have found a managerial talent just waiting for his chance.
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The last time we appointed an incredibly successful perennial number 2 was Don Howe in the early 70's. He had been the coach to a superb Arsenal title winning team under the guidance of Bertie Mee.
Howe was thought of as the premier coach in the English game at the time. We were universally acclaimed as having made a fantastic appointment. The Albion team of the time had recently won two cups and appeared as runners up in two other Wembley occasions. The team had just begun shown signs of decline after several seasons of upper mid table finishes and European campaigns. He replaced FA cup winning manager Alan Ashman.
Howe got the club relegated after his first season in control and crowds dropped to lows of 12000.
The appointment of Steve Clarke will in all likelihood end the same way. This is our Alex Mcleish moment!.
There is a reason why he has been a coach at several premiership clubs and never, ever offered the job at the helm (until now) and that is because the men who knew him and assessed him on a daily basis did not see those leadership qualities apparent.
We only saw those "apparent" qualities after a lengthy courtship of a hyped "teutonic master" went t#ts up and our plan B went to Norwich at lightning speed.
I am very saddened at his appointment as I fear the best we hope for is 17th and to swiftly sack our big mistake.
The clubs offer of only a 2 year contact expresses their unspoken doubt.
I do not normally look on the dark side of things but I find it impossible to enthuse.
Our players will have a similar gut response as many of us and I fully expect to see Mulumbu, Olson and Odemwingie to leave and I will be very surprised if we sign Foster.
The difference between success and failure in the premier league is 10 points. The players we lose and the coach in place will cost us this.
I sincerely hope I am made to eat my words but cannot, at this moment, see that happening.
Sorry for this negativity everyone!
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Very very disappointed. I cant believe we've had to wait all this time for this appointment.
I'm not going to hide my feelings just because some may hurl abuse my way- i'm not happy about it and i can't guarentee he will have my full support. Although i will give him some time and i will still support the lads on the pitch 100%.
I'm feeling a little deflated. I sincerly hope he proves me wrong.
Was thinking the same, gutted to be honest!
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Equally albionicus, Chris Hughton has proved to be an able manager after many years as an assistant and coach. The same goes for Mourinho who spent years as an assistant before becoming a manager. Mourinho himself said Clarke could have stepped up a long time ago and the reports we read suggest he listened to him at Chelsea. Gullit, Mourinho, Zola and Dalglish have all chosen him as their assistant so he must show something that makes him so valuable.
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its all right people saying he does not have any experience as a first team coach/manager but if nobody gave him a chance how can he get experience. hopefully people will get behind him and give him a chance.
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Now the dust has settled, I have a few thoughts on the appointment.
Firstly, we made a lot of researching managers from the moment we appointed Hodgson (and before him Di Matteo). Sure enough, as soon as Hodgson was confirmed as England manager Rangnick was invited over and Ranieri was interviewed for the job. Despite this though, we still had trouble getting a manager and ended up having a prolonged, untidy looking search for a manager. To interview so many managers and coaches over a 5 week period gives the impression of starting from scratch and does not leave the impression of a detailed search having gone on during Hodgsons reign. Interviewing the likes of Ray Wilkins for a start is a head scratcher - what was the point of the research pre Hodgson leaving if you are still interviewing Ray Wilkins after?
The Ralf Rangnick affair also looks a bit of a mess. As soon as we firmed up our interest, German observers were telling us he would not come as he would rather go to a side challenging for honours. Why then, did we allow a 2 or 3 week chase to drag on so long before he said no thanks? Just like Hargreaves before, I think we allowed somebody to lead us on for too long. The club might need to consider this in the future.
The Chris Hughton situation also looks very scruffy and unorganised. We knew the situation with him, having interviewed him already. They must have known he wanted to bring his entourage with him? Why then, did we have him at the top of our list for so long and after making unofficial approaches, eventually made one last approach as reported by Colin Tattum, the Blues journalist? This goes back to the due diligence concept that the club have highlighted so often. Whats the point in researching if you still take so long to work out something they should have already known? If we did not want lots of coaches coming, that should have halted the Hughton chase from the start.
So, we now have Steve Clarke as manager. He was interviewed 2 weeks ago, and Hodgson was approached by England 5 weeks ago. If he wasn't interviewed for the first 2 or 3 weeks, he was not one of our first choices. Even after he was interviewed, we still tried to get Rangnick and Hughton so I dont know why the club bothered pretending Clarke was the first choice. It is better to just say nothing at all rather than pretending when the secret is already out.
Now ive got my rant out of the way, Steve Clarke is a forward thinking choice. It isnt free of risk and I dont buy the lines that "head coach means you only coach" because even a head coach needs to do more than just training ground drills, they need to research their opponents, come up with tactics and identify weaknesses in your own side and the opposition, however he has been around a long time and somebody needed to give him a chance. He has worked with many top managers and that is a positive. If he hasnt picked up things from managers like Mourinho, Gullit, Robson and Dalglish then I wonder what he has been doing. Unlike Appleton, who for me has too little experience to come here, Clarke will have been exposed to many different managers methods and beliefs. Hopefully, he has picked the best bits from everyone and has a good grounding on tactics and what to look for in other teams that can be exploited.
Id rather have Clarke than Bruce or Curbishley, as im not keen on recycling old managers. I am glad we have offered a new manager a chance to do have a go at a premier league club. Lets face it, at WBA we like to do things differently and in bringing in Clarke we have done that. Hopefully, we have found a managerial talent just waiting for his chance.
I actually dont worry too much about Steves ability to organise, coach, dictate tactics and the such like Dexy. The thing that will convince me with him will be his ability to deal with the media, man manage, deliver the team talks and inspire individual players particularly when things go wrong. No doubt for me that these are the hardest things for a manager
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Im not sure ruby, I think that is a very English view on management. Im starting to look a bit wider than that as the success of English managers in the modern age is, well, non existent. There are currently 6 English managers in the premier league and 3 of them came up with promoted clubs this summer (while another was appointed this week). There are 8 managers from Scotland, Wales and N and S Ireland - despite this being the English league and England having 3 or 4 times the population of those 4 countries combined.
English people put a lot of stock in team talks and man management - while foreigners put more stock in tactics and preparation. I wonder if they know something we dont? As for dealing with the media, I dont think that is a big thing for West Brom. We have barely got a mention since appointing Clarke - the media barely know where the Hawthorns is or what colour kits we play in. From what we kno Clarke is well liked by players who work with him so man management should be fine.
I am more concerned about how well he analyses a football match than how inspirational and Churchillian he is (as an aside, "Churchill spirit" plays a lot in the English thinking for me and explains why we believe so much in powerful half time speeches).
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...so I don't know why the club bothered pretending Clarke was the first choice. It is better to just say nothing at all rather than pretending
Lots of good points, of course, but I don't believe we ever stated he was our 'first choice'.
Read the (weasel) words of our statement carefully and you will see what I mean.
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There is something charmingly English in the belief that a rousing team talk will somehow make the difference between success or failure. If that were the case I have a simple solution hire Brian Blessed as team talk coach and watch us qualify for the champions league. Or perhaps not.
I take issue with those who think it is a terrible appointment and in particular those who think Chris Hughton is way better than Steve Clarke but time will tell. There is no longer any point in the debate the deed is done.
With regard to the selection process, I think from the outset Rangnick was on our radar. Raneiri emerged as a possible candidate shortly after Roy resigned (my understanding his agent approached us rather than the other way round). I think these two were the early front runners and the rest of the process was in essence plan B.
Unfortunately by the time Rangnick's name got out into the media the club were having serious doubts about him signing. Hence the rather half hearted enquiry with regard to Hughton who I do not believe was ever top of our list other than in the eyes of the media.
The rather drawn out process was unfortunate but beyond testing our fan's patience (the test results are in and we don't have any :)) no lasting harm has been done and there would be absolutely no complaints had it resulted in Rangnick being hired.
My final word on this subject is that the appointment makes absolutely no difference to those players who might be considering their futures with the club. Their decision is an economic one pure and simple all talk of trophies ambition or wanting to work with their new coach is public relations bilge and fans are daft if they believe it either way. I say this in the almost certain knowledge that at least one of our core squad members will leave this summer however if they all stay I will not claim it as vindication for Clarke's appointment.
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There is something charmingly English in the belief that a rousing team talk will somehow make the difference between success or failure.
Few could argue that poor, lacklustre first half performances have been transformed into much better second-half performances at many a club down the years. What would you attribute that to?
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Knowing the right thing to say to players on an individual and team basis is very important.
Sometimes the hair dryer blast or 'Churchillian speach' may be needed but... very often it can be a quiet word in the individual or team ear that is more effective.
The skill of knowing whats needed when, is an important part of effective management and so is the tactical appreciation of the game of course.
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Few could argue that poor, lacklustre first half performances have been transformed into much better second-half performances at many a club down the years. What would you attribute that to?
Yeah id agree ,Half time talks are important. If man utd or real madrid have had a poor first half are you telling me the managers dont make a difference. Players have to be lifted and given a kick up the backside. This is what worries me about clarke he has never had the full responsability to do this. Can he do It is the question?
Also we should remember when we were 3-0 up at half time against west ham and scott parker was credited for the comeback solely on the half time speech he gave
Do people on here really think half time team talks mean nothing or dont happen?
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If rollickings worked then Barry Fry would be a top manager.
If i were a player i would take notice of a coach who was more knowledgeable than me,not one that called me names.
Being told you aren't doing the job to expectation is quite different and acceptable.
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its all right people saying he does not have any experience as a first team coach/manager but if nobody gave him a chance how can he get experience. hopefully people will get behind him and give him a chance.
Whilst I agree with what you say, I sometimes think that maybe starting off at a lower level i.e. Championship is probably best. I don't recall any assistant stepping into the main job at Prem level for the first time being successful. Well Steve McClaren perhaps?
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Few could argue that poor, lacklustre first half performances have been transformed into much better second-half performances at many a club down the years. What would you attribute that to?
The manager identifying what was going wrong and telling the players how to remedy the situation and tactical / personel changes, rather than rants and "once more unto the breach".
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Few could argue that poor, lacklustre first half performances have been transformed into much better second-half performances at many a club down the years. What would you attribute that to?
I can think of plenty where teams have had good first halves and terrible second halves and others which have been good start finish and poor start to finish. Often the half time turn around is purely a function of the team under the cosh having an opportunity to re-group and the team that is on top running out of steam or just getting complacent.
Coaching interventions do make a difference but are limited during the course of a game. The key is being able to identify opportunities and threats and make the necessary tactical adjustments. However the bulk of the impact that a coach can have on any team happens in the run up to the game and no amount of bluster during the game will rescue a flawed game plan or poor preparation. Coaches shouting at players probably makes very little difference to the outcome (some would argue it is counter productive).
Fans and the media like the Churchillian stuff but in truth it counts for very little compared with an subtle and sometimes hardly noticed tactical change. In truth Sir Alex could probably unplug the hairdryer but what the heck it makes good copy and contributes to the myth of the manager.
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Im not sure ruby, I think that is a very English view on management. Im starting to look a bit wider than that as the success of English managers in the modern age is, well, non existent. There are currently 6 English managers in the premier league and 3 of them came up with promoted clubs this summer (while another was appointed this week). There are 8 managers from Scotland, Wales and N and S Ireland - despite this being the English league and England having 3 or 4 times the population of those 4 countries combined.
English people put a lot of stock in team talks and man management - while foreigners put more stock in tactics and preparation. I wonder if they know something we dont? As for dealing with the media, I dont think that is a big thing for West Brom. We have barely got a mention since appointing Clarke - the media barely know where the Hawthorns is or what colour kits we play in. From what we kno Clarke is well liked by players who work with him so man management should be fine.
I am more concerned about how well he analyses a football match than how inspirational and Churchillian he is (as an aside, "Churchill spirit" plays a lot in the English thinking for me and explains why we believe so much in powerful half time speeches).
Interesting one Dexy. Personally I dont think there is much difference between a top foreign coach and a top english coach in terms of tactics and preparation. For example how much difference would there be between Mourinho and Hodgson? not much in my view. What sets them apart from run of the mill coaches is their ability to man manage across the entire spectrum or business. Mourinho is known to excel in this area and you could sense that Roy had the inate ability to extract the best out of the both player and team. So I dont think my view is either English or Churchillian. I think it is universal that the principal key to success in sport, business or life for that matter if judged by results is the ability to inspire others by ones own actions or words.
So I go back to my original point that SC has all the tools to do the "job" but can he inspire and motivate those around him to produce when it matters. For me that is the what sets apart a true leader from someone who assists or follows.
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If rollickings worked then Barry Fry would be a top manager.
If i were a player i would take notice of a coach who was more knowledgeable than me,not one that called me names.
Being told you aren't doing the job to expectation is quite different and acceptable.
Neil Warnock is famed for his HT rants. You tube his uncut effort at Shrewsbury in 1995 its bloody brilliant ;D
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Another odd one was Phil Brown's half time effort V Man City making them sit on the pitch for the half time "Talk" I cannot remember the result 2-2? :D
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Neil Warnock is famed for his HT rants. You tube his uncut effort at Shrewsbury in 1995 its bloody brilliant ;D
Not sure what good it did them Huddersfield were top going into the last 5 games that season failed to win any of them and finished 5th okay they did get promotion via the play-offs. If people think that an x-rated pantomime act is leadership then I despair. Any idiot could do what Warnock did in that video and the proof was in the video because there was an idiot doing it. The players hardly looked inspired shell shocked perhaps inspired no.
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last season i was moaning we signed only free transfer championship players.so we can only say in jp we trust as for all the years we have slagged the chairman off look where we are .all we can do is get behind clarke and see where it takes us.thank god we now have a headcoach/manager to sought out who he wants to keep and new signings ,as it looks a rebuilding job with spine of the side wanting to be elsewhere and chasing silverware :o
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Not sure what good it did them Huddersfield were top going into the last 5 games that season failed to win any of them and finished 5th okay they did get promotion via the play-offs. If people think that an x-rated pantomime act is leadership then I despair. Any idiot could do what Warnock did in that video and the proof was in the video because there was an idiot doing it. The players hardly looked inspired shell shocked perhaps inspired no.
That wasnt my point?.............I just said as rants go it was brilliant!
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That wasnt my point?.............I just said as rants go it was brilliant!
As a rant cannot fault it :)
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What will Steven cCarke make of this?
http://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/blogs/world-of-sport/bride-punched-ex-newcastle-star-wedding-132152814.html
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Lots of good points, of course, but I don't believe we ever stated he was our 'first choice'.
Read the (weasel) words of our statement carefully and you will see what I mean.
We did say he was the outstanding choice though, although I take what you say on board, we havent outright said he was the first choice.
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Neil Warnock is famed for his HT rants. You tube his uncut effort at Shrewsbury in 1995 its bloody brilliant ;D
Is that the one which includes the famous line of "you, your in ******* Latvia!"
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The manager identifying what was going wrong and telling the players how to remedy the situation and tactical / personel changes, rather than rants and "once more unto the breach".
I rest my case your honour.
Man management is an attribute that would be welcome in being a head coach and im sure being a good motivator also helps but it is the IMPORTANCE we place on it in England that is the problem. As seen in this thread, people all feel Clarke will be fine with tactics, analysing our players, analysing opposition and working out what our problems are in matches, but worry that he wont be able to motivate the players and also worry about half time team talks. Apart from the fact it seems impossible to actually know which bits he will be good at and which he wont be good at, I do think this highlights one of the reasons why England are falling behind the rest of the world despite our enthusiasm for the game and our large population.
Standaman made a good point about half time being more about players regrouping. Maybe there was a good talk in the dressing room, but it is an English myth, going back to our times on the battle field and Churchill, that making a good speech and getting everyone fired up is a bigger deal than all of the background preparation and intelligence. For me, in rating a managers attributes, being able to give a good half time team talk is some way down the list for me. Id rather the manager be able to identify what needs to be changed as londonbaggiemike says. Man management may come further up the list but what is man management in the end? Being a good psychologist? Fabio Capello never got on with his players in his career yet he has won everything. It is a good thing to have but again, if place it below analytical skills and football intelligence.
This may sound rude, and apologies if it does, but i think another reason we cling to these things, the press included, is because they are easier concepts for us to understand. We can all identify with Alex Ferguson giving the hair dryer treatment or Harry Redknapp being able to motivate players as it isnt a very deep thinkers subject. Tactical nuances and analysing a performance however are much more complicated however and are harder to make an argument about as none of us know that much about it. We therefore sometimes are drawn towards what is simpler to understand.
It could be worth reading up on the philosophies of the likes of Marcello Bielsa, the Bilbao manager everyone has been waxing lyrical about for the last few months, or Benitez or Wenger. These managers (Bielsa excluded so far) have all done more than any English manager, managing today. You have to question why surely? Why in the modern age are there no English managers? Is it because they have been very slow to adapt to how football managers/coaches should work? Morurinho is somebody people often point to as being the master of mind games, man management etc and yes, he can be good at these things, but do people ignore the fact he surrounded himself with analytical masters like Villa Boas and brought through coaches like Brendon Rogers who again is a football deep thinker? Eventually, I think English coaches will evolve, but I think we as fans and in the media need to think deeper as well and look away from the obvious.
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I hear what you say Dexy but for me history right up to the present day suggests otherwise. Unless your leader has the communication skills and the ability to inspire individuals and the collective at any "Given Moment" ( a film of the same name about this concept was made starring Al Pacino I seem to remember) then all the planning, analysis, re grouping, tactical talks etc will likely come to nothing. Off course when things are going well professionals will require very little motivating but that is not what we are talking about really. Yes the top coaches surround themselves with top quality people that is a part of what they are good at. Identifying and surrounding themselves with talented people. But this still does not negate the absolute need on occasion to become prickly, brutally honest and yes on occasion heated in order to receive the required response. The vast bulk of us dont find this comes naturally but to born leaders it is probably second nature. It would be interesting to canvass a cross section of the top football coaches over the last 20 years but my guess is they would all to a man say that at times they have had to be both unpopular and even disliked in order to get the job done.
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Put simply ruby, do you feel being able to give a half time team talk is the most important attribute a manager should have and if not, where would you rank it (as in, what would you see as a less crucial skill, football intelligence etc).
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Put simply ruby, do you feel being able to give a half time team talk is the most important attribute a manager should have and if not, where would you rank it (as in, what would you see as a less crucial skill, football intelligence etc).
Absolutely the most important attribute for a leader to have by a mile! The ability to lead and inspire at "Any Given Moment". It is IMO people who possess this quality who more often than not succeed over their contemporaries.
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I guess we will have to agree to disagree. I just feel that it is the old thinking that has held English coaches back. I feel to many believe that this is the most important aspect to being a head coach/manager while foreigners pay more attention to the finer details, and therefore, hold more top jobs.
I do refer back to my old point though - why are there so few English managers and why do only a few managers go to manage in Europe? Is it because they dont want to move, or is it because there is no demand for them in Europe as their skills - being good talkers, arent valued abroad?
Having a quick look at English managers who manage in Europe, the most successful were Roy Hodgson, Steve Mclaren, and Sir Bobby, 2 deep thinking coaches and 1 training ground coach. None of them knowns for their inspirational half time team talks.
History shows, the European are more enlightened about football than we are.
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There a press conference?
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There a press conference?
Next Monday.
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What have the last 15 or so posts,,,,,,,,,,,,,,got to do with Steve Clarke being appointed the new head coach? ???
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What have the last 15 or so posts,,,,,,,,,,,,,,got to do with Steve Clarke being appointed the new head coach? ???
Everything Timdon. If you pick the thread up correctly you will find the discussion I had with Baggies revolved around SCs ability to step up from a No2 position. My view being that the biggest hurdle he would face would be the man management aspect of this. Baggie had a different point of view and the discussion did broaden slightly but still highly relevent to the appointment of our new coach.
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What have the last 15 or so posts,,,,,,,,,,,,,,got to do with Steve Clarke being appointed the new head coach? ???
As Ruby says, it is a discussion about the merits of our choice of Coach. I think it is quite important.
Further to that debate, I was listening to talksport today (I wanted to get a bit of England build up in the car), where I heard an interview with Guillem Balague. They asked him about the choice of no striker and then brining Torres on instead of the other strikers. Interestingly, he said (not word for word) "Im surprised there has been a lot of talk about this but it is a good thing as it means people in England are talking about tactics for a change".
Backs up what I was saying about people in England looking at things like Passion rather than tactics and those sort of things.
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As Ruby says, it is a discussion about the merits of our choice of Coach. I think it is quite important.
Further to that debate, I was listening to talksport today (I wanted to get a bit of England build up in the car), where I heard an interview with Guillem Balague. They asked him about the choice of no striker and then brining Torres on instead of the other strikers. Interestingly, he said (not word for word) "Im surprised there has been a lot of talk about this but it is a good thing as it means people in England are talking about tactics for a change".
Backs up what I was saying about people in England looking at things like Passion rather than tactics and those sort of things.
Spain were rubbish though, so I'm not sure it supports his point.
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I dont get what you mean koren. He said that it was unusual for the English to have a lot of talk about tactics - not that Spain got their tactics right.
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As Ruby says, it is a discussion about the merits of our choice of Coach. I think it is quite important.
Further to that debate, I was listening to talksport today (I wanted to get a bit of England build up in the car), where I heard an interview with Guillem Balague. They asked him about the choice of no striker and then brining Torres on instead of the other strikers. Interestingly, he said (not word for word) "Im surprised there has been a lot of talk about this but it is a good thing as it means people in England are talking about tactics for a change".
Backs up what I was saying about people in England looking at things like Passion rather than tactics and those sort of things.
I didnt hear that Baggies but It brought a smile to my face because as I arrived home this afternoon Hawksbee & Jacobs had Reidy on to talk about Ireland last night and what it was like to work for Roy and what he was like in the dressing room Reidy said " people have the wrong impression about Roy he can get angry and throw the tea cups around. We have a piece of wood in the dressing room which he kicked so hard I thought we might have to send him to the see the medics"
I guess we will be debating this one for a while to come yet!! :)
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I dont get what you mean koren. He said that it was unusual for the English to have a lot of talk about tactics - not that Spain got their tactics right.
Well he was defending these pioneering and innovative tactics which failed; something everybody was suggesting would happen. I agree to an extent that talk of tactics is usually of a rudimentary nature in this country; but to pretend that playing with no striker was common place and it wasn't a topic of major discussion was wrong. Fan's tactical awareness is pretty off topic really, as longs as the coaches mentality is one of a serious nature towards them. I bet plenty of Spaniards were condemning the tactics pre-game as well and these people were proved right - the tactics failed.
Maybe I just don't Like Guillem Balague.
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I didnt pay attention to his defence of the tactics. I was talking about the fact he mentioned English people not really putting as much stock in tactics and the like. As for fans tactical awareness being off topic, the point was that I am more bothered about Clarke's approach to tactics, rather than if he is good at half time team talks etc while quite a few other fans were more interested in that aspect of management.
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I didnt hear that Baggies but It brought a smile to my face because as I arrived home this afternoon Hawksbee & Jacobs had Reidy on to talk about Ireland last night and what it was like to work for Roy and what he was like in the dressing room Reidy said " people have the wrong impression about Roy he can get angry and throw the tea cups around. We have a piece of wood in the dressing room which he kicked so hard I thought we might have to send him to the see the medics"
I guess we will be debating this one for a while to come yet!! :)
They probably asked what he was like in the dressing room then. As I say, in England we focus on this more than tactics. Im not saying it isnt without merit, but I think it is a much smaller issue than we in England make it. I feel his tactical awareness, ability to read games, ability to pick weaknesses and mroe football based topics are more important.
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They probably asked what he was like in the dressing room then. As I say, in England we focus on this more than tactics. Im not saying it isnt without merit, but I think it is a much smaller issue than we in England make it. I feel his tactical awareness, ability to read games, ability to pick weaknesses and mroe football based topics are more important.
Baggies has the right idea.
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Been off work for a week so joining the debate a bit late (no internet at home!).
At first I was, like quite a few on here, underwhelmed by Steve Clarke's appointment. But then I thought that I would have been very happy if he'd come in as an assistant, judging him on his credentials and the high regard he appears to be held in for his coaching abilities, as that is the job he usually does. Those abilities are lessened by the fact that we've decided to make him head coach...it's just a job promotion and hopefully we'll see that it was a long overdue promotuion.
All appointments are a risk...I would have liked Rangnick but there was no gaurantee that he would have been successful.
Let's get behind him and see what happens, rather than damning him before we've kicked a ball in anger.
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Not that its relevant now but....
Sky Sports understands ;D former USA coach Bob Bradley was in the frame for the manager's job at West Brom and Norwich.
Bradley, who is currently head coach of the Egypt national team, is thought to have been sounded about a move to both clubs prior to the recent appointments of Steve Clarke and Chris Hughton.
The 54-year-old was on the radar for West Brom and Norwich as they both searched for new managers following the exits of Roy Hodgson and Paul Lambert earlier this summer.
However, Egypt were reluctant to lose Bradley with the country well-placed to qualify for the 2014 World Cup.
The American has also only lost one of his 14 games in charge and that was a friendly against Brazil.
Bradley, who is highly regarded in coaching circles after his success with the USA and now with Egypt, is thought to be keen to try his luck in club management in Europe at some point in the future.
Bradley guided the US to the 2010 World Cup and helped them finish top of their group above England before losing in the knockout stages to Ghana.
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Not that its relevant now but....
Sky Sports understands ;D former USA coach Bob Bradley was in the frame for the manager's job at West Brom and Norwich.
Bradley, who is currently head coach of the Egypt national team, is thought to have been sounded about a move to both clubs prior to the recent appointments of Steve Clarke and Chris Hughton.
The 54-year-old was on the radar for West Brom and Norwich as they both searched for new managers following the exits of Roy Hodgson and Paul Lambert earlier this summer.
However, Egypt were reluctant to lose Bradley with the country well-placed to qualify for the 2014 World Cup.
The American has also only lost one of his 14 games in charge and that was a friendly against Brazil.
Bradley, who is highly regarded in coaching circles after his success with the USA and now with Egypt, is thought to be keen to try his luck in club management in Europe at some point in the future.
Bradley guided the US to the 2010 World Cup and helped them finish top of their group above England before losing in the knockout stages to Ghana.
Could be more relevent after 12 games of the new season............................but I sincerely hope not :-\
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Everything Timdon. If you pick the thread up correctly you will find the discussion I had with Baggies revolved around SCs ability to step up from a No2 position. My view being that the biggest hurdle he would face would be the man management aspect of this. Baggie had a different point of view and the discussion did broaden slightly but still highly relevent to the appointment of our new coach.
Just a little bit :D
......but I do see where you are coming from
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Impressed to read today that SC has spoken to most of the players despite being on holiday, even if its just to touch base it shows some indication that he is aware of the man management aspect and gives him a chance to have a conversation and briefly comment on the job with the players
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Got to say I was pretty pleased with the SC appointment but after the last couple of days I am actually very excited to see his tenure as our boss as it could be very exciting with the brand of football he is proposing and his general attitude.
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Looking forward to a bit more expansive football this season particularly at home please Steve. Gut feeling is that aside from the obvious LB CM he will look to bring one or two wide attacking players into the club. I hope so we seem so lacking in this area. Also an interesting article today in the Mercury with SC saying he is very much looking forward to working with the Long/Odemwingie pairing and finding the way to get the best from it. Roy played Odemwingie generally in the deeper role except when Long was injured and he moved him out wide right when he looked much better in the 433. Be interesting to see what he does but a nice problem to have really.
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Looking forward to a bit more expansive football this season particularly at home please Steve. Gut feeling is that aside from the obvious LB CM he will look to bring one or two wide attacking players into the club. I hope so we seem so lacking in this area. Also an interesting article today in the Mercury with SC saying he is very much looking forward to working with the Long/Odemwingie pairing and finding the way to get the best from it. Roy played Odemwingie generally in the deeper role except when Long was injured and he moved him out wide right when he looked much better in the 433. Be interesting to see what he does but a nice problem to have really.
When I read this
http://www.sundaymercury.net/midlands-sport/west-bromwich-albion-fc/west-brom-news/2012/06/24/west-brom-forward-pairing-excites-steve-clarke-66331-31247584/?
my first reaction was "Oh no just when things seemed to be going well our new coach is about to repeat the biggest mistake our old coach made" Then having thought about it he has seen the DVD's he must have seen Odemwingie looking completely lost in the withdrawn striker role and he is a good coach so therefore he must have a different solution i.e. a 433 with Odemwingie wide right Long as the central striker and Brunt on the left.
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When I read this
http://www.sundaymercury.net/midlands-sport/west-bromwich-albion-fc/west-brom-news/2012/06/24/west-brom-forward-pairing-excites-steve-clarke-66331-31247584/?
my first reaction was "Oh no just when things seemed to be going well our new coach is about to repeat the biggest mistake our old coach made" Then having thought about it he has seen the DVD's he must have seen Odemwingie looking completely lost in the withdrawn striker role and he is a good coach so therefore he must have a different solution i.e. a 433 with Odemwingie wide right Long as the central striker and Brunt on the left.
More likely Thomas (or A.N. OTHER) on the left ?
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When I read this
http://www.sundaymercury.net/midlands-sport/west-bromwich-albion-fc/west-brom-news/2012/06/24/west-brom-forward-pairing-excites-steve-clarke-66331-31247584/?
my first reaction was "Oh no just when things seemed to be going well our new coach is about to repeat the biggest mistake our old coach made" Then having thought about it he has seen the DVD's he must have seen Odemwingie looking completely lost in the withdrawn striker role and he is a good coach so therefore he must have a different solution i.e. a 433 with Odemwingie wide right Long as the central striker and Brunt on the left.
More likely Thomas (or A.N. OTHER) on the left ?
Probably right about Thomas rather than Brunt who I would expect to continue in midfield. I hope he considers CB on the left rather than the right though and he might have that option if Zolten stays fit and on form. But I for one would really love to see PO play consistently wider on the right and maybe new addition in the wide attacking role particularly one that can play on both sides. For me Long is best leading the line his pace and aerial threat make him the better option there. Fortune would be the man to put pressure on his position.
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I hope it is Brunt wide left Odemwingie has pace and Brunt has crossing ability and when played in his best position wide left he tends to stay out wide which gives us width. Thomas on the other hand whilst he has pace and trickery but seldom delivers a telling ball into the box.
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I hope it is Brunt wide left Odemwingie has pace and Brunt has crossing ability and when played in his best position wide left he tends to stay out wide which gives us width. Thomas on the other hand whilst he has pace and trickery but seldom delivers a telling ball into the box.
Couldnt argue with that Stan. By far the most frustrating thing about Jerome. So often he does all the hard work and then fails to deliver the final ball. Such a shame because he really is a very talented footballer with the ball at his feet one on one. Personally I would be quite happy for Brunty to sit a deeper and orchestrate but on the left where he can whip an earlier ball from a deeper position Charlie Adam style.
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Got to say I was pretty pleased with the SC appointment but after the last couple of days I am actually very excited to see his tenure as our boss as it could be very exciting with the brand of football he is proposing and his general attitude.
Havent been in the loop as much the last few weeks. Are there any articles where he talks about his planned style of football or is this just more what you have heard behind the scenes?
I hope he does open up our play a bit more.
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Havent been in the loop as much the last few weeks. Are there any articles where he talks about his planned style of football or is this just more what you have heard behind the scenes?
I hope he does open up our play a bit more.
In his press conference he said he would like us to attack more at home...also likes to get the ball down.
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http://www.birminghammail.net/birmingham-sport/west-bromwich-albion-fc/west-bromwich-albion-fc-news/2012/06/22/players-will-enjoy-training-with-me-says-new-west-brom-boss-steve-clarke-97319-31236456/2/
Players will enjoy training with me says new West Brom boss Steve Clarke
by Gregg Evans,
West Bromwich Albion head coach Steve Clarke
STEVE Clarke is aiming to maintain the feelgood factor at The Hawthorns – and believes the players will relish his daily training sessions.
The newly-appointed head coach has mastered a range of motivational techniques during his 14-year education as a No.2 and will use all his experience to get the best out of the Baggies squad.
Spirits are high in the Albion camp after ex-boss Roy Hodgson guided them to back-to-back mid-table finishes.
And while Clarke will devise his own training plan, the 48-year-old Scot is confident that the players will buy into his ideas.
“I’ll be open to the players,” he said. “I’ve worked for a long time as an assistant coach and I know that if you go and give players a cuddle at the right time, that is part of the job now.
“I think the players will enjoy working with me.
I’ve got a good way of working on the training field.
“The players should enjoy coming to work and if they do, then you’re halfway there.
“I don’t want to lose the strengths that the club had last season though. They were really well-organised, disciplined and hard to beat. That is the first priority for anybody.
“On top of that I’d like to add my own little stamp and we can hopefully become a little bit more attacking, especially at home.”
Clarke admits management has changed since he was a player and he is ready to evolve too.
He remembers the days when strict orders were the only option, however, in this day and age he knows coaches need to adapt.
“I don’t think you have to be nasty, definitely not in the modern game,” he added.
“If you went back to when I was a player you could have a manager who was a right so-and-so and be very strict and not play you.
“In those days your weekly wage was your weekly wage and your bonus was important to you. If you weren’t in the team you wouldn’t be getting your bonus so the manager had that power over the players.
“Nowadays the players are all millionaires so you have to handle them in a different way.
“It’s not a case of being nasty, it’s a case of being strong and being able to put across your opinion.
“With any reasonable person, if you can give an opinion and a reason for doing something they will accept it.
“They might not like it or enjoy it but they will accept it and that’s what you have to do now as a modern head coach or manager.”
Albion return to pre-season training during the first week of July, however, those who appeared at the European Championships will get extra holiday.
Striker Chris Wood will also be granted time off as he has been called up for the New Zealand Olympic squad. Their first match is against Belarus at the City of Coventry Stadium on July 26.
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Just let the bloke get on with it!
So many opinions but based on what? Does anyone know what SC will actually do? Of course not.
Give the bloke a good chance. Its a marathon not a sprint!
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Just let the bloke get on with it!
So many opinions but based on what? Does anyone know what SC will actually do? Of course not.
Give the bloke a good chance. Its a marathon not a sprint!
Clam down Turkish thats the first 3 lines of a rant again.............what happened someone come to the door.... :) People are just speculating thats part and parcel of being a football fan.......isnt it?
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I like that Turkish is on here, his stories are normally very good and it also allows us to all say "Calm down Turkish", very "Snatch". Now where's my shooters?!
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I like that Turkish is on here, his stories are normally very good and it also allows us to all say "Calm down Turkish", very "Snatch". Now where's my shooters?!
Perhaps Oldbury should send a personal invitation to Vinnie to join our forum as associate director of member discipline....................Turkish could find himself in trouble :o
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Well i have not posted much on this issue but for what its worth im glad old Roy has gone and i believe he got showed up for what he is in the euros which is a steady eddie and set in his ways. I never posted much on here when he was manager because it would have caused to much bitterness as my opinions of his style where not great. I believe given time steve clarke could prove to be a great signing for us i hope that he stays a long time and brings us success and good football. We need a forward thinking manager who can adapt to different styles and new ideas and sets the team up to win not just difficult to beat.
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Well i have not posted much on this issue but for what its worth im glad old Roy has gone and i believe he got showed up for what he is in the euros which is a steady eddie and set in his ways. I never posted much on here when he was manager because it would have caused to much bitterness as my opinions of his style where not great. I believe given time steve clarke could prove to be a great signing for us i hope that he stays a long time and brings us success and good football. We need a forward thinking manager who can adapt to different styles and new ideas and sets the team up to win not just difficult to beat.
Fair enough Ian but you have to give Roy Hodgson a lot of credit. Before he arrived we had always flattered to deceive in the PL. Some good players but no substance and an alarming ability to leak goals like a sieve. From the moment he arrived he clearly brought a much greater level of coaching and organisation and it showed on the pitch as we started to give just about everyone a tough afternoon. He also laid some long time unwanted records to rest Stoke City and The Villa to name but two. And who could forget that wonderful Sunday at the custard bowel back in February. So yes at times it wasnt always pretty and I like you hope that SC can bring a bit more free flowing football back. But did Roy move WBA forward and make us a better team?....................a resounding yes.
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Well i have not posted much on this issue but for what its worth im glad old Roy has gone and i believe he got showed up for what he is in the euros which is a steady eddie and set in his ways. I never posted much on here when he was manager because it would have caused to much bitterness as my opinions of his style where not great. I believe given time steve clarke could prove to be a great signing for us i hope that he stays a long time and brings us success and good football. We need a forward thinking manager who can adapt to different styles and new ideas and sets the team up to win not just difficult to beat.
Sorry ian you are wrong on this subject. Roy Hodgson was a saviour for this club and I for one wish he was still here. Saying that I will give my full support to SC.
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Well i have not posted much on this issue but for what its worth im glad old Roy has gone and i believe he got showed up for what he is in the euros which is a steady eddie and set in his ways. I never posted much on here when he was manager because it would have caused to much bitterness as my opinions of his style where not great. I believe given time steve clarke could prove to be a great signing for us i hope that he stays a long time and brings us success and good football. We need a forward thinking manager who can adapt to different styles and new ideas and sets the team up to win not just difficult to beat.
I am not sure you would have been on your own in January there were a number of posters voicing similar concerns about Roy however that is in the past. Looking forward I hope you are not expecting too much from Steve Clarke. He has stated that he wants to more attacking football particularly at home but I am sure he will not lose sight of the need to be difficult to beat because ultimately his job depends on it.
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Sorry ian you are wrong on this subject. Roy Hodgson was a saviour for this club and I for one wish he was still here. Saying that I will give my full support to SC.
Not necessarily, he hasnt said if he did a good job in terms of results. Hodgsons results are undeniable, but I suppose a lot depends on your opinions of football and what a team like WBA should be looking to do. I have to admit, I did always have a sense of emptiness following Hodgsons Albion. It was very solid and for the first time assured of safety but there was something crucial missing and that was a sense of a positive purpose. We were playing very basic football with the sole purpose of staying alive in the division. It reminded me a bit of the man who works 7 days a week and earns millions - whats the point of having the money if you are not going to use it?
That's why I hope and believe Clarke will open us up a bit more again and find a good balance between a solid strucutre and more entertainment.
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I am not wrong in my opinion just have adifferent one to many. Dennis smith helped us beat stoke yet he was inept. Dimatteo helped us beat arsenal away yet he was sacked. Hodgson gave us stability he has not moved us forwards in football terms. Yes we got results but we lost games we should have won also. He was shown up for what he is at the euros lack of vision set england up just like us hard to beat but as an attacking force we were stifled. Our football has gone backwards but we will always be hard to beat. Clarke will be on a learning curve but more modern in his approach i hope
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Not necessarily, he hasnt said if he did a good job in terms of results. Hodgsons results are undeniable, but I suppose a lot depends on your opinions of football and what a team like WBA should be looking to do. I have to admit, I did always have a sense of emptiness following Hodgsons Albion. It was very solid and for the first time assured of safety but there was something crucial missing and that was a sense of a positive purpose. We were playing very basic football with the sole purpose of staying alive in the division. It reminded me a bit of the man who works 7 days a week and earns millions - whats the point of having the money if you are not going to use it?
That's why I hope and believe Clarke will open us up a bit more again and find a good balance between a solid strucutre and more entertainment.
I think the key to this lies in the quality of players as it always does. Roy was a pragmatist he understood the limitations of our players at this level and realised that squeezing the maximum out of them collectively would bring better results than allowing them freedom individually. There is no bigger truth in football than great players change games. I doubt very much whether Pep Guardiola placed any real constraints on Lionel Messi. He probably just let him go out and do his own thing. The reason I say this is because I think this will be SCs biggest challenge, can he find a better balance with essentially the same players? RDM couldnt. One cant help but think that for us to improve some more we have to improve the quality of the squad but for a club like us that takes time. Yes could well be a job well done if Steve just keeps us in the division let alone anything else. Then you look at say Stoke City who have invested heavily and finished below us twice! albeit that they did get into the Europa. Moving forward from where we are on the pitch aint going to be easy.
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There is the truth we do need to improve the quality of our players. However i still believe that we could and would have stayed up even without hodgson at the helm as i believed that is where abouts this squad of players is in terms of ability. Hodgson =negative and I for one hope Clarke = positive.
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You might well exchange "Organised" for stilted and draw the conclusion that we were less "entertaining" for the past 18 months. But that also brought stability and a growing sense that the Premier league is our league. It's not just somewhere we're visiting for a bit.
I as a fan started, for the first time ever in all honesty, actually started believing away results were possible. I went into away at Wigan and Villa and such with an actual realistic hope we'd get a win.
SC may well be more attack minded and I'd welcome more Albion goals, but I'll be very surprised if that doesn't also mean more conceded.
If SC is indeed more attack orientated i think this coming season will see more goals scored and more defeats in the 3-1 category... I'd rather have kept Roy, but I wish SC all the luck in the world.
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You might well exchange "Organised" for stilted and draw the conclusion that we were less "entertaining" for the past 18 months. But that also brought stability and a growing sense that the Premier league is our league. It's not just somewhere we're visiting for a bit.
I as a fan started, for the first time ever in all honesty, actually started believing away results were possible. I went into away at Wigan and Villa and such with an actual realistic hope we'd get a win.
SC may well be more attack minded and I'd welcome more Albion goals, but I'll be very surprised if that doesn't also mean more conceded.
If SC is indeed more attack orientated i think this coming season will see more goals scored and more defeats in the 3-1 category... I'd rather have kept Roy, but I wish SC all the luck in the world.
Lot of truth in that Solo. i also would been very happy to keep Roy because although at times it was a bit painful to watch there were some good days too. But the overiding factor is that staying in the PL does allow you as a club to do so many other things. Squad and Stadium improvement and so on. Im sure Roy would have done that for us. Im still very optimistic about Steve Clarke though. He has an excellent pedigree as a coach so i expect him to have the players behind him fully.
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Ive posted on it before, but I suppose it is all about what you see as being the eventual aim of being in the premier league. Hodgson was a stepping stone for me, a man to try to establish us in the top flight, which he did. In the end though, if our top level is to be a mid table club, which im quite happy with, I want us to have another angle to the club, other than just grinding out 11th place finish after 1th place finish. Take nothing away from the superb job Hodgson did, but if that had been the long term I would have questioned if the premier league status was worth it.
I want the club now to try to make more legends. I want to be able to tell future generations I saw memorable sides, like fans from the 50's, 60's, 70's and early 80's can. I want to see us play some football. Not total Mowbray idealist with no organisation football, but something that does entertain more often than not.
It isnt easy and Hodgsons was less risky but it i worth the gamble. Swansea under Rodgers were able to play great football, with some average players, and finish 11th, on the same points as ourselves playing less entertaining football. Rodgers managed to find the perfect mix through good management and that is now the challenge for Ashworth, Clarke and co.
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I really think we have to be part of the new wave of talent that must be brought into the domestic game. If German clubs can have at least 2 academy kids, on average, in their first team so should we.
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The 70s side were promoted in good shape, with good players, then along came Robson, Regis and Cunningham, all by different routes.
Next season we may have to accept being out of the limelight to some extent - a relatively low key coaching appointment, some players maybe coming through the academy ranks (if they're good enough they're old enough), maybe another Ashworth gem, and the media attention mostly on the promoted clubs/"exciting" new managers at Swansea, Villa, Liverpool etc at first.
TBH I'd settle for that to some extent, but only as long as there are some signs of progress and spark, I wouldn't to see us packing the club with middleweight "established" players just to try and survive, the Bolton/Blackburn model of the past decade - look how that runs out of steam.
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The 70s side were promoted in good shape, with good players, then along came Robson, Regis and Cunningham, all by different routes.
Next season we may have to accept being out of the limelight to some extent - a relatively low key coaching appointment, some players maybe coming through the academy ranks (if they're good enough they're old enough), maybe another Ashworth gem, and the media attention mostly on the promoted clubs/"exciting" new managers at Swansea, Villa, Liverpool etc at first.
TBH I'd settle for that to some extent, but only as long as there are some signs of progress and spark, I wouldn't to see us packing the club with middleweight "established" players just to try and survive, the Bolton/Blackburn model of the past decade - look how that runs out of steam.
Agree with all of that. No shame in being out of the limelight for a time while hopefully we continue to build and become really established in the top division.
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I hope we are out of the limelight.The let the squad become settled and keep the vultures away.
I would say there will be far more pressure on Lambert and Rodgers than on Clarke.
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Well i have not posted much on this issue but for what its worth im glad old Roy has gone and i believe he got showed up for what he is in the euros which is a steady eddie and set in his ways. I never posted much on here when he was manager because it would have caused to much bitterness as my opinions of his style where not great. I believe given time steve clarke could prove to be a great signing for us i hope that he stays a long time and brings us success and good football. We need a forward thinking manager who can adapt to different styles and new ideas and sets the team up to win not just difficult to beat.
couldnt agree more i did post about this last season and a few on here tried to shout me down but i stand by what i said. after the england game the other night even my mrs could see it was rubbish and i said to her now you know why i came back from the games last season in a right mood because i had to watch that every game!!
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Kevin Keen appointed as Joint-Assistant Head Coach along side Keith Downing.
Tom Ross Twitter
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Kevin Keen appointed as Joint-Assistant Head Coach along side Keith Downing.
Tom Ross Twitter
Expected really. Another good coach by all accounts.
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'Joint Assistant Head Coach'.
::)
Glad he's on board, but the 'joint' bit is all a bit silly.
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'Joint Assistant Head Coach'.
::)
Glad he's on board, but the 'joint' bit is all a bit silly.
Kevin hands out the Bibs, while Keith lays out the cones ;)
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It's a good idea to have a few people around the training pitch adding different ideas. In his first managerial job it should help Clarke to have somebody he is familiar with by his side.
I didnt actually consider before what Keens appointment at Liverpool tells you about Dalglish's respect for Clarke. Keen is clearly Clarkes man having worked with him at West Ham and I doubt Keen would have ended up at Liverpool without Clarke so Dalglish must have put a lot of stock in Clarke's opinion of who to hire.
It's nother sign that people in the game must consider Clarke a safe pair of hands.
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I read with Ladbrooks Steve Clarke is the first manager to get the sack this coming season
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Mcdermott or Hughes i think as both clubs will want instant success.
but i can see why clarke is high on list
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Mcdermott or Hughes i think as both clubs will want instant success.
but i can see why clarke is high on list
My money's on RDM.
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another good shout
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Westham would of got rid of Sam Allardyce if they hadnt of won promotion so its him for me ,
I know thier fans hate his style of football so it wont be long for the boo boys to start getting on his back
if they dont start well .
Steve Clarke will be fine at Albion as the players seem to love him already as his training methods
seem to have won them over, once you have the players on side you are half the way there.
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I read with Ladbrooks Steve Clarke is the first manager to get the sack this coming season
Strange obviously just reflects where the money has gone in the market but I would have thought other managers are under greater pressure and have less patient boards. Adkins, Allardyce or RDM all would be better bets than Clarke to win the sack race in my view.
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It would have to go absolutely pear shaped for us to sack him before Xmas so I'd expect others to go before him - Liverpool, villa and west ham seem like likely slackers to me.
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I read with Ladbrooks Steve Clarke is the first manager to get the sack this coming season
No suprise, he isnt clear favourite, bookies have as much idea as us at the start of the year to who going to get the sack so put the man who hasnt had a job favourite is not unusally
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I think he will be here for the season at least whatever happens, we obviously spent a lot of time identifying who we want and Albion dont tend to go with quick fixes, we arent a club who sack a manager a season.
For me i think Allardyce would be the one, the fans dont like him, the board dont seem overly impressed and i reckon by Xmas, Redknapp will be in there.
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i reckon pulis. i just think stoke will struggle this year and from when we played them last season there fans seemed like they were yurning on him.
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AVB.............................................................. ;D
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I would not put any money on that >:(
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Strange obviously just reflects where the money has gone in the market but I would have thought other managers are under greater pressure and have less patient boards. Adkins, Allardyce or RDM all would be better bets than Clarke to win the sack race in my view.
That's what i though! apart from RDM we stick by our managers till the end (Megson left so that doesn't count)
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Shoot me down and strike me off if you want to but so far this guy doesn't inspire me
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Shoot me down and strike me off if you want to but so far this guy doesn't inspire me
I do kind of agree, but its far too early to say anything against him yet. I hope like all of us he proves to be a very good head coach who continues with the fine work Roy has done.
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Don't care of he inspires me , inspiring long ,Pete , yacob etc is what hes paid for.
Sack race
Pullis
Rodgers
Avb
RDM
Allardyce
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Shoot me down and strike me off if you want to but so far this guy doesn't inspire me
Good thing that's not his job.
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Shoot me down and strike me off if you want to but so far this guy doesn't inspire me
We've made important signings and had decent perfomaces in the pre-season friendlies we've played so far. He hasn't dribbled or farted live on the telly, he hasn't been caught drink driving or leaving a brothel, he hasn't been charged with tax evasion and to top it all, it's the close season and the Olympics are everywhere.
How would you like him to inspire you? A gold medal in the three day event perhaps?
Give the bloke a chance!
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Good thing that's not his job.
Well it will be part of his job come 18th of August wont it, he inspires said players, players inspire the audience. lets just wait and see ay
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Well it will be part of his job come 18th of August wont it, he inspires said players, players inspire the audience. lets just wait and see ay
He inspires the players who get the results. In what way does he not 'inspire' you just out of interest?
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He inspires the players who get the results. In what way does he not 'inspire' you just out of interest?
Exactly, Clarke doesn't give a toss if your exited or not. His entire job is to get results
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Exactly, Clarke doesn't give a toss if your exited or not. His entire job is to get results
I know and to an extent I don't really care as would rather us be successful and come away with a win then look back and think we played okay though.
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The key for me will be seeing if Clarke can get that extra 10/15% out of the players like Hodgson was capable of.
I think the league will be much tougher than the last 2 seasons so hopefully Clarke has the tactical nouse and motivational skills to get us through the season.
The most disappointing thing from my point of view is what we've done in the transfer market so far. If we get off to a poor start I can see a lot of the blame being put in the direction of Clarke rather than the powers that be higher up the food chain........
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The key for me will be seeing if Clarke can get that extra 10/15% out of the players like Hodgson was capable of.
I think the league will be much tougher than the last 2 seasons so hopefully Clarke has the tactical nouse and motivational skills to get us through the season.
The most disappointing thing from my point of view is what we've done in the transfer market so far. If we get off to a poor start I can see a lot of the blame being put in the direction of Clarke rather than the powers that be higher up the food chain........
Why what were you expecting by now? Most deals not done until well in August, plenty of time left yet
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Why what were you expecting by now? Most deals not done until well in August, plenty of time left yet
To be honest I was expecting upgrades on several positions in the squad but noises from the club suggest there isn't much more to be done now. I just think for a club going into its 3rd consequitive season in the prem we should be doing more.
Like I say I just hope it ain't all put on Clarke's shoulders if we start badly.
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Why do people think we need to make s***loads of changes?? We finished 10th last season so wholesale changes aint required! We have secured the best keeper we have had in a while and possibly go on to be the best keeper we have ever seen for us and signed an Arg international to replace Scharner, we have also signed an exciting winger in El Ghanassy and there is still 1 or 2 minimum to come in, add to the fact we have/ are clearing out the dead wood, I am 100% happy with how the summer has gone and cant fault anyone at all so far. I dont know what half the people on here want/ expect anymore??
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Why do people think we need to make s***loads of changes?? We finished 10th last season so wholesale changes aint required! We have secured the best keeper we have had in a while and possibly go on to be the best keeper we have ever seen for us and signed an Arg international to replace Scharner, we have also signed an exciting winger in El Ghanassy and there is still 1 or 2 minimum to come in, add to the fact we have/ are clearing out the dead wood, I am 100% happy with how the summer has gone and cant fault anyone at all so far. I dont know what half the people on here want/ expect anymore??
Champions league qualification minimum
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Champions league qualification minimum
Many a truth said in jest!
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Champions league qualification minimum
Thats what it seems like with some people. If we dont finish top 12 again I can see some fans getting on Clarke/Peace back, which would be discusting!
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We were always going to be questioned due to us appointing a head coach who has never been in charge of a team before. I believe that the appointment of Steve Clarke will be a good appointment, but likewise others believe it will be a failure and if that's how they fail then I'm sure Clarke is looking forward to proving them wrong. We came a long way under Hodgson, we certainly overachieved but what I would hope is that some of our fans realise it's going to take Clarke a short while to adjust to being a number one, I also hope that they don't expect Clarke to equal Hodgson's achievements here. Although possible, Clarke will probably make some mistakes next season, Hodgson sure made a few last year. We just need to give Clarke a fair chance, he has massive boots to fill and I feel that will unfortunately be his downfall with our supporters.
Player wise, we have to realise that our financial resources are small, especially in comparison to the majority of sides in this league. We currently have assembled a very good squad of footballers, the best perhaps since the days of Astle, Bomber and co. That's how far we've come on our resources. To improve on the likes of Odemwingie, Mulumbu, Olsson etc will cost us a lot of money, money we quite simply don't have. So baring that in mind, in the transfer market we will have to take risks and we have to hope that the signings of Yassine El Ghanassy and Claudio Yacob prove to be masterstrokes. Anybody who was expecting wholesale changes are, well, over expecting in my opinion.
I think we'll be ok next season. Most importantly we have to give Clarke time and a chance. He's an unknown quantity so far, but what I hope is that if we lose a game the knives don't come out for him. Roy Hodgson, for example, our greatest manager in recent times? He was hounded by a lot of the board for some of his decisions last season and understandably so. I'm sure quite a few wanted him out too and look what he went onto achieve with us. I've said it earlier, Clarke will make mistakes, but what he needs is the fans backing and I'm sure we'll go onto have another successful season finishing around 12th-14th.
If folk are expecting us to go and break last seasons finish then in my opinion, they are setting their expectations way too high.
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I hear this word upgrade on here a lot. It's a myth, for a club our size and stature, whose income is spent almost entirely on the team, we have almost reached our peak. There are only two maybe three positions we could get a better player than what we already have.
We won't get better than Foster, or Olsson, or Ridgewell, or Mulumbu, or Morrison, or Brunt, or Odemwingie, or Gera. That leaves right side of defence both centrally and at fullback. But why bother? The personnel in place (MacAuley, Dawson, Reid, Jara and Jones) are perfectly acceptable for mid-table Premier League, perhaps slight question marks over the right fullbacks. The other position is second striker. For what he does we would even be hard pressed to find better than Fortune, I do think we could find a better "goalscorer" though.
Then you look at back-up with the potential of Berahino, El Ghanassy, Dorrans, Thorne, Long, Allan, Hurst, Roofe, Mantom and Wood, which of these should we upgrade???
Yacob is certainly an improvement on Scharner and Andrews. What about a substitute goalkeeper I hear you ask? Well I don't rate Myhill so I think we need to bite the bullet on Daniels, tell him he's back-up this season and let him sink or swim.
The only players I haven't mentioned are Thomas and Tamas, I expect these two to get very little game time under Clarke, but we know when required they can step in and do a job in more than one position.
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I think Clarke's tenure will be similar to Mowbray's. The football will be better to watch, we'll press higher up the pitch and we'll ultimately be caught on the break too much.
Hopefully Clarke won't be as stubborn as Mowbray and instead he'lllearn as he goes along making the necessary changes to adapt etc.
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I hear this word upgrade on here a lot. It's a myth, for a club our size and stature, whose income is spent almost entirely on the team, we have almost reached our peak. There are only two maybe three positions we could get a better player than what we already have.
We won't get better than Foster, or Olsson, or Ridgewell, or Mulumbu, or Morrison, or Brunt, or Odemwingie, or Gera. That leaves right side of defence both centrally and at fullback. But why bother? The personnel in place (MacAuley, Dawson, Reid, Jara and Jones) are perfectly acceptable for mid-table Premier League, perhaps slight question marks over the right fullbacks. The other position is second striker. For what he does we would even be hard pressed to find better than Fortune, I do think we could find a better "goalscorer" though.
Then you look at back-up with the potential of Berahino, El Ghanassy, Dorrans, Thorne, Long, Allan, Hurst, Roofe, Mantom and Wood, which of these should we upgrade???
Yacob is certainly an improvement on Scharner and Andrews. What about a substitute goalkeeper I hear you ask? Well I don't rate Myhill so I think we need to bite the bullet on Daniels, tell him he's back-up this season and let him sink or swim.
The only players I haven't mentioned are Thomas and Tamas, I expect these two to get very little game time under Clarke, but we know when required they can step in and do a job in more than one position.
Dont you mean Yacob should be an improvement on Scharner and Andrews? But in general I agree with you. I think this season could be a breakthrough year for one or two of our young prospects. I certainly hope so.
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Dont you mean Yacob should be an improvement on Scharner and Andrews? But in general I agree with you. I think this season could be a breakthrough year for one or two of our young prospects. I certainly hope so.
No I mean IS, depends how he is used of course but his pedigree, like Borja Valero before him is unquestionable.
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No I mean IS, depends how he is used of course but his pedigree, like Borja Valero before him is unquestionable.
I would defer my judgement until ive seen him play! I really hope he is and the club have extended him a permanent contract so they must like what they see. But dont forget Jacko PS had 40 full caps for his country against Jacobs 3 and was already proven in the PL and as Valero proved reputation can count for nothing although I dont feel Mowbray ever used him properly but thats another story.
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I think Steve will do fine. We have by far the best squad we have had in the PL and he isn't a spring chicken.
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I would defer my judgement until ive seen him play! I really hope he is and the club have extended him a permanent contract so they must like what they see. But dont forget Jacko PS had 40 full caps for his country against Jacobs 3 and was already proven in the PL and as Valero proved reputation can count for nothing although I dont feel Mowbray ever used him properly but thats another story.
It's Austria and Argentina, plus Wigan had already had Scharner's best days. He was an experienced head when we needed it. This boy is a FOOTBALLER.
Valero had no reputation, he's gained it since leaving. But it was clear to all when he played for us, ability wise he was light years ahead of anything around him. If anything, irrespective of Mowbray, he was too good for us at the time.
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Shoot me down and strike me off if you want to but so far this guy doesn't inspire me
Team GB athletics haven't inspired me but who knows what might happen in the coming weeks .
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We could be the modern day Chalrton of the late 90's early 00's, would suit me fine
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I hear this word upgrade on here a lot. It's a myth, for a club our size and stature, whose income is spent almost entirely on the team, we have almost reached our peak. There are only two maybe three positions we could get a better player than what we already have.
We won't get better than Foster, or Olsson, or Ridgewell, or Mulumbu, or Morrison, or Brunt, or Odemwingie, or Gera. That leaves right side of defence both centrally and at fullback. But why bother? The personnel in place (MacAuley, Dawson, Reid, Jara and Jones) are perfectly acceptable for mid-table Premier League, perhaps slight question marks over the right fullbacks. The other position is second striker. For what he does we would even be hard pressed to find better than Fortune, I do think we could find a better "goalscorer" though.
Then you look at back-up with the potential of Berahino, El Ghanassy, Dorrans, Thorne, Long, Allan, Hurst, Roofe, Mantom and Wood, which of these should we upgrade???
Yacob is certainly an improvement on Scharner and Andrews. What about a substitute goalkeeper I hear you ask? Well I don't rate Myhill so I think we need to bite the bullet on Daniels, tell him he's back-up this season and let him sink or swim.
The only players I haven't mentioned are Thomas and Tamas, I expect these two to get very little game time under Clarke, but we know when required they can step in and do a job in more than one position.
That is a very good post Jacko, totally agree.
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We could be the modern day Chalrton of the late 90's early 00's, would suit me fine
I just don't want the bit Afterwards :'(
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I hear this word upgrade on here a lot. It's a myth, for a club our size and stature, whose income is spent almost entirely on the team, we have almost reached our peak. There are only two maybe three positions we could get a better player than what we already have.
We won't get better than Foster, or Olsson, or Ridgewell, or Mulumbu, or Morrison, or Brunt, or Odemwingie, or Gera. That leaves right side of defence both centrally and at fullback. But why bother? The personnel in place (MacAuley, Dawson, Reid, Jara and Jones) are perfectly acceptable for mid-table Premier League, perhaps slight question marks over the right fullbacks. The other position is second striker. For what he does we would even be hard pressed to find better than Fortune, I do think we could find a better "goalscorer" though.
Then you look at back-up with the potential of Berahino, El Ghanassy, Dorrans, Thorne, Long, Allan, Hurst, Roofe, Mantom and Wood, which of these should we upgrade???
Yacob is certainly an improvement on Scharner and Andrews. What about a substitute goalkeeper I hear you ask? Well I don't rate Myhill so I think we need to bite the bullet on Daniels, tell him he's back-up this season and let him sink or swim.
The only players I haven't mentioned are Thomas and Tamas, I expect these two to get very little game time under Clarke, but we know when required they can step in and do a job in more than one position.
I can see Jerome Thomas still been 1st choice on the left wing this season as we wouldnt have give
taken the years option on him if he was going to be a bit part player.
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Valero had no reputation, he's gained it since leaving. But it was clear to all when he played for us, ability wise he was light years ahead of anything around him. If anything, irrespective of Mowbray, he was too good for us at the time.
i always thought valero couldve been quality for us, saw a couple of weeks ago sky sports spanish journalist said that man city and real madrid were linked with him ( don't know how much truth was in this though) such a shame we never kept him around.
Modric is an example he wasn't exactly brilliant in his first season in the premiership but look at him now....
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i always thought valero couldve been quality for us, saw a couple of weeks ago sky sports spanish journalist said that man city and real madrid were linked with him ( don't know how much truth was in this though) such a shame we never kept him around.
Modric is an example he wasn't exactly brilliant in his first season in the premiership but look at him now....
Him not settling in the country & in the team along with the lad being home sick all played a big part in we moving him on.
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Dragging the thread back from Vallero (he left 3 years ago really) to our new Head Coach, two things seem to be apparent from the friendlies to date. Firstly he seems to have settled on a 433 formation with Odemwingie on the right and two deep sitting midfielders. Secondly he is trying to adopt a more fluid passing style of play. Personally I approve of both developments which of course does not mean they will be successful but I like the way things are shaping up
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Dragging the thread back from Vallero (he left 3 years ago really) to our new Head Coach, two things seem to be apparent from the friendlies to date. Firstly he seems to have settled on a 433 formation with Odemwingie on the right and two deep sitting midfielders. Secondly he is trying to adopt a more fluid passing style of play. Personally I approve of both developments which of course does not mean they will be successful but I like the way things are shaping up
Yep, we have looked good so far and he seems to have identified what we all know in that a 433/451 plays to our strengths. As long as he keeps us up, i'll be happy. He obviously knows what he is doing from the clubs he has worked at. I've got confidence in our recruitment policy and if Ashworth thinks he is the right man for the job, then that is good enough for me.
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Team GB athletics haven't inspired me but who knows what might happen in the coming weeks .
You were saying? ;D Let's hope the same happens on this end.
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Shoot me down and strike me off if you want to but so far this guy doesn't inspire me
Any inspiration yet now we have finally played a match?? :-*
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Any inspiration yet now we have finally played a match?? :-*
Early days but encouraging.I do hope to be eating my words
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Couldnt of had a better start.
Hope he keeps it up.
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Still early days but I think this could be a JP & DA Masterstroke, I like the formation and the style of football he is trying to get us to play. Nice flowing football 8) Last year we became quite boring or be it we finished 10th but when I pay 40 quid a game I want to be entertained, last year we were to rigid players like Mulumbu,Thomas, were suffering the most and we lacked creativity with a Andrews - Mulumbu midfield :-X but now i feel clarke has got a very good balance. At the moment the signs are looking good, oh and some dingle mate said to me that he would be our Terry Connor lol he has already won more games than Connor and he had 14 games . :P
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I will be delighted if we keep up this proactive approach at home.This is where i pay most of my money, home games.
I think its roles reversed this season.More success at home than away.I will take that
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Lets face it we needed a good start to the season and in all honesty it began with making signings like Yacob, Rosenberg and Lukaku as it got people excited for the new season and gave people something to talk about ahead of the big kick off. It has continued with a well deserved victory over Liverpool but there are going to be plenty of ups and downs to come but the early signs are positive.
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Still early days but I think this could be a JP & DA Masterstroke, I like the formation and the style of football he is trying to get us to play. Nice flowing football 8) Last year we became quite boring or be it we finished 10th but when I pay 40 quid a game I want to be entertained, last year we were to rigid players like Mulumbu,Thomas, were suffering the most and we lacked creativity with a Andrews - Mulumbu midfield :-X but now i feel clarke has got a very good balance. At the moment the signs are looking good, oh and some dingle mate said to me that he would be our Terry Connor lol he has already won more games than Connor and he had 14 games . :P
There are quite a few posts on Mol Mix laughing at Clarke's appointment and forecasting Albion's imminent demise without Roy. If things keep going like this, that will be some very juicy quotation material. :)
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If things keep going like this our Stevie will be more like our Sir Bobby Robson than their Terry Connor...
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Other coaches that have failed are coaches that have tried to become managers. At WBA we dont have a manager role in the old sense, Ashworth is closer to it than what we need Clarke to be.
Thats what the doubters ( most thick media types ) dont take on board. Clarke has only made the step from assistant coach/manager to Head coach, something completely different to that of out and out manager. Take that onboard and you see that Clarke is tailor-made for the role at WBA.
I was pleased for him on Saturday as his decisions both tactically and time-wise were spot on. And his aftermatch interview was the stuff of legends !, especially his response to the "unexpected" win question.
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Other coaches that have failed are coaches that have tried to become managers. At WBA we dont have a manager role in the old sense, Ashworth is closer to it than what we need Clarke to be.
Thats what the doubters ( most thick media types ) dont take on board. Clarke has only made the step from assistant coach/manager to Head coach, something completely different to that of out and out manager. Take that onboard and you see that Clarke is tailor-made for the role at WBA.
I disagree if Steve Clarke can be a good head coach for Albion, then he'd make a good manager for any other team. He's just fortunate to have the infrastructure around him that he does at the Albion.
I think it's a disservice to Clarke to say the thing that what separates him from the Sammy Lees, the Terry Connors, and the Chris hutchings is that he's a head coach not a a manager.
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I disagree if Steve Clarke can be a good head coach for Albion, then he'd make a good manager for any other team. He's just fortunate to have the infrastructure around him that he does at the Albion.
I think it's a disservice to Clarke to say the thing that what separates him from the Sammy Lees, the Terry Connors, and the Chris hutchings is that he's a head coach not a a manager.
I dont understand your point tbf. Its blatantly obvious that the role of HEAD COACH at WBA is completely different to the managers role at other clubs. People site the reason for our anticipated relegation this season is that Clarke wont be able to MANAGE us. I'm making the point that he doesnt have to MANAGE us, he has to coach the first team.............and for that role he is ideally suited. Thats why I dont see him failing at WBA or us getting relegated.
Hope thats cleared up things. Thats why Peace bought him here in the first place.............WBA DO NOT NEED A MANAGER, we needed a HEAD COACH..........and thats just what we've got, and a very good one to boot !
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I disagree if Steve Clarke can be a good head coach for Albion, then he'd make a good manager for any other team. He's just fortunate to have the infrastructure around him that he does at the Albion.
I think it's a disservice to Clarke to say the thing that what separates him from the Sammy Lees, the Terry Connors, and the Chris hutchings is that he's a head coach not a a manager.
I agree with Greenock, a manager and head coach are 2 totally different jobs, coaching and picking a team is just 50% of a managers job, in reality that is all a head coach has to do. The manager scouts, negotiates with agents and players, deals with contracts in and out, buys and sells who he wants and has a much wider scope than a head coach does.
Dan Ashworth & Steve Clarke = Manager
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I dont understand your point tbf. Its blatantly obvious that the role of HEAD COACH at WBA is completely different to the managers role at other clubs. People site the reason for our anticipated relegation this season is that Clarke wont be able to MANAGE us. I'm making the point that he doesnt have to MANAGE us, he has to coach the first team.............and for that role he is ideally suited. Thats why I dont see him failing at WBA or us getting relegated.
Hope thats cleared up things. Thats why Peace bought him here in the first place.............WBA DO NOT NEED A MANAGER, we needed a HEAD COACH..........and thats just what we've got, and a very good one to boot !
I agree that the role is different here than at other clubs Greenock but he still has to ‘manage’ us to some degree. The coaching side of things will be very similar to what he’s done previously and as you say, he won’t have to deal too much with agents, scouting and transfers etc. However, there are other aspects such as man managing players, motivating players, team talks, coping with the media, team selection etc. that he doesn’t have too much first-hand experience off.
Saying that, he has worked under some great managers and I have no doubt that he will pick these things up quickly. The early signs are very good and I do think he could be a great fit for this football club. However, I think we really need to wait at least 10 games before we can start assessing whether he is up to the job or not.
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As Clarke said after the game on Saturday this is only the first game of the season and we should not rush to judgement either way. That said the I think those in the media who predicted that we would struggle this season on the basis of Clarke's appointment were doing the man a disservice and more importantly ignoring the progress that the club has made in the last two seasons.
The often quoted Terry Connor and Sammy Lee examples of long term assistants stepping up and falling flat on their faces are completely different from the circumstances surrounding Steve Clarke's appointment at the Hawthorns. Not only is the role different but the club he inherits is not in crisis far from it.
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As Clarke said after the game on Saturday this is only the first game of the season and we should not rush to judgement either way. That said the I think those in the media who predicted that we would struggle this season on the basis of Clarke's appointment were doing the man a disservice and more importantly ignoring the progress that the club has made in the last two seasons.
The often quoted Terry Connor and Sammy Lee examples of long term assistants stepping up and falling flat on their faces are completely different from the circumstances surrounding Steve Clarke's appointment at the Hawthorns. Not only is the role different but the club he inherits is not in crisis far from it.
Exactly
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He seems to have this expectation about him that we should win games no matter who we are playing, which is only a good thing.
We have often showed too much respect to our opposition where as on the only evidence we have under Clarke is that we are getting in your faces when you have the ball and f****** taking it to them! And attacking very well. Chuffed. ;D
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He seems to have this expectation about him that we should win games no matter who we are playing, which is only a good thing.
We have often showed too much respect to our opposition where as on the only evidence we have under Clarke is that we are getting in your faces when you have the ball and f****** taking it to them! And attacking very well. Chuffed. ;D
That's my kind of attitude, to be honest. I really admire Roy, but it seemed last year he sometimes had the boys go into lockdown weather-the-storm mode. Don't get me wrong -- I couldn't be happier with our amazing defensive work, but well, games are won by goals, aren't they?
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Quote:"He seems to have this expectation about him that we should win games no matter who we are playing, which is only a good thing. "
Thats because he worked for Chelsea and Liverpool ! Clubs expected to win no matter who they played. Agree its a totally positive attitude that I like.
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http://www1.skysports.com/fantasyfc/story/26811/7991623/Premier-predictions
http://www1.skysports.com/football/news/11096/7979752/Premier-predictions
http://www1.skysports.com/football/news/11096/7979803/Premier-predictions
It's probably been posted already, but I cannot believe this still. Idiots.
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http://www1.skysports.com/fantasyfc/story/26811/7991623/Premier-predictions (http://www1.skysports.com/fantasyfc/story/26811/7991623/Premier-predictions)
http://www1.skysports.com/football/news/11096/7979752/Premier-predictions (http://www1.skysports.com/football/news/11096/7979752/Premier-predictions)
http://www1.skysports.com/football/news/11096/7979803/Premier-predictions (http://www1.skysports.com/football/news/11096/7979803/Premier-predictions)
It's probably been posted already, but I cannot believe this still. Idiots.
Sky Sports understands that Sky Sports have never heard of West Bromwich Albion.
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He seems to have this expectation about him that we should win games no matter who we are playing, which is only a good thing.
We have often showed too much respect to our opposition where as on the only evidence we have under Clarke is that we are getting in your faces when you have the ball and f****** taking it to them! And attacking very well. Chuffed. ;D
Agreed. Hopefully we'll go to places like Man City and give it a real go instead of rolling over and having our belly's tickled. Most of the times you'll get beat but I think most fans would rather see us giving things a go.
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Agreed. Hopefully we'll go to places like Man City and give it a real go instead of rolling over and having our belly's tickled. Most of the times you'll get beat but I think most fans would rather see us giving things a go.
Not to mention Manchester United. That was so pitiful the way we threw in the towel last season.
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"I think Steve Clarke could find it tough to bed in at West Brom as sometimes fans can be ruthless when they don't get a big-name manager so the Baggies could be around the bottom."
What the f*** is he going on about? When was the last time we were ruthless to a manager? And when was the last time we had a big-name manager except Hodgson?
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http://www1.skysports.com/fantasyfc/story/26811/7991623/Premier-predictions
http://www1.skysports.com/football/news/11096/7979752/Premier-predictions
http://www1.skysports.com/football/news/11096/7979803/Premier-predictions
It's probably been posted already, but I cannot believe this still. Idiots.
It's completely obvious Merson doesn't like us as we have seen from the last 2 years now we are pushing his beloved Villa. The other Sky pundits are morons who watch the top 6 play and that's it. Someone somewhere needs to take a really good look at punditry and give people who may not be bigger names or ex players a chance as they will know more about football.
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It's completely obvious Merson doesn't like us as we have seen from the last 2 years now we are pushing his beloved Villa. The other Sky pundits are morons who watch the top 6 play and that's it. Someone somewhere needs to take a really good look at punditry and give people who may not be bigger names or ex players a chance as they will know more about football.
Spot on. I thought the knowledge about us from the pundits on soccer sat was a joke. There was nothing about how we had brought in new players to try to Get stronger, or how we have held on to our best players. It was all about how we will struggle because we have a coach who we will want out shortly and a set of players that despite finishing tenth and eleventh are now not good enough. also I found mesons comments about lakaku, before a ball had been kicked a total joke. Infact if I was Clarke I would of played it to them before the match. I have said to myself If we finish comfortable again I will post le tiss, Merson and Nicholas's the table, and I will attach a note saying that's why you sit in your fancy suits, as none of you can be a manager ever as you nothing about the game other than the top six!
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The best thing that could have happened to Clarke is the Sky pundits to criticise his appointment and specifically Charlie Nicholas's comments about the fans turning on him, because it will have reverse effect it will get the fans behind him from the off. Oh and a 3:0 opening day against Liverpool also helps a bit ;D
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The best thing that could have happened to Clarke is the Sky pundits to criticise his appointment and specifically Charlie Nicholas's comments about the fans turning on him, because it will have reverse effect it will get the fans behind him from the off. Oh and a 3:0 opening day against Liverpool also helps a bit ;D
He obviously reads this forum then! ;)
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Some really poor predictions from them but hey come May we will prove them wrong again. It's also amusing how they fail to mention Newcastle as possible top 4 contenders, can't hide from the fact they did great last year and have two quality forwards from the start this time.
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It's completely obvious Merson doesn't like us as we have seen from the last 2 years now we are pushing his beloved Villa. The other Sky pundits are morons who watch the top 6 play and that's it. Someone somewhere needs to take a really good look at punditry and give people who may not be bigger names or ex players a chance as they will know more about football.
Johnny Giles wants a word. Decent panel on RTE if you ever get a chance. Much better than Sky.
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Early days , but a greast win over liverpool to start, as far as SC goes we have by common consent, a top top coach, whether he will be a good man manager remains to be seen as he will be called upon to make some tough selection decisions in the coming months.
my take on it is this , a lot of club number 2's become bagmen and a conduit for players and manager , top clubs do not have time for thast the number 2 has to make a positive contribution and you don't see Mourhino or Dalglish putting up with a bag man, two things impressed me saturday, with half hour to go he replaced one speed merchant in Long with 2 quick players in RL and M AF just to pile more pressure on the back line and also when the players were passing the ball around in our half at 3-0, he urged them to stop fannying and get the ball forward to make more opportunities
I think we will do fine this season top ten finish , but this time i think we will be in the top ten for most of the season instead of the last third , we may even flirt with top six.
if we need to worry about anything its if there is any truth in the rumour that the FA are interested in appointing Dan Ashworth as technical director now that would be a loss. keep the faith
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Clarke is a top-class coach who often plays very nice football and is sometimes doubted purely because he has never managed before. Not quite at the level of Di Matteo but about the same of Hodgson.
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Clarke is a top-class coach who often plays very nice football and is sometimes doubted purely because he has never managed before. Not quite at the level of Di Matteo but about the same of Hodgson.
Amazing... If you had any guile I might think you were trolling. Hodgson is a better manager/head coach than RDM will EVER be.
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Amazing... If you had any guile I might think you were trolling. Hodgson is a better manager/head coach than RDM will EVER be.
Who bought all of our other players other than Foster that made our team successful today? Di MAtteo. Hodgson consolidated what Di Matteo left hm. What made him improve our side is that he added being strong on set pieces to what we already had. That's what made us an all-round side. Di Matteo should never been sacked. But I don't worry about it now.
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Back on topic...
Fantastic start for SC, if anyone had said to me we would have taken 4 points from Liverpool and Spurs away id have taken that at the start of the season.
Credit were credits due, keep focused and continue the progress.
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Who bought all of our other players other than Foster that made our team successful today? Di MAtteo. Hodgson consolidated what Di Matteo left hm. What made him improve our side is that he added being strong on set pieces to what we already had. That's what made us an all-round side. Di Matteo should never been sacked. But I don't worry about it now.
He bought Cox, Tamas, Jara, Barnes, Shorey, Slory, Haber, R.Reid, Ibanez,Tchoyi, Thomas, Myhill, S.Reid, Scharner, Fortune and Odemwingie.
How many of them have been successful?
He never played Forune either.
Our last XI :~
(The Emboldened person deserves the credit.)
Foster Hodgson/Clarke
Reid RDM
Olsson Mowbray
Ridgewell Hodgson
McAuley Hodgson
Yacob Clarke
Morrison Mowbray
Dorrans Mowbray
Mulumbu Mowbray/RDM
Long Hodgson
Fortune RDM
None of the subs were RDM's either
RDM deserves very little in the way of credit for player recruitment. As for set-pieces I distinctly remember him saying Appleton had the responsibility for organising set-pieces.
To be honest we should be most thankful to Mowbray, Ashworth and the scouting network in terms of bringing quality playing staff at the club
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Correct me iof im wrong but didnt Roy leave set pieces to Deano and Downing last season?
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Correct me iof im wrong but didnt Roy leave set pieces to Deano and Downing last season?
You're right. I remember Kiely mentioning this.
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He bought Cox, Tamas, Jara, Barnes, Shorey, Slory, Haber, R.Reid, Ibanez,Tchoyi, Thomas, Myhill, S.Reid, Scharner, Fortune and Odemwingie.
How many of them have been successful?
He never played Forune either.
Our last XI :~
(The Emboldened person deserves the credit.)
Foster Hodgson/Clarke
Reid RDM
Olsson Mowbray
Ridgewell Hodgson
McAuley Hodgson
Yacob Clarke
Morrison Mowbray
Dorrans Mowbray
Mulumbu Mowbray/RDM
Long Hodgson
Fortune RDM
None of the subs were RDM's either
RDM deserves very little in the way of credit for player recruitment. As for set-pieces I distinctly remember him saying Appleton had the responsibility for organising set-pieces.
To be honest we should be most thankful to Mowbray, Ashworth and the scouting network in terms of bringing quality playing staff at the club
I not just talking about Buying, I'm also talking about moulding them into the players they are today. Di MAtteo deserves the credit on Dorrans, Mulumbu and Olsson without any doubt to me. Fortune was brought to be a backup player and he was that under RDM. I think he is waste starting up front because he would be a great utility player for us. His three strenghts are: tackling, dribbling and strength. FOr me he could fit in up front, anywhere in midfield and maybe even at full back occasionally. COx would have been successful if he had more chances up front.
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I not just talking about Buying, I'm also talking about moulding them into the players they are today. Di MAtteo deserves the credit on Dorrans, Mulumbu and Olsson without any doubt to me. Fortune was brought to be a backup player and he was that under RDM. I think he is waste starting up front because he would be a great utility player for us. His three strenghts are: tackling, dribbling and strength. FOr me he could fit in up front, anywhere in midfield and maybe even at full back occasionally. COx would have been successful if he had more chances up front.
Why didn't he trust his signing to play there then?
I would credit Eddie Newton for moulding them more than RDM
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Why didn't he trust his signing to play there then?
I would credit Eddie Newton for moulding them more than RDM
Would you care to explain?
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Would you care to explain?
From all the evidence I can gather Eddie Newton led all the training session and RDM was rarely involved.
Chris Lepkowski - RDM's role at CFC is certainly interesting. Much of the coaching at WBA was conducted by Eddie Newton. RDM was quite hands off in that respect.
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From all the evidence I can gather Eddie Newton led all the training session and RDM was rarely involved.
Chris Lepkowski - RDM's role at CFC is certainly interesting. Much of the coaching at WBA was conducted by Eddie Newton. RDM was quite hands off in that respect.
He obviously saw them in training sessions and saw something because Mowbray hardly strted any of these players on a regular basis and Di Matteo did. He must have done something, especially in Dorrans' development. The whole team was based around him in 2009-10
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He obviously saw them in training sessions and saw something because Mowbray hardly strted any of these players on a regular basis and Di Matteo did. He must have done something, especially in Dorrans' development. The whole team was based around him in 2009-10
Olsson was a stand out player in our relegation season. Mulumbu was brought in January and had a big impact, whilst Mowbray played Dorrans in 8 premiership games towards the end of the season - impressing in those games. (Appleton had the biggest influence on Dorrans)
I think seeing as we have gone off-topic - we should just agree to disagree when it comes to RDM. He was a decent head coach for us, who had plenty off potential, but the wheels fell off badly. Roy came in and achieved far more.
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The way the Albion are structured with regards recruitment how much credit or blame can be levelled at any given coach for signings is debatable. I would also point out that any signings we made as a Championship Club really cannot be compared to those we have made in the Premier League.
The only way thing we can go on is performances and results. It really does not matter who took which sessions it is up to the Head Coach how he allocates tasks to his staff but he is responsible for delivering results.
We have had two games under Clarke and things look rosy. We had roughly 18 months each of Hodgson and Di Matteo so perhaps it might be best to reserve judgement until Clarke has had a least half a season in charge and has had to deal with a downswing in our form.
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Olsson was a stand out player in our relegation season. Mulumbu was brought in January and had a big impact, whilst Mowbray played Dorrans in 8 premiership games towards the end of the season - impressing in those games. (Appleton had the biggest influence on Dorrans)
I think seeing as we have gone off-topic - we should just agree to disagree when it comes to RDM. He was a decent head coach for us, who had plenty off potential, but the wheels fell off badly. Roy came in and achieved far more.
I'll agree to diagree with you then. Buit I also just say that Olsson was not our outstanding player in out relgation season, Brunt was.
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I'll agree to diagree with you then. Buit I also just say that Olsson was not our outstanding player in out relgation season, Brunt was.
I would go along with that too, got into double figures with goals aswell.
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Correct me iof im wrong but didnt Roy leave set pieces to Deano and Downing last season?
Initially the job was Michael Appleton's, but after his departure to Portsmouth, Downing and Deano took over the reigns. We were actually quite impressive on defending and attacking set pieces last season so they done very well in that respect.
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I not just talking about Buying, I'm also talking about moulding them into the players they are today. Di MAtteo deserves the credit on Dorrans, Mulumbu and Olsson without any doubt to me. Fortune was brought to be a backup player and he was that under RDM. I think he is waste starting up front because he would be a great utility player for us. His three strenghts are: tackling, dribbling and strength. FOr me he could fit in up front, anywhere in midfield and maybe even at full back occasionally. COx would have been successful if he had more chances up front.
Cox would still be an Albion player if he was good enough, he wasnt, so he isnt..................
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Cox would still be an Albion player if he was good enough, he wasnt, so he isnt..................
He still could be good enough it's all about being given the chances look at sinclair when he was at chelsea he never had a sniff went to swansea and has proved himself and now citeh are after him.
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Man City are actively recruiting young British players so that they can stay within the quotas as they tighten over the next few seasons. I don't think Sinclair is going to displace the actual starting members of the team for Man City on too many occasions. Don't forget what an outstanding job Luke Moore is doing for Swansea as well but i don't see many of our fans calling for him to come back :o
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Even got mentioned by the sky pundits last night his substitutions seem to come at the right times of games and have impact rather than attempting to see out games.
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http://www.birminghammail.net/birmingham-sport/west-bromwich-albion-fc/west-bromwich-albion-fc-news/2012/08/31/steve-clarke-not-given-up-on-west-brom-transfer-target-97319-31733377/?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter
“I’m going to enjoy it because other people are working behind the scenes. My job is to work on the training ground with the players I’ve got.
“That is what I enjoy doing and if there is any business to be done, it won’t be very much.”
Thought this was worth highlighting.
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http://www.birminghammail.net/birmingham-sport/west-bromwich-albion-fc/west-bromwich-albion-fc-news/2012/08/31/steve-clarke-not-given-up-on-west-brom-transfer-target-97319-31733377/?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter
“I’m going to enjoy it because other people are working behind the scenes. My job is to work on the training ground with the players I’ve got.
“That is what I enjoy doing and if there is any business to be done, it won’t be very much.”
Thought this was worth highlighting.
Come on Dan give us a nice big leaving present :)
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Excellent start for Clarke. Long way to go yet but intial signs are good.
I saw a comment or article somewhere not long ago, can't remember where about number 2's not being able to make the step up and the likes of Terry Connor and Les Reed were mentioned. Big difference between Clarke and those two. Clarke has been at big clubs dealing with bigger players and bigger egos than he will come across here so will have no concerns about telling a few how it is and that will help him.
Big test for all at the club will be how we react to our first defeat which will come ad when we hit the injuries/ suspensions spell which could affect the foundation of the solid back four and the 3 in the middle. Get through that and who knows where the season will take us.
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Along with Laudrup, Surely SC is in line for Augusts' manager of the month award? What an achievement that would be in his first job as a "number 1".
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Along with Laudrup, Surely SC is in line for Augusts' manager of the month award? What an achievement that would be in his first job as a "number 1".
They generally go for the highest points total which would be RDM also our win yesterday was in September. Don't get me wrong, I think SC and BL both deserve it more but I reckon RDM with 3 wins will get it.
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They generally go for the highest points total which would be RDM also our win yesterday was in September. Don't get me wrong, I think SC and BL both deserve it more but I reckon RDM with 3 wins will get it.
If not RDM it'll be Laudrup, Swansea are the media darlings at the moment.
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If not RDM it'll be Laudrup, Swansea are the media darlings at the moment.
Hope so, don't need the curse. :)
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Good to see and hear Muriniho singing Clarkes praises and saying we are a great club history wise :)
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David Moyes will win manager of the month 100% guaranteed !!!!!
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http://www.wba.co.uk//news/article/mourinho-hails-incredible-clarke-388777.aspx
JOSE Mourinho has given Steve Clarke a ringing endorsement as Albion boss, insisting: “He is doing amazing.”
Albion sit fourth in the table with ten points from their opening five games – their best-ever start to a Barclays Premier League campaign.
And the Real Madrid boss, who had the Hawthorns chief as his No.2 at Chelsea for three seasons, says he is not surprised to see Clarke flourishing in his first head coach role.
“He is doing amazing and I’m the last person to be surprised because I felt he was ready for this a long time ago,” said Mourinho.
“He is very mature and he’s a very strong personality.
“He can be a strong leader but at the same time he can establish a good relationship with the players.
“I’m not surprised.
“West Brom is a club with an incredible history and tradition but it is not a club to be in the top places of the Premier League, so we cannot expect Steve to finish in the Champions League places.
“But he is an incredible coach."
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http://www.wba.co.uk//news/article/mourinho-hails-incredible-clarke-388777.aspx
JOSE Mourinho has given Steve Clarke a ringing endorsement as Albion boss, insisting: “He is doing amazing.”
Albion sit fourth in the table with ten points from their opening five games – their best-ever start to a Barclays Premier League campaign.
And the Real Madrid boss, who had the Hawthorns chief as his No.2 at Chelsea for three seasons, says he is not surprised to see Clarke flourishing in his first head coach role.
“He is doing amazing and I’m the last person to be surprised because I felt he was ready for this a long time ago,” said Mourinho.
“He is very mature and he’s a very strong personality.
“He can be a strong leader but at the same time he can establish a good relationship with the players.
“I’m not surprised.
“West Brom is a club with an incredible history and tradition but it is not a club to be in the top places of the Premier League, so we cannot expect Steve to finish in the Champions League places.
“But he is an incredible coach."
we'll see about that.. ;)
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http://www.wba.co.uk//news/article/mourinho-hails-incredible-clarke-388777.aspx
JOSE Mourinho has given Steve Clarke a ringing endorsement as Albion boss, insisting: “He is doing amazing.”
