[beechyboy90]

There will be games we need Livermore but against the poorer sides in the league when we can actually football sides off the park that's what we should do.

Livermore worth a spot on bench to sure games up or add steal etc. Krov and Gallagher as the 2 allowing periera to go through middle worked in our best spell last year and it worked tonight

[BalisPen]

I remember when he signed it was reported he'd played at ch for Hull, so he may be an option there.

But, I want him out of the MF as I have basically had enough of his terrible passing. I cut him a lot of slack as I still put a lot of significance on playing for England despite David Nugent getting a cap, but he has difficulty making a simple pass.

I don't blame him for the OG but his bad passes giveaway possession too easily.

[Hull Baggie]

There will be games we need Livermore but against the poorer sides in the league when we can actually football sides off the park that's what we should do.

Livermore worth a spot on bench to sure games up or add steal etc. Krov and Gallagher as the 2 allowing periera to go through middle worked in our best spell last year and it worked tonight

we didn't have Gallagher last year. You are right though that it worked last night.

[seteefeet]

Hope this is Bilic's epiphany regarding Livermore and he is out for the foreseeable. We just look so much better without him. Apart from him not being particularly good at passing, tackling or running, he just slows everyone down. When he's not passing backwards, he's telling everyone else to pass backwards. Numerous times last night Krov or Gallacher picked up the ball and, instinctively, looked to rive forward and Livermore would be either pointing to a CH or fullback to initiate a backwards pass or, putting his hand up to receive the ball and passing it backwards himself.
This bloke is our captain so holds a lot of sway with the other lads on the pitch, especially the younger ones, therefore, he has a real impact on the tempo of the game. No coincidence that, when he went off, we played on the front foot and the midfield looked like the shackles had been removed.

[baggie82]

Hope this is Bilic's epiphany regarding Livermore and he is out for the foreseeable. We just look so much better without him. Apart from him not being particularly good at passing, tackling or running, he just slows everyone down. When he's not passing backwards, he's telling everyone else to pass backwards. Numerous times last night Krov or Gallacher picked up the ball and, instinctively, looked to rive forward and Livermore would be either pointing to a CH or fullback to initiate a backwards pass or, putting his hand up to receive the ball and passing it backwards himself.
This bloke is our captain so holds a lot of sway with the other lads on the pitch, especially the younger ones, therefore, he has a real impact on the tempo of the game. No coincidence that, when he went off, we played on the front foot and the midfield looked like the shackles had been removed.

This sums up perfectly why 1) he doesn't offer anything and 2) he's a hindrance not an asset. In the championship he could throw his muscle around to deter the opposition. That doesn't work in the premiership so he's redundant. Another player signed by TP that a) isn't good enough, b) ageing with very limited resale value & c) earning more on his contract with us than he could expect elsewhere.

[Dan87uk]

There goes the captaincy then...

https://www.expressandstar.com/sport/uk-sports/2020/12/20/sam-allardyce-considers-captaincy-change-after-jake-livermore-red-card/

Some don't want to hear it but Allardyce is right, the red being harsh or not the "Livermore Lunge" has been a thing for a while now and we just can't afford it.

Only potential downside is that it could end up with the equally atrocious Ivanovic due to his past experience.

Wouldn't mind giving it O'Shea or Ajayi or something and see how they get on.

[OldburyWBA]

There goes the captaincy then...

https://www.expressandstar.com/sport/uk-sports/2020/12/20/sam-allardyce-considers-captaincy-change-after-jake-livermore-red-card/

Some don't want to hear it but Allardyce is right, the red being harsh or not the "Livermore Lunge" has been a thing for a while now and we just can't afford it.

Only potential downside is that it could end up with the equally atrocious Ivanovic due to his past experience.

Wouldn't mind giving it O'Shea or Ajayi or something and see how they get on.

I think Ajayi, Furlong, Johnstone and Gallagher will be the only ones left in this side ona  regular basis in a few weeks so unless we see a Darren Fletcher type signing to take it on straight away then it could be Ajayi out of those 4

[MarkW]

I think Ajayi, Furlong, Johnstone and Gallagher will be the only ones left in this side ona  regular basis in a few weeks so unless we see a Darren Fletcher type signing to take it on straight away then it could be Ajayi out of those 4

Ajayi seems very quiet to me. Both on the pitch and off it, he seems to keep himself to himself. It was noticeable that O'Shea was leading the line Vs Man City, for example. Some captain's do very well despite being quiet, but I'm not sure it's what a lot of fans would want to see. We've always had a fanbase that preferred a Derek McInnes type captain.

