Author Topic: Backing off  (Read 2703 times)

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zippyandbungle

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Backing off
« on: December 22, 2013, 01:34:32 PM »
Im sure I am  not imagining this , whenever a team breaks on us our defence NEVER seem to attack the man with the ball , thus allowing a free run into/around the box .
Now I am aware that if you are last man /outnumbered that the norm would be to stall for reinforcements but we seem to do this as a default setting ?

Am I the only one that see's it ?
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WSBaggie

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Re: Backing off
« Reply #1 on: December 22, 2013, 01:38:25 PM »
Im sure I am  not imagining this , whenever a team breaks on us our defence NEVER seem to attack the man with the ball , thus allowing a free run into/around the box .
Now I am aware that if you are last man /outnumbered that the norm would be to stall for reinforcements but we seem to do this as a default setting ?

Am I the only one that see's it ?

I think it's called experience, you don't see many top defenders go charging at the ball when been counter attacked.

It's an easy situation to criticise and probably lose lose for players when it results in a goal. They get slated for not going to the ball and it goes in or get slated for going for the ball and getting skinned or giving away a penalty or red card.

zippyandbungle

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Re: Backing off
« Reply #2 on: December 22, 2013, 01:43:03 PM »
I think it's called experience, you don't see many top defenders go charging at the ball when been counter attacked.

It's an easy situation to criticise and probably lose lose for players when it results in a goal. They get slated for not going to the ball and it goes in or get slated for going for the ball and getting skinned or giving away a penalty or red card.
in certain situations yes, but if they are breaking on halfway (yesterday) and we have plenty getting back , surely its better to go in higher up the pitch?
If youre going to get told off, get told off for doing something not for doing nothing..

Hunnington Baggie

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Re: Backing off
« Reply #3 on: December 22, 2013, 02:04:05 PM »
in certain situations yes, but if they are breaking on halfway (yesterday) and we have plenty getting back , surely its better to go in higher up the pitch?
Not really, backing off slows both players as the attacker has to analyse exactly when the defender will commit, which allows more players to get back (admittedly it allows more attackers too) but eventually you hope to get to the situation where by the box is well defended and the striker has to shoot through players to get to the goal (basic defending there). even if there is only one defender, better to have one defender there than have a striker go one on one with the goalie.

Yesterday was unlucky as it went between Foster's legs, bit to the left and Brunt makes the block, bit to the right and Foster or the Post are in the way. as opposed to your tactic where a player will have a much higher chance of losing by either being skinned and Graham has all the time in the world to pick his place, as opposed to having to wait for Livermore to created the space, or sent off. In the situation there were two players back and Graham HAD to wait for Livermore to create an opportunity, otherwise risk a long shot that had a much lower chance of going in than if it was closer. Defensively we did exactly what we were supposed to do but for a good run and selective pass by Hull.

WSBaggie

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Re: Backing off
« Reply #4 on: December 22, 2013, 02:19:08 PM »
in certain situations yes, but if they are breaking on halfway (yesterday) and we have plenty getting back , surely its better to go in higher up the pitch?

I'd say that would give the attackers even more space to move into and for the man holding the ball an easier pass.

Both tactics are easy to criticise and pick the faults with when they don't work, I would say backing off gives you more of a chance defensively though.

Greenock Baggie

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Re: Backing off
« Reply #5 on: December 22, 2013, 02:46:14 PM »
How about being defensively savvy and having enough players in the right positions so that we DONT get "broken" on ???

We have lost all our organisation since Hodgson left. The defence is all over the place, midfield is weak as p!$$ and the forwards couldn't hit a barn door.

Mulumbu had his worst game for 3 years yesterday, he was awful, played out of his normal role........and it showed. Long may as well have had the day off for all the service he got. Our "creative" midfielders created nothing, the best attacking player on the pitch was our right back......AGAIN !!! Olssons passing was abysmal. And the whole lot of them were devoid of any confidence !!.....just like the 28 thousand in the crowd.

And another team there for the taking slip through our fingers, ala Southampton, Norwich x 2, Swansea, etc etc etc etc
He's a lad from the Wrenna

wbatillidie

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Re: Backing off
« Reply #6 on: December 22, 2013, 05:07:34 PM »
Teams are doing to us what we used to do by soaking up pressure and hitting on the counter attack, when we have the ball theres no one making any forward thinking runs until Vydra/Berahino came on. We end up just firing a ball down the channels to Long and his touch is awful. It's not a coincidence that we have done better against Man Utd, Arsenal and Chelsea. Sessegnon and Amalfitano are capable of creating chances but when out of form we look flat and useless.
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GrGr

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Re: Backing off
« Reply #7 on: December 22, 2013, 05:28:01 PM »
Teams are doing to us what we used to do by soaking up pressure and hitting on the counter attack, when we have the ball theres no one making any forward thinking runs until Vydra/Berahino came on. We end up just firing a ball down the channels to Long and his touch is awful. It's not a coincidence that we have done better against Man Utd, Arsenal and Chelsea. Sessegnon and Amalfitano are capable of creating chances but when out of form we look flat and useless.

We never ever had ANY idea how to break down teams under Clarke. He set us up to not let in the first goal and hope chance gave us the lead so we could counter attack. When teams didn't care to give us space to attack we always looked completely clueless. So of course this setup was a complete failure time and time again against teams coming for a point at the Hawthorns. This has to change you have to be able to both defend and attack.

AlbionDaz

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Re: Backing off
« Reply #8 on: December 22, 2013, 05:59:40 PM »
There counter attack didn't work every time,sometimes it pays off which it did when they scored,also the double save from Foster.
Was more suprised by the way they went up a gear when we equalised,seems they was toying with us whilst they was leading,new Manager needs to be in place sooner rather than later to address our tactics and awful current form.