Albion sit fourth in the table with ten points from their opening five games – their best-ever start to a Barclays Premier League campaign.
And the Real Madrid boss, who had the Hawthorns chief as his No.2 at Chelsea for three seasons, says he is not surprised to see Clarke flourishing in his first head coach role.
“He is doing amazing and I’m the last person to be surprised because I felt he was ready for this a long time ago,” said Mourinho.
“He is very mature and he’s a very strong personality.
“He can be a strong leader but at the same time he can establish a good relationship with the players.
“I’m not surprised.
“West Brom is a club with an incredible history and tradition but it is not a club to be in the top places of the Premier League, so we cannot expect Steve to finish in the Champions League places.
“But he is an incredible coach."
Anything is possible in football and I`d say the only team who I fear are Man City.
Its all about consistency and Albion seem to have cracked that due to everyone fighting
for their place.
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http://www.wba.co.uk//news/article/mourinho-hails-incredible-clarke-388777.aspx
JOSE Mourinho has given Steve Clarke a ringing endorsement as Albion boss, insisting: “He is doing amazing.”
Albion sit fourth in the table with ten points from their opening five games – their best-ever start to a Barclays Premier League campaign.
And the Real Madrid boss, who had the Hawthorns chief as his No.2 at Chelsea for three seasons, says he is not surprised to see Clarke flourishing in his first head coach role.
“He is doing amazing and I’m the last person to be surprised because I felt he was ready for this a long time ago,” said Mourinho.
“He is very mature and he’s a very strong personality.
“He can be a strong leader but at the same time he can establish a good relationship with the players.
“I’m not surprised.
“West Brom is a club with an incredible history and tradition but it is not a club to be in the top places of the Premier League, so we cannot expect Steve to finish in the Champions League places.
“But he is an incredible coach."
If we broke into the champions league places at the end of the season, we'd probably break the internet :-X Not to mention probably some team like chelsea would be sniffing round him :'(
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If we broke into the champions league places at the end of the season, we'd probably break the internet :-X Not to mention probably some team like chelsea would be sniffing round him :'(
More likely the FA would sack Roy and make Clarke England manager ::)
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Not quite as good as a Mourinho endorsement but ex team mate Graeme Le Saux on Goals on Sunday commented that Clarke is quiet (not necessarily a problem) but very intelligent and he watches and absorbs things. Le Saux seems pretty intelligent compared to some so I guess its a good sign if he classes Clarke as very intelligent.
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What you have to remember is that SC has the likes of Mourinho on his phone, that he can possibly call for some slight guidance. I'm not saying he does use that, but he has the business contacts that a lot of managers wish they had.
SC has really held his own since he took over, and I know it is still early doors, but he could easily emulate and/or even beat Hodgson's last couple of finishes this season.
Its a great time to be a Baggie, and as I was not around to see the glory days, with Regis/Cunningham etc, this is a pleasure to watch, and to be a part of.
Thank you to Jeremy Peace, and to Dan Ashworth for giving Steve Clarke the chance is all I can say
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http://www.expressandstar.com/sport/west-bromwich-albion-fc/2012/09/25/west-brom-boss-steve-clarke-labelled-the-incredible-one/? (http://www.expressandstar.com/sport/west-bromwich-albion-fc/2012/09/25/west-brom-boss-steve-clarke-labelled-the-incredible-one/?)
"West Brom is a club with a an incredible history and tradition"
If there's one manager you want to praise your current manager it is certainly Mourinho!
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How quickly the vultures circle
http://www1.skysports.com/football/news/11095/8176101/
West Bromwich Albion manager Steve Clarke has ruled out being a candidate to become Scotland coach if Craig Levein leaves his position.
Levein is under pressure following Scotland's disappointing start to the 2014 World Cup qualifiers and there have been calls for him to quit.
The Scottish Football Association stated earlier this week following the 2-0 defeat by Belgium that no rash decisions will be made regarding Levein's future.
Following an impressive start to his West Brom tenure, Clarke has been mooted as one option to replace Levein, but the 49-year-old has nipped such talk in the bud.
Asked if he would help his country should they approach him, Clarke said: "No, no. I'm under contract here at West Bromwich Albion."
Clarke, who won six caps for Scotland in the 1980s, is still looking on the bright side despite the recent defeats by Wales and Belgium.
He added: "Obviously the results are disappointing. If you go back to the Wales game, if the second goal that was disallowed is allowed to stand, I think Scotland win the game. Games can turn on those margins.
"If they had got three points in Wales, the situation wouldn't have looked too bad."
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I do not think any of the Scottish managers currently managing in the top two Divisions in English football would touch the the Scotland job with a barge pole given how poor the Scotland team is at the moment.
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You only have to look at Scotland's managers to see there's no chance of them poaching a premier league manager. They'll probably end up with Strachan, maybe Mcleish although he did leave to Birmingham after barely any time before.
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It would take a miracle for any manager to make an improvement on this team. I would see no way in Clarke been the Scottish manager.
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He'll be on football focus today. 12:15 BBC1.
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Only thing I question is what does he say at half time? We always seem to come out worse just after half time, instead of coming out all fired up they always seem very jittery.
Apart from just after half time I thought we did really well today, we showed really discipline under a hell of a lot of pressure and didn't let the red mist descend. That has to be credited to Steve Clarke.
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Only thing I question is what does he say at half time? We always seem to come out worse just after half time, instead of coming out all fired up they always seem very jittery.
Apart from just after half time I thought we did really well today, we showed really discipline under a hell of a lot of pressure and didn't let the red mist descend. That has to be credited to Steve Clarke.
The game plan of containment should have been changed as soon as they went down to ten men. Eleven against ten you need to dominate the ball. We sat back, thought we were very poor today.
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The game plan of containment should have been changed as soon as they went down to ten men. Eleven against ten you need to dominate the ball. We sat back, thought we were very poor today.
Wouldnt say we were poor per say. We wasted a lot of possession which we had worked very hard to create. Tamas was very culpable second half continually giving the ball away cheaply but he wasnt alone. Shame because that extra time on the ball could have been the difference.
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I will be the first to hold my hands up and say I was wrong over not wanting Clarke but I just don't understand the policy of taking long off all the time. It changed the game against the Vile and cost us 2 points and yesterday i'm pretty sure he would have buried one of the chances that fell to Lukaku and gained us a point.
When we have a lead Long is our best option of retaining the ball where sometimes Lukaku has the touch of a baby rhino.
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Better football at home this season without doubt. No denying I was disappointed at the time with his appointment.The players seem to like him and that's good enough for me.
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I will be the first to hold my hands up and say I was wrong over not wanting Clarke but I just don't understand the policy of taking long off all the time. It changed the game against the Vile and cost us 2 points and yesterday i'm pretty sure he would have buried one of the chances that fell to Lukaku and gained us a point.
When we have a lead Long is our best option of retaining the ball where sometimes Lukako has the touch of a baby rhino.
hunslet but you get the impression that lakaku only came to us on the basis that he was guaranteed a good amount of game time. but i agree with you had long stayed on the pitch we could and would be four points better off. having said that lakaku should continue to improve and that could pay dividends later in the season. he does always look like he has a goal in him which is a real positive.
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I'm enjoying the football more under Clarke than under Hodgson. Although Roy did very important work in bringing discipline and positional sense to our defence. I always felt Roy really wanted to play 4-4-2 and you saw that most when the deep midfielders kept trying to bridge the gap to the strikers with long balls, which is where the moves broke down quickly and we lost possession. Clarke has got the team playing with more flair.
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I would say that under Clarke, we still look pretty solid at the back, but the football is more attractive this season.
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So far so good. I think after ten league game in charge we can safely say that he looks the part.
http://lookbackinmildbewilderment.blogspot.co.uk/2012/10/so-far-so-good.html
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Very satisfied with Clarke - he seems to have a level head, thinks about things and has got the defence to attack balance right.
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Last night was a test of his managerial capabilites. Had we lost last night it would have been three on the trot, against a poor Southampton side and then the doubters in the media and our fan base come creeping out the woodwork etc. Thankfully we stopped the mini rot and got a clean sheet to boot. It seems when we've needed a response from the boys we've generally got one. Even if our performance wasn't brilliant last night. It was sufficient enough to get us the points.
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Why is it that people see the last 2 losses as the "beginning of the end" or "the rot setting in" ?? Is this because its lowly Albion !!
Had any other team outside the top 4 lost to Man City at home in the last minute and got beat by a jammy deflection ( again in the last minute ) awat at Newcastle, no-one would have batted an eyelid.
I dont get the over-reaction to the last 2 games ( before southampton ) to be honest.
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I dont get the over-reaction to the last 2 games ( before southampton ) to be honest.
Where was the over reaction?
All I saw was supporters saying had we taken our chances we would have won. That alongside the sloppy late goals we conceded.
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The doom and gloom merchants who were praying for us to lose last night just so they could say our bubble had burst and how it proved Clarke wasnt good enough...........I could just imagine the reaction from "some" on here and especially in the media IF we had lost to Southampton.
I'm not pointing fingers at anyone but you could just imagine it couldnt you !!
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hunslet but you get the impression that lakaku only came to us on the basis that he was guaranteed a good amount of game time. but i agree with you had long stayed on the pitch we could and would be four points better off. having said that lakaku should continue to improve and that could pay dividends later in the season. he does always look like he has a goal in him which is a real positive.
Couldnt agree more , I genuinely believe that Clarke is trying to get us wins now but getting the squad rotated so that when the run in comes they are all up to speed and raring to go.
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Steve Clarke is managing Longs Hamstring problems. Hence the substitutions and his current no involvement with Ireland.
Great manager so far. Has inherited a solid foundation from which to work with though.
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Can't help wondering about the Long hamstring. It's in our interests if he's out of the Irish game as it's 3 days before the Chelsea match and Lakaku will be out for that game against his parent club.
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I have been very impressed with him so far done an excellent job, made the defence even stronger than last season, and we can still play great attacking football.
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Will be interesting to see when a contract extension will be considered ..... obviously behind close doors discussions will take place but I have a feeling we'll reach the magic 40 point mark by early March ... If we do we should offer Steve a substantial extension and he seems the kind of bloke who will honour the contract .... of course money talks and everyone has a price, but he appears to be a thinking kind of guy, maybe similar to Tony Mowbray who jumped ship for bigger things and it didn't work out.
Of course it's early days, but Steve Clarke seems a perfect fit for our club
8)
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We are doing really well and it’s great to be a Albion supporter at the moment but I am starting to worry about Steve Clarke tactics and picking his Starting 11 ok so they did not play well mid-week but bit surprised he made so many changes yes it’s nice to swap it about but keeping the same starting line-up (injuries allowing) to me is better than swapping the team around. I really don’t know if he knows what the best starting line-up is. The forward line is getting swapped about so much im surprised they know what they are doing. Playing Shane long upfront on his own Saturday did not work. We do seem to be constally playing the away team and counter attacking. A lot of our goals scored home and away have been from counter attacks. Ok it is working at mo. but after watching match of the day and hearing Tony Pulis say, we are a counterattacking team and they set up their team to play against this proves we could get caught out and other teams could do the same I think he has to play with the same starting line-up and not keep swapping the forward line like he does. If he continues to do so I fear we could see more results like we did against stoke.
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I think he got it wrong at Swansea and I think he got it terribly wrong on Saturday. He is inexperienced as a number one though he will hopefully learn lessons and its not as though he's done a bad job up to now is it?
What is important is that he isn't too stubborn or too arrogant to learn from his mistakes. Most managers are.
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I can't decide if he is just resting the players or now that we have enough points heis seeing if he needs to buy players in january
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He's made mistakes in recent games, Clarke's still very new to being manager so he will make errors( going with 3 forwards at 0-0 on Saturday being one).Good managers learn from their mistakes so time will tell.
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It was only a matter of time for this type of thread but i do know what your saying. You dont change half a team after another league game, a cup game maybe.,its suicidal.You play your best players at home to get max points.I think we are pretty safe though.Cant see us not winning another 4 games which should be enough to keep us up ;D
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Only change he made Saturday I didn't agree with was Rosenberg in for Morrison. Brunt, Odemwingie, Ridgewell and Jones can have no complaints about being left out after Swansea and Long for Lukaku was expected.
We're 5th in the table deservedly so which would suggest he does know what he's doing.
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To be fair Pulis is talking out his backside. If he could suss teams out so well then why does his team and tactics never change? there are many differing styles in the league but he continues to play the same no matter who it is.
You cannot win them all, even the Invincibles at Arsenal didn't win them all, but really I'd suggest that when talking about people knowing what they are doing you don't use a man that in his first appointment has the complete trust of a team in one of the highest leagues in the world... compared to most of us where we have no managerial ability or others that have some but at such a low level that it is comparatively negligible to what Clarke is doing.
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Only change he made Saturday I didn't agree with was Rosenberg in for Morrison. Brunt, Odemwingie, Ridgewell and Jones can have no complaints about being left out after Swansea and Long for Lukaku was expected.
We're 5th in the table deservedly so which would suggest he does know what he's doing.
As poor as he was at Swansea i would have started Odemwingie for width mate.
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I think the media hype about Clarke being the manager who always mixes it up maybe getting to him a bit. He does seem like a great manager who knows what he's doing but trying to win the game instead of your players will not work. He may have been getting a bit over his head but hopefully he'll learn from his recent mistakes. You need some consistency for the players to gel on the field and we had nothing of that on Saturday. We do have a great squad and players should be fighting for the place week after week but taking off 7 players after a defeat is not the way to motivate players. No complaints though, 5th in the league is great, proud of the boys and the gaffer.
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Clarke did change his tactics on Saturday with the double substitution. In fact we tried a number of different tactics through the game e.g playing through the middle as we all saw. a Stoke fan has pointed out to me today that our back four played twenty more long balls than their back four, these were mainly diagonal to stretch ther defence, and we tried the wide approach when Brunt. So to blame Clarke's tactics are a little naive, the boys simply didn't perform with a little bit of extra quality.
Ps. Don't knock the Opta stats, I did point out that Adam and Whelan were the two who hoofed the ball more than anyone.
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He is a cracking manager. Only when you change things round you learn the strenghts and weaknesses of the team, which is what he did on Saturday. I have a great deal fo faith in him, and we should be backing him and the team. Still gutted that Stoke got one over us, but overall I have been really happy with the way he has played and the way he uses the team. Still guys like Popov who deserve a bit more of a run-out in my view, but that is what happens when everyone is playing well. Lets keep the faith.
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Absolutely we need to rotate. If we just play the core every game they will sputter along on fumes in April, March when good runs determine your season. We have had a good start to the season, but atm we are having a bit of a reaction.
I think the players and manager were affected by the hype and lost the focus a bit, our mindset has not been 100% the last couple of games. It is very telling that we lost focus against teams we don't like to play against. I had hoped we had grown as a team to overcome that, but there still is much work to do to fix that.
Tbh, I hope Clarke is ruthless and that we start to move on parts of the squad that have not been performing for a few years now.
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Steve Clarke has done a cracking job so far.
Let's not forget "We know who we are" and to go from an established mid table side to an established Top 4 side isn't going to happen overnight.
Yes he'll get his tactics wrong and learn from his mistakes, you only know the best combination of players by watching them play "Real" games.
He has inherited a squad of players and there may be changes in the near future, but tactically he gives every game a pretty good shot.
This isn't time to panic or point fingers .... Steve's the bloke for the job, we will do better this season than last season, lets be honest the football we played at Sunderland was great in the most part, we don't become a poor side overnight ..... we just got beat by a better side, and have to 'Take it on the Chin'.
We we're out muscled by Stoke on Saturday, but it was never gong to be a Midlands 'El Classico' was it. We needed to score first to force Stoke out of their shell .,... unfortunately it didn't and we couldn't open them up .... we will be one of many teams who will find that a problem this season.
"In Steve we trust"
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The intention was not to knock his manager ability and the: he does not know what he is doing was just a thread opener. I think he is doing a wonderful job and I can’t believe I get disappointed when we drop out of the top 4 when only a few years ago we were struggling to stop in the premiership.
But I do think he needs to decide who to play up front and in what formation. Playing Odemwingie wide to me does not work he is a very selfish player who will always try and cut in and shoot if you are going to play a wide man he has to supply good passes /crosses into the box I think he can only play down the middle I think Marc-Antoine Fortuné is better playing wide and playing Odemwingie down the middle. End of the day it’s nice to have these options it just knowing what works best.
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I've done my best to stay off here since Saturdays result because I just knew there would be a fickle thread on here slating Steve Clarke, how anyone can knock what he has done so far really do have massive issues with reality! We are in December and are still joint 3rd in the league, who wouldn't have took that back in August? I totally agree with Oldbury 5 of the 6 dropped could have no complaints, he was knocked after the Swansea game for not making changes then he is now knocked for making too many changes?? How about all the changes he has made so far this season both in players and formation that have worked and won us games?? Some people just need to moan all the time for some strange reason....
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I've done my best to stay off here since Saturdays result because I just knew there would be a fickle thread on here slating Steve Clarke, how anyone can knock what he has done so far really do have massive issues with reality! We are in December and are still joint 3rd in the league, who wouldn't have took that back in August? I totally agree with Oldbury 5 of the 6 dropped could have no complaints, he was knocked after the Swansea game for not making changes then he is now knocked for making too many changes?? How about all the changes he has made so far this season both in players and formation that have worked and won us games?? Some people just need to moan all the time for some strange reason....
To be fair this is really the only one and it's taken two days to get to this point, i think we've done well!
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I've done my best to stay off here since Saturdays result because I just knew there would be a fickle thread on here slating Steve Clarke, how anyone can knock what he has done so far really do have massive issues with reality! We are in December and are still joint 3rd in the league, who wouldn't have took that back in August? I totally agree with Oldbury 5 of the 6 dropped could have no complaints, he was knocked after the Swansea game for not making changes then he is now knocked for making too many changes?? How about all the changes he has made so far this season both in players and formation that have worked and won us games?? Some people just need to moan all the time for some strange reason....
Not saying he is not doing well. He has proven he is doing a fantastic job and we all have to be happy the way it is going the only thing I would like to see is a front line that is not being changed each week. I think he needs to find who he wants to start up front and who he needs to play wide.
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Not saying he is not doing well. He has proven he is doing a fantastic job and we all have to be happy the way it is going the only thing I would like to see is a front line that is not being changed each week. I think he needs to find who he wants to start up front and who he needs to play wide.
He swaps Long and Lukaku and it works very well, He also swaps Odemwingie with Gera occasionally to keep him on his toes, other than that Rosenberg, MAF, Brunt or Dorrans barely get a game and Thomas is at Leeds getting game time, the rest are pretty solid starters each week (if fit), he changes formation where required which I personally think is good as it shows he is tactically aware and with a change of formation tends to come a change of personnel, horses for courses and all that so dont necessarily agree with your point just because it has not worked for 2 games on the spin and it certainly doesnt warrant a thread titled 'Steve Clarke does he know what he is doing?' The fact we are joint 3rd in the league shows he knows exactly what he is doing.
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He is obviously learning and no doubt some of the decisions he as made he would change given the chance.
Going gung ho against City for instance.
As others have said i have every faith in him,sure he will make mistakes but these will only make him a better manager.
I believe in a couple of years he will be a top manager and the top sides will be looking to have him as their boss.
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Well with recent articles suggesting were worse as a team from last season as regards to possestion stats, short passing, long passing, crosses, defending etc than i guess you could say were worse and that's the managers doing, but were higher in the league, a squad full of internationals, actually more effective as in where we are in the league and with different scorers( long/lukaku 5 each, pete with 4, than morrison/gera )...and in my opinion a much better watch as a team as opposed to last season so there was always going to be a identity change when SC put his stamp on it and it's worked more than it hasnt as of yet as we either win or lose.......only problem i see is that we don't seem to be able to come back if were losing in a match as good as we have been before.
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It's hard to change a winning team, but I expected more changes against Swansea, give some of the squad a game with the intention of trying to keep the run going, or at least giving a good show. As it turned out, making the changes for Sat after a defeat just seemed to put more pressure on the players, and now we've had 2 lacklustre performances. Interesting selection process coming up for the Arsenal...
IMHO, not knocking Steve.
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Still early days. I thought he made mistake with the team on Saturday too many new faces. Hopefully he will learn from those lessons.
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It's hard to change a winning team, but I expected more changes against Swansea, give some of the squad a game with the intention of trying to keep the run going, or at least giving a good show. As it turned out, making the changes for Sat after a defeat just seemed to put more pressure on the players, and now we've had 2 lacklustre performances. Interesting selection process coming up for the Arsenal...
IMHO, not knocking Steve.
I agree. I think Clarke has been brilliant this season at his use of tactics and utilising substitutions. I jus thought it was an error to play Odemwingie wide right against Swansea when the oppositions strength is about pushing the full backs and using the whole width of the pitch. Having said that - according to reports and highlights Swansea did play well - they then followed that up with a superb victory against Arsenal.
We always seem to struggle against Stoke - and I think the match had 0-0 written all over it - had Myhill/Olsson communicated better - we would have been sitting third. Fine margins. I genuinely don't believe the team selection cost v Stoke. They are just one of those teams who we struggle to create much against. I think we'll bounce back. Wouldn't be overly worried if we lost to Arsenal. I think this team has a resillence about them.
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For me he is doing an excellent job. My main gripe is with his use of Odemwingie. By far our best player, he should be starting every game irrespective of anything else aside from injury.
You don't see Liverpool resting Suarez or Chelsea leaving out Hazard or Everton giving Fellaini the week off. Peter is as important to us as any of these players. We look a much poorer team without him EVERY time he doesn't play.
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For me he is doing an excellent job. My main gripe is with his use of Odemwingie. By far our best player, he should be starting every game irrespective of anything else aside from injury.
You don't see Liverpool resting Suarez or Chelsea leaving out Hazard or Everton giving Fellaini the week off. Peter is as important to us as any of these players. We look a much poorer team without him EVERY time he doesn't play.
Odemwingie indeed gives us another dimension offensively, a rare quality. Without him we have a lot of much of a muchness going on and our game looks flat and predictable.
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For me he is doing an excellent job. My main gripe is with his use of Odemwingie. By far our best player, he should be starting every game irrespective of anything else aside from injury.
You don't see Liverpool resting Suarez or Chelsea leaving out Hazard or Everton giving Fellaini the week off. Peter is as important to us as any of these players. We look a much poorer team without him EVERY time he doesn't play.
In fairness, Liverpool don't have anyone they can replace Suarez with ;)
But anyway, I agree entirely. Odemwingie is ridiculously important to us, he's the only one of our players who can beat a man or do something a bit out of the ordinary. We are a bit too samey without him in the side, trying to get through the middle of the pitch which gets crowded out.
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I would say we have to use Odemwinge as much as possible. I would say he is our best attacking option we have.
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For me he is doing an excellent job. My main gripe is with his use of Odemwingie. By far our best player, he should be starting every game irrespective of anything else aside from injury.
You don't see Liverpool resting Suarez or Chelsea leaving out Hazard or Everton giving Fellaini the week off. Peter is as important to us as any of these players. We look a much poorer team without him EVERY time he doesn't play.
To be fair when we reach the point that Long goes off I'd rather see Pete go up front in his natural position (IMO) and somebody replace him out wide rather than Lukaku/Fortune/Rosenberg.
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To be fair when we reach the point that Long goes off I'd rather see Pete go up front in his natural position (IMO) and somebody replace him out wide rather than Lukaku/Fortune/Rosenberg.
I think that would be the best option when Long does go of form. Not so keen on Fortune going out wide thoughas I dont this he is too effective.
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To be fair when we reach the point that Long goes off I'd rather see Pete go up front in his natural position (IMO) and somebody replace him out wide rather than Lukaku/Fortune/Rosenberg.
I'd rather see Pete up front from the start but we know that won't happen mate. He's better than both Long and Lukaku and his versatility is holding us back to a certain extent. Luckily Long and Lukaku have been mostly excellent up front so we can't really tell what we're missing.
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Thankfully we have been in a good postion to have two stikers to chip in with ten goals between them already takes a lot of pressure of Odemwingie.
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Such a shame to see a topic with this heading!
'Oh ye of little faith'. They used to say a week in politics is a long time! Now it seems to be a Albion supporter and not to hear moaning is becoming a eternity? :o
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Currently the fifth best team in the country. I'd suggest only 4 managers know better. :P
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Historically we dont do well in Swansea and like the clayhead song goes 'we always beat West Brom'
5th in the table, 26 points before the turn of the year with 5 games to play before New Year.
I don't think theres any need to be asking this question at this moment in time.
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>:( That question is an insult to intelligence......SC has been a shining light that has lead the mighty Albion to equal 4th in the Premiership........do you know "Who you are?"
"We know who we are" ;D
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Proving to be a good sound manager. Yes he will make mistakes and we will criticise him but there's not a manager alive who doesn't make mistakes. Glad he's our manager.
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i think sc has done an excellent job so far. if you'd have said at the start of the season we'd be where we are now i'd have bitten your hand off . i must admit i was a little worried with his appointment due to his lack of experience but i needn't have worried as the backroom staff have done their homework and unearthed another jewel as they have with so many of our signings . i don't mind him changing the side as it keeps everyone on their toes to stop them getting complacent .saturdays game was a bore fest as nearlly every game is against stokes tactics the only way we lost was due to an error by a usually high performing player which you just have to take on the chin.the only change i would make to the starting eleven is to play odemwinge upfront as we are going to lose him in january and give long more of a rest if possible due to his ongong injury which clarke says needs to be monitored
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I was a bit worried on how he would cope when he first game here. But the start he made was really good. I think after the Southampton game I knew he would do an excellent job with us, as we had to stop the losing streak and we did that with ease.
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Steve Clarke by utilising most of the squad, has been able to assess their strengths and weaknesses during game time. For me what shows that he knows exactly what he is doing, and is illustrated by the fact that a couple of months ago he was saying that the present squad will be more than capable of dealing with the loss of Mulumbu and Odemwingie to the African nations cup. Now he is a little more cautious stating that we may have to bring a couple in during the January window, but will assess closer to the time.
Perhaps one or two have fallen a little short of expectations, I don't know, what I do know however, is that Clarkey is doing and excellent job and we should all be proud of him and where we are at. Long may it continue.
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When Steve Clarke first came to West Brom he said they wouldn't be talking about the opposition only how we could hurt them...all he has talked about lately is how dangerous Swansea are how dangerous Stoke are....it was also said that when they were searching for our new players they looked for players that would slot seamlessly into the baggies way of playing....some of you are not going to like this, but....Lukaku is like a round peg in a square hole ( I firmly believe that a deal has been struck for his game time).....and Steve Clarke is in my opinion an habitual tinkerman and thats why our players that are in form get taken off or even left out when they are scoring goals. Having said that, he is still a good coach and I for one wouldn't want to swap him as the faults can be ironed out given time and everyone should be given time.
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We sit 5th in the league, having been on a great run and going up to third. Just a few years ago, we were nowhere near this level. We have nearly as many points at the beginning of December as we have finished some seasons with in the past.
If he doesn't know what hes doing, he's doing a f****** good job at hiding it.
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Dont think there is much to discuss really, look at our results, look at our league position and look at what all the managers he has worked under before say about him including the best in the business and that will answer wether Steve Clarke knows what he is doing!
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I'm not keen on the title of this thread.
The reason we all, well most of us, come on here is to debate football and in particular West Brom. I doubt that any of us could do a comparable let alone a better job than SC but we have our opinions and like to air them. I don't doubt that Man Utd fans often disagree with SAF's team selections and tactics and he has been top dog for many years.
For me he's doing a good job with his resources and learning as he goes.
Well done so far Steve.
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It boggles the mind that the question is even being asked after a congested week of games.
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As has already been said, the only change I would argue with was Rosenberg.
Popov had a good game and the club probably new the ridgewell story was about to break. Reid knows the centre halfs and they know him. Plus in my opinion when fit he is a safe option than Jones. Long back in was more of a return to the norm.
We defended quite well. The only real mistake was punished.
For me, nobody played badly. It was a team full of 6/10 performances on saturday. All it needed was for a player or two to step up and have a 7 or 8 game.
For all the changes, until the goal we still looked the more likely winner to me.
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5th in table, best start for years, ridiculous thread.
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5th in table, best start for years, ridiculous thread.
I'd say it's a pretty classic thread! :D
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I'd say it's a pretty classic thread! :D
I would say its the norm with some fans after 2 defeats thats why I tried as long as possible to stay off here over the weekend, probably the same ones who was calling for Hodgson to be sacked last season!
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Well
4 wins from last 6
5th in the prem (were 3rd)
Above Wenger,Rodgers,moyes, jol and Lambert :D
Only one home defeat (against the champions)
We beat the current champions of Europe
Playing good football, with a SQUAD to choose from.
I really have only one thing to say
Franksie he's gorra guw :D
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He's still learning about his players, giving gametime to the squad rather than sticking with the same team, good for him. He set himself a target of 50 points which is another step forward for us and is very achievable after the great start. We're going to lose sometimes, it happens, it's less painful in the top half of the prem than the championship and it's great to be a baggie.
He knows more about coaching than me, I've already retired as it wasn't as easy as it appears.
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I would say its the norm with some fans after 2 defeats thats why I tried as long as possible to stay off here over the weekend, probably the same ones who was calling for Hodgson to be sacked last season!
My take on that comment is that we were lucky that Hodgson got the England job. I believe we would have stagnated under Mr. Hodgson's much more conservative approach. Mr. Clarke has retained the best aspects of Mr. Hodgson's football, and added another dimension going forward. But that is probably another discussion. :)
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Imagine the furore if we do a Newcastle and lose 4 on the bounce :( :o .the boards will be lit up like a Christmas tree. Leave the man alone. Stupid titled thread.
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Imagine the furore if we do a Newcastle and lose 4 on the bounce :( :o .the boards will be lit up like a Christmas tree. Leave the man alone. Stupid titled thread.
Could not agree more.
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Well, next game is Arsenal away. I don't think anybody expects anything from that game. They are a bit on the ropes atm though, so hopefully we can deliver another knock to them. But if it doesn't happen it's not the end of the world but a bonus. After that it's time for us to start to focus a bit again, get back on track and pick up points in games against West Ham (H), Norwich (H) and QPR (A).
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he is a new manager so is still learning.
on the whole i think he does know what hes doing, the football is good, they look organised, together and respect him!
my gripe is similar to some voiced before, lack of use of odemwingie, for me hes either upfront or hes on the bench, doesnt give enough cover on the wing plus he isn a genuine match winner and can win games even when he has played poor.
I also think we use Lukaku to much, id rather him play odemwingie through the middle, he has 5 goals for the Albion, but is wasteful of chances and sometimes his control is woeful! no doubt in the boys talent but in my opinion he should be behind odemwingie in pecking order!
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When I started the thread my intention was not to question if he is a good manager or not or is he doing a good job or not! Ok I could have used a better heeding than: does he know what he is doing...
He is doing a fantastic job and a being new to the job he will make mistakes but I do stand with what I said I’m just a bit concerned that we are this far into the season and we keep swapping the forward line about ok so it is working at the moment the league position proves that but I think this is the poorest premiership we have had for a few years and I think there are a lot of clubs under performing and maybe your position reflects this but good news for us at mo. . I just would like a more consistent line up or I do think players who are not getting regular starting line ups could want to move out. . Steve is doing a fantastic job long may it long continue.
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with consistency comes predictability, and also what is the point of having 5 strikers if we ain't going to use them. not including the strike force and out field which can be Tailored to play in any manner we so wish, which is Clarke's plan after all, the rest of the team (bar illness and injury) has remained pretty consistent.
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Clarke's use of Pete on the wing is starting to bear fruit. The last couple of times he's started there he's put a good shift in defensively - he is now more of a team player. This could be seen as a master stroke if it continues.
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Clarke's use of Pete on the wing is starting to bear fruit. The last couple of times he's started there he's put a good shift in defensively - he is now more of a team player. This could be seen as a master stroke if it continues.
I'd have to argue mate, Swansea away Odemwingie was shocking defending.Look at the third and he gives up tracking back and his man makes the goal.
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I'd have to argue mate, Swansea away Odemwingie was shocking defending.Look at the third and he gives up tracking back and his man makes the goal.
Yeah that happens but arguably one game in three (one no team member covered himself in glory in) isn't particularly bad for someone meant to attack.
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With regards to Odemwingie, and his defensive qualities (or lack of) ...... see the end of the Chelsea game.
He was absolutely fantastic, putting in tackles, closing down, etc.
I would prefer him to be an out and out striker but when he does play wide, he tends to 'do his bit for the team' on the whole.
He can appear lazy and languid at times but that is typical of flair players and I would rather he leave proper defending to others, and concentrate on putting them in the onion bag.
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I'd rather see Pete up front from the start but we know that won't happen mate. He's better than both Long and Lukaku and his versatility is holding us back to a certain extent. Luckily Long and Lukaku have been mostly excellent up front so we can't really tell what we're missing.
how do you work out that odemwingie is better than long? you must see a different game to what i see, odemwingie as only had one good game this season that was against chelsea, he was less than average against sunderland and absolutely woeful at swansea and deserved to be dropped against stoke, and steve clarke does know what he is doing and will become a top class manager.
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how do you work out that odemwingie is better than long? you must see a different game to what i see, odemwingie as only had one good game this season that was against chelsea, he was less than average against sunderland and absolutely woeful at swansea and deserved to be dropped against stoke, and steve clarke does know what he is doing and will become a top class manager.
Don't do it! the "who's better" road is long and painful, when you get out the other side you'll be shadows of your former selves!
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Don't do it! the "who's better" road is long and painful, when you get out the other side you'll be shadows of your former selves!
Well said
How many times do debates on here turn into him v him , horses courses pegs holes.
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I think Steve made the most sensible comment on recent form... 'if we had played Sunderland away and got a point, Swansea away and got a point and Stoke at home and got a point we would be exactly where we are...because we have lost 2 on the bounce we have a problem' I do believe we have a very wise and shrewd man in charge.
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post this again after we beat Arsenal!
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Unfortunately I wasn't able to see the Swansea game, but from what I have seen on here, this is my opinion of P.O. that night. There are now many blogs about how he has improved his defensive duties.This means covering both ends of the pitch. He has always been a flair striker, therefore the extra energy he is using to carry out the new defensive role is bound to be taxing his reserves initially. He is not a 90 minute running machine. This was a midweek game,so little time for recovery.He needed a rest he didn't get it!.This theory also applies to other non regular players, they need to build stamina. Give the lads a break please!
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My only gripe with Steve Clarke is the fact he doesnt play with out and out wingers ,
for us to break down teams like Stoke City and Westham then we need players like Thomas and El Ghanassy.
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My only gripe with Steve Clarke is the fact he doesnt play with out and out wingers ,
for us to break down teams like Stoke City and Westham then we need players like Thomas and El Ghanassy.
Steve Clarke dont think so and he is the manager :P
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My only gripe with Steve Clarke is the fact he doesnt play with out and out wingers ,
for us to break down teams like Stoke City and Westham then we need players like Thomas and El Ghanassy.
Why? To aim crosses at Shane Long who is not the tallest??
I personally think one of SC strong points so far is he reads the game and changes formations during the game to suit. I would much rather have Gera, Mozza, Odemwingie running at a defence with Long being a menace it has served us well and we have had SOME praise from media as to how well we are playing and how organized we have looked.
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Quite simply, yes he knows what his doing, its December and we're 5th in the league. FFS what a mental question.
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SC: “I’m not looking for a response, I’m expecting it,”
I love this quote.
In answer to the original question. Does he know what he is doing? Yes he does and we are lucky to have him.
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he is a new manager so is still learning.
on the whole i think he does know what hes doing, the football is good, they look organised, together and respect him!
my gripe is similar to some voiced before, lack of use of odemwingie, for me hes either upfront or hes on the bench, doesnt give enough cover on the wing plus he isn a genuine match winner and can win games even when he has played poor.
I also think we use Lukaku to much, id rather him play odemwingie through the middle, he has 5 goals for the Albion, but is wasteful of chances and sometimes his control is woeful! no doubt in the boys talent but in my opinion he should be behind odemwingie in pecking order!
I think Lukaku scored 5 goals in how much playing time???? about 400 min
Long has scored 5 goals in how much playing time??? about 900 min
Dont blame the 19 year-old kid. You should be glad he is with us!!
He only become better in years !!!
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I think Lukaku scored 5 goals in how much playing time???? about 400 min
Long has scored 5 goals in how much playing time??? about 900 min
Dont blame the 19 year-old kid. You should be glad he is with us!!
He only become better in years !!!
5/6 months.... that is the only time that matters. I don't care about 2 years from now when he's a Chelsea player.
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I haven't got too many complaints so far under SC but I'm sick of seeing long balls punted forward from the back, in Morrison,Gera,Brunt,Yacob etc we have midfielders who are decent on the ball so why do we take the long route fat too often?.Basic football like that at this level wont work.
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I haven't got too many complaints so far under SC but I'm sick of seeing long balls punted forward from the back, in Morrison,Gera,Brunt,Yacob etc we have midfielders who are decent on the ball so why do we take the long route fat too often?.Basic football like that at this level wont work.
It's worked for Stoke..
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It's worked for Stoke..
They have players who suit that style, harder stronger players if you like. I couldn't see some of ours playing for them could you?
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I think he needs to tweak us a bit more, were to easy to play against at the moment. Swansea just pressed us and passed round us for fun, Stoke didnt give us any space, and Arsenal just did the same as Swansea. I am a bit worried that he dosent have a plan B. Its ok to sit back and counter attack when its 0-0 but like today we were clueless going forward when 1-0 behind. When he arrived he promised nice attacking football, at the moment were trying to do that but I feel we have the wrong players for it. Reid and McAuley are the big culprits of hoofing it forward ,, this tells me that they are uncomfortable on the ball. Think he needs to add a few more players in January.
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I think he needs to tweak us a bit more, were to easy to play against at the moment. Swansea just pressed us and passed round us for fun, Stoke didnt give us any space, and Arsenal just did the same as Swansea. I am a bit worried that he dosent have a plan B. Its ok to sit back and counter attack when its 0-0 but like today we were clueless going forward when 1-0 behind. When he arrived he promised nice attacking football, at the moment were trying to do that but I feel we have the wrong players for it. Reid and McAuley are the big culprits of hoofing it forward ,, this tells me that they are uncomfortable on the ball. Think he needs to add a few more players in January.
Olsson is just as bad.
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I'm starting to get worried by Clarke's positive view of things 'its important not to let negativity creep in' .... OK but its also important to be realistic. If everyone believes everything is still rosey because we are 5th then it sounds a bit complacent.
He should be (and hope he is) ensuring a serious reaction to 3 successive defeats and 3 successive subdued peformances.
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I'm starting to get worried by Clarke's positive view of things 'its important not to let negativity creep in' .... OK but its also important to be realistic. If everyone believes everything is still rosey because we are 5th then it sounds a bit complacent.
He should be (and hope he is) ensuring a serious reaction to 3 successive defeats and 3 successive subdued peformances.
At the same time complete pessimism does no one any good either, these are points we didn't get last year and (if you remember to when he came) the aim of improvement was to get to 50 pts. As I put in the put in perspective thread we are 4pts ahead from last year in the same games with a higher goals for and only slightly higher goals against, so that suggests to me that we are dead on track to get what was expected at the start of the season.
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At the same time complete pessimism does no one any good either, these are points we didn't get last year and (if you remember to when he came) the aim of improvement was to get to 50 pts. As I put in the put in perspective thread we are 4pts ahead from last year in the same games with a higher goals for and only slightly higher goals against, so that suggests to me that we are dead on track to get what was expected at the start of the season.
I've got no wish to knock SC and we are in a great position but think its important to concentrate on current form not feel satisfied with the fact that we are in a better place than we thought we'd be.
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People say we are still fifth which is great BUT Norwich, in 11th place are only FOUR points behind us now !
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People say we are still fifth which is great BUT Norwich, in 11th place are only FOUR points behind us now !
which is no different to what the table has looked like over the last 2/3 seasons. the pack always gets close in December.
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You win 2 or 3 games and you can quickly shoot up the table, likewise if you lose a few games you can quickly be nearing the bottom three, its always tight.
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Not going to criticise the bloke as we are way above where we and everyone else expected us to be. I do think this run of three losing games will come to an end next week but there is something just not clicking at the moment.
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Don't worry too much. Swansea were on top of their game, Stoke is always a disaster and Arsenal away is always difficult.
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I believe Clarke will turn us around, were due a good performance and win and I'm hoping the West ham game will be like the Southampton game a few weeks ago.
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Bloody hell, three defeats on the bounce - against your bogey team, against a side which gained from poor refereeing decisions and a side that no one likes playing against - and some of you are crying already! You are FIFTH!! Do you want to swap with us?
Obviously I don't know what exactly is going on at WBA but blimey - get a grip some of you. It isn't just this board either; WBAUnofficial is in meltdown. Relax and enjoy being where you are.
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Bloody hell, three defeats on the bounce - against your bogey team, against a side which gained from poor refereeing decisions and a side that no one likes playing against - and some of you are crying already! You are FIFTH!! Do you want to swap with us?
Obviously I don't know what exactly is going on at WBA but blimey - get a grip some of you. It isn't just this board either; WBAUnofficial is in meltdown. Relax and enjoy being where you are.
It's just human nature. Fans have little to say when everything is going perfectly, but every dropped point is an opportunity for critique. This reaction is mild compared to the complaints about Roy Hodgson around this time last year.
And to echo others, I don't care for the title of this thread. It's the westbrom.com equivalent of a headline from The Sun.
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It's just human nature. Fans have little to say when everything is going perfectly, but every dropped point is an opportunity for critique. This reaction is mild compared to the complaints about Roy Hodgson around this time last year.
And to echo others, I don't care for the title of this thread. It's the westbrom.com equivalent of a headline from The Sun.
Spot on. Some of my relatives who've followed Albion for decades - including my aunt, who used to crawl under the gates back in the Fifties to get in and watch the match for free (she's from Warley, so you have to expect it ;D ) - have been biding their time while the points were accruing, just waiting for the first run of bad form so they could have a go at Clarke, because they're critical by their nature. These are people who, like me, have followed the club through the dark days of Woking, Gould, Twerton Park etc; they're not plastic fans, they're no more fickle than any other football fan in the country, they just have strong opinions about the club that they love. I personally disagree with them, and as someone who wholeheartedly believes in Steve Clarke, I'll take great pleasure in reminding them of their lack of faith when things start looking up for us again. I'm sure they'll appreciate that magnanimity :P
Liam, while I understand your point, you have to bear in mind that your argument could equally be applied to the recent trials and tribulations of Wolves fans if they were viewed by fans of, let's say, Sheffield United, or Coventry, or Portsmouth, or Plymouth, or Luton. There's always someone worse off than you, and too many of us take that for granted each and every day.
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Hey first I'd like to say the topic of this thread is way OTT! then secondly that this isn't a brunt bashing post. But from what I've read, and the games I have seen, would it be Gera and brunt who need to be dropped, I'm hearing we lack drive and pace going forward. During the Sunderland game I was frustrated at how attacks slowed down through the two of them, so maybe when the squads at full strength we should go with mulumbu and yacob sitting, then an attacking three of Pete, Morrison and dorrans? And try to settle the midfield a bit? I know injuries haven't really helped.
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I would keep Gera but Dorrans does have a burst of pace over the 1st 10-15 yards and can go past a player which Brunt for one doesn't have. Although his form's been patchy maybe it's time for him to get more game time.
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To be honest, injuries/suspensions obviously can affect, I'd just like to see the midfield settled a bit, impossible and I love gera but he seems to be strugglig to keep up and brunt when not on form IMO is a massive passenger
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I think Clarke does know what he is doing! 5th in the league would suggest that! I think the 4 game winning run created expectation more than what it perhaps should be (i include myself in that too) in our last 9 games i think we have won 4, lost 5, if we had spread that out as lost, won, lost, won, lost, won, lost, won, lost then it looks about right for a team of our abilities but because we won had that run, the defeats since have come as a kick in the teeth.
We now have two home games where i would like to think we will win both, i know Norwich and West Ham are going well but realistically home game against both we should be looking to win. My concern at the moment would be we are conceding a lot of goals and not looking like scoring any and that is probably a confidence thing, take a 1-0 scrappy win against West Ham next week and we start again.
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If we can go on another good run, then it will show that Clarke can get this team to bounce back. I have faith in him that he can do that as we have done it before.
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If we can go on another good run, then it will show that Clarke can get this team to bounce back. I have faith in him that he can do that as we have done it before.
More than happy with what Clarke has done so far.
However, it is in this run of defeats than he must learn his most important lessons and lot about the attitudes of our players which he will hopefully put to good use for the rest of the season.
We have some very tricky matches coming up and we need to arrest the slide sooner rather than later - make no mistake, anyone who has seen us in the last three matches will know that we looked more like a bottom three side than a top ten one !
Our attacking play has been near non-existant and the midfield looks weak which is very worrying.
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I think Clarke does know what he is doing! 5th in the league would suggest that! I think the 4 game winning run created expectation more than what it perhaps should be (i include myself in that too) in our last 9 games i think we have won 4, lost 5, if we had spread that out as lost, won, lost, won, lost, won, lost, won, lost then it looks about right for a team of our abilities but because we won had that run, the defeats since have come as a kick in the teeth.
We now have two home games where i would like to think we will win both, i know Norwich and West Ham are going well but realistically home game against both we should be looking to win. My concern at the moment would be we are conceding a lot of goals and not looking like scoring any and that is probably a confidence thing, take a 1-0 scrappy win against West Ham next week and we start again.
I believe Foster will be back on Saturday who (imo) will make a vast difference - it will bring back that confidence that I believe has been the missing ingredient of late .
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Bloody hell, three defeats on the bounce - against your bogey team, against a side which gained from poor refereeing decisions and a side that no one likes playing against - and some of you are crying already! You are FIFTH!! Do you want to swap with us?
Obviously I don't know what exactly is going on at WBA but blimey - get a grip some of you. It isn't just this board either; WBAUnofficial is in meltdown. Relax and enjoy being where you are.
Best post on this thread is from a Wolves fan.
We'll be alright, I think a few too many people may have got carried away with the European dream.
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Best post on this thread is from a Wolves fan.
We'll be alright, I think a few too many people may have got carried away with the European dream.
Bloody hell a Wovles fan says it all, "Relax and enjoy where you are" If and it is a BIG IF we are in the bottom 3 then we can start to worry.
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I believe Foster will be back on Saturday who (imo) will make a vast difference - it will bring back that confidence that I believe has been the missing ingredient of late .
I think there may be a surprising amount of truth in this (about the confidence with foster back, not whether he will be, which I don't know.)
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Best post on this thread is from a Wolves fan.
We'll be alright, I think a few too many people may have got carried away with the European dream.
sometimes you need someone looking in to see the true scale. Rather than many looking out.
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What an embarrassing thread. Reminds we of the "Would you keep Roy next season?" thread.
I'll answer the question for you. Yes he knows what he's doing; look where we are in the table. Does he make mistakes? Of course he does it's his first year as a manager - all managers make mistakes.
Seriously this is good as it will probably get for our club and the majority of people seem depressed.
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What an embarrassing thread. Reminds we of the "Would you keep Roy next season?" thread.
I'll answer the question for you. Yes he knows what he's doing; look where we are in the table. Does he make mistakes? Of course he does it's his first year as a manager - all managers make mistakes.
Seriously this is good as it will probably get for our club and the majority of people seem depressed.
The other question is WHY?
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What an embarrassing thread. Reminds we of the "Would you keep Roy next season?" thread.
I'll answer the question for you. Yes he knows what he's doing; look where we are in the table. Does he make mistakes? Of course he does it's his first year as a manager - all managers make mistakes.
Seriously this is good as it will probably get for our club and the majority of people seem depressed.
I don't agree with the topic or the title but it has created some good discussion which is after all the whole point of a forum like this and makes a change from some of the usual pointless one word stuff that gets posted on here and some of the one word or one line responses those topics seem to get which do nothing other than up peoples post counts.
As such these topics are just as welcome as others.
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One thing I would like Clarke to work on is our ball retention. Of late, it has been poor, in-fact, for the majority of the season it has been poor and perhaps our biggest downfall of the season so far. It appears to be that when sides are quick to press our midfield we don't have the composure to keep it and tend to hoof it in any aimless direction and therefore give the ball to the opposition. Another thing I have noticed of late is the sloppiness of our passing, it just seems to one paced and sloppy with such little conviction with the Mulumbu, Olsson, McAuley, Reid, Brunt and Morrison being the guilty culprits of late. It is something we need to work on as we haven't been good enough with the ball but apart from that, I have little complaints. Something isn't working at the moment and it's up to Steve Clarke to address that and quickly.
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I can understand why this thread has started as three defeats and three very poor performances will start some worry and concern, I'm a bit worried about the way we have played, but I think we will turn things around we due a due a few goals and a win.
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I don't agree with the topic or the title but it has created some good discussion which is after all the whole point of a forum like this and makes a change from some of the usual pointless one word stuff that gets posted on here and some of the one word or one line responses those topics seem to get which do nothing other than up peoples post counts.
As such these topics are just as welcome as others.
It's created such a lot of discussion because it's a ridiculous question.
This discussion could have occurred in the the main Steve Clarke thread.
The other question is WHY?
I have no idea, but we have peaked as a club at the moment, unfortunately that means we've hit a ceiling and can no longer improve (significantly at least), so some are never going to be happy supporting this club, which is fine, but you ruin it for the rest of us.
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I couldn't care if its ridiculous or not, the forum is here for discussion, its created discussion, whatever the reason for it creating it is irrelevant.
Don't like the topic, don't post in it.
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It's created such a lot of discussion because it's a ridiculous question.
This discussion could have occurred in the the main Steve Clarke thread.
I have no idea, but we have peaked as a club at the moment, unfortunately that means we've hit a ceiling and can no longer improve (significantly at least), so some are never going to be happy supporting this club, which is fine, but you ruin it for the rest of us.
I was asking Why are the fans depressed!
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I was asking Why are the fans depressed!
I have no idea
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Well we agree some fans will never be happy
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Teams of sussed us out so its up to Steve Clarke to change it ,
our 2 most skillful players at the club are Thomas and El Ghanassy where one has been shipped out
to Leeds Utd and the other cant even make the bench.
playing this narrow midfield sh@@@ is really starting to get on my cake.
I want to see Thomas brought back from his loan spell and Jara-Reyes and El Ghanassy given a chance.
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He didn't versus the Arsenal...
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This is the first chance this season for the negative doom & gloom mongers to come out and play. The ones who claim to be Albion, yet only appear on here when things go wrong. So welcome back lads, you've not been missed, but you have been notable by your absence!
Losing away to Swansea and Arsenal is nothing to be embarrassed about and I think any neutral person would have said a draw was fair against Stoke.
We got lucky a few times previously and things are evening out a bit, plus the team were always going to have a lull, all teams do.
The next three matches are West Ham, Norwich and QPR. If we can get 4 points then we’ll be on 30 by the half way point. A fantastic achievement.
SC will make mistakes and will learn from then, but I for one am very happy with his input.
We’ll survive easily this year and finish about 12th at worst I think. We may even be safe by February as I honestly believe about 37 points will see anyone ok.
Keep the faith and enjoy a positive period for us. 8) ;)
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i wonder what some fans were expecting at this stage of the season with a coach in his first ever managerial job! top of the league with a 9 point gap!!
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Lets be honest, im pretty sure SC isn't the one telling the defense before game to lump it upto a 5'6 striker, and telling brunt to drift inside......when they cross the line the players are the ones to be held accountable and considering we have lost 5 out the last 9 and he has rotated and gave chances to others, then it's the players who dont know what they're doing if you will.
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i've read this thread with interest and astonishment and i have to say i'm with KingKoren it is ridiculous but it as caused discussion,
so my take on it is this won 4 on bounce lost 3 on bounce would this thread have been started if we had say WLWLWLW or WLLWWWL i would very much doubt it so really it is ridiculous but people obviously want to discuss it so fair's fair
but all i will say is the only reason this thread was probably started was because the expectation went through the roof when it shouldn't have done we knoe what we are but were not ready for EUROPE yet
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Imo, We don't need or won't Europe at this stage - hang on maybe the players have come to the same realisation!? ofcourse not, silly me. ::)
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Some good news for Steve Clarke.
Clarke to face no disciplinary action from FA for comments made about Mike Jones post-Arsenal game. #wba
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This is the first chance this season for the negative doom & gloom mongers to come out and play. The ones who claim to be Albion, yet only appear on here when things go wrong. So welcome back lads, you've not been missed, but you have been notable by your absence!
Losing away to Swansea and Arsenal is nothing to be embarrassed about and I think any neutral person would have said a draw was fair against Stoke.
We got lucky a few times previously and things are evening out a bit, plus the team were always going to have a lull, all teams do.
The next three matches are West Ham, Norwich and QPR. If we can get 4 points then we’ll be on 30 by the half way point. A fantastic achievement.
SC will make mistakes and will learn from then, but I for one am very happy with his input.
We’ll survive easily this year and finish about 12th at worst I think. We may even be safe by February as I honestly believe about 37 points will see anyone ok.
Keep the faith and enjoy a positive period for us. 8) ;)
I don't want to knock Clarke either and not happy with the thread title but current form is bound to be a discussion point at any time. Regardless of the difficulty of the last 3 games , the performances have been pretty poor and there have been some selections that have raised eye brows....hence the discussion.
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my only criticism would be too many unforced changes.
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It's a discussion forum! It does not say he does 'NOT' know what he is doing...
It's just asking for peoples opinion for review and discussion. I believe SC is doing a great job and we should trust in our managers decisions during the whole season. It's a tough game out and not always do decisions always pay off!
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This is the first chance this season for the negative doom & gloom mongers to come out and play. The ones who claim to be Albion, yet only appear on here when things go wrong. So welcome back lads, you've not been missed, but you have been notable by your absence!
Losing away to Swansea and Arsenal is nothing to be embarrassed about and I think any neutral person would have said a draw was fair against Stoke.
We got lucky a few times previously and things are evening out a bit, plus the team were always going to have a lull, all teams do.
The next three matches are West Ham, Norwich and QPR. If we can get 4 points then we’ll be on 30 by the half way point. A fantastic achievement.
SC will make mistakes and will learn from then, but I for one am very happy with his input.
We’ll survive easily this year and finish about 12th at worst I think. We may even be safe by February as I honestly believe about 37 points will see anyone ok.
Keep the faith and enjoy a positive period for us. 8) ;)
You can say what you like about people coming and going to the board, but versus Arsenal anyone that takes a team there and play like we did, the manager doesn't know what he is doing. Forget the position we are in the league as that can vanish within just a few games, it's no good resting on our laurals as people have sussed the way baggies play we have to change before West Ham game, if we don't then any points at all in the next three games is going to be a big ask.
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Generally he does, some of his tactics this season have been positive, we have invariably taken the game to the opposition as we did against Man City which ended in us losing because of going for the win. That can be put down to inexperience from Clarke, but he will learn. Our tactics have possibly become a bit stale and predictable though, I think in the first half of the season we were surprising a few teams simply because of how well organised we were defensively and how much flair we had going forwards. A team does not become bad overnight though, the same is true for a manager, I think he is the best man for the job right now because he is ambitious and seems to command the respect of the players. Would like to see varying tactics though as we did under Roy last season, it kept things fresh and prevented us from becoming predictable, which we desperately need to avoid. As said before in this post, our league position means nothing as it can change in an instance. No need to panic yet though, he shows all of the signs of being a very good coach and will one day be a top rate manager.
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You can say what you like about people coming and going to the board, but versus Arsenal anyone that takes a team there and play like we did, the manager doesn't know what he is doing. Forget the position we are in the league as that can vanish within just a few games, it's no good resting on our laurals as people have sussed the way baggies play we have to change before West Ham game, if we don't then any points at all in the next three games is going to be a big ask.
How many teams come away from Arsenal with anything? And you say forget what position we are in, it took us to February I think to get to 26 points last season (where we also lost 3-0 at Arsenal and Swansea as well as losing at home to Stoke 1-0, sound familiar?), we was there in November this year! He has also just been named manager of the month in just his 4th month in management but dont let those facts get in the way!
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You can say what you like about people coming and going to the board, but versus Arsenal anyone that takes a team there and play like we did, the manager doesn't know what he is doing. Forget the position we are in the league as that can vanish within just a few games, it's no good resting on our laurals as people have sussed the way baggies play we have to change before West Ham game, if we don't then any points at all in the next three games is going to be a big ask.
I totally agree and have Albion fans realised we`re the only team in the whole league without any
proper pacy winger ?
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I totally agree and have Albion fans realised we`re the only team in the whole league without any
proper pacy winger ?
It's served us fairly well so far.
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How many teams come away from Arsenal with anything? And you say forget what position we are in, it took us to February I think to get to 26 points last season (where we also lost 3-0 at Arsenal and Swansea as well as losing at home to Stoke 1-0, sound familiar?), we was there in November this year! He has also just been named manager of the month in just his 4th month in management but dont let those facts get in the way!
Taking it in that context, it would have done no harm to give the Arsenal game a good go would it? You could travel back another year as it makes not a scrap of difference as it's in the past did we not beat them 3-2 including a missed penalty. It's because of where we are now, today, that these games are worth contesting to the best of our ability to protect the position we hold, don't go to places with the same old suck and blow routine, they soon cotton on. The annoying thing is we have the personnel to play various types of football.
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Taking it in that context, it would have done no harm to give the Arsenal game a good go would it? You could travel back another year as it makes not a scrap of difference as it's in the past did we not beat them 3-2 including a missed penalty. It's because of where we are now, today, that these games are worth contesting to the best of our ability to protect the position we hold, don't go to places with the same old suck and blow routine, they soon cotton on. The annoying thing is we have the personnel to play various types of football.
Stoke make a living out of it and no-one cottons on, especially us!
The referee made sure we was never going to be in the game, who knows if we had got to 0-0 half time with the crowd on their backs, if panic had set in due to frustration we may just have got something or if the ref had given us the penalty that was and them not gettting the penalty that wasnt. Not many teams go to Emirates and play Arsenal off the park sometimes you have to dig in and hold on in the hope you can nick something later on. But back on subject, you judge the manager over the 15 or so games in charge and he DOES know what he is doing.
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apart from one good cross onto mozzas head in the last few games brunt needs dropping /recall jt back from leeds proper winger who hugs the touchline /no good saying if we had got to half time at 0-0 who knows what could have happened the fact is we were rubbish alarmingly constant giving the ball away and too much hoofing out of defence hope fosters back aswell also wouldn;t mind seeing pete and long swapped around just think odemwingies more natural down the middle and long;s got pace to burn >:(
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Stoke make a living out of it and no-one cottons on, especially us!
The referee made sure we was never going to be in the game, who knows if we had got to 0-0 half time with the crowd on their backs, if panic had set in due to frustration we may just have got something or if the ref had given us the penalty that was and them not gettting the penalty that wasnt. Not many teams go to Emirates and play Arsenal off the park sometimes you have to dig in and hold on in the hope you can nick something later on. But back on subject, you judge the manager over the 15 or so games in charge and he DOES know what he is doing.
I don't think that Stoke really play in the same way every game, sure they can play a lot of 'ugly' football but when they put a mind to it they can play some really good stuff too, quite adaptable in fact. The if buts and maybe's of whether we had got to half time with the score at 0-0 are precicely that...if, but's and maybe's. I would prefer to think that had we been in their faces then the score would have remained 0-0 at half time, as I said earlier nobody should go to the Emirates and stand off 'em..it is footballing suicide, so back on subject I firmly believe he didn't know what he was doing when we played Arsenal.
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http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/keith-downing-hails-west-brom-371480
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http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/keith-downing-hails-west-brom-371480
Sorry ph, but he still didn't know what he was doing at Arsenal.
All the superlatives that are attributed to Steve Clarke are well earned and deserved and I have always said that I don't want him to leave....just change his philosophies from time to time.
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3 defeats on the bounce is just not good enough. I know he has a lot of support but we've just had a lucky start to the season and here comes the downfall, mark my words. Clarke out NOW before it gets any worse. Clueless idiot.
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3 defeats on the bounce is just not good enough. I know he has a lot of support but we've just had a lucky start to the season and here comes the downfall, mark my words. Clarke out NOW before it gets any worse. Clueless idiot.
That just about sums you up. Pathetic dingle with nothing else to do at 1.40am on a Thursday morning than to come on an Albion forum and spout nonsense. Leave that drivel to your set of fans.
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hahaha spotted by the first poster. I am an overseas viewer so its not that time over here! I follow Wigan Athletic, and really wanted to say congratulations on doing so well this season so far! I thought Hodgson gave you a great base defensively and Clarke has added that fast paced offensive element to your game. Maybe if you add a few more quality players in Jan and manage to hold on to Lukaku, Europe could be on the cards? Good luck to you lot anyway. I came over for the West Brom game last season and it was a welcoming place to go. A family club ran in the right way with good finances and a great fan base. Where I'd like to see us lot be one day!
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I totally agree and have Albion fans realised we`re the only team in the whole league without any
proper pacy winger ?
What pacy winger do the vile have/play?.
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What pacy winger do the vile have/play?.
Agbonlahor plays out there a lot and is more than pacy.
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What pacy winger do the vile have/play?.
They have N`Zogbia who`s ripped the Albion apart on many occasion.
Still cant believe Steve Clarke has let Jerome Thomas go out on loan with
this busy christmas period coming up.
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They have N`Zogbia who`s ripped the Albion apart on many occasion.
Still cant believe Steve Clarke has let Jerome Thomas go out on loan with
this busy christmas period coming up.
ugh? thomas as gone on loan so he can get back to match fitness after his injury. makes perfect sense to me.
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Very bold substitutions won us the game.
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Very bold substitutions won us the game.
Bold is not a word I would have used for Steve Clarkes subs yesterday...more calculated I think, as he put them on got the goal that we needed then almost immediately swapped Lukaku for Tamas to shore up the defence....it worked for him for once, well done Mr Clarke, it's nice when a plan comes together.
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i would much rather he makes subs when we are drawing at home to try to win the game or adjust our formation. it cost us a point against city but got us an extra two yesterday.
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Funny how people on this topic have piped down again, not doing bad for a team who have been sussed and a manager who don't know what he's doing are we! See you again no doubt when we lose a couple!
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Over the last couple of games Steve Clarke has really earned his money, we have gone on a little blip but have come back with two great wins, and a much better second half performance against West Ham. Im sure we may go on another little blip this season, but we should all remain confident that Clarke knows how to pick the team up and go on another good run.
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Funny how people on this topic have piped down again, not doing bad for a team who have been sussed and a manager who don't know what he's doing are we! See you again no doubt when we lose a couple!
This is the best quote on this subject.
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This is the best quote on this subject.
Against Arsenal he hadn't got a clue.
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Against Arsenal he hadn't got a clue.
You cant really single out one game every manager will make mistakes. the fact that we have one 10 out of 19 games is the much bigger picture.
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Honestly, I don't know enough about soccer coaching to address the question intelligently -- though that's never stopped me from voicing my opinion on anything footy. But I do admire his humble, game-at-a-time attitude and his relentless emphasis on team play.
Here's a SC quote from today's postgame: "I keep talking about my team and my squad. We don't like to single out individuals."
Inasmuch as Albion's success this year seems to be rooted in a collective, no-prima-donnas effort, SC seems like the right manager at the right time in the right place.
There's my masterful take on the obvious. :D
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Not today I'm afraid, think the decision to bring on Rosenberg and put Mozza out wide cost us.
Team line-ups sometimes perplex me, I know were are short of numbers but starting Dorrans when he quite clearly doesn't want to be here can't help.
Also feel Jones and Brunt are not good enough, always persists with them though.
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some of these team selections are baffling. we are leaking far too many goals and it doesnt look like stopping anytime soon. we need some grit in midfield. I know we dont have Mulumbu or Yacob but we have to find someone that can step up and make a tackle in front of the back four.
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Injuries haven helped him i'll give him that, but he does have a tendancy to play players out of position.....last 10 games have been relegation form and all these late goals were letting in is down to something other than luck, we'll see where we end up and go from there.
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Think Clarke has shown many positives as an up and coming manager, enough to suggest he does know what he is doing. Some of his subs when we have been chasing the game have made a great impact and we a very solid team with a good shape.
However, there are also some big flaws, possibly down to inexperience, that he does need to work on . . . .
I like the idea is changing the side some games to keep the opposition guessing, but at times he is maybe guilty of changing it too much leaving us a little disjointed.
He also seems to struggle with changes, as shown today, to help us see the game out. There have been various occasions this year where we have been comfortable only for Clarke to make a change and is suddenly start coming under increasing pressure.
I think these are things that come with experience, and I'd hope that over time Clarke can iron them out.
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Injuries haven helped him i'll give him that, but he does have a tendancy to play players out of position.....last 10 games have been relegation form and all these late goals were letting in is down to something other than luck, we'll see where we end up and go from there.
This is very disappointing. If we want to improve on where we are we need better players. To attract better players we need strong league positions. This is basic stuff.
I just can't believe it when I hear Clarke say time and time again he is happy with what he has, as clearly quite a few players are not really up to the job if we want to be solid mid table or top half in this league.
Also our fitness levels is a major concern and needs serious work. We get too many injuries and we lack puff at the end of games, leading to stupid mistakes costing goals rather than us scoring goals at the other end.
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This is very disappointing. If we want to improve on where we are we need better players. To attract better players we need strong league positions. This is basic stuff.
I just can't believe it when I hear Clarke say time and time again he is happy with what he has, as clearly quite a few players are not really up to the job if we want to be solid mid table or top half in this league.
Also our fitness levels is a major concern and needs serious work. We get too many injuries and we lack puff at the end of games, leading to stupid mistakes costing goals rather than us scoring goals at the other end.
i said before the game i wasnt confident and got ridiculed for saying so, i said in the after match thread we need a summer clearout as in averge players or ones not getting games etc and also got ridiculed for saying it....it's clearly obvious we need quality players as when our quality plyers arent playing the ones filling in arent up to it... As shown in last 10 games... I wonder if the " double sessions " of training SC had them doing pre-season has anything to do with the players fitness levels as the late goals, hamstring injuries are becoming the norm now.
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I know we have a lot of injuries at the moment but the thing I don't like about Clarke is his fixation with using the squad and dropping players when they've scored or had decent games we were doing so well up untill the Swansea game.
Brian Clough once said"if they are fit you should play your best eleven payers all the time"
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We cannot use illness and injury as an excuse for today. We were winning and should have seen the game out.
We are two goals away from having a negative goal difference for the first time this season. And what's worse, Villa could be the team to inflict it.
I thought today would have been a good chance to go 4-4-2, keep everything tight and hit them on the break. I'm not sure who to blame for today, I'm just angry at the entire club currently.
Olsson certainly never should have made such a clumsy challenge in the box to start with. Then Clarke should have brought a defender on, like Tamas to play in front of the back four to help us keep it tight. Absolutely no need to go searching for a third goal.
We've played well early in the season, but I am beginning to question Clarke's choices recently. If we lose to Villa next week, I will not be held responsible for my actions...
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Maybe SC will learn a harsh lesson from today.
We need to dust ourself off and move on.
Boing Boing!
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Hopefully Clarke would have learnt one or two lessons about today. I have full faith in Clarke im sure we will go on another good run players coming back soon too.
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Until 10 minutes from the end we were in cruise control. Reading will not have a 10 minutes like that again. Only fault I can make of Clarke is when he took Dorrans off Morrison was moved from the middle where he had been excellent and it opened it up. You can't blame Clarke for Olssons challenge.
The back 5 were unchanged, we have a makeshift midfield where only Brunt and Morrison can be considered regulars, we had 2 in there who have been bit part players, Thomas who has been out of the club and Brunt exposed out of position where it again showed, not sure how Clarke can be blamed for it really given the injuries. Up front Lukaku seems to have been the only fit striker and he could easily have had 4 today.
There was someone ready to come on before the penalty who was stripped off, not sure if it was Tamas or Popov so he was trying to do something.
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Next week against Villa SC will drop Lukaku and play Long 100% guaranteed.
2 wins in 10 is poor and shows me he`s loosing the plot.
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Manager's are only generally as good as the players on the pitch.
Our team is probably bottom 6 standard until we get Yaob, Mulumbu, Popov back and Olsson match fit.
Peace's policy of "topping up" in Jan window is going to cost us. This squad need shaking up massively.
We have a lot of championship level players and others who are brilliant Premiership players namely PO, YM, CY, GP, JO, BF.
The problem for us is the championship gang are now starting matches regularly.
Still, I don't think Clarke is ruthless enough.
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The squad was good enough at the start of the season and is good enough now. Unfortunately as happens to all clubs injuries have not helped us.
We massively over-achieved at the start of the season, if we had lost the first 6 or 7 and been bottom half to middle of the table people would be happy enough with our realistic position.
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The squad was good enough at the start of the season and is good enough now. Unfortunately as happens to all clubs injuries have not helped us.
We massively over-achieved at the start of the season, if we had lost the first 6 or 7 and been bottom half to middle of the table people would be happy enough with our realistic position.
indeed
You could make a very good 11 from players who are either out the team or injured?
Again we lose and "we need to spend now" or "Clark needs to learn" I just hope that when he comes on here for advice (he must do surely) he still does it his way , cause so far I'm very happy.
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indeed
You could make a very good 11 from players who are either out the team or injured?
Again we lose and "we need to spend now" or "Clark needs to learn" I just hope that when he comes on here for advice (he must do surely) he still does it his way , cause so far I'm very happy.
It's obvious we're being "dragged down" by certain players that are incompetent at this level. I posted prior to Reading we could lose all of the next 3, now we face QPR and Villa.
Surely by now 12/1/13, after 6 months in job Clarke knows which players he can trust?
Tackling ability in midfield is a real issue. This managment lark is money for old rope.
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one of the issues i have with clarke is the amount of possesion we give to the opposition even poor sides like reading and qpr will have the ball more than us which only gives them oppertunties which reading took to day
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The squad was good enough at the start of the season and is good enough now. Unfortunately as happens to all clubs injuries have not helped us.
We massively over-achieved at the start of the season, if we had lost the first 6 or 7 and been bottom half to middle of the table people would be happy enough with our realistic position.
I don't buy this "over-achieved" thing, no we didn't we got where we were on merit we haven't been able to sustain that effort due to injuries largely but also now due to sloppiness, stupid managerial decisions and an inability to play for ninety minutes.
Our first choice team is very good but our squad outside of the twelve / thirteen players is awful at this level.
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I don't buy this "over-achieved" thing, no we didn't we got where we were on merit we haven't been able to sustain that effort due to injuries largely but also now due to sloppiness, stupid managerial decisions and an inability to play for ninety minutes.
Our first choice team is very good but our squad outside of the twelve / thirteen players is awful at this level.
I don't think I said we haven't got where we are on merit as its obvious we have.
The squad is not a top 6 squad and now we're having injuries its showing and we're dropping back to our realistic levels. Of course our players will be guilty of sloppiness at times, if not they wouldn't be here they be at a bigger club. The inability to play for 90 minutes is a concern and one that needs sorting.
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I don't buy this "over-achieved" thing, no we didn't we got where we were on merit we haven't been able to sustain that effort due to injuries largely but also now due to sloppiness, stupid managerial decisions and an inability to play for ninety minutes.
Our first choice team is very good but our squad outside of the twelve / thirteen players is awful at this level.
that has to be main priority to strenghten overall squad need more cover at the back need natural width and a quality striker for when lukaku goes back to chelsea
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Brave decisions need to be made regarding outgoing and incoming players, but Peace has probably had the cigar out since Nov.
We should be entering the transfer market but no-one at the club seems bothered and we have to fend off bids from the bottom team QPR for our better players!!!
In defence of Clarke if Peace bars him from doing any business due to the "January Window Topping Up" school of thought, then we'll only improve when Mulumbu and Yacob are re-instated as a partnership.
Clarke's mission is probably just to avoid relegation and since Nov he's had massive credit in the bank for 12/13.
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How do you know the club aren't bothered about bringing anyone in ? How many times have we heard that we will sign no-one and then announce a signing ? Do you prefer we do all or business in public like QPR going for players they have no chance of getting at discount prices ?
The fact QPR could if they tried hard enough to attract players and pay their wages is the bloke at the top with the money, more money than we can dream of and how they have gone about things proves how lucky we are with Peace and that's something I never thought I would say.
I'd rather carry on picking up the bargains in Mulumbu, Yacob, McAuley, Olsson etc etc and spend on the odd one here and there like Long and Foster than go about it the QPR way.
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How do you know the club aren't bothered about bringing anyone in ? How many times have we heard that we will sign no-one and then announce a signing ? Do you prefer we do all or business in public like QPR going for players they have no chance of getting at discount prices ?
The fact QPR could if they tried hard enough to attract players and pay their wages is the bloke at the top with the money, more money than we can dream of and how they have gone about things proves how lucky we are with Peace and that's something I never thought I would say.
I'd rather carry on picking up the bargains in Mulumbu, Yacob, McAuley, Olsson etc etc and spend on the odd one here and there like Long and Foster than go about it the QPR way.
I'm not advocating the QPR method. (By the way I hope they don't sign PO).
I just think we're going down a slippery slope with some players. I think there's complacency and players expecting to start matches regardless of how they perform.
I'm unconvinced and underwhelmed by Gera, Brunt, Dorrans, Rosenberg, Ridgewell, Jones. And the jury is out on people we haven't seen much if this season Thomas, Thorne, Reid, Fortune, Dawson.
Nearly all of these are starting and today there was no Yacob, Odemwingie, Mulumbu, Popov, Long all stars from earlier in the season.
We might as well go 4-3-3. Steve Clarke seems to shy away from the tough decisions.
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Need to get back to basics. SC is not Mourinho, and we are not Real Madrid. Rosenberg is just not up to this level. What's wrong with ridgwell Rb and popov Lb,seems obvious.
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my only worry is the obsession with bringing rosenberg on and playing him out of position. today he moves morrison who was superb to accomodate a sub he thought we could get away with. wether clarke as asked for funds we do not know but seeing how weak our midfield is at the moment and continually seeing people like fortune playing wide is baffling.
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I said last week that Clarke needs to sort out this problem of conceding late goals. The players have responsibilities when switching off or getting complacent but ultimately it is the manager's responsibility to resolve the problem. In addition, not for the first time has SC's substitutions caused us to concede in the final minutes, why on earth bring on a striker who so far has been a miserable failure to replace a midfielder who has more defensive qualities?
Many of us had our doubts whether SC could step up from second coach to head coach/manager and I think it is fair to say that there are big question marks over his ability to manage at the top level now.
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I said last week that Clarke needs to sort out this problem of conceding late goals. The players have responsibilities when switching off or getting complacent but ultimately it is the manager's responsibility to resolve the problem. In addition, not for the first time has SC's substitutions caused us to concede in the final minutes, why on earth bring on a striker who so far has been a miserable failure to replace a midfielder who has more defensive qualities?
Many of us had our doubts whether SC could step up from second coach to head coach/manager and I think it is fair to say that there are big question marks over his ability to manage at the top level now.
Well he brought on an extra defender against QPR and that worked well didn't it?
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Well he brought on an extra defender against QPR and that worked well didn't it?
Yes but we didn't concede 3 late goals :-[
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Yes but we didn't concede 3 late goals :-[
I didn't realise all three goals were a result of that substitution.
Sack him.
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I didn't realise all three goals were a result of that substitution.
Sack him.
You're being silly.
The point is, yes we conceded a late equaliser at QPR but we didn't completely collapse like today. Conceding three goals in ten minutes whilst 2-0 up against a team bottom of the league isn't something you can accept under any circumstances from a club seventh in the league. All we had to do was shut up shop, get me behind the ball and close space either that or keep the ball.
Why bring Rosenburg on and move Morrison? What we were doing was working. If we had to make a change bring on a defender.
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It's a completely fair point... I don't think your over reacting or calling for Clarke's head at all, you do have to question in this one game how the hell that happened. Perhaps it wasn't at all to do with Clarke's tac-tics maybe players letting themselves down with their own duties which looks more likely to be the case, bringing Rosenburg on was naive in thinking we had the game sewn up so we'll give this chap a 10 minute run out which probably wasn't the right thing to do but thats football sometimes you take one in the guts and its really hurts all everyone can do is pick themselves up and get ready for a massive week and don't dwell.
Come on you Baggies!
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How anyone can blame the Rosenberg substitution is beyond me. I didn't see Rosenberg switch off at the back post, or concede a penalty.
It's not Clarke's fault - it's the players who where already back in the changing room. I've never been so angry at a defeat than this.
The players owe us a big result - better start next week.
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In short, yes, dammit, SC does know the hell what he's doing. Jesus peesus! >:( You can't blame one player sub for today's catastrophe. SC had good reason to think we were fairly secure in the game. Whatever you may think of Rosenberg -- and I'm not especially excited about him -- he's not some fricking supernatural points vampire who comes on like the devil's own and destroys us.
If you're looking for one person to shoulder the most blame (and I don't actually think that's fair as there is blame to go around), there is little question that person is Jonas Olsson. He made a horrendous tackle on Jimmy Kébé for a well-deserved penalty. With his aggression destroyed -- or was it just fatigue? -- he was too timid when covering Alex Pearce as Ian Harte's free kick came in for the game-winner, from what I could see. I love Jonas, but he clearly made some terrible mistakes. Again, I don't see the point in piling on Jonas, but to blame Clarke -- utterly absurd.
I feel so bad for Lukaku and Morrison, and even Foster, for that matter. Their teammates really let them down!
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We hear increasing talk about Clarke's 'obsession' with playing strikers out of position.
In my view it works in some cases (eg Odemwingie, Fortuné), but not in others (eg Rosenberg).
However well you think it works, though, it's unreasonable to paint this as some kind of quirk of Clarke's. He has (mainly inherited) a squad with a surfeit of good strikers and a deficit of wide players, particularly quick ones. Added to which he has a midfield injury/absence problem.
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I think sometimes his substitutions are a bit baffling but give the bloke credit for the position we are currently in.
However with Popov and Tams on the bench, 2-0 up with 8 minutes to go away from home in my humble the last thing you need is a striker on whose work ethic is based around making sure his socks are pulled up and hi shirt hangs straight and that will never score a goal for us in the Prem whilst he has a hole in his derrier.
Having said that 2 wins in the last 10 games isn't the form that will keep us in the exalted position that we now find ourselves.
I think the players need to look at themselves after today
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I'm a little disappointed with Steve's comments on the official site.
He said he is at loss to explain what happened, well if he doest know then no one does. He also said it was not down to complacency. Well what was Ridgewell doing for their first goal if not being complacent. Also mentioned we should talk about how good we were for 81 minutes, i think you can forget that when we were pathetic in the last 13 minutes.
I hope when he and the coaching staff Analise the performance he is at a loss no more!
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The phrase "rabbit in the headlights" comes to mind.
He's seemingly decided Thomas deserves a run to replace Gera - fair enough.
He's seemingly decided Dorrans and Fortune aren't good enough in long term (injuries permitting) - fair enough.
He's seemingly decided Lukaku is a better option than Long right now - fair enough.
What I don't like is giving Rosenberg his customary 10 mins - why? does he deserve it?
What he sees in Brunt I just don't know? How many games have we won with him in the side?
It's these 2 factors more than anything else that are destroying us right now and he refuses to see it. What's the odds that once other players become available Brunt is retained and Thorne is dispatched back to Peterborough?
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Of course he does ...... Look where we are in the league
He's in his first season as a manager for goodness sake ..... He'll make mistakes but who wouldn't
Let's get real and appreciate where we are and what we've got.
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Of course he does ...... Look where we are in the league
He's in his first season as a manager for goodness sake ..... He'll make mistakes but who wouldn't
Let's get real and appreciate where we are and what we've got.
Let's be honest they are simple mistakes that loads of WBA fans can see. Sometimes the mistakes are made over and over again.
What we've got is a team on a horrendous slide.
Get the best players back and there's no issue as results will sort themselves out. But in the summer get rid of the passengers that are blighting this winter period.
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I wouldn't have put Van Persie on as an extra attacker.
We didn't need to score any more goals.all we had to do was prevent the opposition scoring more than one in the remaining time.So we should have left well alone,gone like for like or put another defender on.
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I wouldn't have put Van Persie on as an extra attacker.
We didn't need to score any more goals.all we had to do was prevent the opposition scoring more than one in the remaining time.So we should have left well alone,gone like for like or put another defender on.
Exactly!!
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I wouldn't have put Van Persie on as an extra attacker.
We didn't need to score any more goals.all we had to do was prevent the opposition scoring more than one in the remaining time.So we should have left well alone,gone like for like or put another defender on.
Man u were leading 1-0 against us, did not need to score any more goals, yet put Van Persie on as an extra attacker.
No surprise what happened next.
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Man u were leading 1-0 against us, did not need to score any more goals, yet put Van Persie on as an extra attacker.
No surprise what happened next.
Van Persie was put on as we started to control the game and look like we might nick a goal... As the second half played out we were the better side yet an inspired substitution from Fergie got them the goal that sealed the win. If they had of been leading 2-0 however I strongly expect Van Persie would have sat on the bench while a defensive minded player came on... This what we should have done while we were coasting to a 2-0 victory at a stadium we hadn't previously won at, but instead we threw on another attacker, lost our composure and chucked it down the sh8tt8r. No excuses just pure stupidity from the gaffer and the team... That doesn't matter anymore, we need to look ahead to the next two crucial games rather than dwell on a stupid, stupid last 8 minutes.
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Give Steve Clarke a break
Under Roy last season .... didn't we have about 26 points at this time.
We've missed Foster, Olsson, Yacob, Mulumbu, Gera & Long for long periods .... 6 players who are a shoe in for the first team.
Midfield defensive pattern badly disrupted with Y & M missing.
Rosenburg hasn't;t lived up to expectations.
Think everyone in the world, players, staff and fans started to believe our own hype how good we are ..... The only one who didn't was Steve Clarke.
Have faith in the bloke and remember ........ If we we're still in a Champions League spot it may we be Steve Clarke who would be out of the door at the end of the season, due to our success ..... careful what you wish for guys .... you may get it.
The bloke deserves our total support ..... Mid table mediocrity had been our dream up until this season .... and virtual survival by Christmas is plain fantasy thinking isn't it.
In "Nobby" we trust
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I think Steve Clarke does know what he is doing.
He is making mistakes same as anybody would in their first job and he will continue to do so. The mistake i think so far have been -
1) Changing the team to often for the sake of it
2) Subs - I think its the old Mourinho trick of always using subs to sway a game, whether to come back or to see it out, rather than sometimes just leaving things as they are. Difference Mourinho had was he had world class players he could always put on in the their natural position, Clarke doesnt have that option.
3) Late goals - I dont think he should take the majority of the blame here, thats down to the blokes on the pitch but maybe he should be asking is there something about the players on the pitch at the time, does a certain players performance level (probably a defender) decrease in the last 15 minutes of games and should they look to replace them then? Can we do something different in our setup, possession, etc (i imagine the coaches are working on it)
I think going forward if he deals with the above he is going to go from being a good coach to a great coach, the 3 points above are things that can be sorted pretty easily too.
I think we have lost our momentum a bit and its no coincidence since Yacob has been out we have stopped playing such good football, i think Thorne has been very good so far, but i think we need somebody who can compete with Yacob who does a similar job because i personally dont think we can rely on Yacob for the whole season and when he is such a big part of us playing well (and thats very noticeable) we need somebody who can do the same job as it appears its crucial to the way we play. If we make one signing this window i hope thats it, if we are being greedy then i hope we get a wideman too, but if we dont i think we have Brunt, Thomas, Fortune, Odemwingie, Lukaku and Dorrans (if he stays) who can all play there and havent let us down yet.
As for saturday and the late goals problem, i said before i dont really blame Clarke, i blame the players on the pitch. It may be partly down to the fact that the defence lost some protection without Yacob but i still think the players on there personal pride should see them through games, you are always going to concede the odd late goal but i think thats 10-11 times so far this season thats happened and i think the players need to have a look at themselves, you should do everything to keep the balls out before it even gets to your box, win your first headers, block crosses, make sure your marking your man, etc. I dont think its them not trying or anything, i just wonder if they are concentrating as much and because we are now safe and job done so to speak whether they have that same desire and pride to match teams like Readings effort and commitment when the pressure is cranked up.
I think we will finish midtable, maybe sneak top half which is a realistic aim for a club like us and a great achievement, i think the downside as fans and probably players there will be the what if? factor as i think we could make top 6 at a push and i hope the players dont look back at the end of the season with any regrets.
Clarkey is doing a good job, important to remember its his first one too and hopefully mistakes he is making, he is learning from!
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When Steve took over Roy Hodgson had already stabilised the team and we looked a good tight outfit and that still showed when Steve Clark took over but now he is changing things and doing it his way and his inexperience is now showing. The swapping and changing of the front line is baffling and I’m not sure the players seem to know what formation we are playing. I still think he will do a good job for the Albion but it’s going to take time it’s a good job we had a good start to the season I still think thanks to Roy Hodgson. The form we are showing now we would be fighting to stop in the division.
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Seems to me that during the bulk of the game, defensively the fullbacks tuck in and we are not too worried about crosses coming in as we know Olsson, McAuley and Foster can deal with them. Trouble is when we are defending a lead in the dying minutes, we seem to get deeper and deeper so the opposition pile players into the box which makes it harder for Olsson, McAuley and Foster to deal with the balls in the same way. We need to be be better at stopping the balls coming in towards the end. Even in the wins against Norwich and QPR , there were dangerous balls coming in at the death and we could easily have lost the lead in those as well.
I can't remember us being under the same sort of seige last season at the end of games as we seemed to close down better and stop the attacks starting.
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"I can't remember us being under the same sort of seige last season at the end of games as we seemed to close down better and stop the attacks starting."
I think in the second half of last season having 3 experienced DM helped in Mulumbu,Sharner and Andrews available.
We have lost our best choices in that position for a few games and it shows.
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Yes he does...most of the time.
Rosenburg for Dorrans smacked of cockiness to me. He thought ' lets go for the 4-0, improve the goal difference and take all the plaudits that will come our way..'
Dorrans' absence left us short in midfield, enabled them to build pressure... and the rest is history.
Absolutely the wrong tactic at that stage in the game.
He looked really shocked and humbled in the press conference and I think deep down he knows he's blown a massive 3 points out the window.
My concern is that we have a really indifferent second half of the season and drift steadily down to 11th/12th and finish on 48/49 points. Realistically I can't see us finishing above Arsenal but would be delighted if we ran Everton close and pipped Liverpool. That would show signs of progress to me.
I think we all want to see small improvements year on year gradually improving the squad and coaching until it really is top six quality.
We need two or three back to backs to turn us round and a good cup run and I , for one, will stop foaming at the mouth!!
If SC can learn from these painful mistakes he will improve and we will improve with him.
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What I don't like is giving Rosenberg his customary 10 mins - why? does he deserve it?
We have a player clearly highly thought of by people within the club (not within the stands obviously), struggling to get pitch time and adjust to Premiership football. Cruising against Reading is an ideal time to bring him on.
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We have a player clearly highly thought of by people within the club (not within the stands obviously), struggling to get pitch time and adjust to Premiership football. Cruising against Reading is an ideal time to bring him on.
He starts tonight
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He starts tonight
Booooo. ::)
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Another baffling performance by the Manger, team selection and subs. I thought he said he owed us one and wanted a cup run.Not so sure with the starting line up he wanted it enough.
Starting to get concerned with players playing out of position and under performing
Loosing the plot?
I cant really remember the last time we played well and we never come out the blocks from the off at home, its more laboured than Roys football
Bitterly disappointed just lately.Its a dam good job we have the points on the board, i wouldnt fancy us having to play catch up
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lets hear another im happy with the first 74 minutes and im happy enough with our squad who cant beat half a qpr team.... very disappointed
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I think SC made a od for his own back by saying he wanted to take the cup seriously and then playing a weakened team against Liverpool and dropping key players tonight.
Ideal chance for a cup run. According to CL, Myhill error cost us, whilst Green made 5 excellent saves. Question is then, why drop Foster?
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Clarke won't please everyone all the time but im very concerned by these lifeless displays since Chelsea.
He has been hit by injuries to key players and is still new to being a head coach but that isn't going to wash forever.
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Really dont see the point in 'resting' Foster? Apart from 8 minutes of picking the ball out of the net at Reading he had nothing to do.
I can understand the resting of Olsson and Ridgewell who have had injuries.
What the recent games have shown that although everyone thought we had a strong squad we actually dont.
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Its like De Ja Vu from last season, a bloke in charge who's fine when things go well but cannot turn things around once they start to go bad.
With RDM the turning point was Ipswich away in the cup, For Clarke, it was Swansea away.............exactly the same thing with the whole thing going to hell in a handbasket !