[TheJacko2000]

I think Ajayi, Furlong, Johnstone and Gallagher will be the only ones left in this side ona  regular basis in a few weeks so unless we see a Darren Fletcher type signing to take it on straight away then it could be Ajayi out of those 4

I don't see any future for Furlong in a back 4. The lad can't defend. Regards Livermore everyone knows my feelings on the player AND the man, but this has been a long time coming.

Might get a surprise skipper. Pereira perhaps. Like you say though, whichever midfield enforcer he brings in will probably get it long term.

[Atomic]

I think Ajayi, Furlong, Johnstone and Gallagher will be the only ones left in this side ona  regular basis in a few weeks so unless we see a Darren Fletcher type signing to take it on straight away then it could be Ajayi out of those 4

O'Shea (Young and our best player last two games playing in a two at centre back), Ajayi and Gallagher.

Of the outfield players that started last night they are the only three I would bother with given the choice.

The rest ain't genuine Premier League quality and will not be in the future.

[Oldbury24]

O'Shea (Young and our best player last two games playing in a two at centre back), Ajayi and Gallagher.

Of the outfield players that started last night they are the only three I would bother with given the choice.

The rest ain't genuine Premier League quality and will not be in the future.

Most of my favorite Albion sides haven't necessarily been the ones who play the best football, they have been the ones who could mix it and had leaders all over the pitch.   At one point it seemed to be a key criteria for Albion signings that they had to be, or have been, somebody else's club captain.  I've never been convinced with Jake as captain (or as a top level footballer if i'm honest), he seems to be from the "lead by example" school but i like to see a more vocal natural leader in the position.

It tells you everything about this group of players, that i do have affection for after last year, that the most natural leader we have is a 21 year old who has only played a handful of games in his natural position.     We all thought Ivanovic would come in and play the captains role, but that's difficult when you are struggling with your own game. 

If BS see's enough in Dara to keep him in the team then he could do worse than just throw him the armband. 

[LiamTheBaggie]

No issue with what Sam Allardyce has said about Livermore.

It was far more politer than what I would have said.

Brain dead football from an experienced professional.

[gazberg]

Livermore still got 18 months left sadly or I'd hope to see him moved on in Jan.

Could do with him off the books.

[OhBilics]

There goes the captaincy then...

Yeah, when I read that article I thought, "But who are you going to give it to?"

I just can't think of anyone in the team that seems like a leader, which is part of our problem, I reckon.

[smethwickw]

Troy Deeney. A ready made target man and captain rolled into one. People may not like it but these are the kind of players we will need to give us a chance.

[chonobaggie]

Troy Deeney. A ready made target man and captain rolled into one. People may not like it but these are the kind of players we will need to give us a chance.

Troy is a player I wished we had got in the summer. So he should be someone we could look at. A natural leader. If he can stay fit.

[JMullen95]

First touch is pooh, can’t pass to someone 5 yards away, positional sense is almost as bad as Sawyers’ but it’s all good because he “plays with a bit of passion”.

[Aztech]

First touch is *****, can’t pass to someone 5 yards away, positional sense is almost as bad as Sawyers’ but it’s all good because he “plays with a bit of passion”.

He’s awful, yet I’d still play him before Sawyers.

[gazberg]

Looks way out of shape.

[Droitwich Baggie]

Mr Useless.

[GREGMT]

I kept telling you we needed to replace Sawyers and Livermore about every other player.

There are league 1 midfielders that are now better than Livermore, can't run, can't shoot, can't pass, limited tackling ability.

How can Harper actually be worse?

[Dexy]

I kept telling you we needed to replace Sawyers and Livermore about every other player.

There are league 1 midfielders that are now better than Livermore, can't run, can't shoot, can't pass, limited tackling ability.

How can Harper actually be worse?

We knew this half way through last season but Bilic neglected it and Dowling should also have dealt with it.

[Droitwich Baggie]

Just a useless employee.

[TheJacko2000]

Livermore has never been any good. Said from day one.

[zac]

He offers absolutely nothing.