I can see saturday being Clarkes Man City, not to say he will get sacked but it must be a turning point for the club one way or the other. Win and we can take confidence from the result, lose and the seasons over in terms of what we can achieve.
I dont think nwe'll go down but it will become JUST ANOTHER SEASON ON LOST OPPORTUNITIES ! as so many other in our past have turned into !
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Could Steve Clarke have done anything different with the team selection? It was wise to drop Olsson and Ridgewell given their recent problems with injuries but the only questionable choices for me tonight were the inclusion of Myhill and Rosenberg. Perhaps tonight was an ideal chance for Rosenberg to try and make that lucky break but when a manager insists he wants to target the cup competitions it's slightly disappointing to see our best player (Odemwingie) sitting on the bench against a side which looked there for the taking. Steve Clarke has done a lot of good things this season but he's on the verge of potentially ruining some of that good work with some questionable decisions, added to that, I don't think he's been helped by the players recently who have let both themselves and Steve Clarke down with their failure to defend the remaining minutes of matches appropriately. The irony is, it's due to that failure we're all moaning tonight.
My main worry is that now our season is more or less over, we're out of the cup competitions, our league status looks more than safe, that the players churn out these regular zombie like performances where we plan to coast through matches. I can't see fans accepting that and nor should they when they shell out so much money.
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Its like De Ja Vu from last season, a bloke in charge who's fine when things go well but cannot turn things around once they start to go bad.
With RDM the turning point was Ipswich away in the cup, For Clarke, it was Swansea away.............exactly the same thing with the whole thing going to hell in a handbasket !
I can see saturday being Clarkes Man City, not to say he will get sacked but it must be a turning point for the club one way or the other. Win and we can take confidence from the result, lose and the seasons over in terms of what we can achieve.
I dont think nwe'll go down but it will become JUST ANOTHER SEASON ON LOST OPPORTUNITIES ! as so many other in our past have turned into !
but we havent had this sort of opportunitie for 30 odd years. were little west brom punching above our weight blah blah blah. yes we might be a little but theres a lot of poor teams this season and some bigger ones in transition so its an ideal chance to push on,spend a bit of cash and attract some good players while we are in this position.roy got us to tenth everyones happy spend very little. this window were 7th even better,however we have a lot of key players missing and some of our squad players are simply showing they are not good enough. massive chance to push on being missed by jp.
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We as in JP will not spend a penny in this window so just get used to it and by the way isn't he on his hols >:(
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We as in JP will not spend a penny in this window so just get used to it and by the way isn't he on his hols >:(
True, JP is happy to let things slip away as usual..............
Yes, we were great the first quarter of the season but the last eleven have been generally dire so we cannot live off the great start now as we slide and slide.............
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We as in JP will not spend a penny in this window so just get used to it and by the way isn't he on his hols >:(
That old chestnut. What difference would it make if he was on Holiday? Player recruitment/talks is at the hands of Dan Ashworth and Richard Garlick. If there is business out there which the club see as a good deal then we shall do it. Even if that is a loan signing to tide us over until the end of the season. Such plans would have been discussed prior to January anyway so I wouldn't blame Peace for jetting away to Barbados.
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I'm not going to start JP bashing but this season is typical of any number of seasons when you've supported the baggies for as long as some of us have on here.
Like I said, we promise so much but deliver so little..............and its always been the same. I mean, how can a team like the 79 team not win anything and a few years later, get relegated winning 4 matches all season. The late 60's team was the same ! Its all to familiar where Albion are concerned and if I could I'd pack it all in...................BUT we all know thats not going to happen. I must be a masochist or something, we all must be !! ???
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This zombie football is what is really ringing the alarm bells for me. We lack urgency, drive, tempo, hunger, will to win the games. If it was just one game, I could understand such things happens. But this is all winter now, since our shocking performance at Swansea and even before that at times truth be told. The players are not 100% switched on, and I look to the manager as to why. Are they on the same wavelength at all? Same planet?
Is is simply the injuries and our replacements are playing to their ability?
Is it the coaching?
Is it the frequent changes?
Is it a fitness problem?
What is going on here?
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This zombie football is what is really ringing the alarm bells for me. We lack urgency, drive, tempo, hunger, will to win the games. If it was just one game, I could understand such things happens. But this is all winter now, since our shocking performance at Swansea and even before that at times truth be told. The players are not 100% switched on, and I look to the manager as to why. Are they on the same wavelength at all? Same planet?
Is is simply the injuries and our replacements are playing to their ability?
Is it the coaching?
Is it the frequent changes?
Is it a fitness problem?
What is going on here?
Didn't we do near enough the same thing last year though? But instead had a bad November, decent December and an awful January, this year it's a Perfect November and a bad December and having a bad 1st half of January.
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Let's hope so. We got back on track once we got Andrews and Ridgewell last year. In this case we should get back on track once we have our midfield back, ie Yacob and Mulumbu, and Reid, Long, Olsson, PO, in other words, our 'Old Reliables'.
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a game too far, the lads who have come in have done there best. a bit of apathy from clark. if you look at the team last night you would say only gmac and morrison would have reason to complain about the amount of games they have played. yacob as been injured for a while and we knew we would be losing mulumbu so if you couple that with geras injury, brunts poor form,constant line up changes and accomodating players in wrong positions very much explains our slump for me.
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Let's hope so. We got back on track once we got Andrews and Ridgewell last year. In this case we should get back on track once we have our midfield back, ie Yacob and Mulumbu, and Reid, Long, Olsson, PO, in other words, our 'Old Reliables'.
I think we need the same again this season, two more players to freshen thing sup I was impressed with Ridgewell and Andrews last season.
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I haven't seen the game but the team on paper looked pretty sensible last night. Who else could have played ?
Olsson is just back from injury and 3 games in 8 days could have set him back again. Pete just back from injury. Popov and Ridgewell, not much to choose between them. Bringing Reid back is a step backwards in my book.
Could argue Foster should have played but he's not been in the form of last year either.
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I went to the game and fail to see what Clarke could have done different? OK in hindsight he could have played Foster but whos to say he wouldnt have threw one in the net too? People have been asking for 2 up front, we started with 2 and ended with 5 up front! All his subs were attacking, people were asking for YEG to play, he came on too. Apparantly Odemwingie was only on the bench because he hasnt trained for 4 days, and it was a perfect chance to play MR in his proper position. On any other day that could have been 3-0 to us and no one would be questioning it, QPR are in the next round thanks to Robert Green not our managers line-up.
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I went to the game and fail to see what Clarke could have done different? OK in hindsight he could have played Foster but whos to say he wouldnt have threw one in the net too? People have been asking for 2 up front, we started with 2 and ended with 5 up front! All his subs were attacking, people were asking for YEG to play, he came on too. Apparantly Odemwingie was only on the bench because he hasnt trained for 4 days, and it was a perfect chance to play MR in his proper position. On any other day that could have been 3-0 to us and no one would be questioning it, QPR are in the next round thanks to Robert Green not our managers line-up.
This is right.
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We as in JP will not spend a penny in this window so just get used to it and by the way isn't he on his hols >:(
Why slag off JP ? The manager picks the team !
If we went out and acquired a top player he'd be no good on the bench !! (Long and Odemwingie being our best players as an example)
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ADDER and PHBAGGIES. Both great posts. I was at the game and thought the side Clark picked was ok. Unlike our keeper Green made some good saves. Don't get me wrong I don't think we played well at all.
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As of the past we fluttered a little when we went a goal down, a worrying trend.We are far too labouring at home.We only come out our shell when its to late.We should be at them from the off at home who ever is in the team
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I think both Clarke and the players are to blame for this slump. I think overall Clarke does know what he is doing, i have concerns why we constantly change the team, last night was mainly injured and illness related but for the last two months we have chopped and changed, he has been unlucky with core players been injured but every team has injuries and suspensions and when you use that as an excuse (which i dont think Clarke has to be fair) you are going down one route.
I also think he made the same mistakes as many other managers, setting the bar too low. At the start of the season said the aim was 50 points and then go from there, why say that? Same as when managers come up and say we want to finish 17th or get to 40 points, really annoys me. You give players an excuse and i think thats exactly what ours are doing now, there job was to stay up and hit 50 points, realistically by May we will of done that but wheres the incentive and ambition? I dont think the players are not trying but pyschologically i dont think there is the same drive, desire and commitment during games, because there job for the season is done, as i say i dont think its on purpose its just the way it is.
If i was Clarke i would get them in today and say to them all the 2nd part of the season starts now, we are aiming for top 6, you have shown you are good enough to do it, so prove you can finish there, no excuses, we want top 6. If you dont do it then i will know you are not upto the standard needed to move this club forward and will look to replace players in the summer so its over to you, do what you were doing the first 3 months and you could be here a long time and aiming for better things, play like you are now, i- going through the motions then you will look to be replaced.
As players and a club we have to keep looking to improve, we messed up in the cups, last night was prime example, we had a go last 15 minutes against a awful QPR team, where was that intention for the other 75 minutes? They ballsed up the cups but they can do something in the league still, i think they need to as we drift towards midtable, fans start to lose a bit of interest especially after such a promising start. I think the players have let Clarke down, he has gave them an excuse to do so, but now he has to set them new targets. A lot of those players are being paid very big wages and i think a few need to have a look are they doing enough.
The old saying is 'aim for the moon, if you miss you land on the stars' that should always be our ambition, aim for the best and lets see where it takes us instead of settling for average. If we finished 10th this season but the manager, players and fans could all say we gave it everything, we really had a go but we just werent quite good enough, i think we would all be happy, but to whimper home like we are now would be a anti climax.
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It would be interesting to see how many times Roy started a game with the same line up (injuries allowing) compared to Steve Clarke
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Expectations have just got the best of some of us, me included.I am ok now i have slept on it. As long as we stay up and be part of the greed league next season i will be happy
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Last night annoyed me, but it is a fact that their keeper was man of the match.
We are missing our two best players, who happen to also play alongside each other - its akin to missing both your centre halves - the effect that has had on us is massive.
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This is relegation form, the level of form that saw RDM sacked. I fully expected to have 39 points before the new year with the teams we had to play in December and by now well over 40. When you look at the form of the clubs we have played over the last month or so I don't think those expectations were unrealistic. SC will have to start to look at his own input and see what he is doing wrong because we are not yet safe and points are becoming hard to come by. Also the fitness aspect worries me as the amount of avoidable hamstring injuries has been the main cause of our first team players not being available.
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Last night annoyed me, but it is a fact that their keeper was man of the match.
We are missing our two best players, who happen to also play alongside each other - its akin to missing both your centre halves - the effect that has had on us is massive.
I agree mate but at the same time it's no excuse for these zombie/lifeless like performances of late.
If you lose as we have been i expect to at least have a proper go.
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This is relegation form, the level of form that saw RDM sacked. I fully expected to have 39 points before the new year with the teams we had to play in December and by now well over 40. When you look at the form of the clubs we have played over the last month or so I don't think those expectations were unrealistic. SC will have to start to look at his own input and see what he is doing wrong because we are not yet safe and points are becoming hard to come by. Also the fitness aspect worries me as the amount of avoidable hamstring injuries has been the main cause of our first team players not being available.
Its a fine line, if we hadnt of hit the post against Fulham at 1-1 would we have won? If one of Lukaku's that hit the bar against Reading had gone in, surely we would have held on to 3-0, if Green didnt have a monster game last night we would have won comfortably. We are not as bad as people are trying to make out on here, no need to hit the panic button.
It seems to be the norm for us this time of year as the past 3 years have been the same, quality in depth is something a team of our size will never have as you cannot keep them all happy, im sure if all our core players were available during this period it would look a lot different but one can only assume I suppose.
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Its a fine line, if we hadnt of hit the post against Fulham at 1-1 would we have won? If one of Lukaku's that hit the bar against Reading had gone in, surely we would have held on to 3-0, if Green didnt have a monster game last night we would have won comfortably. We are not as bad as people are trying to make out on here, no need to hit the panic button.
It seems to be the norm for us this time of year as the past 3 years have been the same, quality in depth is something a team of our size will never have as you cannot keep them all happy, im sure if all our core players were available during this period it would look a lot different but one can only assume I suppose.
This is relegation form though, 2 wins in 11.
We have lost 4 and drawn 1 of our last 5 games and 4 of those games have been against average sides at best. I hope Clarke isn't a one trick pony but so far I haven't seen a plan B.
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We will lose games at this level and to teams you don't expect just as we beat teams you wouldn't expect to , that Premier League life. What bothers me is the limp, lifeless performances that have become normal now. I'm not knee jerking as I've seen most things from the Albion but if Clarke and the coaching staff can't get a better effort from whatever players pull on the stripes on Saturday tea time in a Midlands Derby then IMO serious question's should be asked regarding leadership and motivation .
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This is his first real test as a manager. We have had to deal with a number of injuries that hasn't helped our cause by any means but we are on a stinking run that he has to get us out of as soon as possible, now we have our players returning from injury it is time for him to show his worth.
I feel for him in a way as I do think this January was a great opportunity to add on or two new faces especially having lost Gera for the season but it looks like we will do nothing transfer wise. We have never been in a stronger position league wise but that won't take long to slip away if we carry on as we are.
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For me he knows what he is doing 99% of the time it's just the endless unnecessary tinkering I have a problem with. He needs to make changes to cover injuries/suspensions and international duties but that should be it.
I remember thinking after the Southampton game that we'd start seeing Odemwingie starting regularly as he scored both goals that night and played very well..only for him to be dropped the very next game! Against Chelsea he played out of his skin, attacked like we know he can and tracked back...yet come the next game he's back on the bench.
I just don't get it.
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For me he knows what he is doing 99% of the time it's just the endless unnecessary tinkering I have a problem with. He needs to make changes to cover injuries/suspensions and international duties but that should be it.
I remember thinking after the Southampton game that we'd start seeing Odemwingie starting regularly as he scored both goals that night and played very well..only for him to be dropped the very next game! Against Chelsea he played out of his skin, attacked like we know he can and tracked back...yet come the next game he's back on the bench.
I just don't get it.
Last night he made 2 unforced changes (Rosenberg/ Myhill) Arry made 6 for QPR and we lost 1 nil.
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Last night he made 2 unforced changes (Rosenberg/ Myhill) Arry made 6 for QPR and we lost 1 nil.
Harry dont normally change his team game on game like Steve does, most managers make 6 changes for cup games
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Harry dont normally change his team game on game like Steve does, most managers make 6 changes for cup games
F*** me there are 13 teams in our division below us who wouldnt mind being in our position now especially Arry im guessing yet all we can do is pick faults with our manager in his first year as one, getting bored of it now if im honest.
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For me he knows what he is doing 99% of the time it's just the endless unnecessary tinkering I have a problem with. He needs to make changes to cover injuries/suspensions and international duties but that should be it.
I remember thinking after the Southampton game that we'd start seeing Odemwingie starting regularly as he scored both goals that night and played very well..only for him to be dropped the very next game! Against Chelsea he played out of his skin, attacked like we know he can and tracked back...yet come the next game he's back on the bench.
I just don't get it.
I think he was trying to finesse things too much around the Swansea game, and that led to the slip in form, and we had all our luck in one game at QPR and nothing elsewhere. It's now in danger of becoming a self fulfilling thing - if we lose on Saturday the confidence will go big time, and we could slide dangerously down the table. We know he's a good tactician, now we'll find out if he can motivate when heads are down.
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I think he was trying to finesse things too much around the Swansea game, and that led to the slip in form, and we had all our luck in one game at QPR and nothing elsewhere. It's now in danger of becoming a self fulfilling thing - if we lose on Saturday the confidence will go big time, and we could slide dangerously down the table. We know he's a good tactician, now we'll find out if he can motivate when heads are down.
We will lose games at this level and to teams you don't expect just as we beat teams you wouldn't expect to , that Premier League life. What bothers me is the limp, lifeless performances that have become normal now. I'm not knee jerking as I've seen most things from the Albion but if Clarke and the coaching staff can't get a better effort from whatever players pull on the stripes on Saturday tea time in a Midlands Derby then IMO serious question's should be asked regarding leadership and motivation .
I echo these and other concerns.
Is Clarke too soft to manage in the role of leader? Where is the iron will to win? Are the players bored to death?
All good managers absolutely detest losing, but all we seem to hear is 'we'll have a chat about it, make sure it doesn't happen again, and move on to the next game'. Now, of course I don't know what Clarke is like on the training pitch, when he talks with players in private, what he is like in the dressing room before games, during half time and afterwards.
I didn't like it when Clarke, after we went third, effectively told the players they were punching above their weight and it was ok to relax and take the foot off the gas. It's Clarke's job to manage the resources over a season, it's the players job to give 100% every time they step out on the pitch. But we haven't seen that have we? We have seen limp team after limp team give tepid performances.
I know we have injuries and without a doubt that has been a crucial reason for our poor form. But the players that step into the gap, and the team, can at least still give performances with "spark" (that Clarke admitted after the QPR game we lacked). How many times have we had "spark" this season?
As for 'luck'. Good teams create their own luck, weak teams complain about lack of luck. We never had any luck under Mowbray, but we leaked soft goals left and right, like we do now.
I have no doubt Clarke is tactically very knowledgeable, but there are aspects of his leadership that look weak to me.
I hope he proves me wrong once he gets his best team back and that we start to be impressive again. And I hope the club leadership moves to strengthen our squad's depth because beneath the surface we still stink.
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Last night he made 2 unforced changes (Rosenberg/ Myhill) Arry made 6 for QPR and we lost 1 nil.
yes yet again he made unnecessary changes...exactly my point....and one of those changes cost us the game.
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yes yet again he made unnecessary changes...exactly my point....and one of those changes cost us the game.
The other nearly won it.
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make no mistake about it forget our start to the season this is relegation form we are in . i can take losing as long as the team fight , but we're not even trying . saturday is a must win game lose and put in a drab performance and the pressure is really on . this run could turn into the same that hull went on a couple of seasons ago and look where they are now
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The other nearly won it.
Agreed but sadly you get nowt for "nearly" winning......except a free weekend on 26/27 Jan.
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The bloke is clueless and to prove this watch him leave Odemwingie and Lukaku on the bench for the
Villa game and start Long and Fortune instead.
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The bloke is clueless.
Of course he is ::)
By the way, where are your credentials?
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Of course he is ::)
By the way, where are your credentials?
Huh? He needs some kind of academic credentials to have an opinion? Ridiculous, and no, I don't need any 'credentials' to form that opinion. ;D
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I have no doubt Clarke is tactically very knowledgeable, but there are aspects of his leadership that look weak to me. .
Without being privy to what goes on behind closed doors, on the training ground and in the dressing room, I don't know how you can possibly come to that conclusion. It's a comment seemingly based on very little apart from your gut feel and the glimpses you get off Clarke in front of the media.
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This is relegation form, the level of form that saw RDM sacked. I fully expected to have 39 points before the new year with the teams we had to play in December and by now well over 40. When you look at the form of the clubs we have played over the last month or so I don't think those expectations were unrealistic. SC will have to start to look at his own input and see what he is doing wrong because we are not yet safe and points are becoming hard to come by. Also the fitness aspect worries me as the amount of avoidable hamstring injuries has been the main cause of our first team players not being available.
Yes, but at the start of the season, no one would have expected us to have 33 points by the start of January! Did you honestly expect us to keep accumulating points at the same rate as we were in the first half of the season?
After our good start people appear to have lost quite a bit of perspective. We are for all intents and purposes a mid table side and therefore, our form was always likely to even out at some point. Had we accrued 33 points in a more even fashion most people on here would be delighted.
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I always did expect us to have a blip along the way this season. We have improved on the previous two seasons points wise, but quite a big amount. We have had five or six first teamers out. Once those players get back together again results will get better for us.
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Huh? He needs some kind of academic credentials to have an opinion? Ridiculous, and no, I don't need any 'credentials' to form that opinion. ;D
I hate baseless points like "he's clueless". Really? Clueless is having no understanding of the rules. It's an INCREDIBLY annoying thing that happens when things aren't turning up roses, It happens near enough every year about this time like clockwork.
I get EXTREMELY pissy this time of year because of comments like these made by pretty much everyone I know about pretty much everything while not taking into account all the good things they have. I remember similar (I mean exactly the same) quotes about Hodgson about this time except with him be actually WERE in a relegation fight on relegation form and not just fearing it. Old habits i guess.
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Of course he is ::)
By the way, where are your credentials?
If he feels like that then he feels like that.
His credentials are as valid as yours to be posting on this forum and that's how it will stay.
Mods mod the forum, members post on it.
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I hate baseless points like "he's clueless". Really? Clueless is having no understanding of the rules. It's an INCREDIBLY annoying thing that happens when things aren't turning up roses, It happens near enough every year about this time like clockwork.
I get EXTREMELY pissy this time of year because of comments like these made by pretty much everyone I know about pretty much everything while not taking into account all the good things they have. I remember similar (I mean exactly the same) quotes about Hodgson about this time except with him be actually WERE in a relegation fight on relegation form and not just fearing it. Old habits i guess.
We get EXTREMELY pissy about members who don't allow others to have their say. We usually find that the ones who try and shout others down are the ones who don't remain on here.
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OH yes OF LITTLE FAITH!
New coach, developing team. What actually did some of you think? Let the man grow into the role. Let the man develop HIS TEAM!
Good and great managers need more than 6 months. Some of you would have called for the sacking of Ferguson after his first 12 months, so stop this silly criticism and show some sense when you comment!
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OH yes OF LITTLE FAITH!
New coach, developing team. What actually did some of you think? Let the man grow into the role. Let the man develop HIS TEAM!
Good and great managers need more than 6 months. Some of you would have called for the sacking of Ferguson after his first 12 months, so stop this silly criticism and show some sense when you comment!
and again, people have a RIGHT to post what they want on here whether you agree with it or not, that will not change, the people who are the ones causing us problems are the ones that are not willing to let those people have that say without shouting them down. Its a forum for people whether happy or negative, always has been, always will be.
If you want to have a sensible discussion carry on, if all we are going to get is constant shouting down then we will be looking at those people who will be the ones no longer on here.
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Yes, but at the start of the season, no one would have expected us to have 33 points by the start of January! Did you honestly expect us to keep accumulating points at the same rate as we were in the first half of the season?
After our good start people appear to have lost quite a bit of perspective. We are for all intents and purposes a mid table side and therefore, our form was always likely to even out at some point. Had we accrued 33 points in a more even fashion most people on here would be delighted.
Given the form of the teams we were playing, apart from Man U yes I did, we had the easiest fixtures of the whole season over this period and we failed to capitalise on it due to constant Tinkering.
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I always did expect us to have a blip along the way this season.
Isn't 2 wins and 7 defeats in 11 games a bit more than a blip - 11 games is more than a quarter of the season? I'd quite like to see Clarke acknowledge that there's a problem, rather than trying to make out that we always play quite well and that the poor results are more or less down to bad luck.
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At present the answer has got to be yes due to our position in the premier but think only time will tell. If we start to regain our form and we secure a comfortable top half of the table finish we will all be saying, roll on next season with lot of optimism and be discussing what new players s.c. will be looking for. If we continue with our present form and just escape a relegation battle then pessimism will follow and the discussion will be which of our top players will be wanting to leave and how much longer should we give s.c. One thing he does know that he will be judged on the teams results and very little else.
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If he feels like that then he feels like that.
His credentials are as valid as yours to be posting on this forum and that's how it will stay.
Mods mod the forum, members post on it.
This is where this forum lets itself down. Everyone is entitled to opinion but if they choose to share that opinion then they should expect it to be challenged. (This is my opinion, so would expect no censure or
anti comment from mods. ;))
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This is where this forum lets itself down. Everyone is entitled to opinion but if they choose to share that opinion then they should expect it to be challenged. (This is my opinion, so would expect no censure or
anti comment from mods. ;))
The thing with opinions is: Yes, everyone is entitled to one but if it is ridiculous, stupid, anti-social or dangerous then surely people should be told. Hitler thought that Jewish and Black people were inferior yet because it was his opinion does that in some way validate it? Of course not! The man was a **** and had opinions to match.
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I feel the summer will determine alot, Who will he deem surplus to requirements? We have a core of about 8 players who are quality whilst the rest could be deemed quantity hence the poor run of form whilst a few of our quality players are out injured, Without ashworth pulling rabbit's out of the hat it will be interesting to see who he brings in.
I do wish he would play players in they're positions though, MAF is not a wide player and Brunt isn't CM, i know injuries haven't helped but with yacob back, mulumbu in a few week's, popov back it shall be an interesting lineup.
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I hate baseless points like "he's clueless". Really? Clueless is having no understanding of the rules. It's an INCREDIBLY annoying thing that happens when things aren't turning up roses, It happens near enough every year about this time like clockwork.
I get EXTREMELY pissy this time of year because of comments like these made by pretty much everyone I know about pretty much everything while not taking into account all the good things they have. I remember similar (I mean exactly the same) quotes about Hodgson about this time except with him be actually WERE in a relegation fight on relegation form and not just fearing it. Old habits i guess.
Clearly if he was actually clueless he'd go in the pub, grab 8 people and put them on the pitch. Even then he wouldn't be clueless as he recognises it to be a team game!
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This is where this forum lets itself down. Everyone is entitled to opinion but if they choose to share that opinion then they should expect it to be challenged. (This is my opinion, so would expect no censure or
anti comment from mods. ;))
There is a huge difference between debating and challenging , we welcome debate all day long but it's more the insulting replies we won't be allowing on here. It's a handful of members who let this site down not the forum itself thank you very much. ;)
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This is where this forum lets itself down. Everyone is entitled to opinion but if they choose to share that opinion then they should expect it to be challenged. (This is my opinion, so would expect no censure or
anti comment from mods. ;) )
Challenging an opinion is different from challenging the person expressing the opinion.
Just fine:
- "Steve Clarke is the best head coach ever because he...."
- "Steve Clarke is a good head coach because he...."
- "Steve Clarke is a bad head coach because he...."
- "Steve Clarke is the worst head coach ever because he...."
Generally unacceptable:
- "You're wrong about Steve Clarke because you don't have any coaching credentials."
- "You're wrong about Steve Clarke because you are ___ years old."
- "You're wrong about Steve Clarke because you don't attend as many games as I do."
- "You're wrong about Steve Clarke because you live in Burkina Faso."
- "You're wrong about Steve Clarke because you are impossibly thick."
If you must challenge someone's right to hold an opinion, the only way to proceed is to be polite. Here's an example:
From what I've seen, Olsson and McAuley are better at defending corners than Wile and Robertson were.
Response:
With respect Quakes I'm guessing you never saw them so are basing your view on the very limited video footage of the time.
Trust me, Albion have never had a centre back as good at defending corners as John Wile. He won almost everything in the air.
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This is where this forum lets itself down. Everyone is entitled to opinion but if they choose to share that opinion then they should expect it to be challenged. (This is my opinion, so would expect no censure or
anti comment from mods. ;))
Theres no problem with anyone challenging anyone elses opinion. The problem is the way its done.
I would have expected someone with as much experience on forums as yourself to understand that ?
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Ever since Clarke came out and said it was about time we were shown some respect, results have taken a slight dip. He is very much a players manager however the comments he made were naieve in my opinion. He should have carried on as things were with two fingers firmly up to the mainstream media.
He obviously does know what he's doing, but the learning curve in the modern game needs to be a very short one if you want to keep your job and make a name for yourself.
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Given the form of the teams we were playing, apart from Man U yes I did, we had the easiest fixtures of the whole season over this period and we failed to capitalise on it due to constant Tinkering.
I hate this whole 'easy' game mentality that some of our fans have. Every game in this division is hard especially for a team like us who are yet to truly establish ourselves at this level.
At the start of the season we were getting positive results against teams which many of us wouldn't have expected to. On the flip side, we have had some results where on paper we probably should've done better. That's football for you.
At the end of the day, if someone had said that we'd be sitting on 33 points by the end of January 95% of Albion fans would've snapped their hand off.
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The answer is an emphatic NO.
What he was doing not starting Thomas heaven knows.
I sometimes think myself, as a complete novice could do better.
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The answer is an emphatic NO.
What he was doing not starting Thomas heaven knows.
I sometimes think myself, as a complete novice could do better.
Not sure I would agree with that. Thomas certainly played well and its easy with hindsight to say he should have started. With Yacob back I don't think it was as straightforward a selection as that.
Thomas certainly did himself no harm today, likewise Dorrans. Both played well. Perhaps both motivated by being in the shop window!
A very decent second half but how does one explain that shocking first half? That was truly woeful.
Worrying to see Yacob injured again and Brunt seeming to be yet another hamstring victim?
Anyway, one point closer to safety....thank God we've got so many points on the board already on current form.
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Not sure I would agree with that. Thomas certainly played well and its easy with hindsight to say he should have started. With Yacob back I don't think it was as straightforward a selection as that.
Thomas certainly did himself no harm today, likewise Dorrans. Both played well. Perhaps both motivated by being in the shop window!
A very decent second half but how does one explain that shocking first half? That was truly woeful.
Worrying to see Yacob injured again and Brunt seeming to be yet another hamstring victim?
Anyway, one point closer to safety....thank God we've got so many points on the board already on current form.
Mate, Thomas HAS to start he's one of the few natural widemen we have. You cannot play football with an unbalanced team which is wha SC is attempting.
Kudos to Brunt for scoring. Someone from the middle is going have to sit on the bench, whether that's GD, CB, JM or whoever.
The alternative is SC will earn himself the sack.
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for me we try to accomodate too many players in unatural positions being that midfielders pushed wide or centrally and strikers played wide. obviously injuries can force this but the fact we always start 4-2-3-1 limits this aswel. for me wether we play 1 or 2 up top they should be from lukaku/pete/long. play 1 or 2 but dont push them out wide. if it means players sit on the bench due to the good form of others so be it.
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The answer is an emphatic NO.
What he was doing not starting Thomas heaven knows.
I sometimes think myself, as a complete novice could do better.
I find it absolutely bizzare that people can come up with such a statement.
Yes we are on a bad run of form at present but we are sitting 8th in the table. What more do people want?!?!?
He has areas of his management that he has to work on but then so does every manager. Given that it's his first season in the hot seat he's doing a great job. I just cannot fathom how people could think otherwise.
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If he can't see the balance is wrong with playing players out of position, And he keeps on doing it from now on then i'd have to say no. Dorrans was far better in his natural role, Pete was way more effective upfront in his natural role not tracking back defending. The next game he cannot revert back to playing players out of position. First half proved it as we was all over the place and i didn't know what formation we were playing.
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I'm starting to get concerned with Clarke. I don't want to sound like a villa fan so I will chose my words carefully. When Roy left I feared the worst but was pleasantly suprised with how quickly we set out of the blocks. I thought we were fortunate sometimes but we rode our luck well and capitalised on teams often but to me it looked like we had a plan A,B and C. Just lately we have looked lost for periods in a game and waited too often for teams to come to us rather than make our impression and take the game to them. Injuries haven't helped, We really have missed Yacob, and now we are missing Mulumbu. Clarke needs to buck his ideas up and fast.
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I find it absolutely bizzare that people can come up with such a statement.
Yes we are on a bad run of form at present but we are sitting 8th in the table. What more do people want?!?!?
He has areas of his management that he has to work on but then so does every manager. Given that it's his first season in the hot seat he's doing a great job. I just cannot fathom how people could think otherwise.
Wake up - we were 4th because we have good players. I take it you were happy with 1 draw and 2 losses against the bottom 3 in table in last 3 matches?
Even the fans can see the mistakes and he keeps making them!!!
Why isn't he whealing and dealing in transfer window to resolve things? 11 days to go.
I'm not saying sack him, I just don't think he's particularly good or special. Time to call a spade a spade.
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Wake up - we were 4th because we have good players. I take it you were happy with 1 draw and 2 losses against the bottom 3 in table in last 3 matches?
Even the fans can see the mistakes and he keeps making them!!!
Why isn't he whealing and dealing in transfer window to resolve things? 11 days to go.
I'm not saying sack him, I just don't think he's particularly good or special. Time to call a spade a spade.
How can you possibly suggest that us being fourth was purely down to the players!?
Yes you need good players but it's a manager who sets up the team, plans the tactics and motivates the players. The way you are talking we might as well make the manager position redundant and let the players go out and organise themselves!
Why do you think good managers are paid millions of pounds of year? Because they are absolutely fundamental in how a team sets up and performs week in week out. Surely that much is obvious?
I'm not happy with the current form but EVERY team has ups and downs throughout the season. That is just basic logic. However, if you take the season as a whole he is doing a great job. Honestly, what more did you expect from this season. Champions league? A title charge? Some of our fans appear to have lost all sense of perspective in recent weeks.
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We were 4th because luckily for SC, Dan Ashworth signed an absolute gem in Yacob.
And yes credit for setting the team up and gaining the points but it wasn't rocket science.
Since Yacob's injury we've been all at sea. SC has been left exposed as someone with poor tactical knowledge.
Why continually play people out of position? Brunt CM? Dorrans winger? Rosenberg 10 minute cameo's? Ridgwell instead of Popov tonight?
Why haven't we signed a winger when 19 days of transfer window have elapsed?
These situations are elementary to us fans, he's with the team day in - day out.
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We were 4th because luckily for SC, Dan Ashworth signed an absolute gem in Yacob.
And yes credit for setting the team up and gaining the points but it wasn't rocket science.
Since Yacob's injury we've been all at sea. SC has been left exposed as someone with poor tactical knowledge.
Why continually play people out of position? Brunt CM? Dorrans winger? Rosenberg 10 minute cameo's? Ridgwell instead of Popov tonight?
Why haven't we signed a winger when 19 days of transfer window have elapsed?
These situations are elementary to us fans, he's with the team day in - day out.
Are you seriously suggesting that the signing of Yacob alone has taken us from being a mid table PL club to one which hasn’t fallen below 8th this season?
Nothing to do with how SC has utilized him alongside Mulumbu?
Nothing to do with how SC has kept the organization we had under Hodgson whilst adding more flair and goals?
Nothing to do with how SC has flittered between 442 and 451 depending on the opposition? (see Wigan away)
Nothing to do with how Clarke attracted one of the most outstanding young forwards in the world?
For me it's once again a case of football fans thinking that they could go out and do a better job. Football management isn’t rocket science but to suggest that a manager doesn’t have a fundamental impact on how a team performs is absolute madness. Why do you think clubs chop and change managers to try and reach their maximum potential? Why do you think we swapped RDM for RH a few seasons ago?
He has made mistakes and some of his team selections are frustrating at times. Earlier in the season he was a tactical genius for the way he set us up against the likes of Everton, Liverpool and Chelsea and now, after a run of poor form, he doesn’t know what he is doing. That for me just sums up the fickleness of football fans and the want it now attitude that is poisoning English football.
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Are you seriously suggesting that the signing of Yacob alone has taken us from being a mid table PL club to one which hasn’t fallen below 8th this season?
Nothing to do with how SC has utilized him alongside Mulumbu?
Nothing to do with how SC has kept the organization we had under Hodgson whilst adding more flair and goals?
Nothing to do with how SC has flittered between 442 and 451 depending on the opposition? (see Wigan away)
Nothing to do with how Clarke attracted one of the most outstanding young forwards in the world?
For me it's once again a case of football fans thinking that they could go out and do a better job. Football management isn’t rocket science but to suggest that a manager doesn’t have a fundamental impact on how a team performs is absolute madness. Why do you think clubs chop and change managers to try and reach their maximum potential? Why do you think we swapped RDM for RH a few seasons ago?
He has made mistakes and some of his team selections are frustrating at times. Earlier in the season he was a tactical genius for the way he set us up against the likes of Everton, Liverpool and Chelsea and now, after a run of poor form, he doesn’t know what he is doing. That for me just sums up the fickleness of football fans and the want it now attitude that is poisoning English football.
Get off your high horse just because I don't agree with you!!!
Yacob was the primary reason why we were 4th - couldn't you see it?
Yes it's a crying shame he got injured and we've been left with below par / sub standard players but I don't think SC has helped himself with the way he's set them up.
As other fans have quoted it's square pegs in round holes ALL of the time, every match.
Why the hell he hasn't moved in transfer market I'll never know because it sure ain't right.
I think we're destned to finish bottom half.
I've been watching Albion since 81/82 and have a mountain of football knowledge.
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We are punching above our weight as a club because our best 13/14 players when all fit and available are good enough to keep us at between 8th and 12 th in the table but once we start to get injuries/ suspensions / African Cup the players coming in are now a significant drop down in quality and consistency. However that reflects just how much stronger our better players are that when we came up with RDM and even when Roy was manager.
The 4-2-3-1 that gave us the "surprise package" first half of the season becomes unsustainable when one ,let alone both, of Yacob and Mulumbu are in available as we just don't have cover for that holding role - putting Brunt in there doesn't work and neither Dorrans nor Morrison are really equipped to do that job but Morrison is probably the best option - too early yet to judge on Thorne but I am inclined to give him a run in the centre of midfield with Jimmy Morrison until other options become available. Could be either 4-2-3-1 or given the 34 points on the board 4-4-2 with Odemwingie linked to Long or Lukaku
So SC is having to make the best of a relatively limited group of available players but my only comment (slight criticism?) is that he seems to make some unforced changes in selection sometimes ignoring good form from the last game(s) - I'm quite old school in believing that the starting line up should be the best eleven available until injury/loss of form dictate changes - obviously in-game substitutions are irritant and I think that SC is better at this than RDM or RH were but more consistency in starting line up and shape could help to get more consistent performances - from which points will flow.
Overall SC has done well and I certainly will not start to give him a hard time when he finds himself with fairly limited options.
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We are punching above our weight as a club because our best 13/14 players when all fit and available are good enough to keep us at between 8th and 12 th in the table but once we start to get injuries/ suspensions / African Cup the players coming in are now a significant drop down in quality and consistency. However that reflects just how much stronger our better players are that when we came up with RDM and even when Roy was manager.
The 4-2-3-1 that gave us the "surprise package" first half of the season becomes unsustainable when one ,let alone both, of Yacob and Mulumbu are in available as we just don't have cover for that holding role - putting Brunt in there doesn't work and neither Dorrans nor Morrison are really equipped to do that job but Morrison is probably the best option - too early yet to judge on Thorne but I am inclined to give him a run in the centre of midfield with Jimmy Morrison until other options become available. Could be either 4-2-3-1 or given the 34 points on the board 4-4-2 with Odemwingie linked to Long or Lukaku
So SC is having to make the best of a relatively limited group of available players but my only comment (slight criticism?) is that he seems to make some unforced changes in selection sometimes ignoring good form from the last game(s) - I'm quite old school in believing that the starting line up should be the best eleven available until injury/loss of form dictate changes - obviously in-game substitutions are irritant and I think that SC is better at this than RDM or RH were but more consistency in starting line up and shape could help to get more consistent performances - from which points will flow.
Overall SC has done well and I certainly will not start to give him a hard time when he finds himself with fairly limited options.
Nice post. If our back-up players are so far behind the better ones, all the more reason to buy now.
Or maybe JP has poked his nose in and told SC nothing doing, we don't want to qualify for Europe and subsequently raise fan expectations.
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Nice post. If our back-up players are so far behind the better ones, all the more reason to buy now.
Or maybe JP has poked his nose in and told SC nothing doing, we don't want to qualify for Europe and subsequently raise fan expectations.
Do you honestly believe that ? Do you think any manager/ coach would be happy to sit back and have his career ruined by a Chairman trying to hold a club back deliberately ?
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Do you honestly believe that ? Do you think any manager/ coach would be happy to sit back and have his career ruined by a Chairman trying to hold a club back deliberately ?
Don't forget, this is the same chairman who didn't want to see us established as a Premier League side ;)
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Do you honestly believe that ? Do you think any manager/ coach would be happy to sit back and have his career ruined by a Chairman trying to hold a club back deliberately ?
I really hope my cynical view is wrong.
I just don't know and will never find out.
But when you have JP quoting he doesn't want the Europa League, then what other conclusion can you draw?
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What ever he said at half time tonight worked.
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What ever he said at half time tonight worked.
Fair point. Whatever was said 5 mins before kick off failed.
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Steve Clarke is an inexperinced manager/head coach, he will make mistakes, does he know what he is doing, well, most of the time yes, does anyone know exactly what they are doing in the first twelve months of a new job, no.
He will be a better manager in the long term because of the last two months, we have to be the ones to give him that experience, hopefully we will also get the benefits.
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Nothing to do with how SC has kept the organization we had under Hodgson whilst adding more flair and goals?
No offence Nocky,but imo I haven't witnessed this much this season.
Not knocking SC,I think he needs more time to get established as a Prem Manager,I also think the fans got us the draw in the 2nd half,not so much SC's half time team talk,BRE was amazing in the 2nd half.
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No offence Nocky,but imo I haven't witnessed this much this season.
Not knocking SC,I think he needs more time to get established as a Prem Manager,I also think the fans got us the draw in the 2nd half,not so much SC's half time team talk,BRE was amazing in the 2nd half.
I sit in it and it wasn't amazing until the Brunt goal, ie until they gave us something to shout about. Perhaps not what people want to hear but was definitely the case.
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I sit in it and it wasn't amazing until the Brunt goal, ie until they gave us something to shout about. Perhaps not what people want to hear but was definitely the case.
The fans were excellent in the second half, never stopped. I thought the Atmosphere was great all game really.
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My biggest problem at the moment is the style of play. Clarke said he was going to make sure the fans would be excited by the style of play. You can see glimpses of nice passing football but most of the time we either hoof it or give it away. Its like he has come in and said to the players to carry on from last season.
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Get off your high horse just because I don't agree with you!!!
Yacob was the primary reason why we were 4th - couldn't you see it?
Yes it's a crying shame he got injured and we've been left with below par / sub standard players but I don't think SC has helped himself with the way he's set them up.
As other fans have quoted it's square pegs in round holes ALL of the time, every match.
Why the hell he hasn't moved in transfer market I'll never know because it sure ain't right.
I think we're destned to finish bottom half.
I've been watching Albion since 81/82 and have a mountain of football knowledge.
Having watched Albion for that long, and watched some of the dross throughout the 80’s, 90’s and 000’s I would’ve thought you would be in a good position to recognize how good we have it as present.
Yacob was ONE of the reasons we were 4th, as was Steve Clarke.
It all comes down to a very simple question:
At the start of the season, would you have been happy sitting 8th in the table after 20 odd games?
As for your comments re the transfer market, you have no idea what is going on behind the scenes. At the end of the day, we are sitting 8th in the league; hardly as if we are in desperate need of reinforcements.
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No offence Nocky,but imo I haven't witnessed this much this season.
Not knocking SC,I think he needs more time to get established as a Prem Manager,I also think the fans got us the draw in the 2nd half,not so much SC's half time team talk,BRE was amazing in the 2nd half.
Well before today only Man City had conceded less goals than us at home. Clear evidence of how organised we have been at times this year.
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Having watched Albion for that long, and watched some of the dross throughout the 80’s, 90’s and 000’s I would’ve thought you would be in a good position to recognize how good we have it as present.
Yacob was ONE of the reasons we were 4th, as was Steve Clarke.
It all comes down to a very simple question:
At the start of the season, would you have been happy sitting 8th in the table after 20 odd games?
As for your comments re the transfer market, you have no idea what is going on behind the scenes. At the end of the day, we are sitting 8th in the league; hardly as if we are in desperate need of reinforcements.
Yeah great 8th - about same as last season.
We won't finish there with this side - better hope Yacob is fit in double quick time.
We ain't a patch on Swansea, I'm sure they want to drive onto 6th or 7th where they deserve to be.
I'm not happy with the style of play or football we've produced since Nov12 and I see no end in sight unless we enter the transfer market.
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GREGMT, we're 8th in the Premier League, our club is lauded for the way it is run and today we put in a sterling second-half performance to get back on terms with a club that only a few years ago we couldn't touch. 'Punching above our weight' has become a kind of cliche here, but finances, attendances etc. ring it true. I quote you, "I've been watching Albion since 81/82 and have a mountain of football knowledge." That's nice, but as I've been watching the Albion for far longer than you, I'd like to remind you of the fact that slagging off our club has never been a tradition. The bunch of players we have are, on the whole, on lower wages than most at their level. Some of our results this season have been groundbreaking. Our 'blip' is something every club goes through. I'm not having an unnecessary pop at you mate, but I remember in the 70's with my brother coming home in the freezing cold from games away at Huddersfield and Southampton etc. Even if we'd lost and had our little grumbles, we'd still be singing on the way back and fully behind our club. Although football and the Albion is a big part of my life, I've always tried to keep things in perspective, realising it's not my job, or my wife or kid, but a passion I have that transcends and is different to all other things I have to deal with. Why then would I choose to moan and groan about my passion? What then would be the point of being passionate about something that obviously gets me down? No, I'll always follow the Albion and I wish there were fewer Baggies taking our games as if they were life or death. Our club is there to be supported, not belittled.
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Yeah great 8th - about same as last season.
Nothing wrong with a bit of ambition. I am weary also of hearing people reminding us of where we sit in the table. It's perfectly reasonable to want to see a bit of improvement this year.
"We're third. Yay. Stop moaning."
"We're fourth. Yay. Stop moaning."
"We're fifth. Yay. Stop moaning."
"We're seventh. Yay. Stop moaning."
"We're twelfth. Yay. Stop moaning."
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GREGMT, we're 8th in the Premier League, our club is lauded for the way it is run and today we put in a sterling second-half performance to get back on terms with a club that only a few years ago we couldn't touch. 'Punching above our weight' has become a kind of cliche here, but finances, attendances etc. ring it true. I quote you, "I've been watching Albion since 81/82 and have a mountain of football knowledge." That's nice, but as I've been watching the Albion for far longer than you, I'd like to remind you of the fact that slagging off our club has never been a tradition. The bunch of players we have are, on the whole, on lower wages than most at their level. Some of our results this season have been groundbreaking. Our 'blip' is something every club goes through. I'm not having an unnecessary pop at you mate, but I remember in the 70's with my brother coming home in the freezing cold from games away at Huddersfield and Southampton etc. Even if we'd lost and had our little grumbles, we'd still be singing on the way back and fully behind our club. Although football and the Albion is a big part of my life, I've always tried to keep things in perspective, realising it's not my job, or my wife or kid, but a passion I have that transcends and is different to all other things I have to deal with. Why then would I choose to moan and groan about my passion? What then would be the point of being passionate about something that obviously gets me down? No, I'll always follow the Albion and I wish there were fewer Baggies taking our games as if they were life or death. Our club is there to be supported, not belittled.
OK very fair post. I just want us to make the most of ourselves and be the best we can be.
I think we're letting ourselves down right now.
I'm very passionate about sport and when I play the desire is always 100%.
I get angry when I see others give less than 100%.
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GREGMT, we're 8th in the Premier League, our club is lauded for the way it is run and today we put in a sterling second-half performance to get back on terms with a club that only a few years ago we couldn't touch. 'Punching above our weight' has become a kind of cliche here, but finances, attendances etc. ring it true. I quote you, "I've been watching Albion since 81/82 and have a mountain of football knowledge." That's nice, but as I've been watching the Albion for far longer than you, I'd like to remind you of the fact that slagging off our club has never been a tradition. The bunch of players we have are, on the whole, on lower wages than most at their level. Some of our results this season have been groundbreaking. Our 'blip' is something every club goes through. I'm not having an unnecessary pop at you mate, but I remember in the 70's with my brother coming home in the freezing cold from games away at Huddersfield and Southampton etc. Even if we'd lost and had our little grumbles, we'd still be singing on the way back and fully behind our club. Although football and the Albion is a big part of my life, I've always tried to keep things in perspective, realising it's not my job, or my wife or kid, but a passion I have that transcends and is different to all other things I have to deal with. Why then would I choose to moan and groan about my passion? What then would be the point of being passionate about something that obviously gets me down? No, I'll always follow the Albion and I wish there were fewer Baggies taking our games as if they were life or death. Our club is there to be supported, not belittled.
Brilliant post. Have to agree about over the top negativity (I know the forum invites all opinions :D) Anyone who thinks we SHOULD be even top 8 does need a reality check. Look at the wages we pay and the money we spend. 17th would be a decent return.
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Yeah great 8th - about same as last season.
We won't finish there with this side - better hope Yacob is fit in double quick time.
We ain't a patch on Swansea, I'm sure they want to drive onto 6th or 7th where they deserve to be.
I'm not happy with the style of play or football we've produced since Nov12 and I see no end in sight unless we enter the transfer market.
We haven't been below 8th this season and you're still moaning. 8th below teams that have spent 10x as much as we have and with wage budgets that would absolutely blow us out of the water.
What did you expect us to achieve this season? There is only so far we can push on and given the budgets off the other teams around us 7th or 8th is probably the best we can ever realistically hope for.
At the moment we are on target to reach our highest top flights point haul ever. I don't know what more you want. Obviously your expectations are way out of kilter with what a club of our size can realistically achieve.
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We haven't been below 8th this season and you're still moaning. 8th below teams that have spent 10x as much as we have and with wage budgets that would absolutely blow us out of the water.
What did you expect us to achieve this season? There is only so far we can push on and given the budgets off the other teams around us 7th or 8th is probably the best we can ever realistically hope for.
At the moment we are on target to reach our highest top flights point haul ever. I don't know what more you want. Obviously your expectations are way out of kilter with what a club of our size can realistically achieve.
Yes but we haven't a hope of 8th with the present team - this is what I'm flagging up.
We look like a bottom 6 team right now!
What if Swansea finish 6th, surely their budget is same as ours?
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Yes but we haven't a hope of 8th with the present team - this is what I'm flagging up.
We look like a bottom 6 team right now!
What if Swansea finish 6th, surely their budget is same as ours?
What's the point of playing the 'what if' game? None of us know what's going to happen for the rest of the season. All we can accurately comment on is where we are now and we are currently sitting in 8th place.
As I've said many a time, every team has their ups and downs. We are currently on a down but who's to say we won't finish the season strongly. Finishing anywhere between 8th and 12th is about what a team of our budget should realistically expect.
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What's the point of playing the 'what if' game? None of us know what's going to happen for the rest of the season. All we can accurately comment on is where we are now and we are currently sitting in 8th place.
As I've said many a time, every team has their ups and downs. We are currently on a down but who's to say we won't finish the season strongly. Finishing anywhere between 8th and 12th is about what a team of our budget should realistically expect.
Jesus, thanks for the misery. ;) No offense, but you sound like Mr. Gradgrind in Hard Times!
(http://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Society/Pix/pictures/2010/4/19/1271690135698/Patrick-Allen-as-Mr-Gradg-001.jpg)
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Steve Clarke is still inexperienced as a manager the tactics used second half yesterday should have been used from the start against the team with the worst goal difference in the league, however I dont buy into arguments we are playing like a bottom six side, we are playing like what we are a midtable Premier Leage side.
As for Jeremy Peace, how this bloke still gets criticised is beyond me in all fairness, its like some fans still have this agenda against him.
Europa League football would be the worst thing for us next season our squad isnt big enough to cope and as we have proved we do things patiently and wont panic buy just to build our squad.
I think some fans need to get a sense of realism as to where we actually are as a club. Its fine to dream but sometimes dreams are either just that or will take alot longer than some expect them too.
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We will lose games at this level and to teams you don't expect just as we beat teams you wouldn't expect to , that Premier League life. What bothers me is the limp, lifeless performances that have become normal now. I'm not knee jerking as I've seen most things from the Albion but if Clarke and the coaching staff can't get a better effort from whatever players pull on the stripes on Saturday tea time in a Midlands Derby then IMO serious question's should be asked regarding leadership and motivation .
I posted this after QPR ...going on last night 1st half Clarke and co failed what i asked but somehow second half pulled it out the fire . I still ask questions regarding motivation and this awful habit of playing players out of position (how much more balanced do we look with JT ?) , I'm hoping for a continued improvement at Everton .
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I would agree with the motivational side of it too be honest.
If they only react to rollockings do it before the game ;)
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This is nothing personal against you DudleyLad as i think thousands think the same as you (including my dad, we had this discussion about the Europa League as he doesnt want us to get in it)
But i desperately want us to get in the Europa League, i want to see new teams, travel aboard watching Albion and more importantly its another competition we may win (okay its a long shot) to me we have 2 competitions every year we can win, the season runs from August to May, by January we are out the competitions we can win.
I think clubs and fans should always want to win things, have aims, as an Albion fan i can accept we wont win the Premiership, we are there to make up the numbers, but also if we dont want to get in the europa, we are literally just playing fixtures for the sake of it, to earn enough points to stay on the money train that is the Premier league, thats not sport or entertainment.
I hate the Premiership with a passion, i find the other 3 leagues below a lot more competitive and enjoyable as a whole package, if we were in the Europa league and in a relegation battle, so be it, if we went down, so be it, we arent going to do a Blues and go bust but by just aiming to to stay in the premiership to earn more money, yet when we earn this extra money what are we going to do with it if we dont want to aim higher?
I am realistic and think we are building slowly and sensibly but from a fans point of view, if we dont make the europa this season, so be it, but last year we said as we had had two steady seasons we should aim for europa this season, i can full well see us next season saying the same, season after we should aim higher but do as a club and fans really want it?
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Albion 79
You've made a very good point there. For teams like us, Fulham, Swansea, Stoke etc who are now established in the Premiership, we have to question its very purpose. None of us are going to win the Premiership or qualify for the Champions League because we just cannot compete sufficiently to build a squad with enough depth of quality. Trying to succeed in the Europa League would enhance the prospects of relegation. All that's left is staying up, and doing well in the two domestic Cups. Perversely, its more exciting for us if we don't secure our place in the Premiership until March or April, which is frankly ridiculous.
Until the Financial Fair Play rules finally kick in, which will give us a greater chance of finishing in the top 4, there needs to be something extra to incentivise us. A trophy and extra prize money for the highest finishing club outside of United, City, Chelsea, Arsenal, Tottenham and Liverpool?
Lets face it, the Premiership right now in mid-January consists of 6 or 7 clubs realistically fighting for Europe, 6 or 7 clubs fighting to stay up, and 6 or 7 clubs who just need to avoid being dragged into the relegation battle. Not much motivation at all for that middle 6 or 7 clubs, and I don't think much has changed for the last 15 years.
We all know that 13 or 14 clubs COULD feasibly be relegated at the start of the season, and that only 6 or 7 clubs COULD qualify for Champions League. That latter number needs to increase, and hopefully the Financial Fair Play rules will be the catalyst.
Knowing that barring a miracle or a disaster, a team like ours will finish between 7th and 14th each year is what makes the Premiership very boring between Christmas and Easter. It just breeds complacency.
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I think on balance Clarke has got more right than he has got wrong. However he does take risks yesterday for instance taking Yacob out of the midfield (a forced change) and replacing him with Thomas was high risk. There were times when we could have been completely overrun and it was as likely that we ended up on the wrong end of a 4:0 defeat than pulling it back to 2:2. My guess that a more cautious coach (Hodgson for instance) would have replaced Yacob with Thorn and tried to work their way back into the game with the same basic shape.
Hodgson was criticised on here on occasion for being a bit rigid and not making changes when circumstances sometimes seem to beg for a change to be made. Clarke at least does try to change the game from the bench but there will be times when that it goes wrong and we will ship 4 goals.
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We all know that 13 or 14 clubs COULD feasibly be relegated at the start of the season, and that only 6 or 7 clubs COULD qualify for Champions League. That latter number needs to increase, and hopefully the Financial Fair Play rules will be the catalyst.
While the likes of Blatter are in control of FIFA, I don't hold much hope for Financial Fair Play. Blatter and his cronies are well known for bribes and back-handers, they thrive on finances being unfair and biased.
This scheme is another example of hollow words, just like the 'Kick racism out of football' campaign. Half-arsed and only taken seriously by a handful of people, mainly the English.
I doubt it will have any effect at all on The Albion or anyone else for that matter. I hope I'm wrong though.
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There was always going to be a point where questions of Steve Clarke would be asked but the second half performance last night was encouraging and hopefully a return to the West Brom of old. Ultimately, the players have let him down recently with the failure to defend routine balls in the box against Reading, and there appalling attitude in the first half last night. Thankfully Steve Clarke got a reaction from them and one which has saved our bacon in the end.
We've still had a good season so far, although the form of late looks like ruining the early season form and putting dents into what has been a positive season for the club, however, once our key players have returned, there will be a period where we start winning games frequently and picking up points. That's the nature of football and the Premier League, none of us know what to expect and that's why this league is so entertaining. However, if we are going to start picking up points then the attitude of the players and fans alike shall need to change.
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The three points that we threw away at Reading lsdt Saturday and the two home points dropped yesterday would have put us 5th before today's games.
Just saying....
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But thats football its always full of if's, buts and maybes.
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Correct, but those 5 points would have changed people's views substantially.
We are a very fickle lot!
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I think some fans need to get a sense of realism as to where we actually are as a club. Its fine to dream but sometimes dreams are either just that or will take alot longer than some expect them too.
The idea that West Bromwich Albion is anywhere near suffering from lack of "realism" is a stretch. It's a club that has achieved the great heights of mid-tableness -- and there it seems likely to stay, or slip down from.
It's an investment for JP. No danger of anyone not acting "sensibly" while there's pounds to be carefully extracted.
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I think in general ... we have and we will continue to suffer without the anchor of the two defensive midfield players on the park.
In simple terms our defence will continue to be more exposed when they are off the park ... Thorn seems a possible stop gap ... But Dorrans, Brunt, Morrison, Gera etc ARE NOT defensively, destructive type of players.
When the two Defensive Midfield births are filled with the above , we will be exposed and in general have to score a minimum 2-3 goals to give ourselves the chance of victory ... 'because a sure as eggs are eggs we will concede too easily.
We will get more than 47 points .... we will finish above 10th and we will remain an established Mid Table Side ... (Remember we've only just arrived in the middle of the table)
Let's enjoy the ride .... having followed the Baggies since 1971 ... there have been far far more lows than highs believe me over 42 years ... and I for one am going to enjoy this moment ...because Guys it very often HAS BEEN a lot worse than where we are at the moment ... Believe me.
We Know What We are ..... Says it all really, if we really believe it.
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Jesus, thanks for the misery. ;) No offense, but you sound like Mr. Gradgrind in Hard Times!
(http://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Society/Pix/pictures/2010/4/19/1271690135698/Patrick-Allen-as-Mr-Gradg-001.jpg)
Where is the misery? My posts in this thread have been about defending SC and commenting on what a good season we've had! There are plenty of miserable fans floating around this forum but I'm certainly not one of them.
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ftp://Nothing wrong with a bit of ambition. I am weary also of hearing people reminding us of where we sit in the table. It's perfectly reasonable to want to see a bit of improvement this year.
8th is a bit of improvement though.
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I was a bit shocked when I saw the second half:
We were actually winning second balls! :o
We were battling as if we meant it! :o
We had a bit of tempo and drive! :o
We had desire! :o
WHY? WHY? have we been so Listless, Lifeless, Limp these winter months, when all it takes is a bit of desire to at least show that you want to compete?
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The idea that West Bromwich Albion is anywhere near suffering from lack of "realism" is a stretch. It's a club that has achieved the great heights of mid-tableness -- and there it seems likely to stay, or slip down from.
It's an investment for JP. No danger of anyone not acting "sensibly" while there's pounds to be carefully extracted.
I think there is a lack of realism in quite a few whether thats because some younger fans dont remember the mis-management of the late 80's and 90's I dont know but the club is light years away from where it was five years ago let alone ten. For me the business and football model Peace puts in place has meant we have evolved as a club and will continue to do so.
So no I dont think to suggest some fans have no sense of realism is quite a just argument. Id take mid-table each season for a good while yet if it means as a club we can build on a solid foundation.
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The realism is we are level on points with Arsenal and Liverppol after 23 games played this season. That is 2/3rds of the season played and we are still matching clubs with huge spending power (if wenger wants to spend). Liverpool have just spent £12m on Sturridge and even though they say though don't spend , Everton spent £12m on Fellaini, £6m on Jelavic and some Greek guy cost a few bob as well.
It is amazing how quickly things can change in football, look at Newcastle United and to some degree the vile. Last season NUFC were the surprise team, they had spent big, Cabaye, Ben Arfa, Cisse, santon, Ba and look at him now. They are claiming injuries are crippling them , just like we have had ours.
Lets be positive, we are NOT in a relegation battle, we are still battling for a top 7 spot (unlikely but still there) and have so much to be grateful for.
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All true. But tbh it's a miracle we are still top half of the table with the awful run we are on. 2 wins in 10 (12) games! The PL is very strange this year.
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The realism is we are level on points with Arsenal and Liverppol after 23 games played this season. That is 2/3rds of the season played and we are still matching clubs with huge spending power (if wenger wants to spend). Liverpool have just spent £12m on Sturridge and even though they say though don't spend , Everton spent £12m on Fellaini, £6m on Jelavic and some Greek guy cost a few bob as well.
It is amazing how quickly things can change in football, look at Newcastle United and to some degree the vile. Last season NUFC were the surprise team, they had spent big, Cabaye, Ben Arfa, Cisse, santon, Ba and look at him now. They are claiming injuries are crippling them , just like we have had ours.
Lets be positive, we are NOT in a relegation battle, we are still battling for a top 7 spot (unlikely but still there) and have so much to be grateful for.
Positive is a word some of the posters on here have never heard of. Look at where we are now then look at where we were at this time last season . Improvement or what?
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All true. But tbh it's a miracle we are still top half of the table with the awful run we are on. 2 wins in 10 (12) games! The PL is very strange this year.
Yes it is STRANGE as you say and thats what makes me even more frustrated as this year we could have taken advantage in a big way and really done something, but it seems we have let the opportunity pass us by, again.
Just like we always do !
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Yes it is STRANGE as you say and thats what makes me even more frustrated as this year we could have taken advantage in a big way and really done something, but it seems we have let the opportunity pass us by, again.
Just like we always do !
I bet Chelsea fans are saying the same thing after their last two home games against QPR and Southampton!!!
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Yes it is STRANGE as you say and thats what makes me even more frustrated as this year we could have taken advantage in a big way and really done something, but it seems we have let the opportunity pass us by, again.
Just like we always do !
I'm not sure that is correct, the opportunity this year was to stay in this league when the money increased, we have pretty well done that, to achieve a top 7 finish requires massive investment (£30-40million+), we simply do not have that kind of money to splash, so we cut our cloth accordingly, that means, bargain centre backs who are good as long as they are not exposed to pace (the pacy variety cost an awful lot more and is the reason Ollson is going nowhere) and a thin squad that gets weary through the winter months (and picks up injuries through being over played).
This is our lot, the disappointment for me was our cup performances, but we are still a few players short of competeing in even those competitions in all probability.
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The realism is we are level on points with Arsenal and Liverppol after 23 games played this season. That is 2/3rds of the season played and we are still matching clubs with huge spending power (if wenger wants to spend). Liverpool have just spent £12m on Sturridge and even though they say though don't spend , Everton spent £12m on Fellaini, £6m on Jelavic and some Greek guy cost a few bob as well.
It is amazing how quickly things can change in football, look at Newcastle United and to some degree the vile. Last season NUFC were the surprise team, they had spent big, Cabaye, Ben Arfa, Cisse, santon, Ba and look at him now. They are claiming injuries are crippling them , just like we have had ours.
Lets be positive, we are NOT in a relegation battle, we are still battling for a top 7 spot (unlikely but still there) and have so much to be grateful for.
a very good post! i think at times some people on here think we are Barcelona!
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a very good post! i think at times some people on here think we are Barcelona!
I agree. And we are in this league position, level with Arsenal and Liverpool, DESPITE just two wins in 12 games!
It's a decent season. We are doing ok despite not living up to our earlier high standards.
We belong!
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Yeah great 8th - about same as last season.
at this time last season we were 15th (and had been for a few matches) and about 8 to 9 points worse of..
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He's still learning, our impressive start to the season raised our expectations of him and now when things aren't going quite the way they were questions are naturally going to be asked. Realistically he's done a great job so far for us but even experienced coaches like Hodgson went through tough periods with us.
He talks the talk that much is plain to see. This period is his first real test of his abilities as a number 1, he does some baffling things but again going back to Hodgson he did similar and big questions were asked of him too.
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I'm not sure that is correct, the opportunity this year was to stay in this league when the money increased, we have pretty well done that, to achieve a top 7 finish requires massive investment (£30-40million+), we simply do not have that kind of money to splash, so we cut our cloth accordingly, that means, bargain centre backs who are good as long as they are not exposed to pace (the pacy variety cost an awful lot more and is the reason Ollson is going nowhere) and a thin squad that gets weary through the winter months (and picks up injuries through being over played).
This is our lot, the disappointment for me was our cup performances, but we are still a few players short of competeing in even those competitions in all probability.
No the opportunity in a poor premier league was to finish in a REALLY high position, not just 17th FFS !
Everyone agrees this season the league is poor and we looked like we could take advantage but same old Albion, pass up the opportunity for mediocrity !
Why finish 3rd or 4th which is within our capabilities this season when we can all be happy finishing 17th !!! after all we should dare to finish high in the league should we, after all we are only little old ALBION !!
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No the opportunity in a poor premier league was to finish in a REALLY high position, not just 17th FFS !
Everyone agrees this season the league is poor and we looked like we could take advantage but same old Albion, pass up the opportunity for mediocrity !
Why finish 3rd or 4th which is within our capabilities this season when we can all be happy finishing 17th !!! after all we should dare to finish high in the league should we, after all we are only little old ALBION !!
But the facts just do not back up your arguements, its a fact that as a general rule, your Premiership spend governs your finishing position, our cup performance is a disappointment and I would agree an under achievement.
If the Premiership is weaker this year, its primarily as a result of financial mis management and overspending to achieve the goals you seek (Bolton Blacburn etc), we are benefitting form this and in the long term, will continue to do so.
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I had to smile when I read that Albion started performing on Saturday after Clarke gave them a half time rollicking. Perhaps in future he should kick their backsides before the start of the first half. ;D ;D ;D
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I think Clarke expects the players to be a bit self motivated. I just can't understand the way we have played for two months now (pre second half against Villa). Slack jawed, limp, uncompetitive, or to quote a comment on the Guardian re our first half against Villa - "a strangely listless Albion".
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No the opportunity in a poor premier league was to finish in a REALLY high position, not just 17th FFS !
Everyone agrees this season the league is poor and we looked like we could take advantage but same old Albion, pass up the opportunity for mediocrity !
Why finish 3rd or 4th which is within our capabilities this season when we can all be happy finishing 17th !!! after all we should dare to finish high in the league should we, after all we are only little old ALBION !!
Do you genuinely believe that finishing 3rd or 4th is within our capabilities? What about the likes of Arsenal, Liverpool, Tottenham and Everton, all of whom have financial budgets that blow us out of the water.
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Do you genuinely believe that finishing 3rd or 4th is within our capabilities? What about the likes of Arsenal, Liverpool, Tottenham and Everton, all of who. Have financial budgets that blow us out of the water.
I would argue that 3rd or 4th is way beyond our capabilities and anyone really believing that is delusional.
In fact if we did achieve this imo "impossibility", it would possibly hamper our incremental stabilization in the PL. I would go as far as to argue that a champions league qualification place may, repeat may, send us into a Leeds style downward spiral into the Championship.
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Anyone who thought that we would finish in 3rd or 4th this season is living in dreamland, i'm sure we would all love to see us upset the odds a little bit and have a season to remember, but COME ON, isn't this season still good enough? If someone said to us at the beginning of the season that we would be around the top 8 still competing with Arsenal and Liverpool, we would have snapped their hand off, sure the cups were disappointing, but for me its the luck of the draw, it could have been worse. We could have been like Wolves did and lost to Luton and look where they are now... i'll tell you what Villa, Blues and Wolves would kill to be in our position right now. some of our "fans" need to be realisitic.
http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/west-brom-2-2-aston-villa-1546969
This shows that Clarke can step up to the plate as a manager i reckon.
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I think the second half comeback, shows how good of a manager we have in Steve Clarke. He said the right things and the players delivered.
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I think the second half comeback, shows how good of a manager we have in Steve Clarke. He said the right things and the players delivered.
Good point. Foster has come out today and said that Clarke went ballistic at the team at half-time, which obviously had the desired effect. He still makes mistakes but so do all managers at times, even the best, but I am a lot happier under Clarke than Hodgson which says a lot considering the superb job Roy did during his tenure.
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But the facts just do not back up your arguements, its a fact that as a general rule, your Premiership spend governs your finishing position, our cup performance is a disappointment and I would agree an under achievement.
If the Premiership is weaker this year, its primarily as a result of financial mis management and overspending to achieve the goals you seek (Bolton Blacburn etc), we are benefitting form this and in the long term, will continue to do so.
What facts are you referring to ?? I'm referring to the fact that we always let opportunities pass us by, anyone who has supported us for any length of time knows thats a fact. I'm referring to the fact that had we beaten the last 3 teams instead of losing twice and drawing once, we'd be 5th in the table and barring shef Wed, be in the quater final of the FA cup FFS !! NOW THOSE ARE FACTS !!
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What facts are you referring to ?? I'm referring to the fact that we always let opportunities pass us by, anyone who has supported us for any length of time knows thats a fact. I'm referring to the fact that had we beaten the last 3 teams instead of losing twice and drawing once, we'd be 5th in the table and barring shef Wed, be in the quater final of the FA cup FFS !! NOW THOSE ARE FACTS !!
Stop shouting, you'll have a heart attack!
I stated what fact I was refering to, that money spent on teams in the Premiership is reflected in the finishing position, I wish it was not true, but it is, fact.
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Stop shouting, you'll have a heart attack!
I stated what fact I was refering to, that money spent on teams in the Premiership is reflected in the finishing position, I wish it was not true, but it is, fact.
By and large yes it is a fact but everyone agrees that a higher than normal finishing position is up for grabs this season, Liverpool have been in the bottom half of the table until christmas and how often does that happen ( not often enough is the nswer your looking for ) but its symptomatic of the way the league has panned out this season.
United will probably win it again but even their team, if you look at it com pared to past teams they have had ( barring RVP ) IS WEAKER THAN PREVIOUS SEASONS !!
I just feel we've let ( another ) golden opportunity pass us by and the cup ( not ) run is a joke !
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By and large yes it is a fact but everyone agrees that a higher than normal finishing position is up for grabs this season, Liverpool have been in the bottom half of the table until christmas and how often does that happen ( not often enough is the nswer your looking for ) but its symptomatic of the way the league has panned out this season.
United will probably win it again but even their team, if you look at it com pared to past teams they have had ( barring RVP ) IS WEAKER THAN PREVIOUS SEASONS !!
I just feel we've let ( another ) golden opportunity pass us by and the cup ( not ) run is a joke !
I'm as dissapointed as you Greenock, I was absolutely gutted after the QPR defeat, I had a row with the missus, sulked for two days, I want us to win something in my lifetime and I'm 52 this year! :o
The way football is in this country, you have to be in the Premiership or its just existing, I don't like the way it is, but I have to accept it, we are still punching above our weight.
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Anyone who thought that we would finish in 3rd or 4th this season is living in dreamland, ... some of our "fans" need to be realisitic.
What the heck is this near-continual refrain about being "realistic"? It's like a disease. I'm so sick of hearing it. Apart from being patronising -- does anyone honestly think the average Baggie fan hasn't learned a bit of sensible perspective? -- it's a bit like the schoolmarmish scold. Football fans dream.
Jeez. Save your storied "realism" for household budgeting, motorway safety, and proctology exams. ;D
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I just feel we've let ( another ) golden opportunity pass us by and the cup ( not ) run is a joke !
That is the truth. If the squads we'd fielded had been incapable of winning those matches, I would disagree, but that's not the case. You're right. We could have -- and FFS should have -- won. It's beyond disappointing.
That said, we've seen now what it's really going to take to make sustained, repeated inroads on the top of the table, and here I agree perhaps with Greenock that we don't have the resources.
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What the heck is this near-continual refrain about being "realistic"? It's like a disease. I'm so sick of hearing it. Apart from being patronising -- does anyone honestly think the average Baggie fan hasn't learned a bit of sensible perspective? -- it's a bit like the schoolmarmish scold. Football fans dream.
Jeez. Save your storied "realism" for household budgeting, motorway safety, and proctology exams. ;D
Although I agree with the sentiments of many posters calling for realism (or rather an acknowledgment of where we were and what we wanted pre-Hodgson) I must say the quoted post is very funny. Very good point too.
It wasn't long ago that mid-table obscurity was the dream. We've got sick of it much quicker than I thought we would.
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What the heck is this near-continual refrain about being "realistic"? It's like a disease. I'm so sick of hearing it. Apart from being patronising -- does anyone honestly think the average Baggie fan hasn't learned a bit of sensible perspective? -- it's a bit like the schoolmarmish scold. Football fans dream.
Jeez. Save your storied "realism" for household budgeting, motorway safety, and proctology exams. ;D
Well obviously not when you see people moaning about being 8th in the league and suggesting we should be challenging the top 4...
It's OK to dream; we all do it. I'd like nothing better than to see us challenging further up the league and competing for trophies on a regular basis. The issue is when people start thinking that their dreams should be reality.
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Good point. Foster has come out today and said that Clarke went ballistic at the team at half-time, which obviously had the desired effect. He still makes mistakes but so do all managers at times, even the best, but I am a lot happier under Clarke than Hodgson which says a lot considering the superb job Roy did during his tenure.
I admire Clarke. I'm a pretty calm and level headed guy (yes really, even if I can be obnoxious with my rants/posts on the forums here) but I don't think I could have kept my calm so long as he did after recent performances. He was a very, very lucky guy we were only 2-0 down at half time so he had a chance to turn it around.
It was so funny when Foster said he doesn't understand a word when 'he [Clarke] is like that' but that he still got the message... I guess Clarke goes back to 'Scottish' when mad enough ;D
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It was so funny when Foster said he doesn't understand a word when 'he [Clarke] is like that' but that he still got the message... I guess Clarke goes back to 'Scottish' when mad enough ;D
Why does getting yelled at angrily always sounds a lot less threatening and a lot more meaningful in Scottish?
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I think anyone doubting his man-management skills was proved wrong on Saturday, fantastic turn around and it seems that the dressing room dressing-down he handed out did the trick. Keep the faith!
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Good point. Foster has come out today and said that Clarke went ballistic at the team at half-time, which obviously had the desired effect. He still makes mistakes but so do all managers at times, even the best, but I am a lot happier under Clarke than Hodgson which says a lot considering the superb job Roy did during his tenure.
I'm a little concerned that a game as big as that one being a local derby and with the previous poor results that they needed the manager to go ballistic at half time to get them playing like they did in the second half. They should have been well up for it from the off.
I'm happy with the job he's done so far, if anything our early form works against him as we got to expect so much more of the team.
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I'm a little concerned that a game as big as that one being a local derby and with the previous poor results that they needed the manager to go ballistic at half time to get them playing like they did in the second half. They should have been well up for it from the off.
I'm happy with the job he's done so far, if anything our early form works against him as we got to expect so much more of the team.
I agree. The way our team just allowed Villa to roll us over was gutless. Granted, looking at stats it looked like we've created some opportunities but the majority of those were ballooned into the roof of the Smethwick End. I think we had one meaningful effort which just wasn't good enough in a derby occasion, especially against a brittle defence which has conceded goals left right and centre. Thankfully we turned it around in the second half but I must question why that intensity and desire wasn't there in the first place. Villa did play well and I'll credit them for that, but we contributed to our downfall by allowing them to have it so easy.
I also loved Steve Clarke's reaction after our equaliser, it obviously meant a lot to him and that was good to see. We haven't seen much emotion from him on the touchlines but he generally seemed delighted which was extremely pleasing. He was obviously hurting as much as us after our first half display.
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We are currently in eighth place in the Premier League, on level points with 6th and 7th (Arsenal and Liverpool). Considering the current form we are in this is nothing short of remarkable don't you think?
On the plus side, if we 'always' let these golden opportunities pass us by........surely there is no need to be disappointed is there, as we are used to it by now?
I know its not what some want to hear but, we used to be really pooh..........and I mean REALLY pooh, most of us remember those dark days. Now we are eighth (Joint 6th with Arsenal and Liverpool) and some are a little disappointed (Which as long as it's not taken too far, isn't necessarily a bad thing). Look how far we have come!
Back on topic....Steve Clarke is (in my eyes) doing a great job!
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Lost his way and the football is dire.We have less possession than any other team on most match days.
Like someone said on the match day thread his early success is the momentum from Roys time.I expect an up tempo performance against Spurs otherwise i wont be happy >:(
We decide to play a little when its too late
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I must say I really don't understand our tactics, our defence isn't very good, so quite why we sit back and allow teams to dominate us I don't know. It's meaning we're having to score 2 goals every single match just to get points at best. I wouldn't even mind if it was good teams controlling us, but teams like Reading who always have less possession also end up forcing us back and getting 60% possession against us.
You look at the amount of goals we concede late on and its largely due to the fact the team isn't good enough to sit back and repel constant attacks. Somehow it worked in the first half of the season but the clean sheets noticeably dried up very quickly this season. It seems very peculiar that we rely on probably what is man for man, the weakest area of our team, to be what rely on virtually every game.
Last year it worked because how Hodgson drills his teams, he can make average players play above themselves. Right now our average players look exactly what they are. I wouldn't back the team based on paper or performances to survive next season.
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Players don't look up for it and we have to go behind before playing.
75mins is "Rosenberg Time" regardless of match situation.
Why play Thorne ahead of Yacob? If Yacob's not fit don't select him at all. Thorne looks like a frightened rabbit.
Midfield is completely lop-sided, 1 natural winger in Thomas.
Cannot afford to leave out Long or Lukaku, why not play 442 and go for it instead of relying on a dire 5 man midfield?
Brunt contributes next to zero and always plays regardless.
Absolutely no pace in side apart from PO, Lukaku, Long and to a lesser extent Popov & Jones.
Why no transfer activity when the team is woefully short?
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1 up top usually a raw kid against seasoned pro's.
Hoofing it up top
Dozy 60 mins again
Boring, uninspiring.
Defenders all over the place.
I'm not saying sack him but im very worried , it's like Robson and RDM rolled into one and like this we will struggle next season.
oh and forgot the predictable 60 min sub!
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The Clarke honeymoon period is well and truly over. Unless we start improving rapidly then talk of a divorce will start to gather momentum >:(
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(http://i1359.photobucket.com/albums/q786/jon7w/clarkecrossword_zpsae9051f4.jpg)
May have something to do with the lack of tactics....far too busy!!
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I think any talk of his job being on the line soon is very, very, very premature. I think he has clearly earned the right to be in charge next season. I'm finding it hard to judge him at the moment. For the last 2 months we have been crippled by an awful run of injuries where every one of our top players have all suffered with at least 1 or 2 games out of the team. (I cant think of any of our better players who have played all over this period, can you?)
Today for instance Mulumbu, Gera, Odemwingie and Reid were all out while Yacob is quite evidently half fit and Long was back for the first time in ages so had to go on the bench.
It probably wont get much better all season now as we have sold player, lost players for the season and not mended the gaps that have appeared in our team with a signing or two, which is tying one of Clarke's hands behind his back if you excuse the cliche.
All that said, we are looking very flat now game after game and without Odemwingie's odd burst of dynamism, I do worry that we could be in trouble of slipping towards the bottom 6 by the end of the season. We will stay up of course but I am growing tired of this poor run of form now. It's been a few months and 13-14 games where we have won 2 games. That is bottom 3 form.
If anything though, this just highlights the mistake we have made this month in our club policy not to sign anybody. The energy has gone from the side. I only hope it is rediscovered by the reintroduction of Mulumbu and a fit Yacob (and not the half fit version we have seen in his last two appearances).
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I'm starting to worry about what's going on at our club. We must be the only club in the world who will not strengthen when they are doing well in jan. as for Clark, I'm starting to seriously worry about thus guy. I have been frankly bored watching us at home for a while, when did we last play well got 90 mins? We need probably one more win this year but history shows that the team finishing poorly goes into next you poorly and I can only see one result at the minute
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The Clarke honeymoon period is well and truly over. Unless we start improving rapidly then talk of a divorce will start to gather momentum >:(
Haha quality!! If we are going to sack a manager everytime we have a bad 7-8 weeks we will have 2 managers a season in this league.
Its not looking good at the moment but Ive seen enough from this team to think we can turn it around. Anyone who even thinks of anything like sacking Clarke after the 6 months we have had really need to re-think how football works.
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:( needs to change things around upbeat about tonight's gamer due to clarks comments about ten days with the squad and no match
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When was the last time we actually played well?
The players seem to be lacking motivation to me and just seem to be going through the motions.
There is a level of complacancy throughout the club at the moment with an assumption that we are safe. It will only take a couple of sides towards the bottom to put a few results together then were right back in the mix.
The premier league isn't very good again this year and i'm afraid that our current level of performance is completley unaceptable.
I think Steve may have to change his tune now regarding reinforcements considering we have yet another injury.
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I'm starting to get very worried with Clarke and with this team. Why on earth have we not made any signings even a loan signing. Ridgewell and Andrews made a good impace towards the end of last season.
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It is a bit late for that now red head - there are just over 24 hours left as I type this.
We should have planned for this as soon as QPR started offering big money however I have serious doubts over whether we will actually replace Odemwingie in this window.
Losing him and Gera was always going to damage us. They were our 2 first choice wide men. I said last summer we needed a new wide man but we only bought in one, Yassine El Ghanassy who was a gamble squad player who has been written off already. Bearing in mind we were, in my opinions, a wide man light at the start of the season, I now feel we are 3 wide men light going into the final 4 months of the season.
We have shot ourselves in the foot, we only have ourselves to blame.
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I'm starting to get very worried with Clarke and with this team. Why on earth have we not made any signings even a loan signing. Ridgewell and Andrews made a good impace towards the end of last season.
Both also came in the last 3 hours of the transfer window. That window we only brought in Allan outside of that last day.
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I got a bit of stick when I posted this topic. Have your opinions changed? How much longer does he have until fans start getting on his back?
The fans wont get on his back the idiots who like moaning and dont understand football will! If we sack a manager when we are 9th we will be more of a laughing stock than Chelsea. Have faith for him to turn it around. I have never ever seen a team where constantly changing managers works!
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I still have faith in Clarke and would see it very poor of the club to sack him. I just think that he needs to change one or two things which will be made easier once we have Yacob and Mulumbu back.
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1 up top usually a raw kid against seasoned pro's.
Hoofing it up top
Dozy 60 mins again
Boring, uninspiring.
Defenders all over the place.
I'm not saying sack him but im very worried , it's like Robson and RDM rolled into one and like this we will struggle next season.
oh and forgot the predictable 60 min sub!
Dexy, I think this is the levelling out that if we are all brutally honest about where we are as a club was always going to come at some point. Its a difficult thing to accept that the very best we can ever probably really expect in this league is to be mediocre at best. So in reality there is actually not much to play for other than the cash the PL brings, local bragging rights and a hopeful punt at one of the cups.
I actually think he has done a pretty good job so far. I mean most of us if not all would have accepted 34 from 24 at this point. My main concern at the moment is the formation. In the early season when the weather was fairer and teams were still working each other out it worked pretty well but since the injuries have kicked in it looks suspect. The main problem is that it seems to isolate the lone striker if the opposition press the ball because we are not quick enough to move the ball Swansea style. I would rather we went to Roys 442 which gives us a cutting edge but doesnt abandon sound defensive principles. Mulumbu is a huge miss if im honest and one or two others really need to lift their game and show more leadership. We need to get to the 40 point mark asap.
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When was the last time we actually played well?
The players seem to be lacking motivation to me and just seem to be going through the motions.
There is a level of complacancy throughout the club at the moment with an assumption that we are safe. It will only take a couple of sides towards the bottom to put a few results together then were right back in the mix.
The premier league isn't very good again this year and i'm afraid that our current level of performance is completley unaceptable.
I think Steve may have to change his tune now regarding reinforcements considering we have yet another injury.
We played well 2nd half against Villa and the same again tonight.
Once we get the balance we`ll be alright.
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If we don't get the 8 points i have predicted then i expect him to go at the end of the season .Momentum of last season took us up to November.Now he seems clueless
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It is a bit late for that now red head - there are just over 24 hours left as I type this.
We should have planned for this as soon as QPR started offering big money however I have serious doubts over whether we will actually replace Odemwingie in this window.
Losing him and Gera was always going to damage us. They were our 2 first choice wide men. I said last summer we needed a new wide man but we only bought in one, Yassine El Ghanassy who was a gamble squad player who has been written off already. Bearing in mind we were, in my opinions, a wide man light at the start of the season, I now feel we are 3 wide men light going into the final 4 months of the season.
We have shot ourselves in the foot, we only have ourselves to blame.
Agree with all that regarding wide players.
Think we should all do ourselves a favour and try and forget about deadline day tomorrow :(
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When was the last time we actually played well?
The players seem to be lacking motivation to me and just seem to be going through the motions.
There is a level of complacancy throughout the club at the moment with an assumption that we are safe. It will only take a couple of sides towards the bottom to put a few results together then were right back in the mix.
The premier league isn't very good again this year and i'm afraid that our current level of performance is completley unaceptable.
I think Steve may have to change his tune now regarding reinforcements considering we have yet another injury.
My question would be When last our last good January? It's like our version of Chelsea's November.
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We played well 2nd half against Villa and the same again tonight.
Once we get the balance we`ll be alright.
I wouldn't say we played well in the second half.Everton took their foot off the gas thinking we were going to be has abject from the first
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I hope Clarke is learning a lot of lessons with this campaign. You cannot compromise and play pretend belief when it comes to the strength of the squad. At the end of the day it is his job on the line. He needs to be tougher with management and with the players and ruthless in his assessment of the squad. It's alright being a nice, mature bloke but now he is in charge of a big operation and sometimes he needs to make real decisions without if/buts/hopes getting in the way.
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I hope Clarke is learning a lot of lessons with this campaign. You cannot compromise and play pretend belief when it comes to the strength of the squad. At the end of the day it is his job on the line. He needs to be tougher with management and with the players and ruthless in his assessment of the squad. It's alright being a nice, mature bloke but now he is in charge of a big operation and sometimes he needs to make real decisions without if/buts/hopes getting in the way.
Good point mate, Clarkes got the next few months to learn from his mistakes this season ready to kick on next season. Lets not ruin our season by expectations. At the start 90% of people on here said they would be happy with 15th-17th place, Im confident we will pick up more wins to get to 50 points.
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We mentioned last season that Roy Hodgson annoyed us for being too stubborn and that the best managers in the game are those which are willing to adapt themselves and their sides. Hodgson was predominantly a 442 man and from this season so far, Clarke looks like a man which favours the 4231 approach. What I do hope from Steve Clarke is that he doesn't become to stubborn and sets his foot in stone with that formation, when times are bad, I would like to see him experiment and try something different. Afterall, there have been times this season where he has altered the formation of the side and it's done us favours, maybe we could do with replicating that in hope that it has a positive effect on our form and performances. I remember Roy Hodgson changing our formation late January at Stoke and getting very positive results the following month.
This season was always going to throw learning curves in the direction of Steve Clarke. I just hope he continues to learn quickly otherwise what could have been a potentially good season will feel no different to any other. He and the side are in need of something which can create a positive feel good factor because at the moment, things from the club and from the supporters feel downbeat.
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Clarke's results will improve when he gets his best players back (minus one sadly).
One of the main things this season has thought us is that our squad is not as strong as we had hoped it was.
2 more or less lucky wins in 12 something games tells a story.
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Pleased to see Clarke saying he will be taking a look at himself after tonight's defeat and also there will be a transfer meeting tonight or tomorrow.
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No wins in 7 now with Spurs and Liverpool up next. If that is extended to 10 I'll be worried.
If you look at 10 games as a quarter of a season, to not win a game over that period of time would be very concerning.
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Clarke's results will improve when he gets his best players back (minus one sadly).
One of the main things this season has thought us is that our squad is not as strong as we had hoped it was.
2 more or less lucky wins in 12 something games tells a story.
i am sorry to say its not the personal that are picked its the formation one up top [lakaku] hoofing it the ball dont stick its the same recently no pentnitration first half 60 mins in subs made when we are behind then rosenburg gets on for the last quarter teams have sussed us out this is relagation form if clarkes in charge next season we will be down i know hes just been sacked but i would send for mcinness i am sure he would do well with a better sqaud than what he has previously managed and a baggie legend and leader >:(
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i am sorry to say its not the personal that are picked its the formation one up top [lakaku] hoofing it the ball dont stick its the same recently no pentnitration first half 60 mins in subs made when we are behind then rosenburg gets on for the last quarter teams have sussed us out this is relagation form if clarkes in charge next season we will be down i know hes just been sacked but i would send for mcinness i am sure he would do well with a better sqaud than what he has previously managed and a baggie legend and leader >:(
Wouldn't want McInnes anywhere near the club without at least another five years experience and neither would you if he hadn't played for the club. 4-5-1 has worked this season, The ball doesn't stick to either Lukaku or Long but we have got some very good results nonetheless, I do wonder how much longer we can go on in the formation without trying Fortuné up top though.
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Our biggest problem atm is midfield though. We are so soft, slow and ponderous and it puts tremendous pressure on our not so hot fullbacks and our overstretched centerbacks. Completely different to how we started the season. With Yacob and Mulumbu back we will have our spine in place again, it's been badly missed.
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Our biggest problem atm is midfield though. We are so soft, slow and ponderous and it puts tremendous pressure on our not so hot fullbacks and our overstretched centerbacks. Completely different to how we started the season. With Yacob and Mulumbu back we will have our spine in place again, it's been badly missed.
Do you think it will improve our creativity though without Gera and Odemwingie. It will help defensively but I still worry.
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Do you think it will improve our creativity though without Gera and Odemwingie. It will help defensively but I still worry.
At least it will free up Brunty. He was one of the only players today that played the ball straight forward and found our strikers and JT. And we'd look like we have a prem team out there again.
But yes, creativity has been a problem all season. In fact I think Clarke should give up the idea of playing two dm's as it makes us so rigid. At least in some games he could try dropping Yacob down to lone dm closer in front of the cb's and have Mulumbu and Morrison in freer roles. I'd push Brunty out to the right and have JT on the left.
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At least it will free up Brunty. He was one of the only players today that played the ball straight forward and found our strikers and JT. And we'd look like we have a prem team out there again.
But yes, creativity has been a problem all season. In fact I think Clarke should give up the idea of playing two dm's as it makes us so rigid. At least in some games he could try dropping Yacob down to lone dm closer in front of the cb's and have Mulumbu and Morrison in freer roles. I'd push Brunty out to the right and have JT on the left.
The much maligned Brunt is certainly our best passer of the ball and creates more than anyone else, so having him further forward I agree will help, but unlocking a stubborn defence at home? Not so sure. Where is our next win coming from?
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With Long, Lukaku, Mozza, Mulumbu and Brunt we do have players capable of sticking the ball in the net. Lukaku can create something out of nearly nothing, and Long scores 'weird' goals like today and against Sunderland, but most important of all is to get the team game back both the offense and defense. We can't look to individuals to carry the load we have to get a functioning collective again. But yes, creativity is something we need to fix for next season.
Also, we must stop leaking goals. We are forced to score two or three goals each game to have a chance of winning. At least with a more stable defense we give ourselves a chance.
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He totally bores me but he gets my full backing at the moment
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One problem im starting to notice is that he dont cut any threat from the other team out, we have a weak link in Jones who is terrible when hes left in the winger. But last night played Dorrans whos only job should have been to cover Baines and they both let him in to easily.
Bains was a threat, Berbatov, Benteke all these players were what we needed to stop and we didnt! We have Bale coming up next and i dont see a very pretty afternoon for the right sided midfield!
Can Clarke not see where our team lacks, RB and with Mulumbu and Jacob out CDM. Why have we not gone out a coverd these possitions! A what is the point of throwing Rosenberg on and putting Lukaku on the wing when chanceing a game. Its just mind boggling at the moment.
Im starting to loose confidence, if we didnt have a good start we would be in big trouble!
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Surely everyone should be getting more than a little worried now?
Clarke seems to be doing a RDM and not be able to arrest the slide and only our good start will save though it looks a depressed end to the season coming up.
Always wondered how the 'RDM' might have ended if we hadn't of got rid so now we might find out something similar ! Where is the next win coming from ?
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Not lost faith just interest which is sad seeing as i only been able to follow us the last month i caught the bad run of form but we dont seem to be bouncing back at all or trying to correct it, were moving the ball around to slow displaying heavy touches and poor passes, to negative giving to many teams to much respect got two poor fullbacks, I know we have played outstanding this season but Clarke has hes first big test here. Come on you baggies lets see some spirit.
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Next 6 games
Liverpool A
Sunderland H
Chelsea A
Swansea H
Stoke A
West Ham A
On current form then I can see us losing them bar Sunderland. The football he is giving to us at the moment is truly woefull. Its his job to stamp his ideas into the team but at the moment I am seeing a team that can't defend well or can't do a simple 5 yard pass. A lot of fans are losing interest due to the fact were producing dire football and are out of 2 cups.
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I think a few people are getting a bit silly, what do you want us to do sack him? I believe we'll come out of this bad spell we're going through. Is it a sheer coincidence our form dips when we lost the YM/CY partnership? Lost Long for a few weeks? Once everyone bar Gera is back fit, we'll be fine. It's only because we've been positioned higher all season people aren't happy I think, if we'd have been around the 8th-12th places nobody would say anything, would they?
EDITED: TEXT SPEAK
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Good-Bye Mr Clarke,Hello Mr Atkins!
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Good-Bye Mr Clarke,Hello Mr Atkins!
Nigel Adkins, a failed Premier League manager? The mind boggles.
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Good team set up today, really enjoying the game untill the sending off spoilt it, like the 4-4-2 with Lukaku and Long, it will bring wins.
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I'm not sure Nigel Adkins is the answer at all to be honest. Only as much experience as Clarke as a Prem Manager/ Head Coach.
Clarke has a test now to see how he will deal with all thats going on both on and off pitch. I don't we're at the Clarke out stage, its the time for players and staff to sit down and if something needs sorting out then clear the air and get it sorted and get back to what we were doing earlier in the season.
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Clarke got us into the highest position in recent history and hasn't had the ability to pick either his best or a settled side in weeks. The performance that we wre putting in before Popov's madness suggests that we are regaining our early season form.
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Good-Bye Mr Clarke,Hello Mr Atkins!
Jeeeez I've heard it all now!
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I'm not saying sack Clarke, but I am getting concerned. At what point do we say enough's enough? His appearance makes me think he lacks motivation, though I'm not saying he's like that behind closed doors. Just an observation.
Some of his team starts and subs make me wander at times. I'm glad we went 442 today, but I'm so confused as to why he was so reluctant to bring in any more players when he had chance through January.
It only takes a couple of injuries (Gera & Thorne) and some silly behavior (Odemwingie & Popov) and suddenly our team is depleted. Having got rid of Jara, Dawson, Cox and Wood, that's EIGHT players the squad has lost in a matter of weeks. Thank goodness Dorrans didn't actually go, after being told he was free to go.
At first I didn't like Clarke, but when we started playing well and getting results it turned my opinion. But now, I find myself thinking 'was it just good fortune?' early on, as we seemed to have hit a slump that seems insurmountable.
I realise we're still not in a bad position, but surely thats only down to the fortune of other teams losing too? If they'd won, we'd be much further down the league.
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I've said it before and i will say it again, Clarke has been very unlucky in the last few months.
He has had to contend with an injury crisis in the last 2 months that has seen the majority of our first team and every big player bar Macauley miss a game or more due to injuries. As well as that he has lost 2 players for the season to injury, Mulumbu to the African Nations and then Peter Odemwingie due to his modern footballer arrogance.
During all of this, he has received little support from a board (and I include Ashworth and Garlick in this) who appear happy with us having all but secured another season at this level and are now looking to strange as much profit out of the season as is possible, and who have for me, written off half a season for the sake of a million or two.
Clarke has to take some blame for not getting us out of this slump and for the poor football we have played recently but then again, apart from the style of football I haven't been able to offer many alternative tactics to what he is doing at the moment. He has to be here at the start of next season, barring a spectacular run of poor results.
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Unlucky for Clarke today. I'm pleased he went with the two up front and it seemed to have worked, they were causing a problems and had the best first half we have had for a while. Positive signs were there and a point or maybe 3 were in sight. Then Popov happened.
Don't think he did much wrong at all with the subs, with a defender being sent off it was a certaintity that a striker was going to be withdrawn. Then he went for it at the end with three strikers on to try and sneak what would have been a precious result.
With the loss though i do feel the pressure is on, a very tough game next week, we have to perform to our capabilities and hope for a result. If not then the Sunderland game is a huge one for him, 0 or maybe even 1 point from the two games would seriously call questions on his future.
Big times for Clarke and the club at the moment with the ill discipline going around the place :(
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I can not believe we are even talking about Steve Clarkes future, this is a madness, we are still 9th in the Premiership, we have had a bad run with injuries on a thinnish squad, this has happened every winter to West Brom due to our smaller squad, it needs to be addressed in the long term, but please, we are turning into Dingle clones!
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Good-Bye Mr Clarke,Hello Mr Atkins!
I never mentioned getting rid but we should be concerned !
He's earnt this season at least but we need to see more in the last third of the season to give us some hope for next season.
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I never mentioned getting rid but we should be concerned !
He's earnt this season at least but we need to see more in the last third of the season to give us some hope for next season.
His main problem was that he overestimated the squad and was too accepting. When he gets his best team back out there results will improve, but it's a bit worrying that he was so naive. Then again he has never been in the hot seat before, hope he learns his lessons fast for next season.
And if he did mess with the training regime against the advice of the club's professional staff, please think again for next season.
Etc.
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I cant believe that some people want SC out, seven months or so in charge, 9th in the league with 34 points, dont these people remember the days of Brian Talbut, Dennis Smith, Brian Little, Bobby Gould and for those who dont, ask some of us old un's about the dark days in Division 2 and 3. FFS give this bloke a chance.
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It could be a lot worse....
Anybody fancy swapping our current position (points-wise or financially) with Villa, Birmingham or Wolves?
Thought not!
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I cant believe that some people want SC out, seven months or so in charge, 9th in the league with 34 points, dont these people remember the days of Brian Talbut, Dennis Smith, Brian Little, Bobby Gould and for those who dont, ask some of us old un's about the dark days in Division 2 and 3. FFS give this bloke a chance.
I think I'm right in saying that Clarke STILL has the highest points tally we've ever had at this time in the PL.
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I remember Charlton punching above their weight starting the season well and fading towards the end for a few seasons , then sacking their manager curbishley,because they thought they could do better I bet they regret that now. Be careful what you wish for .
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I think a few people are getting a bit silly, what do you want us to do sack him? I believe we'll come out of this bad spell we're going through. Is it a sheer coincidence our form dips when we lost the YM/CY partnership? Lost Long for a few weeks? Once everyone bar Gera is back fit, we'll be fine. It's only because we've been positioned higher all season people aren't happy I think, if we'd have been around the 8th-12th places nobody would say anything, would they?
EDITED: TEXT SPEAK
Surely if we had been 8-12th before this rot we would now be sitting around 16-19th?
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Surely if we had been 8-12th before this rot we would now be sitting around 16-19th?
If my aunty had balls she'd be my uncle....
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If my aunty had balls she'd be my uncle....
And your point being?
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I totally agree with Baggies. He has been very unlucky recently; I don't think he's done much wrong. What happened today just encapsulates his misfortune. I thought the tactics were working well and then an experienced player inexplicably destroys all that good work. What can he do? I'm always impressed with what he has to say and I can't fault a lot of decisions. Lets just be thankful we have a lot of points on the board.
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Yesterday, Mick's Tractor Boys went above Wolves in the table for the first time this season. ;D No matter how bad your immediate situation appears, sacking your carefully-chosen manager/head coach is not something to be taken lightly and certainly isn't some instant panacea for losing.
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Yesterday, Mick's Tractor Boys went above Wolves in the table for the first time this season. ;D No matter how bad your immediate situation appears, sacking your carefully-chosen manager/head coach is not something to be taken lightly and certainly isn't some instant panacea for losing.
Is this a new Spanish bread related dish? (no need to answer). ;)
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And your point being?
We weren't 8th-12th when the run started so its irrelevant. What's getting on the managers back going to do to help us? I don't think he can do much more, I actually think he's the only one who has come out of the last month with any credit at all. He's obviously a top bloke. I think we'll beat Sunderland at home and give a good account of ourselves away at Chelsea.
I don't mean to aim this all at you, but generally speaking what can you do about a player driving himself down to London to try and force a move, or Mulumbu being in Africa, a host of injuries or Popov spitting at someone? It's a matter of time until we turn this around in my opinion and there's no need to get on Clarke's back
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I remember Charlton punching above their weight starting the season well and fading towards the end for a few seasons , then sacking their manager curbishley,because they thought they could do better I bet they regret that now. Be careful what you wish for .
Curbishly was there manager for a number of seasons,the team was built up by him,SC inherited the core of this team so its not really the same thing.
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Lets not start talking about sacking SC. We are in a good position in the league. We've had more than our share on injuries so be fair with whats happening. Lets see how we do with the team back to strength before we jump to any conclusions. If we finish in the top 10 thats a 3rd year we have done well. We can build on this, just give it some time.
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Results are poor but more worrying for me is the lack of disciplne from our players.The things that have gone on in the last few days have left me dumbfounded.
I think Clarke could have lost the respect of the team.
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It is a perplexing situation with all the madness going on with the players. Think SC must make a statement and put the foot down, even to the extent it costs us a game and let a few of our "superstars" know what the pine bench feels like. Couldn't believe what I witnessed on the telly this morning. Commend SC on his statements re the Popov incident, disgraceful, next I think he needs to show Olsson the ropes in being respectful to the club he serves, and an extremely humble and apologetic PO sitting next to SC in a press conference would also start to turn things around from a moral point of view. What has happen to our club?????????
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We weren't 8th-12th when the run started so its irrelevant. What's getting on the managers back going to do to help us? I don't think he can do much more, I actually think he's the only one who has come out of the last month with any credit at all. He's obviously a top bloke. I think we'll beat Sunderland at home and give a good account of ourselves away at Chelsea.
I don't mean to aim this all at you, but generally speaking what can you do about a player driving himself down to London to try and force a move, or Mulumbu being in Africa, a host of injuries or Popov spitting at someone? It's a matter of time until we turn this around in my opinion and there's no need to get on Clarke's back
Yes however my reply was to a comment of somebody saying what if we were in that position and I was making the point that if that was the case we would be in a far worse position than what we are now
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>:( No doubting SC is p!@#$d- off with the result against Spurs...basically blamed Popov for effing up the team ...as seen on the interview after the game.
I support SC and he must be just as frustrated as us with the team effort and results.
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We cant keep sacking managers.I will admit he wasn't my choice and i was deflated when he was announced.The man lacks charisma, he doesnt look like Mr Motivator
If we don't pick up at all in any of our games left i do worry for next season. Popov was to blame for yesterday and i would not play him again.There was most definitely an improvement in our performance until he was sent off.
Steve has a tough challenge ahead no doubt.Roy's euphoria has come to an end.Its time for Steve to show us he can manage the players
My season ticket next season depends on whether the football improves until the end of the season
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We cant sack Clarke, we have got to give him time, he is still learning and hopefully he can learn from this bad run that we are on at the minute.
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Really have to stick with Clarke almost no matter what happens between now and the end of the season. Too often the Head Coach gets the bullet which lets under performing players off the hook. I feel that some players may have got a bit ahead themselves and yes it is up to him to sort them out but you cannot blame the coach for their stupidity, particularly if he has not the resources to bench players who are letting him down e.g. Olsson.
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Results are poor but more worrying for me is the lack of disciplne from our players.The things that have gone on in the last few days have left me dumbfounded.
I think Clarke could have lost the respect of the team.
Loosing Respect, i agree.
We should have just done enough this season on the back of Roy's good work which now seems to have come to an end.If the performances don't improve from the start of next season hes gone by Christmas
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I like Clarke and think with time could become a great manager for us, however this is really 50/50 at the moment.
1) the club have decided that we just get to summer then rebuild and push on (due to us being"safe"already) and Clarke has agreed to this so they will show loyalty to him.
2) a couple more matches without a win and he's gone, there may have been other factors with RDM but ultimately the run is very similar?, and each place is worth around 800k .
Many people have mentioned the board failing to back him in jan, maybe they offered, maybe he was happy with the squad, very easy to blame the chairman , maybe the chairman should pick the formation and play people in there proper position?
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I think I'm right in saying that Clarke STILL has the highest points tally we've ever had at this time in the PL.
That fact is what is saving Clarke from a massive grilling atm.
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Really have to stick with Clarke almost no matter what happens between now and the end of the season. Too often the Head Coach gets the bullet which lets under performing players off the hook. I feel that some players may have got a bit ahead themselves and yes it is up to him to sort them out but you cannot blame the coach for their stupidity, particularly if he has not the resources to bench players who are letting him down e.g. Olsson.
Most of our problems go back to the myth that we have a 'strong' squad. I just cannot believe SC saying that he was 'happy' with the squad, that little mistake may still cost him his job.
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1) the club have decided that we just get to summer then rebuild and push on (due to us being"safe"already) and Clarke has agreed to this so they will show loyalty to him.
Many people have mentioned the board failing to back him in jan, maybe they offered, maybe he was happy with the squad, very easy to blame the chairman , maybe the chairman should pick the formation and play people in there proper position?
What if the board had no intention of backing him,as his job is under scrutiny after the amazing collapse of out good start.
Also was told in the Sportsman that 5 players fell out with SC in training,guy who told me is genuine,but he heard it second hand and might not be the complete truth.
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Can somebody tell me how many points we had this time last year?
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He was always going to say he was happy, we had a record points total in January - he's hardly going to talk about replacing team members. I'm sure if there was money available he'd have been interested in a few additions, we never spend money in January and we're getting where the loan deals we used to rely on just aren't the quality we need anymore.
Hodgson due to his status in the game, the club seemed willing to basically do what he wanted (within reason), spending on Ridgewell in January, and backing him on Long. I think due to Clarke's lower status and a much lower risk of him leaving, they can get away with being a lot more stringent, particularly with the start we had - justifying the teams quality in their view.
He certainly deserves the summer, and there's no way the club will sack him with the club virtually safe. We don't want to be constantly changing manager. And nor should we, we have the lowest wage bill and the players aren't that good - Hodgson got the England job on the back of his work with us. He's an excellent manager. But Clarke deserves time too. There are concerns to be had, over style, what direction exactly he's taken us. But he's also been unlucky - our injury record was superb the past couple of seasons, this year its been terrible.
With the increased tv deal and given we spent nothing this January, he needs to be actually backed in the summer. We did well in the transfer market, but that was for a limited number of players last year, this year we're going to be looking at 7 or 8 - relying on free's and loan's for that is going to be a very difficult prospect.
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I think he has lost the respect of the players. The continues swapping and changing of the team and with all the controversy on and off the field is making us a lathing stock
I think before it is too late he has to go. It’s a shame he seems a nice man but he needs to develop as a manager and I don’t think it should be with a Perm side. We need someone to pull the team back into line and stop the rot
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Can somebody tell me how many points we had this time last year?
29
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29
and we had 32 by the 26th of feb so we are still in front.My only concern i cant see where the next point is coming from.Momentum this time last year was on the rise
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I think he has lost the respect of the players. The continues swapping and changing of the team and with all the controversy on and off the field is making us a lathing stock
I think before it is too late he has to go. It’s a shame he seems a nice man but he needs to develop as a manager and I don’t think it should be with a Perm side. We need someone to pull the team back into line and stop the rot
Lost the respect of the players for mainly forced changes? Most the team can't complain if they're dropped anyway.
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My misses said hes a miserable looking man, more miserably looking than me.
I said wait till you hear his voice
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I think he has lost the respect of the players. The continues swapping and changing of the team and with all the controversy on and off the field is making us a lathing stock
I think before it is too late he has to go. It’s a shame he seems a nice man but he needs to develop as a manager and I don’t think it should be with a Perm side. We need someone to pull the team back into line and stop the rot
So someone else comes in he dont he doesnt do nothing after 13 games what do we do then sack him? Everybody slags Chelsea off with how they sack managers yet 99% of people act the same of them. It would be a farce if Steve Clarke was sacked I couldnt see how we could then appoint another manager who has any self respect.
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and we had 32 by the 26th of feb so we are still in front.My only concern i cant see where the next point is coming from.Momentum this time last year was on the rise
Hopefully a nice 4-0 win at home against Sunderland will give us the impetus going into the final run in.
I remember they were flying last year and hadn't lost in 12 games I think, we mullered them late on in Feb then went on that good run in.
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and we had 32 by the 26th of feb so we are still in front.My only concern i cant see where the next point is coming from.Momentum this time last year was on the rise
Was momentum on the rise? I thought that our return to form came after the Wolves game which is more like next weekend? This time last year we had just lost 2-1 at home to Swansea.
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Up until the demolition derby we had been pretty ordinary last year going into that game we were just 5 points ahead of the Wolves and the drop zone. Had we lost that game we really would have been in the relegation dog fight. There were questions being asked of Hodgson on here because frankly we looked poor the previous week against Swansea and lost to Norwich in the league and cup. The truth is this team has blown hot and cold for 3 years under three different the head coaches.
I am not prepared to lay the blame for the current downturn anywhere else other than at the players door. As for losing the dressing room well if that is the case the answer is ship the malcontents out at the first opportunity any other solution is the tail wagging the dog in my opinion.
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My misses said hes a miserable looking man, more miserably looking than me.
I said wait till you hear his voice
To be fair, Roy was hardly Mr Charisma was he?
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So someone else comes in he dont he doesnt do nothing after 13 games what do we do then sack him? Everybody slags Chelsea off with how they sack managers yet 99% of people act the same of them. It would be a farce if Steve Clarke was sacked I couldnt see how we could then appoint another manager who has any self respect.
If Clarke can rally his troops for a decent March and April he will have a golden opportunity to sort things out in the summer, including fixing a number of mistakes he did this season. Not many managers get that chance so Clarke needs to grasp it. He is a leader now, not a right hand man and he needs to show leadership. If he can't then ultimately he will not last in this job. If he can't lead then no matter how good he is at the x's and o's he will always struggle.
IF there is any whispering in camp, discipline issues, poor morale etc. Clarke needs to stamp it out and make his authority clear and undisputed.
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To be fair, Roy was hardly Mr Charisma was he?
I suppose you are right.At least roy showed more anger by banging his head :)
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I think Steve Clarke is doing a decent job, probably as well as can be expected.
If start of the season we knew we would be 9th or 10th now, i think that would be a realistic placing, because we had the surge up the league by November expectations grew and now we are in a rut its important not to panic. if we had won and lost alternate weeks from day one we would probably be around where we are now but because we won a lot of games and now lost a lot of games, i think sometimes expectations and panic go one extreme to the other.
That said the run of form is a concern, yesterday i felt we would win before the game and still think we would of until Popov's sending off. Clarke changed formation and brought in a few faces to freshen things up so that would hopefully show that he is aware of the problems and is trying to do something about it. I think he does make too many changes and i think we have lost our identity of whether we are good footballing team, a counter attacking team, an organised team or a defensive team, ideally we would be all of those things but sadly not! I think at the moment we are none of those types of teams and ideally you want to be 2-3 of those styles.
I also think the players have let him down, in our squad i think there is only Foster, Rosenberg and Lukaku who have played domestically above where we are are now as they have experienced Champions League football but the rest of our squad havent much experience of the top 8 of the premiership or winning cups, etc in this country and i think it shows, i think they are resting on their laurels, we havent got many medal or achivement winners in our club from top flight football, thats not to say they arent any good, they are but i think the level we are at now is about right.
If i was Clarke i would be thinking is there a few of the players who have been with us a while who it may be time to move them on, i think they are all good players but eventually people can just get a bit stale and i think that is possibly the case with some of our squad and in the summer it does need freshening up, create a new buzz and not get complacement, that may mean a couple of the established players making way but thats football and the way you improve.
I bet he has learnt more about management the last few months than he did the first few and i cannot imagine anybody really believes he should be sacked, its too easy to always blame the manager, nobody with the way we are run as a club could probably do any better.
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we have certainly had issues with our footballers this season.Remember Mr Ridgwell and his antics
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we have certainly had issues with our footballers this season.Remember Mr Ridgwell and his antics
A private joke with his mate which happened months ago until it was released to the press.
No need to be disciplined by Clarke or the club in my opinion and one which should have been swept under the carpet by the club and supporters well before now.
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A private joke with his mate which happened months ago until it was released to the press.
No need to be disciplined by Clarke or the club in my opinion and one which should have been swept under the carpet by the club and supporters well before now.
Yes but of late it seems to be West Bromwich Albion footballers with all the media attention at the moment.Something within the club stinks for me
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Yes but of late it seems to be West Bromwich Albion footballers with all the media attention at the moment.Something within the club stinks for me
I'd hazard a guess it is the twenty pound notes Ridgewell used! ;D
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I'd hazard a guess it is the twenty pound notes Ridgewell used! ;D
Are you agreeing its dirty money :)
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All of Hodgsons hard work all been well and truly undone by Clarke and this lack of disipline that is happening wouldn't of been tolerated by hodgson (Ridgewell wiping his backside with money,Odemwingiegate,Olsson sticking his fingers up,Popov spitting) doesn't seem like he's in control to me and his teams and formations are very questionable at times...really can't see where the next 3 points are coming from but we shall see what happens,but i'm sure Peace has taken all this into account.so clarke beware things must improve quick or peace might take action
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I think Clake's big misake was the wholesale changes he made for the swansea game I think he thought our squad was a lot better in depth than it actually is,it cost us our momentum and we have never recovered.
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I think Clake's big misake was the wholesale changes he made for the swansea game I think he thought our squad was a lot better in depth than it actually is,it cost us our momentum and we have never recovered.
Agreed. I truly believe that Steve Clarke has learned more in the last 6 months as a manager than over many years as a number 2. Things could not have been better 2 months ago but I believe there was perhaps a little too much faith in the squad as a whole. As a club we have made huge strides on and off the pitch over recent years and it is key that we understand exactly where we're at. The truth is, we have (on our day), a cracking team and a very capable squad. Unfortunately we've all learned that the squad ain't capable enough! SC knows this and I honestly think there will be the investment over the summer needed to add the quality needed - and if you will 'galvanise' our position as a strong Premier League team. SC has had to deal with a number of issues recently, the squad as been plagued by injuries (as many other clubs have and accept that), Yacob and Mulumbu breakdown, Gera etc, Ridgewell being a dick, Odemwingie ,who's truly a moron and in many ways unmanageable and now 'the cobra' Mr Popov. We had a great run which we ALL enjoyed, now lets get behind the lads and stop acting 'small time'. Consolidate for next season and enjoy being not just the 'pride of the midlands'.....but the ONLY team in the midlands next season!!
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I truly hope that your optimism is well founded, but I must admit to a few niggling doubts. I am sure that SC is an excellent coach, but is he an excellent Head Coach? Has he got it in him to be Mr Hard Man when its necessary, as it probably is just now, or is he stuck with Mr Nice Guy, the players friend? For me, the jury is still out.
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I truly hope that your optimism is well founded, but I must admit to a few niggling doubts. I am sure that SC is an excellent coach, but is he an excellent Head Coach? Has he got it in him to be Mr Hard Man when its necessary, as it probably is just now, or is he stuck with Mr Nice Guy, the players friend? For me, the jury is still out.
As fans we wont know whether he is a hard man when he needs to be or not, one face in public is more often then not different in private behind closed doors. He's done a good job for me but just like under the much more experienced Roy Hodgson he makes a few baffling decisions.
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Agree with B_H.
Unless we are then on the training ground then it's difficult for us to form opinions that Steve Clarke is too soft with the players or isn't strong enough when it comes to discipline. What are we basing that on? At the end of the day, if players such as Jonas Olsson and Goran Popov have no self discipline then it's unfair that we should blame Steve Clarke for that.
After watching his interview and reading a particular quote on Sunday, I got the impression that Steve Clarke was incredibly angry and probably gave the lads a drilling.
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>:( I reckon SC has had a run-in with JP (as every previous manager at Albion have done,at this time of the year).
He has asked for a couple of players in the January window and Jeremy has told him to sell players instead......he seems really drunk off in his post match interview (unshaven as well...not a good sign).
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I think the death knell for SC will be if he puts Odemwingie back into the team regardless of results.
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I think the death knell for SC will be if he puts Odemwingie back into the team regardless of results.
I don't understand your reasoning there. JP decided not to sell him so why would he sack him for playing PO. It would annoy the fans (although many would appreciate the chance to let him know our feelings) but I can't see that prompting "Clarke out" chants.
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I don't understand your reasoning there. JP decided not to sell him so why would he sack him for playing PO. It would annoy the fans (although many would appreciate the chance to let him know our feelings) but I can't see that prompting "Clarke out" chants.
JP decided not to sell him not because he particularly liked PO, but because he couldn't get what he wanted and because as we all know JP wont be messed about.
I think it was all about personal pride and business acumen on JP's part.
Reading what Steven Reid is supposed to have said in the papers it doesn't look like the players will welcome him back with open arms, he basically says that if its decided to bring him back then they just have to get on with it.
Imagine how Dorrans, Morrisson Long or Brunt will feel if they loose their place to PO?
If he hasn't lost the dressing room yet, IMO he will then.
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I think Clake's big misake was the wholesale changes he made for the swansea game I think he thought our squad was a lot better in depth than it actually is,it cost us our momentum and we have never recovered.
the most sensible post on the matter for me..
The Swansea game changed our season
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JP decided not to sell him not because he particularly liked PO, but because he couldn't get what he wanted and because as we all know JP wont be messed about.
I think it was all about personal pride and business acumen on JP's part.
Reading what Steven Reid is supposed to have said in the papers it doesn't look like the players will welcome him back with open arms, he basically says that if its decided to bring him back then they just have to get on with it.
Imagine how Dorrans, Morrisson Long or Brunt will feel if they loose their place to PO?
If he hasn't lost the dressing room yet, IMO he will then.
I dont think Morrison could have any complaints about been dropped as he`s absolutlely pish lately.
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If they lose their place to PO because he deserves his place through application then i think no-one can complain..
PO is our best player, the players attitude will determine the players inclusion.
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I dont think Morrison could have any complaints about been dropped as he`s absolutlely pish lately.
Morrison hasn't been at his best lately. The Swansea game was a big chance in our season that's for sure. only two since then, seem pretty amazing really.
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Yes but of late it seems to be West Bromwich Albion footballers with all the media attention at the moment.Something within the club stinks for me
Success breeds media attention. Especially when a small club is upsetting the Premier League balance, they don't like it up 'em.
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the most sensible post on the matter for me..
The Swansea game changed our season
Seconded, luckily we had a great start or that match could have done to us what we did to the dingles?
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Seconded, luckily we had a great start or that match could have done to us what we did to the dingles?
Imo it was not so much the changes in personnel for the Swansea game that did for us, it was that Clarke and management, once we reached third, made it clear that it was acceptable to stop pushing now. All the talk about we'll see how our season goes once we hit 40 points blah blah blah blah made it clear to the players the season was practically over... in November! Slacking season was now upon us.
That little misstep resulted in the generally slack atmosphere at the club and then the injuries started to take it's toll on our first team players. All kinds of things started to brew on the players minds (future transfers...) instead of what they should have been focused on, winning football matches in the here and the now. It's very hard work to get a winning habit back once you let it go...
Imo it speaks volumes about the mindset of Steve Clarke and management, that instead of accepting the challenge of following the run as far as it went, they instead tried to preemptively defuse expectations and pressure of a positive nature. Now, as a direct result, we have pressure of a negative nature instead, trying to sort out the mess in our team, dressing room and management after a string of shocking failures.
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West Brom team against Sunderland in our 4-2 victory: Myhill, Jones, McAuley, Olsson, Ridgewell; Yacob, Morrison; Brunt, Gera, Odemwingie; Long
West Brom team against Swansea in our 3-1 loss: Myhill; Jones, McAuley, Olsson, Ridgewell; Yacob, Mulumbu; Brunt, Morrison, Odemwingie; Lukaku
To my calculations that's two changes. Not exactly wholesale is it really? And one of those was because the game had came to quick for Zoltan Gera.
At the end of the day, Swansea performed very well that day and reading their forums, their fans had suggested that it was the best they had played in a very long while, added to that, certain players within our side failed to do their jobs properly and I don't think we should pinpoint the blame at Steve Clarke's door if certain players cannot be arsed to track a run.
After that Swansea game we can question the changes Steve Clarke has made to the side but how many of those have been forced due to injury or suspension or general fatigue. Don't forget in that week which concluded with our final game against Stoke, we had played 3 games within 7 days so I don't blame Steve Clarke for making changes in order to keep the squad fresh.
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I dont think Morrison could have any complaints about been dropped as he`s absolutlely pish lately.
Square peg, round hole.
Morrissons best position up the field behind the striker, passing and creating.
Since we've had Yacob and Mulumbu missing he's been used in a more with drawn role.
On his day a quality Premiership midfielder.
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Yes we got comprehensively beaten by Swansea but the game in question has to be Stoke.
That was 6 or 7 changes for that one which is something that you rarely see, even with a busy schedule.
I don't mind the rotation of 1 or 2 players but changing 6 or 7 (Can't remember what it was) is basically throwing a new team in.
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vs Swansea it wasn't so much the team selection, it was the fact that no changes were made when we came into the game at the start of the second half that had everyone fuming
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vs Swansea it wasn't so much the team selection, it was the fact that no changes were made when we came into the game at the start of the second half that had everyone fuming
But maybe Clarke wanted to see the character of the group whilst displaying the mantra "you got us into this mess, you get us out of it"?
And in fairness, our second half performance was much better than the terrible first half so to some extent he got a reaction from them. Just a shame we couldn't get that important second goal which Clarke eluded to in his after match press conference.
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Imo it speaks volumes about the mindset of Steve Clarke and management, that instead of accepting the challenge of following the run as far as it went, they instead tried to preemptively defuse expectations and pressure of a positive nature. Now, as a direct result, we have pressure of a negative nature instead, trying to sort out the mess in our team, dressing room and management after a string of shocking failures.
and I bet the same people who are now complaining about SC and Management trying to defuse the overgrowing expectation, at that time, would now be leading the chorus of complaints of the Club failing to live up to them if they hadn't.
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and I bet the same people who are now complaining about SC and Management trying to defuse the overgrowing expectation, at that time, would now be leading the chorus of complaints of the Club failing to live up to them if they hadn't.
I guess, if you bought into the expectations in the first place instead of simply enjoying the good times.
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Nothing wrong with having expectations, secret is to not get too down if the expectations aren't achieved.
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Imo it was not so much the changes in personnel for the Swansea game that did for us, it was that Clarke and management, once we reached third, made it clear that it was acceptable to stop pushing now. All the talk about we'll see how our season goes once we hit 40 points blah blah blah blah made it clear to the players the season was practically over... in November! Slacking season was now upon us.
That little misstep resulted in the generally slack atmosphere at the club and then the injuries started to take it's toll on our first team players. All kinds of things started to brew on the players minds (future transfers...) instead of what they should have been focused on, winning football matches in the here and the now. It's very hard work to get a winning habit back once you let it go...
Imo it speaks volumes about the mindset of Steve Clarke and management, that instead of accepting the challenge of following the run as far as it went, they instead tried to preemptively defuse expectations and pressure of a positive nature. Now, as a direct result, we have pressure of a negative nature instead, trying to sort out the mess in our team, dressing room and management after a string of shocking failures.
You set youself realistic targets and if and when you achieve them you set new targets. I am sure that Steve Clarke didn't walk in the dressing room one day and say "nice one lads, we have done what we set out to achieve and its only November, where is everyone going on holiday? "
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I'm a big Steve Clarke fan, supported him from day one & will continue to whilst he is our head coach but has he missed something out here or am I getting paranoid?
“Everyone that was out there gave 100 per cent for themselves, their team-mates and the football club – and that’s what’s important going forward.”
http://www.wba.co.uk/news/article/clarke-wants-another-reds-letter-day-640683.aspx?pageView=full#anchored
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the most sensible post on the matter for me..
The Swansea game changed our season
The "fat Lady" hasn't even begun to clear her throat yet, and you're trashing him already?
Stabilty, patience and continuity will out Bud ;D 8)...don't lose your nerve.
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I'm a big Steve Clarke fan, supported him from day one & will continue to whilst he is our head coach but has he missed something out here or am I getting paranoid?
“Everyone that was out there gave 100 per cent for themselves, their team-mates and the football club – and that’s what’s important going forward.”
http://www.wba.co.uk/news/article/clarke-wants-another-reds-letter-day-640683.aspx?pageView=full#anchored
What has he missed out?
I think you're being paranoid :D
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http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/sport-opinion/west-bromwich-albion-comment-piece-1293130?
In the Premier League guide to football management, Steve Clarke’s copy has just flicked open on to the ‘how to deal with a crisis’ chapter.
The last few days have been about a stroppy footballer on Twitter, a Macedonian spitter, an angry Swede, injuries and a lack of transfer activity.
And that’s before we mention no victories since Boxing Day. That early December prognosis of reaching 40 points by the end of January never did happen.
Management wasn’t just about the good times back in autumn, when Albion were pushing towards the top four.
The early form could not have been better in many respects – new players gelled, there were few injuries and all was good.
And then came the dip.
That’s been followed by the Peter Odemwingie saga. Goran Popov’s dismissal and Jonas Olsson’s moment of rage will soon be forgotten.
The injuries and lack of signings are a hassle Clarke and his staff will have to deal with.
This is the period where Clarke will learn more about the club, his players, his staff and, crucially, himself as a ‘manager’ in his own right.
Clarke’s clumsy deliveries during early press conferences have been surpassed by a more confident and eloquent conviction during his, and the club’s, handling of the Odemwingie issue.
That’s merely the side the media, and subsequently, the public see.
But how Clarke deals with Odemwingie behind closed doors and this run of form will, in many respects, shape this period of his managerial career.
Albion players have made it clear the Nigeria international has some way to go before he’ll be fully accepted back. Clarke has to pick the right words and make the correct decision by the club.
Form wise, Albion hit a similar dip under Robbie Di Matteo – one which cost him his job.
That shouldn’t be an issue for Clarke as Di Matteo wasn’t just judged on results, but general dereliction of other duties which are required for the job.
Clarke has shown he is savvy enough to learn from errors, whether it’s through a change of formation or personnel on the pitch.
His Albion are in a decent place in the league and the return of key players will help.
But this period will be educational to Clarke. He will learn more now than he ever did during those good times in August and September.
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What has he missed out?
I think you're being paranoid :D
There, I edited it for him ;)
I'm a big Steve Clarke fan, supported him from day one & will continue to whilst he is our head coach but has he missed something out here or am I getting paranoid?
“Everyone that was out there gave 100 per cent for themselves, their team-mates, the football club and the fans – and that’s what’s important going forward.”
http://www.wba.co.uk/news/article/clarke-wants-another-reds-letter-day-640683.aspx?pageView=full#anchored
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There, I edited it for him ;)
Oh, I naturally assumed the fans came under the football club :D
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Delighted for Steve Clarke.
He's had issues which should never have happened recently which some of the more experienced managers might have failed to deal with, instead, Clarke has had to face this in his first season as the gaffer added to a decline in form with the loss of our two most important players in Yacob and Mulumbu. In addition to that, the players have let him down badly in recent weeks with their own lack of discipline but thankfully the lads gave him a performance and result which judging by his reaction to the second goal and interview on SKY obviously meant a lot to him.
Any talk of a lack of discipline within the squad is now hopefully muted as the boys gave SC everything last night and more importantly, Steve Clarke deserves it.
Well done gaffer.
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Still have to admit totally baffled be his tactics we play for a draw not having one shot on goal then ten min left brings on a forward then another one. If he was going for the win why not start the game doing so Without doubt we owe the result to Ben foster. Albion can play some very good attacking football it almost seams Steve as no confidence in Albion being an attacking football team I think albions strengths are attacking. Be interesting to see what he does next game. Last night was much needed just hope he is positive in the ability of the players and get back to the attack style of play
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Still have to admit totally baffled be his tactics we play for a draw not having one shot on goal then ten min left brings on a forward then another one. If he was going for the win why not start the game doing so Without doubt we owe the result to Ben foster. Albion can play some very good attacking football it almost seams Steve as no confidence in Albion being an attacking football team I think albions strengths are attacking. Be interesting to see what he does next game. Last night was much needed just hope he is positive in the ability of the players and get back to the attack style of play
there really is no pleasing some, as David Moyes said pre match the initial goal will be to not lose, bringing lukaku on meant the ball didnt keep coming back at us every time it was cleared, and its not just as black and white as bringing on another striker after that, he bought on fortune a player with brut strength who the ball just easily sticks to and hold it up well. The clear plan was counter attack football, until the 80th it didnt really work attack-wise, but we won 2-0. Were we a bit lucky, yes, did we take our chance yes, was luck made by the fact our keeper was epic, yes!
Can't knock Clarke one bit for last night i find it unbelievable.
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Think he got it spot on last night, obviously we got abit lucky here and there, but I thought he got everything right decision wise.
Brining Lukaku on when he did helped us also.
Credit were credits due, hes had a lot of stick the last few weeks, and has had to deal with a lot of problems.
Fair play Clarkey.
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Think he got it spot on last night, obviously we got abit lucky here and there, but I thought he got everything right decision wise.
Brining Lukaku on when he did helped us also.
Credit were credits due, hes had a lot of stick the last few weeks, and has had to deal with a lot of problems.
Fair play Clarkey.
Spot on
Lukaku was brought on when Liverpool were pushing hard for the winner & all there player were looking at our goals when all of a sudden they were looking over there shoulder in doing so taking some pressure off our defence. :-*
Well done Gaffer.
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You make your own luck...
The penalty save was Karma not luck..i even callled it and said Foster will save it
We defended as a team wore them out letting them play their posession footall and running round all night whilst we parked the bus and waited for our chance...it came and we took it, were pretty decent on set pieces and it showed last night, we cleared everything of theirs and scored off one of ours
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A while before the next game.They all deserve some sunshine.Go get some golf in and train abroad i say
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Clarke got it all on spot on, on Monday night. Certianly did help with having Mulumbu and Yacob back together. Its such a big advantage to have someone like Lakaku on the bench.
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Delighted for Steve Clarke.
He's had issues which should never have happened recently which some of the more experienced managers might have failed to deal with, instead, Clarke has had to face this in his first season as the gaffer added to a decline in form with the loss of our two most important players in Yacob and Mulumbu. In addition to that, the players have let him down badly in recent weeks with their own lack of discipline but thankfully the lads gave him a performance and result which judging by his reaction to the second goal and interview on SKY obviously meant a lot to him.
Any talk of a lack of discipline within the squad is now hopefully muted as the boys gave SC everything last night and more importantly, Steve Clarke deserves it.
Well done gaffer.
Fully agree with everything you say there Liam. I can't help thinking that a lot of people are not giving this season's performances on and off the field enough credit. Maybe this is due to the way we have been almost used to constant progression as a club over the last few years? I'm only 32 and haven't followed Albion as long as many on here but now is only the first time I have had that feeling about the team and the club.
If you consider it is Steve's first managerial appointment, the high expectation following on from Roy's time here, key players being unavailable for various footballing and non footballing reasons, a big dip in form on the pitch and the amount spent on players by many other teams in the league we are still joint 7th in the table alongside a highly regarded Swansea team that have only scores 2 more goals than us. All in all, I would class that as a commendable achievement.
Onwards and upwards!
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Steve has done a great job since he has been here after thirty games his record is
Won 12
Drew 5
Lost 13
A great start long may it continue.
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Still think we should be higher up the league with the amount of decent strikers at the club,
only Man Utd and Man City have better options than us.
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Steve has done a great job since he has been here after thirty games his record is
Won 12
Drew 5
Lost 13
A great start long may it continue.
I think you are a win and a draw short mate? And lost 11?
West Bromwich Albion 26 7 2 4 19 12 4 2 7 17 23 1 37
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I think you are a win and a draw short mate? And lost 11?
West Bromwich Albion 26 7 2 4 19 12 4 2 7 17 23 1 37
That included the Cup games as well mate.
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That included the Cup games as well mate.
I get you mate good.
Thanks for putting me right. ;)
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I think this summer will be a big one for Steve Clarke as I feel that if we are to get even better then new players will have to be brought in. With all the disappointing things that have happened to us just recently I thought he handled it all very well.
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I think this summer will be a big one for Steve Clarke as I feel that if we are to get even better then new players will have to be brought in. With all the disappointing things that have happened to us just recently I thought he handled it all very well.
I think so as we are coming to the end of "Eras" with Reid,Gera JT? just to name 3 then Pete O then..................A lot of work!
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Still think we should be higher up the league with the amount of decent strikers at the club,
only Man Utd and Man City have better options than us.
Think it may be time to step back and take those blue and white tinted glasses off pal!
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I think this summer will be a big one for Steve Clarke as I feel that if we are to get even better then new players will have to be brought in. With all the disappointing things that have happened to us just recently I thought he handled it all very well.
Agree with this, I posted somewhere else this year has been essentially Roy's team managed by SC, next year will be... interesting.
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Its also a massive Year for us, can we continue our development and take the next step?
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Not his biggest fan.I might start believing this time next year if we are in a similar position.Its like watching Stoke mark 2 at times.I still say the euphoria from last season will see us through
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http://www.wba.co.uk/news/article/zoltan-hails-clarke-impact-659447.aspx
Midfielder says current boss has succeeded in following in Hodgson's footsteps
ZOLTAN Gera admits Roy Hodgson was a hard act to follow as Baggies boss – but believes Steve Clarke has pulled it off.
Albion are currently sitting in ninth spot in England’s top flight on 37 points - just two off seventh place, with a game in hand on the two sides directly above them.
And, with 12 games remaining, there is every possibility Clarke’s troops can surpass the club’s best-ever Barclays Premier League finish of tenth, which came courtesy of their 47-points haul under now-England manager Hodgson last term.
Gera also believes the club have come a long way since he joined the Black Country outfit for his first spell in 2004 because of a series of successful appointments of managers/head coaches.
“I think there is a big, big difference now because when I came to the club the manager’s style was different and the squad was different,” said the Hungary skipper.
“I’ve learned from every single manager at the club during my time – Gary Megson, Bryan Robson, Tony Mowbray, Roy Hodgson and now Steve Clarke.
“The club always finds a good manager and I was quite happy with everyone of them.
“This is a different era because we are a stable Premier League team and the head coach has done a fantastic job.
“I’m sure it was difficult for him after Roy leaving.
“It’s hard and I think he has done very well in his first year as a No.1.
“He’s done so, so good.
“He never panics.
"Some managers panic - but he always trusts in the players and says the right things in the dressing room before the game, after the game and at half-time.
“I think he has a very good future.”
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Thanks for the link, a very good read. lets hope is future is with West Brom.
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http://www1.skysports.com/football/news/11668/8530435
West Brom head coach Steve Clarke has played down his chances of replacing Rafa Benitez as Chelsea manager in the summer.
Clarke, who spent nearly 20 years at Stamford Bridge as player and coach, admits he is unlikely to be in the running for the Chelsea job, although he remains ambitious.
He said: "I think it's too early to start connecting me with Chelsea. There are a lot of managers that are out there who have a better case than me.
"Wherever I am on the bookmakers list is a good indication and I'm sure I'm not in the list at 50/1 even!
"I'm not even a year into the job here. Up to now it has been a great season and I haven't looked anywhere beyond that.
But Clarke, whose team play Chelsea on Saturday, added: "If you are asking me if I want to manage a top team in the future? Of course I do.
"If you don't have that ambition to further and better yourself than you shouldn't be in the game. But it's not for now.
"The dream for me is we go to Chelsea and play as well as we can and get another three points."
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I can't think that RA will chase Steve Clarke as Head Coach- also I can't imagine that SC will take the postion even if offered as he still would have more long term potential and stability with us (smile Steve! :)
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Not his biggest fan.I might start believing this time next year if we are in a similar position.Its like watching Stoke mark 2 at times.I still say the euphoria from last season will see us through
We`ve played some cracking stuff at times this year and the football we produced against Sunderland
was pretty awsome. Dont get this Albion like Stoke City at all.
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http://www1.skysports.com/football/news/11668/8530435 (http://www1.skysports.com/football/news/11668/8530435)
West Brom head coach Steve Clarke has played down his chances of replacing Rafa Benitez as Chelsea manager in the summer.
Clarke, who spent nearly 20 years at Stamford Bridge as player and coach, admits he is unlikely to be in the running for the Chelsea job, although he remains ambitious.
He said: "I think it's too early to start connecting me with Chelsea. There are a lot of managers that are out there who have a better case than me.
"Wherever I am on the bookmakers list is a good indication and I'm sure I'm not in the list at 50/1 even!
"I'm not even a year into the job here. Up to now it has been a great season and I haven't looked anywhere beyond that.
But Clarke, whose team play Chelsea on Saturday, added: "If you are asking me if I want to manage a top team in the future? Of course I do.
"If you don't have that ambition to further and better yourself than you shouldn't be in the game. But it's not for now.
"The dream for me is we go to Chelsea and play as well as we can and get another three points."
Is it just me or is that part about a top team just a little bit disappointing to hear?
I like Clarke, but I'm not impressed to read that from him. I know we're not a "top"team right now, but we are building, and something special is happening and we are getting there. Comments like that devalue Albion.
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Is it just me or is that part about a top team just a little bit disappointing to hear?
I like Clarke, but I'm not impressed to read that from him. I know we're not a "top"team right now, but we are building, and something special is happening and we are getting there. Comments like that devalue Albion.
Not really.
You manage a corner shop thats doing quite well. But no matter what you do that corner shop will never get any bigger because of what it is.
Tesco/Sainsbury's pop round see what you'e done with the corner shop, offer you a managers job at one of their stores with all the potential and finance package that goes with it.
What would you do
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Is it just me or is that part about a top team just a little bit disappointing to hear?
I like Clarke, but I'm not impressed to read that from him. I know we're not a "top"team right now, but we are building, and something special is happening and we are getting there. Comments like that devalue Albion.
No its not just you Chipper, I felt the same when I read through Liam's post.
I think most Albion fans have taken to SC, he is a young coach in the early stages at this level, if he carries on with the progress he is making I doubt a lot of us would begrudge him a move to a club that can genuinely challenge for major trophies, bit like the response Dan Ashworth has had from many on here (fair play mate, you've done your job, good luck or the future) kind of attitude.
Just dont feel it was necessary to insinuate he would leave West Brom for a 'top team', it sort of makes you realise what he's thinking about us as a club.
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Not really.
You manage a corner shop thats doing quite well. But no matter what you do that corner shop will never get any bigger because of what it is.
Tesco/Sainsbury's pop round see what you'e done with the corner shop, offer you a managers job at one of their stores with all the potential and finance package that goes with it.
What would you do
Agree, I would follow the money when it came along, of course I would, but in the meantime I wouldn't be insinuating to the loyal customers at the corner shop that it's not as good a shop as the big place up the road. While I was still there and it was paying my wages I wouldn't say anything of the sort.
What would you do?
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No its not just you Chipper, I felt the same when I read through Liam's post.
I think most Albion fans have taken to SC, he is a young coach in the early stages at this level, if he carries on with the progress he is making I doubt a lot of us would begrudge him a move to a club that can genuinely challenge for major trophies, bit like the response Dan Ashworth has had from many on here (fair play mate, you've done your job, good luck or the future) kind of attitude.
Just dont feel it was necessary to insinuate he would leave West Brom for a 'top team', it sort of makes you realise what he's thinking about us as a club.
That quote struck me too. I immediately thought you should have said something along the lines of taking Albion to challenge the top clubs in the league as a statement of ambition rather than talk about joining a big money club.
But we are what we are and anyoneone of real quality who comes to us will be using us as a stepping stone in some way and I don't think that any of us fans think otherwise. So while we are riding high let's just enjoy the best players and staff that we can recruit and the success that comes with it.
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No its not just you Chipper, I felt the same when I read through Liam's post.
I think most Albion fans have taken to SC, he is a young coach in the early stages at this level, if he carries on with the progress he is making I doubt a lot of us would begrudge him a move to a club that can genuinely challenge for major trophies, bit like the response Dan Ashworth has had from many on here (fair play mate, you've done your job, good luck or the future) kind of attitude.
Just dont feel it was necessary to insinuate he would leave West Brom for a 'top team', it sort of makes you realise what he's thinking about us as a club.
Totally agree. As I said, I like Clarke, I admire his steady, understated approach to the job, I think he has handled difficult situations like Odemwingie's behaviour and Popov's dismissal excellently and above all as kept us moving in the right direction continuing our progress toward being an established top club.
But, I really, really do think he has made a mistake in so openly reminding us that we are not there yet and that he expects to move on to bigger and better things. We all know it, he doesn't need to say it.
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Totally agree. As I said, I like Clarke, I admire his steady, understated approach to the job, I think he has handled difficult situations like Odemwingie's behaviour and Popov's dismissal excellently and above all as kept us moving in the right direction continuing our progress toward being an established top club.
But, I really, really do think he has made a mistake in so openly reminding us that we are not there yet and that he expects to move on to bigger and better things. We all know it, he doesn't need to say it.
Nail....Head, mate!
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He has been excellent he has dealt with Popov and Odemwingie situations well.
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Agree, I would follow the money when it came along, of course I would, but in the meantime I wouldn't be insinuating to the loyal customers at the corner shop that it's not as good a shop as the big place up the road. While I was still there and it was paying my wages I wouldn't say anything of the sort.
What would you do?
The customers know that anyway, but they will stay loyal no matter what.
Just because the manager leaves doesn't mean the customers will.
I see your point, perhaps on reflection he should have said nothing.
But we know what we are ( I know a song about that). In the main were a stopping off point for players/managers either on the way up or on the way back down.
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Everyone getting a bit over sensitive about this in my opinion. He was just talking in a plain open and honest way. Nothing he said was a distortion of the truth or a lie. If people cant speak out without fear of being second guessed all the time what have we arrived at. Lets get some balance here please. Overall SC has done an excellent job of coaching the team and of promoting WBA through the press. Sound bites are just that. Substance is what really counts.
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rubyruby. Absolutely spot on. If we all know it (and we do) what's the harm in SC saying it? Albion are never going to be serious top 6 club. SC has gone about his whole career in a well thought out and structured way. Of course he is going to move on from us at some point and of course he will want that to be an upwards move. It's where Albion are in the scheme of things.
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The comment was a little disappointing from our perspective but I suspect the queston was unexpected and he replied as honestly as he saw things relating to managerial roles in general.
"Listen, you've hit me with a question that has come out of left field because I haven't even thought about it."
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Everyone getting a bit over sensitive about this in my opinion. He was just talking in a plain open and honest way. Nothing he said was a distortion of the truth or a lie. If people cant speak out without fear of being second guessed all the time what have we arrived at. Lets get some balance here please. Overall SC has done an excellent job of coaching the team and of promoting WBA through the press. Sound bites are just that. Substance is what really counts.
Not overly sensitive ruby, just an opinion, like yours, second guessing what's going on at the club is very often what sparks debate, I'm sure you've done it in the past, there's enough on here that try to grab the moral high ground but I don't think you're one of them.
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Not overly sensitive ruby, just an opinion, like yours, second guessing what's going on at the club is very often what sparks debate, I'm sure you've done it in the past, there's enough on here that try to grab the moral high ground but I don't think you're one of them.
Off course DAMTCL i wasnt being critical of peoples right to an opinion. I was just expressing my view that the remark he made was perhaps being taken a little too literally. I am asbsolutely sure he meant nothing disrespectful to WBA by his remark and was simply talking honestly so I felt words like "disappointed" that he said it were not really merited. Bit like politics really. The negatives tend to get picked up on before the positives which sometimes is a shame.
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Off course DAMTCL i wasnt being critical of peoples right to an opinion. I was just expressing my view that the remark he made was perhaps being taken a little too literally. I am asbsolutely sure he meant nothing disrespectful to WBA by his remark and was simply talking honestly so I felt words like "disappointed" that he said it were not really merited. Bit like politics really. The negatives tend to get picked up on before the positives which sometimes is a shame.
However, the fact remains, I am disappointed to hear that said by our Head Coach. I'd rather prefer to hear that we aspire to join that top club category, and our Head Coach aspires to take us there.
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Fair enough Chipper cant argue with that. Maybe im a bit more in the Royesque "we'll have done well to survive in this division on the budget we have" mould..................... :)
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What happened to the "Does Steve Clarke know what he's doing thread?"
He has just included a 16 year old in our squad for Chelsea. I need to vent my anger. :D
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Fair enough Chipper cant argue with that. Maybe im a bit more in the Royesque "we'll have done well to survive in this division on the budget we have" mould..................... :)
:) I've been around long enough to realise that we're fortunate to be where we are with our resources, no mistake about that. And I still rate Clarke extremely highly and think that appointing him was a master stroke by the club (take a bow JP). I just think that what he said was inappropriate and not what I would expect of someone in his position.
Maybe my problem is that hone is started going to Albion we really were one of the elite and I just hark back tothose days too often! :D
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He could have put a slightly different spin on his reply but it only glosses over the truth that if he does well here and a better opportunity comes along he will take it. I don't think fans who often clamour for a coaches dismissal during even a fairly short run of poor form can expect any manager to do anything else.
I like Clarke and I hope he sticks around a while longer. Given how the club is developing there are fewer clubs these days which are obviously a step up compared to the Albion, hence that too good to turn down opportunity might be sometime coming like it has been with Moyes at Everton.
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It was a comment I didn't particularly like but if we're being honest with ourselves, Steve Clarke is using us as a stepping stone to achieve better in his career and I don't blame him. If he has two or three successful seasons with us then he's bound to start attracting the attention of people elsewhere, just likes the players who have successful seasons with us.
That is probably the first time Steve Clarke has faced such questions as a head coach and I'm sure he's probably been caught off guard, hence the response. Give it a few more years when he becomes more experienced and familiar with the role and a bit more media savvy, I'm pretty sure those sort of comments will disappear and they may read slightly more respectable.
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Everyone getting a bit over sensitive about this in my opinion. He was just talking in a plain open and honest way. Nothing he said was a distortion of the truth or a lie. If people cant speak out without fear of being second guessed all the time what have we arrived at. Lets get some balance here please. Overall SC has done an excellent job of coaching the team and of promoting WBA through the press. Sound bites are just that. Substance is what really counts.
Yep, I agree and think, as is often the case, various media statements are often over analysed, at least in my view.
Having read SC's comments I don't really see an issue to be honest.
The blokes clearly doing a superb job for Albion and long may it continue but despite the stability of the football club over the past few years, the turnover of Head Coaches remains quite high - as tends to be the general way in modern football
I think most of us hope SC bucks the trend and remains at the Albion in the longer term but you just never know how things will pan out.
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I think we will be a top club in the next five years or so. If the prem league is forced to comply to a similar system as the bundes liga, we shold have a head start compaired to the top teams.
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SC might be gone sooner than we think. If Jose returns to Chelsea, watch them team up again.
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SC might be gone sooner than we think. If Jose returns to Chelsea, watch them team up again.
He's ambitious and that, even though it would be Chelski, would be a backward step in his career. Not going to happen.
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There's no way anyone with an ounce of ambition is going to give up a job managing a premier league team to go and be an assistant. His whole time as an assistant was working towards him being a manager.
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He's ambitious and that, even though it would be Chelski, would be a backward step in his career. Not going to happen.
I don't think that will happen. With the start that he has made with us, I see him continuing been the head coach for his career.
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Clarke is a decent manager - nothing more. A little too on the negative side for me, especially on occasions such as yesterday.
It's the players that generally make a manager. He can count himself lucky moving into a manager's job in the Premier League with a club as financially stable as WBA, and with one with such a fantastic scouting system. This has made his job much easier.
This season we have world class players in Lukaku and Foster. I'd be very worried about losing Lukaku if I was Clarke. And Clarke must do something about our offensive midfield players next season, the current incumbents aren't up to it Dorrans, Brunt and Morrison.
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I don't blame Clarke too much for Yesterday its natural for him to go a bit more defensive and not having Brunt and Lakaku to play was a shame too because who knows what could have happened if they both played. This club has a great knack at finding gems, Yacob, Odemwingie, Mcualey, Mulumbu, i see no reason why we cant find one or two more this summer.
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I don't think you can criticise Clarke for his tactics yesterday although we didn't play that well but while we kept the score at 1:0 we always had a chance of nicking something from the game. Obviously being without key players did not help our cause but to be honest we ran into a Chelsea team having one of their better days. the defeat was disappointing but had Clarke gone gungo-ho we could easily have been out of the game by half-time.
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Not happy with the set up at all.
Watched the whole game and Chelsea were awful...the Club are in turmoil and the fans hate the manager and are not too pleased with the owner either..
We set up to do a Liverpool and this was never going to work again ...im sure even Benitez watched that video...
Timid approach and dictated to by a team lacking confidence...
Feel for Fortune...hardly palys and when he does he is expected to hold the ball up for non existant midfield players who have been told to stay back as much as possible..
I feel we have turned a corner and made a massive step towards being a top 8 team every year...
So i was not pleased to see us go to Chelsea and "Hold out" and try and compete..
Benitez must have been happy with our team sheet...
Odemwinge and Thomas should have been on from the start, their full backs spent the first 60 mins of the game in our half !!!
We are no longer a team that survives in the Prem and goes to teams hoping to compete...
Time we backed ourselves more and made the so called big teams dig deep for their points !!!!!
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Not happy with the set up at all.
Watched the whole game and Chelsea were awful...the Club are in turmoil and the fans hate the manager and are not too pleased with the owner either..
We set up to do a Liverpool and this was never going to work again ...im sure even Benitez watched that video...
Timid approach and dictated to by a team lacking confidence...
Feel for Fortune...hardly palys and when he does he is expected to hold the ball up for non existant midfield players who have been told to stay back as much as possible..
I feel we have turned a corner and made a massive step towards being a top 8 team every year...
So i was not pleased to see us go to Chelsea and "Hold out" and try and compete..
Benitez must have been happy with our team sheet...
Odemwinge and Thomas should have been on from the start, their full backs spent the first 60 mins of the game in our half !!!
We are no longer a team that survives in the Prem and goes to teams hoping to compete...
Time we backed ourselves more and made the so called big teams dig deep for their points !!!!!
Funny how two people see things differently in a game, talking to a Chelsea fan who went to the game and he said Chelsea played better than they had done in ages.
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Funny how two people see things differently in a game, talking to a Chelsea fan who went to the game and he said Chelsea played better than they had done in ages.
MOTD presenters said the same thing.
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MOTD presenters said the same thing.
I suspect the lack of pressure is a major factor in Chelsea playing a bit better.
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He's doing great, but I think he needs to make his stamp on the side. The likes of Fortune,Dorrans,Thomas,Tamas should be let go. He has already said he has been abroad looking at new players so thats a good sign. For his first season as manager/head coach he has done great but the big test will be next season. I think his main task for next season is to build a better defence.
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This season we have world class players in Lukaku and Foster. I'd be very worried about losing Lukaku if I was Clarke.
People forget that for most of the season lukaku was nothing like the player - nowhere near - that he's been the last three or four games. Often he was terrible.
And the period we were most successful is the one in which he made least contribution.
So the idea that our good season is all down to lukaku doesn't stack up at all. If you want to attribute the difference to one player, it's yacob.
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So, according to the Mail The club is going to be talking to Clarke in the summer about extending his contract. Meanwhile he is saying he is happy and comfortable here.
Personally I'm quite happy for him to be here too, though he does occasionally concern me with comments about his future, like the latest one about working abroad at some point. I just wish he'd keep stuff like that to himself!
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He's doing great, but I think he needs to make his stamp on the side. The likes of Fortune,Dorrans,Thomas,Tamas should be let go. He has already said he has been abroad looking at new players so thats a good sign. For his first season as manager/head coach he has done great but the big test will be next season. I think his main task for next season is to build a better defence.
His main task for next season is getting a pacy winger / striker to replace Odemwinge and
Lukaku. Our defence is fine at the moment and isnt the proprietary.
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I felt he made a mistake with starting with Fortune today, shouldn't be played as winger.
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I felt he made a mistake with starting with Fortune today, shouldn't be played as winger.
Didn't start as a winger, we started with a 442, Fortune moved out wide after we changed shape and put Dorrans more central.
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Poor. Why not start Long & Lukaku - that would have troubled Taylor - why so conservative?
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At times he baffles me, I mean why play Fortune' when he has barely kicked a ball in months. We should play our strongest team at all times. Today was a game where we needed a win, the likes of West Ham,Swansea,Fulham,Southampton are not that far behind and to finish below 10th would be a big big shame. Don't get me wrong he was doing great until Christmas. But I do feel he was helped by Roy due to the fact Roy left us in really good shape, now that has faded away. Players are getting sent off for stupid things and our defending is embarassing at times. We also don't seem to turn up intill half-time. I think the summer and the first 10 games of next season will tell us if he's up to the task. Thats why I would personally wait before offering him a new deal.
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To be fair he did state he was going to make changes, Probably to see players who are out of contract at the end of the season, I feel roys habits helped at the start of the season as our form since nov has been relegation material. Hopefully he signs quality no quanity during the summer.
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highest league position, on target for most points, one more win for for our most wins in the prem and some of you are still questioning him?
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highest league position, on target for most points, one more win for for our most wins in the prem and some of you are still questioning him?
I think its the form since say November,that is concerning the majority of those voicing there concerns,on a personal note,I haven't made my mind up about him yet,just something about him that dont sit right,dunno what it is,but maybe its cause I wanted Laudrap to take the helm.
I also think the momentum of Hodgson was a factor in our early success to the season.Will be interested to see what happens in the Summer,will Peace back the Manager or hold back on the purse strings.
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I don't rate him. If we had performed the first half the season as we have the 2nd we would be in the relegation zone. First half we still had Hodgson influence. Now we only attack in the 2nd half of games. We can't pass it's lots of long balls. Even the set pieces don't seem to be working now - how many corners did we waste today? It has to be down to training and team selection and that's down to Clarke.
I know it's great we are 8th but all down to a fantastic start to the season which the manager has let slide.
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I don't rate him. If we had performed the first half the season as we have the 2nd we would be in the relegation zone. First half we still had Hodgson influence. Now we only attack in the 2nd half of games. We can't pass it's lots of long balls. Even the set pieces don't seem to be working now - how many corners did we waste today? It has to be down to training and team selection and that's down to Clarke.
I know it's great we are 8th but all down to a fantastic start to the season which the manager has let slide.
You can't just write off half seasons like that. We've a small squad and it was highly unlikely we'd keep that form up. Football playing Swansea for all the hype around them have had a similar drop off in form. Our team isn't that good, they're way over performing to be where they are when you look at Newcastle with a bunch of French internationals and similar teams below us.
Unless we get a rich owner, no manager, under no style of football will improve the current performances. You can't blame the manager for hitting the ceiling. No one will exceed this.
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Apart from winning the FA Cup, finishing 8th is just about our realistic ceiling for a season's performance when weighed against the massive wage and spending power of those above us. Only Everton in the top 7 are realistically in our "group" (and only just).
Investing now just to stay at this level is what its all about at.
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Obviously i would have taken where we are in the league at the start of the campaign and some people say we were running on Roy's adrenaline, still not convinced with Steve though. Next season we will get a much better indication of his management and coaching skills
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Next season will be where he convinces us whether he can become a good manager for us. Overall he has done very well for us. But this summer is a massive one for us as we are unsure as to who is leaving yeah and we do need to bring in some more quality to the side.
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I think he did make a mistake yesterday starting Fortune but then you've got to give him credit for taking off Yacob(Tactical not injury-related) to bring on Long which changed the game. I think he will have learned a lot this season and I personally think it's unfair on him to say the first half of the season was down to Roy, particularly as a lot of our success came at home where we were notoriously poor under Roy.
This slump in form is pointed to as a weakness of Clarke but the exact same thing happened under RDM and Roy himself, the 5-1 against Wolves was our season-defining result. It is also swept under the carpet that the period of December to February saw us missing various key players at various points. Look at our record since we've had a more recognisable squad, we've started doing better again which is no suprise.
As mentioned, for all the hype Swansea get, they are below us in the table. In terms of money, we are finishing above teams we have no right to be finishing above.
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Main thing that he got wrong Yesterday was certainly taking off two strikers and replacing them with midfielder we lakced ideas and creativity.
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I notice Steve Clarke was at the Man Utd v Chelsea game doing some scouting for when Mourinho takes over.
Dont know about bringing in players as I think Mr Peace will be looking for a new manager in the summer.
Next season is already looking bleak for us. :'(
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I notice Steve Clarke was at the Man Utd v Chelsea game doing some scouting for when Mourinho takes over.
Dont know about bringing in players as I think Mr Peace will be looking for a new manager in the summer.
Next season is already looking bleak for us. :'(
Interesting hopefully, what you said is not what it turns out to be. Clarke has said that he has wanted to get into management for a number of years.
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I notice Steve Clarke was at the Man Utd v Chelsea game doing some scouting for when Mourinho takes over.
Dont know about bringing in players as I think Mr Peace will be looking for a new manager in the summer.
Next season is already looking bleak for us. :'(
Eh? We play Man United last game of the season, far more likely he was watching them to scout for that game!
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Would be very disappointed in him if after being his own man he goes back to being a sidekick. If he does then so be it. Our set up allows for such changes
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Eh? We play Man United last game of the season, far more likely he was watching them to scout for that game!
Cant really see him going all that way just to see what Man Utd can do as surely he
would already know, a pointless end of season game against Man Ure ?
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I notice Steve Clarke was at the Man Utd v Chelsea game doing some scouting for when Mourinho takes over.
Dont know about bringing in players as I think Mr Peace will be looking for a new manager in the summer.
Next season is already looking bleak for us. :'(
Laughs uncontrollably.....Rainbow your posts just get better and better. Hope you enjoy your trips to Colchester Stevenage and Crawley to see the beautiful game?
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Cant really see him going all that way just to see what Man Utd can do as surely he
would already know, a pointless end of season game against Man Ure ?
Its not as if Manchester is a million miles away from the Albion, he would have a good idea of how they have played as do a lot of us, but no harm in going to watch them to get a bit more research.
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I notice Steve Clarke was at the Man Utd v Chelsea game doing some scouting for when Mourinho takes over.
Dont know about bringing in players as I think Mr Peace will be looking for a new manager in the summer.
Next season is already looking bleak for us. :'(
Have you been driNking Pimms in the bank holiday sun?
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I notice Steve Clarke was at the Man Utd v Chelsea game doing some scouting for when Mourinho takes over.
Dont know about bringing in players as I think Mr Peace will be looking for a new manager in the summer.
Next season is already looking bleak for us. :'(
Managers regularly travel to watch other teams play, it's part of the job of being a football manager. I'm a little bit worried about you Rainbow, but i can assure you Clarke wasn't at the game scouting for José Mourinho.
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Have you been driking Pimms in the bank holiday sun?
more like shagging his 6 toed sister..
funny guy but how a doghead can take the mick is beyond me.....
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Cant really see him going all that way just to see what Man Utd can do as surely he
would already know, a pointless end of season game against Man Ure ?
Wouldn't be much of a head coach if he didn't watch the opposition play would he? It might be pointless to you, but to Albion fans, every game is important.
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I doubt if any recent Doghead manager has ever scouted the opposition.
That's why they're constantly surprised when the opponents waltz through their defence ;D
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BetVictor have given out odds for our next permanent manager. Obviously just standard procedure.
http://www.oddschecker.com/football/football-specials/west-brom/next-permanent-manager
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BetVictor have given out odds for our next permanent manager. Obviously just standard procedure.
http://www.oddschecker.com/football/football-specials/west-brom/next-permanent-manager (http://www.oddschecker.com/football/football-specials/west-brom/next-permanent-manager)
That list is worth a chuckle. No doubt they'd take my fiver on Tony Blair.
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I'd make a cheeky bid for Rafa
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Anyone reckon Everton may go for him if Moyes leaves.
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Anyone reckon Everton may go for him if Moyes leaves.
I think Everton might go for Rafa. Doesnt he and his family still live on Merseyside
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rainbow you should be on the stage mate :D
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Everton can have Steve Clarke once Moyes sods off,
christ knows how we are still in 8th position.
Shane Long and McAuley score against Wigan then he puts them on the bench against Man City,
the bloke is clueless.
Any other manager with Odemwingie, Fortune, Lukaku, Rosenberg, and Long at their disposal would
of finished in the top 5.
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Everton can have Steve Clarke once Moyes sods off,
christ knows how we are still in 8th position.
Because we have a good team and a good manager perhaps ? Actually can't believe some people are doubting Clarke despite us having our best season in a long while. Long may it continue!
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Any other manager with Odemwingie, Fortune, Lukaku, Rosenberg, and Long at their disposal would
of finished in the top 5.
Howling with laughter at that one.
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Howling with laughter at that one.
Top five what are you on? Lukaku and Long have been the two strikers that have made the biggest impact this season. Both Fortune and Rosenberg have had good games and Pete would have played for if it not had been for what he had done. Although they are good strikers would any of the top five clubs seriously consider bringing any of those players in?
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I sincerely hope that if Ferguson's retirement does trigger a manager merry go round we do not lose Clarke in that process because that would be a setback and a very unwelcome way to start what is going to be an important summer for us.
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Everton can have Steve Clarke once Moyes sods off,
christ knows how we are still in 8th position.
Shane Long and McAuley score against Wigan then he puts them on the bench against Man City,
the bloke is clueless.
Any other manager with Odemwingie, Fortune, Lukaku, Rosenberg, and Long at their disposal would
of finished in the top 5.
hahahahahahaha
Your last post on this particularly topic was basically expressing your worry at Steve Clarke leaving. One loss later he's rubbish and you want to get rid of him.
At first it was relatively amusing but now you're just getting boring.
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Everton can have Steve Clarke once Moyes sods off,
christ knows how we are still in 8th position.
Shane Long and McAuley score against Wigan then he puts them on the bench against Man City,
the bloke is clueless.
Any other manager with Odemwingie, Fortune, Lukaku, Rosenberg, and Long at their disposal would
of finished in the top 5.
Stop with the trolling.
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Everton can have Steve Clarke once Moyes sods off,
christ knows how we are still in 8th position.
Shane Long and McAuley score against Wigan then he puts them on the bench against Man City,
the bloke is clueless.
Any other manager with Odemwingie, Fortune, Lukaku, Rosenberg, and Long at their disposal would
of finished in the top 5.
Top 5 really? ;D 8th is the best we can do!
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I sincerely hope that if Ferguson's retirement does trigger a manager merry go round we do not lose Clarke in that process because that would be a setback and a very unwelcome way to start what is going to be an important summer for us.
Clarke still has a lot to learn however losing him now would be a major set back for us I feel.
There is a very good chance will could lose Clarke to everton this summer.
The scary thing is I cannot think of a suitable replacement at this time.
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Everton fans want Martinez from what i have heard so far today
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Everton can have Steve Clarke once Moyes sods off,
christ knows how we are still in 8th position.
Shane Long and McAuley score against Wigan then he puts them on the bench against Man City,
the bloke is clueless.
Any other manager with Odemwingie, Fortune, Lukaku, Rosenberg, and Long at their disposal would
of finished in the top 5.
Mate you're just trolling now, find something else to do instead of boring us!
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Last 20 games w4 d5 L11. If we start next season like we have finished this then we will be lucky to stay up.I still say we have ennjoyed the momentium from last season upto November.
Maybe our poor second half has not been helped by Odemwingie gate
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Everton fans want Martinez from what i have heard so far today
Don't really know why everyone rates Martinez so highly. All he's done is barely escape relegation for a few years and this season looks as though they are going down. Surely you'd want someone with a proven track record, especially as David Moyes was the 16th highest paid manager in the world in 2012 football and they are obviously aware of how spending money on keeping a high class manager is invaluable if you want to get results with limited finance. I wouldn't want Martinez anywhere near our team based on his performance at Wigan.
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Clarke still has a lot to learn however losing him now would be a major set back for us I feel.
There is a very good chance will could lose Clarke to everton this summer.
The scary thing is I cannot think of a suitable replacement at this time.
I think there is a big danger Everton will go for Clarke this summer. He has cut his managerial teeth very effectively here, and achieved much on a limited budget (probably in the eyes of the outside footballing experts we are perceived as punching above our weight). We'll have to see what the summer brings but Jeremy Peace has made excellent Head Coach choices and he will again do us well
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One things for sure, the vacancy at Goodison strengthens his contract negotiations?
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Everton can have Steve Clarke once Moyes sods off,
christ knows how we are still in 8th position.
Shane Long and McAuley score against Wigan then he puts them on the bench against Man City,
the bloke is clueless.
Any other manager with Odemwingie, Fortune, Lukaku, Rosenberg, and Long at their disposal would
of finished in the top 5.
917 posts as a troll...that is some effort. Congrats.
Anyone think we could lose Clarke to Chelsea as an assistant perhaps?
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Whenever theres a manager merry go round in the Prem we always seem to be involved somewhere, so maybe again through no fault of our own, apart from being relatively successful, it looks like we will be again mentioned at the very least.
For me? I'm still unsure about SC.
The good first half of the season could have been a carry over from the Hodgson effect, it could also be down to SC. The worrying thing is that the second half of the season we have been in a nose dive from which we dont seem able to recover. Maybe thats from the unsettling effect that Odemwonga's had, maybe it's down to inexperience and strange team selections, who know's?
Whatever happens we go into the closed season knowing that yet again we have a truly defining 3 months to get through.
If SC stays, who will he bring in. Next season he has the chance to mould the team as his from the start so I doubt if the club and fans will be so forgiving if we get off to a bad start.
Never a dull moment here is there?
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To be honest I'm not 100% convinced by Clarke just yet despite being delighted with the season we have had overall. He wasn't the one many wanted for the job and I said at the time he needed to make a good start to keep the fans off his back and there was that period over Christmas where people were really beginning to question him with the odd few ridiculously calling for his head.
The second half of the season has been a little overshadowed by the Odemwingie fiasco and must have had a negative affect on the team. In my view Clarke handled the situation well and had it not been for him taking to twitter again I firmly believe he would have been back in the starting XI long before now and everyone could have turned a blind eye until the summer.
He's already made a few comments to the media about the need not to stand still as a club and wanting a marquee signing so he is already sending messages to the chairman that he needs backing in the transfer market. It will be interesting to see how the summer pans out as we may need to get busy in the transfer market.
As things stand I believe we will see the real impact of Clarke next season when he's had the chance to get one or two players in he thinks will make a difference to how he wants us to play.
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One way to judge Clarke is by the quality of players he is able to recruit in the summer. I think Clarke has upset many fans by his decision to select and play Odemwingie against Man City. Odemwingie should now be history and we should be blooding a promising youngster.
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After Odemwingie went down to QPR, had a twitter rant, then another twitter rant and then the altercation with the fans last weekend Clarke still decides to bring him off the bench against Man City.
Its almost like hes sticking two fingers up to the fans by saying 'if I want to pick him I'll pick him'.
I thought Clarke handled the situation well at the very start but has lost control since. It serves no purpose whatsoever to keep him around the squad. He has been an unwanted distraction that had we hadn't had the start we had could have meant we would have been relegated due to our poor form since the QPR debacle.
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I like Clarke and although he has made mistakes i think he has been a good appointment, also its worth remembering as a club unless we change our approach majorly (which i hope we dont) then we are probably as high as we can be, to be the 8th best team in the country with how we are run, newly established prem team is some achievement.
With some extra investment in January we could maybe kick on for 6th spot, and ideally have better cup runs but other than that i am not sure what else he can do. Its his first managers job and he will of learn from mistakes.
Personally i cannot see the appeal to a move to Everton, it would be a sideways move, as a club they are bigger than us but they are also millions in debt, have a rundown ground, and appear to of like us reached their level without huge investment which they have been trying for years and got nowhere, i like Everton but i would see Albion to Everton as a sideways move based on the last few years and unless their circumstances change.
With Odemwingie, i believe he met with the club a week ago today, upto then he hadnt been involved for a few games, since the club meeting when apparently it was agreed he would leave, fines were accepted / suspended, etc, etc the two games since he has been involved. Maybe Odemwingie apologised to Clarke and the club and the agreement was if he was involved til the end of the season he would give his best. Also i assumed that the players would be hacked off with him but in the last 4 x months only Reid has spoken out, usually these circumstances players have things to say so maybe Odemwingie is still wanted / liked by his team mates and Clarke may of taken that into consideration. Its a lose lose situation, if he doesnt play him we are keeping a proven player on the bench and paying him a huge wage, if he does play him then he upsets a chunk of the fans. I doubt he will experience this situation again during his managerial career!
Clarke has also introduced youth players, Thorne had started to breakthrough, Brown has been involved, Nabi, Daniels and O Neill have also involved so it seems Clarke wants to get the youth involved which can only be good.
He could definitely improve the cup runs but overall i think its a job well done so far!
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Haven't we reached our highest league position of any of our previous Prem seasons???
Was this with Clarke at the helm??
We win as a team
We lose as a team
Great job so far im a happy Baggie
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Very pleased so far and not many of us would have guessed how well the season would go , i would like to see a little less long balls and stronger discipline but i can't be too picky with whats been achieved . I think Clarke has earned the right to be allowed to push the boat out on a few extra quality players to take us to the next level and i hope the board can see that too.
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Haven't we reached our highest league position of any of our previous Prem seasons???
Was this with Clarke at the helm??
We win as a team
We lose as a team
Great job so far im a happy Baggie
But apparently can't draw for toffee :D
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On Evertons Bucket list i hear
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Very pleased so far and not many of us would have guessed how well the season would go , i would like to see a little less long balls and stronger discipline but i can't be too picky with whats been achieved . I think Clarke has earned the right to be allowed to push the boat out on a few extra quality players to take us to the next level and i hope the board can see that too.
I would agree with you Dexy although if im honest those few quality players are probably likely to just keep us ticking over mid table. To go to the next level pushing in to the top 6 looks a step too far to me. But i very much agree that we need some players who will improve us in possession of the ball particularly in defense. A better run a a cup would be a nice change too! Still who would have thought a couple of seasons or so ago that we would be looking like an established PL side.
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Wasn't Steve watching Man Ud because we're playing them next week ?
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Last 20 games w4 d5 L11. If we start next season like we have finished this then we will be lucky to stay up.I still say we have ennjoyed the momentium from last season upto November.
Maybe our poor second half has not been helped by Odemwingie gate
I think Jack makes a good point here.
I was watching Gary Neville talking about Ferguson yesterday and he said one of the great things he always got right (which often can make or break a manager) is knowing how to handle players that challenge a managers authority.
Since Odemwingie gate I feel Clarke has been undermined by the whole thing and has lacked the charisma, authority and experience to deal with it well enough.
It's made him look weak and that can filter through to the rest of the players.
The fiasco was embarrassing Saturday; getting him to warm up to come on then sending him back to the bench because of the heckling he got. Surely he should of known that was going to happen? Lets just hope it all gets nipped in the bud over the summer.
For me however I think we would of been better with someone like Ralf Rangnick; a figurehead with a little bit more about them.
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CB
Point taken however Clarke and Fergie work in completely different circles in a financial sense
If Odemwingie had been at Man Utd, and acted as he did .... he'd be gone, ostracised, finished ..... Fergie can afford to lose tens of millions and has a squad that wouldn't miss anyone really .... we don't
How on earth could Clarke act .... Rosenburg not tested, Lukaku yet to fire, Long off form, no Gera, Yacob & Mulumbu .... what else could he do.
Odemwingie is hopefully a one off ..... due diligence went wrong on this occasion ..... I personally think he should have been used sparingly, if at all, however how honestly would Fergie acted if he was the manager at The Baggies ..... Think his only option was resignation.
Odemwingie doesn't really understand what he is doing, he truly believes he has been wronged ... he appears to have had poor advice but at the end of the day he's a loose cannon, and it Will happen again, probably a number of times both professionally and personally probably ... but what do I know.
He's be gone in the summer and over time we'll hopefully remember his good points only.
As for Clarke this was a No Win situation for everyone, if he could have dark holed Odemwingie he probably would ... but he didn't have the resources or financial back up to can him.
Just my opinion, but you have to take the season as a whole, who knows we may start like a runaway train next season.
I like Clarke, and if I'm honest I don't think Roy would have got us any higher in the league.
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I think, given that its the first time big decisions have actually rested on his shoulders, he hasn't done too badly.
There are some things where I felt he could have done better, and a more experienced manager would probably have done, but we have to hope he learns from that and we can carry on improving.
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I think he's done well so far. He's probably made us more flexible with the switching between 4-5-1, 4-4-2 and 4-3-3 and using the 3 centre backs with wing backs against Man City.
I'll be interested to see how it develops with some of his own signings. I suspect we'll be getting a bit more pace and energy into the side.
As far as his handling of the Odemwingie saga goes, there's no sign of any other players being affected too much by what's gone on which is surely more important than making decisions based on what the fans want.
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I think Jack makes a good point here.
I was watching Gary Neville talking about Ferguson yesterday and he said one of the great things he always got right (which often can make or break a manager) is knowing how to handle players that challenge a managers authority.
Since Odemwingie gate I feel Clarke has been undermined by the whole thing and has lacked the charisma, authority and experience to deal with it well enough.
It's made him look weak and that can filter through to the rest of the players.
The fiasco was embarrassing Saturday; getting him to warm up to come on then sending him back to the bench because of the heckling he got. Surely he should of known that was going to happen? Lets just hope it all gets nipped in the bud over the summer.
For me however I think we would of been better with someone like Ralf Rangnick; a figurehead with a little bit more about them.
It's very false to try and extrapolate next seasons form by the second half of this season though. Loads of teams have one good half one bad half, Everton usually do, likewise Arsenal, Wigan of course only seem to bother playing March onwards. Most teams vary year by year but few teams are consistent through the season, only the very best.
Plus we've had nothing to play for in months, Europe quickly went out the window when it became clear only 5th would be getting in, we were out of both cups, and definitely not going to be relegated. Mix in the Odemwingie saga, and injury problems with a small squad.
If people aren't happy this season, then realistically they never will be. Because this is as good as it gets, its not getting any better than this - league wise anyway.
And Rangnick quit his last job on stress, then took a behind the scenes job after rejecting us. It seems pretty clear mentally he doesn't fancy being a manager.
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Yes think it's a case of appreciate what you've got and be careful what you wish for....
If Clarke went now there would be a whole load of uncertainty over his successor (remember how long it took to appoint Clarke after Roy went).
Clarke also has good contacts in the game which have already helped in the shape of Lakaku.
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Overall I have been very impressed with the start that Clarke has made as he has surprised me as I didn't think we would pick up as many points as what we have done this season. However by bringing Odemwingie on after everything that happened is wrong and only makes things worse. I will really judge how he gets on this summer, and how the new players do.
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It's very false to try and extrapolate next seasons form by the second half of this season though. Loads of teams have one good half one bad half, Everton usually do, likewise Arsenal, Wigan of course only seem to bother playing March onwards. Most teams vary year by year but few teams are consistent through the season, only the very best.
Plus we've had nothing to play for in months, Europe quickly went out the window when it became clear only 5th would be getting in, we were out of both cups, and definitely not going to be relegated. Mix in the Odemwingie saga, and injury problems with a small squad.
If people aren't happy this season, then realistically they never will be. Because this is as good as it gets, its not getting any better than this - league wise anyway.
And Rangnick quit his last job on stress, then took a behind the scenes job after rejecting us. It seems pretty clear mentally he doesn't fancy being a manager.
Never a truer word spoken. We should enjoy our lofty position while it lasts because no doubt one day the pendulum will swing. Thats the nature of things.
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Yup, What goes round comes round in football
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Fair few are used to it. This is probably the best we will have in the foreseeable?
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To be honest I'm not 100% convinced by Clarke just yet despite being delighted with the season we have had overall. He wasn't the one many wanted for the job and I said at the time he needed to make a good start to keep the fans off his back and there was that period over Christmas where people were really beginning to question him with the odd few ridiculously calling for his head.
The second half of the season has been a little overshadowed by the Odemwingie fiasco and must have had a negative affect on the team. In my view Clarke handled the situation well and had it not been for him taking to twitter again I firmly believe he would have been back in the starting XI long before now and everyone could have turned a blind eye until the summer.
He's already made a few comments to the media about the need not to stand still as a club and wanting a marquee signing so he is already sending messages to the chairman that he needs backing in the transfer market. It will be interesting to see how the summer pans out as we may need to get busy in the transfer market.
As things stand I believe we will see the real impact of Clarke next season when he's had the chance to get one or two players in he thinks will make a difference to how he wants us to play.
I agree with you. The wheels could have come off completely with a new Head Coach with no managerial experience but they didn't. Credit to SC for that. I also like him as a bloke. But the reality is that he inherited someone elses squad, the strongest squad incidentally that the Baggies have ever had in the Prem, and he also, critically, inherited the discipline that Hodgson had instilled in them. He has got a rebuilding job to do over the Summer and we will only see how good SC is next season.
Given the above I would be absolutely staggered if Everton wanted him. Laudrup would surely be a better move for them.
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I agree with you. The wheels could have come off completely with a new Head Coach with no managerial experience but they didn't. Credit to SC for that. I also like him as a bloke. But the reality is that he inherited someone elses squad, the strongest squad incidentally that the Baggies have ever had in the Prem, and he also, critically, inherited the discipline that Hodgson had instilled in them. He has got a rebuilding job to do over the Summer and we will only see how good SC is next season.
Given the above I would be absolutely staggered if Everton wanted him. Laudrup would surely be a better move for them.
Although Laudrup used his knowledge of Spanish football to bring in 3 or 4 excellent cut price signings, basically you could say similar things about him at Swansea - inherited a good side with a solid defence and an established style of playing. Clarke and Laudrup deserve similar credit for fine tuning. I would not be staggered at all if Everton show an interest in Clarke.
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He has no bottle.
Why does he constantly have a go at Odemwingie yet still puts him in the squad
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He has no bottle.
Why does he constantly have a go at Odemwingie yet still puts him in the squad
When has he had a go? I mean a proper go? The one thing he always DOES say is he's in the squad through necessity due to a small squad size.
we don't have many players who can play the wide role without using academy players who aren't ready.
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He's has about his twitter rants and how stupid he is for doing it.
Why can't Jerome Thomas play there?
And why do we need him when there has not been nothing to play for for a number Of weeks now?
Why not give other players the chance like other clubs do
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Its not Knee jerk. Roys momentum has now gone.This bloke is clueless.Never wanted him from the day his name was mentioned.I will be gone by November.Now lost more than last season.No fight no bottle no idea.The media keep saying what a season we have been Average at best
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Its not Knee jerk. Roys momentum has now gone.This bloke is clueless.Never wanted him from the day his name was mentioned.I will be gone by November.Now lost more than last season.No fight no bottle no idea.The media keep saying what a season we have had.Average at best
Our highest position for 35 years is average?? You summed up your post nicely at the start - knee jerk. When we announced Clarke I remember you saying we would be in a relegation battle, proved you wrong big time there hasnt he!
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Overall I have been very pleased with Steve Clarke this season however there are a couple of things lately that have got me annoyed, why play Odemwingie at all he doesn't want to be and neither do the fans so why give him ten minutes in games when we have young players like Brown who are the future of this club and they should be getting some game time.
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Disappointing with the chopping and changing, the persistence of Odenwonga
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Dont get me wrong there is a few things he needs to improve but some fans make me laugh they never talk football its either; we win - 'great season so lucky to be an Albion fan for seasons like this' or next week we lose - 'Manager out'! Its laughable. ;D
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I want him here next season, massive summer for us in terms of players coming in and out which hopefully Clarke will get right.
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He has obviously got allot of hard work to do in the summer months.Our form since the end of November has been dire, carry this form into the start of next season and its uphill from the off
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He has obviously got allot of hard work to do in the summer months.Our form since the end of November has been dire, carry this form into the start of next season and its uphill from the off
I agree, bit of perspective at last. As others have said big summer!
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I have never slagged off Steve Clarke, but it could be argued that the first half of the season he inherited Roy's side, with all the good habits etc, and reaped the rewards. The second half of the season was his to make his mark and help us to kick on, and on this basis you would have to say he has failed. I dont want to knee jerk and say sack him, but I, like a lot of others on here, am not one bit confident about next season, even though 8/9th should make me very happy.
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I think he's a good head coach and his success all depends on the funds he will be given by jp that will make or break him
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For a club of our size he done a fine job!! I dont buy the "it was Roys side" stuff. Bottom line is we employ a coach to get the best out of whatever players are at his disposal. That is what is expected of him. Likely 8th place in the PL our BEST ever finish and points total he has excelled. Its an irrefutable argument. The season is over 38 games not 24!
As for why we have been much better in the first half I would have thought that was fairly obvious. We just dont have a big enough squad to meet the demands that this league now presents. Key players just become more and more jaded as the season progresses. Unless were going to go back to a 25 man squad that we can utilise then i expect the same again next season when essentially we are using around 16 or 17 players.
Personally I dont get carried away too much. When each season begins Im realistic enough to believe that to survive in this league is an achievement in itself. If we lose two or three fringe players but add a bit of quality to try and improve what we have no reason to think we cant stick around again.
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1. I think he needs backing regarding players he wants to bring in.
2. I think he needs to add a chunk of discipline both on and off the pitch , the players have been far, far too relaxed since nearing the 40 point mark for me. Players behaviour has annoyed me this season too.
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1. I think he needs backing regarding players he wants to bring in.
2. I think he needs to add a chunk of discipline both on and off the pitch , the players have been far, far too relaxed since nearing the 40 point mark for me. Players behaviour has annoyed me this season too.
I hope Peace backs him, we know that were not going to spend major as that's not our nature but I think we can all see that we do need some improvement in a lot of areas.
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I have never slagged off Steve Clarke, but it could be argued that the first half of the season he inherited Roy's side, with all the good habits etc, and reaped the rewards. The second half of the season was his to make his mark and help us to kick on, and on this basis you would have to say he has failed. I dont want to knee jerk and say sack him, but I, like a lot of others on here, am not one bit confident about next season, even though 8/9th should make me very happy.
Fair do's. One thing though he brought Lukaku in not sure if Roy (rate the man very highly) would have done so.
One player does not make a team but this season he has transformed our attack.
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Our first half of the season was built on an excellent home record, totally the opposite to how we performed at The Hawthorns under Hodgson.
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Personally I lay much of the blame with the players, 90% of managers in the world would struggle to motivate the group we have in the situation we are currently in, Swansea have been much the same since they won the League Cup look at Fulham also.
The fact is we achieved our main aim for the season by mid-December and from then on it has been an uphill struggle to get the players up for games. Yes we will say why didn't we push on and go for Europe etc and I can't think of many good reasons why we couldn't. However, when you look at what the majority said when Clarke got the job, we should be delighted with the prospect of finishing 8th/9th.
Factor in the Odemwingie saga, which despite what many will say has obviously had an impact on the players and its not surprising that performances were nowhere near the level of the first half of the season. That said, the squad we have now is one of quality and many of the players will still be here next season ready for a fresh challenge and the surrendering of a few meaningless end of season games against sides who needed points does not make the likes of Olsson, Yacob, Mulumbu, Brunt, Long, Foster and McAuley poor players.
Just think, if our season had of been the other way round and we had of been pooh before Christmas everyone would be buzzing with optimism for next season. Such an outrageous overreaction.
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The jury is still out on him, despite our great achievements this season. I was very impressed earlier on this season with not only himself but the application of the players and some of the results they pulled off was enough to make us very proud. He always came across very well too in the media and he looked the part after spending so long as a number two. It seems to be that now we've reached our season target the players have taken it upon themselves to go on their holidays and the application of some of the players which was applaudable prior to November has become non-existent. The biggest culprits of decline appear to be Jonas Olsson and James Morrison who really haven't reached their standards.
There have been problems during the new year and January where injuries to both Claudio Yacob and Youssouf Mulumbu really affected the balance of the side and our lack of control in the middle from those two provided Steve Clarke with a problem. It was disappointing to see that the board weren't going to help him early January and get an addition in to help Mulumbu and Yacob. What also hasn't helped is a certain player who has deflected the attention of a good season onto himself and proved to be a nuisance to the club - all this happened in January in what is Steve Clarke's first season. There's plenty he will have learned which will leave him in good stead for the future.
The disappointing thing about this season is not only have performances dipped but our form has gone into rapid decline which has seen a lack of discipline from certain individuals. We've had four red cards this season and all have been to a lack of self discipline and nothing football related. That is something Clarke could iron out. Whilst we achieved our target pretty early on in the season and after exiting both cup competitions there hasn't really been a target and due to this the players have coasted through. The statistics don't make great reading either - 4 wins in the last 20 and 15 points since November - it is form associated with sides fighting at the bottom half of the table and baring that in mind questions were always going to be asked.
On the whole, this will go down as our best season in years and years, beating the achievements of Roy Hodgson, however, numerous factors have lead me down the path of not enjoying this season and wanting it to be over as soon as possible. Next season will be interesting. The attitude of the players must improve and with an overhaul is key areas looking likely, that's when we'll get a real picture of Steve Clarke.
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I think we can look back at the last few months and learn a lot from it. The fact that bringing players in over the January window is a good thing as I was impressed with Ridgewell and Andrews in the second half of last season. Clarke will have more experience now as he has had his first season and I think in order for these end of season type of performances not to happen again make the targets even higher.
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Nicely put Liam. the one point I would like to endorse is that surrounding Peter Odemwingie. There is no doubt in my mind that the whole sorry mess has effected the teams focus slightly. I have a lot of sympathy for Steve Clarke in this. He is obviously the man that has been caught in the crossfire between the club and the player. A no win situation for him really which he has done his best to put a lid on. But as soon as the bulk of the supporters washed their hands of him then there was only ever going to be one outcome.
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Nicely put Liam. the one point I would like to endorse is that surrounding Peter Odemwingie. There is no doubt in my mind that the whole sorry mess has effected the teams focus slightly. I have a lot of sympathy for Steve Clarke in this. He is obviously the man that has been caught in the crossfire between the club and the player. A no win situation for him really which he has done his best to put a lid on. But as soon as the bulk of the supporters washed their hands of him then there was only ever going to be one outcome.
And once the supporters washed their hands of him and abused him on match-days, Steve Clarke should have followed the trend and washed his hands of him too - even if he didn't want too. The player in question is one who is just a distraction lacking the basic principles of team ethic. Steve Clarke will have learned a lot from this episode I would have thought, no matter how much he has annoyed me with his handling of it.
I still think a large reason behind our decline was the loss of Yacob and Mulumbu in January. Yacob hasn't looked the same player since, just looks a touch off the pace and when Mulumbu did return he got himself suspended stupidly. They are positions which Steve Clarke might want to strengthen by adding more depth considering both are fundamentally important to us.
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Regarding the Mulumbu and Yacob situation having Thorne out was a big blow as he would have played more and he is more suited to that role.
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A few have said that SC inherited Roys team for explaining the first half of the season and when eventually stamping his own authority the decline started. I am inclined to believe this.
There also seem to be various other issues. The PO saga must have had an effect on the team and in his latest revelation he commented that he has had fall outs with certain players. The small group of players selected can’t help also as it is limiting choice and perhaps making players too comfortable knowing they will likely get selected and not putting in a performance accordingly.
SC also seems to have problems with discipline.
I was never in favour of SC being selected to replace Roy and my choice at the time if he had applied was Laudrup and that is not just a reaction to the way Swansea have played this season.
I am not convinced that JP will fully back the manager in funding player purchases during the summer as he must be concerned as with many of us by the form since December.
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I truely belive he will be the first EPL manager to get sacked next season!
Hes done nothing to improve us from what Roy did, the team was still playing under Roys way untill November then he started tinkering with the team, Switching the LB, giving Dorrans a chance playing 4,3,3 instead of the 4,2,3,1 that we seemed very suited to play.
Maybe not his fault but the Odemwinge situation was badley delt with and it still going on now and he is to blame by keep going against the fans wishes which will unsettle the team.
Cannot control his players, Popov spitting, Mulumbu Kicking Out, Odemwinge got set off for kicking out and theres another one I belive!
Hes not dealing with the McAuley situation very well, we all know we need him and he must do to but will not force a deal for the guy with JP putting his hand in his pocket.
I dont belive he can motivate the team either, we went behind in so many games at the start of season and we have looked lac luster since getting to 35points!
Didnt get anyone in in January which ment the players didnt get to kick up the backside from new players fighting for a place
To be quite frank 2013 we have had relagation form!
I seriously worrying about next year...
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Cannot control his players, Popov spitting, Mulumbu Kicking Out, Odemwinge got set off for kicking out and theres another one I belive!
There is. Fortune slapping Gaston Ramirez ;D
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There is. Fortune slapping Gaston Ramirez ;D
yes exactly...Its not good enough and not many other teams have had players sent off for those kind of reasons.
To be quite frank though, Swansea have done no better since getting themselves safe, yes they won the CC but other than 2013 has been simlar to ours. So did Laudrup get the new manager effect and slowly peaterd out?
We have got to score good in the first 5 games of next year because i can truely see his head on the block soon!
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Hes done nothing to improve us from what Roy did, the team was still playing under Roys way untill November then he started tinkering with the team,
We mainly played 4-4-2 under Hodgson, our setup under Clarke was totally different.
I can't believe people have forgotten how bad at home we were under Roy.
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i have commented at various times throughout the season regarding SC and i still cannot make my min d up regarding him as the manager, although it is his first season as the main man he has served under enough top managers to see how its done, i have questioned his tactics and also his selections for certain games, all things said and done 4 wins out of last 21 games is not good enough.
he really will have to look at his squad next season it definitely needs some improvement if we are to repeat the final league position of this season,
he will have to hit the ground running as i said it is his first season and next season we will find out if he has what it takes to be a top man or is he another excellant coach who cannot hack the top job, just hope we don't start next season like we finished this
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Regarding the Mulumbu and Yacob situation having Thorne out was a big blow as he would have played more and he is more suited to that role.
You really think this!! :o
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I think Clarke has come in for flack at the end of what has been our most successful season in recent history. Unfair in my opinion.
Fair enough we've been poor form and results wise in the second half of the season I'm not one of these with the blinkers on either but I think the second half of the season is more to us not having a squad to sustain a 38 game season and being a bit streched as opposed to Clarke being out of his depth etc...
We've done a classic Charlton really got to 40 odd points and then 'off to the beach' In our Great Escape season under Robson with about 5 games to go we went to The Valley (when we were scrapping for our lives) and whacked them 4-1, they finished 7th that season I think and the next season had another top half finish despite finishing both season very poorly. I'm not saying I agree with it but the players have given us a great season and been safe for a very long time and teams like that getting poor results at the end of the season against teams scrapping for their lives isnt uncommon. When we finished bottom under Morbray we whacked a lackustre, mid-table Sunderland 3-0, Wigan 3-1, held Bolton to a 1-1 draw in the final few weeks when they werw on the beach.
It's amazing how down the road Lamberts had a few good wins and their fans hail him like Mourinho and we're having a pop at Clarke over here.
In Clarke we Trust! we'll be fine !
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You really think this!! :o
yeah, Thorne basically IS a defensive midielder and is good enough cover. When one is out he very easily could have just slotted in.
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It is much better to finish the season well, then start the season well - momentum and all that!
Why should the players take the foot off the gas?
That is not, and has never been the WBA way.
Clarke stated in his press conference at the start of the year that his first aim was to get to 50 points. Unless we beat Ma Utd next weeek - he has failed.
We spent nothing in Jan - why was this? Peace etc happy with their lot, or did they not trust Clarke with money.
Some terrible displays lately, and the fact that we have to break the bank next year, just to compete is very worrying.
We should be looking onwards and upwards, but the majority of fans are looking down the table again
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This season is starting to have such a disappointing feel to it. Dont get me wrong, would rather have the points on the board early than scaping for them as we did previously. We have gone from Euro outsiders to lets get 55+ ponts to 50 points to hang on to 8th.
We will probably lose v. Man U and with Swansea hosting Fulham they will take 8th I think. So 9th, 1 better than last year, 1 point better than last year...........progress? Think SC has had too much time to think about team formations, tinkering etc and it aint helped at all. I also think he is his own worst enemy including PO in the squad. The crowd and players were distracted against Wigan, we lost. PO is definitely going, so why in the squad against Norwich?
For the sake of the season and optimism for the team and SC, I can only hope we turn in a decent diplay on Sunday else I fear the summer is going to feel pretty flat.
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FOOT OF THE GAS / ON THE BEACH ETC
Yes agreed our performance have dropped and whatever we say once we passed the 40 point mark, players would have relaxed in some way ..... wouldn't they.
But lets look at this fact concerning the best team my a mile over the past 20 years .... Manchester United.
They secured the title with 4 games to go and Fergie said he wanted to beat the total Chelsea had achieved by winning his last 4 games and has an unbelievable squad. Then .....
Draw at Arsenal, Lose to Chelsea, scrape past Swansea and if they lose to us on Sunday (Big ask I know) but that would give them 3 points out of 12 ..... relegation form isn't it .... and that's from the runaway champions.
You take the season over 38 games ...... no doubt that the Odemwingie farce has effected the club, but it was always going to wasn't it. Injuries will always cause us problems ..... no crystal ball but what would have happened to Aston Villa if they had lost Benteke for the final 6 games?
Overall we got a bit ahead of ourselves as the season started ..... I couldn't believe the contrast between games ...... Sunderland away vs Swansea away / Southampton away vs Norwich away. Talk about a contrast in fortunes.
Realistically we willnever be able to compete over the season as a whole against Man Utd, Man City, Chelsea, Arsenal, Liverpool, Spurs etc ........ Lets get real they just buy success don't they.
Guys ..... we have achieved very near our full potential this season. The main frustration at the moment is I fear we will be pipped by Swansea for 8th place at the death ..... but
9th on 48 points ........... I bet all of us would have taken that every time in August last year.
Clarke has done fine, mistakes yes ..... but it's his first season give him a break .... he learn much more from loses than he will do from wins.
Roll on next season
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As stated previous, i think Clarke has done a decent job, i dont think league position wise he could of done much more, the cup runs to me is a disappointment.
I think as some have stated above, the concern is we usually finish seasons quite well and it leads to everybody feeling as they we have finished on a high, this season that wont be the case, i always think its too easy to question the manager and keep sacking them, but i do fear for Clarke if the first 10 games of next season dont start well, he will have fans turn on him, taking into account the form in 2013.
I dont think many coaches or managers would of finished above 8th with this group of players, the advantage Clarke does now have and this is where i would be concerned if i was some players, is that he has 3 x months to start changing the squad, he is a good coach and i have no doubt it wont of gone unnoticed over the last few months some of the players performances and efforts and i have no doubt he will be looking at ways to improve.
To me as said above players often get away too easy, i know its sub concious, etc but if i was a few of them i would be asking myself have i really done myself justice since Xmas, and also what their professional and playing ambitions are because the reality is for many of these players, playing for us in the top 10 of the Premiership is as good as it will get, thats not Clarkes fault, its how we kick on, if at all.
The next step up from us in this country is Tottenham and Arsenal, then next step up from them is Chelsea, Man City and Man United, realistically how many of our team / squad would get in the Tottenham and Arsenal teams, let alone the top 3. (Of course there is Europe but England still appears to be treated as the league to play in)
Goalie = Foster if he wanted i am sure could, but he seems happy in the Midlands.
Defenders = McAuley has been great but he is 33/34 and he wont go any higher, Olsson possibly could if he gets back to the form of upto 6 months ago, Ridgewell i think his place could be in doubt with us let along moving higher, Reid is now coming to the end of his career, Popov and Tamas are backups for us so they wont go higher, Jones has potential and i think has really improved since Xmas but whether he would get a bigger and better club at the moment would be a no.
Midfield = Thomas is leaving, Morrison has 1 good game in every 4 and think playing for us his level, Dorrans has done okay and been steady but i dont see higher clubs coming in, Brunt the same, Gera is in the same catergory as Reid, Mulumbu i think could step up to a Arsenal or Spurs type club but as far as we know no club has ever actually tried to sign him despite rumours so maybe they arent convinced, Yacob i personally feel the jury is still out on, first few months was great but since the injury he looks half the player, and i think he looks good when alongside Mulumbu, very average when not with Mulumbu, i also am not sure he is the type of player who you would want alongside you when the chips are down, so for me, if i was a bigger or better club in this country i wouldnt rush in for him, yet! Hopefully next season he can kick on.
Forwards - Lukaku isnt ours, Odemwingie and most like Fortune will be gone but i doubt to a top club, Rosenberg i think needs to prove himself with us and Long i dont think is consistent enough for a top club.
The above sounds negative, it isnt, because for the club we are and where are now, these players have done a good job and they are right for us, but for them personally i dont think they can afford too many games like yesterday where they just cant be bothered, because this is as good as it gets for a lot of them, i would have a long hard think over the summer if i was them players and really try and make the best of their Albion careers, i am not claiming we are some super club but the reality is that when they leave us they will be heading downwards with the exception of maybe 2-3.
Its upto them, Clarke will no doubt want to add more quality, we may be able to do that with the extra money we have (we dont have to go crazy though) and those players need to decide if they want to be part of trying to move to the next level and really give it everything, not just 3-4 months of the season as i dont think there Albion careers will last much longer if thats the case. Clarke will of learnt more about the squad in the last 4 months than he did the first 5, and i think a few of them may well find they are no longer first team regulars next season and they only have themselves to blame.
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crackin post fella
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As stated previous, i think Clarke has done a decent job, i dont think league position wise he could of done much more, the cup runs to me is a disappointment.
I think as some have stated above, the concern is we usually finish seasons quite well and it leads to everybody feeling as they we have finished on a high, this season that wont be the case, i always think its too easy to question the manager and keep sacking them, but i do fear for Clarke if the first 10 games of next season dont start well, he will have fans turn on him, taking into account the form in 2013.
I dont think many coaches or managers would of finished above 8th with this group of players, the advantage Clarke does now have and this is where i would be concerned if i was some players, is that he has 3 x months to start changing the squad, he is a good coach and i have no doubt it wont of gone unnoticed over the last few months some of the players performances and efforts and i have no doubt he will be looking at ways to improve.
To me as said above players often get away too easy, i know its sub concious, etc but if i was a few of them i would be asking myself have i really done myself justice since Xmas, and also what their professional and playing ambitions are because the reality is for many of these players, playing for us in the top 10 of the Premiership is as good as it will get, thats not Clarkes fault, its how we kick on, if at all.
The next step up from us in this country is Tottenham and Arsenal, then next step up from them is Chelsea, Man City and Man United, realistically how many of our team / squad would get in the Tottenham and Arsenal teams, let alone the top 3. (Of course there is Europe but England still appears to be treated as the league to play in)
Goalie = Foster if he wanted i am sure could, but he seems happy in the Midlands.
Defenders = McAuley has been great but he is 33/34 and he wont go any higher, Olsson possibly could if he gets back to the form of upto 6 months ago, Ridgewell i think his place could be in doubt with us let along moving higher, Reid is now coming to the end of his career, Popov and Tamas are backups for us so they wont go higher, Jones has potential and i think has really improved since Xmas but whether he would get a bigger and better club at the moment would be a no.
Midfield = Thomas is leaving, Morrison has 1 good game in every 4 and think playing for us his level, Dorrans has done okay and been steady but i dont see higher clubs coming in, Brunt the same, Gera is in the same catergory as Reid, Mulumbu i think could step up to a Arsenal or Spurs type club but as far as we know no club has ever actually tried to sign him despite rumours so maybe they arent convinced, Yacob i personally feel the jury is still out on, first few months was great but since the injury he looks half the player, and i think he looks good when alongside Mulumbu, very average when not with Mulumbu, i also am not sure he is the type of player who you would want alongside you when the chips are down, so for me, if i was a bigger or better club in this country i wouldnt rush in for him, yet! Hopefully next season he can kick on.
Forwards - Lukaku isnt ours, Odemwingie and most like Fortune will be gone but i doubt to a top club, Rosenberg i think needs to prove himself with us and Long i dont think is consistent enough for a top club.
The above sounds negative, it isnt, because for the club we are and where are now, these players have done a good job and they are right for us, but for them personally i dont think they can afford too many games like yesterday where they just cant be bothered, because this is as good as it gets for a lot of them, i would have a long hard think over the summer if i was them players and really try and make the best of their Albion careers, i am not claiming we are some super club but the reality is that when they leave us they will be heading downwards with the exception of maybe 2-3.
Its upto them, Clarke will no doubt want to add more quality, we may be able to do that with the extra money we have (we dont have to go crazy though) and those players need to decide if they want to be part of trying to move to the next level and really give it everything, not just 3-4 months of the season as i dont think there Albion careers will last much longer if thats the case. Clarke will of learnt more about the squad in the last 4 months than he did the first 5, and i think a few of them may well find they are no longer first team regulars next season and they only have themselves to blame.
Really well thought post, and does make you look at things differently..........
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has done an exellent job in what some seem to forget is his 1st job as Head Coach.
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yeah, Thorne basically IS a defensive midielder and is good enough cover. When one is out he very easily could have just slotted in.
Yes big pity Thorne has missed out on the chance of further games since his injury. He is basically a DM - obviously there are different types of DM, Mulumbu is more of a box to box CM, Yacob more of a DM and Thorne could possibly fit into either category. There has to be some confidence shown in one or two of the younger players.
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We mainly played 4-4-2 under Hodgson, our setup under Clarke was totally different.
I can't believe people have forgotten how bad at home we were under Roy.
This.
I don't see how anyone can say how the success of the first half of the season was just a carry on from Roy because as mentioned we were absolutely horrendous at home for the majority of the season. A few wins at the end gave it a much more respectable look but in truth we know how bad it was. Our good form at the start of the season was based on a superb home record, where we lost only twice from the start of the season to January.
We have always struggled around December time in the Premier League, it happened under Mowbray, RDM and even Roy. This is down to the squad size we have, it's been the same issue every year. This year I think we had more injuries than ever before, and they didn't help Clarke particularly as injuries were to key players in our system.
Clearly there has been a few problems in the 2nd half of the year. I can't decide whether it's motivation of players or whether it's because we've been playing teams who have had something on the line-our performance against Southampton was the best in 2013 imo and that was against a team who at the time thought they were safe so it was seen as a nothing, end of season match.
I think our main problem in 2013 is that we haven't been able to use the formation or at least have the personnel to play the formation we want to. The success we had at the start of the season was with the 4-2-3-1/4-3-3 formation but with the Odemwingie sage and the Gera injury, we don't really have the players to use that formation hence a lot of the tinkering in the 2nd half of the season imo. It is also why I think Morrison has struggled the 2nd half of the season, as he has had more of the creative burden on him with no Gera/Odemwingie and relatively poor form of Brunt.
It is Clarke's first season as a head coach and I think mistakes were inevitable. I don't think he could have done any better in terms of league position. He will only get better imo. My main issue for next year is that it is going to be a big transfer window for us in terms of ins and out, and I am not sure whether Peace will change the transfer strategy to continue our upward trajectory.
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To me its obvious. We just dont have enough players we can use regularly in the squad because our budget wont allow it. So as the season reaches mid way and a dew injuries kick in we are so reliant a small core of players we just burn them out. They cant sustain the standard the demands are too great. To be fair if you look at all the other teams similar to us then they all suffer in much the same way. After Christmas they cant buy a win. The big budget teams by and large get stronger because they have more options.
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Clarke did make a couple of statements a while back that we would see the benefit of the rotation policy later in the season. I take this as meaning that it would keep the squad fresh but there hasn't been much evidence of this with the way we are finishing the season.
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Clarke did make a couple of statements a while back that we would see the benefit of the rotation policy later in the season. I take this as meaning that it would keep the squad fresh but there hasn't been much evidence of this with the way we are finishing the season.
Well losing Gera and the PO situation that is 2 out of a small squad he has had to manage with?
The budget usually says where a team ends up?
Look at the ones above us?
Then take a look at the ones below QPR?
Steve Clarke has done us proud.
I hope he does not leave there are not that many young managers about who have the experience at this level.
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To me its obvious. We just dont have enough players we can use regularly in the squad because our budget wont allow it. So as the season reaches mid way and a dew injuries kick in we are so reliant a small core of players we just burn them out. They cant sustain the standard the demands are too great. To be fair if you look at all the other teams similar to us then they all suffer in much the same way. After Christmas they cant buy a win. The big budget teams by and large get stronger because they have more options.
this is also the reason we may be "told" by SC, JP etc that we are keen on a Cup run, the truth is we don't have a squad large enough to do it without risk..
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I really dont like all this Steve Clarke bashing as we`ve only been poor twice all season which was against
Fulham and Norwich, the other games have been boring(not poor) or entertaining like the Newcastle/Man City away games.
If we wasnt putting it in like the Wolves every week then thats the time to be worried.
For me things started to go wrong when we lost Gera and Odemwingie who were our only real wide players.
I`d like Albion fans to keep faith with SC as he`s a good bloke who talks alot of sense and iam sure he`ll
find those attacking players in the summer to make us a force again.
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I have questioned several bizarre decisions he has made and his approach but for the Norwich game I am going to blame the players solely in terms of the performance. During this terrible run we have been on the manager does take a lot of the blame but Saturday it was for me just a complete non effort from the team. You cannot blame the manager for professional footballers not being able to pass a football.
The main gripe I have with him from the Norwich game is to continue to use Odemwingie, Sunday was painful for us all and the decision to bring him on again really was the ultimate nail in the coffin. I said to my friend in the pub I would literally rather concede another goal than seeing him represent the club again.
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Although I haven't been Clarke's biggest fan this season it would be unfair for any suggestions for him to be dismissed without having had a proper chance to bring some fresh players in.
Lets not forget how long it took for us to appoint him last summer. It was virtually pre-season by the time he got behind his desk.
For me the eyes of the fans should be firmly set on Peace and Garlick this summer. It's up to them to part with some cash and bring some quality in.
I think peoples admiration for Peace has gone too far the one way that he has now become blameless.
Let the Wolves be the example; we can't let our squad stagnate, blame the manager like they did with Mick, pay the price then see the true culprit was the chairman for not investing in squad enough.
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I`d like Albion fans to keep faith with SC as he`s a good bloke who talks alot of sense and iam sure he`ll
find those attacking players in the summer to make us a force again.
You've changed your tune. You've spent half the season bleating away depressing us all about how we're destined for relegation next season.
"Iam almost resigned to the fact we`re be back in the Championship next season"
A quote from you a while back.
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I think a lot of Clarke's grounding in management was at club's that had deep squads and players of perhaps better quality than the ones he is working with at the Albion.I think that at times he has not appreciated the limitations that places on him as a coach.
However as the excellent post by Albion 79 put it the emphasis really is on the players not the coach you can quibble about team selection, rotation, formations etc. but at some point the players have to take responsibility for delivering a five yard pass to a team mate. Clarke might want to bring changes but if he has not got the options available to him there is very little he can do to get a message across to an under performing player.
At the very least Clarke needs to be given the opportunity of shaping the squad and needs to be supported by the club if he feels it is time to move one or two of our senior players on.
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Just read in the paper today that Everton have made a move to take Steve Clarke to Goodison? Good luck to Steve if it's true. 8)
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Just read in the paper today that Everton have made a move to take Steve Clarke to Goodison? Good luck to Steve if it's true. 8)
Source?
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Just read in the paper today that Everton have made a move to take Steve Clarke to Goodison? Good luck to Steve if it's true. 8)
If this is true, and im awaiting your credible source, I was actually thinking today "wouldnt it be funny if 3 scottish managers all moved around?
Fergie - retired
Moyes to Yanited
and Clarke to Everton....
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I think a lot of Clarke's grounding in management was at club's that had deep squads and players of perhaps better quality than the ones he is working with at the Albion.I think that at times he has not appreciated the limitations that places on him as a coach.
However as the excellent post by Albion 79 put it the emphasis really is on the players not the coach you can quibble about team selection, rotation, formations etc. but at some point the players have to take responsibility for delivering a five yard pass to a team mate. Clarke might want to bring changes but if he has not got the options available to him there is very little he can do to get a message across to an under performing player.
At the very least Clarke needs to be given the opportunity of shaping the squad and needs to be supported by the club if he feels it is time to move one or two of our senior players on.
Spot on. When Gera and Odemwingie were lost that was two genuine quality players taken out of a starting XI good enough to challenge for Europe. Olsson must've played nearly 50 games this year with internationals, he must be knackered. The question for Clarke is whether he goes for a couple of quality additions or a reshape of the squad with a bti of a clear out to get in his own style of player - probably he would like flexible, intelligent players like he was.
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If this is true, and im awaiting your credible source, I was actually thinking today "wouldnt it be funny if 3 scottish managers all moved around?
Fergie - retired
Moyes to Yanited
and Clarke to Everton....
Does that mean that we would end up taking Paul Lambert??? :-X
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I get the feeling he may go back to Chelsea with Mourinho, Clarke did say a few weeks back he would not rule out going back to a no2.
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He has done a great job, a higher finish than Roy achieved and we are playing much better football too. We've put our foot off the gas recently, its been a long and hard but in the end very successful season.
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Just read in the paper today that Everton have made a move to take Steve Clarke to Goodison? Good luck to Steve if it's true. 8)
You must be the only one that has read anything,most of the money today has been for Gus Poyet(inevitable after last night) and Alan Stubbs.
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We are in a dreadful run of form and unfortunately it looks like we might end up finishing 9th instead of 8th which will be a real shame. However its worth remembering that we have been in this position for a long time and look like we might drop one place on the last day, that means that all of the other clubs just below us haven't been in great form either or they would have caught up with us in the league long ago.
Its the nature of the Premier League, there isn't much between most of the clubs when it comes to quality. It doesn't help that we have lost that competitive edge and got very comfortable since we got past the 40 point mark.
Clarke has done a good job for us and he will have learnt a lot this season, the time to judge him is by what we do next season but he needs help from the board to get the players he needs.
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I'll give Clarke a 7/10.
On the whole a good season with our highest finish and best points total in the Premier League. Good wins against Liverpool (twice), Chelsea and Everton were the highlights.
Marked down one point in our failure to have a decent run in either of the cups but mostly cup competitions can go either way.
Two points knocked off for the handling of the Odemwingie situation. I believe he has handled the situation badly and left it to fester into divisions and problems in the dressing room resulting in our poor form in the 2nd half of the season.
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You must be the only one that has read anything,most of the money today has been for Gus Poyet(inevitable after last night) and Alan Stubbs.
I was told last week to get money on Alan Stubbs and Duncan Ferguson, that was from a scouser!
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I really dont like all this Steve Clarke bashing as we`ve only been poor twice all season which was against
Fulham and Norwich, the other games have been boring(not poor) or entertaining like the Newcastle/Man City away games.
If we wasnt putting it in like the Wolves every week then thats the time to be worried.
For me things started to go wrong when we lost Gera and Odemwingie who were our only real wide players.
I`d like Albion fans to keep faith with SC as he`s a good bloke who talks alot of sense and iam sure he`ll
find those attacking players in the summer to make us a force again.
Hahahaha, this was your post just last week:
Everton can have Steve Clarke once Moyes sods off,
christ knows how we are still in 8th position.
Shane Long and McAuley score against Wigan then he puts them on the bench against Man City,
the bloke is clueless.
Any other manager with Odemwingie, Fortune, Lukaku, Rosenberg, and Long at their disposal would
of finished in the top 5.
You really are fickle, almost dingle like!!
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I'll give Clarke a 7/10.
On the whole a good season with our highest finish and best points total in the Premier League. Good wins against Liverpool (twice), Chelsea and Everton were the highlights.
Marked down one point in our failure to have a decent run in either of the cups but mostly cup competitions can go either way.
Two points knocked off for the handling of the Odemwingie situation. I believe he has handled the situation badly and left it to fester into divisions and problems in the dressing room resulting in our poor form in the 2nd half of the season.
Never been Clarke's biggest fan but Peace and his mate are to blame for the Odemwingie situation they should have just got rid to QPR and took the money.Now Clarke and the club have been left with a big albatross round their necks and we are going to lose out big time.
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You've changed your tune. You've spent half the season bleating away depressing us all about how we're destined for relegation next season.
"Iam almost resigned to the fact we`re be back in the Championship next season"
A quote from you a while back.
he has other things on his mind tonight? :D
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Well losing Gera and the PO situation that is 2 out of a small squad he has had to manage with?
The budget usually says where a team ends up?
Look at the ones above us?
Then take a look at the ones below QPR?
Steve Clarke has done us proud.
I hope he does not leave there are not that many young managers about who have the experience at this level.
It was just an observation - it's close to madness to want your manager out when assured of a top 10 place. I like Clarke and hope he proves himself further next year for us. Some big decisions to be made re Gera, Reid, Fortune, JT and on players to come in.
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Our passing has deteriorated rapidly since Christmas, defending from set pieces is poorer and apart from McCauley get his head on corners our scoring from set pieces has also got worse. That to me is stuff that should be covered in training. If its getting worse then you have to wonder what are they doing in training? That falls down to the responsibility to Steve Clarke - so for me he scrapes a 5/10.
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I remember our first game this season against Liverpool,and being a bit concerned how we would do,having a rookie Manager.Walking back to the car after the game my Mate made a comment" Well we dont have to worry about Steve Clarke,he knows what he is doing" We then touched the heady heights of 3rd place,and to be fair we were all in dreamland. Then came the slump. I know there are many reasons why our season has petered out a bit,but,if I had to pinpoint one,its James Morrison. At the start he was pulling all the strings,gaining rave reviews,then,well we know the rest.If SC can settle on the formation he wants,and can bring in a few players to strengthen the squad,then I think we will be ok.If he continues with swopping formations,putting square pegs in round holes,a la Morrison,then we are going to struggle, and the sooner we sign a replacement for Lukaku the better!
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Hahahaha, this was your post just last week:
Everton can have Steve Clarke once Moyes sods off,
christ knows how we are still in 8th position.
Shane Long and McAuley score against Wigan then he puts them on the bench against Man City,
the bloke is clueless.
Any other manager with Odemwingie, Fortune, Lukaku, Rosenberg, and Long at their disposal would
of finished in the top 5.
You really are fickle, almost dingle like!!
That was just a stupid heat of the moment rant.
When I sit down and look at the likes of Wolves and Blues then it makes me realise that
how good a job Steve Clarke has done keeping us in the top half of the Prem all season.
For me things started going wrong once we lost our real wide players in Gera and Odemwingie.
I hope Jeremy Peace backs our manager in the summer and we can move forward as a club,
the football we play is as good as the Mowbray/ Di Matteo days so ive no real complaints.
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My own personal thoughts on Clarke our fairly mixed. I think he has the all the attributes to be a good manager, but at the same time I am not overly convinced by him. He is a bit of a dour character and I wonder what he would do if we were struggling badly, I suppose we were spolit by having the experienced Roy Hodgson who sadly (for us) went onto bigger and better things. For his first season as head coach we cant grumble at all, after all 8th or 9th place finish is a fantastic achievement for this club. However since Christmas we have been pretty awful with the exception of a few games, and that worries me quite a lot. I hope we have a good summer recruitment wise, and I hope we have a good start to the new season as if we don’t I fear Clarke will be under immense pressure. I just get the feeling he isn’t a manager, he is a number two who is good with coaching etc but tactics wise and subs he seems to be a little out of his depth. Just my thoughts.
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Steve Clarke talking about his first season at the Albion:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ea44bNpYfc&feature=youtu.be
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Quote from the Clarke interview above:
"We need more quality players in the squad, and probably we need a slightly bigger squad".
Very obviously so.
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Some rumours going round that this is happening
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Some rumours going round that this is happening
Hes not even in the bookies top ten so i cant see it to be honest
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Hes not even in the bookies top ten so i cant see it to be honest
It is on the old twitter to be fair. Don't mean it's true though!
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It is on the old twitter to be fair. Don't mean it's true though!
Probably a mischievous Dingle.
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Hes not even in the bookies top ten so i cant see it to be honest
"Are you Saunders in disguise"
#ladbrokes
:D
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He has done a great job, a higher finish than Roy achieved and we are playing much better football too. We've put our foot off the gas recently, its been a long and hard but in the end very successful season.
Couldnt have said it better myself. Job done this season, onto the next!
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You've changed your tune. You've spent half the season bleating away depressing us all about how we're destined for relegation next season.
"Iam almost resigned to the fact we`re be back in the Championship next season"
A quote from you a while back.
I do still think we`ll be relegated next season especially as its common knowledge that we`ll
only be signing 2 new players in the summer.
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I do still think we`ll be relegated next season especially as its common knowledge that we`ll
only be signing 2 new players in the summer.
How do you work that one out ? Direct line to JP or Garlick ?
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I do still think we`ll be relegated next season especially as its common knowledge that we`ll
only be signing 2 new players in the summer.
So that will be into league 2 then?
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I do still think we`ll be relegated next season especially as its common knowledge that we`ll
only be signing 2 new players in the summer.
whose we?
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If we only sign 2 players this summer i doubt very much whether Steve Clarke will get relegated...................i think he will have walked by September 3rd at the latest! ;)
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I do still think we`ll be relegated next season especially as its common knowledge that we`ll
only be signing 2 new players in the summer.
He is correct, although how we talked FAlcao and Ronaldo in to it I don't know?
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He is correct, although how we talked FAlcao and Ronaldo in to it I don't know?
Distinct lack of ambition signing Falcao - why not Messi?
Cheap option again Albion.
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I do still think we`ll be relegated next season especially as its common knowledge that we`ll
only be signing 2 new players in the summer.
Common knowledge? Clarke said himself he'd like 3 or 4, which is what he said last year. We ended up signing 6 last summer.
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Quote from the Clarke interview above:
"We need more quality players in the squad, and probably we need a slightly bigger squad".
I can't see how that squares with his previous comment, repeated several times, about us only signing 3 or 4 players. It looks highly likely that there will be more than that number leaving. Maybe he's actually sat down to think about it a bit more and has realised that 3 or 4 isn't enough. Perhaps he's also realising that there are question marks over some players that there wouldn't have been earlier in the season, such as Olsson.
With the increased money coming into the game, the number and quality of our signings this summer are crucial to us not ending up in a major relegation fight next season. I've seen lots of media references to us having had only 1 win in the past 8 games, but our playing record in the past 20 games of W 4 D 4 L 12 is a more telling stat IMO. That's relegation form. It doesn't look that much prettier if you look back 26 games to the end of November: W 6 D 5 L 15.
Clarke has made comments recently about us having problems because of the loss/poor form of key players. If nothing else, our form going back some time should demonstrate that relying on a handful of key players staying fit and in form isn't a recipe for success.
The spotlight is very much on Mr Peace this summer.
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Common knowledge? Clarke said himself he'd like 3 or 4, which is what he said last year. We ended up signing 6 last summer.
agree who said we wil only sign two players ? Lets wait and see and stop being pessimists
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Thought number 1
Only the stupid reveal their actual transfer budgets /targets
Thought number 2
This year I have a feeling we will split our dealings with more done in January
Thought number 3
Whoever we buy (even with low cost) have faith , if there is one club that scouts well its ours.
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Overall he has done very well for us this season. For a lot of the season he has got the very best out of a lot of the players this season and has used the players well. Some of his tactics have been very good as well. Negatives would be playing Odemwingie since the incident I would never have had him anyway near the eighteen over the last couple of months.
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A lot of Everton fans are saying Clarke is on the Everton shortlist, some guy called fourth official(twitter) who is quite reliable has hinted it. But he says Martinez is more likely at the moment.
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A lot of Everton fans are saying Clarke is on the Everton shortlist, some guy called fourth official(twitter) who is quite reliable has hinted it. But he says Martinez is more likely at the moment.
Doubt that it would happen anyway but Martinez is already discussing a deal so highly unlikely.
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I think it will Martinez.
I doubt very much if he would have left Wigan without something lined up?
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I think it will Martinez.
I doubt very much if he would have left Wigan without something lined up?
Yeah, us! :o
;D
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Yeah, us! :o
;D
Well you never know!! Rather Clarke thanks though!
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Not sure how reliable fourth official is but just saw this:
Fourth Official ?@FourthOfficial_ 31s
Nice to see Ralf Rangnick has denied even holding talks with Everton, we did say he hadn't and had heard its actually Steve Clarke
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he's generally quite reliable I've found. probably the only ITK person I trust on twitter. And when it comes to Everton he is very aware.
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From recent for and results Steve Clarke is probably only five more matches from the sack. Thats if he dont go to Everton. I think the albions good start to the season had more to do with Roy Hodgsons the previous season. Thats why we faded away towards the end of the season!!!
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From recent for and results Steve Clarke is probably only five more matches from the sack. Thats if he dont go to Everton. I think the albions good start to the season had more to do with Roy Hodgsons the previous season. Thats why we faded away towards the end of the season!!!
It's funny because when we started poorly in Hodgson's full season, there were loads of people claiming he'd only done well before because of RDM the season prior.
You have to judge on the full season, its pretty noticeable that all the teams below us Swansea, Fulham, and West Ham also had poor ends to the season (as in last 10 games or more) which is almost certainly because they were safe with little to play for. I doubt you'd level the accusation that Laudrop only did well because of Rodgers anyway, even though Swansea pretty much followed our season. For half the season we had nothing to play for pretty much, even our league position was unlikely to end up lower than 9th after new year, and we had no chance of europe through the league. Its not particularly right but it happens at all clubs, its pretty much impossible to match the motivation of clubs in a relegation battle and in Europe battles. It's why so many mid table teams have end of season lulls and you'll notice teams in relegation battles pretty much always start getting a lot more points at the end of the season.
At any rate he'll get plenty more time than 5 games, that's a ridiculous thing to say. We'd have sacked Hodgson based on that policy and probably have got relegated. Always makes me laugh when football fans criticise sackings when its the fans who are almost always the most reactionary. Imagine if Swansea sacked Laudrop after 5 games next season, what would you say!? How quickly people forget we just finished 8th. As good as we can ever expect to do. That's us winning the league, relative to budget. Yeah sure there's things to work on, but what club isn't that true for?
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Eric Nelson ?@SoupOrCereal 5h
Serious talk coming form Goodison Park that Steve Clarke will be next Everton boss. On a shortlist of 3, he impressed most. #Moyes #EFC
I don't for one minute think Clarke will join Everton but seems to be a lot of interest in him up there.
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It's funny because when we started poorly in Hodgson's full season, there were loads of people claiming he'd only done well before because of RDM the season prior.
You have to judge on the full season, its pretty noticeable that all the teams below us Swansea, Fulham, and West Ham also had poor ends to the season (as in last 10 games or more) which is almost certainly because they were safe with little to play for. I doubt you'd level the accusation that Laudrop only did well because of Rodgers anyway, even though Swansea pretty much followed our season. For half the season we had nothing to play for pretty much, even our league position was unlikely to end up lower than 9th after new year, and we had no chance of europe through the league. Its not particularly right but it happens at all clubs, its pretty much impossible to match the motivation of clubs in a relegation battle and in Europe battles. It's why so many mid table teams have end of season lulls and you'll notice teams in relegation battles pretty much always start getting a lot more points at the end of the season.
At any rate he'll get plenty more time than 5 games, that's a ridiculous thing to say. We'd have sacked Hodgson based on that policy and probably have got relegated. Always makes me laugh when football fans criticise sackings when its the fans who are almost always the most reactionary. Imagine if Swansea sacked Laudrop after 5 games next season, what would you say!? How quickly people forget we just finished 8th. As good as we can ever expect to do. That's us winning the league, relative to budget. Yeah sure there's things to work on, but what club isn't that true for?
From JP's form in these matters i cant see where your coming from
Just look at RDM's stats and then look at Clarkes. Its all in black and white!!!!
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I would hope and presume that serious talk is just coming from the fourth official twitter.
On the one hand I'd be surprised if they went for someone so inexperienced, but on the other he does fit Everton's style pretty well, certainly a lot more than someone like Martinez. Whatever people think it'd be a huge blow to lose him, the last thing the club needs with Garlick just a few months in the job and what will likely be a lot of moulding needing on the squad is us needing a new manager as well.
From JP's form in these matters i cant see where ur comin from brains.
Just look at RDM's stats and then look at Clarkes. Its all in black and white!!!!
RDM was in a relegation battle, Clarke achieved what his aim was (survival) in the first half of the year... You can't even begin to tell how the season is shaping out after 5 games, 5 games into 2011/12 we'd lost 4 of our first 5 and still finished the season well above relegation. I'll take brains as a compliment from the kind of trigger happy fan who wants a new manager every bad run of form.
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Looks like Rangnick was never in the running for the Everton job, would not surprise me if Kenwright will want someone similar to Moyes.
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I would hope and presume that serious talk is just coming from the fourth official twitter.
On the one hand I'd be surprised if they went for someone so inexperienced, but on the other he does fit Everton's style pretty well, certainly a lot more than someone like Martinez. Whatever people think it'd be a huge blow to lose him, the last thing the club needs with Garlick just a few months in the job and what will likely be a lot of moulding needing on the squad is us needing a new manager as well.
RDM was in a relegation battle, Clarke achieved what his aim was (survival) in the first half of the year... You can't even begin to tell how the season is shaping out after 5 games, 5 games into 2011/12 we'd lost 4 of our first 5 and still finished the season well above relegation. I'll take brains as a compliment from the kind of trigger happy fan who wants a new manager every bad run of form.
Ummm i might be a little mis understood here, I dont want Clarke to go. Ask me again in six months though!! Thats if we dont lose him to Everton.
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The third man on Everton's short list has been a closely guarded secret. It wouldn't surprise me at all if Clarke is the No.3. Anyone know what contract he is on with us?
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Losing Clarke would be a huge blow, due to the fact their is no one better out there.
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I wouldn't begrudge him a move in a few years but as it stands I would be incredibly disappointed if he decided to go elsewhere.
Despite him having a terrific first half the season where he deserved many plaudits, the second part of the season has left many questions hovering over him. He'll have to prove those doubters wrong. No denying we had a very good season overall but the tail in form in the back end of the season will put clubs off in my opinion. In addition, I would like a bit of loyalty from Steve Clarke considering we gave him an opportunity to showcase his talents with a very good squad - who knows where he would have been if we never offered him the opportunity? That being said, I still expect him to be here next season to continue the good work he has started and to prove those doubters about him wrong.
This summer is already going to be big enough for Richard Garlick without having to deal with a change of head coach.
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Still quite long odds on Clarke, just put a score on at 33/1 so I won't be too sad if he goes now :-*
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The third man on Everton's short list has been a closely guarded secret. It wouldn't surprise me at all if Clarke is the No.3. Anyone know what contract he is on with us?
2 year deal I think.
I still think it will be Martinez but Solskjaer has also been mentioned today.
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The third man on Everton's short list has been a closely guarded secret. It wouldn't surprise me at all if Clarke is the No.3. Anyone know what contract he is on with us?
He signed a two year contract - not sure if there's been any movement towards extending that.
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He would be a manager at Everton though not a head coach, can't see Everton going for him unless they go down the head coach route. Maybe Rangnick will be the director there ?
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Still quite long odds on Clarke, just put a score on at 33/1 so I won't be too sad if he goes now :-*
I said a few weeks at that I thought Clarke might go to everton.
I've just had a cheeky tenna at 66/1, just in case ;)
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Clarke would probably jump at the Chance to Join Everton. Like most other managers working under Peace they get frustrated. Didnt i read somewhere Clarke walked out of a transfer meeting
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Clarke would probably jump at the Chance to Join Everton. Like most other managers working under Peace they get frustrated. Didnt i read somewhere Clarke walked out of a transfer meeting
A poster reckoned so on the transfer forum.
It's a risky choice for everton (if rumours are true, personally I doubt they are) but no more risky than say Martinez in my opinion.
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Just been on 3 Everton message boards, not one mention of Steve Clarke from what i read
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Correct me if I'm wrong, but, before you get to speak to a manager/head coach, you need the permission of the club holding the contract, I think such a situation would have been leaked by JP/Albion.
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Correct me if I'm wrong, but, before you get to speak to a manager/head coach, you need the permission of the club holding the contract, I think such a situation would have been leaked by JP/Albion.
I'm sure that's the official line but I am sure there is an eliment of putting the feelers out to see if he is interested.
My theory is this, if he stays great! If he goes I earn a bit of cash! ;D
Anyone fancy hodgson back when he gets sacked for not getting England to the next world cup :-X
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Has Chris Lepkowski said anything on the matter ? Seems that nothing has been mentioned up here.
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I think Clarke is a smart man, and smart enough to stay away from Everton. Financially they are not too far from us, and like Peace, their chairman is very strict with his finances, so to suggest that Clarke would have some kind of war chest up there is wrong; a large section of their fans actually despise the chairman for his lack of spending.
Secondly, they are a bigger club than us, with a proud history etc...which basically means he's got a harder job off the pitch as the pressure will be there. I just don't think it's very logical that he'd leave when he's at a similar scenario here with less looking at his every move.
Personally I think Martinez will go there, it's a much more logical match.
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I don't want him to go.......but
This summer there could be a massive overhaul of the squad , he may have his ideas, garlick/peace may not agree with them , after finishing eighth he may feel entitled?
There is also the "quit whilst your ahead" theory, the second half seemed to fall away somewhat, if he stayed and lost 6 of he first 9 does he go the way of RDM ?
Odemwingie may have had some effect, he may wish to be closer to Scotland, he may feel with the sale of felani, baines etc he could really mould "his"team?
And from everyone's point of view , someone who perpetually struggles and just got relegated, or someone with a bright future who secured safety after half a season and took a low budget club to eighth in his first season?
I wonder
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I think Clarke is a smart man, and smart enough to stay away from Everton. Financially they are not too far from us, and like Peace, their chairman is very strict with his finances, so to suggest that Clarke would have some kind of war chest up there is wrong; a large section of their fans actually despise the chairman for his lack of spending.
Secondly, they are a bigger club than us, with a proud history etc...which basically means he's got a harder job off the pitch as the pressure will be there. I just don't think it's very logical that he'd leave when he's at a similar scenario here with less looking at his every move.
Personally I think Martinez will go there, it's a much more logical match.
Everton spend triple what we do every season so i dont understand what you are saying on that score.We could only dream of their war chest.In saying that i am not sure what the debt is because of it, but a much bigger club and potential to tempt most managers
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Well I think Everton is the next step for Clarke, I just wonder if it is a season too early?
However, it is just rumour at this point but I wouldn't be surprised to see him go there.
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Most of these Clarke to Everton rumours seem to have been generated by this 'Fourth Official' character on Twitter. I don't know why people take such stock in what this guy says, his wrong so spectacularly and so often, and then he snidely goes back and deletes his previous tweets. Those who point out, highlight or retweet his fabrications are immediately blocked.
Last summer he said we were nailed onto appoint a manager (my memory fails me who he said now) but whoever it was, was never in contention and was not a JP manager, every Albion fan could see it was false. Not worried about these Clarke rumours at all, purely because its come from him.
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Nothing is being reported in the midlands about Clarke being on the shortlist. That fourth official guy has been wrong before.
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Not all these rumours came from this bloke though. There were rumours weeks ago before this guy started tweeting. The Fourth Official guy is probably wrong but if he throws enough rubbish out there, something will stick eventually.
Regardless of that, an Everton Fan site seem to reckon Martinez has got the job.
http://www.sos1878.co.uk/everton-news/martinez-becomes-first-foreign-blues-boss/#commentspost
Roberto Martinez is set to become the new manager of Everton Football Club.
Martinez, who resigned from Wigan Athletic last week, takes over from David Moyes after almost four years in charge of the Lancashire club.
Welcome to the greatest club in the world, Roberto. We wish you well and are right behind you.
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http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/22761798
Clarke will not be joining Everton.
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http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/22761798
Clarke will not be joining Everton.
It will be interesting to find out 'in the wash' if Clarke was ever unofficially interviewed for the job.
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Not all these rumours came from this bloke though. There were rumours weeks ago before this guy started tweeting. The Fourth Official guy is probably wrong but if he throws enough rubbish out there, something will stick eventually.
Regardless of that, an Everton Fan site seem to reckon Martinez has got the job.
http://www.sos1878.co.uk/everton-news/martinez-becomes-first-foreign-blues-boss/#commentspost
Roberto Martinez is set to become the new manager of Everton Football Club.
Martinez, who resigned from Wigan Athletic last week, takes over from David Moyes after almost four years in charge of the Lancashire club.
Welcome to the greatest club in the world, Roberto. We wish you well and are right behind you.
Crashed AND burned !!!!!
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A year to the day that Steve Clarke was appointed as Albion boss, when I first heard the news I was in two minds like a lot of fans as to whether he would do well for us. He made some very good signings and after the Everton game I knew that we had a very good manager on our hands here. I really hope that he can continue our progression for the forthcoming season.
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This made me have a chuckle to myself this afternoon:
http://www.sportsdirectnews.com/secret-agent/27002-baggies-boss-clarke-on-thin-ice.php
West Bromwich Albion boss Steve Clarke is a leading candidate to be the first manager sacked next season.
The Baggies management are looking at his position closely after what they consider a disastrous last half of the season.
The former Chelsea and West Ham United assistant boss made a brilliant start to his managerial career, even lifting the Midlanders into the top four at one stage after losing just two of the team's first 14 games and including wins against Chelsea and Everton.
But the club's bosses remain deeply worried about his position following a second half to the season that saw him lose 17 and draw six of the last 28 games. That's 21 from a possible 84 points
And the suggestion among many of them is that he was riding on the coat-tails of the team assembled by previous manager Roy Hodgson over the early games.
He's likely to get six games at the start of the season to prove himself and will then be under constant review.
He will be grateful for a relatively comfortable-looking start to the season with only Manchester United away as his sixth game of the season looking particularly tough
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This made me have a chuckle to myself this afternoon:
http://www.sportsdirectnews.com/secret-agent/27002-baggies-boss-clarke-on-thin-ice.php
West Bromwich Albion boss Steve Clarke is a leading candidate to be the first manager sacked next season.
The Baggies management are looking at his position closely after what they consider a disastrous last half of the season.
The former Chelsea and West Ham United assistant boss made a brilliant start to his managerial career, even lifting the Midlanders into the top four at one stage after losing just two of the team's first 14 games and including wins against Chelsea and Everton.
But the club's bosses remain deeply worried about his position following a second half to the season that saw him lose 17 and draw six of the last 28 games. That's 21 from a possible 84 points
And the suggestion among many of them is that he was riding on the coat-tails of the team assembled by previous manager Roy Hodgson over the early games.
He's likely to get six games at the start of the season to prove himself and will then be under constant review.
He will be grateful for a relatively comfortable-looking start to the season with only Manchester United away as his sixth game of the season looking particularly tough
Anyone else think he's in trouble if we start off poor next season?
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Anyone else think he's in trouble if we start off poor next season?
Along with all the other managers in the prem.
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He's in real trouble, we're second from bottom already.
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KC beat me to it. There is pressure on all managers in this division because the prizes are so great - it's why we see so many managerial sackings and if the club feel the need to change management, then they will. Look how ruthless the sacking of Di Matteo was viewed by some. As it happens, I think we have a very good squad which are more than good enough for this division; provided they are added to appropriately I see no reason why we can't have another successful season - more importantly, Steve Clarke will have learned an awful lot and it will stand him in good stead for the future.
Articles like that really are unnecessary and given our opening fixtures, we have a great opportunity to really silence articles like those and get some points on the board and once again hit the ground running.
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Setting aside how much I dislike the "secret agent" style of journalism when there is no name on the copy there is no reputation on the line when said story turns out to be drivel. It raises an interesting point how many games does any Premier League Manager have at the start of the season before he is under real pressure? My guess is 6 with no win and a couple of real hammerings in that sequence and they all we will be under pressure and without some measure of improvement in the next 6 many would not get to be in charge for game 13.
That might seem harsh and it probably is, however with so much at stake is not surprising that the sack race is often won by the end of November.
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This is ridiculous, i am sick of reading such rubbish from self-styled journalists, encouraged by social media.
Kids setting up blogs or 'in the know' twitter accounts, surely theres better things to do!?
By all means share opinion but dont try to kid anyone that your privy to secret information.
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This is from the sports direct website, I think we should get Joe Kinear in to deal with Steve Cark, Jesus Olson , Gary McDonald and Peter o so nearly.
:D :D :D :D
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He's in real trouble, we're second from bottom already.
Bostin'. A much needed laugh amongst this nonsense. Of course he's a favourite to be replaced.... most of the others already have been!!!
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He was an early favourite fot the sack last year if you recall.
Survived the first six games then !!
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Nature of the beast really. Poor 2nd half of the season, lost our top scorer in Lukaku and will probably lose our previous 2 time top scorer also in Odemwingie.
I am not confident about the coming season. Success (or survival) this season is down to who we replace those two players with.
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Nature of the beast really. Poor 2nd half of the season, lost our top scorer in Lukaku and will probably lose our previous 2 time top scorer also in Odemwingie.
I am not confident about the coming season. Success (or survival) this season is down to who we replace those two players with.
I'm 110% sure you wont find 1 fan who would disagree with that statement kris_boing
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We had a very bad second half of the season, but he has to get credit for the job he has done so far. Albion had a lot of injuries to key players in and around the slump, combine that with players losing form and odemgate and most supporters should be happy with a top eight finish.
My issue is how far will JP push the boat out for quality players and with his statement about using loan market to bring in players seems to indicate that not a lot of money will be spent which might urine off a lot of fans
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not a lot of money will be spent which might pee off a lot of fans
On fees, no, wages, yes.
SC should be fine, as long as we never find ourselves below 15th or so for more than a month. Then, he might be in trouble.
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On fees, no, wages, yes.
this transfer model is fine but it has its risks last season Rosenberg didn't work out and it only takes one or two of these mostly untested players to drag us into trouble. We should still invest in. Players whom have premier experience and that usually means spending money on trsni
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http://www.expressandstar.com/sport/west-bromwich-albion-fc/2013/06/28/west-brom-plan-new-deal-talks-with-steve-clarke/ (http://www.expressandstar.com/sport/west-bromwich-albion-fc/2013/06/28/west-brom-plan-new-deal-talks-with-steve-clarke/)
West Brom chairman Jeremy Peace is planning contract talks with head coach Steve Clarke after admitting “you cannot knock what hes done".
Acclaim for Clarke leading the Baggies to the club’s highest Premier League placing was tempered by the frustration of the fade-out over the second half of the season.That is something Clarke and West Brom’s team of support staff have been analysing. in an effort to remedy a fault which prevented the Baggies pushing for a place in European competition.
But the demanding owner-chairman still declares himself “relaxed” about Clarke’s future even though the head coach is currently contracted only for next season.
Peace said: “He has done well. We had a great start and a very indifferent finish – apart from the last game which was something to behold.
“Everyone’s pleased with how it’s turned out and we have progressed on and finished eighth. Steve has another year left on his existing deal.
"We will sit down over the next few months and discuss where we go with that. His contract is well structured, he gets rewarded for improvement and where we finish in the league.
“He’s been very good. You cannot knock what he did.”
That hasn’t stopped some bookies establishing Clarke among the front-runners in the annual “sack race odds.
That's a profile aggravated by the potential loss of key players this summer and the down-turn in results after January.
But Peace and sporting & technical director Richard Garlick are working with Clarke to try to prevent a repeat.
Garlick said: “There are things we are doing to avoid the January dip. Perhaps in the past we had players who weren’t quite up to it, so we couldn’t rotate.”
And Peace rejected criticism that the club did not do enough in the January window to avert the problem.
He explained: “We spoke to Steve by asking ‘What do you need in January? and he said ‘I think we’re OK and don’t need to strengthen’.”
Meanwhile, Premier League new-boys Cardiff are the latest club linked with West Brom’s want-away striker Peter Odemwingie.
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I think this means we'll wait and see for the first few months of the season to see how he does before offering a new contract.
Based on 2012 results there would be no question about giving him a new contract but we had such a poor end to the season then questions are bound to be asked.
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It's a worrying phenomenon that we were so poor the second half of the season, even more so now knowing that SC was given the option to strengthen in January.
I think he'll have to hit the ground running this season even more so than last season, the fans and directors will be less forgiving than last season if we were to have a poor start.
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It's a worrying phenomenon that we were so poor the second half of the season, even more so now knowing that SC was given the option to strengthen in January.
I think he'll have to hit the ground running this season even more so than last season, the fans and directors will be less forgiving than last season if we were to have a poor start.
Well, without a doubt the foundation of his next season will be laid this summer. Unless we bring in really strong players Clarke will have his work cut out for him.
I don't really buy that 'Clarke was given the option to strengthen in January'. Sounds like cheap talk to me. Yes, 'strengthen' maybe but if that 'strengthening' was of marginal or questionable quality maybe Clarke didn't see the point? I don't think he would have turned down a really strong player would he, I mean who would?
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It's a worrying phenomenon that we were so poor the second half of the season, even more so now knowing that SC was given the option to strengthen in January.
I think he'll have to hit the ground running this season even more so than last season, the fans and directors will be less forgiving than last season if we were to have a poor start.
Closest he got to strengthening in January was being given free gym access! :P
Its well known we have a strategy and even with the extra TV money we are still not going to fork out excessive amounts for players!
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I could be totally wrong, but it looks to me as though Steve Clarke might be being given more of a say in transfers this summer.
He obviously played a big role in us signing Romelu Lukaku last year, but the rest of the signings had been watched by the scouting department for several months (if not longer) and so it would have just been left to Clarke to give the go-ahead to sign these players based on what he knew.
We have already signed Nicolas Anelka this year, who obviously worked with Clarke at Chelsea. We have also been linked (albeit tenuously in one or two cases) with other ex-Chelsea players such as Salomon Kalou, Florent Malouda and Tiago, which suggests to me that Clarke is having far more of a say in who we sign this summer.
With this in mind, I think Clarke will be under a bit of pressure at the start of next season. Last season was a huge success overall, but the poor second half of the campaign cannot be ignored and I'm sure Clarke knows that he can't afford a poor start next season.
If Clarke is having more of a say and the signings turn out to be a huge success though, his already impressive reputation in the game will be enhanced further.
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Well, I think Clarke recognized we had no depth to our squad last season and he was forced to play obviously out of form players for long stretches. Also he knows we overall lacked pace and creativity in our offensive game. Hopefully he looks to fix those problems this summer.
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I don't think Clarke will be having more say in the transfers. A lot of the ex Chelsea players linked with us are almost purely on the grounds that Clarke has worked with them in the past there is nothing to say the club has any solid interest in any of them other Kalou where there is an acknowledged interest.
That said I would hope that he is in a better position to understand where the squad needs strengthening and be more specific in briefing the recruitment team. The El-Ghannassy and Rosenberg signings missed the mark last summer and with the advantage of hindsight it was difficult to see either of them fitting into Clarke's preferred style of play.
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I don't think Clarke will be having more say in the transfers. A lot of the ex Chelsea players linked with us are almost purely on the grounds that Clarke has worked with them in the past there is nothing to say the club has any solid interest in any of them other Kalou where there is an acknowledged interest.
That said I would hope that he is in a better position to understand where the squad needs strengthening and be more specific in briefing the recruitment team. The El-Ghannassy and Rosenberg signings missed the mark last summer and with the advantage of hindsight it was difficult to see either of them fitting into Clarke's preferred style of play.
I think Clarke will obviously have more input this season since he now knows the squad much better.
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In the Daily Star Clarke says he wants two more strikers as well as Anelka to support Shane Long.Kalou and Malouda are named.
Could be paper talk but these are the type of players we should be looking at now to progress.
For all the Clarke knockers,do you think any other manager would tempt these type of players into coming here.
As for the dip in form after Christmas,we lost Yacob and Mulumbu for long periods,Clarke wanted to dip into the market but wasn't allowed,he said he hopes to this season to prevent that happening again.
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In the Daily Star Clarke says he wants two more strikers as well as Anelka to support Shane Long.Kalou and Malouda are named.
Could be paper talk but these are the type of players we should be looking at now to progress.
For all the Clarke knockers,do you think any other manager would tempt these type of players into coming here.
As for the dip in form after Christmas,we lost Yacob and Mulumbu for long periods,Clarke wanted to dip into the market but wasn't allowed,he said he hopes to this season to prevent that happening again.
Well said we could have done with an Andrews/Sharner mucker in if possible.Water under now.
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A fantastic win today - one of our best results since, well, winning 5-3 there in 1978!
Its increasingly looking like a superb transfer window for us, and Berahino's emergence is a huge bonus. The squad is now looking very strong, and these two wins will make such a massive difference.
The change in mood since before the Sunderland is incredible, but while the players will get all the well-deserved attention, let's give due credit to Steve Clarke who has responded brilliantly to the huge pressure he was under. He's shown any doubters, surely, that he knows what he's doing.
We need to now snap up Amalfitano, secure Berahino on a long term contract, and look to strengthen the squad further in January by offloading Long and probably Dorrans and continuing to trust our scouting system.
Suddenly the prospects for the season look a lot rosier!
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A fantastic win today - one of our best results since, well, winning 5-3 there in 1978!
Its increasingly looking like a superb transfer window for us, and Berahino's emergence is a huge bonus. The squad is now looking very strong, and these two wins will make such a massive difference.
The change in mood since before the Sunderland is incredible, but while the players will get all the well-deserved attention, let's give due credit to Steve Clarke who has responded brilliantly to the huge pressure he was under. He's shown any doubters, surely, that he knows what he's doing.
We need to now snap up Amalfitano, secure Berahino on a long term contract, and look to strengthen the squad further in January by offloading Long and probably Dorrans and continuing to trust our scouting system.
Suddenly the prospects for the season look a lot rosier!
Good thread mate (sorry I took a word out), I think they'll be a few skirting past it though ;), having listened to & read a lot of his interviews the one thing that struck me was he never lost faith in himself & his staff, maybe that was picked up on by the players, the last few games for me has shown the players believe in the Coach & are buying into his idea's, really positive signs emerging & todays result (totally justified #nofluke) proves we should fear no one for the rest of the season.
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It's simply wonderful to see us play football again and to have square pegs in square holes. To be fair to Clarke Sessegnon and Amelfitano are clearly a step up in class to players he had available previously. I was impressed with some of our moves today and with our approach play/counter attacks. Anichebe and Berahino were also impressive today.
This was much more like it Steve, keep it up! :D
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I have not seen a Clarke interview yet, Moyes was respectful and complimentary, well played David Moyes, mind you, I thought he looked ill!
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I was slightly concerned with Steve Clarke after the Swansea game as I felt some of this tactics and subs were pretty poor. However credit to him for the signings that he has made and for this good run we are now on. I was also happy with the starting eleven he pick on Wednesday against Arsenal. Today he picked and attacking formation and looked to have a right go. Putting Sadio on for Sinclair further emphasized how positive he was today.
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Got it spot on today. We played with purpose and had a right go at United and thoroughly deserved the win.
My only frustration with Clarke is we know we play well playing a 4-2-3-1 formation which compliments the players we have yet he will pick a 4-4-2 and, 9 times out of 10, play terrible.
I have never been in the Clarke out camp but I did ask him to sort it and sort it quickly and fair play to him, with todays performance and last weeks as well, he certainly has.
Hope he enjoys a large glass of wine tonight because he deserves it. Well done Steve.
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Just need to say...
FFS is everybody happy now?
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As I said in the after match debate he made a brave decision to replace Sinclair with berahino it would have been very easy to bring on dorrans as a sub but it proved the right decision.
Im hoping now that this pretty much being Clarkes squad we see what he can do I think last season he worked mostly with what Roy left us with.
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As I said in the after match debate he made a brave decision to replace Sinclair with berahino it would have been very easy to bring on dorrans as a sub but it proved the right decision.
Im hoping now that this pretty much being Clarkes squad we see what he can do I think last season he worked mostly with what Roy left us with.
for someone who rarely cracks a smile(nice to see him with one after the game today!) Steve Clarke is a very positive thinking individual. All the interviews leading up to the match had comments of him thinking they can get a win. He believes that every game the squad has a chance to pick up 3 points. This is a good thing for the lads and Clarke's become a much better manager since the arrival of Sess, amalifitano and anichebe. It's amazing how quality players improve a managers ability to manage..lol.
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Steve's now managing (coaching) his team that's on the front foot ... Isn't it great to look forward in anticipation to games, who ever we are playing, rather than being selective in the games we hope we can win.
I know it's early days .... but after yesterdays match lets give anyone a run for their money .... it won't happen all the time but we're playing like a team that can equal last seasons performances aren't we.
Clarke is a cool level headed bloke and you get a similar reaction if we win convincingly or lose heavily .... that's the way it is and the way it should be.
If we're cooking by Christmas the bloke deserves a decent contract doesn't he?
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To be fair, SC has made a few mistakes but so as every manager. The fact that the club backed him with the signings tells me that he is doing a good job in the eyes of the powers that be. I still think we could be in for a hard season, but if Amalfitano, Sess, Olsson, G-Mac, Mulumbu, Yacob can remain relatively injury free, I think the squad we have will be good enough to win quite a few games. Defensively we have looked sound this season which for me is the most important thing.
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always thought we made a great choice in SC. He really does know what he is doing and deserves much of the credit for the win yesterday. Everyone is entitled to their view, but I do think sometimes Albion fans can be a little negative when they view and comment about the team and the Manager. I don't think we have looked better in twenty years!
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Good thread mate (sorry I took a word out), I think they'll be a few skirting past it though ;), having listened to & read a lot of his interviews the one thing that struck me was he never lost faith in himself & his staff, maybe that was picked up on by the players, the last few games for me has shown the players believe in the Coach & are buying into his idea's, really positive signs emerging & todays result (totally justified #nofluke) proves we should fear no one for the rest of the season.
Some speak as if the first 5 games of any season are the be all and end all, I'm so sick of the knee jerk brigade!
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Some speak as if the first 5 games of any season are the be all and end all, I'm so sick of the knee jerk brigade!
Sorry I can't reply as I don't understand the point :-\
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The performances in the first few games could well be a blessing in disguise. I think it really got through to everyone just how static and one dimensional we had become.
Sessegnon said in his interview the night he signed that Clarke had said he wanted more movement in the team to create more chances.
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just hope he doesnt go back to 442 when the system is working.
hope he doesnt try to accomodate anelka or morrison play the team that is on form.
i stated a few weeks ago in the other friend that i wasnt happy with clarke but i would continue to support him until jezza wielded the axe or he turned it round, i was always hoping for the latter long may it continue.
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have to say very worried about his selection and tactics in first two home games, great effort against Everton and a more fortunate effort against Fulham, Sunderland were there for the taking , team picked against arsenal in LC was good enough and should have won that night,
cant help thinking that the players that were injured , forced his team selection to a certain extent against Man U but what a performance and I will give him massive credit for bringing the kid on when sinclair was injured because we all thought it would be Dorrans.
lets hope we can carry it forward against what will obviously be a far stronger Arsenal than their LC team, but ours will be stronger to
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I'm not sure if I like this thread as we all know how quickly it can turn, i'd rather it all be merged as one. 'The Steve Clarke Thread'.
Credit where its due, his decisions have been working lately obviously with the results changing but as I have said it could change if we have successive losses.
To end on a positive, the squad and ability within it does bring plenty of potential to make it a smoother road for Steve.
As I have already said his positive tactics last week really surprised me and his bravery and ambition paid off in bringing Saido on for Sinclar on what was already a pretty attacking set up anyway.
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I'm not sure if I like this thread as we all know how quickly it can turn, i'd rather it all be merged as one. 'The Steve Clarke Thread'.
Credit where its due, his decisions have been working lately obviously with the results changing but as I have said it could change if we have successive losses.
To end on a positive, the squad and ability within it does bring plenty of potential to make it a smoother road for Steve.
As I have already said his positive tactics last week really surprised me and his bravery and ambition paid off in bringing Saido on for Sinclar on what was already a pretty attacking set up anyway.
I agree about the thread, couple of poor results and things will change so the other topic has been locked and this renamed the Steve Clarke Thread so all posts will go in this one.
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Good article here in the London Evening Standard with Steve Clarke.
http://www.standard.co.uk/sport/football/working-with-jose-mourinho-at-chelsea-opened-my-eyes--steve-clarke-8921997.html
For Steve Clarke, whose West Brom side play Chelsea on Saturday, a return to the Bridge is always special.
Twelve years as a player with the Blues brought three honours: the FA Cup, League Cup and UEFA Cup Winners’ Cup. This weekend’s visit as manager has an extra appeal as it will be the first time Clarke goes head to head with Jose Mourinho.
Despite that, the two will not share a glass of wine at the end of the match. “In all my time working with him, I’ve seen him have just two sips of red wine,” says Clarke. As for the post-match managerial chat, which Sam Allardyce argues is so vital, Clarke says: “Hopefully, we will get a chance to have a quick five minutes. You guys in the media take up a lot of our time after the games now.”
Five minutes is probably all Mourinho needs to assess how well Clarke has developed given that, in his first Chelsea spell in 2004, he plucked the Scot from Chelsea’s youth team to become assistant manager.
“Certainly Mourinho was one of my mentors,” says Clarke. “It was good for me at that time in my career. He gave me good ideas, showed me a different way to work.”
How different? “A way of working which was more global,” explains Clarke. “You could do everything on the pitch within the training session: the tactical, technical, physical, psychological. More contact, more possession, more technical exercises with the ball. There was less separate running, more strategic running.”
The impact of Mourinho’s ‘global idea’ was such that Clarke says he has tried to take it forward; proof of how Mourinho has influenced the English game.
Clarke was hardly a coaching novice when he came under Mourinho’s wing. It was Glenn Hoddle’s arrival as Chelsea manager in 1993 that made Clarke think of life, one day, as part of a backroom staff. “Glenn’s method and manner of coaching intrigued me.”
It was another five years before Clarke made the transition when former Chelsea team-mate Ruud Gullit chose him as his No2 at Newcastle. He even had one match as manager — a 5-1 defeat against Manchester United — after Gullit resigned.
When Bobby Robson took over at St James’ Park, he kept Clarke on and that experience taught him a great deal about man management.
“To see Bobby getting the best out of different characters was an education.” However, while Robson was Mourinho’s mentor, the two had very different coaching styles. “Bobby’s was good, solid British coaching.”
Although Clarke has picked up a lot from Mourinho, their demeanour on the touchline bears no resemblance. “I don’t think I’ve copied Jose’s style. I’m very different, quiet. I can be quite reserved, definitely not a shouter.
“There’s a limit to the number of times someone can shout at players. You’re dealing now with a lot of very wealthy young men and, to shout and scream every week, you lose the message. Sometimes I get angry but I always try to put my message across in a way the players will understand.”
It is this mix, Mourinho’s coaching methods and his own style, that the 50-year-old has taken with him in a roller-coaster career. This saw Clarke take charge of coaching at the Bridge after Avram Grant replaced Mourinho in 2007. “Unlike Jose,” says Clarke, “Avram was not a coach.”
Luiz Felipe Scolari’s arrival at the start of the 2008 season meant a “more Italian style where the fitness work is separate from the actual football work”. But, with the Brazilian World Cup winner bringing his own coaching staff, it also marginalised Clarke who felt his talents were not utilised enough.
Clarke’s misery was ended in September 2008 when he went to work as assistant for his former Chelsea team-mate Gianfranco Zola at West Ham.
After being shown the door at Upton Park in 2011 following Zola’s sacking, Clarke soon became assistant to Kenny Dalglish at Anfield. While he was there for little more than a year, Clarke did what he really enjoys. “Kenny is a normal British manager and has a coach. So, on the coaching field, the running and organising the sessions was my responsibility.”
Days after leaving Liverpool Clarke became a boss for the first time, taking over at West Brom after Roy Hodgson left for England, and he went into that job with the sort of experience few aspiring managers can claim.
The upheavals have also made Clarke philosophical. “People who own a club are entitled to do what they want. Sometimes there are some human casualties. Now, if you get two years, you’ve done well. The average time for a manager is 14 or 15 months. You have to learn to deal with it.”
At the Hawthorns, Clarke has learned to work under a director of football, Richard Garlick, and his chairman Jeremy Peace insists that the top flight is not a licence to spend money.
“They don’t run the club just to have two or three good years in the Premier League. They run it to sustain it over a number of years. I’m not going to say you don’t get some frustration when you see a club you think are at a similar level spending more than you. But you come in with your eyes wide open.”
Improving on last year’s eighth will not be easy given the stop-start season the Baggies have had — losing the first two home games, winning at Old Trafford for the first time since 1978 but losing at Anfield 4-1 two weeks ago. Clarke admits to feeling the pressure. “We’ve already lost a couple of managers. And this is before you’re really into the meat of the season. You are sitting on the sidelines and you know that the vultures are starting to circle.”
Clarke may feel all the more worried about the circling vultures as his contract runs out at the end of the season. “We need to start winning games and picking up points,” he says.
Crucial to this will be holding on to Saido Berahino. The England Under-21 international only made his Premier League debut in September but could make Hodgson’s squad for this month’s friendlies against Chile and Germany.
The club are in talks with the 20-year-old over a new contract — said to be increasing his weekly pay from £850 to £12,000 — but Clarke says: “All I’ll say with Saido is give him time to breathe, develop and mature. He’s a big talent. We have to give these kids time to grow.”
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Just because the media doesn't know anything about it....
and just because a contract hasn't been signed.....
Doesn't make it true
http://www.sportsmole.co.uk/football/west-brom-albion/sack-race/news/baggies-delay-clarke-contract-talks_119277.html (http://www.sportsmole.co.uk/football/west-brom-albion/sack-race/news/baggies-delay-clarke-contract-talks_119277.html)
West Bromwich Albion delay Steve Clarke contract talks
By Liam Power, Reporter
Filed: Thursday, November 21, 2013 at 01:37 UK
Last Updated: Thursday, November 21, 2013 at 01:37 UK
West Bromwich Albion are reportedly yet to offer Steve Clarke a new contract, despite the Baggies boss having less than seven months left on his current deal.
Clarke is still waiting to hear from West Brom chairman Jeremy Peace about the possibility of fresh terms, despite enjoying a largely successful 15 months in charge of the Hawthorns in his first managerial role.
The Scot wants to build for the future at West Brom but is yet to be sounded out over any kind of preliminary contract talks by Peace, leaving speculation over his future open to debate, according to The Mirror.
Contract talks have been a consistent theme at the Hawthorns this week, with the Baggies hoping to tie down England Under-21 international Saido Berahino to a long-term professional deal.
The Baggies are currently 10th in the Premier League table after recovering from a patchy opening to the campaign, earning eye-catching results against the big sides including a 2-1 win over Manchester United at Old Trafford in September.
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Seems like an attempt by Clarke's people to get the ball rolling. Hopefully it will get done soon but I don't think Peace will make his move until he has assessed how we fair in December and January.
A friend went to an Albion Foundation function recently and said the way Clarke's work, coaching and man management was spoken about was off the scale - obviously held in massive regard in many quarters of the club. It's music to my ears that this article suggest he wants to stop here for the long term.
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Obviously his contract is going into it's last 6 months so until he is offered a new one and signs there will be speculation. From the club's point of view I would have thought that once we have pretty much secured our Premier League place for another season then we would open discussions regarding a new contract.
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It's now getting to the point where at least initial discussions need to take place even if it is just a show of intent from the club to commit to discussions in a few months time if they haven't already done so. We can't let our manager get to the stage where he starts to worry too much about his future and take his eye off the ball so to speak. I do expect this story is a result of the people representing Clarke to try and get the ball rolling but I don't think we will hear anything about a potential new deal until February or March time at the earliest.
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West Bromwich Albion are reportedly yet to offer Steve Clarke a new contract, despite the Baggies boss having less than seven months left on his current deal.
Clarke is still waiting to hear from West Brom chairman Jeremy Peace about the possibility of fresh terms, despite enjoying a largely successful 15 months in charge of the Hawthorns in his first managerial role.
The Scot wants to build for the future at West Brom but is yet to be sounded out over any kind of preliminary contract talks by Peace, leaving speculation over his future open to debate, according to The Mirror.
oh well it must be true then...I keep forgetting that sh*tty tabloids are the font of all knowledge
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http://
At the moment we stand 4 points above the relegation zone
If we have a run of form like last year then we could be relegated
No wonder the club is holding on for a while before commiting
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Previously I have had reservations , and I still think there is much to learn and progress, however who else is out there that would actually be a significant upgrade and could integrate within our club?
Although he has made mistakes, I think that a new contract will be almost a formality , agree with others that cleaver Mr Peace will wait till Jan.
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I think he's going to be a superb manager in the future, he seem's to have got through that rough patch with us and came out the other side, always the concern with younger managers. Hopefully we've got him for a long time because I like the direction he's taking the club, and he's built on Hodgson's work admirably. The two of them have done a superb job to establish us in the premier league, repeatedly outcompeting clubs with far greater finances. Naturally others deserve credit for this as well, but we're a far more solid side under those two than we could have ever hoped previously.
With that said I can understand why the club isn't exactly darting into contract talks, managers are always in a notoriously fragile situation. But I do hope we get him tied down. I don't think he gets the credit he deserves really for the job he's done, I can't think of any (realistic) managers I'd rather have at the helm at the moment anyway.
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Albion have this evening released a statement revealing they plan to hold talks with Steve Clarke about his contract situation in the New Year:
http://tinyurl.com/nad9wyc (http://tinyurl.com/nad9wyc)
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Albion have this evening released a statement revealing they plan to hold talks with Steve Clarke about his contract situation in the New Year:
http://tinyurl.com/nad9wyc (http://tinyurl.com/nad9wyc)
This is good news, and I really hope they can sign SC up for a few seasons, or on a rolling contract maybe.
I think he's doing a good job and also like the way he represents us in the media, a genuine football man who says it as it is.
From the perspective of an ordinary Albion fan, I hope there's some positive news on a longer term deal in the New Year.
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8 year contract anyone?? :o
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I like the twelve month rolling contract gives both parties the security of a minimum of a years money as wages or compensation.
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I like the twelve month rolling contract gives both parties the security of a minimum of a years money as wages or compensation.
Yes seems a sensible arrangement that - just hope Clarke would be happy with that as I suspect the club will be and have been before.
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i certainly felt Clarke should have made subs earlier last night. I think Long shouldn't have played the full ninety minutes he looked very tired after seventy I would have liked to have seen Sadio Berahino come on. Still after taking charge of his 50th Premiership game for us last night his record his very good.
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I expected some people to blame Clarke but there is only one person culpable for not winning - he missed 2 clear chances to put the game to bed.
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Sorry, he does have to take a lot of the responsibility. Amalfitano is not 100%, Sessegnon was clearly not up for chasing back, never mind his misses, Long knackered and getting kicked about, Brunt as captain out wide and staying out there "on his wing" when something needed to be done double quick after the 3 Villa subs transformed the game. Reacting to that is part of Clarke's job, we were like rabbits in the headlights and not just after they scored the first, for a good ten minutes beforehand.
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Whilst not disputing the fact we should perhaps have made changes earlier i am interested to know who people would have summoned from the bench. Morrison and Anichebe were the obvious contenders but do people think bringing Anelka,Berahino etc would have made that much difference. Problems came about because Villa missed the m/f out bought on 2 of their quicker players who were more likely to get to knockdowns and loose balls than the players they had on in the starting line up.
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Well only the dog heard me, but I was saying (shouting!) that Morrison should come into centre midfield to fill that knock down gap(taking Sess off), Mulumbu maybe push forward a little bit, and the wide players come in more to hustle them - they were practically teeing up chips from the halfway line onto the D at one point.
I'm not trying to be clever after the event, and I can see why any manager would want to leave Sess on as he can work magic out of nothing, but I just don't see why you'd simply leave things like that when 3 very good and fresh players have come on and are running rings round your tired legs. Even bringing on Anelka to try and hold things up might have slowed the game down a bit.
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I was saying mozza for sess about 10/15 mins before it happened, and i thought long was struggling the last 20 mins, I personally would've bought sess and long off on the hour for mozza and anichebe and depending how it went gone saido for amalfitano.
Clare got out thought yesterday but it happens to the best, there's no disgrace in it..all we ask is you out think lambert in the reverse fixture next year!
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Lets face it Lambert made the glaringly obvious and correct substitutions in bringing Agbon and Weimann on - it didn't take much tactical genius to realise they were going nowhere unless those changes were made.
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Lets face it Lambert made the glaringly obvious and correct substitutions in bringing Agbon and Weimann on - it didn't take much tactical genius to realise they were going nowhere unless those changes were made.
This is what has baffled me. I've seen people lauding Lambert for his substitutions last night but let's be honest, the three players brought on are arguably three of their better players. It didn't take a genius to realise that at some point they would need to be introduced.
When Clarke noticed these coming on, it should have been then when James Morrison got ready, because we were always going to struggle against an energetic midfield when we're carrying Stephane Sessegnon who isn't the greatest at the doing the defensive side of the game.
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This is what has baffled me. I've seen people lauding Lambert for his substitutions last night but let's be honest, the three players brought on are arguably three of their better players. It didn't take a genius to realise that at some point they would need to be introduced.
When Clarke noticed these coming on, it should have been then when James Morrison got ready, because we were always going to struggle against an energetic midfield when we're carrying Stephane Sessegnon who isn't the greatest at the doing the defensive side of the game.
Its because he had the balls to do it, only once before have three subs been made at once in the 'Premier League era', if it works it'll change a game instantly if it doesn't then god help you and I think Lambert was hoping to get to an hour still at 2-0 to tire us out and then put on 3 of his best players.
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Its because he had the balls to do it, only once before have three subs been made at once in the 'Premier League era', if it works it'll change a game instantly if it doesn't then god help you and I think Lambert was hoping to get to an hour still at 2-0 to tire us out and then put on 3 of his best players.
Nothing to do with balls, he had no choice.
The game was passing his team by it was $hit or bust for Lambo
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Having criticised Clarke earlier, it has to be said that that kind of "betting the house" substitution backfires at least as often as it produces results; you can easily lose shape and get even worse. If Clarke was waiting to see, however, I think he had his answer well before they got their first.
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I have previously criticised Clarke but, on Monday I think the players let him down , if we cant keep a 2 goal lead against them the players need to take a look at themselves .
I am a little concerned at the choice of 4 attackers on the bench , seems strange not to do something and certainly earlier but If sess just finishes one of those chances I think we go on to 4-5-6 -nil
Having said that this was the match when sess and morgan don't perform 100% , it happens we move on .
beat the scumbags at seal park and we wont be to down?
so in short SC still has to learn , but could he really have done much more on Mon?
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I think clarke was caught between his game plans, he set out what he was going to do and expected the substitution at some point, most likely gabby. But when all three came on at the same time he's probably thought of either sticking to his plan or panic subbing and getting it wrong and regretting not sticking to his game plan.
With hindsight, i think the best idea would have been to call the sub straight after those 3 going on and get a message on to slow the game right down. Keep possession, draw fouls, put it in wide positions and just keep it a boring game for 5-10 minutes and drain out all their energy.
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Out of contract come next summer, and I wouldn't renew his deal.
I am not a boo boy and will support the team I love even if I am not happy with them.
I think we are dangerously slipping. I make it about 34
Points in 32 games since the year started. (However without doing a proper count I can't confirm this but I won't be be far out)
I'm left cold with starting line ups sometimes, I am left even colder by substitions. I haven't voiced this opinion since the start of te season as we had a mini revival and I thought we had turned a corner, but we haven't.
A good win v Man U doesn't matter if you throw away points in a historic derby match can't close matches out, can look toothless in other games.
I think if his starting 11 don't win on ther own we won't win. Am I alone in this opinion?
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Out of contract come next summer, and I wouldn't renew his deal.
I am not a boo boy and will support the team I love even if I am not happy with them.
I think we are dangerously slipping. I make it about 34
Points in 32 games since the year started. (However without doing a proper count I can't confirm this but I won't be be far out)
I'm left cold with starting line ups sometimes, I am left even colder by substitions. I haven't voiced this opinion since the start of te season as we had a mini revival and I thought we had turned a corner, but we haven't.
A good win v Man U doesn't matter if u throw away points in a historic derby match can't close matches out, can look toothless in other games.
I think if his starting 11 don't win on ther own we won't win. Am I alone in this opinion?
we were unbeaten in the last eight games till Newcastle, granted we have drawn too many games but laughable decision have gone against us which would have given us alot more points and instead of looking down we'd be looking at champions league football, so if decision even theselves out over season from here to the final game we should get a least 5 to 7 points of refs and relagation will not be in a sentence with Albion
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we were unbeaten in the last eight games till Newcastle, granted we have drawn too many games but laughable decision have gone against us which would have given us alot more points and instead of looking down we'd be looking at champions league football, so if decision even theselves out over season from here to the final game we should get a least 5 to 7 points of refs and relagation will not be in a sentence with Albion
Very well put, I'd agree and say now is not the time to panic, and I said I wanted him out before!
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That's 38 points from the last 38 games I think! The negative first half tactics and hoofball are getting tedious, and results in us more often than not chasing the game. This team is better than that and if things don't improve before the end of the year then it's goodbye SC. A younger more dynamic manager may be needed.
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That's 38 points from the last 38 games I think! The negative first half tactics and hoofball are getting tedious, and results in us more often than not chasing the game. This team is better than that and if things don't improve before the end of the year then it's goodbye SC. A younger more dynamic manager may be needed.
tried that before in the PL... last one didn't even last the whole season before being replaced by an older one who would focus on defense and counter and would take a draw over going ftw and risk losing.
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Only two defeats in ten games, its not too bad. However decisions have cost us from both refs and Steve Clarke. I think he is a good managers and an experienced one at this level now. His decisions making subs have been inconsistent this season. We have three very winnable game coming up which I think we will win two of them.
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That's 38 points from the last 38 games I think! The negative first half tactics and hoofball are getting tedious, and results in us more often than not chasing the game. This team is better than that and if things don't improve before the end of the year then it's goodbye SC. A younger more dynamic manager may be needed.
Personally I have confidence in Steve Clarke.
Last night at Newcastle was clearly disappointing but overall this season I think there have been many positives, with performances and results against the likes of Man U, Arsenal and Chelsea being prime examples
We've also clearly been unfortunate with various penalty decisions.
Fully appreciate that those factors count for nothing in the big scheme of things but after a relatively long unbeaten run, it seems a bit harsh to suggest the Head Coach may need to be sent packing within the next few weeks.
Just my opinion.
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As much as i like SC as a person I'm getting concerned about the hoof ball that has appeared in our game again.
All it does 90% of the time is give the ball back to our opponents but SC shouldn't need telling that , we have decent players on the ball so for goodness sake get it down and play it. Keep giving the ball away like we have of late and we will be drawn into a relegation battle .
Just to add question marks must be starting to be asked of one or two of the Summer signings , certainly Anelka was Clarke driven and that hasn't worked out yet.
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Never wanted him and still dont.He should be doing better with the players at his disposal. Crazy yesterday for taking both wide players off. Why Anechibe left Evertons bench for ours god only knows
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Never wanted him and still dont.He should be doing better with the players at his disposal. Crazy yesterday for taking both wide players off. Why Anechibe left Evertons bench for ours god only knows
The Dingles didn't want Mick…
We look more than capable of staying up this season and I think some are forgetting that is realistically our primary objective.
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Clarke is doing a good and without question is the right man. We are always going to have spells in this division where we look unbeatable and then other spells were we struggle to win a game. That is the nature of football in this division and no other manager would be capable of halting that.
Clarke has proven in his tenure so far that we can trust him. I do trust him and I do believe we will finish comfortably in mid-table. Granted, our season might not be as good as last season but for a club of our size it will still be a success.
I have questions over why we're persisting with this long ball approach but on the whole I am very happy with him and whenever I've asked questions of him before, he's came back and answered them and I expect no different this time around.
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I wonder whether Fulham will try to get him...?
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I wonder whether Fulham will try to get him...?
They have already appointed Rene? the former Man Utd assistant to succeed Jol
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Meulensteen is a forward thinking manager and will keep Fulham up so that's another team we need to finish above. Clarke is really starting to worry me with the timings of his substitutions and his team selections. The best thing that could happen to him in my opinion is if Long is sold from under him in January. It means we HAVE to play football on the ground.
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Meulensteen is a forward thinking manager and will keep Fulham up so that's another team we need to finish above. Clarke is really starting to worry me with the timings of his substitutions and his team selections. The best thing that could happen to him in my opinion is if Long is sold from under him in January. It means we HAVE to play football on the ground.
We did play football on the ground for most of the first 60 minutes against Villa. Brunt hit a decent long pass which Long dealt with superbly. It really does not follow though that if Shane is in the team we have to hit it long.
I'm sure he would love to have more chances created for him by good team passing moves.
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It really does not follow though that if Shane is in the team we have to hit it long.
I'm sure he would love to have more chances created for him by good team passing moves.
Exactly right, the problem is when Shane is in the team we DO hit it long
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Meulensteen is a forward thinking manager and will keep Fulham up so that's another team we need to finish above. Clarke is really starting to worry me with the timings of his substitutions and his team selections. The best thing that could happen to him in my opinion is if Long is sold from under him in January. It means we HAVE to play football on the ground.
That was my exact thought during the Newcastle game - I hope Long is sold in January - for basically the reasons stated above.
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That was my exact thought during the Newcastle game - I hope Long is sold in January - for basically the reasons stated above.
The best solution would be to play it on the floor, give Long some decent service and then see what he can do .The fact that Anelka has done nothing of note so far and Anichebe has had one good game only would make me hesitant to sell Long , Clarke must be behind our defenders hitting the hoof ball and in fact several games last season we tried to hit Lukaku with the direct attack( Reading at home was awful for it ).
I get the feeling whether Long goes or not we haven't seen the last of this poor dinosaur tactic under SC but yet at times we have played some very good football....baffling really.I cringe when i see Olsson/Gmac/Reid/ Mulumbu about to launch yet another loose ball in the air , i like SC as a person but this is awful to watch.
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Meulensteen is a forward thinking manager and will keep Fulham up so that's another team we need to finish above. Clarke is really starting to worry me with the timings of his substitutions and his team selections. The best thing that could happen to him in my opinion is if Long is sold from under him in January. It means we HAVE to play football on the ground.
Long is not the reason we play the ball in the air that is down to Clarke, we were doing it with Anelka up front and we have done it with Anichebe.
I think if you look back to the first half of last season at the goals Long was scoring I would not say they were the product of hoof ball, we were playing some cracking football back then.
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Long is not the reason we play the ball in the air that is down to Clarke, we were doing it with Anelka up front and we have done it with Anichebe.
I think if you look back to the first half of last season at the goals Long was scoring I would not say they were the product of hoof ball, we were playing some cracking football back then.
No they were mostly the product of good wing play, but that is down in South Wales now ... When we do it with Anichebe or Anelka the ball sticks, not so 90% of the time with Shane I'm afraid. The control for the first Vile goal is the exception rather than the rule and I for one don't want to keep turning up at these grounds watching us lump the ball forward to a man who for all his running and endeavour scores a goal every 5 or so games. Especially when we have a proven system that has taken all three points away from Old Trafford.
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I really hope that Long does not get sold in January and Clarke is forced to rely on the semi retired Anelka the 15 stone glass statue that is Anichebe, the goal scoring machine that is Rosenberg and a youngster who is probably not strong enough to lead the line on his own.
We go long whenever we do not have Yacob at the base of the midfield and an attacking midfielder who does not drop back into the midfield to collect the ball. If Clarke has made a mistake this season it is changing the shape and personal in the midfield. Whether he was forced to drop Yacob to the bench because of injury or because both he and Mulumbu were on 4 yellow cards and he didn't want to lose both of them for the next game I don't know, but for whatever reason he did not put out the Yacob Mulumbu combination which has been the bedrock of our best performances over the last two seasons.
Equally our key creative players Sessegnon and Amalfitano are inconsistent. Getting Sessegnon to be his consistent brilliant best was a task that eluded three (?) Sunderland managers and Amalfitano is being loaned to us from Marseille for a reason I guess the that reason is there is a frustrating lack of consistency in his performances. The Old Trafford game seemed to be a peak that neither have attained since.
I am not sure if Clarke can be reasonably blamed for this and I doubt selling Long will do anything other than weaken the squad.
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No they were mostly the product of good wing play, but that is down in South Wales now ... When we do it with Anichebe or Anelka the ball sticks, not so 90% of the time with Shane I'm afraid. The control for the first Vile goal is the exception rather than the rule and I for one don't want to keep turning up at these grounds watching us lump the ball forward to a man who for all his running and endeavour scores a goal every 5 or so games. Especially when we have a proven system that has taken all three points away from Old Trafford.
Now that is stretching the truth , for me Odemwingie was never a wide player and his only thing was to thrash the ball across the box more than likely hoping for a goal himself(The fact he hasn't been missed says it all).Lumping the ball with the players we have now is criminal IMO whoever is up top, I'm yet to see the ball stick with Anelka or Anichebe so clearly this tactic doesn't work not to mention one is constantly injured and the other more interested in wrestling opposing defenders so far.As good as that day at Old Trafford was the very same player got no joy at Stoke.
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No they were mostly the product of good wing play, but that is down in South Wales now ... When we do it with Anichebe or Anelka the ball sticks, not so 90% of the time with Shane I'm afraid. The control for the first Vile goal is the exception rather than the rule and I for one don't want to keep turning up at these grounds watching us lump the ball forward to a man who for all his running and endeavour scores a goal every 5 or so games. Especially when we have a proven system that has taken all three points away from Old Trafford.
That 1 in 5 ratio will look pretty good next to Anichebe's record at the end of the season I'm sure.
I don't know why we'd sell Long when he is one of only two strikers who has actually scored for us this season. Relying on Anelka, Anichebe, Vydra and Berahino for goals post January would be criminal.
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I really hope that Long does not get sold in January and Clarke is forced to rely on the semi retired Anelka the 15 stone glass statue that is Anichebe, the goal scoring machine that is Rosenberg and a youngster who is probably not strong enough to lead the line on his own.
We go long whenever we do not have Yacob at the base of the midfield and an attacking midfielder who does not drop back into the midfield to collect the ball. If Clarke has made a mistake this season it is changing the shape and personal in the midfield. Whether he was forced to drop Yacob to the bench because of injury or because both he and Mulumbu were on 4 yellow cards and he didn't want to lose both of them for the next game I don't know, but for whatever reason he did not put out the Yacob Mulumbu combination which has been the bedrock of our best performances over the last two seasons.
Equally our key creative players Sessegnon and Amalfitano are inconsistent. Getting Sessegnon to be his consistent brilliant best was a task that eluded three (?) Sunderland managers and Amalfitano is being loaned to us from Marseille for a reason I guess the that reason is there is a frustrating lack of consistency in his performances. The Old Trafford game seemed to be a peak that neither have attained since.
I am not sure if Clarke can be reasonably blamed for this and I doubt selling Long will do anything other than weaken the squad.
That, and Marseilles wanted Florian Thauvin, who they now have. so their choices are Thauvin and Ayew, no need for Amalfitano as a 3rd choice.
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Morgan is still creating chances - e.g. the Sess miss 1st half v Villa.
He always puts a shift in as well. Think if he and Jones stay fit we'll see plenty of chances created from the right.
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No they were mostly the product of good wing play, but that is down in South Wales now ... When we do it with Anichebe or Anelka the ball sticks, not so 90% of the time with Shane I'm afraid. The control for the first Vile goal is the exception rather than the rule and I for one don't want to keep turning up at these grounds watching us lump the ball forward to a man who for all his running and endeavour scores a goal every 5 or so games. Especially when we have a proven system that has taken all three points away from Old Trafford.
I think it's pretty naive of you to think there is only one game plan for us to play with Anichebe or whoever up front. It worked at Old Trafford yet at Chelsea we went with the idea of focusing down the wings and through the middle (with Long up top) and should have come back with 3 points.
Long has put in some cracking performances over the last couple of games along with the start he had last season where he scored 7 goals up til January then a combination of injury and Lukaku pushed him away from the run he had in the first half of the season.
To be honest I can't tell you which one of our strikers at the moment will come near to matching his total of 7 he had by January last season. I can't see Berahino doing it as he is mostly utilised out wide by us and he doesn't fit the proven system you talk of us been so successful with (e.g Old Trafford).
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As most of you have guessed i am not a fan of Steve Clarke but let me tell you this all other opposition supporters i speak to tell me how lucky we are to have him.So there, we are very lucky indeed
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If we lose on Saturday he surely is in danger??
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Maybe he should have rung the changes a bit more when were doing well and confident, Amalfitano looks knackered to me, Vydra and Anichebe not used much. Now, if he makes changes for Norwich and we don't win, we are right down in it.
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Maybe he should have rung the changes a bit more when were doing well and confident, Amalfitano looks knackered to me, Vydra and Anichebe not used much. Now, if he makes changes for Norwich and we don't win, we are right down in it.
True, but if we win (which we're more than capable of doing) we're back into the mid table area with an opportunity to push on.
We clearly need a win sooner rather than later, but speculation with regard to SC possibly getting the push at this stage (from recent posts in the thread) is surely a bit premature?
Personally, from a supporter perspective, I'm fine with the job SC and his management team are doing.
Last night indicated just how tough it can be when you're up against opposition who have had that level of financial investment in the team.
I'd absolutely never write us off against that kind of opposition, we've kicked the "big" clubs up the backside numerous times, but the odds are clearly stacked against us if one club have invested hundreds of millions from owners who sometimes appear to have a bottomless pit of cash against a club functioning on a stand alone self financing basis.
The fight back by Villa in our previous home match does appear to have dented the confidence of many of our fans and it sometimes feels as if there are some Albion supporters, who even into our fourth consecutive season in the Prem, still don't have the confidence in the top quality personnel we have, on and off the pitch, to have the know how and expertise to ensure we'll remain at this level for some time to come.
It's almost as if some of our fans need a confidence boost rather than any of the players.
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If we lose on Saturday he surely is in danger??
He should only be considered in danger if we go on a losing streak which threatens to do serious damage as to whether we remain a Premier League club. I didn't expect anything last night and therefore it was more or less a 'free match' - if you lose, you move on but if you get something then brilliant. Let's face it, we are your archetypal mid-table club with fans whose expectations have risen and will struggle to come to terms with a club having spells of good form and then then inevitable spells of bad form.
I don't reckon we will lose either.
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Good post liam completly agree, hes job is safe to me but it is crucial festive run of games that determines every clubs season. Worrying win percent now though need some three pointers as they say in basketball.
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He should only be considered in danger if we go on a losing streak which threatens to do serious damage as to whether we remain a Premier League club. I didn't expect anything last night and therefore it was more or less a 'free match' - if you lose, you move on but if you get something then brilliant. Let's face it, we are your archetypal mid-table club with fans whose expectations have risen and will struggle to come to terms with a club having spells of good form and then then inevitable spells of bad form.
I don't reckon we will lose either.
I wonder who's idea it was to sign Anelka if it was Clarke pushing for it then that will be a big mark against Clarke(i suppose we'll never know), hopefully we win Saturday but if we get beat then that could be the tipping point for a lot of fans and maybe Peace
Our last 38 premier league games have resulted in us getting 38 points, that's serious relegation form and i'm sure Peace will be aware of all of this, like i said though hopefully we can get maybe 6-7 points out the next three
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I wonder who's idea it was to sign Anelka if it was Clarke pushing for it then that will be a big mark against Clarke(i suppose we'll never know), hopefully we win Saturday but if we get beat then that could be the tipping point for a lot of fans and maybe Peace
Our last 38 premier league games have resulted in us getting 38 points, that's serious relegation form and i'm sure Peace will be aware of all of this, like i said though hopefully we can get maybe 6-7 points out the next three
Everybody are allowed to make mistakes, Clarke included. What annoys me is when he keeps repeating old known mistakes over and over again, almost to the point of obstinacy. Head coach/manager is a job where you must learn from your mistakes or eventually you end up paying the price. With the squad and players we have we should be comfortably fine but if we aren't something is very wrong and the focus will inevitably be on Clarke.
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I wonder who's idea it was to sign Anelka if it was Clarke pushing for it then that will be a big mark against Clarke(i suppose we'll never know), hopefully we win Saturday but if we get beat then that could be the tipping point for a lot of fans and maybe Peace
Our last 38 premier league games have resulted in us getting 38 points, that's serious relegation form and i'm sure Peace will be aware of all of this, like i said though hopefully we can get maybe 6-7 points out the next three
Whoever signed Nicolas Anelka has no bearing whatsoever on Steve Clarke's position. If anything, all three (Peace, Clarke, Garlick) are culpable if that signing doesn't become a success as it was no doubt sanctioned by Garlick and Peace - no matter how much Clarke wanted him. I don't see why Saturday would be a tipping point for the fans or Peace - granted we would all be annoyed, but to throw around suggestions like he could be reaching tipping point, in my opinion, is laughable and slightly premature. We are in a healthy position and as of yet, we haven't hit the form we are capable of. Given time, that form will turn around and supporters will then be looking towards the other end of the table - such is the nature of football.
As for last season, the final third of the season doesn't do Clarke many favours whatsoever, but I hope the club take note of many factors which contributed towards that - not least the gutless performances from some of our players who knew they had reached their season remit and therefore coasted along.
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I think at the moment its too early to discuss it but don't be under any illusion he is safe. If things continue and results don't pick up I wouldn't be surprised given the short amount of time left on his contract that he goes. Seems the average span of an Albion manager/ head coach is around 18 months- 2 years and we're coming to that stage.
Interesting comment there Liam about last season but surely the role of a head coach is to get those players who are coasting into the right frame and replace them if they don't do it. I think last season will have a major bearing if a decision is to be made.
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I think that's the mentality of the football club more than anything to be honest, Phil. Our natural aim is survival and we achieved that fairly on in the season. The intensity in terms of performance wasn't the same and unsurprisingly results dropped. I don't think we were helped by a certain player and his re-integration process which I also believe caused more harm than good. I personally lost interest in our season slightly once we had nothing too play for - I also think this forum could possibly support that - it was certainly quieter in the back end of the season. Maybe if our remit wasn't just survival then our form might not have of tailed off as much as it did?
What didn't help us last season is that we were short on options. In the forward areas, Shane Long wasn't performing and the understudy was then Markus Rosenberg who has flattered to deceive. Thankfully, Lukaku was on form. Even in midfield, Yacob was becoming extremely leggy without a natural replacement and the loss of Gera didn't do us any favours as we then ended up with players in the wrong positions - we also lacked a genuine wide man as Jerome Thomas wasn't up to the standard.
I'm not totally defending Clarke because I appreciate he has made mistakes last season and I expected that in his first season but I do believe other parts of the club are equally culpable.
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Whoever signed Nicolas Anelka has no bearing whatsoever on Steve Clarke's position. If anything, all three (Peace, Clarke, Garlick) are culpable if that signing doesn't become a success as it was no doubt sanctioned by Garlick and Peace - no matter how much Clarke wanted him. I don't see why Saturday would be a tipping point for the fans or Peace - granted we would all be annoyed, but to throw around suggestions like he could be reaching tipping point, in my opinion, is laughable and slightly premature. We are in a healthy position and as of yet, we haven't hit the form we are capable of. Given time, that form will turn around and supporters will then be looking towards the other end of the table - such is the nature of football.
As for last season, the final third of the season doesn't do Clarke many favours whatsoever, but I hope the club take note of many factors which contributed towards that - not least the gutless performances from some of our players who knew they had reached their season remit and therefore coasted along.
38 points in 38 games enough said really, i reckon it will be a tipping point in as much that if we get beat i guarantee most of the local phone ins and social media will be saying its about time Clarke went, fans are fickle mate and if we get beat Saturday you watch a lot turn who are currently sitting on the fence
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38 points in 38 games enough said really, i reckon it will be a tipping point in as much that if we get beat i guarantee most of the local phone ins and social media will be saying its about time Clarke went, fans are fickle mate and if we get beat Saturday you watch a lot turn who are currently sitting on the fence
If you want a benchmark as to judge whether an Albion manager is under pressure or not then the point a game average is as good as any. If we drop below a point a game for an extended period during a season then the manager is under pressure almost by default.
If we lose to Norwich on Saturday we will be at the point a game average after 15 games therefore the pressure would start to mount and failure to get anything from the Cardiff game would see Clarke needing a win against Hull.
I wrote this about Chris Hughton http://lookbackinmildbewilderment.blogspot.co.uk/2013/11/for-whom-bell-tolls.html which makes the point that most managers in the mid-table mix are only three defeats away from being under pressure Clarke is in the same boat.
For what it is worth I believe that we will finish December above the point a game benchmark and the crisis will be averted until the next point we lose two games on the spin.
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I know a few fans that want to see us do something in the cup this year, Could be a thing which determines whether he stays or goes, Like Phil said the good feeling we had before is going gradually but with the players we have i certainly wouldn't be to happy with the manager if we slip into relegation troubles, Big three games for us coming up going into the second half of the season, COYB.
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I'm not going to say 'Clarke Out', but some of the facts are worrying. For instance, 3 wins in 14 this season, and the afforementioned 38 points from 38 games (which has at least improved from the 18 in 22 or whatever after the first few games).
And people may say that we could've beaten Chelsea, or we could've beaten Arsenal, but the fact is we didn't (Ridgewell's poor defending and Anelka's awful finishing made the difference too, not just penalties given or not). We did well to get points, but as we saw against Villa, finishing teams off is proving a problem. Clarke's use of subs another.
I'm not calling for his head, but nor am I going to pretend that everything smells of roses either. We have 3 big games coming up that will define the season more than any win at Old Trafford, win at least 2 and we will be fine, lose more than 1 and it's looking worrying.
The last thing we want is another Di Matteo style 'death plunge' turn in form.
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For me Clarkes position should only be jeopardy if its looking like we are fast approaching relegation. Having supported west brom for 35 years i suppose I'm more easily pleased than most (through mostly having seen years & years of pure undiluted rubbish from players and managers alike!).
We are now a competitive mid table premiership team for me and whilst we are there or there about, I'm happy to be honest. We've had very few "spankings" this year and with a bit more luck, could be another 5/6 points ahead.
I don't see any managers out there that will suddenly turn us into a top 5/6 team with resources and set up at Albion.
SC will make mistakes and I'll no doubt disagree with his tactics / subs from time to time. Which club's fans don't??
Glass very much half full for me.
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I've been calling for his head since January. The second half of last season was a disgrace. Don't get me wrong im not going to start chanting CLARKE OUT!! because like booing players it does nothing to support the team during games but if we don't take at least 7 points from the next 3 games he's in trouble.
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if we don't take at least 7 points from the next 3 games he's in trouble.
Thankfully most our fans remember the real dark days. Steve Clark is a good coach and his done a great job and the time to judge him on this season is in May.
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I was at Woking, listened to Twerton on the radio (my old man wouldn't take me said it would get nasty) :( sat in the Brummie for the Crewe 5-1. I remember the bad times, but we cannot and will not judge Clarke in May, I suspect he will be judged around mid January which makes the next 6 games absolutely vital up to the FA Cup third round. Minimum of 10 points required from those six matches for SC to keep his job in my humble.
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Win a game Steve Clarke is great! Lose a game Steve Clarke out ::). The younger ones on here dont remember the 'dark days'
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I hope we offer him a contact as soon as possible because we'll struggle to find a better head coach.
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Win a game Steve Clarke is great! Lose a game Steve Clarke out ::). The younger ones on here dont remember the 'dark days'
I feel the other way mate it seems to be more of the older generation, god knows how they coped in the 90's. It makes me laugh, on the general football board most fans slag teams off for ridiculous sackings saying it's a joke. Unless we lose our next 10 matches we would be that joke of a team who sacked the manager. To me he hasn't hardly done anything wrong and things that are completely out of his hands have stopped us being higher up the table....... For example; Penalty against Arsenal, Sess missed chance and penalty against Stoke, penalty against Chelsea, Sess missed chance v Villa.
They are simple things that should have happened and 8 points there missed out on that we should have really got which Clarke could have done nothing about. I honestly believe we have been very unlucky this season.
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I feel the other way mate it seems to be more of the older generation, god knows how they coped in the 90's. It makes me laugh, on the general football board most fans slag teams off for ridiculous sackings saying it's a joke. Unless we lose our next 10 matches we would be that joke of a team who sacked the manager. To me he hasn't hardly done anything wrong and things that are completely out of his hands have stopped us being higher up the table....... For example; Penalty against Arsenal, Sess missed chance and penalty against Stoke, penalty against Chelsea, Sess missed chance v Villa.
They are simple things that should have happened and 8 points there missed out on that we should have really got which Clarke could have done nothing about. I honestly believe we have been very unlucky this season.
Flip side of the coin we were very very poor in 2 winnable home games at the start of the season, there are 6 points lost that you can put down to Clarke. I wouldn't sack him, but for people to suggest he is ok unless we lose 10 on the trot do not know our chairman and are slightly detached from reality. If we failed to register another win this year (say we had 6 draws) and then went out of the cup in early January would you be saying the same?
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Win a game Steve Clarke is great! Lose a game Steve Clarke out ::). The younger ones on here dont remember the 'dark days'
Interestingly, the ones supporting Steve Clarke in the last couple of pages are the younger ones..
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Flip side of the coin we were very very poor in 2 winnable home games at the start of the season, there are 6 points lost that you can put down to Clarke. I wouldn't sack him, but for people to suggest he is ok unless we lose 10 on the trot do not know our chairman and are slightly detached from reality. If we failed to register another win this year (say we had 6 draws) and then went out of the cup in early January would you be saying the same?
I would be dissapointed not to have beaten Norwich and Hull but draws in all the other games could be seen as decent points and defiantly not enough for the sack. Those two games at the start were very poor but a huge reason for that was down to lack of recruitment over the summer and we had no creativity which we have now, who that was down to we don't really know could of been one of Peace, Garlick or Clarke we don't know.
Overall though Clarke has been a massive success since he has been with us in my opinion.
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I would be dissapointed not to have beaten Norwich and Hull but draws in all the other games could be seen as decent points and defiantly not enough for the sack. Those two games at the start were very poor but a huge reason for that was down to lack of recruitment over the summer and we had no creativity which we have now, who that was down to we don't really know could of been one of Peace, Garlick or Clarke we don't know.
Overall though Clarke has been a massive success since he has been with us in my opinion.
Think massive is something of an overstatement, without Lukaku 2nd half of last season we'd have been down with the dead men, back to my original point the 4 PL matches after the 3rd round are Southampton and Villa away, Everton and Liverpool at home. Say we also draw those 4 matches. That is a further 10 points from a possible 30 from today (and a ten match unbeaten run). Yet all would be creditable draws? Do you see where I'm going with this. We're better winning two and losing three than drawing five. Results business. Clarke is without a contract offer and we'd have 25 points from 24 games. Is his position still safe?
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I'm one of the older ones & I'm very much in the pro Clarke camp.
Unsurprisingly, if you look back at some of the comments in this thread following a couple of defeats they're very much of a 'how many more games do we give him' nature & yet win at Man U, draw with Arsenal/Chelsea & it becomes 'he needs to be given a new contract' scenario, I think in the eyes of many fans Clarke, like most managers/coaches are only ever 2 or 3 results away from their P45.
I have backed him from day one & whilst I have not always agreed with some of his selections/subs etc.. I believe he's the man to take us forward & a loss away to Newcastle & then to the Champions elect (IMO) is far too little evidence to suggest the knives are being sharpened behind him, having said all that & knowing 'the Albion way' of doing things, I would be surprised if SCs position isn't regularly being reviewed (wiley old fox that JP)
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I quite like him but he does make some strange tactical decisions it seems and the win rate over the last 12 months hasn't been good enough. That said I'd only move him on if we slipped into the bottom three and if someone better and safer is out there, but how many Roy Hodgsons are available?
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I'm one of the older ones & I'm very much in the pro Clarke camp.
Unsurprisingly, if you look back at some of the comments in this thread following a couple of defeats they're very much of a 'how many more games do we give him' nature & yet win at Man U, draw with Arsenal/Chelsea & it becomes 'he needs to be given a new contract' scenario, I think in the eyes of many fans Clarke, like most managers/coaches are only ever 2 or 3 results away from their P45.
I have backed him from day one & whilst I have not always agreed with some of his selections/subs etc.. I believe he's the man to take us forward & a loss away to Newcastle & then to the Champions elect (IMO) is far too little evidence to suggest the knives are being sharpened behind him, having said all that & knowing 'the Albion way' of doing things, I would be surprised if SCs position isn't regularly being reviewed (wiley old fox that JP)
Good post mate, and I'd tend to agree.
Personally I also think he's the man to take us forward and I'm intrigued as to who those who appear to want SC given the boot, would like to replace him, and also what their expectations are when comparing our budget to a number of clubs we're attempting to compete with? (and that's not me being negative or small time - just being realistic as I'm hoping we achieve that 50 point target and get a decent Cup run, both of which we're more than capable of doing).
I would acknowledge though, that virtually every Albion key employee is likely to be under regular review and nothing in football should surprise us too much, but from a supporter perspective I hope SC is with us for the long term (and whatever today's result that opinion won't change).
But I'm looking forward to getting up to The Hawthorns in a few hours, a couple of Carlsberg's after a hard week at work then hopefully cheering on the Albion as we get back on track.
COYB 8)
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The Di Matteo sacking showed how quickly the club is prepared to act if they feel it is necessary. However the following factors were in place.
1. A major slump in the teams form which showed very little sign of improvement.
2. There were concerns about how attentive Di Matteo was being to his duties
3. There was at least 2 readily available replacements who could be expected to improve the situation.
We are not in the same situation now and nor will we be unless we have an awful run of form for the remainder of the year.
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Other than Martin Jol who is actually available anyway even if SC got the sack, He has assembled this squad so he should see the season out at least. Although making subs with 15mins left is getting frustrating.
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Doesn't matter what any of us on here think and from comments its very mixed to be honest as we have no bearing but its something that can be discussed as thats why we're all on here, all that matters is if Peace thinks our Prem status is at risk he will act, if he thinks we will be safe in mid-table then he will be happy to leave things as they are as we know finances dictate we will never break into that top 6.
The fact talks have not began could come into play though not so much from our side but if he is close to the end of his deal then others clubs could start showing interest and thats when we have to get talks started if we want to keep him here.
I'm in the unsure camp with him, some of the results and performances have been impressive and when things are going well all is good but then when things are not going well he seems to struggle to know what to do to change it at times.
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Clarke is struggling he is out of his depth.
The form since the turn of the year is shocking.
We still have time to save it but we need to act quickly now I feel.
Clarkes only saving grace at this point is the lack of replacements.
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that's it for me today the clown has to go or we will be deep in the mire after xmas !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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JP will be like a shark sensing blood over the next month. If he becomes convinced of the view that relegation is becoming a real threat by the new year he will be ruthless and sack Clarke. Clarke therefore has 4 to 5 games.
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that's it for me today the clown has to go or we will be deep in the mire after xmas !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Clown? How respectful.
If we're going to debate this issue, lets at least do it with a bit of dignity and class.
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And who would we get in who would do a better job on the same budget ? Jol? Holloway? Hmm.....
Clarke is the best option and we've already got him. We need to back him.
When will fans learn that chopping and changing managers is a mugs game?
Choose the right man and back him.
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9 wins in 41 games - that's Clarkes record. Does he deserve to keep his job with those stats! I suggest not.
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9 wins in 41 games - that's Clarkes record. Does he deserve to keep his job with those stats! I suggest not.
Or 19 wins in 57 games.
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Calendar Year to Date
League Games Played: 33
Points Obtained: 30
Average PPG: 0.90
Relegation Form.
Goodbye Clarke.
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Slightly worried about Steve Clarke at the minute. However their is not one manager out of work at the minute who would be a possible option if we were to sack Clarke.
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This is starting to look very similar to the situation that led to Di Matteo's sacking. We're in a rut and Clarke is struggling to get us out of it. Villa game is the perfect example - two goals up and comfortable, yet we somehow throw it away whilst taking off our main attacking threat at 2-1.
Today we actually deserved to win, yet at the same time it's difficult to say anybody played particularly well (Mulumbu apart). I also very much doubt we would have created so much had we not gone a goal down early on, yet we should always look to dominate games against the likes of Norwich/Cardiff/Hull from first minute to last.
There are also a few tactical/selection issues that i'm struggling to make sense of: why don't we use Anichebe's strength to play off his feet? Why do out of form players continually get picked? If it's because their replacements aren't good enough, that again is Clarke's fault. He has had 18 months to work out that we need a new LB and cover for Mulumbu. Why drop Berahino when he is bang in form?
Before today i said we'd need six points from the next three games. Still stands, but i'm not confident. Defeat in either of the next two and Clarke's job will be hanging by a thread.
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The run we have been on going all the way back to January simply hasn't been good enough and we have ran out of excuses now, the players haven't been good enough and a lot of the time they haven't been set up well enough to get the results.
Something needs to change quickly, I'm not saying change the manager just yet but he needs to have the balls to mix it up a bit now with most players getting back to fitness and being available for selection and its time to give some of them the chance to impress. He will be feeling the pressure massively right now and another couple of poor results will see JP begin to panic and I don't see him holding off too long if he thinks our future in the league is seriously under threat.
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The run we have been on going all the way back to January simply hasn't been good enough and we have ran out of excuses now, the players haven't been good enough and a lot of the time they haven't been set up well enough to get the results.
Something needs to change quickly, I'm not saying change the manager just yet but he needs to have the balls to mix it up a bit now with most players getting back to fitness and being available for selection and its time to give some of them the chance to impress. He will be feeling the pressure massively right now and another couple of poor results will see JP begin to panic and I don't see him holding off too long if he thinks our future in the league is seriously under threat.
It goes back to the Swansea away game at the end of November last year. We have had some good performances but by in large we have be rubbish!
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Not sure what's going on at the minute, we are dropping like a lead balloon with no sign of it stopping.
This reminds me of the Mowbray and Di Matteo days prior to his sacking
We play lots of tippy tappy football
We create chances and miss the majority
We have lost the ability to defend, having to score two to draw is silly
The players constantly moan at each other as if not having a clue
We constantly moan at refereeing decisions
We constantly blame the ref for losing us a game by not awarding decisions
Steve Clarke constantly provides excuse after excuse as to why we haven't won.
End product will be relegation.
I'm not anti Clarke particularly, and if cannot really think of a replacement BUT the facts speak for themselves. 38 points from 40 is poor and there are no excuses.
A change is needed, it may not work but something has to be done and the players are unsackable.
I was listening to Clarkes interview on the way in and he was moaning about having too many attacking players and not enough defensive options, so why buy/loan so many then. Our defence us not good enough, so why not get some back up when the chance was there.
We have three tough away matches with a tricky home tie in the middle. I reckon well be in the bottom three at the month end, so this can only end badly.
There is time to change, and it has to be done before it's too late.
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I am going to say the same as I said end of the season. We don't seem able to pass to each other and we can't find the target so what do they do in training? You have to look at the coaches and assume they are not good enough.
I know Clarke has to learn but he never seems to acknowledge when he has got something wrong and doesn't learn from it.
The amount of money spent and squad he has are better than previous managers had. Time for him to go so things can be sorted by New man in January.
I am one of the old school on here.
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We needed a right back to compete with jones and a left back to compete with ridgewell.
Our early business was cheap and last resort.
Having said that the players we have with some better tactics and organisation would be fine I think. Clarke doesn't learn from his mistakes. We have become long ball team. And our attacking play is all down the right we
Rely on jones.
I'm hoping to hear the news that he's gone. The thing that worries me is we don't want a terry Connor situation here...
I can't see a replacement
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Clown? How respectful.
If we're going to debate this issue, lets at least do it with a bit of dignity and class.
after watching that today you want dignity ? I want someone who knows what there doing in charge , we are far to slow attacking , keep going backwards , and look lost ! that better
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For what it's worth my opinion is Clarke benefitted from Hodgson's organisation for the first third of last season, but since then he has tried to put his own stamp on things and failed miserably. Since November last year our record is abysmal relegation form.
I think a change is needed but the problem is there is no one available
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It goes back to the Swansea away game at the end of November last year. We have had some good performances but by in large we have be rubbish!
This is a basic fact.
We looked much better for a while with the new players coming in after the August transfer window, but those players have adopted to their new surroundings now and sunk to the same level of strange lethargy as the players around them.
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For what it's worth my opinion is Clarke benefitted from Hodgson's organisation for the first third of last season, but since then he has tried to put his own stamp on things and failed miserably. Since November last year our record is abysmal relegation form.
I think a change is needed but the problem is there is no one available
Sums it up perfectly for me.
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I think we are best seeing how we do in the next two games. I think we've been terribly unlucky this season and Clarke deserves some time to get us going again.
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I think we are best seeing how we do in the next two games. I think we've been terribly unlucky this season and Clarke deserves some time to get us going again.
We have been very unlucky at times especially with the two penalty decisions going against us but if it comes to crunch time Peace won't look at those, he will look at the results and points on the board as they are the only things that matter.
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Like all Baggies fans I'm not impressed (to say the least!) with anything Albion are doing on the pitch at the moment, but I thought I'd throw something out there that's on my mind, so here go's. By the way, If I said I've been going since 94 then it gives you an idea about what me and the rest of you have experienced.
Last close season JP released THAT statement describing us a 'mid championship club' and I realised something for the first time, that as a club we're probably operating at our extreme limits, because otherwise why would an articulate and intelligent person as our Chairman is, wish to let us know a fact that is obvious?
Yes we've been promoted and relegated, using the parachute payments to full effect to get ourselves back up, Yes, were in the Prem on merit, we earned the right to be there. But, and its a BIG but, as a club do we have the leadership,management and inclination at the top ranks of our club to push us on, and continually improve ?
I believe that our coach at the moment is struggling, does make strange decisions and the rest, but he's a young coach with a bright future, and I believe as fans and as a club we need to realise that we are limited to what the club can achieve, after all, the seasonal ££ outlay is never too far away from the final league positions. We've overachieved this fact in the last two seasons, but I think this season, our player additions in key position has been poor, leading to the results we're currently experiencing.
I can only offer this as my ( slightly rambling! :P ) ' bigger picture' explanation of our current situation,oh............ans as I walked away after the citeh game, I thought about how far we'd come since Kieth Burkenshaw in 94.
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Well when we signed the players in the transfer list I like other fans were delirious at the signings, But also a slight back of my mind moment thought of the size of the squad and how we effectively have to keep them all happy let alone didn't bring in cover for Yacob/Mulumbu. I feel the run since the start of the year cant be ignored but also I think losing Lukaku's goals is being understated, We created so many chances today and most games of which he would have scored, It's not rocket science either, We are ok defensive wise its just we need a goalscorer like Lukaku who replaced Odemwingie's goals. Our forwards wont get 17 between them let alone one striker.
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Strangely I feel the need to defend him.
Firstly almost any team with the amount of chances we had would of won?
Then many have asked him to make changes early, he did
Taking Ridgwell off ( whilst obvious) was also very brave, he now as a massive call at left back (or go 352)
Get the pen at stoke, don't lose the pen at Chelsea, get the third v villa and that table looks massively different, today we may as well go for it and lose 2-0 as 1-0 , he did and it didn't work, but he tried.
Now is not the right time.
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Strangely I feel the need to defend him.
Firstly almost any team with the amount of chances we had would of won?
Then many have asked him to make changes early, he did
Taking Ridgwell off ( whilst obvious) was also very brave, he now as a massive call at left back (or go 352)
Get the pen at stoke, don't lose the pen at Chelsea, get the third v villa and that table looks massively different, today we may as well go for it and lose 2-0 as 1-0 , he did and it didn't work, but he tried.
Now is not the right time.
I agree mate. +1 for this post
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Strangely I feel the need to defend him.
Firstly almost any team with the amount of chances we had would of won?
Then many have asked him to make changes early, he did
Taking Ridgwell off ( whilst obvious) was also very brave, he now as a massive call at left back (or go 352)
Get the pen at stoke, don't lose the pen at Chelsea, get the third v villa and that table looks massively different, today we may as well go for it and lose 2-0 as 1-0 , he did and it didn't work, but he tried.
Now is not the right time.
I don't know mate. If this game was just a one off I'd hear you. You make excellent points but this game is just one in a long list of poor performances under Clarke. Something is off.
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after watching that today you want dignity ? I want someone who knows what there doing in charge , we are far to slow attacking , keep going backwards , and look lost ! that better
Yes. Calling him names isn't really acceptable to be honest. Especially towards a manager which lead us to our highest place finish in the Premier League whilst for the large part playing some of the best football I've ever seen from an Albion side.
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I like Clarke as a coach but maybe it's the backroom staff where the problem is
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Get the pen at stoke, don't lose the pen at Chelsea, get the third v villa and that table looks massively different, today we may as well go for it and lose 2-0 as 1-0 , he did and it didn't work, but he tried.
Now is not the right time.
I dont want clarke to be sacked yet but one thing thats bugging me is albion fans moaning about these decisions that have gone against us.
Against stoke savo sess had 2 guilt edge chances and missed them,if i remember right we missed another sitter in that game aswell.That penalty call shouldnt have mattered we should of won the game end of.
The chelsea penalty is another,5 minutes before that happened we had a 3 on 1 were brunt went for glory instead of playing either player in 3-1 up game over,the other thing was that clown popov shooting from the half way line with 30 seconds to go instead of keeping the ball,end the game 2-1!
The song "we always get s##t refs" is just cringe worthy.
At the end of the day we dont take our chances regardless of what the refs are doing
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Two big games coming up for Clarke where we need 4-6 points so he needs to start getting things right.
Not many managers would last the record of his last 12 months in charge.
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Strangely I feel the need to defend him.
Firstly almost any team with the amount of chances we had would of won?
Then many have asked him to make changes early, he did
Taking Ridgwell off ( whilst obvious) was also very brave, he now as a massive call at left back (or go 352)
Get the pen at stoke, don't lose the pen at Chelsea, get the third v villa and that table looks massively different, today we may as well go for it and lose 2-0 as 1-0 , he did and it didn't work, but he tried.
Now is not the right time.
I agree with this, whilst not being an impressive victory I'm sure we'd be admiring the fact we won ugly - a hallmark often regarded to the good teams that can win without playing brilliant.
Putting it simply, had we taken our chances and by god we had plenty of them, then we sit here celebrating three points. It's unfortunate that the sloppiness of certain individuals unfortunately comes back to haunt the manager. What is expected of Steve Clarke if Sessegnon can't hit the target from around 12 yards?
I've seen people talking about us being reactive to other teams but in the second we were very proactive. Taking off Liam Ridgewell, bringing on a striker and dropping Chris Brunt to left back - it was an attacking move which would have been applauded had our strikers discovered their shooting boots.
Granted, there are a lot of ifs in this post and whilst our performance wasn't brilliant and showed aspects which need work, we created more than enough chances to win the game, despite our build up and approach play looking very ordinary.
One thing that is for certain is that we're approaching a dogfight and Clarke is in need of results - that being said, there is very little out there in the managerial market to make the change. We were fortunate at the time of RDM's dismissal that Roy Hodgson was sat on his settee looking for work.
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He has 2 games left simple.We need 4 points simple.i was disappointed when we appointed him and i still am.His record in this calender year is relegation.Its only some folk on here that support him.Most other sites and radio phone ins would suggest other. The team line up today was shocking for a home game we should be looking to win. 7 games won in a calender year any coach would be walking the plank.Bye bye Stevie boy and take Keen with you if you dont get at least a draw at Cardiff and win your next home game >:(
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For what it's worth my opinion is Clarke benefitted from Hodgson's organisation for the first third of last season, but since then he has tried to put his own stamp on things and failed miserably. Since November last year our record is abysmal relegation form.
I think a change is needed but the problem is there is no one available
I have posted about the Hodgson factor on numerous occasions last season where Clarke inherrited a well drilled team with good habits. It seemed he rode this going into last season but has struggled when trying to change things over the last year and stamp his own mark on the squad.
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The team line up today was horrific for a home game
What was wrong about the line up?
We played our strongest side possible - the only debating point was whether Long/Berahino started.
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I think Clarke is on the brink of being shown the axe. Palace who looked dire a couple of weeks ago are 2 points behind us. ??? Fulham have a new gaffer and Sunderland are looking better under Poyet. While we are going backwards. We can't pass a ball , we can't defend or we do is play a poor style of football. Teams above us are all winning aswell. Next 2 games are Cardiff away which is a tough place to go and they will have Odemwingie who would just love to score against us, after that we have Hull who have impressed me tbh. I reckon we will struggle to get even 3 points from the next 2. At times I feel Clarke could do with some extra help on the touchline, someone who has been there and done it. Someone like Ray Wilkins. Kevin Keen and Keith Downing don't come across as people who would question the head coach. They are more like yes man. We have decent players on paper and they have proved this last season, Lukaku was a blow but he was mostly on the bench, seems like the players don't know what there doing most of the time. His record since that Swansea away game has been poor and needs to sort it out in the next 2 games otherwise he is gone.
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Or 19 wins in 57 games.
As baggie53 commented later on in this thread, SC inherited RH’s team and it could be argued that the start of last season was a continuation of the previous coaches set up and organisation that players were familiar with and as the season progressed SC wanted to implement his own methods and approaches and with his own players for the current season. The record since last November speaks for itself.
People that know me are aware that I was never happy with his appointment from the very beginning but I like many wanted to give him the benefit of the doubt. My patience with him has run out. His latest excuse after yesterday’s defeat, as I have read, of having too many attacking options is a bit poor if he supposedly has the final say on who we sign.
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As baggie53 commented later on in this thread, SC inherited RH’s team and it could be argued that the start of last season was a continuation of the previous coaches set up and organisation that players were familiar with and as the season progressed SC wanted to implement his own methods and approaches and with his own players for the current season. The record since last November speaks for itself.
People that know me are aware that I was never happy with his appointment from the very beginning but I like many wanted to give him the benefit of the doubt. My patience with him has run out. His latest excuse after yesterday’s defeat, as I have read, of having too many attacking options is a bit poor if he supposedly has the final say on who we sign.
3 games played in a week too he said, hang on how many different footballers on the pitch today.I counted 5
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As baggie53 commented later on in this thread, SC inherited RH’s team and it could be argued that the start of last season was a continuation of the previous coaches set up and organisation that players were familiar with and as the season progressed SC wanted to implement his own methods and approaches and with his own players for the current season. The record since last November speaks for itself.
People that know me are aware that I was never happy with his appointment from the very beginning but I like many wanted to give him the benefit of the doubt. My patience with him has run out. His latest excuse after yesterday’s defeat, as I have read, of having too many attacking options is a bit poor if he supposedly has the final say on who we sign.
The previous coaches set up and organisation that never saw us go on a run like we did at the start of last season. Also Roy loved to switch to his beloved 4-4-2 while during that run we mostly played 4-5-1/4-2-3-1. Clarke deserves praise for that run as much as he deserved a little criticism when we struggled towards the second part of the season which was always going to be inevitable anyway because we didn't have the squad to keep it up all season. We also were basically fighting it out for 8th or 9th while playing teams who were fighting to stay in the division so naturally we'd tail off a bit towards the end.
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To say he got us to 8th last season because he inherited RH's squad is incredibly harsh on Clarke. Our form in 2013 is worrying but it was only a few weeks ago people were asking for his contract to be renewed. We were fortunate last time round that a manager like RH was waiting to come in but this time there isn't. We have been getting unlucky in games and feel our points tally doesn't reflect what we deserve. In my opinion Clarke is still the man to take us further.
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To say he got us to 8th last season because he inherited RH's squad is incredibly harsh on Clarke. Our form in 2013 is worrying but it was only a few weeks ago people were asking for his contract to be renewed. We were fortunate last time round that a manager like RH was waiting to come in but this time there isn't. We have been getting unlucky in games and feel our points tally doesn't reflect what we deserve. In my opinion Clarke is still the man to take us further.
I'd tend to agree.
With regard to the comments earlier in the thread about Roy Hodgson (who I feel did an absolutely fantastic job for us and for whom I have huge respect), let's not forget that we had a spell during the Winter period in his full season with us when we struggled for form, particularly at home, and at one time had a worrying drift towards the lower reaches of the league table.
In addition Roy acknowledged that Albion's status within the mid table region of the Premiership was commendable, taking all the other factors into account.
After saying that, counterbalancing ambition and realism is far from easy and the very nature of being a passionate supporter of the Albion means we'll never get a real consensus of what is or is not acceptable, and I certainly don't want to sound like some apologist, and for me, achieving the often quoted target of 50 points and making a concerted effort in the Cup competitions (ie: none of this fielding weakened squads when we play in the 3rd round in January) is what we should be looking to achieve.
With regard to SC and yesterday, the first half tactics were clearly wrong, but I didn't see any lack of desire, commitment and effort once the tactics were corrected, or evidence of a group of players not giving their all for themselves and their Head coach.
Though I would imagine SC was as frustrated as we were, with the lack of an end product after all of our attacking moves, and clearly we need to address these problems and start picking up points sooner rather than later, but I wouldn't necessarily blame the man standing on the sidelines for the fact that so many of our crosses into the box seemed to land straight into the hands of the Norwich GK or into the hands of the front rows of Albion supporters in the BRE or the fact that the finishing of a number of our players was poor. Those players are capable of more than that and have to take personal responsibility for the fact we lost a match we clearly should have won.
They're paid a fortune so have to take the flak for yesterday and make sure they redeem themselves next week.
After saying all that, nothing in football should ever surprise us and I trust the Chairman and Board of Directors to do what's best for the club, and they've shown how astute they are over the years and deserve out trust, though from my own perspective, I believe SC should be given time to sort things out.
But we clearly need a win and the resultant 3 points desperately.
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Pretty much agree with the last two comments.
Although the current form is frustrating, its also not unexpected. We are a midtable team at best, that means we will be inconsistent, we started the season rubbish, but then drew at Fulham, beat Sunderland and Man United and then drew with Arsenal. At the moment we are on the flipside to that, however i am pretty confident at some point we will have another run of probably 9-12 points from 4-5 games that puts us right back in midtable security, and then another run where we struggle, same as about 10 x other teams in the league.
Pardew at Newcastle is a great example, in October he was supposedly gone, now they are in form and he is god, they will have a slump soon and it goes again.
I think Clarke is doing as well as expected, he does make mistakes, but who doesnt, and also its all about opinions, he is the one who is paid to make them, i bet if we did a poll on here on certain things, we would all have different thoughts.
Personally i think the problems are we have too many players and need to cull those who arent playing and realistically are not going too in the future, and i think we need to look at a settled side where possible instead of 4-5 changes a game, that was our downfall last season. Also the defence is a concern, individually they are playing okay but as a unit its not working, i would like to think the players and coaches are fully aware of this and will be working on it! Again it may be a bit too comfortable for them, Popov had a shocker against Villa, but its not that surprising when players get thrown in for a game then left out for 2 x months, why not say to the likes of Popov, Lugano or Dawson, right you are in the for the next 4 games, build your match practice and form, and if you are playing well you stay in, give them a proper chances as at the moment, the current setup isnt doing what it should!
Last season we won our mini league and finished 8th, after 38 games we were the 8th best team in the league, 2013 has been disappointing but its where you are in May that counts regardless of when or where results come.
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I think this all stems back to the odemwingie saga, since then our form has been shocking.
At the time I felt Clarke delt with it well but the more I hear and the longer it continues the more I feel that Clarke set his stall out with odemwingie and that has fed through to the current squad.
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Time to go im afraid. Our form this year has been dreadful, the stats tell the story and I cant see him lasting much longer. We are now in a relegation scrap and with the squad we have we shouldn't be. Time for a change I think.
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I dreamt last night i woke to the yellow bar on Sky Sports.You all know the rest.
i expect 4 points min from the next 2 games.Like many have said his record in the calender year is shocking and most heads would have rolled by now
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Calendar Year to Date
League Games Played: 33
Points Obtained: 30
Average PPG: 0.90
Relegation Form.
Goodbye Clarke.
If it is relegation form, a) why weren't we relegated or b) why aren't we in the relegation spot?
Conclusion - not relegation form ;-)
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If it is relegation form, a) why weren't we relegated or b) why aren't we in the relegation spot?
Conclusion - not relegation form ;-)
It is, we're just luck it's been spread over two half seasons.
So far.......
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It is, we're just luck it's been spread over two half seasons.
So far.......
So our relegation form doesn't actually extend to this season? (Which is actually the most critical point)
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Whoever signed Nicolas Anelka has no bearing whatsoever on Steve Clarke's position. If anything, all three (Peace, Clarke, Garlick) are culpable if that signing doesn't become a success as it was no doubt sanctioned by Garlick and Peace - no matter how much Clarke wanted him. I don't see why Saturday would be a tipping point for the fans or Peace - granted we would all be annoyed, but to throw around suggestions like he could be reaching tipping point, in my opinion, is laughable and slightly premature. We are in a healthy position and as of yet, we haven't hit the form we are capable of. Given time, that form will turn around and supporters will then be looking towards the other end of the table - such is the nature of football.
As for last season, the final third of the season doesn't do Clarke many favours whatsoever, but I hope the club take note of many factors which contributed towards that - not least the gutless performances from some of our players who knew they had reached their season remit and therefore coasted along.
like i said, its a tipping point a lot of peoples minds are made up about clarke now
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First time posting on this forum but long time reader. So I'll keep it short. He must go. Our form is awful, our team lacks genuine pace and he's tactically clueless.
Oh and Peace can follow him as well, along with Garlick.
Shambles
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First time posting on this forum but long time reader. So I'll keep it short. He must go. Our form is awful, our team lacks genuine pace and he's tactically clueless.
Oh and Peace can follow him as well, along with Garlick.
Shambles
You're entitled to your opinion, but be prepared for a barrage of insults. Just as a heads up.
The Clarke issue is bound to come up sooner or later, but I'm not sure about Peace. Whether we like the fact that we hardly spend any money or not, we are one of the only teams (if not the only team) in the leagues who are not in debt. So financially, we're better off as we won't face fines or points deductions for being insolvent.
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First time posting on this forum but long time reader. So I'll keep it short. He must go. Our form is awful, our team lacks genuine pace and he's tactically clueless.
Oh and Peace can follow him as well, along with Garlick.
Shambles
To be fair to SC, He brought in pace with Sessegnon, Anichebe, Sinclair which we all wanted, Injuries happen and for a dodgy pen decision against Chelsea ot Sessegnons finishing against stoke, Villa, Norwich we wouldnt even be discussing Clarke's position, The manager cant kick the ball in the net for the players, It's what they're paid to do.
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We're just a shambles of a club on a downward spiral. It's farcical.
Why don't we go out and sign someone like Soldado like Spurs did we should be competing with them now.
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We're just a shambles of a club on a downward spiral. It's farcical.
Why don't we go out and sign someone like Soldado like Spurs did we should be competing with them now.
Wages ??
Competing with Spurs ? who did we sell for a world record fee in the last transfer window to allow us to compete with them ?
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Its the first time in years for me that the board in itself cannot take any blame.
The worrying part for me is Clarke still does not seem to know his best eleven or formation well over 12 months into the job.
9 wins in 41 games Im sure I read...not really good enough is it?
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Why is Peace not spending is it because he's pocketing money from the club?
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We spent the most we ever have in the summer.
If you want us to be spending like Tottenham etc. then you obviously dont want to understand about football finances.
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Soldado has looked nothing but a donkey so far. All of his goals except for one have came from penalties!
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Why is Peace not spending is it because he's pocketing money from the club?
Peace, like the rest of the shareholders probably get a percentage of the profits, so the higher the profits, the less the club actually sees as it lines the pockets of those who own it.
However, we apparently made £19m last season from TV alone, we're obviously going to make that again this season, so not sure why we couldn't have spent that on bringing in some quality. Clubs don't appear to make their main money from tickets anymore, which is why the attendances are dropping but they're still making their money.
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Exactly Peace is profiteering from our small club he needs to go as well as Clarke
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We brought in Amalfitano, Sinclair, Anichebe and Sessegnon hardly lacking in quality.
Everton beat us to Lukaku because they were prepared to pay £8 million for someone who no matter how good will not automatically be theres at the end of the loan.
As yourselves this where were the club before Peace came be careful what you wish for.
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Exactly Peace is profiteering from our small club he needs to go as well as Clarke
Unless you have evidence of any profiteering then please keep those comments off this forum.
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I can't be the only one that wants the baldy brothers gone surely
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We've been relatively successful in the last 5-10 years with Peace in charge I have no reason to question him at the moment.
We're on the slide that is for sure. As I've said before Clarke's saving grace is the lack of real replacements.
When Di Matteo went Hodgson was lined up and it worked. There is no one around who I could name who would work.
Saying that Peace is very good at picking his people 'against the grain' so I'm sure he has a plan should Clarke not improve results in the next few weeks.
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If it was up to me i'd say he's got 2 games left.
Now were an established Premier League club I'd expect nothing less than maximum points against 2 sides who have been in this league less than 5 months.
I'm sure the reason for the delay in contract talks is so Peace can see if there is an improvement in results over the christmas period. If not I think Clarke will end up giving Peace no option.
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If it was up to me i'd say he's got 2 games left.
Now were an established Premier League club I'd expect nothing less than maximum points against 2 sides who have been in this league less than 5 months.
I'm sure the reason for the delay in contract talks is so Peace can see if there is an improvement in results over the christmas period. If not I think Clarke will end up giving Peace no option.
Only problem with that is if we leave it 2 games and we lose them both we're in deep trouble
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Why is Peace not spending is it because he's pocketing money from the club?
We spent more than enough in the transfer window for us to maintain a similar position to last season, albeit on deadline day. On the most part everyone was pleased with the Sessegnon and Sinclair signing and this addressed some pace issues you say we still have? To say we should be forking out 20+ million for players like Soldado and be competing with Spurs is moronic. We often find ourselves in patches of brilliant and shocking form and unfortunately things aren't going our way at the moment but at least we are creating chances (20+ yesterday). If there was an experienced manager out there waiting then maybe i'd be more inclined to agree with a change but there simply isnt' and looking for a younger manager in the lower leagues is surely more of a risk that keeping Clarke?
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We spent more than enough in the transfer window for us to maintain a similar position to last season, albeit on deadline day. On the most part everyone was pleased with the Sessegnon and Sinclair signing and this addressed some pace issues you say we still have? To say we should be forking out 20+ million for players like Soldado and be competing with Spurs is moronic. We often find ourselves in patches of brilliant and shocking form and unfortunately things aren't going our way at the moment but at least we are creating chances (20+ yesterday). If there was an experienced manager out there waiting then maybe i'd be more inclined to agree with a change but there simply isnt' and looking for a younger manager in the lower leagues is surely more of a risk that keeping Clarke?
Yeah fair points, but look at Southampton. Found a decent coach from nowhere and now they're flying. We should be looking to emulate them there great
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Lads, stop rising to it, if he is as suspected a wind-up merchant then he won't be here long.
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Lads, stop rising to it, if he is as suspected a wind-up merchant then he won't be here long.
i can assure you I'm not I've travelled the length and bredth of this country to see the baggies and have been a season ticket holder for 17 years I've so met many of our legends including Lee Hughes etc I don't think I deserve the treatment I'm getting ??
Just because I want Clarke and peace out does not mean i'm a 'wind up merchant'! They just need to go they're useless
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i can assure you I'm not I've travelled the length and bredth of this country to see the baggies and have been a season ticket holder for 17 years I've so met many of our legends including Lee Hughes etc I don't think I deserve the treatment I'm getting ??
Just because I want Clarke and peace out does not mean i'm a 'wind up merchant'! They just need to go they're useless
I'm convinced, anyone else :D
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I'm convinced, anyone else :D
convinced of what? Convinced that I want the best for our club? These two are useless. why am I being victimised for having a differing opinion
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convinced of what? Convinced that I want the best for our club? These two are useless. why am I being victimised for having a differing opinion
Where are you being victimised ? Try posting without accusations of corruption, abusing people employed at the club and then we will be convinced.
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Where are you being victimised ? Try posting without accusations of corruption, abusing people employed at the club and then we will be convinced.
victimised for wanting the two jokers out who are taking us down why can no one see it, I haven't accused anyone all I've stated is fact and a lot of that has been deleted I can't be the only one who wants them gone and can see this
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You convinced me mate, you must stefanly be a Baggie
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where have i accused anyone of corruption?????
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So profiteering from the club is not an accusation of corruption given theres no proof ?
Maybe we should just build the new stand so we can see where the money goes and fail to fill it
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peace owns the club if the clubs making profit he's taking what's his how's the accusing him of corrupton
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i can assure you I'm not I've travelled the length and bredth of this country to see the baggies and have been a season ticket holder for 17 years I've so met many of our legends including Lee Hughes etc I don't think I deserve the treatment I'm getting ??
Just because I want Clarke and peace out does not mean i'm a 'wind up merchant'! They just need to go they're useless
This post is the one that's got me convinced. ;D
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victimised for wanting the two jokers out who are taking us down why can no one see it, I haven't accused anyone all I've stated is fact and a lot of that has been deleted I can't be the only one who wants them gone and can see this
I think you're right, lamberk and randy will take you down :D
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So come on back it up with evidence instead of accusations. Books don't show it all going in his pocket.
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I think you're right, lamberk and randy will take you down :D
More orange and black ;)
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So come on back it up with evidence instead of accusations. Books don't show it all going in his pocket.
ok fair enough but im just not happy with what's happening as a whole, can we all agree on that? and why are people still saying i'm on a wind up i'm not I decided to post on here because i can see what's happening and its going to go tits up
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More orange and black ;)
Well in that case let the man speak , surely he knows what is needed to survive, and if not he must next time? :D
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ok fair enough but im just not happy with what's happening as a whole, can we all agree on that? and why are people still saying i'm on a wind up i'm not I decided to post on here because i can see what's happening and its going to go tits up
I'm willing to listen, what say we meet for a pie and a pint?, maybe you have a couple of seats you'd be willing to let me have, I'll bring a carrier bag in case there's any rubbish .
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Troll rating: 0/10
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I think there is more going on behind in the background that we know about.
I've heard the Lukaku story (about him being told that Clarke was on his way and perhaps everton would be a better place for him) too many times from different people to think its made up.
I think he probably knows he's on borrowed time and this maybe carrying onto the pitch?
If he is to go he needs to go soon otherwise we all need to bed down and get on with the season.
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Why is Peace not spending is it because he's pocketing money from the club?
Peace, as chairman of our excellently run club, is entitled to earn money from the club. I am sure that the money that he takes from the club is a lot less than our mickey mouse chairman down the road loses by employing idiots and getting back to back relegations. What is the prize money for getting knocked out in the first round of the FA cup?
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I think there is more going on behind in the background that we know about.
I've heard the Lukaku story (about him being told that Clarke was on his way and perhaps everton would be a better place for him) too many times from different people to think its made up.
I think he probably knows he's on borrowed time and this maybe carrying onto the pitch?
If he is to go he needs to go soon otherwise we all need to bed down and get on with the season.
thats fair
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I fully trust JP in which ever decision he makes, we've had a great 10 years which ever way we look at it!
SC has done a great job, he sent a team out there yesterday that had 20+ shots.
Last season has inflated everyones expectations, survival every year is good enough imo.
Yesterday was one of those days, however, RDM was fired quickly to most peoples surprise so SC may well be on thin ice!
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I think there is more going on behind in the background that we know about.
I've heard the Lukaku story (about him being told that Clarke was on his way and perhaps everton would be a better place for him) too many times from different people to think its made up.
I think he probably knows he's on borrowed time and this maybe carrying onto the pitch?
If he is to go he needs to go soon otherwise we all need to bed down and get on with the season.
Did you also see about 2 weeks ago , Jose challenged lukaku to make the reasons he went to Everton public?, as I've said before if we wanted him that day he was ours but he got some very strange phone calls and the catalogue of events led Everton to pay double what they actually needed to, still his brothers avaliable and he's a bloody good left back.
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Just a few comments I want to make:
Firstly, right at the start of last season, I was wondering how much of our good start was down to Hodgson and how much was down to Clarke. I raised points about how much we were retaining the ball, and the way the defence didn't seem as well drilled, but as we were winning I dropped it and moved on, supporting the team. When Clarke started to put his own stamp on things, the wheels fell off, and we haven't got going again since. The main problems are the same ones we had back then, although now with the addition of strikers that can't score goals.
And yesterday, the team selection was wrong from the start. If, as a manager / coach, you have 20,000 fans slating your selection after the game then that's one thing - hindsight is 20-20 after all. But when those fans can look at your starting line-up an hour before kick-off and tell you you've got it wrong, then you're probably not up to much. Just as with Megson, Mowbray, and Di Matteo, twenty-thousand people can see the problems, but 1 man knows better apparently!
And I don't buy this about the players lack of finishing prowess not being Clarkes fault; he is, after all, the head coach. If they're not good at finishing, then he should be working with them to improve it - chances like Sessegnon's yesterday should just be second nature, he shouldn't miss them.
And finally - saying we could have and should have beat Chelsea and Arsenal but for penalties given or not given is also a fallacy. If Ridgewell clears the ball against Chelsea, Eto'o doesn't score, and the penalty is irrelevant. If Anelka scores either of the 2 clear cut chances he had, we beat Arsenal.
It's not unlucky, it's just not being good enough.
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I'm going to keep my opinion short and sweet, yesterday Clarke made 1 mistake; not starting Saido. The players made tons of mistakes and have done on more than one occasion and are accountable. Clarke doesn't buy the players. I think the players are letting us down.
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I'm going to keep my opinion short and sweet, yesterday Clarke made 1 mistake; not starting Saido. The players made tons of mistakes and have done on more than one occasion and are accountable. Clarke doesn't buy the players. I think the players are letting us down.
agree totally some very bad buys and slot of deadwood at the club which needs to be sorted with Anelka and lugano the first to go I'm afraid to say. This transfer Window could make us or relegate us
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Clarke doesn't buy the players but will have some say in who comes in. No manager/ Head Coach will accept players being brought in without his say so. Head Coach/ Manager identifies a position, board/scouting dept give a list of players that fit the criteria/wage etc and manager/head coach has his say, if he isn't happy then he will say so as why would he say yes to players he doesn't want as his job is on the line.
Weren't Anelka and Sinclair players he specifically wanted ?
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Just a few comments I want to make:
Firstly, right at the start of last season, I was wondering how much of our good start was down to Hodgson and how much was down to Clarke. I raised points about how much we were retaining the ball, and the way the defence didn't seem as well drilled, but as we were winning I dropped it and moved on, supporting the team. When Clarke started to put his own stamp on things, the wheels fell off, and we haven't got going again since. The main problems are the same ones we had back then, although now with the addition of strikers that can't score goals.
And yesterday, the team selection was wrong from the start. If, as a manager / coach, you have 20,000 fans slating your selection after the game then that's one thing - hindsight is 20-20 after all. But when those fans can look at your starting line-up an hour before kick-off and tell you you've got it wrong, then you're probably not up to much. Just as with Megson, Mowbray, and Di Matteo, twenty-thousand people can see the problems, but 1 man knows better apparently!
And I don't buy this about the players lack of finishing prowess not being Clarkes fault; he is, after all, the head coach. If they're not good at finishing, then he should be working with them to improve it - chances like Sessegnon's yesterday should just be second nature, he shouldn't miss them.
And finally - saying we could have and should have beat Chelsea and Arsenal but for penalties given or not given is also a fallacy. If Ridgewell clears the ball against Chelsea, Eto'o doesn't score, and the penalty is irrelevant. If Anelka scores either of the 2 clear cut chances he had, we beat Arsenal.
It's not unlucky, it's just not being good enough.
20,000 people haven't criticised his selection and as he pointed out, the team he started with are capable of beating Norwich. Didn't happen yesterday, that is football.
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I think Clarke can be criticised for team selection or tactics but the individual frailties of the players that he is working with are not down to him. I am pretty sure every coach Sessegon has ever worked with has tried to work on his composure in front of goal and failed.
The issue of player recruitment is muddied because of the role of the Technical Director but the Head Coach does play a critical part in identifying areas for improvement based on how he wants to set up the team. If the Head Coach is not clear about this it does not matter how good or otherwise the recruitment team is we are going to end up with a bit of a muddle.
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As a person i like Clarke , i like how he handles himself in the public eye too so in those respects I'd be sad to see him go if the worst comes to the worst.
Many points have been touched on by others in this thread about how we play , the selections , transfers etc but something that's been bugging me of late is how Clarke seems to be sat silent in the dug out....now I don't expect Megson type ranting but when we have these poor 25 minute spells in each half of late i want to see SC on the touch line talking to the players and trying to lift them. Since SC got the job the amount of times we start slowly at kick off and the start of the second half is starting to really stand out for me , why such dozy spells?
A few months back when we had the poor start i was one of the members on here who asked others to give Clarke time and to try to see what he was trying to build , I'm not calling for his head but i won't be defending him either now for a while. We all know the next two games are massive for him , it's up to SC now.
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As a person i like Clarke , i like how he handles himself in the public eye too so in those respects I'd be sad to see him go if the worst comes to the worst.
Many points have been touched on by others in this thread about how we play , the selections , transfers etc but something that's been bugging me of late is how Clarke seems to be sat silent in the dug out....now I don't expect Megson type ranting but when we have these poor 25 minute spells in each half of late i want to see SC on the touch line talking to the players and trying to lift them. Since SC got the job the amount of times we start slowly at kick off and the start of the second half is starting to really stand out for me , why such dozy spells?
A few months back when we had the poor start i was one of the members on here who asked others to give Clarke time and to try to see what he was trying to build , I'm not calling for his head but i won't be defending him either now for a while. We all know the next two games are massive for him , it's up to SC now.
This passitivty has been present in the team ever since Clarke took charge. The games we have won, especially the noteworthy wins against the stronger teams, we have played up tempo and incisively. But the vast majority of the games we have been strangely lethargic seemingly simply waiting for the ball to bounce our way so we get a break. When we don't get that break we have no other plan...and afterwards Clarke comes out and says we were unlucky and didn't get the breaks... ::)
Another point that concerns me is that Clarke manages to come up with square peg solutions time and time again when he sets up the team.
Two of our victories this season have been against Crystal Palace and Sunderland, two teams that were a complete shambles when we played them. Take those two freebies away and Clarke's record is even more problematic.
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This passitivty has been present in the team ever since Clarke took charge. The games we have won, especially the noteworthy wins against the stronger teams, we have played up tempo and incisively. But the vast majority of the games we have been strangely lethargic seemingly simply waiting for the ball to bounce our way so we get a break. When we don't get that break we have no other plan...and afterwards Clarke comes out and says we were unlucky and didn't get the breaks... ::)
Another point that concerns me is that Clarke manages to come up with square peg solutions time and time again when he sets up the team.
Two of our victories this season have been against Crystal Palace and Sunderland, two teams that were a complete shambles when we played them. Take those two freebies away and Clarke's record is even more problematic.
Scraping the barrel a bit mentioning taking the wins against Sunderland and Palace away - no premier league games are freebies.
As for Clarke complaining about us not getting the breaks...there are several prem managers who would have been complaining about decisions a whole lot more than SC has after certain games.
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Scraping the barrel a bit mentioning taking the wins against Sunderland and Palace away - no premier league games are freebies.
As for Clarke complaining about us not getting the breaks...there are several prem managers who would have been complaining about decisions a whole lot more than SC has after certain games.
In Premier League terms those wins were freebies, it's not everyday you meet teams as demoralized and unorganized as they were. You can close your eyes all you want but the alarm bells are truly ringing now. For a while I thought Clarke had pulled it together with the new signings but now we are back to basic Clarke football again which is not a pretty sight.
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stuck a sneaky £10 on Clarke to be next manager to leave at 40/1 on Friday cause i could see the Norwich defeat coming from a mile away now top priced 20/1 i really can't see anything other than a defeat at Cardiff as well as for Hull their away record is awful so that's set up perfectly for them to come and turn us over :(
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stuck a sneaky £10 on Clarke to be next manager to leave at 40/1 on Friday cause i could see the Norwich defeat coming from a mile away now top priced 20/1 i really can't see anything other than a defeat at Cardiff as well as for Hull their away record is awful so that's set up perfectly for them to come and turn us over :(
Not a bad bet, he must be close along with fat Sam ?
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Not a bad bet, he must be close along with fat Sam ?
http://www.oddschecker.com/football/english/premier-league/next-manager-to-leave-post
Malky Mackay currently favourite, would anyone else take him if he got the sack next ? i reckon he's a decent manager and i'm sure Peace will take note if he's given the sack
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I'd take Mackay any day. He's desperate to leave Cardiff because he has got a p@xk of a chairman who doesn't appreciate him and probably wants to bring in an unknown from Malaysia - just as he did recently with a new head of recruitment who knows nothing about football. Cardiff are experiencing the folly of having a mega rich chairman who is using the club to try and get richer.
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like i said, its a tipping point a lot of peoples minds are made up about clarke now
No they are not.
Why are you making assumptions on behalf of everybody else?
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I'd take Mackay any day. He's desperate to leave Cardiff because he has got a p@xk of a chairman who doesn't appreciate him and probably wants to bring in an unknown from Malaysia - just as he did recently with a new head of recruitment who knows nothing about football. Cardiff are experiencing the folly of having a mega rich chairman who is using the club to try and get richer.
He's repeatedly said he wants to see the Cardiff job through despite some obvious concerns about goings on there.
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He's repeatedly said he wants to see the Cardiff job through despite some obvious concerns about goings on there.
He says he wants to see the job through because he is on a lucrative contract and doesn't want to resign for obvious reasons. It is a fair bet that if the opportunity arose to join another Premiership Club he would jump at it. He was fuming when the chairman appointed a Malaysian painter and decorator to take the recruitment job at the expense of his trusted lieutenant, who has now moved to Palace.
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Whether you want Clarke out or not and whether MacKay wants to leave Cardiff or not the fact is Clarke is still in charge here so discuss other names is a bit disrespectful.
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No they are not.
Why are you making assumptions on behalf of everybody else?
You're doing the same?
For the record I think they are.
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Whether you want Clarke out or not and whether MacKay wants to leave Cardiff or not the fact is Clarke is still in charge here so discuss other names is a bit disrespectful.
Not really. This forum is full of comments from fans who want X and Y player out in the next transfer window and want the Club to sign Z, a player who is probably on a contract with another club. Clarke is no different.
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Whether you want Clarke out or not and whether MacKay wants to leave Cardiff or not the fact is Clarke is still in charge here so discuss other names is a bit disrespectful.
Is a fair point, other than the boys in the boardroom would probably have started talking about his replacement whilst the ink was still dry on his contract?
I think in most normal jobs it would be valid, but footballs far from normal?, besides if we don't give any ideas how are the non league footballers going to know who to bet on?allegedly :D
*fictious opinion stated for the point of debate! not the opinion of westbrom.com nor anyone connected with it, nor Kermit the frog or knightrider *
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Fair comment but players come and ago all the while, thats what the transfer window is for so bit different. As the title of the thread says Steve Clarke then thats what should be discussed in here not future managers. We locked another topic yesterday where someone wanted to discuss names of future managers so would do the same again
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Is a fair point, other than the boys in the boardroom would probably have started talking about his replacement whilst the ink was still dry on his contract?
I think in most normal jobs it would be valid, but footballs far from normal?, besides if we don't give any ideas how are the non league footballers going to now who to bet on?allegedly :D
*fictious opinion stated for the point of debate! not the opinion of westbrom.com nor anyone connected with it, nor Kermit the frog or knightrider *
Apparantely the boardroom are supposed to have names of possible future managers they keep an eye on, apparantely they reckon the Fergie blokes worth a shot at some stage :o
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Apparantely the boardroom are supposed to have names of possible future managers they keep an eye on, apparantely they reckon the Fergie blokes worth a shot at some stage :o
Not till we sign Maresca :D
On a serious note, I know there's opinion for and against on here , it would be interesting to hear what they say in the boardroom and wether any decision (if taken) would be Mr Peace or if they were all asked to put their opinions.
I'm not that well connected but there doesn't seem much disharmony from the players , not saying that should be the be all, but they seem quite comfortable with him?, maybe that's part of the problem.
Anyway I would have got rid in summer, now is not the right time, need 25 points by the end of jan, still very do able, and for anyone that says "do it now so the new bloke can spend in jan" ...well :D
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You're doing the same?
For the record I think they are.
No, I was merely highlighting that my mind hasn't been tipped.
I've seen a few calls for his head but many of what I have seen are people appreciating that we're in a bad run of form and Clarke has to turn it around and they are affording him the time to do that.
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No, I was merely highlighting that my mind hasn't been tipped.
I've seen a few calls for his head but many of what I have seen are people appreciating that we're in a bad run of form and Clarke has to turn it around and they are affording him the time to do that.
To be fair he said lots were against and you 100% disagreed, fact is neither of you know, none of us do.Some have made it clear they want him out, some are happy with him and some have kept quiet.
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No, I was merely highlighting that my mind hasn't been tipped.
I've seen a few calls for his head but many of what I have seen are people appreciating that we're in a bad run of form and Clarke has to turn it around and they are affording him the time to do that.
Not going to labour it but
He said ..many have made their minds up
You said ..no they haven't
= your both talking on behalf of others
I'd also give him time, but I'd like to think Jeremy has had a word and maybe offered to play left back.
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Not going to labour it but
He said ..many have made their minds up
You said ..no they haven't
= your both talking on behalf of others
I'd also give him time, but I'd like to think Jeremy has had a word and maybe offered to play left back.
Fair enough, you're right.
I've just read his post again! :D
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Fair enough, you're right.
I've just read his post again! :D
Jesus , let's get married :D
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Jesus , let's get married :D
You can wear the frock! ;D
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Inspired by Liam and Pattayabaggie theres a poll added which will end before our next game to judge whether lots of fans want Clarke out or not.
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Inspired by Liam and Pattayabaggie theres a poll added which will end before our next game to judge whether lots of fans want Clarke out or not.
2 things
1) I think after the next game may have a massive effect on voting?
2) can you add option, "I would have but wouldn't now cause the timings all wrong so even though I don't think he is the right guy for the job , I think he is the right guy at the moment and would wait till the end of jan "? ;)
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2 things
1) I think after the next game may have a massive effect on voting?
2) can you add option, "I would have but wouldn't now cause the timings all wrong so even though I don't think he is the right guy for the job , I think he is the right guy at the moment and would wait till the end of jan "? ;)
1 - I was going to run again next week to see if opinions had changed
2 - Can we count that as 'undecided' ? :D
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I've put no mostly due to the fact of us being hugely unlucky in respect to referee decisions and individual sitters that have been missed and I count an extra 8 points that we would have had and both of these factors are completely out of Clarke's hands and if those hadn't of happened there would be no complaints about his management at all. Obviously I haven't agreed with everything he has done and he has made a few mistakes, but I still believe and very much hope he can turn it around.
Another factor is if he was to go can't see who he would be replaced with, and I trust Peace and Garlick not to get rid unless there is a good, better replacement.
Ask me maybe 4 weeks time and it could be a different answer, this is a very big month for Clarke.
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1 - I was going to run again next week to see if opinions had changed
2 - Can we count that as 'undecided' ? :D
Thats a good idea to reset over the next few weeks to see how the fans feel to be honest me saying most have made their minds up that was possibly premature but it must be close now, anyway i'll be interested to see what the poll says :)
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I'm undecided, he doesn't learn his lessons, but nobody jumps out at me as a replacement. Also he keeps on picking Shane Long which is making the 2 hours in The Sportsman better than the 2 hours in the ground... ;)
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I put no, not because I'm overly happy at the moment just because I couldn't see us getting anyone better and I still think we'll be fine come May.
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I voted no & its going to take us being in the bottom three for an extended spell before I change my mind, whilst I would love us to be challenging for Europe/Champions league it ain't happening any time soon, sorry to p!zz on many of your parades :'(
I'm a West Brom fan & when I sing it, I actually mean 'I know what we are'.
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Inspired by Liam and Pattayabaggie theres a poll added which will end before our next game to judge whether lots of fans want Clarke out or not.
I'm inspiring you? Brilliant. ;D
As for my vote, no I wouldn't sack him.
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but nobody jumps out at me as a replacement.
That is another concern of mine that there is nobody out there in my opinion with a record like Clarke who I feel could do a better job. The only candidate I had earmarked as a potential replacement has recently been appointed the new Fulham manager so we can kiss goodbye to that option.
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Sack him....are people serious???
Ive had enough of football, ive moved to cornwall and im not renewing my sky sports subscription.
Opinions are like idiots, everyones got one and some are worse than others
The internet has killed football, too many qualified coaches on their soapboxes have ruined the game...
How i wish i could go back to radio phone-ins and the Sports Argus at 6pm.....simple times, good football times.. all thats gone now along with my enthusiasm for the game.
For what its worth he shouldnt even be on thin ice...its ridiculous
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1 - I was going to run again next week to see if opinions had changed
2 - Can we count that as 'undecided' ? :D
Only if it makes your job easier sir.
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Sack him....are people serious???
Ive had enough of football, ive moved to cornwall and im not renewing my sky sports subscription.
Opinions are like idiots, everyones got one and some are worse than others
The internet has killed football, too many qualified coaches on their soapboxes have ruined the game...
How i wish i could go back to radio phone-ins and the Sports Argus at 6pm.....simple times, good football times.. all thats gone now along with my enthusiasm for the game.
For what its worth he shouldnt even be on thin ice...its ridiculous
I'm not in the sack him camp yet but 9 wins in the last 41 is not acceptable , in patches we have been brilliant but by in large we have been rubbish for the past year!
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Lads, can we cut the happy clapper/ doom monger type comments please, makes us sound like dingles
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I am in the "no" camp at the moment. I am not sure how far things need to slide before I get to the point where I change my mind. A few lame performances are almost inevitable and if we sacked the coach every time we lost 3 games on the spin we would be getting through coaches at an almost Chelsea like canter.
If I am honest I was more concerned about him at the start of the season when we were floundering in an awful 4-4-2 which we simply did not have the players for. At least we have started playing to our strengths again despite a new dip in form.
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I like Steve Clarke and I hope he gets through this period of his reign. There has been a lot of good things happen during his time. The start of last season will stick with me for a long time because for that brief moment we looked a real top notch side. We were hard to beat and some of our forward play was brilliant. We looked capable of breaking into that top 6.
Was it Roy's hangover? I don't think so because Roy never had us playing that well.
I'm hoping something clicks and he gets it back because I think hes a good footballing guy who I want to see do well.
I get frustrated with his selections and tactics but he has proved he can do it. Its frustrating because he can get it so right like at Old Trafford and the sub of Berahino and also so wrong like not reacting to Lambert's changes against Villa.
Would I sack him if we lose to Cardiff? No. Do I think Peace will? Yes.
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Would Peace sack him before January?
If he's going to be sacked, I would imagine it will happen in February. It allows Clarke the chance to turn us around, allows us greater time to think of a replacement and saves the hassle of a new man wanting to potentially re-shape the squad in January.
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You convinced me mate, you must stefanly be a Baggie
STIB - I think this might show you we had you sussed :-*
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Would Peace sack him before January?
If he's going to be sacked, I would imagine it will happen in February. It allows Clarke the chance to turn us around, allows us greater time to think of a replacement and saves the hassle of a new man wanting to potentially re-shape the squad in January.
Lose the next two games with two poor performances and i think things may well happen quickly....
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STIB - I think this might show you we had you sussed :-*
Stefan The In Bred, he was that rubbish I thought he was a viler, should of realised it was league 1 mentality.
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Get 4 points from the next two games and I think all will be forgotten, well until we have a bit of a bad run again.
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I picked undecided , I've posted before as a person i like Clarke but as others have posted he doesn't seem to be learning from his mistakes.
I am also concerned how dull some of our performances are this season , frankly the squad need a good old fashioned rattling into a bit more going on some of our performances this season.
Is Clarke too soft with the players at vital times ? , how many times at half time do they come out dozy ?
Overall i hope Clarke turns it around because we have had some damn good performances since he got the job ,
that said i suspect if we lose the next two combined with two poor performances JP may act.
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I picked undecided , I've posted before as a person i like Clarke but as others have posted he doesn't seem to be learning from his mistakes.
I am also concerned how dull some of our performances are this season , frankly the squad need a good old fashioned rattling into a bit more going on some of our performances this season.
Is Clarke too soft with the players at vital times ? , how many times at half time do they come out dozy ?
Overall i hope Clarke turns it around because we have had some damn good performances since he got the job ,
that said i suspect if we lose the next two combined with two poor performances JP may act.
It's not only this season though, I raved and ranted about 'zombie' football last winter. I simply believe this languid aspect of our football is a reflection of Clarke's personal temperament. When we play up tempo and with bite we can be impressive at times but then we have the majority of our performances where we are so slow, stolid, lethargic, predictable, uncreative and unimaginative.
I'm all for building on a solid defensive foundation but that is only part of the overall picture. We have to be able to be incisive in attack as well.
We simply have to have a good game plan for the non-sexy games and not only be up for it against the Chelseas and Arsenals. If Clarke loses his job is because he failed in this aspect.
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For the record I am undecided. I like Clarke in many ways but he doesn't make it easy for himself. He needs to grow quickly and fix aspects of his tactics that do not work and haven't worked from the start.
Clarke needs to learn when to attack and when to be cautious as it is now it's all too samey for whatever the opposition puts in front of him. Sometimes his basic setup works but more often than not it doesn't and that is reflected in the results.
It's like always playing 'rock' 100 times out of 100. What if the opposition plays 'paper'? Oops. That's why Clarke has about a 1/3 record if that.
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I think too many people are missing the point. We are at best a mid table team with the current squad. We aspire to be higher due to recent season successes but the truth is we are going to lose 12-18 games. We lack a decent midfield, our defense is shaky and up front we lack any sort of killer striker. I know some will say play Saido; but will he get us 10+ goals in premier games? I doubt it. The truth is this has been in the making for a few seasons and its finally caught up with us. I don't believe its all SC's doing and lets be honest he has been able to attract players to this club just with his name being mentioned.
We have a squad good enough to stay up but little else. Too many overpaid and overrated players in this team. I do not believe sacking SC will change what's happening for the rest of the season. We need a complete overhaul and we don't have the money. So take a deep breath and accept we have managed to stay up for a few years and given time we may progress into Europe but don't expect anything near that for a good few years.
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Stefan The In Bred, he was that rubbish I thought he was a viler, should of realised it was league 1 mentality.
I thought it stood for Small Town In Birminghan so assumed he was a dingle.
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I think somebody said it earlier in the thread, unless we're batting above our average we'll always be a few losses away from disaster, at the moment it's all ifs and buts, if we get 4/6 points from the next two then he's recovered for now but if we get 0/1 with away trips to Spurs and West Ham on the horizon it doesn't look all too rosy.
I gave Clarke a vote of confidence because the question was as of right now, but if the performances and results continue to deteriorate we have to take the change over of Di Matteo to Hodgson as a case study.
I'd be really sad to see him go and i really hope he turns it around and starts doing what we think is obvious; starting the best players in the favoured positions, starting with Berahino up front saturday, perhaps alongside Anichebe.
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I'm still not convinced either way to be honest. Very much 50/50 on him at the moment but I do agree with some people on here that he did carry on from Hodgson's reign and tinkered here and there which is why we had such a good start to last season. Having said that though he did help bring in Lukaku and without his goals it would have been interesting to see where we would have finished had we not signed him.
In regards to this season we have played some good football under Clarke and for most of it up until the last couple of game looked organised and solid at the back. The main issue for me is goals and converting the chances we have created. E.g as mentioned many times Sessengon has been guilty of missing most of these and this is something we need to improve on in order to move up the table.
But I will be honest I am not totally worried yet I still see potential in the team and it was only a few weeks ago where we played terrifically well against Chelsea and should have won. We also played Man Utd off the park and did win. For me I would give it until after xmas and new year before we make any hasty decisions with Clarke as I am pretty sure Peace will because there is nobody out there at the moment who could do any better anyway in my view.
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Still undecided.The starting line up he went with on Saturday was ludicrous. But if we got the refs decisions against Stoke and Chelsea and had a bit of luck against Norwich, we wouldn't be having this discussion.
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For me his time is up. His record this calendar year is shocking and apart from the win at Old Trafford and the draw against Arsenal we have been very average. In defence of Peace he gave Clarke money to spend and for me we are in a worse situation than we were 12 months ago therefore we are going backwards. The man is very dour and shows as much passion as a cardboard cut out. What is with albion? Ever since Gary Megson we have had such boring managers, I love managers showing passion on the touchline. Clarke hardly moved from the dugout on Saturday, he does not inspire me at all therefore does he inspire the players?? His record this year is shocking and for me its time for a change. Two names i'd like to see get it but i wont name them as its disrespectful.
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As our best performances have been against United (home and away if you count the 5-5 in May), Arsenal at home, Chelsea away, is it fair to say that we only up our game and look motivated against the big boys? I'd argue that in those games players don't need motivated, they will naturally be "up for it". I get the feeling from our general performances that Clarke struggles to motivate the players for games like Norwich (we were terrible at their place at the end of last season as well), Fulham, Palace etc.
As for the poll, I wouldn't sack him yet, but the Hull game could be massive for Clarke. I don't expect much from Cardiff away but we absolutely MUST beat Hull at home. If we don't I think it's time for him and us to move on.
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I've voted undecided, because I just don't know what the right answer is.
It would be harsh, but then the form since this point last year has been awful.
He lead us to 8th, but we were in 4th (while still playing with his predeccesors team) at one point and then fell away.
There are no obvious replacements in the way Roy came in when RDM left, but we can't let that get in the way if Clarke isn't the right man for the job.
It's all ifs, buts, and maybes, but if I'm leaning one way it's get rid.
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ive said previously hes not for me, but now is the wrong time .
however ....I think a cross section on here are showing exactly what is wrong with the team, no disrespect intended but comments like "we have to beat hull" and "we need to get 6 points from the next 2 because the matches after are tougher" indicate how many now think?. you would have to ask is this also how the players think, ie we will beat Norwich therefore don't need to put in 110%?
how many times have our fans said on here that they are not going to XXX away because weve already been there etc, it seems that has we grow so does the apathy?
I think we have a very good squad (baring LB) and expect us to be safe...but so did leeds, forrest etc etc
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ive said previously hes not for me, but now is the wrong time .
however ....I think a cross section on here are showing exactly what is wrong with the team, no disrespect intended but comments like "we have to beat hull" and "we need to get 6 points from the next 2 because the matches after are tougher" indicate how many now think?. you would have to ask is this also how the players think, ie we will beat Norwich therefore don't need to put in 110%?
how many times have our fans said on here that they are not going to XXX away because weve already been there etc, it seems that has we grow so does the apathy?
I think we have a very good squad (baring LB) and expect us to be safe...but so did leeds, forrest etc etc
If that's the case then why isn't the Head Coach motivating the players and getting them up for crucial games?
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If that's the case then why isn't the Head Coach motivating the players and getting them up for crucial games?
good question .
I don't know , but there are a few options
1) do internationals like Yacob, Olsson, anelka really think hes in a position to offer them advice?
2) maybe his technical skills are good, man management not so?
3) perhaps they see certain players getting in even when woeful, some dropped when good (ridgewell/saido)
4) both him and his team are just not good enough?
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I think that the last two seasons have raised expectations way too much. Look how much teams around us are spending compared to us, we dont have a fighting chance really. Southampton, Norwich, Cardiff, Sunderland, Stoke etc. have spent way more than us recently. I think realistically we should be aiming to finish around 16th-10th. Call me pessimistic but I just think thats realistic. Last year we played some brilliant football, we overacheived and had a certain Lukaku, the year before we had Hodgson, unlikely we'll ever see a better manager. Footballs a rollercaoster, totally up and down. Last two years we've been in brilliant form but this cant last forever which football club has constantly played in great form year in year out?
This year I believe we're not playing great football but I dont think were terrible I think that this is our standard.
Look back 10years ago and we all wouldve killed to be in this position. Were a safe, solid, mid table premiership team who might get dragged into a relegation scrap now and again (this year) or might challenge for europe now and again.
We hit the glass ceiling last year.
I think Clarke is doing a great job. Record premiership points, record premiership position. 15 games in this season were 15th 2 wins away from the top half. No need to worry just yet
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Regarding us not spending money, I don't buy it. Look at the wages we've wasted on Anelka, we've spent over £10m in transfer fees alone on Sessegnon and Anichebe. Whether these signings come off in the long term remains to be seen, but for me Clarke has had enough money to spend. I don't think we can ask any more of the board, but I do question Clarke / Garlick's judgement on who we've brought in.
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It has to be time for him to go. The only reason we had a great start to last season is simply it was Hodgson's team. Since then he has tried to put his own style to the team and this has resulted in our downfall. The players do not know what they are supposed to do when they get the ball. The tactics simply are non-existent especially in the first half of games. I think his pre match team talk is we'll see what the opposition are going to do and then we'll react to it at half time.
If we don't do something soon we could be in trouble this year and unfortunately that's a realistic thought and not a pessimistic one.
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But compared to teams that surround us we have spent realtively little. Anichebe was apparently only £3mil too.
Cardiff spent £8mill on an unproven defender, medel was about another £10mill i think. Southampton spent £15mill on a striker that has failed to light p the league and another £12mill on Wanyama, arent stoke one of the highest spenders in the league over recent years too.
I'm not asking us to go out and spend these type of figures I know its unrealstic and I think our tansfer policy on the whole is very successful. I think some of us just have to realise that we cant compete with these teams an mid table is probably as good as it gets.
I also think its harsh to judge Clarke on the transfers as its known that he has actually very little to do with them.
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But compared to teams that surround us we have spent realtively little. Anichebe was apparently only £3mil too.
Cardiff spent £8mill on an unproven defender, medel was about another £10mill i think. Southampton spent £15mill on a striker that has failed to light p the league and another £12mill on Wanyama, arent stoke one of the highest spenders in the league over recent years too.
I'm not asking us to go out and spend these type of figures I know its unrealstic and I think our tansfer policy on the whole is very successful. I think some of us just have to realise that we cant compete with these teams an mid table is probably as good as it gets.
I also think its harsh to judge Clarke on the transfers as its known that he has actually very little to do with them.
What a fantastic point.
Times have moved on, £6m compared to 5 years ago is nothing. That is now the going rate for a contracted-Premier League player. 5 years ago it was £2m-£3m.
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The man is very dour and shows as much passion as a cardboard cut out. What is with albion? Ever since Gary Megson we have had such boring managers, I love managers showing passion on the touchline. Clarke hardly moved from the dugout on Saturday, he does not inspire me at all therefore does he inspire the players??
You should write to Jeremy Peace asking that a requirement for the next head coach should be a raving lunatic.
I really don't get the argument about passion on the touch line. If players and fans need to be inspired by someone jumping about on the touchline then I almost feel sorry for them - it says more about them than the coach.
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As our best performances have been against United (home and away if you count the 5-5 in May), Arsenal at home, Chelsea away, is it fair to say that we only up our game and look motivated against the big boys? I'd argue that in those games players don't need motivated, they will naturally be "up for it". I get the feeling from our general performances that Clarke struggles to motivate the players for games like Norwich (we were terrible at their place at the end of last season as well), Fulham, Palace etc.
As for the poll, I wouldn't sack him yet, but the Hull game could be massive for Clarke. I don't expect much from Cardiff away but we absolutely MUST beat Hull at home. If we don't I think it's time for him and us to move on.
The likes of Southampton (last season), Sunderland (home this season/away last year), Wigan away last season, Stoke away this season could be used as examples of where Clarke has managed to motivate his sides for games against the weaker sides in the division.
Although I do agree with you, naturally, sides like ourselves will raise our game when we face the big boys.
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The only reason we had a great start to last season is simply it was Hodgson's team. Since then he has tried to put his own style to the team and this has resulted in our downfall.
Do you really believe that?
At times last season we were playing exciting, fast moving football, something we very rarely witnessed under Roy Hodgson.
Furthermore, we had a very impressive home record in the early stages of the season something which Hodgson couldn't manage in his final season with us.
If Clarke can recapture the football from the early stages of last season then I'm sure we will all be happy.
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It has to be time for him to go. The only reason we had a great start to last season is simply it was Hodgson's team. Since then he has tried to put his own style to the team and this has resulted in our downfall.
That is a very very lazy argument. As others have mentioned, the start of last season we were playing a completely different style of football at times than we were under Hodgson and our home form was very good so I can't see at all how it carried on from him.
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That is a very very lazy argument. As others have mentioned, the start of last season we were playing a completely different style of football at times than we were under Hodgson and our home form was very good so I can't see at all how it carried on from him.
What we were playing when we were doing well wasn't a million miles away from Hodgson's football, it's just a perception because people expected one style of football from Roy and another from Clarke. But the main point was that we were still in the good habits from Roy; we still had the defensive organisation, and were doing the simple things well. Even if the style had become more attacking, and the players were playing with more freedom, they were still doing the basics right - something they have struggled to do over the last 12 months.
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Also, the players were bursting with confidence, and you could even say pride, at the start of last season. Can Clarke reinvigorate that? Can he get them to dig deep to stay up? I'd say it's 50/50 right now given Palace's reboot.
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Personally I don’t see much different to last season from the outfield players the problem is last season we had a goal scorer West brom shots to conversion rate this season is is one of the lowest in the league
This from sky Sports Stats
With no Chelsea strikers currently at Stamford Bridge making the list, it is up to Lukaku, on loan at Everton, to fly the flag for the Blues of both Merseyside and west London. His shot conversion rate (SCR) of 35.71% is the best of the league's top strikers and is undoubtedly helped by the fact that the 20-year-old Belgian tests the goalkeeper with almost three quarters of his efforts on goal.
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The irony is that having just looked at the league table we are top scorers in the bottom half of the table and our goal difference isn't too bad despite going through a recent run of conceding at least two a game. If Sessegnon had his scoring boots on we would be in a very comfortable position now but we have drawn too many games so far, its all about the fine margins. We have had very little luck when it comes to refereeing decisions and not getting the results we should have seems to have left the squad a little low on confidence at the moment but even that is a flimsy excuse.
I have no doubt that we should be doing better in the league with the squad of players we have and the manager has to take his fair share of responsibility for it but some players just aren't performing to the standard we have come to expect from them. Then we have the fact that most of our summer signings have missed out large chunks of the season due to injury and haven't had chance to have much of an impact with the likes of Sinclair and Vydra with both potentially having a big role to play in the second half of the season.
The next two games are massive, if we can come away from Cardiff avoiding defeat and get win against Hull I'm sure things will be looking much better but if we don't manage 4 points out of those then Clarke is on very thin ice.
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No. I think we'll have a decent second half to the season and finish between 10th-12th. For me I'd like us to do well in the FA Cup and maybe we'll have a reversal of last season. A better second half to the season then the first.
No doubt in my mind Clarke is the right man for Albion.
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If what I've read in the sun this morning is true Peace has more or less hung Clarke out to dry by saying there will be no money in Jan and that Clarke had got good enough players in his squad to keep us up.
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If what I've read in the sun this morning is true Peace has more or less hung Clarke out to dry by saying there will be no money in Jan and that Clarke had got good enough players in his squad to keep us up.
He's not been hung out to dry, if he fails to keep us up with this squad then he simply isn't good enough at his job providing we have no major injuries to influential players. We have a budget for the entire season, we always use ours in the summer as the prices are generally inflated in January and we already have a bigger squad than Peace wants.
If we do have funds available in January we certainly wouldn't be advertising that fact, look at West Ham where they keep saying they will have the funds to sign a striker in January but everyone knows how desperate they are so some club is going to hold them to ransom in the transfer window but we don't deal like they do. Lets remember that with our budget we struggled to get the players in we needed in the summer before the last day or two and that is supposed to be the easier time to get value for transfers.
Most of our summer signings haven't even had much of a chance to shine yet due to injury. Sinclair has been missing and he was already playing catchup after missing most of the previous season, Vydra came in and instantly did a hamstring so he is only just getting into the squad and getting a few minutes on the pitch, Anichebe has been in and out due to injury, Amalfitano has been playing on with a knee injury and Anelka has had his issues mentally following the death of a close friend and then missed games through injury.
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He's not been hung out to dry, if he fails to keep us up with this squad then he simply isn't good enough at his job providing we have no major injuries to influential players. We have a budget for the entire season, we always use ours in the summer as the prices are generally inflated in January and we already have a bigger squad than Peace wants.
If we do have funds available in January we certainly wouldn't be advertising that fact, look at West Ham where they keep saying they will have the funds to sign a striker in January but everyone knows how desperate they are so some club is going to hold them to ransom in the transfer window but we don't deal like they do. Lets remember that with our budget we struggled to get the players in we needed in the summer before the last day or two and that is supposed to be the easier time to get value for transfers.
Most of our summer signings haven't even had much of a chance to shine yet due to injury. Sinclair has been missing and he was already playing catchup after missing most of the previous season, Vydra came in and instantly did a hamstring so he is only just getting into the squad and getting a few minutes on the pitch, Anichebe has been in and out due to injury, Amalfitano has been playing on with a knee injury and Anelka has had his issues mentally following the death of a close friend and then missed games through injury.
very true ...
foster
reid dawson lugano garmston
gera Morrison dorrans Sinclair
anelka vydra
all capable , all not really been involved thus far ?
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There's a real lack of quality managers (not surprisingly I guess) out of work at the moment. No one jumps out. Jol would have been the obvious candidate but the last few months at Fulham have damaged his reputation. Others are Glenn Hoddle and Neil Warnock.
Our ex managers of Mowbray, Di Matteo, Robson and Megson are all out of work but none would be welcome back.
Of Championship managers Steve McLaren would be my choice but he has just signed a 2 1/2 year deal and unless he has a release clause will cost a bit to get him out of Derby where he has started off really well. Shaun Dyche has done a superb job at Burnley could he be tempted?
When we sacked Di Matteo he was in a similar position to Clarke - seemingly unable to turn around results. But at the time Hodgson was available which is why we made the change IMO.
Like I sid earlier in the post. There's no one I can think of who jumps out at the moment.
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I wouldn't sack Clarke, Few reasons are because there is no standout manager out there that springs to mind and would be a success like Roy did few seasons ago, And it wasn't Clarke who dived for the pen against Chelsea, Wasn't Clarke who didn't give the pen against stoke, Wasn't Clarke who had 27 shots against Norwich and couldn't score, The only thing I have against him is the squadsize and I feel he struggles to keep them all happy let alone his first 11. We have a good set of players but a little weak when Mulumbu is missing in the centre. Next 2 games could yield 6 points and all is well again, But no points really would test the patience of the chairman and fans.
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There's a real lack of quality managers (not surprisingly I guess) out of work at the moment. No one jumps out. Jol would have been the obvious candidate but the last few months at Fulham have damaged his reputation. Others are Glenn Hoddle and Neil Warnock.
Our ex managers of Mowbray, Di Matteo, Robson and Megson are all out of work but none would be welcome back.
Of Championship managers Steve McLaren would be my choice but he has just signed a 2 1/2 year deal and unless he has a release clause will cost a bit to get him out of Derby where he has started off really well. Shaun Dyche has done a superb job at Burnley could he be tempted?
When we sacked Di Matteo he was in a similar position to Clarke - seemingly unable to turn around results. But at the time Hodgson was available which is why we made the change IMO.
Like I sid earlier in the post. There's no one I can think of who jumps out at the moment.
Rangnick, guillit, vialli, souness , jol
im not saying id take any but they are available , maybe rijkard as well?, and you can bet the club have already got quite a strong list together?
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Rangnick, guillit, vialli, souness , jol
im not saying id take any but they are available , maybe rijkard as well?, and you can bet the club have already got quite a strong list together?
Playing devils advocate z&b! :P
Rangnick:- snubbed us before, so he can go forth.
Gullit:- talks the talk but would probably look at West Brom as a stepping stone back into the Premier & be off the second a better offer came up.
Vialli:- Loved him as a player & has done reasonably well as a manager/coach but do we really want to keep having ex Chelsea cast offs.
Souness:- Never in a month of Sundays, Dinosaur of mammoth proportions, makes me cringe every time I see/hear him on TV.
Jol:- I think as someone else has said, he's damaged goods & I wouldn't want someone trying to rebuild their reputation & failing, at our expense.
Here's my 18pence worth.
I've got a name no one else has really mentioned, he's worked with some top managers & coached top quality players, commands respect from those he works with, knows the Premier League inside out, can attract players of a quality that West Brom have not been able to before, unfortunately he is not perfect & is prone to the odd mistake, on the flip side he makes tactical changes that can win games at the biggest clubs in the Country, he is also one of these guys who relies heavily on his players to be able to do the relatively simply tasks that they are paid for & to his eternal credit he expects Referees to make the correct decisions, especially those big ones that have a major bearing on the result of the game & subsequently his future.
So why don't we give...................... Steve Clarke a go? ;D
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Either a tactical brain or a new job is all he wants for Christmas
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Time is up I think. We are going down if these performances continue. Shame because he's a good guy but we are clueless and he seems incapable of turning this woeful form around.
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Last time we were in free-fall, JP acted. Saved our season. Time for him to do the same now.
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Not used to Albion being this awful... Feel like Megson is in charge again. 7 league wins in a year he has to go in my opinion.
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People can blame Clarke all they want, but he was let down massively in the Summer. It was a key window where we either built on last season or moved backwards - we did the latter.
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Time is up I think. We are going down if these performances continue. Shame because he's a good guy but we are clueless and he seems incapable of turning this woeful form around.
need a new manager before the transfer window,
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I think that's his lot , I'd wouldn't be surprised if he isn't in charge next week.
Same old same old game plan , 1. Sit deep for 70 mins
2. Hoof it (not only to Long either)
3. Constantly lose the ball
4. At best we are drawing on 70 mins
5. Decide to finally attack
6 .Bring on subs far too late
7. More than likely lose or draw if we are lucky.
As a person i like Steve , I've sat and watched today hoping he will finally let our lot have a go against a struggling Cardiff side.....but once again we stick to the same boring old game plan.It's just not good enough , sorry Steve.
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Last time we were in free-fall, JP acted. Saved our season. Time for him to do the same now.
i hope this is the case even if there isnt an obvious candidate...
hes lost dressing room
selections are awful, hes subs are worse and usually to late.
plays out of form players when we have the biggest squad in our modern history to choose from
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People can blame Clarke all they want, but he was let down massively in the Summer. It was a key window where we either built on last season or moved backwards - we did the latter.
perhaps was let down last summer but our decline started last december... after the hodgson wave wore ooff
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I think that's his lot , I'd wouldn't be surprised if he isn't in charge next week.
Same old same old game plan , 1. Sit deep for 70 mins
2. Hoof it (not only to Long either)
3. Constantly lose the ball
4. At best we are drawing on 70 mins
5. Decide to finally attack
6 .Bring on subs far too late
7. More than likely lose or draw if we are lucky.
As a person i like Steve , I've sat and watched today hoping he will finally let our lot have a go against a struggling Cardiff side.....but once again we stick to the same boring old game plan.It's just not good enough , sorry Steve.
Sadly, I agree with all of that. A good and very decent man, but its simply not working.
Might be gone before Hull next weekend, but if he stays and we get 3 points does that really change anything?
Not many good candidates around to replace him though.
I'd go for Glenn Hoddle before the Hammers go for him. Am really struggling to think of anybody better.
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who could do any worse at this moment in time. his continual selections of the same midfield baffles me when for me yacob,brunt and of late sess and morgan have been woeful. gotta go now.
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Enough is enough. Steve Clarke - I'm afraid you are hapless, clueless and beleaguered.
Your tactics and team selections defy belief. You go out to contain fellow relegation candidates in Norwich and Cardiff (we played for a 0-0 today). Yet we go and attack the better sides like Man U and Chelsea as we have nothing to lose!
You constantly pick players not good enough (Ridgewell, Brunt, Morrison etc). There are so many questions to be asked:
1) Gera gains fitness, has sub appearances, then disappears why?
2) Sinclair regains match fitness then doesn't start why?
3) Why Brunt and Ridgewell when they're consistently our worst players?
4) Why no Berahino when Arsenal and Chelsea are interested as he's that good?
5) Why sign Anelka if he's not going to feature?
6) Why hasn't Vydra had a chance (we all know he's better than Blunt)?
7) Where's your passion on the touchline?
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Time to go IMO. We've been very poor for a long time now - results wise and peformance wise. He's set us up in a way where we just can't keep the ball. Our possession stats must be absolutely shocking this season.
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Why hasn't he played Rosenberg? When he played all pre season and looked good alongside Anelka. If your not playing him at all why is he still here.
Vydra should be playing ahead of Chris Brunt. Why didn't we go in for another full back in the summer, Liam Ridgewell will have good games but isn't consistent enough.
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Perhaps questions also need to be asked of back-room team?
Either way, short, sharp shock to the system is needed. Manager with passion for the club and its heritage. Somebody the fans can relate too.
Not saying its a long term option, but could see no worse than bringing in McInnes w/ Big Dave.
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A Sunday Pub Team Manager would do. Even they would have the sense not to pick Ridgewell and Brunt (the worst left side in the premier and champ).
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Surprised and frustrated that he used the same team selection with last game,I think the game against Hull would be his last chance.
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Ironic that Koren and Davies could finally see him off. Those 2 would walk in our side at present, not sure about McShane though!
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I still think despite four months in that Clarke doesn't know his best team. It annoys me so much why he persists with Ridgewell and Brunt. Brunt was a first teamer last season i don't see that this season as I think we have better options than him now.
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Football is a simple game but Clarke makes it mind-blowingly difficult.
I think we have far too many players and plenty of mediocre ones at that. But, it's now mid December and he doesn't appear to know strongest 11, despite the fact he's with the players everyday.
I think favouritism has taken root as there's no logic to constantly picking players inferior and out-of-form.
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Surprised and frustrated that he used the same team selection with last game,I think the game against Hull would be his last chance.
Was it the same??
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No Passion
No Urgency
No Freedom to express themselves
Playing with Fear
We are hurtling towards relegation unless something changes before its too late.
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The main problem with Steve Clarke is that he does not set out the team to win from the start, we were awful first half today and he doesn't change it until we go a goal down. Far too negative.
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Was it the same??
He starts Olsson and Long today,but it's just because Olsson suspension was over and Anichebe was injuried.I don't think it's enough to win a game.
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He'll be sacked, And i dont think many could argue if he does go, 2013 our results have been that of relegation, He was backed in the summer albeit final day, He also got to keep the players already there, So at some point thats going to be unsettling too the squad as we have quantity over quality, He doesnt know his best 11, He sticks with players out of form, Makes changes too late and doesnt seem to read how a game is going and only reacts when we are losing. His lack of management is showing now and i would get a new man in before a home game as i cant see us getting anything against West Ham/Tottenham after the Hull game.
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that's if for me clear your desk Clarke , we have lost it he picks the team and sets them out and its awful , we are heading into the bottom 3 . we need a new man with fresh ideas NOW
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Jeremy Peace would do well to heed the first verse but I'd like to dedicate this poem to Steve Clarke.
If you can keep your head when all about you
Are losing theirs and blaming it on you,
If you can trust yourself when all men doubt you,
But make allowance for their doubting too;
If you can wait and not be tired by waiting,
Or being lied about, don't deal in lies,
Or being hated, don't give way to hating,
And yet don't look too good, nor talk too wise:
If you can dream - and not make dreams your master;
If you can think - and not make thoughts your aim;
If you can meet with Triumph and Disaster
And treat those two impostors just the same;
If you can bear to hear the truth you've spoken
Twisted by knaves to make a trap for fools,
Or watch the things you gave your life to broken,
And stoop and build 'em up with worn out tools:
If you can make one heap of all your winnings
And risk it on one turn of pitch-and-toss,
And lose, and start again at your beginnings
And never breathe a word about your loss;
If you can force your heart and nerve and sinew
To serve your turn long after they are gone,
And so hold on when there is nothing in you
Except the Will which says to them: 'Hold on!'
If you can talk with crowds and keep your virtue,
Or walk with kings - nor lose the common touch,
If neither foes nor loving friends can hurt you,
If all men count with you, but none too much;
If you can fill the unforgiving minute
With sixty seconds' worth of distance run -
Yours is the Earth and everything that's in it,
And - which is more - you'll be a Man my son!
Rudyard Kipling
Be careful what you wish for folks :-X
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He'll be sacked, And i dont think many could argue if he does go, 2013 our results have been that of relegation, He was backed in the summer albeit final day, He also got to keep the players already there, So at some point thats going to be unsettling too the squad as we have quantity over quality, He doesnt know his best 11, He sticks with players out of form, Makes changes too late and doesnt seem to read how a game is going and only reacts when we are losing. His lack of management is showing now and i would get a new man in before a home game as i cant see us getting anything against West Ham/Tottenham after the Hull game.
That is it,he must be gone before Christmas,he was NEVER the manager for us....but who is there.
Why do we find ourselvs asking this again
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Here's the thing about Clarke , I'd simply love it if he turned it around and we played how we know we can ...i really like him as a bloke but how much longer will he get ?
His post match comments were awful too , "need to work harder , need a bit of magic"
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He has brought this on himself with his negative oh god we must not loose team selections. On your bike Steve . You have more than over stayed your welcome
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I went for a long, fast and horrible run and cleared my thoughts for the first 10 mins then thought about Albion for the rest of it. I really really wanted Clarke to work and WBA to have a long-term first team coach who could progress with the club.
I'm in two minds: get somebody in before next Saturday and hope we get that new manager syndrome and make sure we get a vital 3 points and don't get another toothless performance and hope we can get something from the city at Christmas time.
Or
One last chance. And hope Clarke is brave with his starting 11, sets the team out to win and if it doesn't go to plan he reacts well to it.
A new man will want backing in jan, we spend nothing in jan, doesn't sound like a great proposition for a new manager.
It's a dilemma and I'm glad I'm not the man making the decision
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On paper this team should have more than enough to stay up, Clarke is making us look like a team who has just been promoted. Poor style of play, poor tactics and subs and he can't seem to turn it around. Time to go I reckon.
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Jeremy Peace would do well to heed the first verse but I'd like to dedicate this poem to Steve Clarke.
If you can keep your head when all about you
Are losing theirs and blaming it on you,
If you can trust yourself when all men doubt you,
But make allowance for their doubting too;
If you can wait and not be tired by waiting,
Or being lied about, don't deal in lies,
Or being hated, don't give way to hating,
And yet don't look too good, nor talk too wise:
If you can dream - and not make dreams your master;
If you can think - and not make thoughts your aim;
If you can meet with Triumph and Disaster
And treat those two impostors just the same;
If you can bear to hear the truth you've spoken
Twisted by knaves to make a trap for fools,
Or watch the things you gave your life to broken,
And stoop and build 'em up with worn out tools:
If you can make one heap of all your winnings
And risk it on one turn of pitch-and-toss,
And lose, and start again at your beginnings
And never breathe a word about your loss;
If you can force your heart and nerve and sinew
To serve your turn long after they are gone,
And so hold on when there is nothing in you
Except the Will which says to them: 'Hold on!'
If you can talk with crowds and keep your virtue,
Or walk with kings - nor lose the common touch,
If neither foes nor loving friends can hurt you,
If all men count with you, but none too much;
If you can fill the unforgiving minute
With sixty seconds' worth of distance run -
Yours is the Earth and everything that's in it,
And - which is more - you'll be a Man my son!
Rudyard Kipling
Be careful what you wish for folks :-X
An increasingly lonely voice... Clarke is taking us down.
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Just go's to show how vital those Odemwingie/Lukaku goals were in they're relative seasons as this run of form might have happened way sooner.
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An increasingly lonely voice... Clarke is taking us down.
Thanks for that sentiment ::) but I've said before the time to panic is when we're in the bottom three (please don't state the obvious ::) ), never followed the herd & very rarely agree with the populist view.
Steve Clarke won't be allowed to take us down, JP would see to that, so bit of a daft quip.
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Lots calling for his head but no realistic successors being mentioned. A sacking for sackings sack leads nowhere. My own feelings are a side that wins at OT draws with Arsenal and Chelsea cant be all bad. To get rid of now with hectic xmas schedule due is tantamount to suicide time to take stock ad make decision is 5pm new years day
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I dont know what to really think at the moment about Clarke, i dont want us to sack him as part of me feel he deserves a chance to keep it going, however results came he finished 8th last season and if the season finished now we would be in the premier league. Also i think clubs like us who chop and change managers reguarly eventually it catches up with them, i like the idea of continuity and stability.
However if i heard Clarke had been sacked i wouldnt be that disappointed either! I just feel that this group of players should be performing better, we have won 1 in 10 games and although been unlucky at times, that stat isnt good enough. Its not just down to Clarke, a lot of those players have been in the comfort zone since last January and need to have a look at themselves as for most of them, this is the highest they will play at so they should making the best of it, i think they have had more than enough time and chances and so if i was him i would look at making major changes and shake things up.
My concern for Clarke is that we dont go at teams, i think its a trait he learnt under Mourinho when he was over here first time, Chelsea used to coast for the first 60 minutes, then last half hour, make subs and go for it, sadly they had a far better group of players than us and were able to do it! We are a defend and then counter attacking team and i dont think that will change, however lately we have forgot the attacking bit (2nd Half vs Norwich the exception) we just defend and as we arent great defensively it catches up with us. By all means have men behind the ball but start counter attacking from the start of the game, not in fits and spirts, it would madness to go all out attack as we would be picked off but in games against Villa, Newcastle, Norwich and Cardiff, we should be at least matching them and having a go, yet since 2nd half against Villa we have been limited.
Teams in a rut who setup to defend usually only go one way and thats down, also i was concerned about Clarke after match interview, he sounded like a beaten man, what he says to players is different to media i have no doubt, but he look as though he had give up and was out of ideas a bit which is a worry.
As i say i hope he turns it round, if i was JP i would have a word Monday when things have calmed down and say we have Hull, Spurs, West Ham and Newcastle, we need to be looking at 7 x points from those 4 x games, with the players we have thats a feasible target (not easy but feasible) if we dont get 7 x points then things may have to change.
I would be looking at giving some players the chance to prove themselves now too - Dawson (GMac and Olsson dont seem to do much wrong but we concede for fun so something has to change) i would also look to give the likes of Vdrya / Sinclair and Berainho the chance now, they havent played much so unleash them. I have said in another post, i would also try Brunt at left back, Ridgewell is maybe a scapegoat for some, again i dont think he is that bad but i think something has to change in the defence, if not Brunt then give Popov a proper run, dont judge on the Villa game, all players have a mare but give him a go.
My team for next game would be -
Myhill
Jones Dawson Olsson Brunt
(Slow defence but the one we have now isnt quick)
Mulumbu (Defensive Midfield)
Sinclair (RM) Alfie (CM - hass played there CM before) Sessegnon (LM)
Vdrya (AM)
Anichebe (CF)
If we are going to play counter attacking that team has skill, stamina, pace and flair, midfield isnt the strongest physically but they can all play football and it may encourage us to pass and move with the back 4 and Mulumbu behind them doing the dirty work.
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Everyone is saying play the "Albion way" exciting attacking football and going at the opposition. All we see is a negative, containing starting line-up and trying to hold relegation candidates 0-0.
The following players would all enhance our current starting 11, yet they rarely get a chance:
Popov, Sinclair, Gera, Berahino, Vydra. And you can put forward a case for Anelka and Lugano.
The likes of Brunt, Morrison, Ridgewell, Reid etc will not move us forward. They've had their chance and not taken it.
I believe Clarke is now so bad, that you could take any manager from league 2 and he would be better.
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Thanks for that sentiment ::) but I've said before the time to panic is when we're in the bottom three (please don't state the obvious ::) ), never followed the herd & very rarely agree with the populist view.
Steve Clarke won't be allowed to take us down, JP would see to that, so bit of a daft quip.
It's very cute to quote Kipling's poem, but 9 wins in 41 games is a very very poor return. What makes you think that form is going to change?
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I want Clarke to succeed and I would like to be able to construct an argument to support don't ask me to chose luv's sentiments but I am struggling. My concern is that we are starting to hit a downward spiral which we last saw at the end of Di Matteo's tenure.
We have to arrest the decline how many games that Clarke has left is debatable, a win however scruffy would change the landscape but another couple of defeats and his number will be up. I would not sack a Head Coach for the sake of it and whoever we bring in has to be able to make an immediate impact and as other posters have said there is a dearth of obvious replacements.
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Of course form can change its already gone from average to good to bad this season!!!
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Unless he is going to be sacked on Monday, his whole approach for the next 4 games at least has to be to set us to "go for it". That's when we are at our best. That is our strength. We are not capable of playing the way that he is setting us up at present.
There is absolutely nothing to lose by "going for it". The downside is nil because we will get nothing the way we are playing at present. I'd rather lose 4-2 by going for it than lose 1-0 having set out for a draw.
I agree with some posters that sacking a manager for the sake of it is a mug's game. I am genuinely worried about the calibre of alternatives. Other than Hoddle, Vialli, Solksjaer, Jol, who else would be better than Clarke? Southgate worth a shout? I'm not bothered about the Vile rubbish re Southgate or Dingles nonsense re Hoddle. We need the right man wherever he's been in the past.
Bear in mind of course that several managers won't consider working as a head coach under a Director of Football structure. Don't under-estimate the importance of that. Its why Southgate might be a decent shout.
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Clarke out, Hoddle in.
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Clarke is now so bad in the job that I'd take Ian Dowie, Chris Kamara or Barry Fry! Even Gary Megson.
We have the best squad for 30 years and Clarke manages us like this!
If we had a poor squad then you could defend Clarke (as we had when we entered the premiership). It's embarrassing really.
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What worries me is that when Alfie, Seas, and Victor first came in they really made a positive impact. Over the last few weeks their performance levels have dropped considerably.
Could it be that we are coaching their good habits and natural footballing instincts out of them?
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It's very cute to quote Kipling's poem Thanks that's very kind of you to say, but 9 wins in 41 games is a very very poor return. What makes you think that form is going to change? 4 weeks ago not many would of predicted the recent form, I didn't jump up & down & exclaim we were a top 6 team after we beat MU, drew with Arsenal & Chelsea, I not going to wallow & whinge because we've had 4 defeats now.
If anyone would like to come up with a name of a head coach that with come in & GUARANTEE we win every game playing fantastic football I'm all ears
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What worries me is that when Alfie, Seas, and Victor first came in they really made a positive impact. Over the last few weeks their performance levels have dropped considerably.
Could it be that we are coaching their good habits and natural footballing instincts out of them?
My thoughts as well. But the team selection is not working either?
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My thoughts as well. But the team selection is not working either?
We have to look at the coaches and ask what are you doing that seems to have knocked the life out of our players.
Clarke has to go along with his coaching team.
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The thing that gets me is that people are saying we didn't back him in the summer? But he was the guy who decided to waste money on victor, sign a luxury player in sessagnon, a striker who doesn't want to be here and a winger who can't play more than 2 games without getting injured again.
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I'm sorry but today is the day for me where he has to go. If he stays and proves me wrong i'll willingly hold my hands up and say i'm wrong to want him out but enough is enough for me after that today.
I don't need to suggest names as thats not my decision and whatever I say has no bearing on it but if I had to then I would mention Sean Dyche who I think did an excellent job at Watford before he went to Burnely where he again is doing an excellent job or Ole Gunnar Solksjaer but as I said not my decision but please no Jol, Hoddle, Dowie, Holloway etc etc
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The thing I'm struggling with is how we can do so well, and use the right tactics, against the likes of Man U, Chelsea and Arsenal, and yet seem utterly clueless against the lesser sides. Getting results against top teams should be giving us confidence to go out and put the lesser teams on the back foot, but we do the opposite and just sit back. It's like the players are playing in shackles at present and you have to point the finger at Clarke for that.
Another alarming point for me is recalling how badly we faded away last season, with the poor run starting at the end of November. We look like we're doing exactly the same again, only having accumulated far less points than we had done at the same stage last season. Olsson and McAuley became jaded last season as they were playing every game, but when they're fit and not suspended they're playing every game again. It will catch up with them sooner or later just the same as last season.
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Everyone is saying play the "Albion way" exciting attacking football and going at the opposition. All we see is a negative, containing starting line-up and trying to hold relegation candidates 0-0.
The following players would all enhance our current starting 11, yet they rarely get a chance:
Popov, Sinclair, Gera, Berahino, Vydra. And you can put forward a case for Anelka and Lugano.
The likes of Brunt, Morrison, Ridgewell, Reid etc will not move us forward. They've had their chance and not taken it.
I believe Clarke is now so bad, that you could take any manager from league 2 and he would be better.
I disagree with this comment.
Popov for me is not good enough, makes too many mistakes.
Sinclair, Gera and Vydra have all been injured so to say they they rarely get a chance is farcical. Berahino is still young, he won't and shouldn't play every week for me.
Anelka and Lugano? Very experienced. Are you saying that you would drop Jonas or Macca for Lugano?
Anelk had played quite a few games (Barring injuries and bereavement) and although has a good footballing brain, has not been all that.
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I think I'd rather go for someone with experience in the Premier League. We are heading in the wrong direction. To turn this around is going to be quite a task. The players have lost confidence and we need someone to come in and command the respect of the players straight away.
For those reasons I wouldn't go for Dyche or Solksjaer at this moment in time. I'm open to the prospect of Hoddle but I dont think he'd work in a head coach role unless it was short term and with a hefty bonus should he keep us up.
My choice would be McLaren. I think he's perfect for our setup. Would he leave Derby where he has them flying and leave for a struggling Premier League team? Maybe not.
Wouldn't surprise me if we brought someone in from abroad but thats also risky. Somethings got to change though because we are going down if Clarke stays.
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I'm sorry but today is the day for me where he has to go. If he stays and proves me wrong i'll willingly hold my hands up and say i'm wrong to want him out but enough is enough for me after that today.
I don't need to suggest names as thats not my decision and whatever I say has no bearing on it but if I had to then I would mention Sean Dyche who I think did an excellent job at Watford before he went to Burnely where he again is doing an excellent job or Ole Gunnar Solksjaer but as I said not my decision but please no Jol, Hoddle, Dowie, Holloway etc etc
Agree with that.
I think today was the last straw in my view. Overall he's been a good manager, but he's lost the plot. This season he was great against Chelsea, Arsenal and Man Utd. The other results (Sunderland and Palace) were against very poor sides, so that's 3 good performances which isn't enough.
I assume Peace is ready to give him the boot, it's sad but the time has come. My only concern would be his replacement.
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http://www.wba.co.uk/news/article/clarke-relieved-of-duties-1236295.aspx
Judging by his interview it looked like it was happening soon.
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So the inevitable has happened, Clarke has been relieved of his duties along with Keen.
So now, who do we get to replace him? Hopefully the board will take their time and think carefully, before appointing someone to take over. I would hate for us to rush and end up with any old geezer.
Definitely no: Holloway, Warnock, Di Canio.
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Disgusted :-[ I'll leave you all to it, see you tomorrow.
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Gone. Ruthless by Peace but the time had come... Imagine this won't go down well with national media but hey ho... ::)
Thanks for the 12 games at the start of last season Steve.
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Seems a bit panicky. Hate to see i'm massively disappointed.
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Neither saddened or surprised. This has been long coming. Whatever way you look at it, 7 wins in 34 is not good enough.
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If you see an iceberg in front of you, turning early is a shrewd move, carrying on the same course tends to have a poor outcome.
JP decisive again.
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No surprise at all I'm afraid, not sure why some are disappointed.
It would have been great for Clarke to turn it round but since the Swansea debacle last December we have been woeful, and even the most ardent Clarke supporter would struggle to argue against sacking him.
No idea who should be appointed but a change was inevitable.
I dare say the national media will be shocked and stunned, after all he did guide us to 8th and beat Man U at old Trafford, however seven wins in 34 matches says it all.
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Sad that it hasn't worked out, but inevitable after our recent poor form. The team selection was wrong too often, the substitutions too late when things weren't working out too often, and worst of all, the team don't seem motivated or cohesive or bothered (I except Jones and Mulumbu from this criticism). To me he seemed too weak to make hard decisions when they were/are needed.
Would be over the moon with one manager with zilch managerial experience and that is Gary Neville. Would be almost as happy with Solskjaer. I think either of them would motivate/inspire, and they both would command respect, and imo both will become very good managers.
Whoever we appoint, I really hope it is not Hoddle, Jol, or any of the other old dinosaurs. Actually, when I think about it, there is quite a long list of who I wouldn't want and quite a short list of who I would.
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Well 2013 is bad for results, It is a result based industry so some of us called it earlier. Players also should take responsibility but a fresh voice and new ideas is probably what they need. Just please don't go the Mike Phelan route JP.
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Nine wins in the last 41 league games .... how did he manage to hold onto his job for so long?
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I see Roberto di Matteo is 2-1 favourite with the bookies to return to the club. I hope the bookies have got it wrong. I'd prefer to see someone like Malky Mackay of Cardiff, one of the brightest young managers in the Premiership. He would jump at the chance; perhaps he was already tapped up this afternoon!
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Di matteo bookies favourite
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Di Mateo was awful. Peace knows that.
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Gutted for him really. A very likeable bloke who lead us to our highest Premier League finish.
Should have been given next week and then assessed the situation.
A special mention to our gutless players who have helped getting him sacked. I hope they're proud.
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do some forget Robbie was taking us down that's why he was put on gardening leave , correct move by jp we was sinking and fast
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Gutted for him really. A very likeable bloke who lead us to our highest Premier League finish.
Should have been given next week and then assessed the situation.
A special mention to our gutless players who have helped getting him sacked. I hope they're proud.
Feel the same as when Di Matteo went, well gutted but it was right :-(
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I think its a very poor decision really, granted the form has been bad and getting worse. But i'm looking at the candidates and i'm not seeing anyone who's appealing at all. I can't help this decision would never have been made with a proper football man in Ashworth at the helm. Last time we made a rash mid-season sacking that drew criticism, we had one of the best coaches in the country ready to step in within one week. This time who is there? Ian Holloway? It's a very uninspiring list of names.
Still, as with RDM, it should be judged on who we replace him with. Though I have my concerns on that. Something needs to happen quickly, we absolutely cannot go into these Christmas games without a manager.
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Gutted for him really. A very likeable bloke who lead us to our highest Premier League finish.
Should have been given next week and then assessed the situation.
A special mention to our gutless players who have helped getting him sacked. I hope they're proud.
Agreed, the players are the ones who deserve sacking.
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I could see this coming if we had lost against Hull but I am taken aback as to how quickly JP has acted.
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Gutted for him really. A very likeable bloke who lead us to our highest Premier League finish.
Should have been given next week and then assessed the situation.
A special mention to our gutless players who have helped getting him sacked. I hope they're proud.
Why should he have? Even if we had beaten Hull to me there is no tangible difference between 7 wins in 34 matches than 8 wins in 35. It's important to remember the decision has been made over 12 months not 4 weeks.
As to the players... He picked them.
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Thank you Albion. Should have happened last season.
Writing has been on the wall for a while given overall inconsistent performances and poor individual performances.
Someone mentioned Sven Gorran Eriksson - please no!
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I still haven't heard of a suitable alternative.
We're going to be relying on a rookie - or certainly short on PL experience to try and turn what is currently a sinking ship.
I can't believe we've acted so quickly.
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The guy had to go his position was untenable. His team selections were absolutely appalling. I think any league manager would be capable of performing better. I mean the respect from the players was so poor that Ridgewell could be seen laughing and joking with Whittingham after the final whistle. Imagine that happening with someone like SAF? It proves that sadly Clarke was pretty spineless. Ridgewell and Brunt starting oh dear oh dear oh dear.
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I see Roberto di Matteo is 2-1 favourite with the bookies to return to the club. I hope the bookies have got it wrong. I'd prefer to see someone like Malky Mackay of Cardiff, one of the brightest young managers in the Premiership. He would jump at the chance; perhaps he was already tapped up this afternoon!
after hearing about clarkes sacking i sent a text to a load of mates saying i would love malky mackay!!
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Why should he have? Even if we had beaten Hull to me there is no tangible difference between 7 wins in 34 matches than 8 wins in 35. It's important to remember the decision has been made over 12 months not 4 weeks.
As to the players... He picked them.
I would liked to have seen our reaction to the last couple of defeats. If next week had been a disappointment then I would agree that it was perhaps the right decision to make, however, with a winnable home game next week, I would certainly have allowed the Clarke another week to try and show some signs of our form turning around, allowing the club to re-asses potential new targets.
As for the players, who else was there to pick? Clarke cannot be blamed for some of our terrible finishing and shoddy defending which has seen us chuck points away.
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I think what we overlook is that we are at best a mid table team and we will not be buying anyone in January unless we sell some dead wood. I could list a lot of that but who's going to want them. I think we've fallen into a cycle that we may be stuck in. We have had some good young managers but we do not have a strong enough squad to really progress more than we have already. It'll be a difficult time for whoever takes over with the current group of players and right now I'm not getting a good feeling come May next year.
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for me i actually do feel sad as I really did like Clarke but at the same time I am looking at realistically and 9 in 1 or 7 in 34 it enough to say unfortunately its the right decision but my main concern is who is the next person to sit in the hot sit, there is no-one really who appeals to me, especially if you want someone with prem experience, lets hope our planning is as good as ever so we don't become laughing stock like the guys down the road
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Just seen a tweet from Saido Berahino.
He's not happy with the decision. He describes it as "******* shi*t"
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I would liked to have seen our reaction to the last couple of defeats. If next week had been a disappointment then I would agree that it was perhaps the right decision to make, however, with a winnable home game next week, I would certainly have allowed the Clarke another week to try and show some signs of our form turning around, allowing the club to re-asses potential new targets.
As for the players, who else was there to pick? Clarke cannot be blamed for some of our terrible finishing and shoddy defending which has seen us chuck points away.
If you aren't scoring change the strikers... Yet Rosenberg has not kicked a ball in anger for weeks, neither Vydra or Berahino have played more than a handful as minutes as centre forward. If you're conceding goals change the defenders and stick to it, give them a run in the side, yet no appearance for Dawson, only one each for Lugano and Popov. You reap what you sow, Clarke is not proactive enough, and he abandoned his pre-season philosophy before the first game of the season then moaned his squad was too thin and then failed to use it correctly when it was bolstered.
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The incoming Albion manager will have some fine players at his disposal, and ones that won at Man U, and almost beat Chelsea and Arsenal.
Unfortunately for us fans Clarke decided to utilise 2nd rate players that should have been discarded some time ago and the architects of the
Man U win were sidelined such as Berahino and Sinclair.
Lets hope the new Boss has the foresight to strip out the has-beens and hangers-on in January. Let's get this squad size down to a proper size of 24
and not 30. Then the quality players left can build some cohesion and understanding!
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I would liked to have seen our reaction to the last couple of defeats. If next week had been a disappointment then I would agree that it was perhaps the right decision to make, however, with a winnable home game next week, I would certainly have allowed the Clarke another week to try and show some signs of our form turning around, allowing the club to re-asses potential new targets.
As for the players, who else was there to pick? Clarke cannot be blamed for some of our terrible finishing and shoddy defending which has seen us chuck points away.
We had a winnable home game last week, a winnable away game today and got no points from either, not good enough with this squad of players. Next week would have been the wrong timing with 3 games in close succession (2 of which away). The club claim they scout potential new managers all the while so if they are true in that then why wait ?
He cannot be blamed for poor finishing ? maybe not but is it something thats being worked on as its been poor for a while.
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I said it wouldn't work from the off. At best he is a number 2. He has had far to long,he should have gone at the end of last season.Make sure we get it right this time Mr Peace
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Just seen a tweet from Saido Berahino.
He's not happy with the decision. He describes it as "******* shi*t"
Maybe he should be having a word with his colleagues who have served up some rightproper sh*t in the last 12 months, then his coach might not have been sacked in the first place !!
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Just seen a tweet from Saido Berahino.
He's not happy with the decision. He describes it as "******* shi*t"
i think this young man wants to keep is thoughts to himself and stay off twitter.not advisable to upset jp.
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I'm surprised people are surprised. A good guy that was out of his depth. 7 wins this calendar year. 4 wins in 26 is it? Whichever way you look at it he showed no signs in turning it around.
And I'm getting fed up with Berahino's attitude on twitter. Someone needs to shut him up. He is an employee of West Bromwich Albion Football Club and shouldn't be broadcasting views like that. He may well be disappointed. No doubt quite a few players are too but to put that on twitter deserves a nice week or two fine.
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Just woke up here and although not surprised by his sacking I thought JP may have waited until the Hull outcome.
What has puzzled me is why so many people on this forum, both in threads and poll, still supported SC with his appalling win game ratio since last December.
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i think this young man wants to keep is thoughts to himself and stay off twitter.not advisable to upset jp.
Fine him for his outburst and move on.
I quite like his attitude and that he's proving he has a spine. Clarke has done a lot for him over the last 12 months or so. He's understandably disappointed. I do wonder how the others are feeling...
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I said to my old fella last week after the Norwich game that I have had the intensity of supporting Albion knocked out of me in the last 12 months. I have witnessed some turgid performances, home and away, and am now at the point of when we give a goal away and / or lose, I'm like "hey ho" !! which I never used to be, I'd be drunk off for weeks but not any more. A combination of poor managerial decisions and poor performances by players have led to this...........and in a roundabout way to Clarkes sacking. JP is a fan and I imagine he's had the same feelings I and quite a few others have experienced. Seems to me like complacency has set in with players only up for the big games when they are "in the window" and less than motivated for the "bread and butter" games. The players and the coach are equally responsible for the predicament we now find ourselves in but as usual its the manager/coach who pays the price !!!
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How long can we keep going down this road of appointing this type of manager then sacking them 18 months later , not saying this is a bad decision lets hope we can find the right one this tine ,by the way hope a certain person at radio WM is happy Mr Franks
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Fine him for his outburst and move on.
I quite like his attitude and that he's proving he has a spine. Clarke has done a lot for him over the last 12 months or so. He's understandably disappointed. I do wonder how the others are feeling...
not knocking him just dont want him going down the odemwingie path and saying to much.
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Shearer really hasn't got a clue, The stat was on the screen showing results for SC over 2013 and he was still saying it was harsh. Great forward Alan but my god he really is thick. As for Saido it's the internet of todays world, Say something and its heard and his right to have an opinion but what he said is basically against the chairmans decision which in any line of work questioning your boss could get you in trouble, Ironically not long after singing a new deal.
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Just mentioned Beriniho outburst on match of the day. Shearer said sacking is harsh.someone said watch out for the media bashing now
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i think this young man wants to keep is thoughts to himself and stay off twitter.not advisable to upset jp.
. Didn't think devoted Christians used such language double standards or what ? Mind you he is on 15k a week now so thinks he can say what he wants
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Saido has comically attempted to retract the tweet, mustn't want to lose a week of that new contract! ;D
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The timing of this sacking is right IMO there was no sign of Clarke turning things around and we couldn't continue on the slipper slope.
Rangnick, Solskjaer, Koeman, Hoddle, Vialli - someone like that would do me. Definite no's - Di Matteo, Curbishley, Jol, Keane, Bruce, Di Caneo, Pearce, Holloway, we'd have no chance with any of them.
Berahino is a young kid he has little experience of the world. He thinks he knows it all but he doesn't. He needs someone to take him under their wing and make sure he follows the correct path. I fear this isn't happening at the moment.
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its a long shot, a very long shot, but Marcelo Bielsa anyone? would be a brilliant signing
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Talksport.albion callers a plenty right now.Lee crying
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its a long shot, a very long shot, but Marcelo Bielsa anyone? would be a brilliant signing
Never heard of him PIE, seriously. Who is he, whats his record etc etc ? I'm interested mate !
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A bit disappointed as the positive spin on Clarke is he was in charge of our highest ever premiership finish, the downside, our 2013 record is awful!
I think the national media response is annoying, and fans of other clubs, saying we are a disgrace, never had it so good, how can we sack a manager after the Man Utd, Arsenal and Chelsea results, the fact remains, whoever you beat, you still only get 3 points for a win and 1 for a draw and other results havent been good enough, people think its a knee jerk reaction but the club statement clearly states its based on 2013 results and on that basis, a years results, its not that harsh a sacking.
I think the feel good factor has gone from the club lately, expectation has risen and performances and results have dropped so there is only one conclusion. I think whoever comes in needs to get the fans excited again, we didnt have that buzz with Clarke when he was appointed although he did a good job in the end.
I liked Clarke and think his achievement outweighs the negative, he seemed a decent genuine bloke too but similar to Di Matteo, maybe it was time to move on and he will probably be a better manager for it too. Not sure if it had any impact but a credible journalist said things havent been right since the summer as Clarke 'privately' enquired about the Everton job but it got back to Albion, hence the last few months been non committal in the way of contracts, transfers, etc. Again have no idea if is true but the guy who said it is normally quite credible and has no reason to stir up things at Albion.
Ultimately this squad should be doing better than it is, however with our better calibre of signings comes a bigger ego and that is an additional management skill which i am sure Clarke had to learn about!
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I do get the feeling Clarke wants to be a manager in the true sense of the word. We were just a stepping stone, a foot in the door. We really shouldn't be feeling sorry for him or ourselves. The club is bigger than any one man. Onwards and Upwards.
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Never heard of him PIE, seriously. Who is he, whats his record etc etc ? I'm interested mate !
Bilbao
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Some of the names I'm seeing mentioned on here really do scare me!
And why oh why are people mentioning ex-albion managers? We've moved on, never go back. Onwards and upwards...
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its a long shot, a very long shot, but Marcelo Bielsa anyone? would be a brilliant signing
He was another I suggested in the ground today. I remember watching his Chile side - they were a joy to watch.
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Never heard of him PIE, seriously. Who is he, whats his record etc etc ? I'm interested mate !
Hes getting on abit now, 59, but could possibly want a crack at managing in the Prem (the only way I see him coming)
Basically he is the guy who invented the way a lot of top teams are playing at the moment, (barcelona included - Alll about the pressure when off the ball) a lot of managers say they take inspiration from him, Pochettino and Guardiola are huge fans of him. read somewhere a while ago that Guardiola called him 'the best analytical manager in the world''
he has managed Argentina and Chile, along with a couple of Argentinian teams where he won cups/leagues and most recently, Athletico Bilbao in spain, he took them to the Copa del Rey final and the UEFA cup final in 11/12.
grabbed this from wiki: "Athletic Bilbao's striker Fernando Llorente said in an interview "At first he seems tough and he may even annoy you with his persistence and don't-take-no-for-an-answer resilience, but in the end he is a genius." Barcelona's Pep Guardiola called him the "best manager in the world" in 2012."
so yeah, very much a long shot but would be ace
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I do have a certain amount of sympathy for Steve Clarke on reflection some of our Senior Players are now on their fourth coach and the inconsistencies in their performances have seen us relegated once and cost two coaches their jobs, even Hodgson was unable to coax a consistent level performance out of them. Whoever the new coach is the plan should be to stabilise over the second half of the season and then break up the current squad.
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I quite liked Clarke but his time was up. the continual selection of underperforming players while others not given a chance to prevent our slide was poor. I think jp will have someone lined up and hopefully give us the kick up the backside a new manager gives like what as happened to sunderland and palace.
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Wanted Clarke gone a long time ago (I'm sure i've said this in many posts this year) so happy now it has happened. Like people have said, annoying that media and fans of other clubs are saying it is wrong. Try watching a year of what we've had and say that it's harsh. Aim for this season now has just to be to stay up surely and then push on again next season. I feel like all the good names that have been brandished could be out our league, maybe Ragnick is a possibility now? At the game today, it was evident to see that whoever comes in needs to get a left back and a striker in January, or at least give berahino/vydra a run in the team
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It's incredible how this has divided opinion like it has. Basically non-albion fans are saying 'we are crazy, hope we go down, all that nonsense etc' versus us who believe he had not produced the results. Although an ardent baggies fan i believe we have not had good luck this season, but then again we are scrappy and wasteful, and new blood is probably what is needed. We are probably going to have to look in Europe however, like most of us are saying...
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It's incredible how this has divided opinion like it has. Basically non-albion fans are saying 'we are crazy, hope we go down, all that nonsense etc' versus us who believe he had not produced the results. Although an ardent baggies fan i believe we have not had good luck this season, but then again we are scrappy and wasteful, and new blood is probably what is needed. We are probably going to have to look in Europe however, like most of us are saying...
Problem is non Albion fans and the London media see headlines about poor decisions and thats it, they don't see beyond that, they ignore the poor run in 2013 of 31 points from 34 games. Its not a quick rushed decision, its one based on a long spell.
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This is absolutely the correct decision and the fact JP and the Board have acted swiftly and decisively again gives me a lot of confidence in how the club is being run. This isn't a knee jerk reaction, JP assesses the situation every 10 - 12 games and when you look at Clarke's record in 2013 it simply isn't good enough, in fact it's relegation material.
The cracks were already appearing this summer when Clarke started publicly criticising our transfer policy and lack of activity. SC has the chance to address the Board regularly, it isn't helpful to anyone to go public with these things when we're all meant to be on the same team. In any event, we broke our transfer record twice on deadline day and now have a squad that's capable of beating anyone on their day as has been proven. However, and despite the sensational win at United, SC continued to tinker with the team and formations when it wasn't necessary. As a result, we lost the momentum we had built. Furthermore, some of his substitutions or lack of them has been bewildering in recent weeks.
SC is a nice guy and I'm sure will go back to being a very successful number 2. He's not a natural leader though and this decision is spot on. The timing of it also gives us more than a fair chance to get out of this downward spiral before we find ourselves in the bottom 3.
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The general media will always see the sacking as harsh, but they'll only have seen the headline results. They'll gave watched (the highlights if) us beat Man Utd and almost beat Chelsea,but won't have watched us struggle against teams we've clearly been superior to.
The squad are good enough to challenge the best that the premier league can throw at us, but they've been drained of confidence and the head coach hasn't been able to boost them. The team hasn't been changed when players have under performed despite having a much bigger squad than we've ever had available. Too many basic mistakes have been made than should be simple for coaches to identify, every opposition side have attacked our left back's side as they know it's a free cross.
I don't doubt that Clarke is good at working in a coaching team, just don't think he was ever capable of dealing with the pressure of a hectic premier league schedule. He rarely made effective tactical substitutions except when he was forced to (eg. Man Utd away) and seemed too happy to try to avoid conceding,even when we were already behind.
I honestly believe our squad is the best we've had in decades, so I hope we can find the right man to lead us forward.
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Personally i think something has happened behind the scenes....
Shocker unless there is something we don't know..
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I feel a bit sorry for Clarke as he was unlucky with the Lukaku situation, some refereeing decisions etc., and I would have given him until the New Year. However, he made some poor team selection decisions (Berahino not starting), and he was slightly too cautious.
Anyway the deed has been done, and it is vital we get the right man in. Think its important we get a manager who believes in an attractive footballing style, i.e. not hoof/percentage football, but able to get results. Anyway that is the style, I understand, which is being taught through the Academy.
Alot of dross is out there amongst the names being mentioned (McGregor, Holloway, Lennon). Sigh of relief that it won't be Tony Pulis! As I said in another thread, Ronald Koeman, would be my choice. Plays good football, mentally tough and has good experience. Hoddle maybe, but not sure about his management. I liked Di Matteo's football, but it would be too awkward for JP.
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Sorry to see him go and even more sorry to see him lose his way over the last 12 months , really felt there was a good manager in there. I have to say he has had some rotten luck while with us regarding refs and a few players behaviour but we could all see this coming. That said three or four of our players want to take a good look at themselves in the mirror over this.Nice genuine bloke so i wish him good luck in the future.
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A special mention to our gutless players who have helped getting him sacked. I hope they're proud.
I've not finished reading the thread but can i just say this comment is 100% bang on. They need to take a long hard look at themselves.
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It's incredible how this has divided opinion like it has. Basically non-albion fans are saying 'we are crazy, hope we go down, all that nonsense etc' versus us who believe he had not produced the results. Although an ardent baggies fan i believe we have not had good luck this season, but then again we are scrappy and wasteful, and new blood is probably what is needed. We are probably going to have to look in Europe however, like most of us are saying...
I said the same about Southampton last season for sacking Adkins, look where they are now.
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I said the same about Southampton last season for sacking Adkins, look where they are now.
roughly where we were last season under Clarke???
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roughly where we were last season under Clarke???
The first third of last season*
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Just had a read of the oatcake.you can most probably guess what they have to say
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The first third of last season*
exactly what I meant - same stage last season
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The first third of last season*
Aren't we just turning into the second third? and they have only picked up two points in the last 5 games. Seems eerily similar to me...
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Problem is non Albion fans and the London media see headlines about poor decisions and thats it, they don't see beyond that, they ignore the poor run in 2013 of 31 points from 34 games. Its not a quick rushed decision, its one based on a long spell.
Absolutely. These people don't run or follow the club to understand why he had to go. Reading reactions on Sky for example proves that.
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intrigued by the club statement that 'This Club's track record proves we do not take such decisions lightly, having only enforced a change in this position three times in approximately 14 years'
Little
Megson
Robson (ish? mutual consent hardly in my books means we were pleading with him to stay!)
DiMatteo
Clarke
all since 2000??
Spin it however we like we are about to enter 2014 with our fifth permanent manager since January 2009 five years ago!
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I don't think any of us fans who have followed the club closely can be shocked by this decision. Clarke has been very weak for a whole year now. He has had a long time to turn things around but there has been no sign of improvement rather the opposite, the slide has continued, weak predictable performances have become the norm not the exception and most of that is down to decisions made by Clarke himself.
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Thanks Steve for your efforts. Think the Liverpool win was one of the best day trips had over at the Hawthorns.
Wasn't calling for his sacking but did feel after yesterday's performance and result the tipping point had probably arrived.
Started season very poorly. New signings seemed to add impetus for around two months but since second half of Villa we have been poor, out thought, outplayed and too easily bullied in mid-field.
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Very mixed feelings about Clarke getting the sack. His time here was broken into two spells that great run that we had until December last year and 2013 it has been a very poor run and I'm not too surprised that he has been given the sack. Some of his tactics, selections and subs have been very poor.
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I actually feel a bit sick in the stomach waking up to this news. I wanted Clarke gone but I'm shocked at how ruthless JP has been. It's such fine margins in this league. Take away away the last minute penalty decision at Chelsea, the Sessegnon sitters/mulumbu non penalty against Stoke and various other misfortunes we've had this season and we could quite easily be sitting here on 20 points.
However, we've been very poor for a long time and there have been fundamental problems in the way he's had us playing for the last 12 months. Personally, I'd go for Martin Jol. He had a poor time at Fulham but he's got a quality CV, plays good attacking football and would fit into our type of structure.
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OK don't crucify me but I'm going to throw a name out there...Nigel Pearson.
Has a 42% win rate at all clubs combined. Knows our system and could get a response from the players.
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OK don't crucify me but I'm going to throw a name out there...Nigel Pearson.
Has a 42% win rate at all clubs combined. Knows our system and could get a response from the players.
I believe that he and JP don't exchange Christmas cards. Know what I mean? ;)
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Thank God Jeremy Peace was never president of the USA, we'd all of been nuked by now, such is his haste to press the PANIC button, we needed a calm figure at the helm, instead we got 'Jittery Jeremy The Self Preservationist', I've supported his running of the club for years (even when he's been getting dogs on here) but what a club of our size needs is stability & continuity not new coaches/managers every 18 months, you're only ever a couple of knee jerk reactions away from League 1 Mr Peace, just ask Bilbo & Frodo down the road, I sincerely hope this decision doesn't come back to bite us on bum.
As for the media & other fans criticism's, well, I agree with them! this has made us look mickey mouse & shown us in a very poor light nationally (not that I'm bothered about what others think of us).
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Thank God Jeremy Peace was never president of the USA, we'd all of been nuked by now, such is his haste to press the PANIC button, we needed a calm figure at the helm, instead we got 'Jittery Jeremy The Self Preservationist', I've supported his running of the club for years (even when he's been getting dogs on here) but what a club of our size needs is stability & continuity not new coaches/managers every 18 months, you're only ever a couple of knee jerk reactions away from League 1 Mr Peace, just ask Bilbo & Frodo down the road, I sincerely hope this decision doesn't come back to bite us on bum.
As for the media & other fans criticism's, well, I agree with them! this has made us look mickey mouse & shown us in a very poor light nationally (not that I'm bothered about what others think of us).
I'm not really sure how its "knee jerk". 38 points from 41 games is relegation form. If we got relegated under Clarke this season I presume no one, anywhere would question his sacking, so why exactly does it suddenly become knee jerk just because those games are spread across two seasons?
I liked Clarke and feel he probably would have kept us up. But I don't really see anything knee jerk about this. We've had some dreadful luck this season - but you can't blame luck alone for having less points than games over a 41 game period. That's over 2/3 of his time here in relegation form.
The only real reason there's any outcry is because when we have done well in this time frame, its happened to be very visible in the media - wins at Man U, Liverpool, should have been at Chelsea, and got lots of attention. The terrible moments - the 4-0 loss to Norwich, the abject games against Swansea, Norwich, Cardiff, Southampton this year on the other hand have all gone under the radar in the wider public. Frankly given we generally played well against the big sides, it suggests to me our players attitude isn't the greatest.
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Name calling (Jittery Jeremy) is easy and cheap. Peace has to make the call, and maybe he'll be wrong but at least he has the balls to do it.
If Clarke had been half so bold with his decision making we may not be in this position.
Starting last week against Norwich without a goal scorer was ridiculous, constantly bringing on players with ten minutes or less left is a waste of time, publicly criticising the club about its transfer policy is suicidal.
Like most Albion fans I've watched our displays since we threw away a two goal lead at Reading with dismay. We were dismal for most of the second half of last season, and a couple of performances apart we've been dismal this season too. Our performances lately, twenty minutes against Villa apart, have had relegation written all over them, and Clarke has looked like a bloke who had run out of ideas.
He clearly had no idea of his best side, or even his favourite formation.
I admired how he dealt with Odemwingie, and also Anelka's "retirement" but those issues apart this year has been a car crash for him.
Good luck to him in the future. From some of his comments along the lines of wanting to be a proper manager at some point, and about being at a bigger club, I believe he only ever saw Albion as a stepping stone. That being said, here you go Steve, it's your opportunity to take that step.
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The Villa game was the start of it really for Steve Clarke, he has to make subs after they did he left it too long and we payed the price fro dropping two points, if we had won that game then I believe that Clarke would very much still be in charge today, and I don't think that we would have lost four games on the spin.
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If those defending Clarke are happy with 7 wins in 12 months and 3 so far this season despite breaking the transfer record twice then more fool them.
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I'm not really sure how its "knee jerk". 38 points from 41 games is relegation form. If we got relegated under Clarke this season I presume no one, anywhere would question his sacking, so why exactly does it suddenly become knee jerk just because those games are spread across two seasons?
I liked Clarke and feel he probably would have kept us up. But I don't really see anything knee jerk about this. We've had some dreadful luck this season - but you can't blame luck alone for having less points than games over a 41 game period. That's over 2/3 of his time here in relegation form.
The only real reason there's any outcry is because when we have done well in this time frame, its happened to be very visible in the media - wins at Man U, Liverpool, should have been at Chelsea, and got lots of attention. The terrible moments - the 4-0 loss to Norwich, the abject games against Swansea, Norwich, Cardiff, Southampton this year on the other hand have all gone under the radar in the wider public. Frankly given we generally played well against the big sides, it suggests to me our players attitude isn't the greatest.
Its knee jerk Dan because 4 games ago we were sitting comfortably in the top half with people talking about Europe & not giving out the stats for the last however many games, ergo 4 games = knee jerk in my humble.
As regards to blame, I feel you can certainly blame bad luck/finishing/refereeing decisions but its always easier to blame......... the coach/manager.
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Yes the double blow of the Chelsea match (cheated out of 3 points by Ramirez) followed by
the Villa comeback got us in a downward spiral.
Clarke looked really down after that Villa game as though he knew it would be a battle from there.
Steve has handled himself well and represented the club well .....wish more managers took a balanced approach instead of ranting and raging in the heat of the moment.
Good luck to Steve and Kevin Kean.
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He stood on that touch line against Villa and failed to do what he's paid for.
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Its knee jerk Dan because 4 games ago we were sitting comfortably in the top half with people talking about Europe & not giving out the stats for the last however many games, ergo 4 games = knee jerk in my humble.
As regards to blame, I feel you can certainly blame bad luck/finishing/refereeing decisions but its always easier to blame......... the coach/manager.
Its not the fans making the decision. Although even then i'd point out that 2 of the 3 wins we've had are against the bottom 2, who were particularly terrible at the time we played them.
Actualy i'd say given the club's stance on his contract, in light of media questioning over it being foolish to let it run down so much, that they had concerns about the clubs form 4 games ago too....
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Name calling (Jittery Jeremy) is easy and cheap. Peace has to make the call, and maybe he'll be wrong but at least he has the balls to do it.
If Clarke had been half so bold with his decision making we may not be in this position.
Starting last week against Norwich without a goal scorer was ridiculous, constantly bringing on players with ten minutes or less left is a waste of time, publicly criticising the club about its transfer policy is suicidal.
Like most Albion fans I've watched our displays since we threw away a two goal lead at Reading with dismay. We were dismal for most of the second half of last season, and a couple of performances apart we've been dismal this season too. Our performances lately, twenty minutes against Villa apart, have had relegation written all over them, and Clarke has looked like a bloke who had run out of ideas.
He clearly had no idea of his best side, or even his favourite formation.
I admired how he dealt with Odemwingie, and also Anelka's "retirement" but those issues apart this year has been a car crash for him.
Good luck to him in the future. From some of his comments along the lines of wanting to be a proper manager at some point, and about being at a bigger club, I believe he only ever saw Albion as a stepping stone. That being said, here you go Steve, it's your opportunity to take that step.
It doesn't take 'balls' to sack an employee when you're the man at the top, on the contrary its very easy, what does take balls Chipper, is the ability to have the courage of your convictions & back potentially the best coach we've had in the Premier League, we're only ever going to be competing in the bottom 12 of the league, which will mean sometime's dropping perilously close to the relegation zone but I feel in Steve Clarke we had a man who could stabilise us for the foreseeable future, sadly JP's lawn needs mowing so that's not going to happen now is it?
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12 months.
7 wins.
Turgid football
What was stable about that?
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Here's a thought: put the assistant coach in charge for a while whilst you offer the job around, no takers as it might be a poison chalice so give the job to the assistant for the rest of the season, any of you see where I'm going with this?
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Here's a thought: put the assistant coach in charge for a while whilst you offer the job around, no takers as it might be a poison chalice so give the job to the assistant for the rest of the season, any of you see where I'm going with this?
Not really. Last time we sacked a manager mid-season it was a resounding success that is probably the reason we're still in the premier league today.
RDM had far more reason to complain too.
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I feel a bit sorry for Clarke as he was unlucky with the Lukaku situation, some refereeing decisions etc., and I would have given him until the New Year. However, he made some poor team selection decisions (Berahino not starting), and he was slightly too cautious.
Anyway the deed has been done, and it is vital we get the right man in. Think its important we get a manager who believes in an attractive footballing style, i.e. not hoof/percentage football, but able to get results. Anyway that is the style, I understand, which is being taught through the Academy.
Alot of dross is out there amongst the names being mentioned (McGregor, Holloway, Lennon). Sigh of relief that it won't be Tony Pulis! As I said in another thread, Ronald Koeman, would be my choice. Plays good football, mentally tough and has good experience. Hoddle maybe, but not sure about his management. I liked Di Matteo's football, but it would be too awkward for JP.
trust me he wasn't.
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12 months.
7 wins.
Turgid football
What was stable about that?
Stats are good, I like stats.
Season 2012/13 West Bromwich Albion Finish Position 8TH
Season 2013/14 West Bromwich Albion v Man U (W)
Arsenal (D) ? (W)
Chelsea (D) ? (W)
Playing excellent football.
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Not really. Last time we sacked a manager mid-season it was a resounding success that is probably the reason we're still in the premier league today.
RDM had far more reason to complain too.
Why did he have "far more reason to complain" we finished 8th last season under Clarke.
Also when RDM was sacked, Roy was available.
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Stats are good, I like stats.
Season 2012/13 West Bromwich Albion Finish Position 8TH
Season 2013/14 West Bromwich Albion v Man U (W)
Arsenal (D) ? (W)
Chelsea (D) ? (W)
Playing excellent football.
And the other games where we've been turgid, one paced, one dimensional and lacking in leadership?
We beat Arsenal under Robson.....shall we get him back?
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Right decision wrong timing in my book. 5games in the 14 days from next weekend. To be without a man in charge over that period would be negligence of the highest order probably leading to disaster!
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And the other games where we've been turgid, one paced, one dimensional and lacking in leadership?
We beat Arsenal under Robson.....shall we get him back?
I haven't heard his name mentioned, is he available?
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some think its was good , some don't , that's why we love this game?
I didn't think Clarke was the right man and had said many times on here however, I was willing to see at the end of the season but .....
Our last 4-6 matches we have really been going backwards , in terms of decision making Id find it hard to explain throwing Vydra on with 4 minutes to go?, the constant re-selection of players who are under performing and the omission of the players that do perform?
I understood that it was relatively new to him and mistakes would be made, most of us have a level of patience ??, problem is once is a mistake , second poor , 3rd downright negligence and he keeps making the same mistakes .
people will point to our best performances and victories this season , most were when Berahino was on the pitch , so why play silly buggers , play him and let him score for Gods sake.
The first match of this season was a massive worry , not that long ago we went to Southampton and tore them apart , so , at home, we sit off them and stay rigid in our defensive set up , which to me looked like point proving and if the manager can use a prem match to point prove when we all pay our hard earned , then im sorry respect has gone (both ways)
prior to Clarke our last 2 managers managed England and won the champions league , ill bet Clarke will not come close?
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Why did he have "far more reason to complain" we finished 8th last season under Clarke.
Also when RDM was sacked, Roy was available.
Manager of a promoted club who'd only had 3 months of bad form. Compare that to Clarke who's 12 or 13 months now of bad form. Well, if its the majority of his time here, its not really form.
Finishing 8th last season is pretty irrelevant when it was because had an amazing start, what happened in August-November 2012 shouldn't inform decisions made now.
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12 months.
7 wins.
Turgid football
What was stable about that?
When you consider, we had a world class striker in Lukaku for much of that period, it really is a dire record which, when I look at it in the cold light of day, shows what a good and timely decision it was.
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Jol will be appointed by Wednesday IMO, said to have already been sorted.
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Big call by Jeremy Peace but the right call, happy to have a chairman who acts before it's too late.
Results wise we just haven't been anywhere near good enough in 2013 - obviously the board hasn't acted in haste, but instead looked at that record as a whole, which is the right thing to do. The run of games from Villa to Hull was his chance to turn it around and we've picked up only one point in that so far (which is abysmal to be honest), but just as importantly we haven't even competed in some of those games.
Replacement-wise, i want attractive football again - there are no real standout candidates in this country so i'd be quite happy with someone from abroad of the Pochettino ilk). Will likely get crucified for this but if we do look closer to home, how about Mowbray? Loved the football he played here and as long as he has learned his lessons and improved defensively then i think it could work. Ok, he struggled at Boro, but that was a club on a big downward spiral - i think we have a good squad in place that is easily good enough to stay up with the right manager.
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Jol will be appointed by Wednesday IMO, said to have already been sorted.
totally agree and I will be fine with this appointment
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If those defending Clarke are happy with 7 wins in 12 months and 3 so far this season despite breaking the transfer record twice then more fool them.
He is the coach transfer dealings are not up to him. You can't blame him for last minute panic buys even if they work or not.
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He is the coach transfer dealings are not up to him. You can't blame him for last minute panic buys even if they work or not.
I can blame him for baffling selections, negative formations and zero ambition to win games though.
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Jol will be appointed by Wednesday IMO, said to have already been sorted.
This makes a lot of sense in terms of timings - very similar to Hodgson appointment. We have seen a guy we want is available and have acted quickly to get him.
I'm not against Jol as an appointment but certainly wouldn't be my first choice.
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Can we have Jols managerial record please. he will keep us up. He probably has a better squad than at fulham
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46% win ratio I think.
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Nailed on to be Jol for me. It's not our style to sack someome without a replacement in mind. Jol has a great cv and we'd have had little chance of getting him had he not had a poor time at Fulham.
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I think that the problem with Steve Clarke is that he never set up him teams to win from the start of the game. We very rarely started well and too. The game to the opposition even at Old Trafford he was force into a change early in the game to bring Saido on to influence the match. Even in his last interview he talks about keeping the game at 0-0 and then having to change it when we go a goal down.
Let's face it we were awful in the first half and it needed changing earlier he was certainly to loyal to players who just weren't doing it. Plus we had turned into a hoofball team.
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He is the coach transfer dealings are not up to him. You can't blame him for last minute panic buys even if they work or not.
Anelka was Clarke inspired i believe , i think Anichebe was too. Neither have delivered yet.
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I read from an Everton journalist last night that Clarke put himself forward for the vacant role at Goodison. Think it was the first time it was brought out into the media. Maybe JP had that in mind, as well as the criticisms of the board in the summer?
Not saying they would be sole factors to his sacking, but I would imagine they could have played a part.
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Does anyone know what Berahino tweeted? It was mentioned on MoTD but too risky to broadcast. I see it's been deleted now and replaced by an apology from him.
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Does anyone know what Berahino tweeted? It was mentioned on MoTD but too risky to broadcast. I see it's been deleted now and replaced by an apology from him.
He said it was f-ing s***.
Although he later claimed it was nothing to do with our decision to sack Clarke.
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http://metro.co.uk/2013/12/15/saido-berahino-i-wasnt-blasting-west-brom-board-over-steve-clarke-sacking-i-just-had-a-flat-tyre-4231047/
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http://metro.co.uk/2013/12/15/saido-berahino-i-wasnt-blasting-west-brom-board-over-steve-clarke-sacking-i-just-had-a-flat-tyre-4231047/
Shocking story... That's quite clearly a screw in his tyre and not a nail ;)
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Yes i'm sure it was relating to your tyre mate, and pigs can fly ;D
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He was said to have inquired about the everton job 'privately' last summer. So read into that how you feel suitable.
Clarke was close to leaving before Di Canio went from Sunderland, he even told Lukaku he was unlikely to be here for long and as I've said before is the rumoured real reason why Lukaku went to Everton and why long was so close to moving out to hull.
I do think the start Clarke made was partly down to hodgsons organisation but we cannot ignore the fact we have only won 7 games in 2013.
We are lucky that it is over the course of a year and not a season and we maybe able to keep our premier league status due to the bold moe by JP.
I'm sure he has someone lined up otherwise he'd have waited.
Jol doesnt inspire me but neither did Hodgson but he steadied the ship somewhat and it's exactly what we need here.
We have the squad just need someone to pick the right team.
My only criticism of the sacking of Clarke is that it wasn't sooner, however I do believe this is because a replacement wasn't lined up and makes me feel that this job has Jol written all over it.
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Always liked Clarke but I thought he rode the crest of the 'Hodgson'wave when he came in. Since the Hodgson habits have worn off and new players have come in etc he seems to have struggled and no-one could argue that the 2013 calendar year was abysmal - he would have been gone long ago if not for a couple of outstanding performances/ results.
We have a squad that's far too talented to be playing so poorly, especially at the start of matches, so something is wrong at the moment and Clarke seems unable to address this.
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I think that the problem with Steve Clarke is that he never set up him teams to win from the start of the game. We very rarely started well and too. The game to the opposition even at Old Trafford he was force into a change early in the game to bring Saido on to influence the match. Even in his last interview he talks about keeping the game at 0-0 and then having to change it when we go a goal down.
Let's face it we were awful in the first half and it needed changing earlier he was certainly to loyal to players who just weren't doing it. Plus we had turned into a hoofball team.
We were predictably awful in so many games under Clarke. I can't understand how people are surprised he is gone. Clarke knew how to set us up against the 'sexy' top sides but he was clueless how to break down the opposition when they didn't play into Clarke's script which is the majority of the games in this league. Clarke was unimaginative and predictable and his lack of flexibility is why he no longer has a job.
Good luck to our next manager.
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Alarm bells started ringing again when he failed to react to the Villa triple substitution.
I can't see how people can defend his tactics - he is afraid to drop his mates and speak out - Brunt clearly isn't a wide player - yet we carry the guy - we are far better without him starting.
Vydra player of the year last year i the Championship - pace to burn - doesn't play him!! Amalfitano looks like he has burned out already - give him a rest!!!
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Why did he have "far more reason to complain" we finished 8th last season under Clarke.
Also when RDM was sacked, Roy was available.
Roy didn't want the job at first though did he ? Hughton was all but lined up until Roy changed his mind.
Decision will have been based on this year though as a whole not last season so bearing in mind we finished 8th after a fantastic start which come Christmas stopped and we stuttered across the line for the rest of the seasn and it hasn't picked up, thats why he's gone.
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Only one win in the past 10 games, nine in the past 41 and just 31 points from the last 34 Premier League matches.
Sums it up. Can't argue with the stats.
We cannot adapt technically and with a wealth of new players we insist on playing the old guard. Brunt was so off the pace yesterday he shouldn't have even been on the pitch.
New man, new hope,new team.
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I might be wide of the mark but as I think I said in an earlier post there is a cut off point at which the club will act and that is when the team is performing at less than a point a game over a sustained period of time. It may be coincidental but defeat at Cardiff took us below a point a game for the season and given that he was below that level for the whole of the calender year that is the point where the club will draw the line. Above that level I think they will stick with the Coach even if the football isn't very good and the fans are moaning.
I also heard Shaun Custis (Sun Football Writer) on Sunday Supplement say that the flurry of Steve Clarke out of contract stories came from Clarke or someone close to him and I suspect the transfer window story also came from the same source in which case he put the rope around his own neck.
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The board have wanted him gone for a while now due to "Internal issues" but were waiting for a reason to justify it and the run of defeats is just the reason to act. I was suprised he was appointed but not that he was sacked but the timing is correct as it is before the transfer window and the new manager will have an input in signings.
I feel sorry for SC the man as this might be his last managerial role but I am not sad at the decision from a club point of view.
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The board have wanted him gone for a while now due to "Internal issues" but were waiting for a reason to justify it and the run of defeats is just the reason to act. I was suprised he was appointed but not that he was sacked but the timing is correct as it is before the transfer window and the new manager will have an input in signings.
I feel sorry for SC the man as this might be his last managerial role but I am not sad at the decision from a club point of view.
Do those internal issues have anything to do with Everton in the summer, and Clarke's sniping of the board in the summer?
I appreciate you probably can't answer this question.
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Clarke talked a lot in the summer about being nervous about lack of signings etc. Probably to increase pressure on the board to release funds.
He was backed on deadline day when we broke our transfer record twice, but unfortunately the signings didn't pay off. We have got worse if anything.
In hindsight, if we had been successful in bringing Lukaku back to the club I certainly think we would have more points on the board by now.
All if's but's and maybe's I suppose.
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It was his snipes at the board in the media, such as when he said before the end of the transfer window he was not being supported in the transfer market, also some of his other quotes regarding the board both internally and to the media such as the Berinho comments were only going to end one way and unfortunately for him he gave them a perfect excuse.
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Seem's harsh from the board, considering he was woefully backed in the transfer window up to the last day. Somebody needed to give them a jolt because we certainly weren't acting prior to deadline day.
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Seem's harsh from the board, considering he was woefully backed in the transfer window up to the last day. Somebody needed to give them a jolt because we certainly weren't acting prior to deadline day.
I think that's the straw which broke the camel's back. JP was forced into a corner to spend big (by our standards) and it has not worked.
Maybe JP agreed to back him too late in the window and he didn't get his first choices. He also was left with no time to offload those surplus to requirements.
Bottom line is that JP is in charge, and he's going nowhere.
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Seem's harsh from the board, considering he was woefully backed in the transfer window up to the last day. Somebody needed to give them a jolt because we certainly weren't acting prior to deadline day.
Agreed. Our summer recruitment up until the final day was poor and left Clarke under prepared.
Clarke's comments may have forced their hand but they shouldn't hold it against him. At that point in time, that squad was destined for relegation. The new additions have improved us but unfortunately for Clarke, he hasn't got enough out of them.
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Roy didn't want the job at first though did he ? Hughton was all but lined up until Roy changed his mind.
Decision will have been based on this year though as a whole not last season so bearing in mind we finished 8th after a fantastic start which come Christmas stopped and we stuttered across the line for the rest of the seasn and it hasn't picked up, thats why he's gone.
Doesn't change the fact Roy was available, which was my argument in the original post.
Football isn't played over a calender year though is it, managers/coaches should be judged for what they achieved during a football season, otherwise before you know it well be sacking coaches for losing pre-season friendlies.
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Steve had a bright start last season but we started to dip in the 2nd half of season,and the poor form extend to this season,he couldn't save us and failed to make us bounce back.It's an unfortunate but inevitable decision for him.
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Having just read through this mornings post's it appears there was 'more to it' then meets the eye & maybe it was more to do with 'internal affairs'.......... well excuse my cynicism but how convenient, I guess some might buy into it & it may placate the few who think it was a wrong decision but I'm having none of it & how some can believe SC somehow 'bullied' Peace into buying players on deadline day by moaning in the press is beyond me.
Peace & Garlick are equally culpable as far as player recruitment goes, difference being they're in a much stronger position to let the 'fall guy' take the wrap when it doesn't workout, time will tell if the right decision has been made & as an Albion fan I sincerely hope Peace has called it correctly, because if things go 'tits up', those same fans who are currently agreeing with him won't take long to turn on him.
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Doesn't change the fact Roy was available, which was my argument in the original post.
Football isn't played over a calender year though is it, managers/coaches should be judged for what they achieved during a football season, otherwise before you know it well be sacking coaches for losing pre-season friendlies.
May have been available but didn't want it at the time.
No its not played over a calender year but form over a calender year will be looked at, it certainly wasn't done on the back of last couple of games, 31 points from 34 games is shocking, 3 wins this season is shocking with this squad. So if judging on this season then the decision is 100% correct, on a downward spiral with seemingly no way of stopping it.
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totally agree and I will be fine with this appointment
How can you be fine with Jol? We apparently still want to run with the head coach scenario, well Jol hd to get somebody to oversee the coaching and that self same person succeeded him a short time later. Get the feeling with Jol his standing his way higher than his achievements in this country. I just dont see him as the person to stop the rot people have been on about SC´s lack of passion on the side well Hangdog could be a word invented for Jol!
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I have nothing personal against SC,he comes over as an honourable man.
I was stunned when someone told me the starting line up v Norwich in the Sportsman last week,but i still voted undecided on this thread because he hadn't had the rub of the green from refs.
After listening to 90 mins of boring football yesterday on the radio iwas no longer undecided, and neither it seems was JP. I applaud Mr Peace for acting so incisively before we reached an hopeless position, but no he has the hard task of finding a man who can get the best of our talented squad and who plays football the Albion way.
My choice would be Hoddle. Nutty as a fruitcake admitted, but has a lot of respect within the game.
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Talk of negative formations and turgid football - compared to the time under Roy, Steve Clarke was positively cavalier.
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Roy got results though.
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Roy got results though.
Cant argue with that Divine
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Roy got results though.
yeah but some accusations have been related to style of football
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yeah but some accusations have been related to style of football
Fans will put up with poor performances aethetically if the points come... If you have neither it becomes a problem.
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I always have backed Steve Clarke I felt he would get things right after those two home defeats at the start of the season but the last three weeks he has been very poor, with starting 11, tactics and subs. it is a shame as some of his choices with the subs have been really good this season and have led us to win games. Had some great memories with Clarke, but the FA Cup and Carling cup have angered me, results like losing to Wigan and Norwich at the back end of the season were also very disappointing, and then the last two defeats and the Villa game were very poor.
I'm sure he will get a job soon.
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Fans will put up with poor performances aethetically if the points come... If you have neither it becomes a problem.
Was Hodgon's style that bad though? I know there were some games where we were dull, but I'd say under Roy we also played some great football.
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Clarke on his sacking:
‘I believe I have unfinished business at West Bromwich Albion Football Club so it is with deep regret that I was relieved of duties as Head Coach last night.
‘I could not have been better prepared for my first job in management after over 14 years coaching experience learning from some of the great managers in the modern era. It was certainly a challenge to succeed Roy Hodgson, having been appointed England manager, after he successfully guided the club to a 10th place finish in 2011/12, after only securing their Barclays Premier League status the year before.
‘It goes without saying that I was extremely proud to have built on that achievement by securing the club’s highest ever finish in the Barclays Premier League and for over 30 years in the top flight by finishing 8th in 2012/13.
‘Going into this season expectations were high, perhaps unrealistically so, but with it still being only our fourth consecutive season in the top flight, our primary objective had to be to establishing our status in the Barclays Premier League. I was, and remain convinced that we were well placed to achieve this aim.
‘It has been an honour to manage this club and I would like to thank the staff who have assisted me in every possible way as well as the fans who have been tremendous throughout. Now, I wish everyone connected with the club the very best for the future.’
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I think the signiongs, desperate as they were, were the final nail in the coffin.
Not a decent signing among any of them, totally average players at best and not one was better than we already had, en expensive waste of time and money by anyone's standards, and showed just how poor Sc was.
Anelka, oh come on really.
The Ant what was it 19 goals in 7 seasons, pure garbige for a striker.
Sess, can't hit a barn door.
Sinclair £50k per week to sit at home for half the season, stupid.
:o
Amal, one good game thats all.
Vydra, did well in a very poor championship last year, f all this year.
If I missed anyone, then that says it all about them.
Sorry Clarke, was an expensive risk that didn't pay off, his good fortune was rising on the back of RH's good work, nothing else.
Now come on JP, you need to prove your worth, sign a coach with calibre, not some untried cheapy like you did with TM, RDM, Sc we deserve more.
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Touch of class from Steve Clarke in that statement.
He'll be a success, wherever he goes. He can learn a lot from his time with us.
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Touch of class from Steve Clarke in that statement.
He'll be a success, wherever he goes. He can learn a lot from his time with us.
Spot on LTB. Di Matteo didn't do too badly when he was sacked by JP did he!
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Touch of class from Steve Clarke in that statement.
He'll be a success, wherever he goes. He can learn a lot from his time with us.
Oh sorrry Liam, didn't realise you were an SC fan, I thought this was a WBA site.
If you seriously believe SC is any good then you have extremely low standards, he is and will only ever be a second rate assistant, he rode his luck on the back of RH, then he ran out of ideas, he is dour, boring and hasn't got a clue how to be a decent coach, couldn't motivate a slug to go out in the wet.
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Link to his statement.
http://www.leaguemanagers.com/news/news-7319.html
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Who cares about SC's statement FFS, I care about the demise and poor run of form we were in and getting worse under SC.
He has gone, thank god, move on.
Now we can look forward to regaining some pride and getting our season back on track.
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Oh sorrry Liam, didn't realise you were an SC fan, I thought this was a WBA site.
If you seriously believe SC is any good then you have extremely low standards, he is and will only ever be a second rate assistant, he rode his luck on the back of RH, then he ran out of ideas, he is dour, boring and hasn't got a clue how to be a decent coach, couldn't motivate a slug to go out in the wet.
What are you on about?
Are you telling me that wasn't a dignified response?
I would hope that if we are going to discuss Steve Clarke then it gets done with as much dignity as he's showed towards us. Granted, it hasn't worked out, but there's no need for the personal abuse - it doesn't reflect well on you at all.
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Who cares about SC's statement FFS, I care about the demise and poor run of form we were in and getting worse under SC.
He has gone, thank god, move on.
Now we can look forward to regaining some pride and getting our season back on track.
Being as this is a Steve Clarke thread I think if you feel the way you do then maybe you should just stick to the next manager thread?! This is the perfect place for his statement. We've got a lot of good memories with him at the helm.
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What are you on about?
Are you telling me that wasn't a dignified response?
I would hope that if we are going to discuss Steve Clarke then it gets done with as much dignity as he's showed towards us. Granted, it hasn't worked out, but there's no need for the personal abuse - it doesn't reflect well on you at all.
Ignore this claptrap. It was classy of Clarke and I wouldn't have expected anything less from the man. People on the wind up however lack class - just like the teams they probably support. Don't bite.
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Ignore this claptrap. It was classy of Clarke and I wouldn't have expected anything less from the man. People on the wind up however lack class - just like the teams they probably support. Don't bite.
Lot of respect for Clarke as a man, very likable and the statement shows the dignity of the guy.
However, his 2013 record and last two performances were just not good enough.
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What are you on about?
Are you telling me that wasn't a dignified response?
I would hope that if we are going to discuss Steve Clarke then it gets done with as much dignity as he's showed towards us. Granted, it hasn't worked out, but there's no need for the personal abuse - it doesn't reflect well on you at all.
Surprised you dignified his post with a response mate.............................dingle bells dingle bells dingle all the way. ;)
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Surprised you dignified his post with a response mate.............................dingle bells dingle bells dingle all the way. ;)
Unfortunately he's not a dingle mate
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Personally I think the sacking was harsh, but Peace clearly knows more about the running of West Bromwich Albion than I do and his previous history in these types of matters are commendable.
For me, Clarke can probably count himself as unlucky. The decisions at Chelsea have clearly impacted on our results and if we had been given the rub of the green in other games we could have been in a much different position.
The mistake that I think has cost Clarke is that setting up in games against the top teams to remain in the game for as long as possible and then trying to take the game to them is fine (and clearly works) but not setting up to attack the less successful clubs has been his downfall. The criticism of Brunt and Ridgewell I also find strange because I bet whoever comes in next will continue to pick them. I also agree in many respects with his management of Berahino. I would liked to have seen him a little more but he is learning the game and the expectations our crowd are already putting on him could finish a promising career. We have had a number of promising young strikers recently and where are they now?
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Unfortunately he's not a dingle mate
You can see how someone could make that mistake though ;D
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Who cares about SC's statement FFS, I care about the demise and poor run of form we were in and getting worse under SC.
He has gone, thank god, move on.
Now we can look forward to regaining some pride and getting our season back on track.
not a very dignified post, unlike steve clarkes statement.
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Clarke on his sacking:
‘I believe I have unfinished business at West Bromwich Albion Football Club so it is with deep regret that I was relieved of duties as Head Coach last night.
‘I could not have been better prepared for my first job in management after over 14 years coaching experience learning from some of the great managers in the modern era. It was certainly a challenge to succeed Roy Hodgson, having been appointed England manager, after he successfully guided the club to a 10th place finish in 2011/12, after only securing their Barclays Premier League status the year before.
‘It goes without saying that I was extremely proud to have built on that achievement by securing the club’s highest ever finish in the Barclays Premier League and for over 30 years in the top flight by finishing 8th in 2012/13.
‘Going into this season expectations were high, perhaps unrealistically so, but with it still being only our fourth consecutive season in the top flight, our primary objective had to be to establishing our status in the Barclays Premier League. I was, and remain convinced that we were well placed to achieve this aim.
‘It has been an honour to manage this club and I would like to thank the staff who have assisted me in every possible way as well as the fans who have been tremendous throughout. Now, I wish everyone connected with the club the very best for the future.’
This statement is exactly as I expected, signing off as a genuine football man and with dignity.
Many thanks Steve for your hard work, and some great memories, and wishing you the very best of luck in the future.
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Have to say the club statement of us having the highest wage bill in the clubs history is pretty pointless - I wonder how many prem clubs have a wage bill less than at a previous stage of their history ? There's more money coming in and wages have gone up continually.
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You can see how someone could make that mistake though ;D
Had me fooled too.
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Little bit of a love in with Steve Clarke , and that is the persons choice, personally I don't really care about his statement unless it says .
"I'd like to apologise for my unprofessionalism towards Matej VYDRA, I'd like to apologise for sticking with ridgewell and brunt, I will personally refund the cost of the away travel to Cardiff, I was wrong to use Southampton at home to prove a point, I now realise that starting Rosenberg as a loan striker versus stoke was ridiculous , I fully appreciate that my sons should not have used twitter to slag off mr Peace, I really really wish I'd have made the subs v villa at the point when the rest of the stadium knew I should, I was wrong to phone lukaku and long &&&&&&&&&&&&&, and then the west brom fans might realise why there is a problem between me and Jose, and finally, maybe if should not have actually approached Everton about their vacant position (personally and through friends in the press) last summer.
Steve Clarke
But it doesn't .
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Another article here, this time from CL on Clarke's departure - it doesn't give too much away in terms of replacements - or the direction we shall be taking. It was an interesting read nonetheless.
http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/west-brom-search-steve-clarke-6407779
Three weeks is all it took for a managerial spell to unravel.
It was in the final week of November that West Bromwich Albion issued a statement to reassure fans that they would be discussing a new deal with Steve Clarke in the New Year.
The fact the Baggies wished to wait until January should have set some alarm bells ringing.
The doubts were already there.
And then came four defeats - not just four losses, but four flat and tepid displays. With it came the sack.
Of late there was a change in Steve Clarke’s manner, both on the touchline and away from it.
Albion’s decision to remove him and joint-assistant Kevin Keen from their posts on Saturday was based, not on the last four games, but on their form over the last 12 months.
And you could see Albion’s point although the decision was such a surprise that I’m told Clarke was not expecting it - despite his dark demeanour after Saturday's game.
The decision to sack Clarke, while it might have been coming given the results, was executed swiftly on Saturday night.
In 2013, Albion played 34 games. They claimed seven wins, 10 draws - 31 points over 34 games.
In his 54 Premier League games, Albion took 64 points but Clarke’s ethos had changed in recent times.
The verve and energy of last season’s sides were long gone.
At the start of his time with Albion, Clarke was brave with his team selections and changes. It didn’t always work, but you rarely came away from a game wondering ‘what if’.
With hindsight, the Chelsea game a few weeks ago was a milestone. Clarke behaved with dignity and class while those around him lost their heads.
But Albion lost their way after that.
The Baggies' most recent form had been dreadful. The energy of Clarke’s sides of early last season wasn’t evident this year. Recent starting XIs have almost had a ‘fear’ factor to them - a need to not lose, rather than seek a win.
Where once Clarke was proactive, he had become a reactive boss.
There was nowhere else to go following the reversal at Cardiff. And his mood suggested so afterwards.
It’s hard to believe that just three weeks ago, Albion and Clarke seemed to be looking ahead to a bright future. Indeed I wrote about the need for his future to be sorted out. And then came the three weeks from hell.
Clarke has cut a frustrated figure for a while. On August 29, a clearly frustrated and tetchy Clarke made a plea for new players. It wasn’t a dig at his employers as such, but it was an impassioned cry for help.
That assistance arrived on the final day of the transfer window, with Victor Anichebe and Stephane Sessegnon arriving for a combined fee just shy of £12million. Morgan Amalfitano pitched up on loan from Marseille.
The message from the Board was clear: you asked for players, now give us results.
Jeremy Peace isn't a man who likes to be told when and how to spend his money. The Albion chairman wasn't about to forget those comments from late August.
Yet the arrival of new faces this summer perhaps added to Clarke's problems, rather than solved them.
An inability to settle on a first XI was an increasing feature of recent times. James Morrison, one of Albion’s best players of recent years, has spent way too long on the bench while the lumbering Sessegnon has strolled around offering pretty much next to nothing since September.
Sessegnon and Anichebe have been relatively poor so far. Amalfitano has also been on the wane, suggesting that maybe Marseille had valid justification for letting him go.
Who is the main Albion striker? Four months into this season and nobody knows whether it’s Shane Long, Victor Anichebe or Nicolas Anelka. Crucially there is no goalscorer.
Indeed Anelka’s presence has come to symbolise Albion’s decline.
Clarke has done some things well. He deserves great credit for leading Albion to eighth last year - yes, the form slumped but they started the season brilliantly. He had to deal with the tricky Odemwingie situation and used Saido Berahino sparingly this season - the youngster’s recent conduct on Twitter suggests he still has a bit of growing up to do.
And Clarke also guided Albion to victories over Manchester United and Liverpool - in their own back yards - along with a near miss at Chelsea. Those were memorable days for Albion supporters.
He took on a side which Roy Hodgson had moulded and gave it more of a cutting edge. But it’s also clear there have been some underlying issues between Clarke and the club.
When asked about the well-being of injured players before or after recent games, Clarke’s reply, on several occasions, was a pithy: ‘you had better ask the Director of Performance (Mark Gillett).’ The suggestion was that Clarke was unhappy that other members of staff were getting new deals, while his future was put on hold.
You could sense a growing frustration in recent weeks. And not all of it was emanating from poor results.
Good luck to Steve Clarke. He was a good man, with bright ideas on football. He simply lost his way.
His successor is not an obvious call.
Has the cycle returned to ‘experienced boss’ rather than ‘younger coach’? Maybe so. This doesn’t strike me as being a job for a boss who is still wearing his managerial L-plates.
Yet there is no Roy Hodgson this time.
So who?
Martin Jol is an obvious call. Experienced and relatively successful. Will the ex-Albion man fancy a job? His demeanour at Fulham was of a tired man, who needs a rest from football.
Roberto Di Matteo has been one of the early favourites with bookmakers but those links appear to be tenuous - it's unlikely Peace would reappoint a man he has previously sacked.
Michael Phelan, Ray Wilkins and Paul Clement (brother of Neil) are intriguing options but all lack ‘managerial’ experience. They are, in effect, slightly different takes on the man Albion have just released.
Ole Gunnar Solskjaer is refusing to commit his long-term future to current club Molde and would be an interesting candidate, as would Ralf Rangnick (sporting director at FC Red Bull Salzburg and RB Leipzig), who was linked with Albion two summers ago.
Burnley’s Sean Dyche is an astute young boss, whose family still remain in Northamptonshire. He has 18 months left on his deal but has a £1million get-out clause. Albion are rarely keen to pay out compensation.
Malky Mackay is well-liked by key figures at the club but, again, is under contract at Cardiff.
Derek McInnes, now at Aberdeen, and Michael Appleton are also admired by the club. Stuart Pearce, Owen Coyle and Glenn Hoddle are also available - though the ex-England boss upset Peace with some comments he made after being interviewed for the Albion vacancy back in 2004.
It would be fair to assume there might also be left-field candidates from overseas.
Albion don't have much time, although caretaker Keith Downing might find himself in charge for longer than just one game.
The successful candidate, whoever emerges, might not get much, if any, money to spend in January. He might have to work with what he inherits.
So, for now at least, it’s up to Jeremy Peace.
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Little bit of a love in with Steve Clarke , and that is the persons choice, personally I don't really care about his statement unless it says .
"I'd like to apologise for my unprofessionalism towards Matej VYDRA, I'd like to apologise for sticking with ridgewell and brunt, I will personally refund the cost of the away travel to Cardiff, I was wrong to use Southampton at home to prove a point, I now realise that starting Rosenberg as a loan striker versus stoke was ridiculous , I fully appreciate that my sons should not have used twitter to slag off mr Peace, I really really wish I'd have made the subs v villa at the point when the rest of the stadium knew I should, I was wrong to phone lukaku and long &&&&&&&&&&&&&, and then the west brom fans might realise why there is a problem between me and Jose, and finally, maybe if should not have actually approached Everton about their vacant position (personally and through friends in the press) last summer.
Steve Clarke
But it doesn't .
that's your personal view of course - several unproven theory's in there such as using the Southampton game to prove a point, etc. etc.
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"I'd like to apologise for my unprofessionalism towards Matej VYDRA, I'd like to apologise for sticking with ridgewell and brunt, I will personally refund the cost of the away travel to Cardiff, I was wrong to use Southampton at home to prove a point, I now realise that starting Rosenberg as a loan striker versus stoke was ridiculous , I fully appreciate that my sons should not have used twitter to slag off mr Peace, I really really wish I'd have made the subs v villa at the point when the rest of the stadium knew I should, I was wrong to phone lukaku and long &&&&&&&&&&&&&, and then the west brom fans might realise why there is a problem between me and Jose, and finally, maybe if should not have actually approached Everton about their vacant position (personally and through friends in the press) last summer.
Steve Clarke
But it doesn't .
1. Unprofessionalism towards Vydra? Is it Steve Clarke's fault that Vydra has spent the majority of his Albion career injured?
2. Ridgewell and Brunt are senior members of the side. Ridgewell's replacement isn't exactly a world beater but he's the best in that position. Brunt, I would imagine also figures quite highly in this seasons assist count - granted he hasn't been brilliant
3. How was Southampton at home proving a point? An assumption with no evidence. We ran into a team who since that day have been very good this season. We were at that point under prepared and came close to a point had it not been for a debatable penalty.
4. Rosenberg came here with a good pedigree and had to wait his chance for a start - at that point we had hopes for him. Hindsight is wonderful, eh?
5. His sons defended their dad, I don't think Clarke instructed them to do that but I agree with your sentiment.
6. Don't understand your point about phoning Long and Lukaku? We were close to signing Lukaku. We were beaten by a team who had a bigger budget.
You have a point with your comment regarding Everton. That would have left a sour taste in Peace's mouth.
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1. Unprofessionalism towards Vydra? Is it Steve Clarke's fault that Vydra has spent the majority of his Albion career injured?
Just my view, the time he gets to play is almost workplace bullying.
2. Ridgewell and Brunt are senior members of the side. Ridgewell's replacement isn't exactly a world beater but he's the best in that position. Brunt, I would imagine also figures quite highly in this seasons assist count - granted he hasn't been brilliant
Most can see they are not good enough, Clarke in fact pulled ridgewell at HT v Norwich and then put him straight back in?
3. How was Southampton at home proving a point? An assumption with no evidence. We ran into a team who since that day have been very good this season. We were at that point under prepared and came close to a point had it not been for a debatable penalty.
My opinion that he played a poor selection and formation to force the club in to signings, completely went against pre season set up and how we set up months earlier when we battered them
4. Rosenberg came here with a good pedigree and had to wait his chance for a start - at that point we had hopes for him. Hindsight is wonderful, eh?
Would you have given him his first league start on his own upfront v them?
5. His sons defended their dad, I don't think Clarke instructed them to do that but I agree with your sentiment.
Ta
6. Don't understand your point about phoning Long and Lukaku? We were close to signing Lukaku. We were beaten by a team who had a bigger budget.
Budget was irrelevant , if we wanted him he was ours and Chelsea were happy, lukaku (his advisors) received a call putting him off ....you can work out the rest.
You have a point with your comment regarding Everton. That would have left a sour taste in Peace's mouth.
It would and it did, he was willing to walk and did not give two hoots for us, don't see why we should care for him?
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I don't care for him, I'm just arguing a case for him, we just have differing views on how we see it.
Your work place bullying comment is just hyperbole to be honest. Maybe Vydra should have been utilised a bit more but it's not Clarke's biggest mistake if I'm honest and certainly not 'bullying' by any stretch of the imagination.
Ridgewell was dropped against Norwich as not only did he have a poor first half, but more importantly, Clarke wanted to get us back into the game and therefore made several attacking changes - had we had our finishing boots on, that would have been a good call in hindsight.
I don't think he was proving a point at all against Southampton - I just feel he opted for players he could trust and depend on. It's ok scoring goals in pre-season but the league is a different kettle of fish. I will agree with you, Rosenberg should have started ahead of Long that day, but I certainly don't buy into Steve Clarke trying to prove a point.
As for starting him against Stoke - he featured up-front alongside Shane Long - not exactly on his own. We had three games in that week. Clarke spoke regularly about utilising a squad we all regarded as having strength in depth. I would have had worries had it been the Rosenberg who had proved he wasn't good enough but at that point he was an unknown quality - despite having a good pedigree.
There were a number of reasons which could have lead to Lukaku joining Everton. Chelsea demanding a horrific price for just one season, the fact we muddied the waters with our haggling over Izzy Brown. Worth remembering that Everton had received a windfall from selling Fellaini and were therefore in a much stronger financial position.
I think any manager coming here would see up as a stepping stone - I don't blame Clarke for that. That's the nature of the beast.
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I disagree re Lukaku. You say the budget was irrelevant. That's surely impossible at this club!
Everton offered a loan fee of £5m plus they are paying his £3m wages for the season - an outlay of £8m with £5m paid even if he's injured. No way would JP have matched that, and nor should he have done so.
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Zippy is saying in as many words that ALLEGEDLY Steve Clarke or his advisors contacted Romelu Lukaku (or his advisors) telling them he (Clarke) may not be here for the full season and he would be better served going elsewhere. Prior to this contact a deal to rejoin WBA was agreed.
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Zippy is saying in as many words that ALLEGEDLY Steve Clarke or his advisors contacted Romelu Lukaku (or his advisors) telling them he (Clarke) may not be here for the full season and he would be better served going elsewhere. Prior to this contact a deal to rejoin WBA was agreed.
Interesting...
So nothing linked to United sealing a deal for Fallaini at around 10.30 on transfer deadline day and suddenly having money to burn?
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24 hours on and my feelings are much the same
I am not for one suggesting Steve Clarke shouldn't have been sacked. However I am a firm believer that what has got us to being 11. 10, 8 position in the last few seasons has been in part due to the extra points gained by being a club operating in a consistent and stable manner. is it worth an extra 3 points or 10 points who knows but think of the damage done to clubs in chaos and you can see what I mean. We are in danger of losing that.
I've read a lot in the past 24 hours of a great decision to sack SC and great timing etc. It may have been necessary but to me it represents huge failure beyond SC at this club. It is the second time in three managers that this board has seen fit to get rid in 18 months. Doesn't say a lot for their recruitment strategy of managers does it?? I would have liked to think that the top tier in any business would work together - last night's statement by Garlick effectively may as well have said we have all done great jobs SC hasn't. I don't buy that.
Yes the wage bill may be the highest in the clubs history but Mr Garlick did you provide the club with value for money in achieving that last summer??? To me the jury is still out on that one. Yes Mr Peace you can get Mr Garlick to stand up and laud the clubs track record (disputed) on not sacking managers over the last fourteen years but is sacking two of your last three appointments without either of them completing two seasons in charge success or failure in management recruitment strategy??
I still believe that beyond the top 6/7 in the premiership sometimes the difference is the TEAM within the club. I get the director of football theory. I get that the 'club' shouldn't be dictated to by a manager who may not be around long term. But equally as a result of that model the chairman and director of football are part of that TEAM that affects results on the pitch and to distance themselves is naive at best - to simply absolve themselves of the 20% win rate in the last year is not on. One of them appointed the manager the summer before last, the other masterminded the players this summer.
United we stand divided we fall???? Hope the new manager (sorry head coach) is welcomed in with that mantra.
As for the Everton nonsense - would we rather have a manager who has ambition to better himself or a jobs-worth manager who is only here for the pay packet? if the board take offence at this ambition, what does it say about them??
Time to make an appointment that you wont regret in 18 months time and not unwind the 'Dan Ashworth' years and return to becoming an ill run knee jerk yo yo club.
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Interesting...
So nothing linked to United sealing a deal for Fallaini at around 10.30 on transfer deadline day and suddenly having money to burn?
I think the inference was that we would already have signed the Loan agreement by the time Everton got their money to burn....
Allegedly Lukaku (or his advisors) hesitated due to a phone call and a window of opportunity opened for the Toffees
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24 hours on and my feelings are much the same
I am not for one suggesting Steve Clarke shouldn't have been sacked. However I am a firm believer that what has got us to being 11. 10, 8 position in the last few seasons has been in part due to the extra points gained by being a club operating in a consistent and stable manner. is it worth an extra 3 points or 10 points who knows but think of the damage done to clubs in chaos and you can see what I mean. We are in danger of losing that.
I've read a lot in the past 24 hours of a great decision to sack SC and great timing etc. It may have been necessary but to me it represents huge failure beyond SC at this club. It is the second time in three managers that this board has seen fit to get rid in 18 months. Doesn't say a lot for their recruitment strategy of managers does it?? I would have liked to think that the top tier in any business would work together - last night's statement by Garlick effectively may as well have said we have all done great jobs SC hasn't. I don't buy that.
Yes the wage bill may be the highest in the clubs history but Mr Garlick did you provide the club with value for money in achieving that last summer??? To me the jury is still out on that one. Yes Mr Peace you can get Mr Garlick to stand up and laud the clubs track record (disputed) on not sacking managers over the last fourteen years but is sacking two of your last three appointments without either of them completing two seasons in charge success or failure in management recruitment strategy??
I still believe that beyond the top 6/7 in the premiership sometimes the difference is the TEAM within the club. I get the director of football theory. I get that the 'club' shouldn't be dictated to by a manager who may not be around long term. But equally as a result of that model the chairman and director of football are part of that TEAM that affects results on the pitch and to distance themselves is naive at best - to simply absolve themselves of the 20% win rate in the last year is not on. One of them appointed the manager the summer before last, the other masterminded the players this summer.
United we stand divided we fall???? Hope the new manager (sorry head coach) is welcomed in with that mantra.
As for the Everton nonsense - would we rather have a manager who has ambition to better himself or a jobs-worth manager who is only here for the pay packet? if the board take offence at this ambition, what does it say about them??
Time to make an appointment that you wont regret in 18 months time and not unwind the 'Dan Ashworth' years and return to becoming an ill run knee jerk yo yo club.
I think that is a very good analysis.
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Little bit of a love in with Steve Clarke , and that is the persons choice, personally I don't really care about his statement unless it says .
"I'd like to apologise for my unprofessionalism towards Matej VYDRA, I'd like to apologise for sticking with ridgewell and brunt, I will personally refund the cost of the away travel to Cardiff, I was wrong to use Southampton at home to prove a point, I now realise that starting Rosenberg as a loan striker versus stoke was ridiculous , I fully appreciate that my sons should not have used twitter to slag off mr Peace, I really really wish I'd have made the subs v villa at the point when the rest of the stadium knew I should, I was wrong to phone lukaku and long &&&&&&&&&&&&&, and then the west brom fans might realise why there is a problem between me and Jose, and finally, maybe if should not have actually approached Everton about their vacant position (personally and through friends in the press) last summer.
Steve Clarke
But it doesn't .
First time I've ever not read one of your post's after the first couple of lines, thought you were better then that z&b :'(
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24 hours on and my feelings are much the same
I am not for one suggesting Steve Clarke shouldn't have been sacked. However I am a firm believer that what has got us to being 11. 10, 8 position in the last few seasons has been in part due to the extra points gained by being a club operating in a consistent and stable manner. is it worth an extra 3 points or 10 points who knows but think of the damage done to clubs in chaos and you can see what I mean. We are in danger of losing that.
I've read a lot in the past 24 hours of a great decision to sack SC and great timing etc. It may have been necessary but to me it represents huge failure beyond SC at this club. It is the second time in three managers that this board has seen fit to get rid in 18 months. Doesn't say a lot for their recruitment strategy of managers does it?? I would have liked to think that the top tier in any business would work together - last night's statement by Garlick effectively may as well have said we have all done great jobs SC hasn't. I don't buy that.
Yes the wage bill may be the highest in the clubs history but Mr Garlick did you provide the club with value for money in achieving that last summer??? To me the jury is still out on that one. Yes Mr Peace you can get Mr Garlick to stand up and laud the clubs track record (disputed) on not sacking managers over the last fourteen years but is sacking two of your last three appointments without either of them completing two seasons in charge success or failure in management recruitment strategy??
I still believe that beyond the top 6/7 in the premiership sometimes the difference is the TEAM within the club. I get the director of football theory. I get that the 'club' shouldn't be dictated to by a manager who may not be around long term. But equally as a result of that model the chairman and director of football are part of that TEAM that affects results on the pitch and to distance themselves is naive at best - to simply absolve themselves of the 20% win rate in the last year is not on. One of them appointed the manager the summer before last, the other masterminded the players this summer.
United we stand divided we fall???? Hope the new manager (sorry head coach) is welcomed in with that mantra.
As for the Everton nonsense - would we rather have a manager who has ambition to better himself or a jobs-worth manager who is only here for the pay packet? if the board take offence at this ambition, what does it say about them??
Time to make an appointment that you wont regret in 18 months time and not unwind the 'Dan Ashworth' years and return to becoming an ill run knee jerk yo yo club.
Clarke bears the ultimate responsibility for what happens on the pitch. Clarke took a bunch of players that had been comfortably mid table for 3 seasons running (as you point out) and over the long period of a year had them perform as relegation candidates. Moreover things were only getting worse by the game. There is no avoiding that fact. The inability to learn lessons and adapt in the face of adversity is what cost Clarke his job.
I agree that the summer was a very poor job by the club, but that includes Clarke. It was obvious to me that significant actions needed to be taken over the summer regarding the squad but for whatever reasons the club (including Clarke) failed to act decisively and WITH A CLEAR PLAN. Instead Clarke dug the hole much bigger and much deeper.
No doubt part of that failure lies with the other bosses, but ultimately it is the head coach that bears the responsibility for the strategic vision, the tactics and for the football on the pitch. Clarke failed miserably in bringing the club forward on all accounts. Mr Clarke may be a very nice man, but the head coach needs to be more than a nice man, he also needs to be decisive and very, very clear about his objectives and goals. Moreover he cannot be a soft touch, which I feel Clarke ended up being on too many occasions because he didn't make the hard decisions when they needed to be made.
Look at SAF, he bent and corrupted an entire league around his relentless, even childish, compulsion to win. I never felt an ounce of that drive in Clarke. To be honest I believe that Clarke lost the players the week before the Swansea away game in November last year, the point where we had gone up to third and Clarke's reaction was to go out and say that we were overperforming and nobody expected us to keep up those performance levels. Ever since then the players have been a soft touch and put in limp performance after limp performance apart from a handful games where they have been fully concentrated and up for it (games against the interesting opponents).
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24 hours on and my feelings are much the same
I am not for one suggesting Steve Clarke shouldn't have been sacked. However I am a firm believer that what has got us to being 11. 10, 8 position in the last few seasons has been in part due to the extra points gained by being a club operating in a consistent and stable manner. is it worth an extra 3 points or 10 points who knows but think of the damage done to clubs in chaos and you can see what I mean. We are in danger of losing that.
I've read a lot in the past 24 hours of a great decision to sack SC and great timing etc. It may have been necessary but to me it represents huge failure beyond SC at this club. It is the second time in three managers that this board has seen fit to get rid in 18 months. Doesn't say a lot for their recruitment strategy of managers does it?? I would have liked to think that the top tier in any business would work together - last night's statement by Garlick effectively may as well have said we have all done great jobs SC hasn't. I don't buy that.
Yes the wage bill may be the highest in the clubs history but Mr Garlick did you provide the club with value for money in achieving that last summer??? To me the jury is still out on that one. Yes Mr Peace you can get Mr Garlick to stand up and laud the clubs track record (disputed) on not sacking managers over the last fourteen years but is sacking two of your last three appointments without either of them completing two seasons in charge success or failure in management recruitment strategy??
I still believe that beyond the top 6/7 in the premiership sometimes the difference is the TEAM within the club. I get the director of football theory. I get that the 'club' shouldn't be dictated to by a manager who may not be around long term. But equally as a result of that model the chairman and director of football are part of that TEAM that affects results on the pitch and to distance themselves is naive at best - to simply absolve themselves of the 20% win rate in the last year is not on. One of them appointed the manager the summer before last, the other masterminded the players this summer.
United we stand divided we fall???? Hope the new manager (sorry head coach) is welcomed in with that mantra.
As for the Everton nonsense - would we rather have a manager who has ambition to better himself or a jobs-worth manager who is only here for the pay packet? if the board take offence at this ambition, what does it say about them??
Time to make an appointment that you wont regret in 18 months time and not unwind the 'Dan Ashworth' years and return to becoming an ill run knee jerk yo yo club.
That, my friend is an excellent post, eyes open, baggies goggles left clearly on the table.
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That, my friend is an excellent post, eyes open, baggies goggles left clearly on the table.
Not really, see my answer above.
Ulmitately Clarke was a one trick pony. When his one trick didn't work he had no other idea. Look at the last game against Cardiff. When Hodgson took over he dropped our backline 10 meters. In the game against Cardiff Clarke had dropped our backline a further 10 meters and our midfield was now defending where Hodgson had his backline. Clarke also pulled the wingers down even further to play as secondary full backs. Cardiff simply put two guys on Sessegnon, kept depth behind Long and closed down our right so Amelfitano got nowhere. And that was that, we barely had a shot on goal all game against a very poor Cardiff side.
That kind of nonsense was the norm with Clarke, not the expeption. Clarke's tactics worked against the top sides who are expected to play with a high backline and very aggressive football but he was utterly clueless outside of those games and that was proven time and time and time and time again.
Sorry but we had to get rid or we would have faced an Agent Grant scenario when Grant took West Ham down. At least now we have a chance to reboot our season.
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Not really, see my answer above.
Ulmitately Clarke was a one trick pony. When his one trick didn't work he had no other idea. Look at the last game against Cardiff. When Hodgson took over he dropped our backline 10 meters. In the game against Cardiff Clarke had dropped our backline a further 10 meters and our midfield was now defending where Hodgson had his backline. Clarke also pulled the wingers down even further to play as secondary full backs. Cardiff simply put two guys on Sessegnon, kept depth behind Long and closed down our right so Amelfitano got nowhere. And that was that, we barely had a shot on goal all game against a very poor Cardiff side.
That kind of nonsense was the norm with Clarke, not the expeption. Clarke's tactics worked against the top sides who are expected to play with a high backline and very aggressive football but he was utterly clueless outside of those games and that was proven time and time and time and time again.
Sorry but we had to get rid or we would have faced an Agent Grant scenario when Grant took West Ham down. At least now we have a chance to reboot our season.
Completely agree. Even the 2-0 win vs Palace was a bit of brilliance from berahino (our first shot on target) and a goal from a set piece. We have had far too many games where we haven't controlled possession against poor teams due to tactics and team selection when we have players capable of keeping the ball as well as creating a severe lack of chances. He HAD to go
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I agree totally that Clarke's win record in the past year or so made it inevitable that he would get the boot, but in many ways he was unfairly treated. By all accounts it was not his decision to select players to sign, though he no doubt had an input. Who wanted to sign Anichebe, Anelka and Sessegnon, players whose wages alone must be costing a fortune? Anichebe and Sessegnon appear to be two panic last minute buys. Why did we re-sign Gera and Reid, two injury prone players with a very poor record of being fit to play? Why didn't we stump up the extra cash which would have seen Lukaku back with us for another season? We never appeared to make such poor decisions when Ashworth was involved, so how much influence did Garlick have in these signings - and non signing?
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I agree totally that Clarke's win record in the past year or so made it inevitable that he would get the boot, but in many ways he was unfairly treated. By all accounts it was not his decision to select players to sign, though he no doubt had an input. Who wanted to sign Anichebe, Anelka and Sessegnon, players whose wages alone must be costing a fortune? Anichebe and Sessegnon appear to be two panic last minute buys. Why did we re-sign Gera and Reid, two injury prone players with a very poor record of being fit to play? Why didn't we stump up the extra cash which would have seen Lukaku back with us for another season? We never appeared to make such poor decisions when Ashworth was involved, so how much influence did Garlick have in these signings - and non signing?
I appreciate it is difficult to work for JP, but our early season targets had a distinct whiff of ex-Chelsea (Anelka, Kalou, Sinclair) and known quantities (Gera, Reid, Popov). To me that speaks clearly of Clarke input.
People can speculate all they want but I don't think Lukaku was ever truly on his way back to us, the whole Everton deal stinks of in game politics.
I agree our off season was a shambles but I believe Clarke was pussyfooting about, like he did during most of the games during his time here, trying to keep too many people happy. We needed a shakeup in some departments (Rosenberg, Popov, Dorrans/Morrison/Brunt eg.) to make room for new hungry players/new blood. We knew PO had to leave so we needed to be on the ball with a sharp replacement etc.
PO is probably a good example of how it can be difficult to work with JP, I'm guessing JP refused to sign anyone until PO was sold which means the options for replacements were limited. Such cases must be frustrating for the head coach. Still, for whatever reason we were weak in the off season when we needed to be decisive after a very poor winter/spring.
Hopefully now we can get a head coach with clear initiative and goals yet still able to think outside the box when needed and not get caught in dogma.
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At least he can go for his dream job at Chelsea now!!!!
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I think its a bit harsh for people to keep saying what rubbish signings we made in the summer and deadline day, some of these signings are barely 3 x months into their Albion careers so to write them off as poor is a bit premature.
Last few games the whole team (not just summer signings) have been rubbish, before that i bet you could go back to the postings on Sessegnon from 6 x weeks ago saying what a great signing he was, same applies to Amilfitano, they are in a poor run of form but doesnt make them awful signings.
Anichebe i think has played around 3 x games as the main striker, one of those was against Man United and we was awesome, other than that its been fits and spurts so you cant see he is awful, nor can we say he is brilliant, same as our other signings its too early too call. Players such as Sinclair, Vdyra, Lugano have barely had a chance due to injury, etc so cant judge their value yet either.
I would be more looking at players who since November of last year have performed below par - Olsson, Ridgewell, Yacob, Morrison, Brunt, Long namely and i dont think GMac or Mulumbu have been at the top of their game either but they have still been better than the others.
I think most of the players have let down Clarke to a certain extent, and i also think he got it wrong in not really knowing his best team and after having a certain style (ie - counter attack) we have seemed to lose our way last few games.
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My collected thoughts on the Clarke sacking
http://tinyurl.com/nmd52kv
Ultimately paid the price for some poor decisions and some unwise potshots at the board in the press but there was something inevitable about it as soon as we dropped below the point a game average over the first half of the season.
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First time I've ever not read one of your post's after the first couple of lines, thought you were better then that z&b :'(
I'm sorry you feel that way.
We all disagree on something's and clearly him going was always going to be emotive, I would say many people only get to hear certain bits and pieces and there was plenty not right with Clarkes regime.....still onwards and upwards.
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Steve Clarke could find himself back in a job with Jose Mourinho
http://www.sportsdirectnews.com/premier-league-news/37330-clarke-could-rejoin-mourinho-at-chelsea.php#.Uq9IKsuYZEY
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According to Skybet Clarke is favourite for the Watford gig
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I think people put to much emphasis on garlick. He oversees operations we have scouts and a chief scout.
We are a prudently run club this at times will be our downfall we can't unearth mulumbus and olsons year in year out it is not realistic.
The director of football may finalise deals but a great deal of who the club signs is down to the manager. Hodgson wanted long and McCauley he got them. Clarke wanted Anelka and Malouda the club went for them we only got one.
Yes so far Lugano looks a pants signing sometimes foreign players dont settle. However when he signed and we had got the 90+ capped of Uruguay most of us were happy. Vydra championship top scorer last year (although hasn't had a chance yet) again most of us very happy. When Sinclair signed he was tee type of player we needed (got injured)
Anelka has been injured a lot and played in a different system to how he got 9 or so goals pre season.
These 4 signings I mention we can't fault garlick for: Clarke is to blame for not playing
vydra. Clarke is to blame for wanting Anelka- playing him preseason and not in the actual season in the same formation as he and Rosenberg were scoring for fun. Clarke is to blame for Vydra having played about 45 mins total hasn't given a chance. It's not garlicky fault that Sinclair got injured. It's not garlicks fault that Lugano couldn't get a game due to form of gmac and Olson and when he got a game he looked out of his depth.
With regards to sessi Clarke wanted more flair players we got sessi and Morgan who arguably have been our best offensive players this season. We tied down berahino maybe when his head could have been turned by money and still have him on quite a modest contract. Clarke wanted a new target man after regretting not asking to keep maf garlick has got him one!
The only bad business that we can blame him for is popov!
And with regard to Gera, our form completely went when he got injured last season a 1 year deal again didn't look bad business (might even freshen side up) similar with Steven Reid good honest pro not a bad back up. Club new alot of business to be done so kept him as back up.
Personally I don't think garlick has done anything wrong and it's really straw clutching. We can properly assess this next summer when he either have a big turn over off the back of relegation or having stayed up see what he does with Gera Reid Anelka amalfitano sinclair.
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I realize that there is a chance that this sacking backfires on us (I think there no obviously high calibre candidate like Roy waiting to take over this time) and we end up getting relegated.
Nonetheless I am SO happy Clarke has gone. I have been an Albion fan for 37 years and even in the darkest of days I have never been so demoralized as I became recently, almost to the point of emotional disengagement.
My problem with Clarke is his insistence on shuffling the pack every time he sits down to write the teamsheet. Either he is indecisive or he is over-mindful of the need to keep about 24 players happy. I think his endless rotation has KILLED us.
I hope the new boss keeps a more stable team. I realize you might need to tweak selection and formation so that you have a 'home team' and an 'away team' or even 'playing a top 7 team' and 'playing anyone else team'...and I also know that sometimes after 60 minutes you might want to bring subs on. But even with those requirements you only need a core of your 16 best players...the other 6-8 squad players, whether they like it or not, are there to cover injuries or drastic loss of form. And loss of form means you have been consistently poor and you get replaced for 8+ games while the other bloke shows what he can do.
How can any of our strikers settle in and play to their best when they keep going in and out of the side? Its madness.
We need a massive cull of dead wood in the window (and nobody in thanks - lets move forward with what we've got) - we all know who we are talking about, theres at least 6 of them, maybe more.
Then we need to decide what formation, what core of 16, run with it and see what happens. Thats NOT what we've been doing for the last year, and we've brought misfortune on ourselves.
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Great post Wapping. Didn't know his best 11 or best formation after 18 months and didn't know how to get his team motivated enough to cross the halfway like and have a go.
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I am inclined to agree with Wapping. The core of the problem is that Clarke learnt his trade at big clubs working with big squads and talented players. For the likes of Chelsea who will play two games a week for most of the season rotation is essential but and this is the critical difference their second string in many cases is better than most of our first choice players. Equally better players because of their better technique are more flexible and can play out of their best position without looking completely lost.
Albion are slightly different proposition. Our players generally are not as good have notable flaws in their game and our resources do not stretch to two above average Premier League players for every position. I think Hodgson understood this and compensated with organisation a consistent formation and as such he kept changes to the starting XI to a minimum.
Obviously the downside is in the final months of the season the players get jaded but that is of little importance when the seasons primary objective of survival has been secured.
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I have been quizzed by supporters of different teams as to if it is a harsh dismissal. no was my answer,and similar to many comments my argument was he tinkered too much and most the time the players who needed replacing were left in the team. we looked good when we had anichebe as a focal point with sess,morgan,berahino and Sinclair operating off him. as much as I like brunt I think the team as outgrown him as a wide midfielder.
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Reasons why he had to go:
1. Declining discipline standards within the club - from the use of twitter, to the kit man copping us a fine for writing on a matchball right through to the players having a drinking session until 1.30am in the hotel bar the night before they lost 4-1 to Norwich at the end of last season.
2. The abandonment of width in the team despite our few good results over the past 12 months being yielded because of this (pace and energy either side with a big man up top).
3. The woefully out of form yet un droppable Amalfitano.
4. Falling into the Shane Long trap and the inevitable long ball hoofball with midfield three miles from the striker it brings.
5. His abject failure to react to Lamberts subs and standing there helpless as our 2-0 lead was wiped away.
6. Starting games like we were defending 1-0 leads and only waking up when losing (or in Saturdays case, not waking up at all).
7. His 100% insistence that we sign Anelka and subsequently ignoring him.
8. The ignoring of Berahino.
We were going down under Clarke, going down with the best modern day squad we've ever had.
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Think we need to understand why so many players hit a run of bad form all at the same time.
Was it down to the head coach or to the players thinking that this season was going to be easy after their eight-placed finish last time?
Either way, it's easy to see why the team is struggling to get a result, with Olsson, Ridgewell, Yacob, Morrison, Sessegnon, Amalfitano and Anichebe all well short of what they showed in the early part of the season. Add to that, the injuries to Foster and Sinclair, and other players, which as McAuley, Mulumbu and Long also blowing hot and cold, it's hardly surprising that we suddenly find ourselves among the relegation candidates.
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Reasons why he had to go:
1. Declining discipline standards within the club - from the use of twitter, to the kit man copping us a fine for writing on a matchball right through to the players having a drinking session until 1.30am in the hotel bar the night before they lost 4-1 to Norwich at the end of last season.
2. The abandonment of width in the team despite our few good results over the past 12 months being yielded because of this (pace and energy either side with a big man up top).
3. The woefully out of form yet un droppable Amalfitano.
4. Falling into the Shane Long trap and the inevitable long ball hoofball with midfield three miles from the striker it brings.
5. His abject failure to react to Lamberts subs and standing there helpless as our 2-0 lead was wiped away.
6. Starting games like we were defending 1-0 leads and only waking up when losing (or in Saturdays case, not waking up at all).
7. His 100% insistence that we sign Anelka and subsequently ignoring him.
8. The ignoring of Berahino.
We were going down under Clarke, going down with the best modern day squad we've ever had.
agree with most of your post but not this. I don't think he's been out of form at all, he just gets 2 or 3 players on him most of the time and no bugger offering him an outlet.
He still manages to get decent balls into the box but our attackers can't stick them away.
He also does a lot to help out Billy Jones and they seem to have forged a decent understanding.
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through to the players having a drinking session until 1.30am in the hotel bar the night before they lost 4-1 to Norwich at the end of last season.
Seriously ? If that was the case I am surprised that the axe didn't fall sooner and it also puts a the recent jolly to Dublin in a somewhat harsher light. Sounds like some of players are taking the urine but reflects very badly on the Coaching staff.
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through to the players having a drinking session until 1.30am in the hotel bar the night before they lost 4-1 to Norwich at the end of last season.
Seriously ? If that was the case I am surprised that the axe didn't fall sooner and it also puts a the recent jolly to Dublin in a somewhat harsher light. Sounds like some of players are taking the pee but reflects very badly on the Coaching staff.
My only surprise is people's surprise ,amongst many many reason he had to go I think Clarke was way to close/soft with the players (or at least a selection) .
There's also plenty of other stuff, some in isolation you can almost ignore, put together and ....bye bye.
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Although I liked Clarke I always had a feeling he let them get away with too much. Look at Odemwingie's twitter rants, would that have happened under Roy? I'm not so sure. Also Mulumbu's silly red cards and Popov's spitting from last season. Our discipline under Roy was superb.
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Although I liked Clarke I always had a feeling he let them get away with too much. Look at Odemwingie's twitter rants, would that have happened under Roy? I'm not so sure. Also Mulumbu's silly red cards and Popov's spitting from last season. Our discipline under Roy was superb.
Great point,just out of interest did odemwingie ever say anything on twitter when Roy questioned his commitment?i cant remember him ever saying anything about it even though it really hurt him. Maybe im wrong but nothing springs to mind.
Odemwingie ran riot under Clarke where as with Roy he was in check even though he was unhappy!
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My only surprise is people's surprise ,amongst many many reason he had to go I think Clarke was way to close/soft with the players (or at least a selection) .
There's also plenty of other stuff, some in isolation you can almost ignore, put together and ....bye bye.
Honestly Zippy I am a little taken aback. I obviously could see the downturn in form and the on field lapses but boozing the night before a game is beyond the pale and symptomatic of a shambolic regime. If I were in charge of the club all concerned would be shipped out at the earliest opportunity regardless of reputation or status.
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Although I liked Clarke I always had a feeling he let them get away with too much. Look at Odemwingie's twitter rants, would that have happened under Roy? I'm not so sure. Also Mulumbu's silly red cards and Popov's spitting from last season. Our discipline under Roy was superb.
Agreed, I was going to make this point myself and I was going to say the warning signs were there when Odemwingie kicked out against Fulham a la Di Matteo away at Blackpool. And say what you want about Odemwingie but IMO he didn't manage him well. Our top scorer in the previous two seasons and he basically kept us up the first season (a 15 goal seasons striker was something we had never had in the PL before), yet Clarke only ever played him on the wing or on the bench, I would be sightly pee'd off if I was PO too.
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Although I liked Clarke I always had a feeling he let them get away with too much. Look at Odemwingie's twitter rants, would that have happened under Roy? I'm not so sure. Also Mulumbu's silly red cards and Popov's spitting from last season. Our discipline under Roy was superb.
Don't pin Mulumbu's red cards on Clarke - he's been getting 'em long before SC arrived - think Everton away first year up under RDM. Popov - would he really have thought twice about doing it under Roy don't think so. Let's not make SC total scapegoat for all the clubs failings.
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Nonetheless I am SO happy Clarke has gone. I have been an Albion fan for 37 years and even in the darkest of days I have never been so demoralized as I became recently, almost to the point of emotional disengagement.
I'm truly bemused that any Albion fan who's followed the club for 37 years can find the Clarke era, including a full season when we finished 8th in the Prem and the following season, admittedly disappointing at times, where we have won at Old Trafford and came within a whisker of winning at Stamford Bridge and went "toe to toe" with Arsenal, to be more demoralizing than the dark times of the mid 1980's, the relegation to the old Div 3, the Gould era, Halifax and Woking in the Cup and onto the brink of entering the financial abyss in the late 1990's etc, etc,
How expectations have changed over the years?
I know I'm going to get hammered for saying this but onto the thread generally, it seems a shame that some seem intent on chipping away until the full character assassination is complete. I guess that's the downside of the nature of anonymous posting on forums and social media, but I have to say I'd be intrigued about the source (if any) of some of the unsubstantiated stories being raised.
Just a personal view.
I was one of the 51% who voted on the site poll to continue to back SC, but do take on board the background to the Directors decision to remove him from the position of Head Coach and to look for a replacement.
Ultimately I believe the club is in good hands and trust their judgement as clearly their perspective includes a lot more insight than an ordinary Albion supporter like myself.
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Nonetheless I am SO happy Clarke has gone. I have been an Albion fan for 37 years and even in the darkest of days I have never been so demoralized as I became recently, almost to the point of emotional disengagement.
Mate its all about opinions i know.ive been going up since 93 and whats happening now in my opinion is nothing like the alan buckley days, the brian little days and the dennis smith days and i didnt see the late 80's ealry 90's which by all accounts was worse then them.
Im in the sack clarke camp,its got poor but has it really got that bad, i dont think it has
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I'm truly bemused that any Albion fan who's followed the club for 37 years can find the Clarke era, including a full season when we finished 8th in the Prem and the following season, admittedly disappointing at times, where we have won at Old Trafford and came within a whisker of winning at Stamford Bridge and went "toe to toe" with Arsenal, to be more demoralizing than the dark times of the mid 1980's, the relegation to the old Div 3, the Gould era, Halifax and Woking in the Cup and onto the brink of entering the financial abyss in the late 1990's etc, etc,
How expectations have changed over the years?
I know I'm going to get hammered for saying this but onto the thread generally, it seems a shame that some seem intent on chipping away until the full character assassination is complete. I guess that's the downside of the nature of anonymous posting on forums and social media, but I have to say I'd be intrigued about the source (if any) of some of the unsubstantiated stories being raised.
Just a personal view.
I was one of the 51% who voted on the site poll to continue to back SC, but do take on board the background to the Directors decision to remove him from the position of Head Coach and to look for a replacement.
Ultimately I believe the club is in good hands and trust their judgement as clearly their perspective includes a lot more insight than an ordinary Albion supporter like myself.
I think the problem is two fold firstly Clarke inherited a very stable situation form Hodgson and it looked like he was going build on that platform which hiked up expectations. The second problem is that the deterioration since the high point last year to now has been dramatic and recently seems to have accelerated. In terms of my own perception this feels like a massive let down particularly when you could argue that we have some of the best players at the club in a generation.
I understand people of my generation feeling worse about our current predicament in someways than when we were slogging through years of pretty dire football with very little hope. During those years we were rubbish we had a squad of journeyman pro's anyone any good was sold and somehow we muddled through. Rightly or wrongly though I seldom felt short changed by those guys and I am not so sure about the current generation.
Rumours of ill discipline may or may not be accurate but given the backdrop of an implosion in our form and some of the issues petty or otherwise that have leaked into the public domain they find a resonance with supporters.The video of the Xmas party barely raised an eyebrow at the time but then the players turned up for the Cardiff game like they had been on the lash for the preceding week one does begin to wonder what the hell is going on.
I personally feel disinclined to vilify Clarke he made mistakes we all do, if some of his players let him down and took liberties then I am sure he will be less trusting in future. I hope he succeeds in his next role he seems a decent and honorable man.
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I'm truly bemused that any Albion fan who's followed the club for 37 years can find the Clarke era, including a full season when we finished 8th in the Prem and the following season, admittedly disappointing at times, where we have won at Old Trafford and came within a whisker of winning at Stamford Bridge and went "toe to toe" with Arsenal, to be more demoralizing than the dark times of the mid 1980's, the relegation to the old Div 3, the Gould era, Halifax and Woking in the Cup and onto the brink of entering the financial abyss in the late 1990's etc, etc,
How expectations have changed over the years?
it seems a shame that some seem intent on chipping away until the full character assassination is complete.
You are right to say that my disillusionment is largely based on heightened expectations. When you had drawn at Burnley last week it didnt hurt so much to lose to Cardiff. But when you know you have a set of players capable of taking points off Man U /Chelsea and Arsenal it is INFURIATING to lose to Cardiff. "Its the hope that kills you!"
Another aspect is momentum. When we first got relegated to the old Div 2 I think we felt like fallen giants and all believed that "we'd be back"...in the event it took us way longer than we expected but there was the feeling that 'tomorrow will be better'. Our rapid fall from the top 5 position that we gained early last year was a stark lesson that we had plateaud out - from that point we knew tomorrow would be worse.
As for character assassination - of course I only know him from media, but I dont find Clarke unlikeable ( the Everton stories posted on here dont really put me off him, there's no loyalty in football, him wanting to go there is just as understandable (and loyal!) as us deciding to sack him). In terms of personality the only Albion manager I felt a personal affection for was Sir Garry Megson...but I thought ToMo gave the best press conferences. In terms of handling the sacking, SC has probably been slightly more dignified than WBA.
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To be fair to Clarke he has been badly let down by a player who's cost us at least 5 points and a Vile loving ref who cost us 2 points.
If we'd been sitting on 22 points I doubt he would have been sacked and most of us would be pretty happy for me it's a case of luck going against him.
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To be fair to Clarke he has been badly let down by a player who's cost us at least 5 points and a Vile loving ref who cost us 2 points.
If we'd been sitting on 22 points I doubt he would have been sacked and most of us would be pretty happy for me it's a case of luck going against him.
I agree to an extent but how do you explain our form January - May last season?
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To be fair to Clarke he has been badly let down by a player who's cost us at least 5 points and a Vile loving ref who cost us 2 points.
If we'd been sitting on 22 points I doubt he would have been sacked and most of us would be pretty happy for me it's a case of luck going against him.
It is true, game changing incidents have happened this season completely out of Clarke's hands that have cost him his job;
Penalty V Arsenal
Penalty V Stoke & Sess miss
Penalty V Chelsea
Sess miss v Villa would have killed the game
These incidents are criminal and they went against Clarke because if the correct decision or outcome happened we would have a very healthy league position and he would be in a job. These don't even count as if's and but's as they are so blatant.
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My collected thoughts on the Clarke sacking
http://tinyurl.com/nmd52kv
Ultimately paid the price for some poor decisions and some unwise potshots at the board in the press but there was something inevitable about it as soon as we dropped below the point a game average over the first half of the season.
Standaman, have only just noticed this link, what an excellent blog. A thoroughly enjoyable read.
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It is true, game changing incidents have happened this season completely out of Clarke's hands that have cost him his job;
Penalty V Arsenal
Penalty V Stoke & Sess miss
Penalty V Chelsea
Sess miss v Villa would have killed the game
These incidents are criminal and they went against Clarke because if the correct decision or outcome happened we would have a very healthy league position and he would be in a job. These don't even count as if's and but's as they are so blatant.
nobody can argue that and of course those if became actualities we would not even be discussing his job, but on the other side of the coin, he is the guy picking players out of form , he is the guy who has put square pegs into round holes, he is the guy who with the exception of the Man U game has been very suspect with his substitutions or lack of, both in their timing and personnel and the over riding statistic of all is 9 wins in 42 games which spread over the two seasons is relegation form in any language, so whether JP has jumped to early remains to be seen
, I just hope whoever takes over gives the young guns their chance, i fully expect to see SB MV and SS starting against Hull and probably VA as well
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It is true, game changing incidents have happened this season completely out of Clarke's hands that have cost him his job;
Penalty V Arsenal
Penalty V Stoke & Sess miss
Penalty V Chelsea
Sess miss v Villa would have killed the game
These incidents are criminal and they went against Clarke because if the correct decision or outcome happened we would have a very healthy league position and he would be in a job. These don't even count as if's and but's as they are so blatant.
If Anelka scores either of his chances against Arsenal, it changes the course of the game and the penalty is irrelevant.
If Ridgewell clears the ball against Chelsea, then Eto'o doesn't score the opener, and we're in a better position.
We could blame referees until the cows come home, but our failings cost us these games. You point to Sessegnon's finishing, but this was within Clakre's control - if the lad has a weak point, you work at it on the training ground until it's stronger. It's no use saying 'if', we have to deal with realities.
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Falloutboy definetly makes sense, we can feel hard done by sure but we had our chances to control the outcome of these games alot better than we did.
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if the lad has a weak point, you work at it on the training ground until it's stronger.
Whose to say we haven't?
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It's a bit late but I'm just going to add that I thought it was the right decision, no matter how much it worries me who we bring in, his time was up.
I'm not going to go into the form over the year or tactics, subs etc but I think we all knew after the Norwich game that if we were to lose the Cardiff he would be clinging on and maybe just about sneak into the Hull game but another awful performance alongside the defeat really put the nail in the coffin. You can't really say it was harsh, maximum he had one more game, also we were looking for at least 4 points from the Cardiff and Hull game so it still it would have been a catch up game if we were to (unlikely) beat Hull with Clarke in charge.
I do feel sorry for him but this is the first time since I have been supporting the club that I have been old enough and clever enough to realise that the manager should be relieved of his duties and actually wanted it to happen. I wish him well for the future, we had some great times under him that are right up there at the top as my time as a supporter but now it's time to focus on the next step for what looks to be a difficult remainder of the season.
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Whose to say we haven't?
Well if we have, and he has shown no improvement and can't take simple chances such as the ones against Villa or Norwich, then you have to look at the coaching - and Steve Clarke was head coach.
When you consider Sessegnon's natural ability, the amount and quality of chances that he misses are incredible. Even though he isn't exactly a 21-year-old breaking through, there is a way to coach a certain amount of finishing prowess into his game.
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Well if we have, and he has shown no improvement and can't take simple chances such as the ones against Villa or Norwich, then you have to look at the coaching - and Steve Clarke was head coach.
When you consider Sessegnon's natural ability, the amount and quality of chances that he misses are incredible. Even though he isn't exactly a 21-year-old breaking through, there is a way to coach a certain amount of finishing prowess into his game.
Mate if the bloke is 29 and played professionally for 12 years if he can't finish now he never will be able to.
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As someone who backed Clarke i was saddened to see him go but not surprised given our form over this season , it's clear the players weren't performing and that just wasn't going to get any better.
I didn't go to Cardiff but did watch the 90 Min's at home on my TV , i sat alone and tried to put myself in a positive frame of mind Pre match and i did think to myself " lets see some fresh faces as we have a big enough squad now"..sadly as the same old lineup appeared in front of me my heart sunk and i could guess what was to follow.
As we know we sit far too deep , hoofing it (and not just to Long) plus the shocking amount of times we give the ball away..oh and the standard "attack when it's usually too late" as I've read a lot this week. I wanted Saturday to be a big improvement and with respect Cardiff aren't brilliant and also have had a bad run of late , sadly we never really looked tuned in and barely took the game to them so much so i muttered to myself at H/T " your just hanging yourself Steve".Post match i suspected he may get the Hull game if he was lucky but when informed via text message Clarke's reign was over from my Dad later that night i was saddened that another young Albion manager had lost his way but deep down knew it was coming.
Was it the right choice ? , i think so and certainly time will tell but i wish Steve the best of luck in whatever he does next particularly as he left with class and dignity.
Even a week on i still feel it's a waste and can't help feeling that maybe he was just a bit too soft with the players at times , i certainly feel allowing the Dublin trip to go ahead after a poor few months was one of the last nails in his coffin.Did they have to go somewhere so public ?...anyway as i say i wish Steve all the best and thank him for some cracking wins...I'm sure he will learn from this.
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Not too far from my feelings Dexy though I thought he might get Christmas to put things right.
Maybe he did not "really" want to ... if as has been suggested there has been tension then quite possibly his own drive and spirit had waned and this was passing on to the players.
All history now, so thanks for the good bits Steve clearly a thoroughly decent bloke, good luck for the future.
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I read on another thread that someone posted that in their opinion the majority of Albion fans disagreed with Clarke going?
The media said it was wrong but they haven't watched more than highlights and the big 4 v wba.
Personally he had to go. Negative football, devoid of attacking plans, wrong team selection of players badly out of form, hoof ball to long, subs in the 90th minute, poor form since Hodgson effect wore off last Xmas. However, I did like the way he conducted himself, believed he cared about the Albion and supposed to be a nice bloke.
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The way we played yesterday was evidence enough.He should never have been appointed in the first place.JP got it wrong.I told you all at the time it would end in tears and i was right all along
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Agree with everything in your post cads ap. Clarke is a honest, decent man, but football is a results driven game.
Turgid football,wrong team selections, no plan B , using subs too late, all contributed to his dismissal.
Whether we did the right thing remains to be seen, but personally i believe we did.
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yes im sorry i did like the man as a man but when it comes to football, way too negative, we didnt seem to react until we were a goal down, substitutions rarely worked and were nearly always too late, didnt have a plan b, didnt adapt systems or players effectively to different games, very uninspiring team selections and tactics, seemed scared to drop certain players or give some players chances, 2013 record is relegation form simple as , just not good enough,
villa game - too slow to react to the sway of the game in the second half, was obvious villa looked a lot more threatening second half long looked tired after about ten minutes, way too slow to react to their subs,
fulham - gmac probably saved his backside here after an awful start
norwich - in all fairness not his fault none of our players had the shooting boots on
cardiff- why not go for them, we looked out of ideas, didnt really deserve anything out of it at all
relied too much on lukaku for points last season, without him where would clarke and wba be, parted a long time ago in my opinion, after such a promising start to his wba career he never recreated the performances and statistics prove that, barring man utd, arsenal and chelsea we have hardly been inspiring, rode our luck really relying on gmac and olsson to carry both full backs and most the team half the time
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What and where next for Steve Clarke then.Championship or a number 2
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What and where next for Steve Clarke then.Championship or a number 2
Think he will quite easily get another job in the Premiership.
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Think he will quite easily get another job in the Premiership.
cant see it to be honest, not with his record in the last 14 months. He should be looking at somewhere like Milwall if he wants to be head coach
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cant see it to be honest, not with his record in the last 14 months. He should be looking at somewhere like Milwall if he wants to be head coach
Holloway is going Milwall.
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Holloway is going Milwall.
Ok a club of that ilk then
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cant see it to be honest, not with his record in the last 14 months. He should be looking at somewhere like Milwall if he wants to be head coach
People will look at his 8th place finish and most people who are not West Brom fans still think his sacking was very harsh. I believe most teams 10th downwards in the Prem would be happy with him as boss.
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I don't know if this has been pointed out on the thread earlier, but it occurred to me that we might have just about stayed up under Clarke but essentially with more of the same downbeat, uninspired football; so as we went through March/April/May and didn't give him a new contract, we would have faced months of negativity/uncertainty with a jaded and ageing squad. Maybe the hierarchy thought it was better to "twist" now, perhaps increasing the chance of relegation but also increasing the chance of a revival going into next season as happened with the Hodgson appointment.
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I don't know if this has been pointed out on the thread earlier, but it occurred to me that we might have just about stayed up under Clarke but essentially with more of the same downbeat, uninspired football; so as we went through March/April/May and didn't give him a new contract, we would have faced months of negativity/uncertainty with a jaded and ageing squad. Maybe the hierarchy thought it was better to "twist" now, perhaps increasing the chance of relegation but also increasing the chance of a revival going into next season as happened with the Hodgson appointment.
On the basis of the previous 12 months, we would have been relegated, I was starting to be quite certain of it, now, I have a degree of hope.
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I voted no.I never wanted Clarke from day one but I thought he was very unlucky to get the sack having been at Old Trafford and Stamford Bridge this season I think we've played some decent stuff.
To be fair Clarke's been badly let down by a player who couldn't hit a barn door Stoke.Villa and Norwich and two very poor ref decisions not even his biggest critics can deny that.
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Off to Celtic.Nice cushy job for him.I knew he wouldnt get another head job in the premier.Obviously if he does well at Celtic it should build his credit for another go in years to come
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i am convinced Clarke would have kept us up much easier than Mel, it wouldnt have been pretty though. The timing of his sacking was certainly bizarre heading into the busiest time of the season and have felt all along the approaching of the transfer window was the clinching factor in his sacking, with JP being neither prepared to spend or listen to any demands for new players as happened in August. I wish him well wherever he pitches up.
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Can't find anything saying he's gone to Celtic? Jumping the gun a bit!
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Can't find anything saying he's gone to Celtic? Jumping the gun a bit!
Yes nothing confirmed, but heavily rumoured to be in the front-line with Celtic at an advanced stage of deciding their management set-up while Roy Keane has apparently turned down an offer.
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Would be a good place to get back on the managerial ladder - the easiest job in the world!
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Would be a good place to get back on the managerial ladder - the easiest job in the world!
Surprisingly few managers succeed at Celtic and a fair few never manage again or take a break from management for a few years after. Very few finish with careers in the EPL.
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Surprisingly few managers succeed at Celtic and a fair few never manage again or take a break from management for a few years after. Very few finish with careers in the EPL.
Imagine if he came runner up and without a cup win
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Imagine if he came runner up and without a cup win
The odds against that must be astronomical.
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Imagine if he came runner up and without a cup win
Like Corberan Tony Mowbray???
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The odds against that must be astronomical.
Unlikely in his first season but after that who knows? Mowbray and Lennon had the advantage of being regarded as part of the Celtic family. Celtic fans tend to like trophies and attractive football. Trophies weren't enough to keep Strachan popular and attractive football didn't work for Mowbray. Only Tommy Burns has managed not to incur the wrath of Celtic fans without winning much and again he delivered attractive football, was a Celtic legend and was competing against what is begrudgingly regarded as a very ascendant Rangers side. Clarke could come unstuck very quickly and even if successful the outcome at most would be a chance of a championship job, which I would imagine he has the chance of already. Can't really see what is in it for him.
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Easy job for him, no rival for his first year so it may be the easiest year in SPL history, a league win is almost inevitable. Even in the next season he'd be in a strong position, as you'd expect Rangers to start challenging again in a few seasons, not straight away.
So basically even if he does badly, he's almost guaranteed 2 league titles and anything else is a bonus. Even if he came 2nd in his third season in charge he could leave and would still have some credibility. In short, it's a good, easy job for him.
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Did anyone catch if he said anything about Albion? I missed it but I just want to see if he said anything interesting.
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Apparently he said plenty of positive things about us.
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Well I doubt he will say anything but good things about us, up until he actually get his next decent Management job.
He is no fool and he maybe more honest after he has the opportunity to add to his resume.
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Did anyone catch if he said anything about Albion? I missed it but I just want to see if he said anything interesting.
Overall he was quite positive about us. He said that the main reason we struggled was that we didn't replace the goals that Lukaku + Odemwingie gave us which was true. He still seems a bit confused as to why he was let go so early after 4 losses on the bounce. He said he was very confused about the fact we appointed Pepe Mel instead of going for someone with experience but that he was happy we managed to stay up and still spoke to a few of the players towards the end of the season to give them a bit of encouragement!
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I thought he came across very well myself.
Seems he does hold us in high regard, I think the players liked him and I agree with him that we would have stayed up with him at the helm.
It wasnt good for around 12 months though after the 8th placed finish I expected more of the same from us but it wasnt to be.
I liked Clarke, shame it didnt work out
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Good coach. Nice bloke. But the acid test is being able to fix things when its going wrong. He couldnt so the board had to act. Think he benefited from the foundations RH laid down.
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The performance away at Cardiff would have gotten better coaches than him sacked. He can be under no illusions how poor we were last season under him.
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To a large extent, I think he ended up being the fall guy for our poor recruitment throughout 2013. How much of a say he had in that recruitment may have had a bearing on his dismissal, but ultimately, after we lost our most effective wide players (Odemwingie and Gera), failing to adequately replace them, and allowed the full-back situation to deteriorate to the point where any team in the league could waltz down our flanks and put crosses in unchallenged, even the greatest coach in the world would have struggled to get results. Clarke's response to our lack of width and inherent defensive fragility was initially "hoof it to Lukaku", and then after Lukaku was gone, it just gradually became more and more negative and defensive in a doomed effort to grind out 1-0 wins. It was dire to watch, but it's difficult to see what else he could have done with the tools at his disposal; after all, Mel's attacking philosophy with the same tools was undermined by exactly the same problems, and the results were ultimately no better.
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To a large extent, I think he ended up being the fall guy for our poor recruitment throughout 2013. How much of a say he had in that recruitment may have had a bearing on his dismissal, but ultimately, after we lost our most effective wide players (Odemwingie and Gera), failing to adequately replace them, and allowed the full-back situation to deteriorate to the point where any team in the league could waltz down our flanks and put crosses in unchallenged, even the greatest coach in the world would have struggled to get results. Clarke's response to our lack of width and inherent defensive fragility was initially "hoof it to Lukaku", and then after Lukaku was gone, it just gradually became more and more negative and defensive in a doomed effort to grind out 1-0 wins. It was dire to watch, but it's difficult to see what else he could have done with the tools at his disposal; after all, Mel's attacking philosophy with the same tools was undermined by exactly the same problems, and the results were ultimately no better.
Mel had far more problems to face than the limitations of the fullbacks and lack of width. Player and Coach revolt. Hands tied by the Chairman, etc.
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I thought he came across very well myself.
Seems he does hold us in high regard, I think the players liked him and I agree with him that we would have stayed up with him at the helm.
It wasnt good for around 12 months though after the 8th placed finish I expected more of the same from us but it wasnt to be.
I liked Clarke, shame it didnt work out
If he was given the tools to work with this time last season that Irvine is getting now, who knows, it may have been a different story.
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The full back and lack of pace problems have been known for along time, why has it taken this long to address the obvious?
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A proper Director of Football helps.
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The full back and lack of pace problems have been known for along time, why has it taken this long to address the obvious?
Fair question - the decision to give Reid another year after initially releasing him AND taking Popov back on for another year were glaring examples of the complacency in the hierarchy following the 8th place finish.
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Palace fan on R5 yesterday said he thought he might be the man to keep them up.
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Fair question - the decision to give Reid another year after initially releasing him AND taking Popov back on for another year were glaring examples of the complacency in the hierarchy following the 8th place finish.
There definitely is a feeling of freshness to our summer transfer campaign this year isn't there. We know so little of what is actually going on behind the scenes, but I don't think it is unfair to say that last summer was marked by poor management that led to lots of finger pointing, whispering, unhappy campers and weird signings. We can only wonder what would have been if our scouting department had been allowed a greater voice in proceedings. Instead it was pretty much completely ignored in favour of 'known quantities' (Anelka etc brrrr).
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A proper Director of Football helps.
Something that I think Clarke actually worked against.
I feel a good chunk of the way we abandon the scouting & recruitment structures from previous years, was down to SCs growing "influence".
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If Steve was as great as the media and fans of other clubs made out then why hasnt he picked up work yet?
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If Steve was as great as the media and fans of other clubs made out then why hasnt he picked up work yet?
I wouldn't be surprised if he turns up at Fulham pretty soon if he doesn't get the Palace job. Still think he's better to focus on being a good number 2 though at a big club.
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A proper Director of Football helps.
Yes specifically to tell the Head Coach and Head of Recruitment to go take a running jump when they come up with the next Anelka signing. Clarke had a major hand in last summer's debacle and the what if he had backing question is irrelevant because he did have backing, as it turned out too much backing. Garlick was the wrong appointment because he lacked the know how to push back in these situations.
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It didn't help that the whole Garlick and McDonaugh thing ruined our preparations for last season it was a complete mess.
I may be wrong but didn't Clarke push for 2 signings that he personally wanted in Anelka and Sinclair
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It didn't help that the whole Garlick and McDonaugh thing ruined our preparations for last season it was a complete mess.
I may be wrong but didn't Clarke push for 2 signings that he personally wanted in Anelka and Sinclair
Not to mention the protracted and eventually doomed courting of Kalou - all ex-Chelsea and Clarke's picks I'd guess.
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Every body from JP down that is involved in transfers was to blame for last seasons debacle. From Garliks lack of knowledge, McDonoughs too powerful influence, Clarkes poor choices, the money men over paying, Anichebe 6mil ffs,keeping dead wood on, generally leaving every thing too late. It all should have been so much easier last year as we were operating from a relatively strong position having just finished 8th. Instead we found ourselves scrabbling around during the last days of the window and quite probably setting the club back 2 years when we should have been consolidating and trying to move forward. All to blame no single party culpable !!
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If Steve was as great as the media and fans of other clubs made out then why hasnt he picked up work yet?
Don't forget he was still being paid by us until June - if he'd taken another job that would have stopped. Same as RDM is STILL being paid by Chelsea.
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His record over 12 month period I.e . Back end of one season beginning of another was abysmal!!!
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His record over 12 month period I.e . Back end of one season beginning of another was abysmal!!!
Wasn't that good :P
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If Steve was as great as the media and fans of other clubs made out then why hasnt he picked up work yet?
I reckon we are still paying him? He was on a 12 month rolling contract? To get another job he would have to walk away from that?
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I reckon we are still paying him? He was on a 12 month rolling contract? To get another job he would have to walk away from that?
Well he would be getting paid either way.
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I reckon we are still paying him? He was on a 12 month rolling contract? To get another job he would have to walk away from that?
He was given a 2 year contract when he came to us and that ran out in June - don't think it was ever changed to a 12 month rolling
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Should never have been given the job in the first place
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A lot said about Anelka and the Kalou chase. It's also highly likely that if Clarke hadn't been appointed we wouldn't have gone for Lakaku and wouldn't have finished 8th.
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Should never have been given the job in the first place
I agree, similar to the situation we are in now.
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A lot said about Anelka and the Kalou chase. It's also highly likely that if Clarke hadn't been appointed we wouldn't have gone for Lakaku and wouldn't have finished 8th.
A lot has been said, as you say, and much if it total conjecture, like your points about going for Lukaku and finishing 8th. Speculation, pure and simple.
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i'm sure i read somewhere ages ago he'd applied for the everton job before Martinez got it while still with us
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I agree, similar to the situation we are in now.
I'd be thrilled to finish 8th again by a man who should never have been given the job. ::)
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i'm sure i read somewhere ages ago he'd applied for the everton job before Martinez got it while still with us
He did - made sense given he'd relocated and spent previous 12 months in Liverpool area.
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I liked Steve Clarke and it was a shame how things ended in the end.
He wasn't helped with the Odemwingie saga which was basically a knife through the dressing room and at times it really showed. It also created fractions in the fan base which wasn't helpful. Our summer recruitment last season was a bit of a joke too. There was an onus on Clarke and he failed to deliver but he wasn't helped by Garlick seemingly having no presence in his new role and the infighting which soon appeared through McDonough's influence. That's where it needed the chairmans intervention but it was sadly lacking.
Clarke was right, we never replaced the goals of Odemwingie and Lukaku and that was the main reason for our struggles. Had they been replaced adequately he might well have been here now. I'll always be grateful to him, he made following Albion enjoyable by producing some of the best football I've seen from an Albion side and that is something I'll remember fondly.
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Find it interesting people think he shouldnt have been given the job when compared to the 2 that have followed he was way OVERQUALIFIED!! As i said previously last season from start to finish and from top to bottom this club was a shambles as can be seen that in the calendar year to date we have won only 4 games >:( Yes he had to go but the timing was all wrong but with hindsight were we any better after he left imo opinion not really for all Pepe´s charisma he was hoplessly naive and in some ways out of his depth, hard to believe but the defence got worse!
Failing to replace the goals of Lukaku and Odemwingie was the real downfall of Clarke everything else was just a sideshow turning us into the seasons Aunt Sally :(
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http://www.dailystar.co.uk/sport/football/415722/Reading-Steve-Clarke-West-Brom
New Reading boss Steve Clarke takes swipe at old club West Brom
STEVE CLARKE took a swipe at West Brom after landing the Reading job last night.
Clarke replaces Nigel Adkins, who was sacked on Monday following Saturday's disastrous 6-1 defeat by Birmingham.
But he couldn't resist a dig at the Baggies for sacking him almost exactly 12 months ago.
Clarke, 51, said: "I've got nothing to prove. My time at West Brom was successful. Since I've left things have not improved.
Is he right or wrong? What position was we in when he got sacked. We did seem to be going in one direction with him im charge
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In fairness i think he has a point. 12 Months on and we really havent moved forward, still loitering around the same position and points mark so i guess its fair.
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He is right in what hes saying.
Just hope he can concentrate on his new job from now on and not continue to make little remarks.
All the best Steve.
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To be fair he was asked whether he had something to prove after the West Brom job which he didn't because he did well here. Can't argue with what he said, I think we would have finished last season a lot more comfortably with Clarke at the helm. Anyway time to move on, I'm sure Clarke will do a cracking job at Reading.
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I still think he was rightly sacked, 1 win in 10 and one of the worst runs in a year saw him go along with some poor performances. Yes he started off well regardless of whether he was riding Roys waves or whether it was down to Clarke himself but when it started turning he didn't seem to know how to change it around, possibly due to inexperience.
Hindsight is a wonderful thing but he was sacked after a string of poor performances and could have had no complaints if he had gone earlier than he did.
I wish him well in whatever he does.
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Ill be keeping an eye on Readings results for a while.
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Could argue that the rot started with him and we are still trying to put right his mess. The decline in home form certainly started under his tenure.
Not saying this is correct but if you put a different spin on it, it paints a different picture.
Good luck to him, don't think he'll pull up any trees, but should have enough to keep them safe.
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Should never have sacked him. The board seemed to expert the team to keep firing without Pete & the fridge; in reality we have struggled along in the bottom third of the league ever since they left as we don't have the firepower to be a mid-table outfit. Clarke was a good coach - had we not over achieved the year before they might not have got rid of him. Peace made a massive mistake and it almost cost us our prem place. Good look to him at Reading.
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Should never have sacked him. The board seemed to expert the team to keep firing without Pete & the fridge; in reality we have struggled along in the bottom third of the league ever since they left as we don't have the firepower to be a mid-table outfit. Clarke was a good coach - had we not over achieved the year before they might not have got rid of him. Peace made a massive mistake and it almost cost us our prem place. Good look to him at Reading.
How do you know Clarke wasn't involved in the treatment of Pete that tipped him over the edge - it's fair to say his contextually 'crazy' claims there was a players clique have since been all but proven true.
Steve Clarke had less points from 15 games than Irvine. Yet he shouldn't have been sacked and AI should?
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To have gone from Clarke to Irvine in 12 months does seem to me to be a step or several in the wrong direction.If we were currently involved in a managerial search and the final appointment came down to a direct choice between Clarke and Irvine at the same stage of their careers as when we appointed them which would you prefer.
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To have gone from Clarke to Irvine in 12 months does seem to me to be a step or several in the wrong direction.If we were currently involved in a managerial search and the final appointment came down to a direct choice between Clarke and Irvine at the same stage of their careers as when we appointed them which would you prefer.
Clarke.
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Definitely Clarke - he is right, we have stood still in spite of our Summer "investments". I really wish we had stuck with SC.
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We were stagnating under Clarke with his 70 minutes of defending and 20 minutes of trying to save the gameas opposed to winning it. We generally play better football now although it's with the wrong players.
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He is at his level one level up from who we have right now
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Why do pundits talk rubbish, according to Danny Murphy tonight, Steve was harshly treated by us. These muppets need to do their homework.
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at least he will see Wembley this year
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Why do pundits talk rubbish, according to Danny Murphy tonight, Steve was harshly treated by us. These muppets need to do their homework.
The media in general hated us for sacking Clarke. I have never seen such an unnecessary outpouring of grief. No matter how many times we showed them the formbook, we were always going to be the bad guys.
But still, fair play to him, and best of luck against Arsenal.
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The media in general hated us for sacking Clarke. I have never seen such an unnecessary outpouring of grief. No matter how many times we showed them the formbook, we were always going to be the bad guys.
But still, fair play to him, and best of luck against Arsenal.
The media were ignorant. All they could refer to was a couple of very good performances against top sides, which caught their attention. They were oblivious to the fact we were losing game after game against sides around us at the bottom, which doesn't offset a decent point away at a top side.
I like Steve Clarke, a good honest football man. Very hard to dislike him, just like Irvine. Just out of his depth as a number one in the Premier League. Delighted if he does well at Reading, he deserves it, but he has a right level as a number one.
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simply a function of the "press" focussing totally upon matches involving the usual suspects, WBA v Hull will not get any attention and thereore the "press" remain ignorant.
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The media were ignorant. All they could refer to was a couple of very good performances against top sides, which caught their attention. They were oblivious to the fact we were losing game after game against sides around us at the bottom, which doesn't offset a decent point away at a top side.
I like Steve Clarke, a good honest football man. Very hard to dislike him, just like Irvine. Just out of his depth as a number one in the Premier League. Delighted if he does well at Reading, he deserves it, but he has a right level as a number one.
I have to disagree with him being out his depth when he led us to our highest ever Premier League finish. We were also 9th in the table when Ramires dived in the last minute to get Chelsea a draw and a couple of games later Clarke was sacked. I was concerned with our run of form but he should have been given a couple of more games. Taking Reading to an FA Cup Semi Final is a good achievement for him as well as keeping them up and I'm sure he'll have them near the play offs next season.
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Two things cost Clarke his job bad ref decisions and Sess's finishing.
Chelsea,Arsenal,Villa and Stoke all ended in draws all four should have been wins which would have given us eight extra points.
Stone wall pens against Stoke and Arsenal and the one given against us at the bridge were poor decisions. And sess's finishing against Stoke and in the Villa home draw where he could have put us 3-0 at half time.
I think clarke was unlucky to lose his job with us
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Two things cost Clarke his job bad ref decisions and Sess's finishing.
Chelsea,Arsenal,Villa and Stoke all ended in draws all four should have been wins which would have given us eight extra points.
Stone wall pens against Stoke and Arsenal and the one given against us at the bridge were poor decisions. And sess's finishing against Stoke and in the Villa home draw where he could have put us 3-0 at half time.
I think clarke was unlucky to lose his job with us
me too 8)
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Good luck to him in the Semi finals.
Cant see them getting a result though, but will be a good day out for all of Reading.
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I have to disagree with him being out his depth when he led us to our highest ever Premier League finish. We were also 9th in the table when Ramires dived in the last minute to get Chelsea a draw and a couple of games later Clarke was sacked. I was concerned with our run of form but he should have been given a couple of more games. Taking Reading to an FA Cup Semi Final is a good achievement for him as well as keeping them up and I'm sure he'll have them near the play offs next season.
The run of form from early January that year was woeful. He was clueless to arrest the slump. That's what I meant by being out of his depth.
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Two things cost Clarke his job bad ref decisions and Sess's finishing.
Chelsea,Arsenal,Villa and Stoke all ended in draws all four should have been wins which would have given us eight extra points.
Stone wall pens against Stoke and Arsenal and the one given against us at the bridge were poor decisions. And sess's finishing against Stoke and in the Villa home draw where he could have put us 3-0 at half time.
I think clarke was unlucky to lose his job with us
Your point about that Villa game is a good one . In the first half we looked a class side and had sess taken that chance would have been 3 up . For me though that's where it changed for Clarke . Lambert made 3 substitutions that affected the play and we couldn't handle it . Clarke just didn't react and subsequently we chucked the points . That is the difference between a good coach and manager in the heat if the moment making the correct decisions is crucial for me both Clarke and Irvine lacked in that respect .
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How many games did we win in at home in 2014? 3 or 4 was it? Yes we finished 8th in Clarke's first season but that was on the back of an outstanding run of form up to December. After that, we were pretty poor resultswise for around 12 months under him. There was no sign of results improving! Admittedly he didnt have a lot of luck but at the same time, I felt we were heading backwards under him.
Tony Pulis has shown what organisation and having a solid system can do for you. In the space of 2 months he has turned us from a team without direction or purpose into a hard working, tough to beat unit. It has shown in the fact that we have won nearly as many home games under Pulis as we have won at home for the last 2 years!!!
Excuses can be made for any manager, some valid some not, but the simple matter is Hodgson and Pulis have shown that decent managers can turn round a team in a short space of time when they have the ability to organise and motivate!
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He also looks much better with the fashionable beard! ;D
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Let's not forget how poor and tacticly naive he was and he was sacked for good reason, standing like a rabbit in the headlights as villa come from 2 down being a good example. His form at Reading is hardly amazing they have beaten I think 2 fellow championship teams and a league 1 team in a replay... And in the league lost 5 ( I think) out of the last 8, he's ok where he is in my opinion.
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He will be sacked by reading this time next year
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You won't hear many Albion fans bemoan Clarke's sacking, we could all see what was happening, his inexperience meant he was really struggling to turn the tide, he lost his way, tactically we were all over the shop and the team selections were becoming more and more bizarre. People who constantly bleat about how unfair his sacking was are the types who have been brainwashed by the likes of Gary Lineker and his ilk.
I wish Clarke all the best, he will be a better manager in the long run for what happened to him at the Albion but it does infuriate me when pundits have a pop at us for it, strange that those who were watching us every week and paying to do so didn't disagree with the sacking but those who watch 4 minute of us on MOTD every week did.
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Clarke lead us to our highest ever premiership finish and in the process we played some very good incisive counter-attacking football. I also don't agree with the comments that he was out of his depth tactically. When he left our organisation and ability to defend set pieces slowly started to disintegrate. He did a good job and his sacking was a mistake, we went backwards thereafter until TP took over.
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Clarke lead us to our highest ever premiership finish and in the process we played some very good incisive counter-attacking football. I also don't agree with the comments that he was out of his depth tactically. When he left our organisation and ability to defend set pieces slowly started to disintegrate. He did a good job and his sacking was a mistake, we went backwards thereafter until TP took over.
7 wins in the whole of 2013 suggests to me that the disentegration of organisation etc had started whilst in charge. Unfortunately a couple of dreadful appointments afterwards compounded this - this was more the reason we continued to decline rather than us missing Clarke.
He did lead us to our highest ever finish, but this was done on the back of excellent form for a few months at the start of the season. When the side began to struggle, he did nothing to turn our fortunes around.
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Steve's success in the 1st half season was based on the foundation which laid by Hodgson. In fact our team was declining since 2014.
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The true test of a manager is when things start to go awry and how they react. It is easy to manage a winning side.
Clarke inherited a good side from Roy and got off to a flying start, unfortunately once the wheels started to come off - notably Chelsea away and Villa at home, he was found wanting.
Sherwood beware!!!!
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I take the good and the bad with Clarke. Many fans want to credit the good to Hodgson rather than the man who was in charge which is a nonsense. When Clarke took over he kicked us on again. Easy to forget the many boring games and negative tactics under Roy. Perhaps Roy's success should be credited to his predecessor or Tony Pulis success should be credited to Irvine?! It's inconsistent and wrong. Simply put we had an amazing spell with Clarke, an par spell and a very poor spell and I hold him responsible for all of that time. The stuff we played between August and Xmas was our best ever level, way above Roy (who also did a good job). Anyway don't mean to bleat on but Clarke doesn't get the credit he deserves. Good luck to him at Reading.
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I n fairness, find a manager / head coach with CV which can justifiably claim,
Worked alongside Mourinhio at champions league final level,
coached winners of Premier League (x3):
coached winners of FA Cup (x1)
coached winners of League Cup (x2)
Led a medium size club to a top eight EPL finish,
Taking a mediocre champs side to an FA cup semi,
and you would be very lucky,
i agree it went wrong for a while, but I do think we will see S.Clarke resurgent soon
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I n fairness, find a manager / head coach with CV which can justifiably claim,
Worked alongside Mourinhio at champions league final level,
coached winners of Premier League (x3):
coached winners of FA Cup (x1)
coached winners of League Cup (x2)
Led a medium size club to a top eight EPL finish,
Taking a mediocre champs side to an FA cup semi,
and you would be very lucky,
i agree it went wrong for a while, but I do think we will see S.Clarke resurgent soon
More chance of platting fog.